So what does everyone think..?

[woo]

<DIV>about our new stats..?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>i am level 42 wearing 100% T5 legendary gear and i have 3600hp, 62% avoidance, 1500(2200) mitigation self buffed.  i was comparing this to a level 45 guardian who had 3500hp, 40% avoidance, 2k mitigation and it seems like tanks MIGHT actually be balanced for once..(!?!?!?!!!!!)</DIV> <DIV>before this patch i had ~2.8k hp, 81% avoidance, ~1500 mitigatoin self buffed.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>i havent dont a lot of fighting, just a few, and its definetely more fun.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>lots of good improvements on this patch.. so many little things like animations for tigers, fish that dont fly anymore, rezzing outside groups.. woo!  im pretty happy.  good job sony <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>how bout you guys?</DIV>

[Bladewind]

<P>no more flying octogorgons /cry</P> <P> </P> <P>That thing looked like a UFO if you dragged it out of the water!</P>

[Squallaby]

I'm lovin it so far.. granted I didn't do much, but after getting my abilities set out.. doing the /respec stuff.. etc. Did some fighting on the beach.. and wow.. I'm lovin it. Truly.. lovin it. I don't MT much.. truly.. my guild has a large number of Guardians/Pallys/SK's that love to tank, so I let em.. so I went with a more DPS based abilites than tanking.. truly.. I'm having a blast. Yes truly <img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div>

[Nemi]

<DIV>I'd tell you what I thought, but that would mean I'd actually had played with the changes.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Unfortunately, SoE dropped the ball with the expansion and noone can get into the EU servers.</DIV>

[Prothos]

Seems more balanced atm.  We will find out more from the 50+ monks in the next few days I am sure.

[Xxooo-Coav]

<P>I dont know.. I cant stay in the game to see everything...  = /</P> <P>Unbuffed, I did see my avoidance was down to 49.9%</P>

[Jenj]

<div></div>Initial takes so far: <ul> <li>Our DPS went up slightly: Getting 250-350 dps on 59 level++) mob.</li> <li>Assassin in group getting 250-400dps. Averaging around 300.</li> <li>Tanking 59+++ mob easy enough</li> </ul> Seems like the mobs are fairly weak currently and probably needs to be beefed up. I havent checked my avoidance or mitigation yet -Jenjer <div></div><p>Message Edited by Jenjer on <span class=date_text>09-13-2005</span> <span class=time_text>07:10 PM</span>

[salerene]

<P>atm hate it with a passion. tried to fight a solo blue^ orc after got done with all that respec stuff and rearranging arts and with all my buffs(the ones I can use outside a group) got beat down twice in a row. Now I have 4% exp debt when normally I'd have only 2% and I know this for fact. EXP debt has changed. so watch it.</P> <P>OH and then the server crashed. if it isnt working then fix it. I'd rather have things fixed and working then having the server crashing every half hour or so.</P> <P> </P> <p>Message Edited by salerene on <span class=date_text>09-13-2005</span> <span class=time_text>09:15 PM</span>

[Prothos]

If you died to a blue solo mob period then you are doing something wrong. 

[Koro]

<DIV>i'm lvl 42, t5 legendary gear with about 55-56% avoidance. just went into feerrott and was messing around with 1 bitter bloom, 3 damselflys, 3 muck dregs. all mobs were green single to triple downs and got beat with about 3 mobs left. so...either i'm not used to the new skills (even though it didn't seem to change a whole lot) or i'm not meant to solo that many mobs at a time.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>either way, i think our avoidance should have remained higher than what it is now.</DIV>

[Isidien]

Still a level 21 newbie, but I'm loving the changes so far -- ^ yellows are a problem (as they should be), have to blow mend and get off some good thundering strikes/rapid swings combos (a combo I love right now -- rapid swings also seems to hit much, much more often), but it can be done.  Blues are no problem whatsoever.  I love the speed of combat now, though; before I used to be able to spam CA's as fast as I could between 2h swings and always have something available; now I can pretty easily blow through everything and have 1-2 seconds of just autoattack.<div></div>

[salerene]

<P>doubt I did anything wrong that I normally don't do. hmmm I turned on auto attack and then I started an HO then did arts that werent part of HO. rinse repeat... hmm nope didnt do anything wrong. Basicly the mob was level 32 which is what my monk is, but in con blue ^. thats one of the changes to the con system. Before I had that mob out of the green it had me close to the orange. it was just hitting way to hard way to fast. also having only 62 avoidence and I think 760 or so mitigation doesnt help much.</P> <P>My player/droped armor is crap now and my mix of adept 1 and app2,3,4 arts just aren't cutting it. I hope SOE is going to give everyone a 1pp+ gift, but I very seriously doubt it. I'd take that over a free day anytime.</P> <P>I can only take down arrow mobs and no arrow mobs up to even to me. which is very boring and tedious. also really have noticed the so call exp bonus and since my server has been down for the passed hour and a half and counting. my total of 3 hours to play is wasted. I started at 8pm central and the server crashed around 830pm or so and its been down since.</P> <P>so I'm really not liking this update</P> <p>Message Edited by salerene on <span class=date_text>09-13-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:55 PM</span>

[Mezlo]

<P>Lvl 45 monk. Totally loving it. Soloing actually is even easier than before.</P> <P> </P> <P>Chingdow</P> <P>Ant Bayle</P>

[Cheezburgerinparadise]

