In Pursuit of Data, A Naked Berserker's Wacky Adventure

[Dimgl]

<font color="#00cc99">Hey everyone,I've been slowly but surely testing and building new information from the new combat system so that I can update my FAQ, and perhaps even write one or two more. One for EoF Achievements, and one for combat in general, since we get the same questions every week or so (IE, should I DW or 2h?) It's been an odd adventure, and I hope that the bugs and problems I am finding don't discourage me so much that I give up on the meanings of the mechanics. Regardless...In my quest for data I've done some rather interesting things (epic x4 boss mobs in labs hitting me only -5- times over 2 minutes), and some rather stupid things (upcoming), however tonight took the cake, and I had two amazing things occur.First, I tanked half of Nizara naked tonight, and still had over 55% mit while fighting.Second, I managed to get to a permanent -25% mitigation wearing a full set of platemail.I've written a post in the Combat Discussion outlining what happened specifically, if you're terribly curious.But consider this post a welcome invitation for all those berserkers who want to tank barechested, and wearing only a loincloth. It can be done!Also, if you guys run into any interesting bugs, or mechanic glitches please let me know about them. I'm reporting them as best I can to the devs as well, but I honestly don't know if I'm getting through, the best I can do is try to understand it all and get a good general combat FAQ out there.</font><div></div>

[Triste-Lune]

i ll check this tonight might have a good laugth if your post in combat discusion proves to be right. At least the part with the freacking diminishing returns being broken is absolutely true. i m only getting like 0.4% mit from using mayhem and like 0.5% from wall of...Now the only important thing is to have enought HP to survive the beating until healer get you in the green again, rince and repeat for the next salve of blow...I achieved about 8.5k mitigation only to get hit by 3.1k instead of 3.2k.<p>Message Edited by Triste-Lune on <span class=date_text>11-29-2006</span> <span class=time_text>02:12 AM</span>

[Chaostik]

<div></div>Dimglow dude ... you rock!<span>  :smileyvery-happy:I'm really looking forward to any further insights you discover ... we really need this fixed and if the devs have any inclination to listen to any Berserkers, they should be listening to you.  Your track record on these zerker forums is outstanding.Thanks again!</span><div></div>

[Taeolen]

Cool, thanks.  This is a test I was wanting to run myself; comparing tanking with and without any armor.

[Johaan]

<DIV>Dimglow, your post in the Combat Discussion forum is one of the better ones I've seen.  Great info and the presentation was easy to understand.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Let's hope the devs want to change it.  I wonder if they even can at this point?  My imagination runs wild when I think of the unintended consequences of a straight up fix...</DIV>

[thisthingsucks]

<div></div>ok if i understand this correctly (and i may not since i have been at my mind numbing job all day) zerkers have higher mit naked? if so is this becuse our armor has the deminished returns? and im guessing you need the right group to get your mit back up? please inlighten me.<div></div>

[Kannab]

<DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It wasnt up until today that i realized that mit is sooooooo broken it HAS to be fixed.  I went with a group of guildies to do some of the city guild raids , to get some status for our guild.  In one of the later instances I started out tanking and at pull with full fabled, group buffs, temp mit buff, and potion i can boost mit close to 9k at least for 30 secs while debuffs land on the mob.   This meant nothing to the mobs and i was gettin beaten to a pulp.  so i insisted to my group that we tried again.  and yet again i got whoped.  i was bewildered.  Fortuantly there was a monk in our group and someone suggested we try avoindace tank. Sure enough the monk was able to not get hit nearly as hard or as often and stay in the green most of the time.  I was very dissapointed and felt comepletly useless to the group.  so from then on i let the monk do its thing and we cleared the zone.  They told me about your post on the combat forums and i went to chek it out cause i was trying to get an explanation of [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] is goign on.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So are the monks and brawlers now the #1 tanks? It seems so to me. at least in this experice and according to OP accounts.  Im gonna get me some cloth armor as well to chek out what happens, more out of curiosity than anything.  but this is complete BS. and if they are planning to leave it like this, (which i dont think they are) at least trhow in a free AA respect or sumtin cause the 8 points i spent on +mit are compeltely useless now.   </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I hope the morons that messed up the whole combat system get fired or perhaps not. maybe they are the only ones that can get it fixed. then kick them!</DIV>

