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View Full Version : Eloquently put...and deserves to have it's own thread.


Bootstwadd
02-24-2005, 04:46 AM
<DIV><STRONG><FONT size=4>Sorry to have stolen your post (from the consolidated list thread), but I thought it was incredibly well written and should be garnering ALOT more attention.</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT size=4>Thank you Durfea~Trecal...</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT size=4></FONT></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> <DIV> <DIV>DurFea Trecal, Shadow Crusader of Antonia Bayle</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I have several issues with the Shadow Knight sub-class as seen from the roleplaying point of view.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>First and foremost, as a member of the FIGHTER Archetype, the Shadow Knight should be able to wield any basic weapon in the game system.  The very basis of the character springs from a knowledge of the use of weapons to inflict harm upon others.  That should inlcude the entire range of basic weapons, including the simplest of ranged weapons.  If I wish to be a level 50 Shadow Knight and use a simple maple bow that I made myself when I was a level 8 artisan than I should be able to do so.  I should also be able to equip and fight with Heritage Weapons such as the Shiny Brass Halberd.  From my basic training as a fighter I would know what such an item was used for, I would recognize the bladed end from the holding end, and I should be able to hit something over the head with it enough times to eventually kill it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Second, as the purely evil opposite of the iconic noble knight, a Shadow Knight should gain pleasure in dealing misery and death to his enemies.  As a player base, we expect and understand that we can neither do as great amount of damage as a pure fighter, nor have the spell selection of a pure mage....our class in general is mostly a roleplaying class.  Therein is the argument for our skills, abilities and spells to carry a flare that other classes may not have.  The Shadow Knight Pet is my biggest dissappointment based on this premise.  If I only get one pet...and he only lasts for one kill....and I have to slay hundreds of creatures to gather enough essences to conjure that one pet....then when I call forth that pet, my comrades should stand in awe, and my enemies should tremble in fear at the mere sight of this fowl demon which comes to do my bidding.  One made the suggestion of a ghostly hound, or hell hound perhaps.....yes, that is an excellent start.  I envisioned a ghostly presence of the creature whose essence I had actually captured, based purely on the spell descriptions.  But my comrade said it best...and I too am not impressed with the "floating brown [Removed for Content]".</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thirdly, as I am a Shadow Knight of the City of Freeport, and a walking omen upon the battlefield of my enemies....my horse was my first true banner of my chosen path.  We were among the first to ride into the Commonlands upon our trusted mounts...to the envy of those around us.  And as much as those horses came to be a part of the traditional icon of the knights of the middle ages and on into the final years of the mounted cavalry, to see any player upon a horse was to acknowledge that player's rank and purpose.  It was at first, a dissappointment that the mounts carried no beating hoof sounds...and it is at best, an insult that a mount cannot cross a stream or survive swimming across a body of water.  But to take the very speed from our mounts, that only served us while traveling and fighting in solitude...is truly to show disdain for the Overlord of Freeport Himself....who by his very appearance, can only be judged to be a Shadow Knight at heart.  Why can any character in the game simply fork over the plunder of treasure, and attain not only the same status symbol of my rank and class, but best it as well?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And finally....I bring your attention to HARM TOUCH and GRAVEN EMBRACE.</DIV> <DIV>Graven Embrace is not needed in the existing mechanics of the game.  The ability to put down one of my own group members as opposed to simply having the fortitude to taunt the attacker from my comrade, is nothing more than a pale attempt to solve one problem by providing a useless "fluff" ability.  If RESCUE performed as it should, then Graven Embrace becomes nothing more than a fluff...a magic trick.  As it stands now, niether one works like it should and the result is a Shadow Knight who expends his power into useless abilities at the cost of the loss of control over the encounter, the loss of possibly multiple group members, and in the worst cases, a good evening of well enjoyed game time.  Give the Shadow Knight his commanding presence on the battlefield, and forget about Graven Embrace.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As for Harm Touch, a Shadow Knight learns all that he can about how to deal damage with the weapons at his disposal.  He learns all that he can about his enemies' tactics, their weaknesses and strengths....he studies the arcane sciences for only the purpose to deliver pain and death.....but in the end, his greatest ability, the most cherrished of all Shadow Knight knowledge....should be that one dark secret...the ultimate power at his fingertips...the power to take life with a single, fatal blow....the Harm Touch.   There should be no living, breathing, thinking creature on the face of Norrath, that shouldn't think twice before attacking a Shadow Knight.  Because a Shadow Knight of any level wields his greatest weapon in the fear that Harm Touch should bestow upon his enemies.  Fear.  There is a thought for you developers and other Shadow Knights.  For if I can't take down an enemy with a single Harm Touch, then he should run wailing in pain from the strike....or better yet....let him fall to a crumple upon the ground, with his life force slowly bleeding from his paralyzed body.  And while we finish his companions, let him lay motionless upon the ground and watch them fall around him....then let him rise again, injured, crippled, weakened....and we shall then put him out of his misery.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>These are the things that make a Shadow Knight.</DIV> <DIV>Power consumption and the intricacies of spell effects mechanics are great for comparing the damage capability of one class to another....but they do not tell you what a class is about, and they do not themselves make a class fun to play.  They only form the framework within which we players play the game.  I think alot of players can accept some mechanical querks within the game system as long as the elements that make the game fun to play are still there.  And I realize that the fun elements are different from player to player.  I see where there have been some major patches to game mechanics that were directly targeted to Shadow Knights and Paladins...most notably the reduction in mount speeds.  That patch had absolutely no affect on the vast majority of all other player classes...but it effected EVERY, SINGLE Shadow Knight and Paladin in the game system....tens of thousands of players...directly.  In my opinion, I think a change that significant should be for the betterment of the class and with the due amount of scrutiny and "customer" feedback.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So thank you for this thread...I do sincerely hope that our concerns become the concerns of those capable of voicing and affecting change.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>In the service of Freeport, so shall it be written.</DIV> <DIV>Durfea~Trecal</DIV></DIV> <P></P> <DIV> <P>DurFea~Trecal, Shadow Crusader of the Legions of Cabilis<BR>Officer of Guild Pestilence of Antonia Bayle</P></DIV></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

sirwiz
02-25-2005, 03:29 PM
Here Here! Couldnt have said it better if I triedChaya DarkenauraShadowknight - Lucan D'LereLeader of Lost Souls

