Petition against Bruiser nerfs next Live update.

[Lejes0]

<DIV>Probably wont make a difference, but if nothing else, in hopes the Devs read this, at least all those who appose, Sign here, and also, while i know many of you have, Please list changes you would like to see that would keep us balanced, but also be fair to us and satisfy our over all game experience.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I like the increase to proc on roughousing</DIV> <DIV>I also like the increase to proc on our offensive stance</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I tend to tank alot so i am in favor of some defensive upgrades to make up for our offensive loss.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Signed</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hongway Lo</DIV> <DIV>70 Bruiser, Guk</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Against Bruiser nerfs LU#24</DIV>

[Mantua1]

<P>I understand they need to change things from time to time. Give Monks instill doubt, ok fine no big deal. It really does not affect my game play - or soloing ability.</P> <P>Having my fear and mez share the same timer - I just cant see that as especially unbalancing. Do not all classes have some extra utility or ability that thier antithisis class lack? Im not crying about not having wind walk or tsunami. I have closed mind and stone deaf. With the reducting the durations - and the fact that mez or fear do not always land or stick for their intended durations nor are they applicable to epic mobs - makes this shared timer decision one I am most certianly not in favor of. IMHO they are taking abilties that already have limited effectivness (depending on your play style solo vs hardcore raider) and further reducing their usefulness to near pointless. Its been hashed over a hundred times. I still say fine reduce the duration and increase the reuse but DO NOT have them share the same timer. </P> <P>Reducing our damage on some CA's. This especially stings in light of other factors - AA issues, recent updates that reduced our DPS. Combined with our lack of some mitigation and reduced avoidance. I mean ok if you think we doing so much damage maybe we could make up for in the upcoming AA changes with the expansion. I am ok with waiting that out.</P> <P>And hey hows our class profession hat coming along? No not the HooLuh quested one. It just feels odd that i think we are the only class that dosent have a dropped profession hat. I could be wrong about that but as far as I know we are the only class without.</P> <P>Some of the more prominent Bruisers have spoken up about this as well in multiple other threads. I hope the really consider what they are planning.</P><p>Message Edited by Mantua1 on <span class=date_text>05-31-2006</span> <span class=time_text>07:09 AM</span>

[Quicksilver74]

<DIV>It's a shame we have been hit with so many nerfs already... and it wasn't even the tip of the iceberg.  I will sign yoru petition... errr whertes my pen?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>   Give us something to compensate.  It's bad enough guardians are outdamaging us, but your lowering our dps even more? </DIV>

[Gungo]

<DIV> <P> I am not arguing about loss of dps or stun locking. </P> <DIV> <P>Here are my suggestions to fix bruisers that will currently be unbalanced after the proposed changes on test. There are 3 issues i see hurting bruisers.</P> <P>1) Harder to tank heroic content due to stuns nerf.....I recommend a significant mitigation AA (aprox 600 miti at rank <img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />instead of def aa.<BR><BR>2) complete uselessness of fear as a spell line.... i recommend they remove fear and give us a 3 hit stone skin on seperate timer. 1 min duration  3 min recast. (non toggleable, so that the recast starts in beginning)</P> <P>3) Loss of agro due to reduced DPS..additional loss of AoE agro..... I recommend making the bruiser hate proc into 50% proc chance, like the monk proc has.</P> <P>Those 3 changes will fix the 3 issues i see them causing in this LU w/o overpowering in solo, group or raid content. </P> <P>If they think we do to much dps already do you really think they will make our offensive stance better?</P></DIV></DIV>

[mr23sgte]

<DIV>Fear lasts 7 seconds - 1m recast atm and is not on the same timer as the 10 second mezz 1m recast.................... I rolled a bruiser on test.</DIV>

[Zigmun]