<P>So far my initial reaction is, I love my monk! I went harvesting in the Feerrott and figured i'd pick on some spiders. I end up with 1 group of green cons and a group of blue cons and ended up kill them all with 13% hp left after using compress. I then go on to beat an Illusionist 3 out of 5 times dueling ( he got smart on the last 2 and drained my power O_o).</P> <P>While i'm so happy for my monk to become a real tank like I wanted, I am also kind of upset that some of my guildies really feel like they got the short end of the stick. I kind of see that shape looming in the distance, fortelling the arrival of the nerf bat because I see a lot of really angry people who only get angrier when they see you soloing a mob 4 levels higher than you with a ^.</P> <P>Hopefully even with our lowered avoidance we can dodge the bat!</P>

[SythRavenha]

<DIV>Well ... 1 hour in, and I can say I have found the following:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>1)  For a casual gamer, this is gonna hurt.  I could not solo green heroics at all.  I got beat down in less than 15 seconds on most of them.  In the past, that was true with Blue double ups, and soem other blues, but NEVER with Green Heroics.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2)  Fighting groups of greens and low blues is much tougher.  In fact, fighting groups of barely greys isn't a cakewalk like it used to be.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>3)  Fighting solo mobs seems about the same, maybe a slight bit easier.  But umm ... who cares??  The xp is horrible, the loot is horrible (didn't see any signs of the so called improved loot tables), and well .. that's about it. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Three strikes and your out for the casual gamer, or the player like myself who plays 2-3 hours a night, but at such irregular intervals and with such constant interruption I feel more of a burden to a group than a help.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I will give it more time of course, but at this stage, it looks like a rough road for solo'ers.  I cannot fathom how anyone is posting that it is easier on anything except solo mobs.  And yes, I am geared out.  And if you wish to rant on me telling me not to solo in a MMORPG, you have to remember that just because it's multi-player in no way, shape, or form, does that acronym have an extra G in it for Group Gaming (so get off that horse before I knock it from under you).</DIV> <P>Message Edited by SythRavenhawk on <SPAN class=date_text>09-13-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>11:16 PM</SPAN></P><p>Message Edited by SythRavenhawk on <span class=date_text>09-13-2005</span> <span class=time_text>11:37 PM</span>

[Cheezburgerinparadise]

<DIV>I went back in and played around a little. It seems as long as you time stuns/interupts you can solo things 7-8 levels higher than yourself. Of course the exp is terrible because the kills take a while. So I tried a few yellow ^. These guys were pretty easy seemed soloable to me usually got me around 40% hp. I do have 3 common imbued rings Sta, Agi, Str. these made the difference for me. If I didn't use them I got my butt handed to me pretty quickly. It also doesnt seem like going OOP is as bad of a problem for me anymore either and that really helped. I realised as well start harvesting because App 4 and Adept 1 skills are almost junk now. I had 3 out of 4 taunts resisted on yellow mobs, I can't imagine how bad it will be on heroic encounters with a group where you need to hold aggro O_o. Anyway I'm off to bed.</DIV>

[diamondma]

im diggin it dps is down but we still do some. was tanking 59^^^'s np today. power usuage is alot better. dueled quite abit today and only classes i had trouble with were sk's when harm touch is up and other monks, otherwise the fights didnt last much longer than a minute. i was very skeptical before playing today but now im throughly impressed. other than the constant server issues (ie zoning) i had alot of fun today. <div></div>

[NamaeZero]

<DIV>Only fought blue solo cons foes so far.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I think they were easier and died faster than before.. but I did notice I took more damage than pre-Revamp. No more fighting stuff and dodging every single attack, I suppose.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I like the new abilities and not having to switch on buffs all the time is awesome. Once they fix the zoning bugs and such, I think the game will be even better and a lot more fun.</DIV>

[PorkSammi]

<div></div>Level 50, mixed T5 rare and Fabled armor/weapons, using Flying Dragon stance.  Pretty impressed overall. Didn't get a good chance to play much after the last few rounds of changes went in, but I spent the day tanking for a group in Pillars of Flame/Cazel's Mesa and only started to have some difficulty when tanking the 62^^^ heroic mobs (and make no mistake, I know I'm only as good as my healer is <span>:smileywink:</span>). Soloing any mob without an arrow up to orange con is very doable and seems to be the right difficulty for the con. Solo'd a ^^ blue con with little problem as well. Triple up blue cons eat me up solo, however. Still noticed the huge damage spikes that they said were adjusted, but I think I like the changes as a whole. <div></div><p>Message Edited by PorkSammich on <span class=date_text>09-14-2005</span> <span class=time_text>03:36 AM</span>

[Goemoe]

lvl 28 monk with aq gear and legendary staff. I love the change. I soloed low ^^greens, green groups of four, blues, whites and two times a simple yellow with ease. The one telling a blue^ is not possible, did something wrong, cause I am most definately no freak in fighting prowess <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> I could tank well with a 26th templar and a 29th ranger. The ranger did (for me) unbelievable damage and still I could hold the aggro. Everything went well in any test I did. The new con system looks great for me too. (I will adopt to being a tank now, but at least it is working) Thumbs up Goemoe <div></div>

[XunSarak]

<P>So far hate it. Due to work I do not get to play for extended periods of time. That and not being able to find a group with the same end in mind (AQ's) I end up solo alot. All of my existing quests are out of the question now as the mobs are blue/white ^^^ with ^ and ^^ escorts. While I can kill 1-2 of the escorts, I can only get the main mob to 10% (best so far).</P> <P>I have lvl 25 Wood Elf Monk and noticed that after patch I lost over 150 mit and 13% avoidance. Mobs that con'd grey are now green/'agro. I happened to have logged out in a bad place it seems. Died 5 times finally getting all shards back. </P> <P>Have been playing a monk since beta. This is my 6th currently active toon and second monk. I will be trying out a lvl 50 monk tonight hopefully</P> <P> </P>

