The *new* Death March, is it broken?

[Zehl_Ice-Fire]

<DIV>I /bugged this last night already.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I don't see anywhere in the spell where it says "high chance to give casting SK instant agro, hope you like dying, wiping raids, or have good healers in your raid". <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Here's what it was doing that seemed off to me, tested in Chel'Drak zone (lots of ads), in ToS, and some big lvl 60 epic encounters in Silent City:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <UL> <LI><FONT size=5>sometimes it did NOT set off on the march when I cast it</FONT></LI> <LI>often I seemed to get instant agro, esp on adds of big epic encounters (I'm not the MT)</LI> <LI>EDIT: I remembered the otherthing, I have to test this again when I am solo just to be sure someone else didn't AOE (no clue if someone did but they shouldn't have been), but it seemed to AOE somehow and we got a few ads?</LI></UL><p>Message Edited by discord37 on <span class=date_text>09-08-2006</span> <span class=time_text>02:00 PM</span>

[Nicholai24]

It generates massive aggro. because it's not supposed to be the kind of thing you use right off the bat, or on every epic encounter. The buff is massive, after all, and all it takes is a little judicious use to make it raid-usable. Just cast it before a fight, and kill an add.Essentially, what you've done is /bugged our new AE Taunt. You're going to be lynched if it's nerfed. People will blame you. <span>:smileyindifferent:</span><div></div>

[Addex]

Dude [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] we finally get snap aggro and u bug it?

[DUNN]

Grabs a pitch fork and yells; <FONT size=5><FONT color=#ffff00>KILL HIM!!!!!!!!!</FONT> </FONT>lol j/k

[Eors]

<DIV><STRONG>I don't see anywhere in the spell where it says "high chance to give casting SK instant agro, hope you like dying or have good healers in your raid".</STRONG></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>You do realise this spell has just been changed........maybe you havent got used to it yet.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Dont /bug the bloody thing it works great to get massive aggro if you are tanking.  But if you hit it right off the bat on a raid (and you are not MT)then you are in for some serious trouble just like a wizzy that finger waggles a massive dps spell before the MT gets sufficient aggro!!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It is not bugged...get used to it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Dogm]

<DIV>!</DIV>

[Pins]

So, group buffs aren't meant to give aggro anymore? [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn], I'd like to know when that happened.

[Lockeye]

<DIV>Thankyou discord37,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I received your /bug report and a fix for the aggro problems will make the next hotfix cycle.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kidding! :smileyvery-happy:</DIV>

[Stuge]

*snerk*<span>:smileyvery-happy:</span><div></div>

[Xanoth]

<blockquote><hr>Lockeye wrote:...<div>Kidding! :smileyvery-happy:</div><hr></blockquote>not funny!-.-<p>Message Edited by Xanoth on <span class=date_text>09-08-2006</span> <span class=time_text>06:38 PM</span>

[Zehl_Ice-Fire]

<DIV>Sheesh ppl.. read first. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV>1. I'm a HER.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2. I'm not the MT. Me snapping agro in a raid with a spell that isn't meant to is NOT GOOD and can wipe entire raids.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>3. I dont mind snap agro, I just want the spell to say high agro getting. If i'm not the MT, and very few SKs are raid MTs sadly, this spell is not good to use during a raid which is when the effects would be most beneficial.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>4. Ok so this will be our super fun surprise who knows what will happen spell <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> MAYBE something good, MAYBE wiping raids lol. I guess that is evil, chaotic and fitting to an SK.</DIV>

[Pins]

<blockquote><hr>discord37 wrote:<DIV>Sheesh ppl.. read first. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV>1. I'm a HER.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2. I'm not the MT. Me snapping agro in a raid with a spell that isn't meant to is NOT GOOD and can wipe entire raids.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>3. I dont mind snap agro, I just want the spell to say high agro getting. If i'm not the MT, and very few SKs are raid MTs sadly, this spell is not good to use during a raid which is when the effects would be most beneficial.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>4. Ok so this will be our super fun surprise who knows what will happen spell <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> MAYBE something good, MAYBE wiping raids lol. I guess that is evil, chaotic and fitting to an SK.</DIV><hr></blockquote> Welcome to casting a group buff, it gives aggro.

