HOF Experience...

[Nasyr24]

Im currently a lvl 68 bruiser (partially raid equiped) and went yesterday into HOF. I had the role of the MT and have to say that i had big problems from time to time to stay alive. My healers were a inqui and a mystic and i had 9700hps buffed.The mobs in there riped through my leather armor like through paper and 5k hits were common. Especially the berserkers twoshotted me several times. I think its really time to give us the possibility to raise our mitigation somehow, cause its not very fun like this.Someone else had such experience in HOF? Any tips?

[Anjin]

<div>It's a massive problem that brawlers have, especially monks as they have no mitigation buffs.  Until SOE sort out the avoidance issue and 1) Make it a worthwhile, and 2) Once that is done, reduce the avoidance of plate tanks, we will always be 3rd rate tanks.</div><div> </div><div>Anjin</div>

[Danter]

<div></div><div>I went into Halls at 67 with Master 1 Retribution and all T7 legendary gear got owned severely by the nameds.  The cents were no picnic either.</div><div> </div><div>At 70 it's doable, but again it's no picnic and you need healers/DPS who really know what they're doing.  At 70 with 75+% avoidance, I avoid attacks at about a 33% rate and if a group of mobs land 2 CAs in a row like Whirling Strike, you're either dead or about to be dead.  You really need to save Vigirous Spirit for the nameds.  If they made Vigirous Spirit until cancelled, this would really help us in Halls.</div><div> </div><div>We need more gear with +crush/slash/pierce on it that have resists.  Where the hell is our Cuirass of Protection?  Why does every piece of Brawler gear that isn't fabled have the same crap stats of +agi/+sta/+str/+deflection and NO resists or you get +str/+sta/+agi/+resists and NO avoidance skills or additional physical mitigation.  Why isn't there a staff of defending or some sort that has a crap damage rating but adds like +5 defense/parry/deflect and a bunch of resists like Grizzle's Shield for Plates.  We are tanks, so give us gear like Plate classes get that's made for tanking.  Not the same DPS gear that has a ton of +STR and no resists.</div><div> </div><div>-Kald, 70 Bruiser Permafrost</div>

[Gora]

<div>Halls of Fate really exposed the difference between brawlers and plate tanks.</div><div> </div><div>Anyone do this regularly with one healer?  Or tank Ishtara with one healer?</div><div> </div><div>I've done this zone with one healer, but it's rough and really not my preference.  I've stopped trying to tank Ishtara with one healer, it's just a waste of my time trying to tank him.  If he lands disabling strike, his next auto attack will likely kill me. </div><div> </div><div>Argest</div><div>Najena</div>

[CosmicAcidGu]

I tanked Ishtara once where one of my healers went down on pull (oops). But it was extremely messy and I was below 20% quite some time.Finnster<div></div>

[Darkdourden]

<div></div><p>I did HOF 12 times to get the update fro the hat, didnt have much problems, but i see that u didnt see that they put a debuff on u that debuff ur mitigation around 2k.</p><p> </p><p>So they will hit u almost the same being plate or leather with that debuff, the normal hits are 3k, with that debuff 5k.</p><p> </p><p>And is normally have some problems at pullage and tankage, but its normally when the mobs shoot u those hits at the begin.</p>

[Nasyr24]

The mobs that do the debuff are only one certain type. And they debuff mitigation for about 4k for only some seconds.