[JudyJudy]

<DIV><EM>It took some time to get used to timing my attacks, but in the long run - It's all good.  I like the changes.  With legendary T4 crafted I have no trouble solo'ing a green^^ - it's a little tougher mind you, but it's all there.</EM></DIV> <DIV><EM></EM> </DIV> <DIV><EM>Battle is a little more fast-paced, and I like that.  I don't have to worry about a mob stunning me at the same time I stun him and loose my darting sparrow opportunity.  It's a bit more cut and dry the exchange of blows between my monk and the mob.</EM></DIV> <DIV><EM></EM> </DIV> <DIV><EM>And 360degree deflection is just awesome.  :smileyhappy:</EM></DIV>

[Gaige]

<P>You guys are *REALLY* not supposed to be fighting green/blue/white +++ HEROIC mobs.  Even if you can kill them, the efficiency SUCKS.  Fight what you are supposed to fight.  Yellow and lower + mobs.</P> <P>No wonder you guys don't like it, trying to fight WHITE HEROICS.  LoL.</P>

[MadchenBlau]

I haven't had the chance to try solo yet, but so far at lvl 50 I'm not unhappy with what I see.  I was very skeptical to how much use I would be in groups, but from my experience I've had a few hours this morning I am happy.  I had no trouble tanking at all in group even in offensive stance.  We weren't fighting anything more than yellow^^^, but I still held up better than I used too and was dishing out decent dps.  I still have a satisfying group role, so I am content. <div></div>

[Baldar538]

<P>I got in for a little bit last night, and these are the changes I noticed (sorry if it's been reported elsewhere. Also, Im only level 16 at the moment, but if people are looking for things that changed):</P> <P> </P> <P>1. My good taunt, Velan's cry, was replaced with Whirl without my asking</P> <P>2.Toughness is no longer a short timer buff, its a stance with a 12 hour recast</P> <P>3. Martial Focus is no longer a short time buffer, its a 12 hour buff</P> <P>(I don't know my stat increases before change on Toughness and MF, so I can't say whether amounts of Avoidance/Mit got nerfed or not)</P> <P>4. Thundering fists is now a short timer buff, and I don't believe the description said anything about stun anymore. It was extra damage if I remember right.</P> <P> </P> <P>Just the few changes I noticed in early game (level 16).. I'd imagine some of these changes spread up the CA lines</P> <P> </P>

[Hondr]

<DIV>I’d have to say, over all I’m actually pleasantly surprised how much I’ve enjoyed the changes.  I expected less with some of the doom and gloom comments made over the past couple weeks from the different classes.  Some classes have more ‘re-learning’ than others… and I’m sure some additional changes are still yet to come.  Actually hope they don’t tweak too much… </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Did just group content last night…  haven’t done any old or new raids as guild is taking it easy last night checking stuff out the new zones for most.  Doing a quickie SP raid tonight... looking forward to the changes and how that’s going to work.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The new spells will take some adjustment, as I’m missing stuff… I think.  Lvl 50 monk and for the first time not sure [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] spells I should be using ATM.  Lol  Need to figure out the stacking of my own buffs, with those that I’m grouped with at the time.  Is it me or we only ever use 3 con points, EVER?  Must be missing something…  Need to play around with personal buffs and stackings… will do that tonight.  I’ll also get a chance to check out raid buffs too.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Didn’t get a chance to fill the tank role last night, Hubby has a 50 guard.  For someone that was PHONOMINAL at maintain agro in almost any situation… 75% of the time he did just fine, but the other 25% he would lose agro to me and 2 times to the assassin.  Even tested with me just on auto atk and OMG… there wasn’t anything he could do to maintain at all times.  For a perfectionist… it was driving him crazy.  He said comments are being made on the Guard board… so maybe a bug, perhaps.</DIV> <DIV>As for tanking…  tonight I’ll also test it out a bit for raiding… as I’ll lead the second group in SP tonight.  I’m sure I’ll tank in a group setting Thursday or after the raid…  Hubby wants to see what they did to his Troub.  Hope he doesn't shelve his 50 bard... Poor guy!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Speaking of shelved toons...  I have a 50 Mystic too but LOVE the monk so not in a rush to check that out other than set up my specs maybe.  Speaking of specs... looking foward to respect next week.  UGH!!  Couple [Removed for Content] choices... but at least I picked <STRONG>ORC</STRONG>!  hehehe</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><BR> </DIV>

[Ai064]

<P>I'm confused about people having difficulty solo'ing.  I must be missing something.  I logged on last night and absolutely tore through the spiders in the tunnel.  With the shortened cast times I got off my high dps attacks very quickly.  I had my winding dragon master1 on, with my avoidance being around 62% which seemed to be plenty high.  I was finishing fights fast and with about 75% life left.  Wanting to push the envelope I found an icy goblin lvl 47 3up heroic mob out on the ice floes.  Prior to the revamp it would have just mowed me down like a blade of grass.  This time I was able to stand up solo to it for a while.  I burned Heal partway through the fight.  I actually got it down to 50% life before I had to feign.  I thought that was credible for as tough a mob as it was. </P> <P>I'm lvl 50, with sixta's and a t5 rare imbued cedar baton for weapons.  With 1600 mitigation and 62% avoidance I loved how I tanked.  I got my wife's druid, lvl 50 fury, to come help me and we could duo lvl 48 3up heroic Tundra bastages.  I could barely tank those in a group before and here we were duo'ing them. </P> <P>I certainly don't want to give the impression that we need to be nerfed but it was nice to actually be able to tank something decently difficult!  And I loved the difference in stances.  When I switched to my offensive stance there was a HUGE difference in how often she had to heal me, which is how it should be.  I was on for an hour or so last night and found zero to complain about.</P> <P>Oh, the FD changes are awesome too!  I don't hesitate feigning now since the self-buffs stay on me!  Now I drop without worrying about the time and power spent rebuffing.  For once it feels like SOE did something very positive!</P>