[Thor Of Hal]

<P>Just remeber guys, before EoF mitigation was overpowered.   Sorry i dont have the link to the post, but its somewhere kicking around, its even on eq2 gamers news bullitens pre eof.  Basically, before EoF we almost got an exponential bonus to survivability the higher our miti was. SoE have tackled this problem, which is why it appears so broken, it is actually in thier eyes balanced now.   </P> <P>The problem might lay in making lower level mobs do more damage and even gray mobs, so in order to incorperate a balance higher level mobs i.e. blue con + have been designed with more of a whack.  This has hidden the fact they have still been scaled back in accordance to our armouring 'nerf' or more accuratley Fix.  Ill have to read dimglows post about tanking niz naked... it sounds interesting!</P> <P> </P> <P>Vlad</P>

[Jvaloth]

<DIV>How is having the highest mit possible pre-EoF  broken?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>To me that was  progression.   It was  hard work to get all fabled.    I noticed the difference for my efforts.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Now...   </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>You have a xegonite tank with 3800 mit self buffed.   You have a fully fabled out MT of a raid guild with 5600 mit self buffed.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>With the mit cap so low the  xegonite tank and the fully fabled MT of a raid guild tank approximately the same.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>That doesnt make any sense!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV><p>Message Edited by Jvaloth on <span class=date_text>11-30-2006</span> <span class=time_text>10:20 AM</span>

[Trynnus1]

Agreed - this is borked. I can not see any solution to this other than going back to old system. [Removed for Content] that will create havoc

[FightGame]

<P>Mitigation isn't the only thing broke.  We raided Freethinkers last weekend.  I don't know excatly what my slashing skill was at (I'm guessing about 380 or so), but I do have the +8 on my relic, and +6 on the HoF ear ring.  I don't have final ability in wisdom line to remove defensive penalties, but I did have a pally in my group with battle leadership.  Also a dirge and 3 healers...don't think they provide any skill buff (none were warden) but maybe they do somehow...</P> <P>My direct melee was resisted 62%.  My combat arts averaged 45% resist.  For comparison, I have data with the same group make up, both before and after combat revamp in DT, Lyceum, Labs, and HoS.  For all of the KoS zones, both before and after combat revamp, were about the same...22% or so.  In DT, my resists were actually down to 15% in one parse.</P> <P> </P> <P>So I was thinking maybe Freethinkers are more resistant to slashing.  Nope, cause all of our melee'ers using various weapon types were highly resisted.  And everyone else is in an offensive stance.  Our melee DPS group also had another pally who also has battle leadership for added skill buff.</P> <P> </P> <P>So I need to do more testing in other EoF zones...hopefully it's only this zone that's like this...because I can't see how they expect us to hold aggro when we are reisisted 62%+....that's crazy.</P>

[Thor Of Hal]

<DIV>Mitigation effectively has been replaced by HP it would seem on the order of importance.  I have argued that mitigation is still top, but it sounds like that SoE intend for us to never get the same kind of miti as the old days...  So instead, i guess its make sure ur HP is higher and ur mitigation is resonable well buffed.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>From personal parses i see, consistantly, mobs in EoF do considerable amounts of melee as the damage done... so logically mitigation is important in mitigated that damage.  But considering what ya found dim and what SoE stance is, i think as i have said HP might be the only way. /shrug</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Apeya]

Just for some fun, we let a wizard in the main tank group in a Labs raid in place of a plate tank. To our surprise (perhaps not), the wizard actually tanked all the trash all the way to the first named. He was holding aggro quite well by using high dmg nukes right off the bat, too. So, maybe mages are the new tanks! <div></div>

[Thor Of Hal]

<P>thats a joke</P> <P>i do hoped u wiped alot</P> <P> </P> <P> </P>