[Addex]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Lockeye wrote:<BR> <DIV>Thankyou discord37,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I received your /bug report and a fix for the aggro problems will make the next hotfix cycle.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kidding! :smileyvery-happy:</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>You almost made me cry <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR>

[Addex]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> discord37 wrote:<BR> <DIV>Sheesh ppl.. read first. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV>1. I'm a HER.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2. I'm not the MT. Me snapping agro in a raid with a spell that isn't meant to is NOT GOOD and can wipe entire raids.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>3. I dont mind snap agro, I just want the spell to say high agro getting. If i'm not the MT, and very few SKs are raid MTs sadly, this spell is not good to use during a raid which is when the effects would be most beneficial.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>4. Ok so this will be our super fun surprise who knows what will happen spell <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> MAYBE something good, MAYBE wiping raids lol. I guess that is evil, chaotic and fitting to an SK.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>You can never please some ppl eh.....You dont have to cast it right away u know? I hope u dont cast Pestilent Touch on pull or you will want it nerf too....

[Zehl_Ice-Fire]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It is not bugged...get used to it.</DIV> <DIV> <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>It doesn't always go off on cast.. so.. yeah, it's at least minorly bugged. I'd say it only went off on INITIAL CAST half the time.<BR>

[Stuge]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>discord37 wrote:<div>3. I dont mind snap agro, I just want the spell to say high agro getting. If i'm not the MT, and very few SKs are raid MTs sadly, this spell is not good to use during a raid which is when the effects would be most beneficial.</div> <hr></blockquote>All heals, nukes, wards etc. generate hate..especially group heals and wards, but the spell descriptions don't say as much.  It's taken as a given.  Ice Nova doesn't say "Does X damage...and generates aggro so watch it, buddy".  Deathmarch buffs the whole group with a myriad of temporary enhancements that allow folks to really pour it on.  Of course it will generate hate.  You can use it on raids just fine, you just need to learn to be patient and judicious in it's use.  Don't open fights with it or even use it early in the fight if you aren't the MT.  Pick your spots and learn how to use it in it's new form to maximum effectiveness.  It's not broken.  Learn it and love it.</div><p>Message Edited by Stugein on <span class=date_text>09-08-2006</span> <span class=time_text>11:10 AM</span>

[Wrapye]

In Labs raid last night, the SK was grabbing aggro fairly readily when we had a pally MT when I didn't have Harmonious Link on the SK.  We switched to a guard when we got down to Vyemm's area, and the SK was not grabbing aggro (MT/guild leader even offered extra DKP to anyone but me who could take aggro from him on the eye that you kill before Prime/Vyemm.  No one won).  So the aggro increase isn't insurmountable, especially now that the deaggro portion of Harmonious Link works on fighters.<div></div>

[Xanoth]

<blockquote><hr>discord37 wrote:It doesn't always go off on cast.. so.. yeah, it's at least minorly bugged. I'd say it only went off on INITIAL CAST half the time.<BR><hr></blockquote>well i'm bored on the breeding grounds, already been here a few hours waiting for a certain winged critter to show its face... so i'll try casting it every time its re-cast comes around, see how many times it doesn't trigger.i've yet to notice it fail though.

[Heart's Rage]

<DIV>Giving it 1 week before an SK complains about not holding aggro, and Devs please fix SK aggro, yada yada yada.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Shoulda kept it lol</DIV>

[Mistmoore-Milaga]

<div><blockquote><hr>Lockeye wrote:<div>Thankyou discord37,</div> <div> </div> <div>I received your /bug report and a fix for the aggro problems will make the next hotfix cycle.</div> <div> </div><hr></blockquote>Wow, you had me going there for a second!</div>

[Wilin]

<blockquote><hr>discord37 wrote:<DIV>I don't see anywhere in the spell where it says "high chance to give casting SK instant agro, hope you like dying, <b>wiping raids</b>, or have good healers in your raid". <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV><hr></blockquote>(In a Jeff Foxworthy voice) If a single SK dying wipes a raid, then something might be wrong with the raid.As others have said, you have to learn aggro management now. Kinda like the assassin that hits decapitate at the beginning of a fight. A little aggro management is needed.

[CHIMPNOODLE.]

