Whats the best AA options for DPS Bruiser?

[Levikun]

I dont know about many of you, but I dont see my bruiser as a MT. More as an offtank. I have no desire to keep aggro and tank when there's a berserker or guardian, or whoever the hell wants to tank, go ahead and tank. I'm looking strictly for DPS here. What AA combo would allow me to maximize my DPS in groups, solo, and/or raids?

[Darkdourden]

<div></div>Well i proof and maxed all the line of AA and i decided to go on procs AE and Single (STA WIS). Anyway many times the ppl will invite u to group as a tank, just try to train and get experience at tanking or u gonna have many problems on the future.

[Raidi Sovin'faile]

<div></div><div></div><p>I'm seriously considering going with the procs and the crit chance increase. That'd be Stamina line 4,4,8 .. Wisdom 4,4,8 .. and Int 4,4,8. The extra attacks are secondary bonuses for whatever weapon I happen to be using... I just wanna see what it's like to start proc'ing a bunch of single target, encounter target stuff and critting left right and center.</p><p>I could be totally wrong, dunno... but the other things out there just don't appeal to me (the unarmed line looks okay... but hard to judge really, and it's got a lot of defensive stuff to it).</p><p>None of the end abilities really stand out for me, except the Int one.. however, I feel I'll get more mileage out of an extra proc ability. Keeping yourself near death seems far too situational, or would take too much work and understanding from your healer (we have the tools, health for mitigation, etc).</p><p> </p><p>Myself, I play my other chars a lot, so when I DO play my Bruiser it's with my brother's Zerker... who's totally decked out in defensive gear and abilities. And he can do tons of DPS WHILE tanking, and keep aggro on groups far better (and we play with a warlock, so that's always important).</p><p>So secondary tank/DPS for my Bruiser is the way I need to go.</p><p>Message Edited by Raidi Sovin'faile on <span class="date_text">03-29-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:25 AM</span></p>

[Levikun]

Not saying I won't tank. I have an SK as my main and a berserker i tried till like 43 then gave up on. I've tanked. I know how. I usually get compliments on how well I can hold aggro but what I'm saying is I dont mind having someone else step in and tank instead of my bruiser. Makes me happier to play DPS spam than a full-on tank if I can at times.

[Cyngii]

<div>The STR line is really good for dps.  Yeah you'll lose some stats, but the DPS is pretty crazy actually.  Since each attack is considered a primary weapon hit, you have to opportunity to proc twice per combat round... through in a 4-4-8 on the INT line and you'll be double attacking pretty much every attack round and critical hitting 25% of the time.  If you're looking at pure DPS i don't know if you can beat that combo from AP alone.</div>

[QQ-Fatman]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Cyngii wrote:<div>The STR line is really good for dps.  Yeah you'll lose some stats, but the DPS is pretty crazy actually.  Since each attack is considered a primary weapon hit, you have to opportunity to proc twice per combat round... through in a 4-4-8 on the INT line and you'll be double attacking pretty much every attack round and critical hitting 25% of the time.  If you're looking at pure DPS i don't know if you can beat that combo from AP alone.</div><hr></blockquote>We all know monks get crazy dps by going str line. But the question here is: do bruisers get good dps too? Brusiers dont have any haste buff, and only have a small dps buff. Our auto-attack isnt as strong as monk's.

[Parasite]

<div>Monks are having the upperhand yes at least at the moment</div><div> </div><div>DPS Buffs are easy to come by, but haste that's another story only a few classes can significantly perma boost your haste rating. So it kinda sux <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> All they need is a coercer to give them 1 buff for 100% dps boost as well.</div><div>We need at least 2 classes to buff us up on haste to get 100% and then some other class to boost dps% as well.</div><div>Still the damage is nice and don't forget we have a proc of our own they don't have.</div><div> </div><div>But i do think the AA Should also have 20% haste next to dps buff and that our dps buff should finaly be revised just to make a descent scaling cuz 3% increased DPS per tier realy aint worth it.</div><div>I'm still using my old old T3 one i think</div><div> </div><div>Greeetings</div><div> </div><div>Daveke</div>

