OTing as a Paly

[Arraza]

<DIV>Folks, I'm looking for some folks who do this on a regular basis to provide me with some insight.  Typically I have been in either the MT role, or just dps/utility on our raids and haven't done much OTing.  Looks like I will be doing some more now that we are moving on to tougher content.  Usually setting up an OT group is a waste for us since we can do better DPS and if we wipe, we would wipe regardless of having an OT anyway.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>My theory was as an OT we need to fight alongside the MT, and taunt and keep amends on an appropriate target and receive any hate transfers we can in order to maintain a high position in the hate list in order to ensure a smooth transition it the MT goes down or whatever nastyness might occur.  This would naturally occur in a bouncing back and forth of agro between the MT and the OT.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So one raid I setup in the MT role, had a nice group with a dirge for hate transfer and I set about taunting and doing my thing, and agro was bouncing back and forth between me and the MT and I thought everything was going well until our raid leader told me to turn off amends and any hate transfers and stop taking agro.  He claimed this was because it was difficult for the healers and the MT... not wanting to argue with him in the middle of the raid and never having OTed before I let it go thinking I may have it wrong.  We then proceeded to wipe a couple times because I was now unprepared to take agro without amends or hate transfers.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I want to make sure I have this right so that when I approach this again I can do the right thing, and justify what I am doing to the raid.</DIV>

[khufure]

Keep amends and hate buffs on, but taunt less.  You don't have snap aggro other than rescue.  You can't afford to spend time getting buffs up then trying to get aggro while your raid wipes.  You will need to find the happy medium where you can stay on the aggro list but not take aggro.  Ideally you want to be #2 at all times.  No way you can do this without trial and error.It is important to be at the front but I wouldn't sit next to the MT.  You don't want to take frontal AEs unless you have to.  Try to sit right on the mobs [I cannot control my vocabulary] so if something happens or you do get aggro you can spin/position it quick.Your group is going to be important.  Usually a paladin OT group should be something like:- Paladin- Coercer or Dirge, maybe Illusionist- Swashbuckler- Shaman (preferably mystic)- Druid- cleric / crusader / monk / big dps casterAt least 1 power regen and 2 healers should be in the OT group.  You also need a consistent DPS to put amends on.  Try to get the same person or class if possible so you can figure out what kind of hate they are giving you.<div></div>You need to explain to your leader that especially because of amends it is a trial and error task of learning this position.

[Wulfborne]

<P>^ Excellent advice.</P> <P>Your raid leader is right that you don't want to be bouncing aggro. All that does in the long run is waste healer mana, since some healers pre-ward or pre-cast heals to combat spike damage, etc... if they cast it on the Guard and you pull aggro, it hasn't refreshed yet for them to heal you. By the time it does, it can be too late, and you can die, while they're casting - now the mob is back on the guard and they haven't gotten him warded or pre-healed, so he has a higher chance of dropping.</P> <P>You need to be decently high on the aggro list without stripping aggro. Keep your amends on, but only taunt for your debuff. When you need to take over, pop sigil, rescue, and dps like your life depends on it (ae if possible). You should get aggro in short order.</P> <P>~Hawke</P>

[JarredDarque]

one of the biggest problems I run into as OT is triyn to keepthe raid convinced that just cause the MT is dead, the fight isnt over.  Alot of times tehy give up or star to try and run aggro off if the MT drops, when if they stayd and backed me (or the OT whoever it is) that we still have a decent chance

[Mgunner]