[PhozFa]

<span><blockquote><hr>Gorag1 wrote:<div>Halls of Fate really exposed the difference between brawlers and plate tanks.</div><div> </div><div>Anyone do this regularly with one healer?  Or tank Ishtara with one healer?</div><div> </div><div>I've done this zone with one healer, but it's rough and really not my preference.  I've stopped trying to tank Ishtara with one healer, it's just a waste of my time trying to tank him.  If he lands disabling strike, his next auto attack will likely kill me. </div><div> </div><div>Argest</div><div>Najena</div><hr></blockquote>Dunno, if it shows the diffrence in tanks. I went with a pally who insisted a plate tank was better so i let him tank. He kept going down esp on the name fights and i tanked and ended up taking less damage. I found proper use of our mit buffs and stuns make a diffrence. Also healers who are good with cures. 1 or 2 stuns can help a healer catch up on your life. Having stun/stifle classes also helps. The only mobs that do a number on me i gotta say are the zerkers. I dislike them hehe. But overall i find the zone fun cause its a challange. I have to pay attention not just pull, kill, repeat.</span><div></div>

[TheSummoned]

You have to study the mobs a lot down there. Who has the highest hit and what to do with it, etc. I normally go with a warden/defiler combo because 1. wards do wonders down there and 2. wardens have the +C/S/P/R buff so you can tank in def stance with 0 drawback. Although I did get one shoted on occasion or 2, it wasn't much of a problem. I hear plate tanks don't have an easy time down there either. Avoidance can be a life saver in there (I was stuck at 1hp for about 5 seconds, felt like eternity, but avoided all attacks until the defiler go me up). I still die in there though...<div></div>

[EasternKing]

<div></div><p>ok guys here is the truth as MT in a raiding guild i regularly die on a pull in HoF the mobs cast a spell that does physical damge so you dont use any resists for it it either lands or it dosent also they hit me with a 4k miti debuff and im sure they hit brawlers with it ...they have brutal strike which also has a miti debuff part which stacks with the debilitate debuff i regulalrly drop to 200-500 mitigation until cured</p><p>My guild monk has tanked this whole zone start to finish and so has my guild bruiser yes they died on pulls just like i do......so please dont go making it out to be a picnic for plate and a trip to hell for brawlers.</p>

[Salarionn]

<div></div>  LOVE THEM BRIG MOBS !!!! I say if your having trouble in HoF take better healers who know how to use cure trama.

[Gora]

<div></div><div>No one's saying it's a joke for plate tanks and a hell for brawlers.  The statement is this.  If I go and go with one healer, it has to be shaman or I will die on too many pulls, reactives and hots are not sufficient to keep me alive from the initial damage spike on too many of the fights.</div><div> </div><div>Plate tanks, specifically warriors, can do this one one healer and which healer type doesn't matter too much as long as they are competent and have appropriate gear.</div><div> </div><div>If I try and tank Ishtara with one healer, I will likely die unless I get very lucky.  I don't have crap gear or spells, i generally don't go there with people who are poorly equipped either.</div><div> </div><div>I like that HOF is challenging, I enjoy the zone, I don't like the fact that it's generally a better idea for me to have 2 healers when i go here if I am tanking while many of the plate tanks I know do it with one.</div><div> </div><div>Argest</div><div>Najena</div>

[MilkToa]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Gorag1 wrote:<div></div><div>No one's saying it's a joke for plate tanks and a hell for brawlers.  The statement is this.  If I go and go with one healer, it has to be shaman or I will die on too many pulls, reactives and hots are not sufficient to keep me alive from the initial damage spike on too many of the fights.</div><div> </div><div>Plate tanks, specifically warriors, can do this one one healer and which healer type doesn't matter too much as long as they are competent and have appropriate gear.</div><div> </div><div>If I try and tank Ishtara with one healer, I will likely die unless I get very lucky.  I don't have crap gear or spells, i generally don't go there with people who are poorly equipped either.</div><div> </div><div>I like that HOF is challenging, I enjoy the zone, I don't like the fact that it's generally a better idea for me to have 2 healers when i go here if I am tanking while many of the plate tanks I know do it with one.</div><div> </div><div>Argest</div><div>Najena</div><hr></blockquote><p>This may be true but it's sure not easy solo healing a plate class tank in HOF. I've done it several times with my defiler and its a real challange since you spend more time dispelling trama effects than you do healing.</p><p> </p><p> </p>

[Aaliel Stonefists]

