Not impressed with STA AA

[Naelael]

Having played a high end SK in EQ1, and now comming back and getting my SK moving along well in EQ2, I have to say that I am not at all impressed with the STA aa for us. I just don't see enough of a difference in HP pool to justify the first 4 points, then I don't use hammer ground since I dont use a hamme so thats a wasted 4 points for me, so it becomes, are our melee crits with all that AA. Honestly... I just don't see it. In the crusader line right now, I have 4/4/8 INT and 4/4/4 in STA. It is possible that I will be using hammer ground at some point, but I am seriously considering taking those 4 aa points away from melee crits, and putting them into INT for a build of 8/4/8, since that seems to be where the vast majority of our DPS comes from. I did a search on the board under aa and have not seen much discussion, if any, about if our melee crits are really all that useful or not. Anyone have any thoughts about this?<div></div>

[Rylight]

sta line is a great line if your actually concerned with your HP, espically in pvp, where hammer ground is an extra stun, and can knock out entire groups. its also great in pve as the MT because you can stun all your enemies and take no damage for a sec, plus have the time to cast a long spell such as heinous blessing or tap viens. the melee crit is alright, but doesnt compare to the int crit. when you get to the 2%+ hp AA, you really start getting your points worth. for instance lets say have 6000hp (around lvl 70 most likely) 2% of that is 120hp, so if you spend all 8 AA points on that you will have about 1000+ extra hp, way better then any adorments or armor.  the other AA gives you 5? sta per point, and for whatever reason I think thats about 100hp per point, (may have to reresearch that, I just remember it giving me identical hp as the 2% AA option at a certian lvl) anyways, its a fair amount of life which is great for tanking or pvping. best of all, the end ability divine aura is probably one of the best ending AA's we have. the ability to take all damage under half my health for 10 secs up to 30 hits has saved me lots of death's whether it be pvp or pve. and can really help agianst named mobs. anyways, I will admit, the melee crits are not really that useful. I mean its great and all but most of our attacks are spell based. honestly it would be worth it if we got like 50% melee crit in the long run. but I think its only like 24% if you max it ? compared to the int lines 68% if you finish it. so if you dont want the 2% health AA that comes after the melee crit AA then I probably wouldnt even bother putting in the 4 points into melee crit, but thats your choice. in the long run its impossible to be impressed with any 1 single AA line. for instance I am doing the int line and sta line as well, but the second int AA option can only be used when holding a symbol.......which I will never do. heck thats not even an option for me, so thats 4 points wasted right there. however the 68% spell crit is Very nice, so in the long run its worth it. anyways, good luck with whatever you decide. <div></div>

[Hark]

Well, from a raiding aspect of it I don't think I will ever ditch 448 in sta.  It basically comes down to this, once you have a weapon and a spell firing solution down you basically only do a finite number of dps from your spells.  Sure that number will fluctuate from encounter to encounter and group makeup but it really is a pretty constant number.  It's not like we are a wizzie here.. we can pretty much have at any point during a fight everything going all times.  So to increase dps even further it's all based off of melee.  That's were I find the biggest difference in fixed dps.  Depending on group makeup your melee can add 200, 300, 1k, whatever more dps in addition to your spells.. and crits isthe sole factor if you happen to get a big crit range weapon for more added melee umph.  Putting 8 into crits, a piece of gear or two, potions, maybe a class that buffs %.. it's not all that unrealistic to have your crit % be high enough for you to consistantly depend on them for dps.Now if you don't raid, or don't have a big crit range weapon and prolly wont have access to one anytime soon.  Which I totally dig, there is a serious lack of them in the game (oh sure there are a billion 2handed weapons in the game but for most part 98% of them really blow).. then yeah sta is useless for you.Just my 2c and i'm really bored <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[Xaxtionlorex]

agree with above, the crits really start to add up, raid buffed im at 40% crit [and 79% spell] really simple math says that 1/4 of my hits crit, my normal crits un grouped are in the 1100+ range, in raids i can almost hit 4000 with just my autto attack hits,thats double the damage of all my spells but harm touch.<div></div>

[Talz]

I have played a lot of classes and think SK have the best AA.  Picking my final build was the hardest character choice I had to make.  I still find myself wanting to change it at times.<div></div>