[Squidwalk]

<P>Well I'm a 37 monk, and I played last night for a while. I am very impressed so far. I started off by doing the full respec, and then redoing all my toolbars. I like the new stuff and the changes too. Then I tried some solo greens with deff buffs up, worked great. Ran with a 38 swashy that pulls agro all the time, and I held my own really well. In fact with dragon up and starting with the sparking dmg per hit buff, I used two taunts and just sat there with autofire on. The swashy didn't pull agro off me. </P> <P>After a while of running around duoing stuff, we hooked up with a group to do the last part of the Foomby's quest. The lami run and the big baddy. We had a 39 guardian as the MT, a fury, the swashy and myself. At first I forgot to turn off dragon stance and pulled agro immediately. But even after turning that off, if I went full Off mode, and didn't pace myself, I was pulling agro. Very impressed with the DPS now. </P> <P>We eventually hooked up with a d 36 defiler and were doing awesome. We both wanted to try a run with me as MT. I went full Deff mode, put dragon stance up, and after the defiler warded me and the group, I pulled the new nightblood ^^ heroic encounters. 2 NB with 40^^ heroic. One of them always ran right for the shammy, but I did manage to get agro back and hold it for both of them pretty well. Occasionally the swashy or shammy pulled it. The shammy was very impressed with teh wards, that lasted quite some time and weren't getting beat down in seconds as before. I was getting pounded on by both these nighbloods, and it we got them down to about half before my ward broke. They said I didn't hardly loose much health in the fight and the healers were way above half power at the end. And that was with a single 40^^ add coming into the mix. I was nearly out of power mind you, but I heald agro pretty well, didn't make the healers have to chain heal me and drain themselves healing. And I realy liked the combo of shammy and monk now, it is awesome and how it should have been all this time. </P> <P> </P> <P>Want to log on with my shamman tonight and play with that.      I did manage to go find an app4 of the Offensive stance thingy. So now at least it's not at app1. The only bummer of the changes is new skill are at app1, with adpets not being discovered/made yet. </P>

[Squidwalk]

Gage " You guys are *REALLY* not supposed to be fighting green/blue/white +++ HEROIC mobs.  Even if you can kill them, the efficiency SUCKS.  Fight what you are supposed to fight.  Yellow and lower + mobs. <P>No wonder you guys don't like it, trying to fight WHITE HEROICS.  LoL."</P> <P> </P> <P>Yup was about to say same exact thing I posted my experience above, then started reading the posts. Guys, they didn't just change our stuff, they changed the con system, A LOT. Notice how things that used to be white ++ heroic are now white +++ heroic. The point of the matter is this. Solo is not supposed to be able to take ANY heroic mobs, expcept probably a green. They don't want solo ppl taking down heroics. But even solo mobs are tougher and con differently then they used to. If you used to be able to take on a yellow + before, you probably won't now. It's to far above you. A white + will be a challenge for you. If you watch carefully the cons of stuff and don't just go grab the same mob you used to beat up, you will notice you are not able to take on the same cons you used to. That was part of the combat revamp. </P> <P>My suggestion is, start with some plain solo greens, and go up for there, trying different mobs of different levels, progressively. Test your character out starting below what you used to be able to do. </P><p>Message Edited by Squidwalker on <span class=date_text>09-14-2005</span> <span class=time_text>11:29 AM</span>

[Edyil]

<P>The game should not be designed with the concept that all players are in T5 rare / Fabled gear.  If you (top tier players) need more content then you should get it - designed from the ground up specifically for your enjoyment.  Universally changing the game so that normal day to day activities are more difficult and time consuming for hard-core gamers just so that you can pass the time while waiting on raids is utterly stupid.</P> <P>If you are in all T5 and up gear you should have a totally seperate discussion about how game development proceeds from those that take years to earn enough to buy a set (which of course by then is way out-dated).</P> <P>Verant knew well enough that there were 3 games within each and that's why the initial success.  RP, casual and power-gamer.  Anyone dumb enough to redesign a game based on just one of the 3 concepts is going to get what they deserve.</P> <P>In the end, keep that in mind when you "don't understand how they can't solo white or yellow ^".  It's actually very simple to understand when you look beyond yourself.</P> <P>It's very easy to see that these changes are destructive to the casual gamer and those that exclusively solo.  Some on the cusp are going to eek by but those with out Masters and without Rare gear are going to flounder and eventually fail.  Those that don't study the numbers, don't read their class boards and don't worry about their gear on a level by level basis and allow spells to go without upgrades aren't going to make it. </P> <P>Does that seem right?</P> <P> </P> <P>The changes are what they are.  We will deal with them individually.  But I'm fairly certain my observations are correct.  These changes are NOT universally good or bad.  The "have's" now have more.  The "have-nots" are now futher behind.  Those of us in the middle will get by.  Those above will fly to 60.  Those behind will painfully adapt (or cancel).  Those that are thinking of buying the game for the first time won't stand a chance.</P> <P>Message Edited by Edyil on <SPAN class=date_text>09-14-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>11:42 AM</SPAN></P><p>Message Edited by Edyil on <span class=date_text>09-14-2005</span> <span class=time_text>11:43 AM</span>

