MAJOR Problem if what I am seeing is correct (Proc'n abils)

[VonStein]

<DIV>27 SK.... playing quite a bit lately and suddenly realized that Grim Harbinger was never going off.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So I started testing.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Tested with  Grim Harbinger (5% chance to proc)</DIV> <DIV>Infernal Pact: Ward with 10% chance for damage and heal proc</DIV> <DIV>Tainted Caress: 7% for an essence used to create pets.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>With all three up, ONLY Tainted caress would proc.</DIV> <DIV>Infernal and Grim up: Only Grim would proc</DIV> <DIV>Tainted and Infernal: Tainted would proc</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The ONLY time Infernal Pact would proc is if neither of the others was up...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Weapons did not affect this, order of throwing the spells didn't affect it.... only which spells were up.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>In essence, some of our class defining abilities will NOT work together.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Pretty sad.... if I'm correct.</DIV>

[Exmortis_MT]

<P>I beleive infernal [act was meant to be cast on others, and its quit useless otherwise, too short to be of use anyway.  Grim harbringer is a nice proc, especially when teamed up with a procing weapon. </P> <P> </P>

[VonStein]

<P>Actually, Infernal pact, if it actualy worked correctly, is not a bad soloing abil at 27.</P> <P> </P> <P>Wards for 250ish damage, which is 4-8 normal monster hits (non CA) at that level... and if I don't have the other abils up, with a 10% proc it heals for 54 pts of damage (if it proc's).</P> <P>Its been a life save a few times for me.</P>

[VonStein]

<P>Does no one else notice this??</P> <P> </P> <P>Or does no one else care....</P>

[emmerde]

i noticed that grim was not going off either and made a post about it on these boards about a week ago. eventually i did notice it trigger ONCE and thus far only once.  ive  parsed numerous battles and have still only seen it proc that one time.  i keep grim up anyway, even though it uses a concentration, becos theres always the hope itll trigger when i need it most lol. <div></div>

[VonStein]

<P>If you don't throw tainted carress or Holy weapon, then it procs about right...</P> <P>If you have holy up, only Holy procs for me...</P> <P>If I have Tainted carress up, which I normaly do to get Essences and the Debuff, then it NEVER works...</P> <P>Same with Infernal pact, but worse, only time I can get infernal to proc is if both Tainted and Grim DOWN, then it works right...</P> <P> </P> <P>Sad really... as these are truly 3 of our class defining abils...</P>

[Greggthegrmreapr]

<DIV>I noticed when playing with my SBH that i equpiied when i hit 28, that if i just have Grim and Vigor of trust up, it went off 5 or 6 times in a fight with a green solo skeleton...  now if i put something else up it never did, or was so rare, i never saw it.</DIV>

[Exmortis_MT]

<DIV>Last night we toiok down 4 raid targets as a guild, so based on this thread I put up in order:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Grim harbringer</DIV> <DIV>Blessed Weapon</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>They both proc, grim more then blessed, but I beleive order may be secret.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Rathumgo]

Infernal Pact is meant for others? As a 34 Sk with Infernal pact at adept 3 it wards for 450......fairly useful really. Also increases hate.  So cast it on yourself every 15 seconds and you're laughing. <div></div>

[VonStein]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Exmortis_MT wrote:<BR> <DIV>Last night we toiok down 4 raid targets as a guild, so based on this thread I put up in order:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Grim harbringer</DIV> <DIV>Blessed Weapon</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>They both proc, grim more then blessed, but I beleive order may be secret.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Thanks... good info to know...</P> <P>Could you possibly test those after throwing Tainted Carress however?? (debuff and gives you an essense).</P> <P>I can't get em to proc while Tainted is up.</P> <P> </P> <P>thanks</P> <P> </P>

[VonStein]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Rathumgore wrote:<BR>Infernal Pact is meant for others? As a 34 Sk with Infernal pact at adept 3 it wards for 450......fairly useful really. Also increases hate.  So cast it on yourself every 15 seconds and you're laughing.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Do you see the DD and Heal affect when you have Grim up though? Should happen fairly often as its at 10%.

