Stealing aggro help

[Bewts]

<DIV>Okay, so my monk is 55.  I switched from playing a templar to a monk and pretty much solo'd most of the way.  I've had groups now and then but nothing consistent.  Last night I had my first opportunity to raid.  We did meathooks, Yailth (that gnoll in LT), Rognog and tried MotM (Evil Eye in the instance in Feerrott).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I was in the MT group with a 60 SK as the tank, 60 Inquisitor, 59 Warden, 56 Templar, 49 Illusionist.  I used duel Cestii's mostly with a self buff line of: Group Haste, my self STR/WIS buff, Halcyon Blessing and a TV on the SK.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Versus Meathooks I stuck with the defense debuff skill, Lunging Mongoose and Freezing Palm.  I Stole aggro</DIV> <DIV>Versus Yailth I did nothing but auto attack.  I stole aggro.</DIV> <DIV>Versus Rognog I feign'd twice in the fight.  I never stole aggro.</DIV> <DIV>Versus the Overlord we had a pitched fight and lacked DPS.  I blew through my power bar when the Overlord hit 50%, tore off aggro, went Tsunami, feigned when it went down.  Jumped up few seconds later, within 5 seconds I had aggro on just auto attack.  I ate the death, revived in zone, buffed myself and the SK with TV and tore aggro with auto attack within 20 seconds.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>My question is, am I relegated to auto attack more often than not?  Do I have to periodically drop my auto attack and stand there just to lower my hate?  And most importantly have any of you other monks ran into issues avoiding aggro?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Sanctum, 55 Monk Grobb Server</DIV>

[Lostmymind6]

yes at lvl 57 I am having these problems as well, but it really seems like just learning to fine tune how to use the CA's. I have found that if you just hold back and auto attack till the tank gets a good handle on hate you should be able to unleash without stealing agro...most of the time

[x0rtrun]

This is no bash against Sk's, but I've always found SK tanks to be lousy at holding agro. With any other MT I've only been able to steal agro on a handful of occasions. Go figure. <div></div>

[Balmore]

Kinda crazy question, did you have you taunt proc up? (Dragon line)<img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Mala-Shea]

<P>Heyas Bewts, </P> <P>Like the gentleman above you said, make sure that your hate proc buff isn't up. It will proc off auto attack and continuously build hate. Theres no way auto attack should ever be pulling agro, unless the tank couldn't find the taunt key. I group with an SK sometimes and I HAVE to tank because 10 secs into it the mob is mine anyways, they must have got our old taunts...lol! </P> <P> </P> <P>Slapp Mastajoe</P> <P>60 Monk</P> <P>Grobb</P> <P> </P>

[Bewts]

<P>Dragon Advance Master II was not up, I made sure of that because I pull aggro like mad from our SK in regular grouping situations with that.  No way I was gonna mess around with that on a raid unless I was tanking.  I had read that some SK's were having issues with their taunt lines and a somewhat recent change.  I'm not sure if thats the issue, but as long as we don't have an active guardian and are relying on our 60 SK I need to figure out how to keep my aggro down so I don't pull it and draw ripostes on the entire raid.</P> <P>On another note, I was told when I hit 60 they wanted me to tank MotM because of our 360 degree parry.  Thinking ahead to when that happens, do you all have any suggestions to keeping aggro on the multitudes of mobs that will be mashing on me?  I've had many issues holding aggro on multiple mobs in group situations and in a raid scenario I can only see it getting worse.  On a single mob I can lock a mob up like OJ should have been, but for multiple mobs I have a deep concern of holding aggro.</P>

[Mala-Shea]

<P>Tanked it many times....AE whenever Storming Hydra comes up...but most of all Fury porcupine FTW! </P> <P> </P> <P>Slapp </P>

[Bladewind]

Yeah, the porcupine thing is nice, and also continually rotate your target to let storm stance (replacement for DA) heap threat for you.

[Rylight]

