Please give advice. Conjurers in PVP........No answer, they own me.

[Ramglob]

<DIV>I apologize for posting this again.  I posted it before and still for a loss on what to do.   I am now a level 56 SK Champion and I would like to think I am half decent player.  I am not saying I am great.  Not at all.  I feel that the SK 1 on 1 is very good in PVP battles.......especially against melee players.  My heal / damage spells for the most part tear them up pretty good.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I have absolutly no answer for (Conjurers)  one on one in pvp.  I hear that they are going to be nerfed which sucks for them but at least it gives me a fighting chance.  I hate when they nerf classes because it takes away characteristics and personality of classes.   I don't want them to be nerfed but the damage they do in a short amount of time is ridiculous.  I mean not even fair.  I would have a better chance at taking down Vox by myself.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I jumped one on the TS docks today and he was 3/4 health at the time.  We were both 56.  My HT was down at the time which would not have made a difference.  I landed the first blow and that was pretty much the extent of my fight.  The pet came and before I had a chance to TAP veins I was dead.  The fight lasted less than 2 seconds.  I literally had a chance to cast maybe 2 spells.  My gear is exc.  I guess I could have FD'd but it really wouldn't have mattered.  It would have delayed the inevitable.  How do other classes fight against them?  I seriously thought that 1 on 1 I would stand a decent chance against anything.  This is about the 5th time I have fought this class one on one and the result is ugly every time if the levels are close.  By ugly I am meaning that I don't even get spells off.  I love a fair fight but I might as well stand there because by the time I hit my first spell I am at 1/4 health.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Please Please Please tell me that other SK's are having a hell of a time against them and that they are our Kryptonite.  I felt like such a wimp after the fight.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Any strategy would be helpful (although isn't it hard to have a strategy if you can only get off 1 -2 spells and the fights last less than 2 seconds)  It is not my gear.  I have never seen another SK with better gear than myself for my level. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Please give me your thoughts.  I could use the help.  </DIV>

[efarbero]

<P>im a 53 conj with mostly masters/adept3 spells and i dont really know how the conj are beating u so fast. it takes a while for us to establish a good dps, so im not sure how he beat u in 2 seconds.  i have never kiled anyone in few seconds, especially tanks.  perhaps you are exaggerating?</P> <P>if you are telling the truth, then now you know how we casters feel when attacked by scouts...we die in few seconds. </P>

[NecroNoc]

You are not the only one who is experiencing this. It has gotten to the point where I have begun to avoid all pet type classes, but Conj's especially. I have never been beaten that quickly, but i do find myself at a total loss against this class. Even with HT available unless I have my lifetap running then there is absolutely no chance for me to take out one of them. I have even been handed my armored a** by a conj that was blue con to me. I have only been able to last long enough to get them down to about 1/4 health, but relying solely on my high resists to get me that far and not offensive techniques. So Im with you, and will be watching this post vigorously for any help. Good Post

[Ramglob]

I really am not exagerating.  My fights with conj are so fast that I can't even implement a strategy.  I almost think it is better to attack the pet because at least you can stun the pet for 2 seconds (which is about how long my fights last with them)and have a little chance.  Unless I have a strong healer I die in seconds.  When I was a level 51 I fought a 46 in EL.  We both squared off and about 2 seconds into the fight I was less than half health and had to use HT just to barely win.  My partner at the time was a 51 Brig and I a 51 SK.  It was our first time in SS.  We rolled up a hill and found Refugee (conj) at the top.  My Brig partner was in front of me and got dropped within I would say 2 seconds.  I to hit shield bash and attempt dire smite both fast casting spells before I got dropped as well.  The total fight probably lasted 4-5 seconds.  The pet just tore through us.  I didn't even get mad.  I just kind of laughed.   I just don't get it.  If I am a tank in exc gear no class should be able to drop me solo that fast.  I can understand losing fights.  It happens.  You get out played, you get frazzled etc.......But I am telling you that no matter what I did I would have only been able to get two spells off.  I would have died no matter what.  I hate nerf posts.  I like the different characteristics of the classes.  It makes the game unique and interesting.  I don't even want the playing fields to be even, but come on.  At leasrt allow fights to involve some skill.  If a tank class is going to lose at least allow us some dignity.  Allow us to take a beating.  I am telling you that the conjurers in PVP do more damage than any Wiz or Warlock.  They just beat me down.  <div></div>