<div></div><div>Ishtara isn't the norm for the mobs in there, the rest aren't that bad.  Ishtara can one shot a plate tank with 6300 mitigation just like he can a brawler.  Vanquishing blow is brutal from him.  Other than that CA he is really tame when I tank him though.  He won't be even breaking my defiler's wards for 75% of the fight, then an 11.5k vanquishing blow out of nowhere. </div><p>Message Edited by Aaliel Stonefists on <span class="date_text">03-23-2006</span><span class="time_text">11:20 AM</span></p>

[ganjookie]

Yeaht hat debuff is a killer.  I was talking with a friend who is a 70 defiler, he has to remove that debuff as soon as it is on the tank.  He'll even cancel any heal that is being ast to remove that debuff.  sounds pretty tough if you dont have a shammy<div></div>

[deadsidedemon]

<div></div><p>Agreed.  This zone is just tough.  I've been through with a top geared guardian that still occasionally died on the pull.</p><p>You know what though ... I like it!  More challenge and less predictability make for an excellent game.</p><p> </p><p> </p>

[ganjookie]

Yeah I hope they dont change it either..<div></div>

[WaachBack]

<div></div>I have succesfully tanked this zone 3 times, killing all mobs and all named mobs. I for one can tell you that it is not a cake walk as a brawler. Even with 2 healers, I have gotten into the red and died a few times. This zone is very doable if you have a good group and are equiped decently. A big thing about this zone that really hurts us bruisers is that most of the mobs here can't be stunned. So there is almost no way for you to prevent damage against you.

[Parasite]

<div>Add to that that u can not avoid their high hit combat arts who u have to resist or mitigate.we can't use our avoidance advantage on those CA wich makes it so hard for us.</div><div> </div><div>Greetings</div>

[Parasite]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><div>Double post</div><p>Message Edited by Parasiteke on <span class="date_text">03-24-2006</span><span class="time_text">09:36 AM</span></p>

[EasternKing]

<div></div>well you want a real easy way of pulling ? so you dont have to have a double blast in the face ? have a pet pull every encounter ....any pet will do just so long as it aggros the mobs and they initial cast on it and then you pull them off the pet or the caster if the pets dead ......easy.

[Parasite]

<div>Pulling is the least of my concerns.</div><div> </div><div>The only one that really kicked my but was the Named that pops when ushut down the installation near second named. For pulling ranged works just nice.</div><div>Hence i even throw in a teleport now and then.</div><div> </div><div>The only thing i am concerned about is having the CA act like spells and can thus not be avoided altough they are physical damage spells.</div><div> </div><div> </div>

[EasternKing]

<div></div>well they only cast them on a pull so if your not concerned about pulling whats your point ?

[Parasite]

<div> </div><div>Its a spell they cast that does physical damage that hurts me the most.</div><div>They cast it on pulling but they will cast it again later that fight if not stunned etc</div><div> </div><div>And don't tell me "whats the point" cuz thats what everybody wonders when  u post new topics / replies</div><div>at least here in the brawler forums anyways.</div><div> </div><div>Greetz</div><div> </div><div> </div><div> </div><div> </div><div> </div><div> </div><div> </div><div> </div><div> </div>

[TheSummoned]

Only soldiers cast on pull.You know what really bothers me with the resist thing... If you resist their CA they can cast it again 3 seconds later. (had this happen to me, didn't die though)<div></div>

[EasternKing]

<div></div><p>[Removed for Content] we had every man and his dog in the guard boards for months and months and now a guard replies to a post in a bruiser forum and i should go away and and not post ?</p><p>HAHAHAHAHAHAHA you guys a really funny.</p>

[Parasite]

<div>OMG  i almost forgot about that one ...</div><div>What the point in resisting then ...</div><div>Zone is clearly made for plate tanks, i don't mind , good to have a zone where plate tanks are required !</div><div>But i remain my point , brawlers need an AA that adds to mitigation not bound to being under 30% hp</div><div> </div>

[Parasite]