[Cyngii]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>QQFatman wrote:<div></div>We all know monks get crazy dps by going str line. But the question here is: do bruisers get good dps too? Brusiers dont have any haste buff, and only have a small dps buff. Our auto-attack isnt as strong as monk's.<hr></blockquote>Haste or no haste, I don't think you're going to get any more DPS from any other achievement path than i posted above.  There just aren't that many passive skill damage increasers to choose from.  The proc from the STA line is nice, but not huge... the AOE attack on the WIS line with 2 hander is ok but a little scary.  Unless you're capped at 100% +DPS, the amount you get from the STR line is still +DPS.  With the double attack and +DPS from STR, the crits from INT, and can still do 4-4-8 in STA for the proc if you wanted to... I think that's the best you'de ever do from achievements. 

[Raidi Sovin'faile]

<div></div><p>Well, here's some food for thought...</p><p>My brother plays a zerker, and has an ability that basically "double attacks".. and he's able to proc off those second attacks. I wonder if stacking some proc abilities with 100% double attack might be the way to go. I'm thinking the AoE proc might be a good choice for keeping aggro/dpsing group encounters, or if you like to play it safe, then the higher proc'ing stamina one might be a good idea.</p><p>I might try it one day when I have enough points to test it out.</p>

[Shakir10]

<div></div><p>Some more food for thought,</p><p> </p><p>Bruisers are tanks, not DPS, as a certain monk would say, "If you want to be DPS, play a scout"</p>

[Teche]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Shakir1065 wrote:<div></div><p>Some more food for thought,</p><p> </p><p>Bruisers are tanks, not DPS, as a certain monk would say, "If you want to be DPS, play a scout"</p><hr></blockquote>Tanks who cant tank raid mobs .. great ... get you nose out of a certain monks Buttcrack for a min.

[Owa]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Shakir1065 wrote:<div></div><p>Some more food for thought,</p><p> </p><p>Bruisers are tanks, not DPS, as a certain monk would say, "If you want to be DPS, play a scout"</p><hr></blockquote><p><font size="4">As far as I can see, what that 'certain monk' says involves getting Guardians de-tanked, Bruisers de-DPSed and Monks getting better tanking and DPS. Doubtless a fabulous cheerleader for the Monk community, he may not be your best source for an unbiased opinion on how to play a Bruiser. Know what I mean?</font></p><p><font size="3">OTBBFIPCPS1987</font></p>

[Quicksilver74]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Teche wrote:<div></div><blockquote><hr>Shakir1065 wrote:<div></div><p>Some more food for thought,</p><p> </p><p>Bruisers are tanks, not DPS, as a certain monk would say, "If you want to be DPS, play a scout"</p><hr></blockquote>Tanks who cant tank raid mobs .. great ... get you nose out of a certain monks Buttcrack for a min.<hr></blockquote>Whatever fool, Bruisers can tank raid mobs.   Granted not EVERY raid mob, but we are better geared to tank certain raids than guardians even.   Look at Gorenaire, brawlers in general make the perfect tank for that fight.  and yes I have tanked gorenaire successfully, 3 times so far. 

[PhozFa]

<div></div><span><blockquote><hr>Teche wrote:<div></div><blockquote><hr>Shakir1065 wrote:<div></div><p>Some more food for thought,</p><p> </p><p>Bruisers are tanks, not DPS, as a certain monk would say, "If you want to be DPS, play a scout"</p><hr></blockquote><u><b>Tanks who cant tank raid mobs</b></u> .. great ... get you nose out of a certain monks Buttcrack for a min.<hr></blockquote>Its true we are supposed to be tanks with a secondary degree in mild DPS'ing. We can tank. We could also tank raid mobs. Problem seems certain epic fights are  tougher for us than certain plate classes. This may be the issue that needs adressing but its not for this thread. Either way some people will always wanna prefer to play their toon DPS and i think the attack on the thread is stupid.Even if we were 100% equal raid tanking as every other fighter. Then 1 of each fighter class shows up for the raid. 6 tanks but only 1 MT spot so the other 5 will be having to do their secondary role. Whats wrong with the people tho decide to focus on that? Personally i try to build my toon to tank and would go for a lesser dps better tanking option. Still nothing wrong with trying to squeeze out the most dps you can.</span><div></div><p>Message Edited by PhozFate on <span class="date_text">04-05-2006</span><span class="time_text">07:21 AM</span></p>

