Monk-Mend vs Brawler-Ignore Pain

[gammyg]

<DIV>I'm not quite sure why Mend is on a 5 minute reuse timer where Ignore Pain is on a 90 second reuse timer. Can anyone provide information on this?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Is it because monks have certain advantages over Brawlers with passive defense buffs or vice versa?</DIV>

[bonesbro]

We can mend other people, and Ignore Pain is self-only. <div></div>

[Gaige]

<DIV><BR></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> bonesbro wrote:<BR>We can mend other people, and Ignore Pain is self-only.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>Because monks rule and bruisers drool!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Because Iksars are wusses!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Because bruisers are nerds!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Okay, okay, bone is right, sorry :smileyindifferent:<BR></DIV>

[IrulanDunedanc]

It may also be a holdover from EQ1 monks.  Mend was self-only, healed 25% of your max hp (50% if you had Crit Mend and it went off), no cast time, and had a 5 minute recast.

[sglant]

<P>But Mend here does have a cast time.</P> <P>I have only used Mend on someone else once. I would rather have self only 90sec cast  = )</P>

[SageMarrow]

well you should have been an evil self serving egotistical blowhard willing to back it up by any means neccessary or  simple jagged broken glass bottle to the back of the head... <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>but nooooo,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>you wanna be a goody two shoes monk so you can help the good people of qeynos...</DIV>

[Grabaan]

<P>I use mend several times a day in raid situations, for those first critical moments where heals may not be coming quick enough, and its good enough for the recovery.</P> <P>Saved countless raids from wiping  by casting this on whoever's tanking, just to give the healers a chance to catch up.</P> <P>I use the special training Lu Sun's because it not only heals for 27% but wipes some poision and disease out too.</P> <P>People claim its worthless, but I see it as one of my more useful skills. Go figure <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>Btw, ding 50 a few nights ago <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P> </P>

[sglant]

probably pointless question, but the training Mend and real Mend are on same timer right?

[Sassinak]

I think Ignore Pain heals less than Mend, but not certain about that. 90 second recycle is awesome, because I can use it every single fight when solo, and almost every fight when duo.  I've saved my own life many times in groups, especially when tanking, when a healer is a little late.  Not having to target myself is handy.  Also, it works when I am practically OOP. <div></div>

[IkkyScar]

Ignore pain is roughly 40% of your total life for bruisers.  Obviously it heals a different amount depending on what your total hp is (buffs, different gear, etc), but it does roughly 40% on bruiser.

[Jezekie]

Ignore Pain shows 24%, Hurt 34%, and Agony 36% all adept 1 unbuffed at lvl 50. They all heal slightly less the listed though. <div></div>

[Tauch]

<span><blockquote><hr>Grabaan wrote:<div></div> I use the special training Lu Sun's because it not only heals for 27% but wipes some poision and disease out too.<hr></blockquote> Watch out with that one, you may wipe a raid or two, instead. =) That ability is bugged and currently only removes beneficial spells.</span><div></div>

[bonesbro]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Taucher wrote:<BR><SPAN><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Grabaan wrote:<BR> <BR>I use the special training Lu Sun's because it not only heals for 27% but wipes some poision and disease out too. <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Watch out with that one, you may wipe a raid or two, instead. =)<BR><BR>That ability is bugged and currently only removes beneficial spells.<BR></SPAN> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>I assume you've already /bug'd that in game, but please add it to the bug thread in this forum as well.  Thanks.</DIV>

[Grabaan]

Hmm, never witnessed it remove a beneficial effect, but I'll keep that in mind. Thanks for the heads up. <div></div>

[IrulanDunedanc]

<DIV>I've seen it erase a Defiler ward when I was duo'ing.  Can't remember which one though.</DIV>

[stfields]

I rarely mend someone other than myself.  For the most part, I hit my manastone and then compress.  I'm glad we have a heal... but knowing that my bruiser brethren have a 90s heal that heals for almost as much as mine is rather disheartening.  <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Did anyone else notice that in that recent patch you can now Mend/Compress/Heal on the run?  No more interrupts.</DIV><p>Message Edited by stfields on <span class=date_text>04-15-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:10 PM</span>

[bonesbro]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> stfields wrote:<BR> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Did anyone else notice that in that recent patch you can now Mend/Compress/Heal on the run?  No more interrupts.</DIV> <P>Message Edited by stfields on <SPAN class=date_text>04-15-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>12:10 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Really??? Awesome!  I will try that out tonight!