<div></div><div></div><div><p>[Removed for Content] we had every man and his dog in the guard boards for months and months and now a guard replies to a post in a bruiser forum <font color="#ffff00">and i should go away and and not post ?</font></p><p><font color="#ffffff">State where i said u should go away ?</font></p><p><font color="#ffffff">I have said that you should start posting usefull stuff instead of opening the same topic over and over again to have it locked  a few hours later. Is this like the 10th topic today u have started this discussion in ? Yes some1 started again on this in your guardian forums. But i recall that was a monk , not a bruiser. We envy the monks as well due to their haste so go whine there.Also remember it was A MONK and not a bruiser soloing the lvl 71th heroic mob.Now in case u are a completely messed up little kid from an other country, in the spirit of francofonian holliday or whatever it is.</font></p><font color="#ffffff"></font><p><font color="#ffffff">J'ai dit que ci tu as des commentaires UTILS alors tu peux les donner. Mais tu viens ici faire le con et le fou et tu ne comprend même pas ton propre class. Arête de salir notre forum aved des commentaires comme "What's your point" et "Blablabla".Vas-t-en fis de put conard de [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] va niquer ta maman.</font></p><p><font color="#ffffff">Or maybe u will finally understand what we are trying to say when we tell u in dutch ?</font></p><p><font color="#ffffff">STOPT ERMEE KLEIN KINDJE VAN MEN VOETEN ! Als ge nix deftigs te zeggen hebt hou dan u bakkes.Ga op het monk forum zeiken als ge u dan beter voelt , wij bruisers hebben het ook hard te verduren gekregen door de leuke rangers en nu hoogstwaarschijnlijk nog harder door de monks die ni kunne stoppe me stoeffen.</font><font color="#ffffff"></font></p><p><font color="#ffffff">So get your posts converted into something people actually care about and stop crapping about monks being so uber, this is the bruiser forum. You did know they are 2 different clases right ? ...</font></p></div><p>Now is there an /ignore command to block me from seeing his posts and topics ?</p><p>Message Edited by Parasiteke on <span class="date_text">03-24-2006</span><span class="time_text">03:17 PM</span></p>

[EasternKing]

<div></div><p>this is not a zone for plate tanks as my guild Brawlers tank this zone with the same amount of challange as i do as a plate tank</p><p>As for your whining about miti AA's its never gonner happen so get over it</p><p>This zone is a challange for ALL tanks regardless off the subclass type...... is that so hard to understand ?</p>

[Parasite]

<div>This is starting to look like a personal chat between 2 Forum-users ...</div><div> </div><div>I wonder who :p</div>

[EasternKing]

<div><hr>I have said that you should start posting usefull stuff instead of opening the same topic over and over again to have it locked  a few hours later. Is this like the 10th topic today u have started this discussion in ? Yes some1 started again on this in your guardian forums. But i recall that was a monk , not a bruiser. We envy the monks as well due to their haste so go whine there.Also remember it was A MONK and not a bruiser soloing the lvl 71th heroic mob.<hr></div><p> Are you so dumb you cannot read my post ? this thread has nothing to do with solo'ing heroics its to do with HoF and you please list me one part where i have mentioned anywhere in this thread about brawlers solo'ing ?</p><p>i have however posted that yes this is a tough zone and this is for ALL tanks i dont belive this zone to be untankable by brawlers</p><p>so again whats your point ?</p><p>your the one mentioning my other post on a completley Diff topic not me</p>

[CosmicAcidGu]

<span><blockquote><hr>TheEasternKing wrote:<div></div><p>[Removed for Content] we had every man and his dog in the guard boards for months and months and now a guard replies to a post in a bruiser forum and i should go away and and not post ?</p><p>HAHAHAHAHAHAHA you guys a really funny.</p><hr></blockquote>don't generalize. It was just one person <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> . Many bruisers want better defensive capabilites / mitigation and many guardians want better dps / soloing abilities. It's funny how while trying to get closer together we don't unite, but rather often insult and trash talk each other.But back to the HoF topic: As a well equipped level 70 Bruiser going to HoF with 2 healers, I die about as much as a similarly well equipped plate tank with just 1 healer. (no, I have no numbers, it's rather something I concluded from exchanging experiences with other guildies). And I think that ratio needs a bit adjustment. I could deal with the fact that plate tanks can do HoF with 1 healer and brawlers can only do it with 2. But I dislike that we still die just as often as the plate tank with 1 healer.Finnster</span><div></div>