[Shakir10]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>annaspider wrote:<div></div><blockquote><hr>Shakir1065 wrote:<div></div><p>Some more food for thought,</p><p> </p><p>Bruisers are tanks, not DPS, as a certain monk would say, "If you want to be DPS, play a scout"</p><hr></blockquote><p><font size="4">As far as I can see, what that 'certain monk' says involves getting Guardians de-tanked, Bruisers de-DPSed and Monks getting better tanking and DPS. Doubtless a fabulous cheerleader for the Monk community, he may not be your best source for an unbiased opinion on how to play a Bruiser. Know what I mean?</font></p><p><font size="3">OTBBFIPCPS1987</font></p><hr></blockquote><p>hehe, I know exactly what you mean. I retired my guardian as my main a while back cause of him. I was being more sarcastic than anything, but the fact still remains that even the Devs have stated that first and foremost Bruisers and Monks are tanks. So there is probobly little hope for you guys in the area of DPS.</p><p>Personally I wish they had never stated that all fighters primary role was Tank because it's leaving many fighters out in many situations. I wish that the Devs or whoever could come up with a good "secondary" role maybe for fighters so that if they are not the main tank they can still be really high value at a raid.  Not saying fighters are not valuable if not the main tank, just that they could use some work.</p>

[Teche]

<div></div><div></div><div><blockquote><hr>Quicksilver74 wrote:<div></div><blockquote><hr>Teche wrote:<div></div><blockquote><hr>Shakir1065 wrote:<div></div><p>Some more food for thought,</p><p> </p><p>Bruisers are tanks, not DPS, as a certain monk would say, "If you want to be DPS, play a scout"</p><hr></blockquote>Tanks who cant tank raid mobs .. great ... get you nose out of a certain monks Buttcrack for a min.<hr></blockquote>Whatever fool, Bruisers can tank raid mobs.   Granted not EVERY raid mob, but we are better geared to tank certain raids than guardians even.   Look at Gorenaire, brawlers in general make the perfect tank for that fight.  and yes I have tanked gorenaire successfully, 3 times so far. <hr></blockquote><span><p><span>Good for you foo, and good for us.  One mob, I hope there are more.  We have dps, if someone wants to focus on dps, thats there choice.  We dont need some monk fanboi telling us we are tanks, its been shoved down our throats since LU13. </span></p><p><span></span> </p><p><span>Edit: I gues ill just shut up now, my lame attemp at jokes are comming across hostile, hell someone even said I was being mean earlyer, im going to go cry now.</span></p></span></div><p>Message Edited by Teche on <span class="date_text">04-05-2006</span><span class="time_text">10:42 AM</span></p>

[Quicksilver74]

<div>I honestly think we are slightly more DPS than Tanks.   It is easy to be a DPS bruiser, because that comes naturally, but to be a tanking bruiser is far more difficult.  </div><div> </div><div>Look at our AAs, the DPS abilities come first, and then the Tanking abilities come after the dps abilities... IE Crits before Parry, Mantis Bolt before Deflection...     It's harder to get the tanking bonus.</div><div> </div><div>Armor - it's harder to get good tanking armor as a bruiser.   Mitigation is real important, but being leather it's hard to get your mit up there. </div><div> </div><div>Strategy and aggro is also hard to learn and maintain.   We can tank, it's just harder then chilling out in a dps role.</div>

[Owa]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Quicksilver74 wrote:<div>I honestly think we are slightly more DPS than Tanks.   It is easy to be a DPS bruiser, because that comes naturally, but to be a tanking bruiser is far more difficult.  </div><div> </div><div>Look at our AAs, the DPS abilities come first, and then the Tanking abilities come after the dps abilities... IE Crits before Parry, Mantis Bolt before Deflection...     It's harder to get the tanking bonus.</div><div> </div><div>Armor - it's harder to get good tanking armor as a bruiser.   Mitigation is real important, but being leather it's hard to get your mit up there. </div><div> </div><div>Strategy and aggro is also hard to learn and maintain.   We can tank, it's just harder then chilling out in a dps role.</div><hr></blockquote><font size="4">/What he said.</font>