<DIV>I'm MT most of the time for our raids, as well grouping. The  more  tools for generating/upping aggro the better. I didn't notice any difference though as of yet. Was not experiencing any serious ctrl issues prior, and did not after the change either. If the consensus is that this change increased aggro ctrl  however...I'm all for it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Filmore Graves</DIV> <DIV>The Shard Collectors</DIV> <DIV>Unrest</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV><p>Message Edited by CHIMPNOODLE. on <span class=date_text>09-08-2006</span> <span class=time_text>12:51 PM</span>

[Zehl_Ice-Fire]

<DIV>Death march isn't meant to be an agro holder.. its meant to give protection & dps to a group (often the non MT group in a raid). I have used the spell many times in the past pre update. Nothing significant happened. The changes weren't supposed to be *that* drastic that I should even notice other than the initial proc.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As far as "don't cast it at the start", Why? we used to try really hard to kill something before a big pull to have it on at the start (I gave up, because its just not possible inside most raid zones). In raids many mobs, especially the worst, have initial stuns or AEs that it can greatly help against.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>(should someone start a new thread now with duscussion of how we use it/how you should use it grouping vs raiding, tanking vs dpsing?)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As soon as I'm no longer trapped at work.. I will head to some t7 instances or something with my wizzy bf and we'll test this agro stuff out more. We like to do that <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />, see if he can still fusion or ice comet it off me after HT & a lot of rounds of taunts + dirge hate hehe.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Shutup Fillmore <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> (just kidding hehe). </DIV>

[FlintAH]

<div><blockquote><hr>Wilin wrote:<blockquote><hr>discord37 wrote:<div></div><div>I don't see anywhere in the spell where it says "high chance to give casting SK instant agro, hope you like dying, <b>wiping raids</b>, or have good healers in your raid". <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div><hr></blockquote>(In a Jeff Foxworthy voice) If a single SK dying wipes a raid, then something might be wrong with the raid.As others have said, you have to learn aggro management now. Kinda like the assassin that hits decapitate at the beginning of a fight. A little aggro management is needed.<hr></blockquote>Anyone pulling aggro can have the raid wiped if it is the wrong mob at the wrong time.  Nothing like someone pulling Vulicidae or Vyemm and getting all the healers killed.</div>

[CHIMPNOODLE.]

<P>"Shutup Fillmore <IMG height=16 src="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif" width=16 border=0> (just kidding hehe). "</P> <P> </P> <P>:smileysad:</P> <P> </P> <P>Hiya Zehl <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P>

[Addex]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> discord37 wrote:<BR> <DIV>Death march isn't meant to be an agro holder.. its meant to give protection & dps to a group (often the non MT group in a raid). I have used the spell many times in the past pre update. Nothing significant happened. The changes weren't supposed to be *that* drastic that I should even notice other than the initial proc.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As far as "don't cast it at the start", Why? we used to try really hard to kill something before a big pull to have it on at the start (I gave up, because its just not possible inside most raid zones). In raids many mobs, especially the worst, have initial stuns or AEs that it can greatly help against.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>We just got the snap aggro that we have been asking for son long, we got the death march to   finally be useful and you are complaining?</P> <P>Go roll a paladin or something...... j/k</P>

[juz]

<P>SKs raid?</P> <P>Surely you jest? :smileyvery-happy:</P>

[Kelkirra]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Lockeye wrote:<BR> <DIV>Thankyou discord37,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I received your /bug report and a fix for the aggro problems will make the next hotfix cycle.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kidding! :smileyvery-happy:</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Not . . .funny. . . .. . . . . <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR>

[CHIMPNOODLE.]

<DIV>"SKs raid? <P>Surely you jest? <IMG height=16 src="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif" width=16 border=0>"</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P>Who told the entertainer he could stop playing? Back on stage wit ya, the crowd is getting restless!<BR></P> <P> </P> <P> </P></DIV>

[Kelkirra]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> CHIMPNOODLE. wrote:<BR> <DIV>"SKs raid? <P>Surely you jest? <IMG height=16 src="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif" width=16 border=0>"</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P>Who told the entertainer he could stop playing? Back on stage wit ya, the crowd is getting restless!<BR></P> <P> </P> <P> </P></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Wait, you mean they allow us in raids now? O.o

[CHIMPNOODLE.]

<DIV>Yep...been some time now. Actually never stopped raiding <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV><p>Message Edited by CHIMPNOODLE. on <span class=date_text>09-08-2006</span> <span class=time_text>02:48 PM</span>

[Kelkirra]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> CHIMPNOODLE. wrote:<BR> <DIV>Yep...been some time now <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Whewt. I should stay awake more often in our raids then <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[CHIMPNOODLE.]