[Anjin]

<DIV>So far so good as far as I'm concerned - losing 20%+ avoidance is a bummer, but this seems to be made up with more mitigation.  My only real concern is being forced into groups - this is made more of a reality by the fact (I certainly couldn't get it working!) that we have no self heal anymore!  Harclaves was a prime example where a self heal would have been handy.  Now instead of 490 health regain per tick, it's only 100 so I was a tad shocked when I only just survived 10 'shrooms on me!  Maybe it was just a bit of luck, but I gained twice as much loot as normal in the instance - no master spells though <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Anjin</DIV> <DIV>lvl 45 Monk - Splitpaw</DIV>

[Arielle Nightshade]

<DIV>FYI...I PvP'd my lvl 50 monk partner (boy...I've waited a LONG time for that!  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />...and cleaned his clock!!!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>err....Ok...beat the crp out of him ONCE in 5 fights  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  ...well..actually...won by a very narrow margin once.   He completely pwned me the other 4.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Those that say a fight with a healer is like watching paint dry for the length of it......are not monks   LOL</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>My 2c, </DIV>

[Ethelwo]

My monk came out ok with the changes. My dps is still reasonable and my tankability has improved, but not to the extent I would MT in a group with the healers being so gimped as they are now. In short my monk can solo just fine if I stick to solo content. In a group he is still in the dps role.

[Lebr]

<DIV>/cheer SoE</DIV> <DIV>Its fun to play again  everything might not be perfect but this is a huge step in the right direction.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Fighting feels like it should decent challenge you can die if you dont pay attention.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Lebru1 on <span class=date_text>09-17-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:08 AM</span>

[KeenaMoonphy]

<DIV>I am loving the new changes personally. Leveling to 50, I was constantly grouped with either a guardian or a zerker because they were friends and we had a steady group leveling up. This time around, Im grouping with other people and I have the change to tank. I LOVE this group role. I dont get to talk as much (much to some people's relief!), but playing the class is FUN! I love Shocking Hands and Will of the Wind, two very nice useful spells. Dragon Advance is great too!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>/cheers SoE!!</DIV><p>Message Edited by KeenaMoonphyre on <span class=date_text>09-15-2005</span> <span class=time_text>08:07 AM</span>

[Gaige]

<DIV>I think a lot of these complaints from solo'ers stems from not understanding the new con system and having preconceived notions and expectations from how the game was pre-DoF.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>MG said a few times that with appropriate tier handcrafted gear and app4 quality spells you should be able to effectively solo white no arrow mobs.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So, when you consider the huge plethora of changes to everything, it takes some getting used to.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Its quite possible to solo though, and group.  Even MT for groups.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Or, that's the rumor <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[Sado]

<P>After the change went live I logged on and rearranged all my spells, putting all greys in back, and then respec'ed.  I had read on the boards the messages about the new con system and have not even attempted any heroics.  I am very scared to say I am delighted with the changes.  I am soloing yellow 46's in everfrost (I am  a 43) but I found that groups of three-one-arrow-down-blues in the feerrott gave more xp.  Yes, monks can solo after the patch,  just solo more appropriate cons (like they warned us about pre-live update 13) and still get good xp.   Yes, I know we have an xp bonus for the next week, but even so, if you don't constantly aim for white and yellow heroics you can still move up level-wise pretty good.  Greens and blues before the update or not the same as greens and blues are now.  My experience is that yellows can be done but will require a little more downtime afterward... I can move faster and more steadily going through groups of blues (no arrow ups.)</P> <P>When I signed on after the update I did not even begin playing until an hour afterward.  It took that long to go through all my spells, and then do the respec.   Then I tried low greens to get the feel of the spells and what I could and could not do, and then worked my way up.   I am very pleased with the changes so far.  A lot of my gear was blue before the update and has turned white now.   And I have NO fabled gear.</P> <P>Love the new tiger animations.  Even more delighted that I got them with the combat upgrade since I have not ordered DoF yet.</P> <P>And what can I say about Wind Walk?  At 42 before the update I could only hide from blues.  Now, after the update, I can hide from every yellow I have seen (except for one yellow "Master" Sattar I saw in the Feerrott yesterday), and with a power regen totem it will hold up indefinately.   And no reduction in speed.</P> <P>Feign Death ? Buffs, totem effects, potions, and tiger form remain up afterward, yeah! I now spend so much less time in buffing that it is great.</P> <P>Use common sense and get rid of the notion of being able to solo all heroics, even greens, and you will do fine.  Sometimes you will have to group to complete some heroic quests...that is just how it is.  But it will not mean you will have to group all the time, like other classes are complaining they may have to now.</P> <P>I, personally, am enjoying the changes for as long as they last...but I doubt they will last.  There is not a doubt in my mind that we will be hit with the nerf bat soon.    </P>

[Crunion]

<DIV>Having a blast sofar.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Stances play a big part in a monks like now and I managed to play around with them yesterday while grouped. You could actually notice a difference if you got hit while in DPS stance compared to MIT stance. We spent the day playing with mobs in pillars of flame and had a monk tank the whole day with no problems (Course we wiped in 5 mins when I tried to tank  <img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> )</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It nice to see invis works, but wish it used mana at abit slower pace, and the animation on tiger was cute.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Overall I like what they've done with the revamp and the expansion. Ah i'm finally getting my collection fix under control now with all the collection quests to work on.</DIV>