[Zagats]

<DIV>I gained my 17th AA yesterday (at lvl 28 lol!), so I did 4 4 8 on INT line to start, and those spell crits are making the dps gain noticeable.  I had started with STR line, then respec'd when I got all 17 points needed.  Might I add that the 8.8% haste I got from the str line really wasnt a noticeable gain.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I think I will be doing STA line next as well.  I'm sure I can find a good hammer!</DIV>

[Bobbette]

It doesn't even matter if you can find a 'good' hammer.  As long as you have a hammer to swap out to cast hammer ground, you can swap back to your primary weapon.I have Sta, Wis, and Int all 448.  My primary one-handed weapon is a hammer but I also have a 1h sword to swap out for the Wis sword skill (so I don't lose the shield too).  My primary two-handed weapon happens to be a sword and to use hammer ground I swap to hammer, cast, go back to my sword.Just put the weapons on your hotbar and swap at will ... I have my shield, my symbol, my bow, my 1h hammer, my 1h sword, and my 2h sword all on a bar.  I think you can write macros to equip things and cast the AA skills but I haven't gotten that fancy.I love hammer ground even solo'ing because it can give me those few seconds to cast off an uninterrupted tap veins or evac or FD.  I spec'ed out of it for awhile and missed it way more than I thought I would, so I went back to it.<div></div>

[Norrsken]

FD is insta cast so you dont need to stun your enemies to get it off... Other than that, thats what hammer ground does best. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Knock them nasty 8 mobs back to push the tap veins. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[Beldin_]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Rylight wrote:<BR><BR>when you get to the 2%+ hp AA, you really start getting your points worth. for instance lets say have 6000hp (around lvl 70 most likely) 2% of that is 120hp, so if you spend all 8 AA points on that you will have about 1000+ extra hp, way better then any adorments or armor.<BR><BR> the other AA gives you 5? sta per point, and for whatever reason I think thats about 100hp per point, (may have to reresearch that, I just remember it giving me identical hp as the 2% AA option at a certian lvl) anyways, its a fair amount of life which is great for tanking or pvping.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Thats much overrated .. 15 sta give me 49 hps at the moment .. so 40 will give 130.</P> <P>You get 0,5% HPs for the other skill .. thats 4% with 8 points .. for me 1% = 73hps so 4% = 292 .<BR></P>

[CHIMPNOODLE.]

<DIV>I love the STA line and notice a large difference in the HPs. I also always chose STA/Health related ability-ups on the way up to 70, but I usually sit anywhere from 600 to 800 hp above most SKs on my server with the line maxed out (often 1000 over others with less gear-ups). Hammer ground is very useful for giving a sec for blessing, a debufff, an extra Tap, and even for giving my healers an extra second to keep me stable on some tougher fights (like hammering heroics attached to some epic encounters). Divine Aura is a godsend as well I find.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm sitting around 8300 with all self-buffs up soloing normally (no potions or clickies), and can easily hit 8600 swapping out a couple pieces. That's also considering that I went for Mitigation gear first, so STA and HP on some of the pieces are only mediocre. The difference is very noticeable.</DIV>

[Axxon]