[Jhall04]

<DIV>Not sure whats going on against conjurors but I do know this...... my group of 4 all in our low 40s attacked a 50 SK and we could not hardly do anything to him with all the lifetaps and evidently good gear,  we didnt have a conj but 2 tanks a healer and a wizzy and any damage we did he just tapped back over time.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Just my 2 pennies.</DIV>

[Kurindor_Mythecnea]

That's what you call foolish nubs facing comprehension of the level gap's apex. IMHO, the level gap should be 5 in neutral zones, 4 for encroachers on aligned zones, and 6 for defenders of aligned zones. Aligned zones would include the surrounding city newbie zones, Commonlands, Antonica, Nekutlos Forest, and the Thundering Steppes. After that point, no clear distinguishment is made between either of the 2 cities' affiliation. At least if my plan was in place, then you wouldn't even have the option to be a fool. <span>:smileyvery-happy:</span><div></div>

[Terabithi]

I was pretty darn clear about this the last time you posted. It is your RESISTS. you need BETTER RESISTS. Until you can resist those spells better, you are a sitting duck. Your awesome mitigation means nothing to a caster.

[Zarovi]

Conjurer's are abit overpowered at the moment. If you don't believe me look at the Highest Magic hit for my server Venekor... 3 conjurers in the top 10 and all 3 being ranked higher then the only wizzy in the top 10. The wizzy is lvl 70 and the 3 Conjurers are lvls 65, 61, and 56. So having a 56 Conjuror able to single hit for more damage then a 70 Wizard is not overpowered? A hard nerf is needed for the pet classes. I have fought a Conjuror 1 on 1 around 20 times. Of the 20 times I won twice. Their pets and the caster's nukes have you almost dead by the time you get a swing on the cloth wearer. The damage burst they do is just insane. The only reason I won the two fights was from getting a good couple swings in then Harm Touching them. I am lvl 58 and all these fights are from lvl 45 to current.

[MorgothTheTerrib]

What I normally do is nuke the pet with a HT and/or another big spell. Once that pets down, it shouldn't be too hard. Just make sure you throw down your disease debuff first. Besides, they're conjurors are about to get the long awaited nerf anyway.

[Ramglob]

<P>Would that work?  HT ing the pet?  That actually makes the most sense so far.  </P> <P>Would a quick disease debuff and a HT drop one?  </P> <P>How fast can they cast another one up?</P>

[Kelkirra]

<DIV>I have a necro and it does take quite some time to cast the general pets. During this time though, the summoner is going to be a sitting duck for your stuns and other spells. Kill the pet, and eat the master alive =).</DIV>

[ssythe]

I was under the impression that conj pets had a good amount of hp but lousy mit(depends on pet they use of course).IF that was true wouldnt there be  chance it would absorb the ht and and not die?Reason i ask is cuz i remember some conj saying there pet had some insane amount of hp..like 13 k or something.

[Kelkirra]

<DIV>They can buff their pet with some decent HP, mostly through the use of Planeshift. Their pets still don't have that much HP and if it does survive the HT, stun and lifetap. I have never personally focused on the pet persay in duels, I go after the master and don't have that much trouble. But that is me. </DIV>

[saubertounito]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Sarasoon wrote:<BR> <DIV>They can buff their pet with some decent HP, mostly through the use of Planeshift. Their pets still don't have that much HP and if it does survive the HT, stun and lifetap. I have never personally focused on the pet persay in duels, I go after the master and don't have that much trouble. But that is me. </DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>What about when HT is down? Basicly the OP needs better resists, theres nothing else to it.