[Cuz]

<P>Check this out it'll blow your mind:</P> <P>Last night I was playing around in Feerrott, I need to kill those blue twerp thingies (ewols? those stupid humanoid blue things just past the beach), so I found a group of 3 defenders. Go at them straight up defence stance, going all out ape doo-doo on them. Fight was easy enough. I see another group with a healer in the fray, not thinking too too much (which happens all too often) I charge in all gung-ho. Lets just say I was happy to have some healing potions. After that I figured I'd wait for them to repop and try something else. Eventually did, and the fun began.</P> <P>I switched to my offensive stance, targeted the healer. Charged in going dps heavy, but still trying to spot incoming heals. I was able to interupt or delay his heals about 75% of the time! Stupid twit went down fast, I switched back to defensive stance, and took down the other two goons. The second attempt took half the time, and I wasn't worried at all.</P> <P>Point of this? I'm long winded and use commas too much, or just flat out improperly. Oh and the game needs you to think a bit more. </P>

[Indigo-B]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Gaige wrote:<BR> <DIV>I think a lot of these complaints from solo'ers stems from not understanding the new con system and having preconceived notions and expectations from how the game was pre-DoF.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>MG said a few times that with appropriate tier handcrafted gear and app4 quality spells you should be able to effectively solo white no arrow mobs.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So, when you consider the huge plethora of changes to everything, it takes some getting used to.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Its quite possible to solo though, and group.  Even MT for groups. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Or, that's the rumor <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>But you're not exactly a casual player so won't be able to see the change from our point of view.</P> <P>Yes, it is quite possible to solo. If you're careful...Yesterday I solo'd a Wind Swept Rock, I was most impressed, it con'd white to me as well :smileytongue:</P> <P>The fact that we now have to be even more careful <FONT size=2>(don't be fooled, it wasn't a walk in the park for us casual players before this but it was pretty acceptable what we could and couldn't do)</FONT> which basically means there are now more zones or areas of zones that simply closed to us. Now, if the server populations were at a level that SOE would like or would have expected then what is basically a nerf on solo'ing <FONT size=2>(whether that is by changes to the class or changes to the mobs)</FONT> would not have had such an effect. The casual player could (prolly) log on, get a group and play for 2-3 hrs quite happily but this is far from the case now and with the new expansion, the zones are even quieter. The main reason casual players solo so much is because it's better <FONT size=2>(more fun, not more efficient)</FONT> to get 2-3 hrs of solo'ing in than 1hr or more of group searching first then 1or 2hrs of playing.</P> <P>And this isn't just for solo'rs...Small group players, like partners that Duo a lot, are hit just as hard from what I have seen.</P> <P>I'm don't "we" are saying that everything they have done here has been negative...In many cases<FONT size=2> (with the exception to the change to Monk. I preferred what I was like before this revamp but that is personal preference only)</FONT> I see these changes as positive...Hey, I even got trained <FONT size=2>(unintentionally, I am certain)</FONT> at a zone line yesterday, been a while since that happened...Strangely brought back happy memories of places like KC, MM and even Balckburrow :smileyvery-happy: but for the casual player I do see this as a blow.</P>

[stfields]

<DIV>One thing I haven't done so far... is solo or duo (which is what I did to get to 50 pre-expansion).  I've been grouping the whole time. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>At first, I was pretty bummed out.  I was in a group with a pally, and he wanted to tank.  So, I got to see how nerfed our DPS was.  I have NOT had the chance to upgrade Halcyon Blessing yet... so I kept SS up in case I got hate.  I got hit big time with that haste nerf.  I used to wear 2 slayer rings (6%), FBSS (15%) and manipulation braclet (20%).  Considering that our self-haste dropped to 30% with Master II Everburning Flame, and I lost about 50% of my item haste... even with the slight boost from SS, swinging my RGF was as slow as molasses. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The pally left and I assumed the tank position.  That's when the fun started.  We romped around Pillar of Flames.  We slaughtered all the level 58-59s on the Naga Island.  I was so glad we could actually tank.  Unfortunately, the experience was slower than my RGF, if you follow. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm pretty happy with my group-buffed stats: 5k-6.2k hp (depending on who is in the group), 2.5k mit, 69.6% avoidance, over 900 attack.  Its not too shabby if you ask me.  I even kept up Walk like Mountain here and there for the extra mitigation and even used Stone Stance for laughs. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We then went to town and slaughtered some guards in the towers.  That was pretty good too.  The exp was ok there as well. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I stated this in another thread, but I'll put it here for completeness:  with only 1 night of playing time in the expansion, it looks like DW legendary cestii has better DPS than the RGF, at least in the tanking role.  If there was an increase in ripostes due to the cestii, the healers didn't notice it. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hate was only an issue if the AoE tant was resisted by all mobs on the initial pull.  But, a storming hydra can help glue them on you just long enough.  Which reminds me, they must've bumped up our Storming Hydra ability... at master I, I'm hitting mobs routinely for over 500 each. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I've been hearing that mystics have been causing trouble with their wards and gaining a lot of hate, wreaking havoc on tanks.  I only saw a little bit of that.  One monk in my guild was saying it was near impossible to keep hate off the mystic in his group, whereas I had very few problems.  I'm thinking it was the group dynamics that caused this disparity.  However, when hate does get out of control, it is very very difficult to peel them off the healers. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Another thing I've noticed, mezzed mobs seem to resist taunts very frequently.  We had a slew of adds, and the coercer was keeping them at bay, but the melee would wake up the mobs before I could grab hate.  Luckily, the coercer didn't go down.  However, on the last mob, the melee waited...and waited... while about 2/3 of my taunts were resisted.  It was bizarre.  But, when Shocking Hand came up, I just stepped up with LM and then taunted twice, and it was locked right on me.</DIV>

