I thought it would have gotten better by the 20s..

[woo]

<DIV>So.. does it ever? --</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG>group#1</STRONG></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>they invited me.. mages, healer, scout.. all 20-25, i was 21 monk</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>then they get into a fight "why did you invite another scout we need a tank"</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>then they kicked me out of group</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG>group#2</STRONG></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>i was leader, 20-25 2 healers, a ranger, and a wizard, and me</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>im 21 again, i said "im trying to find another dps role then we can roll"</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>BOTH HEALERS say "we need a tank not another dps..  im leaving"</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>one left.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>i finally get this group going, then we get to centaurs.. going good i never lost aggro once etc, when the ranger says "look i have more HP than you" (24 ranger.. im a 21 monk) the other healer insists he tanks, so i say fine ill let the ranger tank.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>the ranger tanks, 5 seconds later he dies, aggro gets on wizard and he dies, healer is in yellow and i say "see this is what happens.." and i taunt off, and me n healer finish off the centaur.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>rest of the group says "good thing anex (me.. the monk) wasnt tanking, all of us would have died"</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>i left that group on my own.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG>group#3</STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV>im invited in, im 22 now.. nice group of 20 guardian, 2 wizards, an assassin, and a fury.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>the guardian has less mitigation and less avoidance than me, AND less HP but they insist he tanks.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>turns out he was bad, he lost aggro every 5 seconds to the wizard and even me sometimes (w/o taunting..)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>they let me tank, then the guardian left the group and the healer followed him because he was "a real tank"</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG>group#4</STRONG></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>full group goin well, 45 mins of no one dying, i never lost aggro..</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>then a paladin same level as me is circling us LFG, they /yell and kick me out of the group.. i die cuz i had aggro, and they invite the paladin.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>now im lovin monk but PLEASE tell me the stupidity goes down at some point in time..?</DIV> <DIV>i dont expect to always be MT, and im not.. but the stupidity just baffles me.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>edit: typo</DIV><p>Message Edited by woode on <span class=date_text>03-26-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:42 PM</span>

[Wiou]

You probly just smell bad. <span>:smileytongue:</span> <div></div>

[Mystiq]

<P>Now those were a sad bunch of groups if you ask me. I don't think I've ever had such a string of bad luck, but I've had my share of people ignorant of what a Monk can do.</P> <P>Keep your chin up, and remind people that before level 30 or so, just about every subclass performs very much the same as every other one in their archetype. It is a good idea to form the groups yourself, and if they start argueing and whining over your group decisions, kick them and don't think twice about it.</P> <P>Regards,</P>

[dirtylo]

<DIV>From my experiance this will not change until you make it change. My monk was often recruited for DPS roles which I was fine filling. After awhile I would offer my services as a tank when our MT would afk or LD.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>In the end don't care what the scouts or wizzy's think and just earn the respect of the healers. The monk is looked by most to be pure DPS, but healers will learn that you can tank as well. In the end seeing my monk grow into a tank was a rewarding experiance because it was earned, not assumed.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>That's just me though ;p</DIV>

[SageMarrow]

<P>LOL. That makes good sense and increases your knowledge of the point that i consistently stress in other boards about the reality that is presented in game to players that people often believe that i **Assume** to be true.</P> <P>For the most part, i know what im talking about - and i dont care to fight that stigma that we are not tanks for 8 months only to have a developer, ( aka Mother goose&nbsp<img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> come say that i can tank, which still wouldnt matter because 2/3rds of players dont read these boards. </P> <P>Whats the point in fighting for a sense of absolution that you will never get? And even when you do get it, it will be short lived due to all the other players that chose to play another class that suited more of thier style, be it tank or dps... People allow me tank all the time. But yet and still, it feels moreso of an ALLOWANCE than a right. Personally, I have tanked some of the biggest baddest and hardest mobs at level 37 so far, but fact still remians, that if a Berserker walks up or a Guardian joins the group... Im taking that good ole backseat and punching crap for the night...</P> <P>So hey...</P> <DIV>(edit: or maybe they can make it the MOTO of the day: PLEASE ALLOW YOUR FRIENDLY NEIGHBORHOOD BRAWLER TYPES TO TANK, THANKS!!!!)    you know those little online messages that pop up when you log on?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>then we will really be the laughing stocks of eq2...lol - man that stinks like poo</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>(edited for annaspiders viewing pleasure, thanks!!)</DIV> <P>Message Edited by SageMarrow on <SPAN class=date_text>03-26-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>02:22 PM</SPAN></P> <P>Message Edited by SageMarrow on <SPAN class=date_text>03-26-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>02:23 PM</SPAN></P> <P>Message Edited by SageMarrow on <SPAN class=date_text>03-26-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>03:00 PM</SPAN></P><p>Message Edited by SageMarrow on <span class=date_text>03-26-2005</span> <span class=time_text>03:02 PM</span>

[Owa]

Sage, how on earth can you edit a post twice and still be so incoherent? <DIV>I think I sometimes agree with what you say...but I'm never sure.</DIV>

[SageMarrow]

darn, i guess i will go edit it again and make it readable. sorry anna... <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>is that better anna?</DIV><p>Message Edited by SageMarrow on <span class=date_text>03-26-2005</span> <span class=time_text>03:00 PM</span>

[MarekDrag]

I guess some of it has to do with reputation, as well.  In my guild (VERY small guild) I have been chosen to tank over berserkers, and once even over a guardian.  In another group, guardian couldn't keep aggro, and I took over main tank.  I think a monk makes a fine tank, and there are plenty of other people out there who know just what a monk can do in a fight when played well.  The best thing that you can do is find a core of people to play with, and build yourself a reputation.