[Kylins]

I took the level 40 bruiser training that dropped Ignore Hurt duration down to 60 seconds.  Surely takes the sting off of some of those 1500 dmg combat arts that seem to always hit no matter what defensive buffs you have running lol

[Azazel-Defia]

<DIV>The difference in usefulness of these two abilities is huge. It would be a good idea to start a /feedback campaign to get the mend ability timer reduced. Currently mend is weaker than ignore pain and has over 3x the recast time. The only advantage to it is the ability to cast it on another player. The pros dont seem to be balancing the cons in this situation.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Possible easy fix ideas.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>1. Bring mends recast down to the 90s of ignore pain and leave the difference in effectiveness the same.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2. Reduce mends recast to a 120s recast and make it equally as effective.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>3. Reduce mends recast to 90s, leave the effectiveness difference, make mend only able to heal allies for half its normal effect. (If the ability to heal allies is seen as unbalancing)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>4. make the two identical in either direction....(hrrm not great, but equity level is high on this one.)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>5. Reduce recast, leave effectiveness, make mend always heal the monk for the listed amount regardless of target, heal target for a fraction. (This might be too much, but healing the target for a fraction of the effectiveness that is similar to the difference between the two skills might be balanced. And removing the need to target yourself for a heal might become a really good thing once pvp starts up.)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I understand some monks use this skill in raids, so do I. I am 50 and kill raid mobs daily. The only time I use it anymore is emergency spot heals. However, the long recast makes it unreliable in that role, and the same recast makes the usefulness very limited when I am MA or soloing.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Another factor to remember is that pvp has been anounced, when it arrives the disparity between these two abilities will be huge. It will likely cause a change in some fashion, and remembering that the kneejerk response is to nerf the useful ability........ well best to start work on getting something positive done now.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>summary: /feedback campaign to make changes to mend line. any change you feel is appropriate just throw it in.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Azazel</DIV> <DIV>Nek</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[HL12]

Im grateful we have mend but man I saw two bruisers both lvl 35 duo'ing Temp Clay Golems lvl 34 Heroic named mob in Ruines of Varsoon lastnight.  I gotta say I was impressed.  The temp golem can do some good dmg.  They would basically have one pull and he would tank till he was low, soon as he got low the other bruiser would taunt and pull agro. First bruiser use his IP while the second bruiser would tank the dmg.  They would just ping pong the temp back and forth in between IPs. They wiped 1 once or 2 twice but Im sure camping that spawn they came out on the up side of xp.

[SageMarrow]

realistically, i wont be surprised if they sneak in a Rez for monks somewhere down the line

[psubull]

<DIV>Personally, I feel this thread isn't worth the effort it took me to load it then read it.  It's just like going to the warlock forums and saying "Give us a spell that is equally powerful as ice comet because our counterpart has one."  The casting timers and percent healed are great just how they are.  I guarantee you that there are very few times where you should have to use it (with a decent group), but when you do, it will be just enough, which is what SOE had in mind.  This also holds true to the ignore pain line -- it's just enough to save ourselves on a raid or in a normal encounter most of the time.  You'd be amazed at how much damage you take when grabbing aggro while using brawl, :</DIV>

[Kylins]

<DIV>When the changes on test go live, we are all going to be taking more damage, or so it sounds. I think the Mend/Ignore Pain lines are going to become vital to successfully tanking in any situation. IF that is the case, Mend will definately need reworked to a faster reuse timer.  It seems to me that the concept of Mending wounds would not yield instant results, It would be healing over time, and would be a larger heal change than simpling ignoring the damage delt.. instead of 1200 direct hps, maybe 6 ticks for 500 hps on a 90sec timer.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As is, at level 44 tanking spinechillers in CT with only a cleric healer, I have to use my training heal(bruiser) twice a fight for 1300hps, only once a fight with high dps..  Many times I would die almost immediately if didn't use it, cause they would get a panicked attack, crushing blow, barrage, etc before I could turn around and get them in position and knock off 3/4s of my hps before the cleric could react.</DIV>