Monk as main tank?

[Bardrick]

My friends and I are all making toon to play with eachother on the weekends.  (Kids, work, you know)I drew the fighter card.  So, as it stands we are going to have a Fury, Ranger,  Conjourer, and me.  I was thinking Monk.  I really like the Gi look and I am a martial artist in RL as well. I have also seen monks in action at level 30's, and I do admit they are downright devestating..Will this work well?  Or should I be an armor clanker?I suspect we will be doing normal adventuring, and taking on Heroic ^^^ mobs here and there.  But I dought we will be doing any epic raids...Thank you in advance for your opinions.<div></div>

[Uth]

<P>Monks are with the combat changes even better tanks now as most guardians.</P> <P>We can tank due our high avoidance very good, if you be the main tank for your group get high taunt spells, upgrade armor (for high mitigation) and you should be set.</P> <P>Only on epic targets, the plate tanks are a must, but we have other abilities like group feign death for such encounters, which i used often and rescued a raid from starting all over again. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P>

[Gaige]

We can tank anything, epic raids included.

[Uth]

<DIV>Sure if yer equipped like Gaige <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[SykeAuttic]

<P>That's a fairly close configuration to what the remainder of my guild has for classes.  Currently we have 2 monks, conjurer, warden, fury, dirge, and a templar...there's a paladin somewhere in there also, but not as active as the rest.  Typically, we have a monk tank and we've done just fine in most areas of DoF...so stuff in the pre-expansion areas should be fine as well.</P> <P>As mentioned above, be sure to keep upgrading your gear and arts...it'll cost you, but will keep you guys moving forward through content.</P>

[Quijonsith]

My advice to anyone on what class to play has been to research the styles of the classes and choose for that.  I chose monk because I love martial arts.  Chose templar for the cool factor of the healer in plate.  Chose wizard cause I love the spell effects of elemental spells.  Go with your gut and choose for style and you'll rarely be dissapointed with your choice.

[ganjookie]

I choose Bruiser casue in RL I beat up monks!<div></div>

[Xxooo-Coav]

<P>I think you need to look more at the fury in regards to what would be the best tank. What tank would be suit a fury is the question you should be asking.</P> <P>Since you are only looking at a group tank, Monk shouldnt be a problem, regardless of who/what the healer is.</P>

<div></div>As previouisly mentioned in this thread by a fellow monk...yes, Monks "can" tank anything. However there is no need if there is a sk, guardian, or zerker available. A plate wearing class tanks better, end of story, on epic encounters.  Perhaps if avoidance made more of an impact during a lvl 68x4 fight...things might be different.<div></div><p>Message Edited by KR on <span class=date_text>01-02-2006</span> <span class=time_text>07:01 PM</span>

[Gaige]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> KR wrote:<BR> Perhaps if avoidance made more of an impact during a lvl 68x4 fight...things might be different. <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>At 68 nothing is taken into consideration so all that really matters is HP and taunting.  No one can out taunt a monk on a single target.  Period.<BR>

[FelthLightbring]

<DIV>Just my 2cents* Last night, tanked: Poets, Roost and Table.  Only healer we had was a defiler. No deaths and no aggro problems at all.  So the next time a Guardian tells you to "Back Off" you take out your quarterstaff, poke him in the eye, and show em how tankin' really works  :smileytongue:</DIV>

[Rhouvus]

This is a somewhat stupid discussion - which is why I add something to it <span>:smileywink:</span>If you intend to fight mobs above your level, a plate wearing tank class is better than a monk. A monk loses his reflection/avoidance abilities against high level mobs.If the two of you intend to fight heroics, you will most likely only fight white, no higher mobs. For those a monk might be a better choice.<div></div>

[FelthLightbring]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Rhouvus wrote:<BR>This is a somewhat stupid discussion - which is why I add something to it <SPAN>:smileywink:</SPAN><BR><BR>If you intend to fight mobs above your level, a plate wearing tank class is better than a monk. A monk loses his reflection/avoidance abilities against high level mobs.<BR><BR>If the two of you intend to fight heroics, you will most likely only fight white, no higher mobs. For those a monk might be a better choice.<BR><BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Wll I don't know if that is exactly true, last night in Poets we ran through on the Very Hard setting, the mobs were WELL above my level (i'm 59) I didn't have a problem with aggro, avoidance, dying, or any of that. I've done it with plate tanks and then myself, and honestly with the right group either works fine, regardless of the level.

[Junaru]

"If you intend to fight mobs above your level, a plate wearing tank class is better than a monk. A monk loses his reflection/avoidance abilities against high level mobs."Thats only true against orange con mobs. But guess what, as Gaige put it you lose mitigation also. So in the end it doesn't matter what you wear but how many hps you have.  I tank yellow con mobs Heroic and Epic enough to know it can be done.<div></div>

[Supernova17]

