DPS-adin

[Anariale]

<DIV>So last night we ran Labs, which is a complete cakewalk... so I decided to go full offensive and pull out the Wyrmslayer.  I parsed about 900 DPS for the full raid.  Not too shabby.  This made me think though, so now Im considering changing my AA's around.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Right now Im:</DIV> <DIV>STA - 5 4 8 8 1</DIV> <DIV>Wis - 4 4 8</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hero - 5 5 5 5 1</DIV> <DIV>Support - 3 3gproc 2groupmit</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Im thinking about just going to DPS.</DIV> <DIV>STA - 4 4 8</DIV> <DIV>Wis - 4 4 8</DIV> <DIV>Int - 5 4 8</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hero 5 5 5 5 1 (Because I still do a lot of tanking, and the shield block is pretty nice)</DIV> <DIV>Smite 5 3 and then work towards Smite Evil</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Does anyone have any feedback of what I could expect?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>W</DIV>

[PulsarBD]

go the INT line until you max out the spell crits. thats - IMO - a must for a pally unless he was brainswashed.the STA line is a must for tanking, hammer ground is very good as wel and the additional HP are also welcome there.So STA is 5/8/8/8 and INT is 4/4/8 the remaining 4 point i put into STR.in the plaadin tree i go for teh HERO AA (blocking) and then will fill up the wrath line as well as some support options.Most crucial there are consecrate and brimstone to enhance your DPS. Doom judgement might be help since it dispells beneficial buffs on the AOE targets.with this setup in semi fabled and legendary i go over 700STR self buffed in off stance and in raids i parse in top third. depending on the caster / scout setup.with 1H and shield (cudgel and draconic def) i parse easily over 750 and peak at over 1k. if i  get some INT buff it gets even better <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />unless u play PvP i think smite evil is a waste, since it is only good against select classes.IMO the pally is also a support class, so you could help your guild MT by devotion or intercede.this way we are a good allround solution and can virtually save a raid when it gets into  trouble.my intercede often helps MT to survive certain encounters, the battle rez is great and the DPS come in handy too.<div></div>

[Wulfborne]

<P>I don't have firm numbers for you to chew on, but I went with the following, so you might find some similarities:</P> <P>Str - 4/4/5/4/8</P> <P>Int - 4/4/8/8/0</P> <P>Wraths - 5/5/5/5/1 (Not DJ)</P> <P>Heals - 3/4 (single tgt and ward at present)</P> <P>I am regularly hitting the parse lists with over 1k parses. Even when not tanking, putting up those types of numbers and having amends on others can *easily* pull mobs onto me - and regularly does in a multi-mob encounter. (So healers have to be ready for it, or you'd need to take steps to keep it from happening, like deaggro procs or dropping amends, etc).</P> <P>Personally, I love it. However, I'm also not currently in a position where I am likely to MT a raid, since we have multiple guards and berzerkers that would take that role before me. /shrug You'll also see some slight difference, as I have the 10% cast/recast reduction and you would have the melee crits. After going over my parse logs, I found that my melee dps was significantly lower than my spells, which is why I chose to drop that particular ability.</P> <P><Editing> Adding this in to say that Smite Evil is FAR better than it was at conception. At first, it only affected evil-based characters (SK's, Necro's, etc that can ONLY be an evil class). However, now it affects anything that is NOT a good-based class (so all neutral classes and even animals can get hit) and anything undead, so an undead paladin - if there were one - could get hit. </editing></P> <P>Hope some of that helps.</P> <P>~Hawke</P><p>Message Edited by Wulfborne on <span class=date_text>12-15-2006</span> <span class=time_text>08:40 AM</span>

[Anariale]

<P>Well, straight up Im not giving up the +34 to all skills from the Wis line.  On raid encounters this is a 5-10% increase in to-hit rate across the board for the entire group.  Its very worth it IMO.</P> <P>W</P>

[Wulfborne]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Anariale wrote:<BR> <P>Well, straight up Im not giving up the +34 to all skills from the Wis line.  On raid encounters this is a 5-10% increase in to-hit rate across the board for the entire group.  Its very worth it IMO.</P> <P>W</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Sorry, I wasn't trying to suggest that you should. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> When I mentioned my AA lines, it was only so you could see where I was coming from, in case you tried out your setup and found some slightly different results.</P> <P>~Hawke</P>