<P>I agree with everything that Gungo has posted.</P> <P>My only concern is that as a community with no feedback from the dev's on the latest nerfs to our class we are left to speculate... why??????</P> <P>Is it because they feel we are unbalanced in raid, solo, pvp or in group situations?</P> <P>Do they think we are overpowered in one area or all 4?</P> <P>Do the changes reflect the area's they see us as needing to be rebalanced - or are the changes that tone down our ability to solo mobs not mean't for us to solo - hurt our raid utility?</P> <P>The reason I am saying this - is that right now Bruiser raid and group utility is dps.</P> <P>Groups on hard mobs do not generally invite me to tank - they invite me to dps. Can I step in, yes I can - but if there is a Guardian there - he is usually the preferred MT.</P> <P>So the next question is are we a top tierred dps class with the raid utility of brigands (3k debuff on mit of mob) or other classes? (I could make a list - I won't) The answer is no.</P> <P>So we are not the top tier dps and we are not the prefferred tank - we are truly a "fighter" class. Strong in all area's - but we don't bring any single one strength to the table - and that is our strength.</P> <P>So in what ways are we compensated for this (and proposed changes) as a class so that we remain desirable and wanted for raids and groups.</P> <P>If you take away any more of our dps - what are we left with?  Below par tanking and below par dps. Doesn't sound like class balance to me. </P> <P>If and only if we get answers to those questions will we ever know as a community what changes make "sense" and where we should be as a class. </P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[Colossaltitan]

Petitions are against forum rules <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR><BR>But I'll sign it =X.

[TheSummoned]

Signed, even though it's against the forum rules. btw, Colossal, miss your bruiser any? <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div>

[Colossaltitan]

<DIV>Yesss, soooo much. Lol.   I'm 68 and 3/4 through the epic line on Phayax, atm I'm tradeskilling the rest of the way to 65 for Wurmslayer.  Having a blast on this toon (even though I'm doing epic line lol).  Definetly miss this character, can't wait to get 70 so on some 'not so difficult' raids or raids that I need updates I can tag along on this toon instead of the Necro!<BR><BR>hehe <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[Lejes0]

<DIV>I do apologize to the powers that be in regards to the petition, and i will make sure to read the rules more clearly next time. However whether or not the subject is tagged petition, the premis of this post is no different then any other recent post in regards to live update 24, which is why the changes, and hopefully grab some attention and something be done.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As everyone can see i dont post often, hell its only what, my 4th or 5th. I read the forums all the time, but i felt it was needed to come out and support fellow bruisers who do not like these comming changes, want them to stop, and want the developers to give us something that makes us important at the end game, that and because, i am a patient player, i accept change, but now this is getting out of hand and way overboard. Our DPS, was more or less all we had to bring to a raid. Now that will subside. Sometime ago you wanted to groom us into tanks, Guess what..., avoidance tanking..., doesn't work. I can get my avoidance up to 74.3%  and it doesn't seem to make a difference against anything unless its green. Mitigation, The spirit line and the skin line. One last for two mins and takes health, the other last for 30 seconds and all you can do is taunt, good if your tanking raid mob and need that boost, but hey guess what, cant quite do that can we, cause avoidance seems to be tossed out the window, and even with those 2 buffs up at the sametime, we cant attack to hold agro and still wont quite exceed, if even equal the mitigation of a plate tank.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Lets not even get into our AE agro, it stinks on ice. Was doing the fire X2 dragon in AoA the other day with guildies, zerker was tanking dragon, i was MA and was to grab the 2 adds every 30 seconds when they poped and burn em with our guildies, they poped i used my MASTER!! ae taunt, and guess what, they looked at me, waived, and kept hitting the zerker. i mean honestly, thats just sad, and i felt like an idiot. So the one thing we have to help us with AE agro, our AE, your going to nerf it, a second time. I mean please..., come no, honestly. Me like i am sure others, are taking this a bit personal. If your going to take something from us give us something. I can dps and i like to tank, dont mind either or. So if your gonna cut our dps, gives us some self mitigation buffs, maybe increase the spirit line mitigation, or change it so that it gives a bit more mitigation, some avoidance, without the health drain, increase the roughhousing proc like many have suggested. maybe increase the mitigation and avoidance on our defensive stance, i dunno do something. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also, this whole thing with instill line and scared still line, sharing the same timers. You know, just take the instill doubt and give it to monks all together, might as well just do that. Monks get some wonderful abilities and raid utility stuff, and i am not hating on them, i love monks and admire there class, i tagged team with my friend through our whole career leveling, monk and bruiser combo is sick and can accomplish alot. But they can even patch heal during a raid, our heal is self only. I mean those little things go along way. Please Devs, SoE, work with us here, i love this class so much, but your really ruining it now, your going to Far.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hongway Lo,</DIV> <DIV>70 Bruiser, Guk</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[heelena]