<P>haha rag on the sk's , but really, 54sk here and I vouch for alot of sk's with what im about to say.</P> <P>sadly, its not really your fault, I honestly didnt even read what all spell and ability buffs you had on (partially because I dont play a monk and dont understand them), I trust you had the right combonation for the least amount of hate towards yourself. the fact of the matter is the sk taunts are well..... (not gonna say horrible) simply not up to par/standard with the other tanks when it comes to aggro. why is this?? WE DONT KNOW!!! we have been complaining about this for.... oh..... a YEAR!! and if you think im being a traitor to other sk's just ask them. we lose hate really easily and we are not sure why. maybe soe thinks that since we get three emergency back up hate spells (harm touch line, Fiegn death line, and rescue) that we should have a harder time of gaining hate. we dont know!! but every time I group with a guardian 3 lvls lower then me, he ends up stealing aggro while he is afk on auto-attack!!! that makes no sense, and hes not even in offensive mode, he still has his sheild up (maybe because he knows he is going to steal aggro from me and tank anyways)</P> <P>WE DO TRY HARD, I taunt, shout, and shield bash constantly as much as humanly possible, and we still seem to lose hate, which is why we are always outta power. </P> <P>sadly if you group with a guardian zerker or pally, you will find you wont have this problem. it really hurts for me to have to admit that, but its true. just cant escape it. honestly my whole sk life I either off-tank next to another next. or if I am the MT of the group I ALWAYS MAKE SURE I AM THE ONLY FIGHTER IN THE GROUP, which is usually why I am the one who starts the group, so I get first pick. if I have a guardian or zerker even 3+lvls below me , I am screwed. it only seems I can keep aggro with another sk, or for some reason a pally.</P> <P>the reality is that when you off-tank with an sk MTing, you have to hold off on the beggining of a fight and let him gain a good amount of hate first.......and even then, that doesnt always work.</P> <P>check this, I dinged 54 yesterday and selected my shout to be upgraded to master 2 (the last shout I can get in this game) and I was losing aggro to a lvl 50 warlock. even when taunting shouting and shield bashing sporadically, I just dont know what to do</P> <P>in conclusion. dont feel bad , its not your fault.</P><p>Message Edited by Rylight on <span class=date_text>11-18-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:32 AM</span>

[PhozFa]

I agree with rylight. Many other SKs do also. from grouping with diffrent classes and talking to in game people it seems SKs have the hardest time keeping agro. Also dps classes have to hold back alot more with SKs then say warriors or brawlers (haven't comapred myself to a pally). Most of the bad vibes that come from the SK forums are also agro related issues. We have has this problem for awhile but since the last live update (which our high level taunt was nerfed soe's reason was "to keep it more in line with our previous taunts") its been horrid. Rylight, if our 3 emergency spells were made to make up for our [Removed for Content] agro wouldn't it be ideal to have the recast time shortened? 5 minute rescue, 1 minute FD, and 10 minute HT somewhere along those lines. Alot of times i tank in offensive mode just for the dps agro advantage but obviously that isn't something that is able to be done in raids due to the need for defense. <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Starting to think the devs really don't care <div></div>

[Deathspell]

This reminds me of a bugged Warlock spell. It's to pacify a mob, but the hate it generated was insane and it was very very easy to steal aggro from a tank. Couldn't really use it, unless you wanted to die. Perhaps it's something similar with one of the Monk spells? <div></div>

[Rylight]

Phozfate said <HR> <DIV>Rylight, if our 3 emergency spells were made to make up for our [Removed for Content] agro wouldn't it be ideal to have the recast time shortened? 5 minute rescue, 1 minute FD, and 10 minute HT somewhere along those lines <HR> </DIV> <DIV>yeah they would, but they dont, so whats that telling you.</DIV>

[Landiin]

<DIV>You guys taunting is just fine, its the plates that need address. You have yout tants and dps, we have just our taunts so be happy.</DIV>

[Rylight]

<DIV>ummm, sk's are plate tanks</DIV>

[Supernova17]

Yes, I have run into this as well. Running around in Runnyeye with my 38 Monk doing DPS with a 41 Guardian tanking for the group. I kept stealing aggro even from auto-attacking and he kept telling me to turn off my Dragonstance, but it already was off. Had Offensive Stance, Everburning Flames, Group Haste Buff etc etc running. I enjoy my Monk despite the ease with which he steals aggro. A very fun and interesting class and can easily lockdown a single foe. I'm hoping Monks can hold aggro on grouped encounters better as we level up, because I'm having trouble sometimes with them breaking off and going after my box'd Fury or the DPS =/ <div></div>

[Bewts]

<DIV>As long as people actually target the same mob and don't use implied targetting you can get away with a group taunt on pull, single taunt on a mob, a quick CA or two and then tab through the mobs in the encounter using your single target taunt as it refreshes.  Lots of tabbing involved, but it can keep the hate on you as long as dragon stance up and people dont stack two or three AE's all off at once from the get go.  From my exprience anyways.</DIV>

[x0rtrun]

In my usual group the MT is a pally. With his syphon spell on the swash in our group, and the swashes hate transfer spell on the pally he rarely loses agro, but every once in a while if the swash is slacking i can pull hate. Being in offensive really makes the difference. If you're pulling too much agro, try switching to balanced, or no stance at all. In pick up groups, even when I'm just dpsing I can often pull agro from the tank if i don't limit myself pretty harshly. With good gear and adept3's, it's hard not to pull agro from a tank with poorer gear and adept1s. Personally, i think that if I'm pulling and holding agro without even trying, and i can stand up to the beats, then let me tank. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div>