[PhozFa]

<span><blockquote><hr>Parasiteke wrote:<div>OMG  i almost forgot about that one ...</div><div>What the point in resisting then ...</div><div><font color="#ff0000"><b>Zone is clearly made for plate tanks</b></font>, i don't mind , good to have a zone where plate tanks are required !</div><div>But i remain my point , brawlers need an AA that adds to mitigation not bound to being under 30% hp</div><div> </div><hr></blockquote>This is why the majority of the people don't take us seriously as tanks. Some of our own people don't have faith. I have talked to raid equiped plate tanks who tell me they have had trouble in here. This guard is admiting he has trouble in here. Bruisers (i'm sure monks just don't know many) have tanked this zone with pry the same amount of difficulty. If you can't tank it look at your group set up (if thats not the problem look at yourself: gear, spell, tactics). I'm sure warriors and crusaders do better in some group set ups than others and i don't think we are any diffrent.</span><div></div>

[Kizee]

<blockquote><hr>CosmicAcidGuru wrote:<span><blockquote> </blockquote>But back to the HoF topic: As a well equipped level 70 Bruiser going to HoF with 2 healers, I die about as much as a similarly well equipped plate tank with just 1 healer. (no, I have no numbers, it's rather something I concluded from exchanging experiences with other guildies). And I think that ratio needs a bit adjustment. I could deal with the fact that plate tanks can do HoF with 1 healer and brawlers can only do it with 2. But I dislike that we still die just as often as the plate tank with 1 healer.Finnster</span><div></div><hr></blockquote><p>Kinda off topic but I really would love to see 1 healer do HoF and keep people up thru the whole thing. (even a plate tank)</p><p>If they do the healer and tank must have all masters and fabled equip because the spike damage in that place (even if you cure all the impairments) seems too much for a single healer to keep up with. This is from my experiances as a templar but my long cast time on heals and long recovery are probally why I think it can't be done.</p>

[Gungo]

<div></div>I believe a few posts up a defiler admitted to being able to solo heal a guard in this zone.

[EasternKing]

<div></div><div></div><div>well some good news for you im in Hof atm and took 5 to post this..... pulled about 18mobs and i havent seen there ranged nuke cast once yet ....so it seems they arent casting it anylonger .....so happy days for everyone.</div><div> </div><div>I could be wrong.. ill add to this post when im done in here.</div><div>This place is a joke now ...im using a 2hander and pulling upto 5 groups at a time ......pulling 2-4 centurions .....if u die in this place now you need serious help.</div><p>Message Edited by TheEasternKing on <span class="date_text">03-24-2006</span><span class="time_text">09:46 AM</span></p><p>Message Edited by TheEasternKing on <span class="date_text">03-24-2006</span><span class="time_text">10:18 AM</span></p>

[Danter]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>TheEasternKing wrote:<div></div><div></div><div> </div><div>im using a 2hander and pulling upto 5 groups at a time ......pulling 2-4 centurions .....if u die in this place now you need serious help.</div><div> </div><div><hr></div></blockquote><p>OMG!!!</p><p>Guards are overpowered!</p><p>Nerf them hard SOE....Nerf them hard!!!!!!</p><p><em><font size="1">This is sarcasm if you couldn't detect it</font></em></p><p>-Kald, 70 Bruiser Permafrost</p>

[Kizee]