<DIV>Hehe...if I sleep...raid dies. Then  they might make us <STRONG>stop</STRONG> raiding.</DIV><p>Message Edited by CHIMPNOODLE. on <span class=date_text>09-08-2006</span> <span class=time_text>02:50 PM</span>

[Xanoth]

dont think i've ever fallen asleep raiding...unlike back on tatooine playing SWG, fell asleep and oke up surrounded by random wildlife... o.O

[Kelkirra]

<DIV>It was a joke ppl <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />. I can't sleep while I raid because I'm the MT. -_-</DIV>

[Giral]

<P>best time to cast it Solo or Grouped is when the first Mob is about 1/4 Health , if you cast this Right after the pull, chances are you will take 30 to 40 second's to kill the first target and then it procs of death and takes another 20 to 30 seconds to kill that one and Death march expires </P> <P>so basicly its the same as befor they changed it , befor you use to cast it Right befor the first one died, now you cast it 20 seconds befor the first one dies </P> <P> </P> <P>as for Raid's if you Are the MT best to cast it on PULL for the resist's and increased agro , and if your Not MT just like every other class you shouldn't be going balls to the wall in the first 5 second's(especialy if your in the Dp's group and using ON The march your increasing the Group's dp's so chances are someone in your group isnt expecting to do that extra Damage right off the Bat and they will pull agro doing something they have done numerous times befor ) , throw out your debuff's(as you should), and by then the tank should have agro locked , hit death march and Blast away !</P><p>Message Edited by Giralus on <span class=date_text>09-08-2006</span> <span class=time_text>05:33 PM</span>

[Pitt Hammerfi]

Rofl i died 6 times in labs yesterday , heheh our wizards didnt die once <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />love it

[pawnipt]

Yea if you are to be wanted in a raid you gotta have excelent player skills, especially as a SK since we're not exactly good at just one thing, we have to play our best utilizing every skill we have.  Since this deathmarch change tho i feel like a real tank, since initial agro is much better.  I've been tanking in raids since T5... tho T6 was where it i started getting into tanking heavier, now T7  i have tanked almost everything.  But yea since deathmarch changes, now i actually have something to call in my group that tells people im going at this mob with everything and expect my group to do the same, also any clerics with divine recovery, chaining or stacking with deathmach and you got 110% casting speed, its insane hehe, agro is NP...   fury/dirge/coercer/templar/defiler will make you a godly tank if you know what buffs ya need <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[Ellestil]

<P>I'm sure you guys are familiar with a healer saying "please give me a 10 count before you pull" in groups and on raids. The reason? The massive buff/ward/whatever they cast that has massive aggro associated with it. So, in the same way, Death March is best cast either before the pull so the MT doesn't get stunned/feared/wahtever, or you wait awhile before you cast it to aid with dps. It's just something your gonna have to relearn. However, if you are tanking, then use it right after the pull to help hold aggro. I see no reason why this spell isn't working as intended, and it has proc'd everytime I used it. No offense Discord, but you should really think about what you post concerning a spells effect, and if what your asking for contradicts everything the class your representing has been asking for,  for a very long time.</P> <P>Ellestil</P>

[Vuz]

<blockquote><hr>Lockeye wrote:<DIV>Thankyou discord37,</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>I received your /bug report and a fix for the aggro problems will make the next hotfix cycle.</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>Kidding! :smileyvery-happy:</DIV><hr></blockquote>Wow, nice Lockeye...Not funny! <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[CHIMPNOODLE.]

yep...did some more testing last night. It's phenomenal, I do notice it now that I'm paying attention to it. Excellent.

[Kelkirra]

Yep, the agro is awsome with the new change to DM. Tested it out in Deathtoll last night and was really amazed. O_O

[Margen]

<P>The spell has changed and we will have to adjust to it, I try casting it when the first mob is like 20 pct, figure that will give me a better chance at getting the DB proc.   As for aggro, I want the aggro build up, a lot of times I am the ST and having the ability to pump up aggro if MT goes down is a great benifit IMO.  </P> <P>Just have to remember to not cast in the first couple seconds of the fight, learned that on the first night I raided after change, cast it a bit too soon and had the secondary mob peel off our beserker and wack me hard.  I adjusted after that and haven't had that problem come up much since.</P> <P>This is a good change for our class, we aren't where we need to be yet IMO, but its a nice start.</P>