<P>sign me up for this peti...</P> <P>i agree with most of the things. i am sick and tired of beeing one of those raid-nothing-to-do-charakters...</P> <P>plz give me a reason why i should stay in eq2 with my bruiser.. i want nothing more than a bit of respect.</P> <P> </P>

[KeandraD]

I really don't see the point of this petition... they wont do anything different anyway <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Just hang on, perhaps make an alt, and we'll have our love soon enough <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[J4k]

<DIV>The thing that really angers me is we are supposed to be the higher dps of the fighters. NOT by any means the best dps in the game but the better dps of the fighters. Well now yoou have guardians running around able to out dps us berserkers out dpsing us by FAR. And when i say far I mean about a 600 - 1k dps difference. How can they even begin to justify needing to nerf a class that relys on our dps for aggro when you got classes like guardians and berserkers who are by no means supposed to be a dps class are out dpsing us.</DIV> <DIV>And the worst part is no matter how much we post or how many petitions you wanna make and blablabla they dont give a flying [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]. In alot of cases you post something they dont agree with they ignore it. Sometimes lock the post and when it completly goes against there way of life it gets deleted. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Gungo]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> J4kik wrote:<BR> <DIV>The thing that really angers me is we are supposed to be the higher dps of the fighters. NOT by any means the best dps in the game but the better dps of the fighters. Well now yoou have guardians running around able to out dps us berserkers out dpsing us by FAR. And when i say far I mean about a 600 - 1k dps difference. How can they even begin to justify needing to nerf a class that relys on our dps for aggro when you got classes like guardians and berserkers who are by no means supposed to be a dps class are out dpsing us.</DIV> <DIV>And the worst part is no matter how much we post or how many petitions you wanna make and blablabla they dont give a flying [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]. In alot of cases you post something they dont agree with they ignore it. Sometimes lock the post and when it completly goes against there way of life it gets deleted. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Your wrong and spreading bad information.<BR></P> <P>Edit: bah knowing these boards i'll prolly have to explain this easier. Ok your guard DOES NOT out dps you. In raids he gets his buffs from the mt group, he gets ice shield from wizards, dma shiedls from conjurors and druids. etc etc. THAT IS NOT HIS DPS. Just liek the people who complain that brawlers do massive amount of DPS. THAT is not our dps. bruiser do not add 100% haste or the remainder of 75% dps or the proc, etc. But we get associated through it form the third party unoffcial parsers people use. </P> <P>Druids have a nice little doubel atk aa. If i group a fury w a coercer, illusinist, dirge, inquisitor, and wizard max his haste, dps, w high doubel atks. Then i place a couple of dam shields and applied procs. Then that fury out dps's the wizard shoudl the fury get his melee dps nerfed? NO IT IS NOT HIS DPS. Its the ice shiedl the wizard put on him its the dps buff the coercer gave him its the haste the illusinost gave him its the dam shield and buffs the inq gave him. Its the melee proc the dirge gave him. Its rediculous to say a class is doing more dps then another class because of buffs place don them by other classes. As such the ICE SHIELD and proc buff is directly associated to the wizard. DPS score. Its just that non official third party parser you use Does not take that dps into account. Hence why SoE does not officially acknowledge parsers in game.</P><p>Message Edited by Gungo on <span class=date_text>06-01-2006</span> <span class=time_text>08:48 AM</span>

[Echgar]

Petitions are not permitted per the <a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=faq&message.id=25" target=_blank>Forum Rules of Conduct</a>.  Closing this thread.<div></div>