Arillonahia
02-25-2005, 05:10 PM
Amen fellow knight, amen....Tialneques Fyr, Knight of Innoruuk

roza
02-25-2005, 06:22 PM
<DIV>meh. i do aggree with you, but honestly id be happy if hey just fixed our dps or our tanking ability... its kinda sad coming from another eq game where shadowknight was acctualy pretty decent tank and dps wise. to where he is one of the most worthless characters in the game.. i mean... wow. a level 41 paladin was out dpsing me and im level 43....  not only is a paladin supposed to be a healer / tank.  but he was a few levels below me and still doin it.... i donno man.. SoE is realllllllyy lettin me down big time with this class..  im not saying focus mainly on this class at all because ALOT of classes need to be balanced out. but i mean.. it sure would be sweet if you gave it a little tiny baby peek soe...</DIV>

DarkPuppete
02-26-2005, 11:37 AM
<DIV>I must agree, I would rather fist have my fallen glory back and have fun playing the class before more of the basic technical details fixed, but in a realistic sense, given SoE's notoriously 'sluggish' (and I use that benevolent term with the HIGHEST form of understatement) pace at taking what is said by people when they do not represent the vast majority and subsequently acting upon it, I think it is the technicalities, the broken spells, the broken upgrades, the off-balance power consumption and so forth will be dealt with first (if we are so lucky for them to EVER be dealt with) before our beloved 'distinctions' from the rest of the crowd. I recall the days of EQ in the early years when the Harming Touch was a weapon to be feared, in both PvP and PvE environments, as a one-use torrent of agony matched only by the sickeningly pure cleansing of the Misguided One's Laying of Hands. Other classes struggling in the newbie areas would stand agape and remark with both awe and envy at the sight of a creature simply collapsing every few fights. Not so anymore. The HT is just a flavor spell IMO nowadays. Its much like the end-game of EQ, where the HT is barely felt. Here in EQ2, besides the disgusting resist rate (DONT get me started, if HT can be resisted, make LoH have a chance to fail as well) the damage just isnt enough to get any ooh or aahs anymore. The equivalent of a single Wizard nuke. I have always thought is could be equal to a set %'age of a mobs total Hp's, not overpowering, but enough for people to sit up and take notice. And before non-sk's come in to flame and scoff, the Lay Hands of the Paladin sect IS definatly an ooh and aah skill. To completely heal, versus our piddling Wizard nuke. In truth, a possibly -resisted 1 hour spell that outright KILLED the target once half-dead or so (with exceptions to not effect boss mobs or other players once pvp is introduced) would equal LoH better. But, I have gone somewhat astray here in the last few lines. . .</DIV> <P><SPAN class=time_text></SPAN> </P><p>Message Edited by DarkPuppeteer on <span class=date_text>02-25-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:42 PM</span>

DarkPuppete
02-26-2005, 11:37 AM
<DIV>eek double post, kill it kill it!</DIV><p>Message Edited by DarkPuppeteer on <span class=date_text>02-25-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:37 PM</span>

Xem
02-26-2005, 11:41 AM
<DIV>I would've posted more of what problems SK's have but it has been said, reiterated, repeatedly, consistently etc. So there isnt much use. All that really is left, is for a major change for the SK class.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Just a tidbit: Did anyone hear about shadowknights level 40-50 spells being removed right before EQII launched/went live? I noticed a little bit in one of the recent "big" patches that mostly every class had their spells edited/revamped etc. but I really didnt see any shadowknight spells. Why is that? Is there bigger plans for our lvl 40-50-hurried-in-a-rush spells? Or is that all? Great stuff.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>/chant Beat Blizzard in the net-income field! Yay.</DIV>

spatc
02-26-2005, 02:55 PM
<DIV>Well put, better than I could have put into words myself. SK's are now a joke. I remember when I first made level 20, finally being able to not only ride a trusty steed into battle, but also to be able to present myself as a Shadowknight, looking forward to our next spell that would bring death and despair to our enemies....</DIV> <DIV>Then I try Harm Touch out......resisted</DIV> <DIV>Then I try our "Feign Death " spell, after much previous anticipation....I die, and my whole party also....spell useless/broken/garbage..........</DIV> <DIV>Then I get our first pet spell.....what a *&^^&** joke</DIV> <DIV>Then I get Lucans Pact, the very essence of our evil........."you cannot do that while in this form"........</DIV> <DIV>Then I get our 2nd pet spell....a $%##% bird!</DIV> <DIV>About this time, berserkers get the ability to use tower shields, while we (one of the most defensive classes in the game) are limited to kite shields.</DIV> <DIV>In the low to mid 30's levels I quickly learn that we are very inadequate at holding aggro, not just a minor distraction, but that there are PROBLEMS with the dynamics of the spells we have to use.</DIV> <DIV>I learn to use our one shining ability; our one distinction above other classes, our one ability that actually worked well: our unholy steed to pull mobs a little faster than what a gaurdian could;  even though a guardian or berserker could tank the mob better than an equally leveled and equiped SK could...</DIV> <DIV>Then Sony nerfs our horse. No other problems fixed. Thanks Sony.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Vansteel , 42 SK (cancelled)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>