Redemption line - does it actually do anything?

[Stormreaver]

<DIV>I rarely use Redemption anyway since it usuaes a conc slot I somply don't have, but I'm dubious as to its use anyway. The spell effect says "Transfers 30% of current hate to the paladin", yet it is a maintained spell. What I infer from this is that when you cast it, it does the hate swap, but then you're just maintiaining a useless buff after.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thoughts, opinions?</DIV>

[Talbot]

It is you best agro buff, get used to using it in groups.  See the thread about maintaining agro.  Go ahead and adpet 3 it.  at adept 3 37% of the hate is transferred.

[Troodon]

I think the point Stormreaver is making is that the description implies that its a hate syphon, but its effect suggests it just transfers current hate from the target to the Paladin. There is similar uncertainty regarding the Call to Arms line (well at least Divine Inspiration). From the description and the effect its unclear whether it syphons hate or just transfers current hate. Perhaps something to seek clarificaiton on? <font><font size="1"></font></font><div></div>

[Stormreaver]

Yes, that is my point, I believe the spell only xfers the current hate upon casting, afterward it doesnt do anything. Something to look into, anyway.

[Araknar]

<P>I believ that redemtion continues giving u 32% of the hate the person its cast on gains throughout the entire length its in use, a good example of this is i duo with a ranger quite alot and for a time he was getting agro off me, i tried redemtion on him, taunted mobs once at start of fight and never lost agro to him. not a great detailed bit of info for u but truthful and poignant. </P> <P> </P> <P>Steelle</P>

[uzhiel feathered serpe]

<P>I agree with the above poster. As long as its up, it continues to transfer aggro. I can keep aggro off a lvl 50 wizard thats burning. On warlocks I have a bit more difficulty, but either way If i did NOT have redemption up it would be very difficult to hold aggro from them.</P> <P>Uzhiel, lvl 50 Paladin, Eternal Chaos, Faydark.</P>

[djhbeek]

It certain continues to transfer hate.  I put it on healers regularly, and as soon as they start chain healing every mob that wasn't on me turns to me. <div></div>

[MeridianR]

IMHO - Redemption is a must when grouping with a Warlock. They are aggro machines..... I regularly group with a same level Wizard, and he doesn't generate nearly as much aggro as a Warlock of the same level does. Fighting Nightbloods in RV, with a Warlock I had to make sure I cast call to glory, blinding bash, and noble tone (also smite prayer) before he started nuking, or I could never get aggro off of him....until I used Redemption.    <div></div>

[Talbot]

<DIV>It continues to trasfer hate as long as the buff is up.  This does not mean you don't have to taunt anymore.  You still need to use your taunts to stay up in the hate list.  The key for a paladin to stay at the top of the hate list is use your heals, wards, and taunts as well.  Heals and wards produce a good amount of hate.  The reason they don't produce more than they do is simple.  If you are off tanking you would pull the agro off main tank in which case this would be bad.  Which is why you have to use all of your tools. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>A perfect example, I was making a spell for a level 40 paladin.  He said he had been having a problem with agro management.  Asked if I had any suggestions.  Told him to adept 3 redemption and to use it.  He came back to me 3 days later and said.  OMG thank you so much for the tip on redemption.  Since I started using it, agro management has been so much easier. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The concept of MT is lacking on so many people and the concept of grouping is hard to grasp.  As MT your job is NOT to do damage.  It is to absorb damage and keep agro on you.  Which means giving up our proc buff and our STR buff.  In duo situations it is much easier to control agro than in a full group.  This is where picking your target for redemption becomes a true skill.  Your first look at your group should be are there any troubador's or dirges in group.  Second should be wizzies or warlocks.  Then down the line from there.  These classes are what cause agro to be yanked off in most cases.  I.e. Ae type spells.  If the are nuking before you get your first taunt in you have to say, look you guys need to hold off on nuking tile I get the first HO off.  Your first ho should be followed by your group taunt.  Then if you have a group of mobs beating on you, use your divine AE DD.  This does 2 things It actually damage the mobs.  In group where agro has been yanked off me in more cases than not, that small amount of damage you do to all the mobs ends up being a great hate producer.  Granted this is best when you have 4-6 mobs.  Note: Our AE's are not encounter linked which means.  Watch out for possible adds in your AoE. </DIV>

[Sunstalker]

<DIV>36th pally here. I have grouped with every other class in the game at various levels with large and small differences between my level and thiers. The single class I have lost agro to virtually every time is a Troub if i dont use redemption. We actually did a test once in Zek where I stood to one side of a single mob, the Troub stood to the other side. The Troub then walked within agro range and the mob ran to the Troub then just as it got there it turned around and ran straight back to me as I had taken the agro transferred to me by redemption. We did that and have seen that same result many times over, its just funny when you actually see it work.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>To me this is a god spell that I just wish I could get to master 1.</DIV>

[Azakiel]

Fantastic post. Level 31 Pally here. I have been playing duo with a Warlock friend of mine since about lvl 12. He's a good player and knows when to hold back a bit. In tougher situations I've lost the aggro a few times until redeption came along. I have been checking the Brokers every morning for the last month just to try and get hold of app1 at least! 

[Azakiel]

Doh - adept1!

[Syf]

<DIV>Check the black market too, the ones selling in Qeynos are usually a lot more expensive.</DIV>

[Azakiel]

<P>Thanks for the tip - found loads of Pally spells really cheap on the Black Market. Another thing about redemption.........</P> <P>The stats @ App4 is exactly the same as the stats @ Adept1 - is this intentional ior a bug?</P> <DIV> </DIV>

[Aer]

<DIV>I have found that for more than a few spells Adept 1 offers nothing additional over App IV. It's possible that Adept 1 may offer something more than App IV towards the end of that spell's life (i.e. when its white or lower con) but more often than not they will be the same.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I am just glade the last update made it so that you can now examine the spells before you buy from broker. If you see Adept I doesn't offer anything over App IV, just save yourself 3-4 gold and go with the App IV. The difference between the two is usually very minor anyway. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>All my spells are basically a mix of App IV and Adept I's. I haven't even spent gold on any Adept 3s yet.</DIV>