[Rob89]

<DIV>Max dps for pally:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Sta: 4-4-8</DIV> <DIV>INT: 8-4-8</DIV> <DIV>STR: 4-4</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Wrath: Maxed</DIV> <DIV>Support: Maxxed </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The support line will add higher trigger chance to Call to duty and other stuff</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you go those lines you will parse around 1000-1400 each fight.</DIV> <DIV>Sometimes over 2k.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Vulkan_NTooki]

I'd sayInt, 448Sta 448Str 458I might have gone another path if I had another weapon tho, but with Shadowaxe the str line is nice.. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Also you can increase dps alot with proc itemsThere are some t5 legs that increase dps by 34A neck item neck that increase dps by 7You can wear 2 finger bone manacles that procs roughly 2 times each every minute. You can get acrylia str and agi rings for additional dps and hasteGet the KoS collection earring that procs dmgThere are several clickable dmg items when u have nothing else to push.Im at 65-70 dps and haste minimum in all fights with these items.. Sometimes Im at 90+ in both.Im gonna get some adornments once I get the dogmatic set, so that I can get to the point of diminishing returns on both haste and dps solo.. I havent testet raiding lately, so I cant say how high my dps is atm.. But I will test in february/march, since I have alot of spare time then. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[DarkLord35]

<DIV>Hey Wyrd,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>WB.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I respeced KoS AA's to:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>STA  - 4 4 8</DIV> <DIV>WIS - 4 4 8</DIV> <DIV>INT - 5 4 8</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>shortly after EoF release and haven't regreted it once.  The only draw back I have seen so far is in raid my agro generation is crazy and puting amends on anyone breaking 800dps usually results in me dying a few times unless i'm set up as back up tank or in a healer heavy group.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As for EoF AA's</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>curently have Hero Line to Block which is noticable improvement, (working on additional 1% block adorns) and plan to take Support to the Cure.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If your planning on max dps you might want to add a few proc thingy's like Mystical Orb of the Invoker and Bone Clasp Girdle.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>With this setup you can expect pretty nice numbers. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Jedod</DIV> <DIV>70th Paladin</DIV> <DIV>The Tyrants - Permafrost</DIV>

[Anariale]

<P>I respecc'd last night and during raiding last night I parsed out around 600-700 DPS while defensive for a full HoS raid.  Not bad.</P> <P>The one fight that I went full bore offense was on Pain, and I clocked in at over 900 DPS... and thats without a Brigand on the raid.  Thats pretty nuts for a Paladin on a single-target encounter!  I think my high hit for the night was a 3300 Crit from Refusal of Conviction.</P> <P>I cant wait to run labs this week just to compare to my numbers from last week.</P> <P>I did miss having Divine Aura on the Overlord/Enforcer fight, but TBH, it wasnt anything I couldnt just spam heal through anyways... and thats just one fight.</P> <P>W</P>

[khufure]

<div><blockquote><hr>Anariale wrote:<div></div> <p>I respecc'd last night and during raiding last night I parsed out around 600-700 DPS while defensive for a full HoS raid.  Not bad.</p> <p>The one fight that I went full bore offense was on Pain, and I clocked in at over 900 DPS... and thats without a Brigand on the raid.  Thats pretty nuts for a Paladin on a single-target encounter!  I think my high hit for the night was a 3300 Crit from Refusal of Conviction.</p> <p>I cant wait to run labs this week just to compare to my numbers from last week.</p> <p>I did miss having Divine Aura on the Overlord/Enforcer fight, but TBH, it wasnt anything I couldnt just spam heal through anyways... and thats just one fight.</p> <p>W</p><hr></blockquote>Hey some real numbers!What kind of buffs did you get?  I have found the DPS & haste buff to be the most beneficial, followed by bards.  Try to get this group and tell me your dps in HOS ..- coercer (+dps, int)- illusionist (synergism, haste, int)- troubador (spell buff, DKTM, str/int)- inquisitor (buff, dps buff)- berserker (str buff, berserk)I am sure your raid leader will be happy to let you try a raid with these buffs.</div>