<div></div><div></div><blockquote><hr>TheEasternKing wrote:<div></div><div></div><div>well some good news for you im in Hof atm and took 5 to post this..... pulled about 18mobs and i havent seen there ranged nuke cast once yet ....so it seems they arent casting it anylonger .....so happy days for everyone.</div><div> </div><div>I could be wrong.. ill add to this post when im done in here.</div><div>This place is a joke now ...im using a 2hander and pulling upto 5 groups at a time ......pulling 2-4 centurions .....if u die in this place now you need serious help.</div><p>Message Edited by TheEasternKing on <span class="date_text">03-24-2006</span><span class="time_text">09:46 AM</span></p><p>Message Edited by TheEasternKing on <span class="date_text">03-24-2006</span><span class="time_text">10:18 AM</span></p><hr></blockquote><p>Was it changed this patch?</p><p>I liked it being challenging.</p><p>Message Edited by Kizee on <span class="date_text">03-24-2006</span><span class="time_text">10:50 AM</span></p>

[EasternKing]

<div></div><div></div><p>yes it has been changed in the patch today i went lastnite and it was usual zone get an add and good chance of dying ...today after noticing i wasnt getting hit with the nasty spell / phys damage ability nor the barrages i tried pulling 2 groups of 3 lizzys usually an invitation to death in this zone ....was easy they have nerfed the hell otta this place even the guy on the table is weak now...... and i havent been hit with the brig debuff once either.</p><p>There goes the fun challange zone now its just like the rest a breeze through for loot and crap.</p><p>Message Edited by TheEasternKing on <span class="date_text">03-24-2006</span><span class="time_text">11:00 AM</span></p>

[TheSummoned]

<span><blockquote><hr>TheEasternKing wrote:<div></div><div></div><p>yes it has been changed in the patch today i went lastnite and it was usual zone get an add and good chance of dying ...today after noticing i wasnt getting hit with the nasty spell / phys damage ability nor the barrages i tried pulling 2 groups of 3 lizzys usually an invitation to death in this zone ....was easy they have nerfed the hell otta this place even the guy on the table is weak now...... and i havent been hit with the brig debuff once either.</p><p>There goes the fun challange zone now its just like the rest a breeze through for loot and crap.</p><p>Message Edited by TheEasternKing on <span class="date_text">03-24-2006</span><span class="time_text">11:00 AM</span></p><hr></blockquote>Sucks [Removed for Content] if this is true... I liked the zone as it was.</span><div></div>

[Kizee]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>TheEasternKing wrote:<div></div><div></div><p>yes it has been changed in the patch today i went lastnite and it was usual zone get an add and good chance of dying ...today after noticing i wasnt getting hit with the nasty spell / phys damage ability nor the barrages i tried pulling 2 groups of 3 lizzys usually an invitation to death in this zone ....was easy they have nerfed the hell otta this place even the guy on the table is weak now...... and i havent been hit with the brig debuff once either.</p><p>There goes the fun challange zone now its just like the rest a breeze through for loot and crap.</p><p>Message Edited by TheEasternKing on <span class="date_text">03-24-2006</span><span class="time_text">11:00 AM</span></p><hr></blockquote><p>We went last night and the cents seemed alot easier (they wern't hitting for huge damage) BUT omg we couldn't kill the [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] guy on the table. I have been there 3 other times with a lower level group and didn't have any problems with him , but last night....wow.</p><p>The [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] guy was 2-3 shotting a level 70 pali with 11k hps...me and a level 70 mystic just couldn't keep him up no matter what we did. We tried 5 times and said to hell with it and moved on. :smileyindifferent:</p>

[Gaige]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Kizee wrote:<p>Kinda off topic but I really would love to see 1 healer do HoF and keep people up thru the whole thing. (even a plate tank)</p><hr></blockquote>We did it with a zerker tank and me offtanking with a single defiler.  Killed every named in the zone.

[nobunaga_x]

<div>My well equipped 70 guild bruiser tanked this for me the other night to get me the updates for my rice bowl and he only died twice.  We had 2 healers and killed every named.</div>