[buggz620]

Hehe them groups just plain sucked for kicken ya. They would just go on the (kiss my  a) list. But I really never had a problem getting groups.  When I was lfg I didnt say tank lfg or dps lfg I just said monk lfg. When I got picked up for a group I just assumed I was picked for dps but was always ready to step up to the plate if need be. If your in a group and mt leaves just say Hey lets try a few and if it go's bad will get another . When this happens you better give it all you  got and impress em cause if you screw up here you can kiss your chances of ever MTing for anyone in that group good bye. Does it get better at higher lvls? Sure it did for me as I got higher I tanked more. But to be honest i think it was more because people knew me as a good player and easy to get along with.  (Rather then someone who is arrogant and out to prove that this class could tank. <-----Not saying this is you. )

[Colin MacLaren]

Look for a guild.Or: Solo up to level 25 and then look for a guild.Until about Level 35, stupidy won't go down for pickup groups. At Level 35 half of the player base starts to understand the most basics of the game mechanics and the the role of their chosen class. You'll still have lots of players who are absolutely clueless about everything, like the level 35 Ranger, geared with a full suit of AQ armor and a neat Tier3 vendor bought bow sh he never used once in the three hours I had the pleasure of grouping with her. Or the Maintank constantly loosing aggro, but claiming he has tried so hard to get his Taunts besster than App2, but never found them on the brokers, so there is no way tp upgrade his styles beyond app2 as a fighter. Everytime I join a group, a level 30+ asks me: What is a Dirge? *explain what a Dirge does* "So you can't heal?"At about level 25 leveling starts to slow down and the best XP spots are found in the Ruins of Varsoon. With a bad group, you'll wipe at the first add or named or caster mob or whatever, even with two healers. On the other hand, we managed to survive against light yellow double arrows with a Paladin being the only healer in the group in a guild group.So, from the point of view of a Level 50 Templar and Level 36 Dirge sharing his experience, believe me, it is really THAT bad in pickup groups. So join a good guild, have lots of fun being the main tank in a good groop and maybe even looking forward to tank some raid encounters.<p>Message Edited by Colin MacLaren on <span class=date_text>03-27-2005</span> <span class=time_text>02:15 AM</span>

[SGTChan]

<P>With the exception of the 'monk nerf time frame' I have NEVER had a problem being a tank.  i usually group with friends, and they know first hand that a monk is a great tank (if played well).  I ALWAYS put my aggro redux on a wizard and the main healer.  I ALWAYS pull with a taunt or taunt the mobs en route to the group.  Then I Group Buff and AE Taunt and aggro is never  a problem.  -IF- a monk gets hit, yes we need a little extra healing, but as long as you have aggro control the healers can heal away and there is never a problem.  </P> <P>What I have seen a LOT of is the Cleric (healer)  who is used nuking away for some reason, then has little mana for heals, and then complains that the Monk needs to be healed.  </P> <P>I really find it funny when I'm in a group with a Gaurdian who is my level or lower and the rest of the group insists that he is the tank... I sit back and watch him fall on his face. Then I say somthing witty like "this is how its done" give my aggro redux buffs, etc. and not a problem afterwards.</P> <P>Long story short... Monks can be Great tanks  IF you know how to play your monk well.  Its the monks that have no clue whats going on in life that mess it up for the rest of us !</P> <P>Chandalen</P> <P>42 Monk</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[Wiou]

Yeah, with all seriousness, in the teens and low 20's , the majority of your population is just learning their class, and some people are just dumb. Best thing to do is from the group yourself and take charge and control the group the best you can -- If you want it done right do it yourself, right? If you're not enjoying yourself, just leave your group and go solo or find a different group. <div></div>

[Bur]

I also found the 20s to be annoying as EVERYONE was convinced I couldn't tank.  I took it for what it was worth, met a few healers that were willing to let me try tanking, and found myself tanking more and more as people realized I could actually do it.  At 42 (now) I don't MT groups in general.  I really don't want to MT groups in general (i'm a lazy bum and a DPS role requires 1/10th the attention). People are alot more willing to listen as you get higher, though.  When the tank goes LD or a mob agros without one and everyone shouts "RUN!"  I tell them to stop and I tank the mob, 99.99 out of 100 times we win.  <div></div>