[Lord Hackenslash]

I use all these spells and i see them all proc. the proc percentages are not exactly how the spells define them but i have all these spells up most of the time as well as an imbued weapon and have seen them all function in a single encounter.  one reason you may not see some of them proc is they do not all have distinct graphics and can be resisted. if you test this on some lower level mobs you will see an increaded proc rate due to  less resitances.

[Kazander13]

<DIV>OK here goes again lol. Girm Harbinger(5%) and Blessed Weapon (5%) have always stacked. Grim Harbinger Blessed weapon and Tainted Caress(7-10%) stack and all 3 proc while all three are up. The only one I am not able to test properly at the moment is Infernal Pact because....it lasts 23 seconds, not even that to be honest. And if the ward goes so does the voracious voracious soul proc. But here's another twister with you I duo most the time with my wife who is a defiler, she can also place the Voracious Soul proc on me and it does go off with other abilities( thought it was mine but realized I never had Infernal Pact up). So if it's being measured in that sense than yes they probly all work. I hate to say it but it's difficult to properly test all of these since they are all random and all at a very low percentage to proc. Of all the buffs Infernal Pacts lasts the least next to degree of decay(Which stacks with the others and procs as well) which is only a few seconds. So to be honest I think the lottery effect is mainly kicking everyones [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]. This isn't the first thread started on this issue and so far every time I've seen it, the test come out with them all stacking. It's just low percentages and yeah, it sucks. Lord Hackenslash is correct as well, they can be resisted and worse things like Grim Harbinger and Tainted Caress have the exact same graphic.</DIV>

[VonStein]

<P>I've tested this a number of times, and watched it across three days of play.... as stated, at this current time..</P> <P> </P> <P>If I throw Tainted Carress, Grim will not Proc.</P> <P>If Tainted or Grim are up, Infernal Pact will not proc...</P> <P> </P> <P>If I drop Tainted, or don't throw it, Grim procs fine... see it a couple of times a fight....</P> <P>If I don't have Grim or Tainted up, I DO see infernal pact proc at about a 10% rate (taking dealy into account), which it does NOT if the others are up.</P>

[Kazander13]

<DIV>Not sure what's going on then because I have definitely seen Grim go off while Tainted is up. I have also for sure seen Infernal proc with Grim however have not caught with tainted yet. What I'll do is since tomorrow is quest day for me I'll run it trhough the wash a few more times and see if I can get that one figured out. I honestly don't know what to say about the ones you said don't work for you. Like I said before it isn't the first time I've tried troubleshooting this and only a few have noted the issue. Everytime I've tested mine worked fine. I'll ask a few other SK's on my server to test it out as well to see if anyone else noticed anything.</DIV>

[emmerde]

well after just a few battles i have found that you are correct.  i actually saw grim's proc a few times when i didnt use tainted (which i used to use to pull) and the only other self buff up being unholy order.  guess i now know why i wasn't seen grim's proc before.  it wont work if other buffs or spells are up, also. <div></div>

[VonStein]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> emmerdeur wrote:<BR>well after just a few battles i have found that you are correct.  i actually saw grim's proc a few times when i didnt use tainted (which i used to use to pull) and the only other self buff up being unholy order.  <BR>guess i now know why i wasn't seen grim's proc before.  it wont work if other buffs or spells are up, also.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Yeah, I don't know if anything has changed, but this seems to be the state as of now...</P> <P> </P> <P>Please... others.... go test...</P>

[VonStein]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kazander13 wrote:<BR> <DIV>Not sure what's going on then because I have definitely seen Grim go off while Tainted is up. I have also for sure seen Infernal proc with Grim however have not caught with tainted yet. What I'll do is since tomorrow is quest day for me I'll run it trhough the wash a few more times and see if I can get that one figured out. I honestly don't know what to say about the ones you said don't work for you. Like I said before it isn't the first time I've tried troubleshooting this and only a few have noted the issue. Everytime I've tested mine worked fine. I'll ask a few other SK's on my server to test it out as well to see if anyone else noticed anything.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Thinkin on it... bet Grim Proc'd after Tainted expired....