[Kelkirra]

<DIV>It is all dependant upon which pet they are using. I find that the tank pet is much harder to contend with than their DPS pet. If they bring the tank pet out, pray HT is up, if they attack with the DPS pet, then lay into the conj themselves. Resists aren't exactly going to help you against a pet swinging 3 times harder than you can with melee damage.</DIV>

[Callale]

<DIV><STRIKE>For a wizzie... </STRIKE></DIV> <DIV><STRIKE></STRIKE> </DIV> <DIV><STRIKE>Root the pet...  + Nuke the caster = </STRIKE></DIV> <DIV><STRIKE></STRIKE> </DIV> <DIV><STRIKE>Dead caster.</STRIKE> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Heh, spending too much time on the PVP boards... </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Actually on my 26 SK, I am having a really tough time with this caster type. </DIV><p>Message Edited by Callale on <span class=date_text>05-11-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:23 PM</span>

[ssythe]

<DIV>YA think if the op would post his resists that would help maybe come up with a solution.Im also curious is it the scout pet thats lighting you up? are you letting it have open shots at ur backside(if they even need that to do optimal damage).also i thought certain pets stifle and such.. could that be why u dont get spells/ca's off?.I dont know too much about conj other then they do hella dps:p</DIV>

[Kelkirra]

Their tank pets do stiffle and stun. The DPS pets are just sick with DPS if they can hit you <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Stun stun stun =)

[sshhhh]

I'm searching the SK forums for another reason... but happened upon this thread.  I'm a 70 conj on butcherblock (which isn't PVP but i've dueled lots).Heres the deal... we can short duration buff the hell outta a pet if you give us the time before.  Its a huge burst of dps but then it drops significantly... on a duel I have plenty of time to do this as there is a countdown.  On pvp if you got the jump I wouldn't.The only way someone is gonna take me down in a duel is if they can interupt or stun within 2 seconds of the start of the fight normally... as thats how long it takes me to cast a snare or stifle.  Once I get one of them off I cast another, and another, and meanwhile my pet just wails away.  If you get in close and nail me right away (zerkers seem to do this well, and some scouts do from a range)... I'll melt before I have a chance to do anything.  No my pet will still take about half your HP down... but then his dps buffs will drop and I will be unable to finish the job.If you can snare and get in close I'll most likely melt too (unless I have VERY high focus) as I can't get away to stop you from interupting me with melee.If you let me run around like an idiot long enough though the pet will finish the job... fighting in geography I even use the mage pet sometimes as he stays back and drops bombs.  I just run behind stuff while he picks you off.Anyway =)... get in close/fast and interupt/stun ASAP.  Time is on my side not yours.  Most of my dps is dot oriented and essentially after the buffs wear off my pet is just a walking perpetual dot.  Don't even think about healing either... its a quick fight to the finish with us.You're right though... that initial burst is strong enough that if I get the jump on you and have time to buff up there isn't much you can do about it.  It goes both ways... I know some rangers, brigands, zerkers, etc that will drop me in 2 seconds if I'm not ready for it.  Its all about match ups I guess... A kills B... B kills C... but C might nail A to the wall.p.s. never take pet down first... root or snare if you can (group types work)... but always focus on the conjhappy hunting- dwibble -70 conj - CoLeader Dracos Argentwww.dracosargent.com<div></div>

[Mmaster]

<blockquote><hr>Terabithian wrote: I was pretty darn clear about this the last time you posted. It is your RESISTS. you need BETTER RESISTS. Until you can resist those spells better, you are a sitting duck. Your awesome mitigation means nothing to a caster. <hr></blockquote>I think you forgot conjurers use pets, when I duel a conj they dont really have much on me, I have 80% against physical so their scout pet hits me for about 20-30. I messed around with reflect and ended up reflecting Calcify, their big 12 second stun, after that I just auto attacked her to death. Mitigation means everything to a class that relies on melee, if the conj has a mage out just kill it. Dont forget to use doom jugdement and pay attention to their stoneskin.  Their is nothing to anyone but Swashbucklers, and Brigands(but you dont have to worry about Brigs ;D)<div></div>

[sshhhh]