[Anariale]

<DIV>Im always in the MT group with a Dirge and a Coercer (Guardian MT), so Im generally riding close to full DPS mod.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>W</DIV>

[MeridianR]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>khufure wrote:<div><blockquote><hr>Anariale wrote:<div></div> <p>I respecc'd last night and during raiding last night I parsed out around 600-700 DPS while defensive for a full HoS raid.  Not bad.</p> <p>The one fight that I went full bore offense was on Pain, and I clocked in at over 900 DPS... and thats without a Brigand on the raid.  Thats pretty nuts for a Paladin on a single-target encounter!  I think my high hit for the night was a 3300 Crit from Refusal of Conviction.</p> <p>I cant wait to run labs this week just to compare to my numbers from last week.</p> <p>I did miss having Divine Aura on the Overlord/Enforcer fight, but TBH, it wasnt anything I couldnt just spam heal through anyways... and thats just one fight.</p> <p>W</p><hr></blockquote>Hey some real numbers!What kind of buffs did you get?  I have found the DPS & haste buff to be the most beneficial, followed by bards.  Try to get this group and tell me your dps in HOS ..- coercer (+dps, int)- illusionist (synergism, haste, int)- troubador (spell buff, DKTM, str/int)- inquisitor (buff, dps buff)- berserker (str buff, berserk)I am sure your raid leader will be happy to let you try a raid with these buffs.</div><hr></blockquote>Sorry but tailoring a group like that to a Paladin is a shame...seriously 3 power regen?  Does you guild raid with like 10 regens?Illusionist and Coercer in the same group?  Wow.Here is a good (feasable group, to try..)-- Coercer-- Monk-- Assassin-- Templar-- Defiler (or Mystic for added haste from there AA's)You will have nice Dps (if you have +dps adornments you can get near 100%)You will have nice Haste (from the monk group, a haste item, and the mystic)You will have nice HP (from the templar, and shaman)You will have over the break even point for mitigation (easily)You get decent procs...You have hella hate - Amends on the Monk, plus Enraging DemenourThat is a pretty [Removed for Content] out OT group.</div><p>Message Edited by MeridianR on <span class=date_text>12-19-2006</span> <span class=time_text>11:44 AM</span>

[MeridianR]

Of course there are a ton of group combo's you can try out (changing a Dirge for the Coercer is something to try, you pickup DKTM, blade dance, etc)......but the 3 regen, and 2 chanters in the same group made the dps group cry like baby jesus in your example <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[Anariale]

<P>Our MT Group is typically:<BR>Guardian<BR>Paladin<BR>Templar<BR>Defiler<BR>Coercer<BR>Dirge</P> <P>Our OT Group is typically<BR>Berserker<BR>Monk<BR>Inquisitor<BR>Shaman<BR>Dirge<BR>Swashbuckler</P> <P>Buffs really arent an issue in those groups ^_^</P> <P>W</P>

[MeridianR]

<div><blockquote><hr>Anariale wrote:<div></div> <p>Our MT Group is typically:GuardianPaladinTemplarDefilerCoercerDirg e</p> <p>Our OT Group is typicallyBerserkerMonkInquisitorShamanDirgeSwashbu ckler</p> <p>Buffs really arent an issue in those groups ^_^</p> <p>W</p><hr></blockquote>You really going with the Paladin in the MT group?  Is it mainly for Battle Leadership?  Cause I would think a Warden (for + skills) or Swashie / Assassin (for hate) would be a better choice at the moment.Now I could see the Paladin in the OT group, but I am interested in the setup <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div>

[Anariale]