[Kazander13]

<P>I took a few days to respond for a reason but yes it's confirmed. I have not gotten Grim to proc while Tainted Essence is up. I have tested it in many capacities and I could not get it to go off. The weird thing is, I'm 100% certain I tested this a while back and everything was working properly so I'm forced to believe that a recent update has caused this. Not sure which one but I know it was working before /sigh</P> <P>Grim with tainted was the only one I really attempted so I'll take a look into the others as well, but so far this is looking like a trend. This needs a response or more attention because if this turns out true in all aspects this makes a lot of spells (especially those that use up concentration) not worth using.</P> <P>I wanted to say at first that I felt the effect was minor however, the meat of the SK class has and always will be versatility. Adding everything up to run your opponent into the ground. And if this portion is ignored I believe it could have a negative effect on the overall play of the class. I would like some of the higher level SK's out there if possible to take a few moments while soloing/grouping to check if this is the same with the spell replacements.</P> <P>-Kaz</P>

[VonStein]

<P>Yep... this is a HUGE hit to SK's... Makes playin my SK... my very fist character, the one my Account is named for, a character that I've played across 12 different game systems, and 26 years of RPG, get shelved again...</P> <P> </P> <P>Roled up a Swashy, heck, at least I know they are nerfed...</P>

[EnraptureE]

<DIV>I'll start off with that in general, I have Grim, Knights & Vigor up at most times.  I pull with Tainted, run to safe spot & Infernal meself.  I will admit, I wasn't useing Tainted quite as much a few lvls ago, cause for awhile I wasn't fighting mobs worth it, ie, unless its hard green heroic, it wasn't worth the power.  Now, to what I've noticed;</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I have seen, over the past couple days, as I've been paying extra attention, after having all of the proc's up (minus pre Grim) that everything is going off.  I've Infernal lifetapped, Grim'd & pulled an Essence off the same mob all in 7 seconds.  Its rare, its freaky when it happens, as I pretty much am blinded by lights, but I've seen it, by rechecking logs.  Last night was when I really noticed this, while doing owlbears for SBH quest, I had about 40 to get, which of course meant I had to kill 90 ><.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I noted that during the 3 hoursish I was doing this, that I seemed to proc quite variably.  There seemed to be no real discernable equation to it.  I was fighting weak, average, heroic greens & the odd blue & some grey all varied & I couldn't tell any difference in proc rates.  It truly seemed to be a 5-10% ratio chance to go off, depending on the randomness of that percentile.  I'd see resists of everything & I'd get 3 infernal procs in 1 round & then none for the next 2 casts.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I will say however, that I seemed to get more lifetaps from Infernal last night,than I've noticed in awhile & before I wasn't using Tainted as much, so it may have been a) some small tweaking change with the patch we didn't hear about or b) was just straight up randomness.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So, at least for the moment, they seem to be going off normally, as "normal" can be.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Reav</DIV> <DIV>"plotting the assassination of Lucan D'[Removed for Content]"</DIV>

[VonStein]

<P>My symptoms have changed as well...</P> <P> </P> <P>Now, if tainted is up, I will Proc Pact, but not Grim.... but as soon as tainted drops, grim will start to go off...</P> <P> </P> <P>Bet symptoms will change next update... LOL...</P> <P>Im begining to believe there is some inconsistancy in how Proc's are put on the list... and checked to see if they are going off.... and it changes from update to update...</P>

[VonStein]

Still can't get Grim to proc if tainted up.... sigh...

[Kazander13]

<P>Well I found the payer "cure" (yes there's sarcasm lol). The upgrade to cursed caress and unholy blessing pretty much fixed the main probs. Hate to use leveling as a fix though. Maybe someone (dev) might see this and take a look at it. Seems the problems is with the lower level versions stacking. I'll post again if I find any problems with these.</P> <P> </P> <P>-Kaz</P>