<div></div>you're a little confused there... Calcify is a 5 second stun not 12.our "shattered" line is a 5 second stifle but it used to 12 seconds.Concerning your mitigation vs air pet... that all good and fine... but its his CA's and multiple buffs that do damage not his melee swings.  Meaning you need to have cold and heat resists for his CA's and those buff procs. Mitigation/Avoidance vs. a Conj is useless as stated above.-dwib-<div></div><p>Message Edited by sshhhhhh on <span class=date_text>05-17-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:45 PM</span>

[Mmaster]

<blockquote><hr>sshhhhhh wrote:<div></div>you're a little confused there... Calcify is a 5 second stun not 12.our "shattered" line is a 5 second stifle but it used to 12 seconds.Concerning your mitigation vs air pet... that all good and fine... but its his CA's and multiple buffs that do damage not his melee swings.  Meaning you need to have cold and heat resists for his CA's and those buff procs. Mitigation/Avoidance vs. a Conj is useless as stated above.-dwib-<div></div><p>Message Edited by sshhhhhh on <span class="date_text">05-17-2006</span> <span class="time_text">01:45 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote> No, im sorry, CA's are not spells. They take your mitigation in to account, I think you are confused.<div></div>

[Xanoth]

depends on the damage type of the CA'sas a SK im sure your well aware that our own CA's do disease damage, not melee (some anyway). Agony being a good example<div></div>

[Mmaster]

<div></div>I dont think he understands where the real DPS is coming from, the pets have procs, which really dont sum up to much when you have even the minimal resistances. If you want to figure this stuff out for yourselfs just go through your combat logs and see whats killing you. <div></div><p>Message Edited by Mmaster on <span class=date_text>05-18-2006</span> <span class=time_text>12:35 PM</span>

[sshhhh]

<div></div>Not confused it all... just stating facts...CA / Spells... whatever... =)Semantics aside... elemental resists are what you need... not mitigation.The damage you're taking from a melee pet's (skills, CA's, spells, whatever =) is Cold.If you don't believe me...http://eq2.eqsummoners.com/viewtopic.php?t=2633&highlight=possessCheck under the "Aery" pet... notice that all the damage is cold.The procs/buffs on this pet that "I" cast add fire/cold damage as well.The damage from conj is mostly fire/cold.What exactly are you "mitigating" here with your... well... "mitigation"<img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div><p>Message Edited by sshhhhhh on <span class=date_text>05-18-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:18 PM</span>

[sshhhh]

anxiously awaiting any corrections you can help with on my classes dps Mmaster...sorry I couldn't help myself... he started it <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[Mmaster]

As I said, I am coming from the standpoint of PvE, not PvP and trying to help out, as you however are a numbskull. I said I've dueled conjurers and they havent landed much besides their autoattack, which I would be more afraid of then those CA's you brought up. <div></div>

[sshhhh]

<div></div>Alright... thought this was a PVP thread... I'm confused.  Not sure what why a SK would be commenting on a conjuror's skills in PVE for?  Or why/where PVE is in this thread.Was just sharing what I "know" is killing the people I kill and what the ones that give me trouble do.Anyway... happy hunting all.<div></div><p>Message Edited by sshhhhhh on <span class=date_text>05-22-2006</span> <span class=time_text>06:36 AM</span>

[Durlinn]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Sarasoon wrote:<BR> Their tank pets do stiffle and stun. The DPS pets are just sick with DPS if they can hit you <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Stun stun stun =)<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>This is why my 35 SK has trouble with conjs. I start by throwing a pet at them, then follow up with all the dots I can get on them from a distance because they will surely root first. If they or their pet stifles me, Im basically gone in a few moments. If I can get my shield up and a pet to disrupt the conj, before stunned or stifled, I have a decent chance of killing him. Going after the pet just gives them the chance to nuke you into oblivion. Course having HT up is a whole different story.

[tequiero]

most conjers in pvp will have there mages pet up or scout/  the mage pet   can be killed pretty fast trust me on this and the scout  dont take that long to go down either, it takes about 10-15 seconds to cast another pet, and liek stated above we are sittign ducks while casting that new pet.  the tank pet has tons of HP but no dps what so ever,  know the pets and you know what to kill first