<DIV>This is pretty much how we do it. Not that any one answer is the right one.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>You want to be building agro, but there's no need to taunt, or even be number 2 on the list. It takes some incredible precision to be number 2 on the hate list, so don't bother trying. You may very well peel agro every now and again, but for most encounters, your healers shouldn't be healing through the mob. Healers can very easily have two macros. One /target Joe and /target Bob. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you heal through the mob, and some idiot warlock strips agro, the MT is not getting refreshed wards or heals. So I find this a bad. Sometimes it's not bad idea to let an agro stripper die once in a while. There are times, however, where you do find the need to heal through a mob, for example, fighting a mob with a mem wipe where several different tanks can end up with the mob for a bit.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Most of the time, an ideal OT group is not available. I can generally pull of holding agro until the MT is back up and buffed. If I the MT dies, I can generally pick it up quick if I'm not next in the hate line. Rescue is your friend here. If your MT keeps dying before your rescue timer is up, then you have different issues to worry about.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>One more thing, never take amends off. Your giving a pure DPS class the ability to go all out. Your only hurting your overall raid DPS if you take it off. </DIV>

[hawsecav19d]

<DIV>Its alot like playing a wizard without knowing what your casting. I keep amends on Assassin and dont taunt but with him hitting 1200+ at times for a fight and me around 600 sometimes WE steal agro. Key to having amends on him is if MT goes down I put across raid /r MT downhealers target thru me, /cast Sigil of Heroism,   /r Sigil of Heroism is up you have 20secs to go all out.  About this time Assassin and Wizard in my group hit the biggest things they got and I get agro and keep agro till the fights over, seldom does MT ever get it back unless he reinforces or rescues and there is normally no need.</DIV>

[DarrkElf]

<P>Some great advice here.  Speaking from a raid healers point of view, you will always want a Fury or Warden in the OT group.  This is because, as mentioned above, warding healer classes have longer casting times and are not suitable for 'quick' or 'short-term' healing. </P> <P>From the raids I have been in the OT has a very active role as we are still trying to get better gear for our MT.  In the raid setup you always need at least one healer keeping that OT targetted (preferrably a Fury or Warden) in case the MT goes down, as their heals are fast enough to get off to keep the OT up.</P> <P>So far I have been in 6 fights where the OT has ended up saving the day once the MT has gone down.  Raiding in Courts the OT is especially important as one of the raid targets enjoys porting the MT (and healers and other classes) to another part of the zone in the middle of the fight, meaning all of a sudden no matter how well things were going the raid is left without an MT.</P> <P>For a good OT or MT, communication with each other, with the healers and the rest of the raid group is essential.  Make sure it's clear before the fight who will be healing you as OT, and yell out if the MT goes down so that all the healers switch to you.</P> <P>Like most things, trial and error is what will give you the best idea of what will work for you.</P>

[Mgunner]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> DarrkElf wrote:<BR> <P>Some great advice here.  Speaking from a raid healers point of view, you will always want a Fury or Warden in the OT group.  This is because, as mentioned above, warding healer classes have longer casting times and are not suitable for 'quick' or 'short-term' healing. </P> <P>From the raids I have been in the OT has a very active role as we are still trying to get better gear for our MT.  In the raid setup you always need at least one healer keeping that OT targetted (preferrably a Fury or Warden) in case the MT goes down, as their heals are fast enough to get off to keep the OT up.</P> <P>So far I have been in 6 fights where the OT has ended up saving the day once the MT has gone down.  Raiding in Courts the OT is especially important as one of the raid targets enjoys porting the MT (and healers and other classes) to another part of the zone in the middle of the fight, meaning all of a sudden no matter how well things were going the raid is left without an MT.</P> <P>For a good OT or MT, communication with each other, with the healers and the rest of the raid group is essential.  Make sure it's clear before the fight who will be healing you as OT, and yell out if the MT goes down so that all the healers switch to you.</P> <P>Like most things, trial and error is what will give you the best idea of what will work for you.</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Having a healer always targeting the OT makes no sense.  This is why a macro like /target OT is awesome. No reason not to keep every healer on the MT, but as long as the healers can quickly change their target, you don't need to keep one on the OT.   MT goes down, healers hit the macro, and start warding and healing once the OT takes control. If you heal through the mob, your trying to keep wizards, scouts, other healers who most likely wouldn't survive anyways. They should always start healing the OT when MT goes down.