[Edyil]

<P>I think Gage reitterated what I had previously said.  But I will flatly add:</P> <P>Like EQ1, EQ2 has now become a game of gear and upgrades.  If you have the gear and CAs, your monk life will be cake.  If not, you will struggle to an extent.</P> <P>Now, there are two points to that.  1) When reading declairatives such as "Oh this is great.  I can kill _____________", take them with a grain of salt.  If Monk A can do something, Monk B can do it as well as long as he has equal or better gear.  The sad thing is that tactics take a back seat from here on out (to an extent).  2) As I have said before, this revamp increases the gap between the have's and the have-not's.  Those with the gear will find it easier to get more.  Those without will find it more difficult to get what they need.  Hello?  EQ1 anybody?</P> <P>I'm not complaining.  I just want both sides of the coin to understand where the other is coming from.  I dual box a monk/warden.  So I can do what I need when I need to (for the most part).  Most folks don't have that advantage.  I was proud of myself for dual-boxing Chomper, The Sludge Creep and 4 or 5 mini-bosses in RE last night.  (No Master chests - the dirty buggers)  Those were all first for me and partly as a result of the revamp. But there is a very distinct line where I can and cannot go and what I can and cannot do. </P> <P>For an average player with average gear duoing with a warden, here is my con system (lvl 44 Monk):</P> <P>Down Arrow Singles - Can kill them up to the point where it isn't possible to hit them anymore(+6ish levels or so)<BR>Down Arrow Groups - Can kill them up thru oranges but stop short on reds</P> <P>No Arrow Singles - Up through oranges and some red overcons<BR>No Arrow Groups - Up through whites</P> <P>One Arrow Singles - Up through Yellows<BR>One Arrow Groups - Up through Whites (some yellows but only +1 level or so)</P> <P>Two Arrow Singles - Some whites but mostly blues<BR>Two Arrow Groups - Some whites but mostly blues (group size matters a lot at this point)</P> <P>Three Arrow Singles - Blues up thru level 41's - hit or miss on 42's<BR>Three Arrow Groups - ? (This usually includes a mini boss in a group and would hurt) Greens</P> <P>Three Arrow Mini Bosses - Lvl 38 Blues and below - Level 39 will kill us.<BR>Three Arrow Mini Bosses in Groups - Green (Costs too much power to live when fighting the blues)<BR>Three Arrow Bosses - Greens only</P> <P>Epics - Greys only? Not tested.  I'd guess they need to be more than 12-15 levels below now with the revamp</P> <P>Note:  Keep in mind I got to test most of that with the handy use of Evac (giving me repeatability).  That's how a know, for example, that I can dual box a lvl 38 boss but a lvl 39 will kill us each and every time.</P>

[Crunion]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> stfields wrote:<BR> <DIV>One thing I haven't done so far... is solo or duo (which is what I did to get to 50 pre-expansion).  I've been grouping the whole time. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>At first, I was pretty bummed out.  I was in a group with a pally, and he wanted to tank.  So, I got to see how nerfed our DPS was.  I have NOT had the chance to upgrade Halcyon Blessing yet... so I kept SS up in case I got hate.  I got hit big time with that haste nerf.  I used to wear 2 slayer rings (6%), FBSS (15%) and manipulation braclet (20%).  Considering that our self-haste dropped to 30% with Master II Everburning Flame, and I lost about 50% of my item haste... even with the slight boost from SS, swinging my RGF was as slow as molasses. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>You realize we have 3 spell line hastes, 1 item haste and 1 proc haste that we can stack.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>group haste buff is around 11% (at my current lvl. which isn't too high)</DIV> <DIV>Halcyon at adept 3 is 30-35% (forget the exact total)</DIV> <DIV>Everburning 30%</DIV> <DIV>FBSS 15%</DIV> <DIV>item proc 25% or 50%</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>so with just items and spells you can have around 86-91% haste</DIV>

[JudyJudy]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Indigo-Bro wrote: <P>And this isn't just for solo'rs...Small group players, <U>like partners that Duo a lot</U>, are hit just as hard from what I have seen.<BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV><EM>Sorry, I don't mean to sound dis-respectful or burst your bubble - but I solo most to if not all the time and when I'm not, I'm duoing with my wife's pally.  At level 33, we were killing +++ Green Heroic giants in TS and got at least 2% per each kill with very very VERY little downtime.  It's really all about knowing your class, and granted we're all re-learning, but it's really not that bad for us casual gamers as well.</EM></DIV> <DIV><EM></EM> </DIV> <DIV><EM>They've done a great job of balancing us out.  The stances and haste stacks are just awesome, our stuns and interupts are still there - and frankly I feel like the DPS isn't all that far off.  Sure the con system has changed, along with our mitigation and avoidance - but so has the mobs.</EM></DIV> <DIV><EM></EM> </DIV> <DIV><EM>Give it a bit more time, experiment with what you have and I"m sure as a casual gamer, you'll find your niche again.</EM></DIV>