[oMeGaOh]

Well when our guild raids the highest on the parser:First, and almost almost always, NecroSecond, bruiserLast,  MonkIts ok to be mad, i would be [Removed for Content] if i was pwn all the time in dps too<div></div>

[PhozFa]

<span><blockquote><hr>oMeGaOhMz wrote:Well when our guild raids the highest on the parser:First, and almost almost always, NecroSecond, bruiserLast,  MonkIts ok to be mad, i would be [Removed for Content] if i was pwn all the time in dps too<div></div><hr></blockquote>So bruisers out DPS'ing your conj class durning long fights?</span><div></div>

[Arciahand]

<div></div><p>Call me crazy, here is what I have discoverd with my Bruser, minimal Raid XP... but for groups...</p><p> </p><p>we are great pullers, in a high agro zone, we can pull and then have an assassin or some other ranged type tag the targeted mob, we FD and get a single pull out of a messy room.</p><p>we are awsome off tanks.  We taunt a bit during the fight, if the MT goes down, or adds appear, we can grab agro, we can stun it if we just need a few seconds, fear if nessesary, if you are a smart bruser you can rock the off tank position.</p><p>we tank ok.  The issue I have had is itchy trigger finger casters/scouts.  Rescue is nice, but with only two taunts agro can be tuff to hold if the DPS types open up full boar once the fight starts.  I tend to warn my group in this situation and things work out ok after that... sometimes the Necro has to die... but not normally.</p><p> </p><p>Just my XP, not a whole lot but a bit.</p>

[WaachBack]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>PhozFate wrote:<span><blockquote><hr>oMeGaOhMz wrote:Well when our guild raids the highest on the parser:First, and almost almost always, NecroSecond, bruiserLast,  MonkIts ok to be mad, i would be [Removed for Content] if i was pwn all the time in dps too<div></div><hr></blockquote>So bruisers out DPS'ing your conj class durning long fights?</span><div></div><hr></blockquote>This is true for me half of the time.

[DarkMirrax]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>WaachBack wrote:<div></div><blockquote><hr>PhozFate wrote:<span><blockquote><hr>oMeGaOhMz wrote:Well when our guild raids the highest on the parser:First, and almost almost always, NecroSecond, bruiserLast,  MonkIts ok to be mad, i would be [Removed for Content] if i was pwn all the time in dps too<div></div><hr></blockquote>So bruisers out DPS'ing your conj class durning long fights?</span><div></div><hr></blockquote>This is true for me half of the time.<hr></blockquote>Then your conj are on autoattack and afk

[Sanamien]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>DarkMirrax wrote:<div></div><blockquote><hr>WaachBack wrote:<div></div><blockquote><hr>PhozFate wrote:<span><blockquote><hr>oMeGaOhMz wrote:Well when our guild raids the highest on the parser:First, and almost almost always, NecroSecond, bruiserLast,  MonkIts ok to be mad, i would be [Removed for Content] if i was pwn all the time in dps too<div></div><hr></blockquote>So bruisers out DPS'ing your conj class durning long fights?</span><div></div><hr></blockquote>This is true for me half of the time.<hr></blockquote>Then your conj are on autoattack and afk<hr></blockquote>Just my thoughts.Not a hardcore raider and haven't raided a lot with bruisers, but I have seen him (our bruiser) get pretty high in parses. Never close to me tho, but beating several other "dedicated" dps-classes <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></span></div>

[WaachBack]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>DarkMirrax wrote:<div></div><blockquote><hr>WaachBack wrote:<div></div><blockquote><hr>PhozFate wrote:<span><blockquote><hr>oMeGaOhMz wrote:Well when our guild raids the highest on the parser:First, and almost almost always, NecroSecond, bruiserLast,  MonkIts ok to be mad, i would be [Removed for Content] if i was pwn all the time in dps too<div></div><hr></blockquote>So bruisers out DPS'ing your conj class durning long fights?</span><div></div><hr></blockquote>This is true for me half of the time.<hr></blockquote>Then your conj are on autoattack and afk<hr></blockquote>Dont think that it possible after seeing how fast his power drops.