<P>Paladin for:<BR><FONT color=#ff9900>1)  Mitigation -</FONT> 425 Mit is still worthwhile, it adds up quickly.  There is a noticable difference when your MT has 8000 Mit.  Remember, you move down the curve the higher level the mob is.<BR><FONT color=#ff9900>2)  Avoidance -</FONT> Tower Shields are dreamy on avoidance right now.  Parry and Base Defense break down quickly against high level epics.  Shields do not.  When your Paladin has a 24%+ block rate, that translates very quickly to an additional ~10% avoidance.  No Warden is going to cover that.<BR><FONT color=#ff9900>3)  Battle Leadership -</FONT> +34 to all offensive skills... that means healers are spending a wee bit less power on heal spells, and the MT gets ~half of what a Warden would have given him<BR><FONT color=#ff9900>4)  Str/Wisdom Buff -</FONT> Not as much Wisdom as a Warden, but its there<BR><FONT color=#ff9900>5)  Heals -</FONT> Group heals for the MT group so the in-group healers dont have to worry about it.  In addition to my DPS/Tanking/etc, I usually tie the 6th healer on Heals output on a raid (Note, this is only because Paladin Heals stack with all other healers, while Shaman Wards, Cleric Reactives and Druid HoTs do not stack, so the 6th healer is getting pooped on a ton)<BR><FONT color=#ff9900>6)  Procs -</FONT> Yeah, its like 5 DPS... but its still there</P> <P>An Assassin could give his hate-transfer over, but you really lose out on a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]load of defense.  Not to mention the Coercer's DPS buff is wasted on an Assassin since they already have such high natural DPS mod it throws them into diminishing returns.  Plus it helps having a 3rd really beefed up tank ready to take aggro if things go south.</P> <P>*Shrug* it works for us.  Im sure there are 10,000 reasons to stack it differently.</P><p>Message Edited by Anariale on <span class=date_text>12-19-2006</span> <span class=time_text>12:14 PM</span>

[khufure]

<div><blockquote><hr>MeridianR wrote:<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>khufure wrote:<div>- coercer (+dps, int)- illusionist (synergism, haste, int)- troubador (spell buff, DKTM, str/int)- inquisitor (buff, dps buff)- berserker (str buff, berserk)I am sure your raid leader will be happy to let you try a raid with these buffs.</div><hr></blockquote>Sorry but tailoring a group like that to a Paladin is a shame...seriously 3 power regen?  Does you guild raid with like 10 regens?Illusionist and Coercer in the same group?  Wow.Here is a good (feasable group, to try..)-- Coercer-- Monk-- Assassin-- Templar-- Defiler (or Mystic for added haste from there AA's)You will have nice Dps (if you have +dps adornments you can get near 100%)You will have nice Haste (from the monk group, a haste item, and the mystic)You will have nice HP (from the templar, and shaman)You will have over the break even point for mitigation (easily)You get decent procs...You have hella hate - Amends on the Monk, plus Enraging Demenour</div><hr></blockquote>What you don't like my group.  Ok so it never happens.  It was still fun thinking of it.</div>

[MeridianR]

<div><blockquote><hr>khufure wrote:<div><blockquote><hr>MeridianR wrote:<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>khufure wrote:<div>- coercer (+dps, int)- illusionist (synergism, haste, int)- troubador (spell buff, DKTM, str/int)- inquisitor (buff, dps buff)- berserker (str buff, berserk)I am sure your raid leader will be happy to let you try a raid with these buffs.</div><hr></blockquote>Sorry but tailoring a group like that to a Paladin is a shame...seriously 3 power regen?  Does you guild raid with like 10 regens?Illusionist and Coercer in the same group?  Wow.Here is a good (feasable group, to try..)-- Coercer-- Monk-- Assassin-- Templar-- Defiler (or Mystic for added haste from there AA's)You will have nice Dps (if you have +dps adornments you can get near 100%)You will have nice Haste (from the monk group, a haste item, and the mystic)You will have nice HP (from the templar, and shaman)You will have over the break even point for mitigation (easily)You get decent procs...You have hella hate - Amends on the Monk, plus Enraging Demenour</div><hr></blockquote>What you don't like my group.  Ok so it never happens.  It was still fun thinking of it.</div><hr></blockquote>LOL - well it is a [Removed for Content] group....but I don't think there is a raid leader on the face of this earth that could justify it <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div>

[Wulfborne]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> MeridianR wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR>LOL - well it is a [Removed for Content] group....but I don't think there is a raid leader on the face of this earth that could justify it <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Cash money.</P> <P>Raid leader - "I did it because he wanted to see what happened and paid for the next year of our Ventrilo."</P> <P>~Hawke<BR></P>