<div></div>Ditto on what Gaige said. I'm a 58 Monk alt and a 60 Templar in a high-end raiding guild. Sure a Monk is less effective at avoiding, parrying and deflecting against higher con encounters, but for a plate tank, their mitigation suffers just the same. Against orange con Epics, it's all about Hitpoints, Holding Aggro and Dumping heals to keep up with those 5k crushing/slashing/piercing hits followed immediately by a 5k+ AOE. Against single target orange Epics, we use the Monk Tsunami pull, Monk and Brusier fight for aggro as MT's for almost all single orange epics. Sometimes we throw a plate tank as MT for resists or better group aggro Zerker, Guardian, Paladin etc but right now is the time of the Brawlers. <span>:smileysurprised: We hold single target aggro better than any plate tank, have higher dps than a plate tank to assist holding aggro or bring more dps as the MT of a xp group and we're just plain more fun! </span> <div></div><p>Message Edited by Supernova17 on <span class=date_text>01-03-2006</span> <span class=time_text>11:41 AM</span>

[Gaige]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Rhouvus wrote:<BR>This is a somewhat stupid discussion - which is why I add something to it <SPAN>:smileywink:</SPAN><BR><BR>If you intend to fight mobs above your level, a plate wearing tank class is better than a monk. A monk loses his reflection/avoidance abilities against high level mobs.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Against orange 65+ mobs, they bypass just about everything, including mitigation.  It isn't uncommon to see a orange hit a wizard, guardian, assassin, and a monk for the same amount of melee damage.</P> <P>The *only* thing that matters is HP and taunting, but I said that already.</P> <P>This is why, on our last PPR run I was on Ciriktna and our zerks/guardians were on the adds.  At that time we didn't have a ring, and through my auto attack and storm stance I had a better chance of holding/peeling Cirik through the power drain and mem wipe.  In fact, as you said, avoidance doesn't matter so much that I tanked a lvl 65+++ x4 in my offensive stance.  It allowed me to hold aggro and I had like 9,300hp - to reiterate that is *all* that matters against oranges.  HP and taunting, period.</P> <P>Now that we have the ring I have no doubt that our guardian will tank the PPR named because of the lack of power drain, but that isn't the point.</P> <P>If you think that any high lvl orange epic automatically means plate tank, then you obviously think wrong.<BR></P> <p>Message Edited by Gaige on <span class=date_text>01-03-2006</span> <span class=time_text>12:20 PM</span>

[Cyngii]

Just out of curiousity Gaige how high can you get your HP post revamp if raid tanking?  I'm just curious since PoF Barakah hits me for up to 9500ish hp and without ever being in the main tank group i've only ever gotten up to ~7750 (from defiler/mystic combo).  Can we get into the 10k hp range?  I know brawlers have the highest base HP of the fighters, but we also don't get any hp buffs so rarely have more hp than a guardian (if ever) self buffed.

[Gaige]

<DIV>Highest I've had was like 9,738 or something.  Remember though that I /respec'd almost entirely strength and have a lot of strength gear as I mainly offtank/MA.  I don't tank often, perhaps a few encounters.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Ledbetter though, from Vagabonds, has broke 10k I do believe a few times.  He went all STA and +HP I think.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So it is possible.  You also have to realize a few things.  If you aren't in the MT group you buffs automatically suck, as does your healing usually.  So getting one shot in the short bus group or in the DPS group isn't totally indictive of how you'll tank.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also, debuffs.  If the mob isn't getting properly debuffed he'll one shot anyone, guardian included.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So yeah, if you are set up right with a buttload of stamina and +HP trait selections, breaking 10k hp shouldn't be an issue.</DIV>

[Cyngii]

<DIV>Yeah it's fun trying to work into the rotation with a full T6 fabled Guardian, SK, and Pally (each with near 100% raid attendance) already in the mix.  I went with HP pool increase and Power regen increase with traits, so there might be hope <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  Since our guardian doesn't really have any agro issues I think the only way a monk would raid tank would be a) mob with power drain (and even then it would be a push) or b) 65+ mob and monk had more HP.  Here is another question for you... Since avoidance/mit don't mean a whole lot 65+ would you tank those in offensive stance for better agro control?</DIV>

[Gaige]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Cyngii wrote:<BR> <DIV>Since avoidance/mit don't mean a whole lot 65+ would you tank those in offensive stance for better agro control? <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>Yup, usually.<BR>

[Colossaltitan]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Gaige wrote:<BR> <DIV>Ledbetter though, from Vagabonds, has broke 10k I do believe a few times.  He went all STA and +HP I think.</DIV> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>10.987k was the highest of seen him (This was in COAA) & He was in MT grp sharing buffs with Vellek.<BR><BR>He can break 11k I'm sure of it <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.<BR>

[Cyngii]

That's what i figured since the skill hits from using Coiling Serpent make hitting a 65+ very fun.  Since you're relying on weapon hits for the Storm Stance proc it just makes sense to use the offensive stances in the situations of fighting orange mobs.

[FelthLightbring]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <HR> <P>Supernova17 wrote:</P> <P><SPAN>"and we're just plain more fun!"<BR></SPAN></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Amen Brotha!<BR>

[Colossaltitan]

Pfft~ Dez coming from your mouth a pure Templar Lover.. it must be more fun <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />!<BR>*On a side note, you should be proud! I made a Warden you always told me to try something other than a Melee class* <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Supernova17]

And I made a Fury! MY Fury > Wardens named Collosalltitan! Back to Monks now, you darn Brusier troll! <span>:smileysurprised:</span> <div></div>

[Colossaltitan]

=X.<BR>Its Phay actually and you wanna sleep w/ her!<BR>Warden>Fury <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.<BR><BR>And........... I have a Monk too Dez........................... sooooooooooo, I'll continue to troll here.<BR><3!