[Kelkirra]

<DIV>Comming form a MT perspecitve, this spell is an AWSOME addition to our agro management with the change. Jebus, it creates so much hate that it really isn't funny. I'm going to have to adjust if I ever DPS in a raid again to not catch agro O_O. 2 thumbs up on this change Dev's. =D</DIV>

[boviine]

<P>well-death march is great in a group-if the mt has alot of argo on the mob (but sadly i can pull it off him anyway)...try march in a lab raid on a named at 50%-----got the raid wiped. took argo like it was nothing--mt/ma (guardian and bersk) tried pulling it off me w/ rescue (adept 3 and masters) w/o luck. but all in all with some pratice-this spell rocks timmed just right and can gain argo if need me. at the start i was ticked at soe for nerfing it and did some moaning-but after playing w/ it a few times-I want to use it all the time now.</P> <P>soe really did well with this spell-dps (not as much as before-but it dose "on the march" at cast now then again on death blow- so personally i think it works better) and argo baby.....soe fixed to of our sore spots w/ 1 nerfed spell.</P> <P> </P> <P>celo</P> <P>70sk wood elf sk</P> <P>lucan</P>

[boviine]

<P> </P> <P>edit to my last post-wasnt labs-it was a pickup deception raid</P>

[daga]

    Im a lvl 70 sk on unrest server and personly i think that this death march change is the best sk fix so far. IT gives us agro like a zerker and dps like a monk/bruiser. IT is awesome for tanking and raids. Im not a main tank on our raids, i split tank and pickup tank. This change makes us basicaly have the best pick up tanking abilites/split tanking abilities in the game. Only thing i wish they would fix is give us more resist (imo up it by 1k to every stat) and the mana tap spell(its horriably underpowered) Just my 2 cents but Right on with this fix guys , u make me happy to be sk instead of one  of the millionse of warriors out there <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[Beldin_]

Ok .. i know now also that you should NOT use it if you have Pala tanks in HoF and pulls 3 groups at once <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> And since our Wizzy,Fury and Monk already made a contest who could better pull aggro of the pally i couldn't really also ask for amends <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Ellestil]

<P>Don't forget guys that a lttle FD goes a long way if you screw up the timing and pull aggro on raids you weren't meant to.</P> <P>Ellestil</P>

[AziBam]

<DIV>First off let me say [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]!  Death March rocks now when running as MT.  Was working a bit on the claymore line in SoS last night as MT for group and if we had adds with 2-3 encounters at once (wouldn't want the healers to be bored in SoS would we?) I would drop DM...all the targets would just turn to me and presto we were in the the business of creating a lot of bad guy corpses.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It is a bit tricky if you aren't MT.  I had a 70 guard that was MT for group the other night ask if I was running any hate buffs when we were about 25% of the way through a Den run.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  I laughed and said no such thing for an SK unless we are already taking damage (caress).  I have to admit I began using it a bit less since in most fights it just wasn't needed and we burned down the mobs just fine anyway.  I saved it for bigger fights with named etc. in an attempted to avoid pulling aggro.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I like the idea of FD to drop our own aggro.  I assume the buff doesn't shut off when we do that?  I know buffs aren't supposed to but I'll probably test it before I try it in group.  Has anyone else noted that Twisted Aura drops every time we FD...at least it does for me. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>On a somewhat related note, making another Den run with a healer alt of mine last night we had SK for MT.  At the beginning of the zone I asked if he had discovered the joy of the revised Death March.  HE DIDN'T HAVE THE SPELL!  GAH!  Needless to say I encouraged him to look into it.  Doh.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I honestly hope that this isn't an unintended side-effect that gets "corrected" at a later date by the Devs.  That would really be a huge disappointment.  Since Lockeye was able to joke about it above...(hilarious) I will assume we are safe but there is always the worry about the nerf bat. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Margen]