[Indigo-B]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> JudyJudy wrote:<BR> <DIV><EM>Sorry, I don't mean to sound dis-respectful or burst your bubble - </EM></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>You don't, and you haven't. You've just misunderstood me, which is prolly my fault...I have a habit of using a lot words when maybe just a few will do.</P> <P>Anyway, I'll try and explain my point a bit better. It's a not an issue of I can't solo anymore or we can't solo anymore (I do have an issue with the changes to my Monk but they are in another thread and nothing to do with this)</P> <P>The problem is that there are zones/dungeons/areas whatever that are now no longer accessable to the solo and small group players. A case example would be CoD, my friends went in there (husband and wife team) with their low 30's characters and progressed someway before getting stuck...I was going to make up the numbers with my Monk (only 26th level) but from what we had done previously together they were sure I would be enough...(Since I am the only other active member of our guild at present I would <EM>have</EM> to be enough :smileyindifferent: ) We try it out after the Revamp and we can no longer get passed the entrance mobs. :smileysurprised:</P> <P>Now this isn't a case of crying "We can no longer defeat this encounter we've been nerfed" it's the fact that this zone is now closed to us as a Trio...I don't see, while these mobs are still green (yellow to me atm) that we'll ever be able defeat them. So my question to you is not whether you can still effectively solo or duo but can you still enter and hunt in all the places you could before? If the answer is no then you see what I mean about closing off some more of the game to casual players and as such being a "nerf" If the answer is Yes then perhaps you are right and my friends (and I) just need to learn the classes better.</P>

[Lich]

My Monk still Rocks Love the Changes

[JudyJudy]

<DIV><BR></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Indigo-Bro wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> JudyJudy wrote:<BR> <DIV><EM>Sorry, I don't mean to sound dis-respectful or burst your bubble - </EM></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>You don't, and you haven't. You've just misunderstood me, which is prolly my fault...I have a habit of using a lot words when maybe just a few will do.</P> <P>Anyway, I'll try and explain my point a bit better. It's a not an issue of I can't solo anymore or we can't solo anymore (I do have an issue with the changes to my Monk but they are in another thread and nothing to do with this)</P> <P>The problem is that there are zones/dungeons/areas whatever that are now no longer accessable to the solo and small group players. A case example would be CoD, my friends went in there (husband and wife team) with their low 30's characters and progressed someway before getting stuck...I was going to make up the numbers with my Monk (only 26th level) but from what we had done previously together they were sure I would be enough...(Since I am the only other active member of our guild at present I would <EM>have</EM> to be enough :smileyindifferent: ) We try it out after the Revamp and we can no longer get passed the entrance mobs. :smileysurprised:</P> <P>Now this isn't a case of crying "We can no longer defeat this encounter we've been nerfed" it's the fact that this zone is now closed to us as a Trio...I don't see, while these mobs are still green (yellow to me atm) that we'll ever be able defeat them. So my question to you is not whether you can still effectively solo or duo but can you still enter and hunt in all the places you could before? If the answer is no then you see what I mean about closing off some more of the game to casual players and as such being a "nerf" If the answer is Yes then perhaps you are right and my friends (and I) just need to learn the classes better.</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV><BR><EM>Very well spoken.  I think I understand where you're coming from now, and I would agree that there are zones or even instances for that matter, that are now inaccessable ( or harder to access) due to the changes.  I believe this for a few reasons:  </EM></DIV> <DIV><EM></EM> </DIV> <DIV><EM>1)  Mobs 10 levels below us now can agro, when before they were greyed out - which can keep even the most hardy groups hard pressed to access places they could easilty get to before.  2)  Some classes have been hit pretty hard with the nerf bat and lack the ability (whether it's from their play style or not) to use their character to maximum effectiveness.  3) The con system has changed and many solo mobs that were considered a "no-brainer" are usually now ^^^ heroics.</EM></DIV> <DIV><EM></EM> </DIV> <DIV><EM>All in all, I think we'll all adapt in one form or another - but I think we as monks will do just fine - and I have no doubt you will as well.  :smileyhappy:</EM></DIV>

[Iari111]

<DIV>I am loving the changes.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Soloing seems to be easier.  My stuns appear to land more often now, which helps.  Is it my imagination, or does FD work better now as well?  I have used it more times in the last 2 days than in the last 6 months, and have only had it fail on me once (oddly enough, with mobs that were grey to me )</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As far as grouping, I have not been MT in a group yet.  I am still filling a dps role in our guild group, which is fine by me, with a paly tanking (plus a temp, fury, and wiz).  DPS-wise, I am still very happy..  I was worried that I would not have a place in my usual group, but it works out well.  I stun and dps (I need to be more careful now with over-dpsing), and when adds join in on the fun, I pull them and tank them with relative ease.  The paly finally sees me as both dps <U>and</U> tank, and no longer freaks out when I help him with adds <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>~Luna</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Indigo-B]

<P>Well, played a fair amount of over this weekend. More with my Swashy (who currently fits in with the Trio better than my Monk) but I have been solo'ing the Monk and seem to have a better grasp on what he can and can't do now and made a few levels with the Exp bonus. Need to get him to 30 before Wednesday...Make hay, etc.</P> <P>I still feel it's a shame that some bits may now be closed to us that weren't before...At least until we level some more but have come to terms with that fact and even tho my "life" as a solo'r has been restricted a little more the group encounters are much greater which, if not better for me in general, has to be good for the game.</P> <P>So I'm pretty done with my whining. They only negative thing I really have to say about the monk changes is that <EM>I </EM>don't like them that much but I can see I'm in the minority and anyway, I'll get used to them...Shame I had to lose Beslin's still mind tho <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P> </P> <P> </P>