[Radigazt]

<div></div><p><em>Well when our guild raids the highest on the parser:First, and almost almost always, NecroSecond, bruiserLast,  MonkIts ok to be mad, i would be [Removed for Content] if i was pwn all the time in dps too</em></p><p>Sorry, but I gotta call BS on that.  After the Proc nerf there's no way your Bruisers are parsing more damage than your Brigands and Assassins unless they're way disparate in gear or the Scouts are just plain holding back.  Maybe your Bruiser has uber gear and your Scouts do not, or maybe the Scouts don't have their Combat Arts upgraded, dunno, but after they nerfed Bruiser procs, no way the Bruiser keeps up with the Brigands and Assassins.  Similarly, Rangers, Swashbucklers, Necros and Conjurors will all out-DPS a Bruiser.  Sadly, a Monk will too.  :/  At the moment Bruisers will be out-DPS'd by Necros, Conjurors, Brigands, Swashbucklers, Assassins, Rangers, Wizards, Monks and maybe Warlocks depending upon the make-up of the raid.  Take your trollery elsewhere pls. </p>

[Arciahand]

<div>Yeah... the only way a Bruiser is out DPSing any scout... Bards aside, is if either the equipment is off, or perhaps the scouts are holding back to ensure they do not get agro, the Bruisers don't care since we can take a good beating before the healers start to panic.  Even then though... if you pull agro off the main tain of the raid... bad news.</div>

[1Ralte]

<DIV>so lets put it out there, what is everyone parsing ? I'm realy interested since this discussion poped up what everyone else is doing....</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>A good 3 minute ish fight, decent group, fair amount of procs....</DIV>

[PhozFa]

<blockquote><hr>1Ralter1 wrote:<div>so lets put it out there, what is everyone parsing ? I'm realy interested since this discussion poped up what everyone else is doing....</div> <div> </div> <div>A good 3 minute ish fight, decent group, fair amount of procs....</div><hr></blockquote>You mentioned decent group so i'm assuming your talking about non-raid. So IMO 3 minutes is a long herioc fight. With a <u>decent </u>group you shouldn't be that long on a fight.  It'd be possible in a 3 minute fight to use our self heal 3 times and i don't even think me plus a healer dou'ing even ^^^s take that long to kill them. But anyway in group situations where i'm not tanking ( i don't usally parse when i tank) in legendary stuff i'll do about 450-550 dps before i get agro and cut back. I admit in alot of groups i'll out dps alot of dps classes but usually cause 1 reason. I don't care if i get agro. I let the healers know not to waste thier power healing me. If i get agro i have my self heal and if the mob doesn't die fast enough i'll FD. <div></div>

[1Ralte]

<DIV>in a raid bro, raid, thats all that counts...  *shrug* i get like 900ish</DIV>

[MakhailSamma]

<DIV>DPS is situational as always. Is the mob AEing? What type of AE? Mob more resistant to melee? Heat? Magic? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I would say on a normal even con non named X4 encounter it looks like this:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>1.Conj/Necro one on top then the other, though our conj seems to come out on top more often then not.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2. Bruiser, Monk, Swashy, Brigand, Assassin, Ranger and sometimes the Zerker if a AOE fight. (seems more then not its the bruisers at the top here becuase I am the bruiser, though the Monk with strength line on a long fight will be #1 and the swashys hitting there big time hits with someone to dump hate on will kill me as well. If the Assassin gets off her Assassinate.. forget about it. The ranger sometimes hits #1 as well..though not sure why or how.. perhaps the right procs going off?)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>3. Who cares, they are not on parse.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This is the experience I have had in my guild. Most everyone is mastered out with a spattering of Adept 3's in non essental abilities and have been raiding 5 days a week since August.</DIV>