<DIV>Well the aggro generation from this is a bit tricky at times.  I died 4 times casting last night in DT (all multi mob encounters), mobs where usually at like 30pct.  I ended up switching to sword/board vs two handed, and that helped.  On singles peeling aggro from the MT wasn't really a problem.  But it was awsome when our tank got charmed by the gazers, I cast it and I had locked aggro not even our beserker could peel it off.  I haven't seen a huge personal dps increase from it, its increased, but the 10 second timer limits it a bit.  But the mages in my group deffinetly like it.  Part of less dps may be due to that we have a large amount of dps in the raid and trash mobs drop very fast, so my dots etc. may not have time to build up.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The spell has drasticly changed and we are going to have to play around with it a bit to learn the best way to use it, but it deffentliy is one of the nicer changes for SK in a while.  I find the aggro increase is awsome and once I find the best way to use it my deaths will drop, I have no problem adjusting to a learning curve for having increased agro.</DIV>

[greenmantle]

<BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Just a tip for the SK's that love their healers. I missed that there was a change to the spell on the boards. I know my fault should be looking for every ones changes not just mine.  But i did wonder what was going on last night , mt has agro things going well , Sk says , starting death march , hmm why is the sk now orange.  If they might have missed it just give your healer a tip that it now gets agro like a wizzy pulling with ice comet.

[Incur]

<DIV>Firstly, we raid but we have a very "strange" raid force, MA = me as a SK, SA = another sk</DIV> <DIV>We are a evil roleplaying guild so as you can imagine not perfect raid force, but i love the success we get because of it, and in terms of death march!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I love it =)  so many uses as well because of the way the aggro works,  and half way through the fight the sa can pop it off, DOESNT gank aggro and we carry on, so obviously its not too overpowered aggrowise, and like the other guys say, FD is a wonderfull tool!<BR></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Love the changes, no more aggro loss to necros!</DIV>

[Diern]

<P>This change is simply the best thing to happen to SK's in a long time. Now how about a lower level version?</P> <P>It's nauseating that we finally get the snap agro many of us have been clamouring for, and someone has to report it as a bug and complain.</P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[Kryptonix]

I noticed like everyone else that Death March is like another Rescue, but its like an AE Rescue. HUGE plus when I tank in groups. Something else I have been noticing. When I am not MT in groups, I have been pulling agro away from the MT using a debuff. I would cast debuffs like 3 to 5 seconds into the fight and I would sometimes pull agro. Also happened to me a couple of times during a raid. I thought it was kinda weird. Anyone else experiencing an agro increase to your debuffs?<div></div>

[CHIMPNOODLE.]

<DIV>I'm loving this change. It is great against mem -wipe mobs and generating aggro on caster mobs that hang back due to it's area of effect as well. Was particularly useful against Lord Vyerm last night after a couple of his aerial throws. If you are MT it helps lock aggro early, if you are not MT...you must wait until the MT has things locked down and it will not steal aggro. If not MTing it will make SKs even more desireable for backup tank as well. This is exactly the little something extra SKs wanted. Brawlers have the fast recast FD and group FD as well as the high DPS/hp/tsunami, Zerkers have the temp Defense/miti buff and higher DPS and snap aggro, Warriors have the miti buff/autoparry/hp edge and wide range of taunts....this is a great new tool to our arsenal.  </DIV>

[Oakum]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> greenmantle wrote:<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Just a tip for the SK's that love their healers. I missed that there was a change to the spell on the boards. I know my fault should be looking for every ones changes not just mine.  But i did wonder what was going on last night , mt has agro things going well , Sk says , starting death march , hmm why is the sk now orange.  If they might have missed it just give your healer a tip that it now gets agro like a wizzy pulling with ice comet.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P> </P> <P><BR>Question is, will the healer love the SK enough to heal or will we just let them die like any other dps when they draw aggro?</P> <P>If they are MT then we expect that they will need healing. Even as MA unless they are offtanking we dont expect to have to heal too much on them. </P> <P>It takes less power to rez and necro's, dirge's, or Pally's would probably do that anyway in a raid, lol. For me, it would depend on how much power I had left and how hard the MT was getting hit and how valuable I considered what the SK was bringing to the raid/group.</P> <P>I prefer to keep group/raid members alive but not at the expense of contributing to a wipe with accidental aggro stealing not giving the mt a quick heal when he/she takes some big burst damage due to lack of aggro management. Every once in a while taking aggro can be a skilled player pushing the envelope and it might be better off to just let them die so the MT gets aggro back.  Every 3nd or 4th fight is lack of aggro management IMO. </P>

[pawnipt]

The healers love me,the healers love me not,the healers love me,the healers love me not........ AHHHH FIEGN DEATH!Hehe in my guild the healers love me, cuz i tell them too! or i usually [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] at em<div></div>