<DIV>INT and STA were no brainers for me.  INT is almost compulsory (as someone else said) and I really wanted the extra HPs from STA.  Plus, an AOE stun is something SK was lacking from other tanks, and I like having it.  I don't mind swapping out a hammer to get it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What drives me nuckin futs is settling on the other path.  I was 100% sold that I was going to do 4/4/8 in STA, INT and WIS, and go down the Reaver line, but then I wonder if WIS is worth it for a non-raider.  I have read all I can about people's choices on these forums and I am still confused. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Is WIS a waste for someone who raids infrequently, if at all?  If yes, what is better:  go down STR, or pile the points in INT and STA? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[d3caffed]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Drakkonius wrote:<BR> <DIV>INT and STA were no brainers for me.  INT is almost compulsory (as someone else said) and I really wanted the extra HPs from STA.  Plus, an AOE stun is something SK was lacking from other tanks, and I like having it.  I don't mind swapping out a hammer to get it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What drives me nuckin futs is settling on the other path.  I was 100% sold that I was going to do 4/4/8 in STA, INT and WIS, and go down the Reaver line, but then I wonder if WIS is worth it for a non-raider.  I have read all I can about people's choices on these forums and I am still confused. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Is WIS a waste for someone who raids infrequently, if at all?  If yes, what is better:  go down STR, or pile the points in INT and STA? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Im really mixed up aswell, i was thinking like this.</P> <P>I took reaver in the new sk tree and thought to myself, how do i get the most out of reaver. Well, being able to dish out spells as quick as possible with as little cooldown as possible. And here i am right now, having 4,4,4,4,1 in str tree, 4,4,8 in int tree and reaver (currently at 65 AP). But i must say that i dont really notice a big difference in that 10% faster cast and cooldown from the last skill in str tree. So im thinking of doing a int,sta,wis combo or maybe int,sta or int,wis. </P> <P>I have tried to do some parsing to see how much you lose in melee between off and def stance, (cause of the loss of cru,sla, pie from def stance) and i seem to miss alot more melee strikes when the mobs are over lvl 65, under that its no biggie. So what can i say, in the longer fights, you might actually benefit from more melee power, but in the normal and short fights, your spells are never used up so you stand waiting for them to cooldown. </P> <P>So i guess it comes down to what you wanna do most, if your playstyle puts you in def stance most of the time, you might actually "have" to go 4,4,8 in wis line to dish out any melee damage. But if you go mostly off stance there is no need for wis line.</P> <P> </P>

[Axxon]

I have been in off most of the time, but I am still only 59 so I don't know what the EoF zones will be like.  I will be tanking for my guild most of the time and doing some off-tanking, so whatever is best for that role is what I will do.

[Naelael]

<div></div>I maxed out the reaver line a while back and love that.. Even the leech touch is useful at times. Though...mostly, only in an emergency solo/duo situation. Have started filling the hate line now, have a few points in each and I must say, I really notice a difference in my ability to hold aggro. Its nice. I've stopped filling in the crusader tree because I feel stuck on it rightnow and I don't know what to do with it next. No matter what I wont be going all the way down. I am sitting at 4/4/4 in sta I think right now. Right now, I am trying to decide if I want to go 8/4/8 in INT instead ofjust the normal 4/4/8 that I (and everyone else) already has. I am a big fan of the boosting of int, so we'll see. I am right now considering if I am going to go down STR or AGI. STR for the recast timer, and AGI for the avoidance. <div></div><p>Message Edited by Naelael on <span class=date_text>01-04-2007</span> <span class=time_text>07:10 AM</span>

[Rylight]

Beldin said <hr width="100%" size="2"> <blockquote> <hr> Rylight wrote:when you get to the 2%+ hp AA, you really start getting your points worth. for instance lets say have 6000hp (around lvl 70 most likely) 2% of that is 120hp, so if you spend all 8 AA points on that you will have about 1000+ extra hp, way better then any adorments or armor. the other AA gives you 5? sta per point, and for whatever reason I think thats about 100hp per point, (may have to reresearch that, I just remember it giving me identical hp as the 2% AA option at a certian lvl) anyways, its a fair amount of life which is great for tanking or pvping. <hr> </blockquote> <p>Thats much overrated .. 15 sta give me 49 hps at the moment .. so 40 will give 130.</p> You get 0,5% HPs for the other skill .. thats 4% with 8 points .. for me 1% = 73hps so 4% = 292 . <hr width="100%" size="2"> im really not going to debate this with you cause I honestly dont remember the exact numbers, I just remember that around lvl 50 or so I was respecting my AA's and was putting 1 point into the 2% and +5pts AA's one at a time, and for some reason they came out pretty even per AA point, though I admit that doesnt exactly make sense considering that 5pts of sta should give you very little hp. I dont know , it was a long time ago. and sadly I dont feel like respecing my AA's agian (im to cheap) so I'll just take your word for it. <div></div>

[Margen]

<P>I switched from the STA hp line to the Wisdom BL line after the combat changes.  When I did a way from the 4pct HP buff I think I lost like 300hp's, which really is pretty weak.  </P> <P>4 pct of 8000hp's is 320 hp's, 12000 hps is 480, so the hp increase is kind of useless in most cases.  Mind you I still have 8 points in melee crits though.</P>