How do i maximize my hate for t7 raids

[dragit]

I need some advice , Last night while on a lab  trash raid , I was haven trouble keeping agro being the mt  , that is a prob . All my spells are adept 3, I was useing all of my taunts . which buffs you guys think generate the most hate for us , which attacks do you all think give us the most hate . Now remeber All of my taunts , are adept3 all my attacks and buffs are adept 3 , so Im more interested in a discusion about the best way to hold agro on the mobs . not about how to pull or such . I know how to do that . IM just tired of my mobs bouncing around and me chasing the suckers , while running out of power .  any advice wold be appreciated.<div></div>

[WolfSha]

<P>Ok, assuming you know what you're doing, it's most likely your raid setup.</P> <P>Get an assassin or swashie in your group and have them put hate transfer on you.</P> <P>And / or get a coercer / dirge in your group with hate gain on you or their DPS mod on you - you can hit 100% dps with corercer and dirge which really helps on agro.</P> <P>Get a troub grouped with your casters to lower their hate.</P> <P>Also, corercer and / or dirge in your MT group will give you lots of mana regen.</P> <P>All that is in an ideal world (ie in a raid guild), but there are also some things you can do with an imperfect raid setup.</P> <P>If you have a guard or paladin (or both) in there not doing much tanking, get them in group with the problematic caster(s) and get them to put moderate / amends respectively on the casters.  They can only do one each, but it can help.</P> <P>The guard one (moderate) is plain hate lowering so that's fine, but the paly one (amends) is hate transfer so either make sure your paly is kitted out to tank when he gets ago, or is about 5-10 levels lower than the mobs so he has very little hate of his own cause he can't hit it :smileytongue: </P> <P>If your raid isn't full then grabbing a lvl 55 paly can be quite handy for this and they'll be falling over themselves to come get AA from labs at that level (just make sure they know to play cleric and stand at max range or they'll be dead, naked and grumpy in no time!)</P> <P>Also, <EM>when</EM> are you loosing agro? in the first 10 seconds or mid fight?  if its in the first 10 seconds then shout at your casters and tell them you want 0 dps till you ask for it and build up some hate first.  make a macro saying "ok, dps now" or something.</P> <P>One last thing.  A lot of the mobs in labs are REALLY resistent to taunts at times.  You'll see a lot of resists coming off the mobs and your spell times will be much shorter.  I've had 4 or 5 master taunts resisted in a row the odd time.  If you see this call it out on ventrilo / teamspeak so that people know you're getting resisted and can back off the dps.  If you're not using voice then make a macro that says *** taunts resisted, watch your dps for a bit *** or something.</P> <P>Hope that helps</P><p>Message Edited by WolfShark on <span class=date_text>10-13-2006</span> <span class=time_text>05:10 AM</span>

[arieste]

<DIV>Im not a pro raid tank, but I am a 70 zerker, so here is random advice:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>in Labs, I don't think there are many or any fights that require a max-burn from you DPS.  I think your best bet is to get them to calm down a bit.  Sometimes it's not you, it's them.  The setup suggestions from the prev. post are all excellent.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What else you can do?  Maximize your DPS. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>each of these will increase your DPS and progressively decrease your defence, so if you aren't fully geared or have poor/few healers, you might not want to try 2&3</DIV> <DIV>1.  tank with buckler</DIV> <DIV>2.  tank in offensive</DIV> <DIV>3.  tank with juggernaut</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I also find that most "peels" are not on the main mob, but on the "adds".  A good idea might be to cast your 3 AEs right after your taunts.  "Rambo" also works.  (Rambo = Destruction + Open Wounds)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>TBH, I think the prev. poster nailed it in that your need to slap your DPS people a bit and get them to watch aggro.</DIV>

[Triste-Lune]

wolf summed up pretty much all what could be done to hold aggro.I tend to use rampage during 1 fight then the next open wounds and the third i gibe the encounter that way i have always one of my aggro tool up.Also when you fight start by using your low recast timer CA, then the longerones, by the time you will have use the long one the short recast will have refresh wich can help a little. though it s up to your play style to spam CA or use mostely melee auto attack.Dont forget also mayhem it s not generating as much hate as pre LU13 but it s still a group buff that the mob register as an aggression and increase your hate.hope my little inputs helps.<p>Message Edited by Triste-Lune on <span class=date_text>10-13-2006</span> <span class=time_text>06:00 AM</span>

[Thor Of Hal]

<P>So your agro sucks...</P> <P>Some general things about threat.</P> <P>- According to SoE.   1 damage = 1 Threat (though there is much discussion on this)</P> <P>-  It decomposes over time, so if you dont keep it up you will loose agro faster</P> <P>As a zerker imo there are several things you need to look at:</P> <P>1. Your AA setup,</P> <P> Since us Zerkers are reliant on dps more then outright taunts then guardians.  Make sure that you have your buckler 76% double attack.  Put 8 AA points into armour and 8 into your dps wis line.  Since blackguard admits for the time being that mitigation is way overpowered make use of it while u still can.</P> <P>2. Your group setup.   </P> <P>You MUST have a dirge in your group... its silly not to. Among many other big benefits they have Cacophony of Blades will proc on every hit you do... combine this with Rambo and you will see your dps reach 2k levels + MASSIVE aoe taunting.  Get a coercer in your group... they provide massive hate GAIN which is FAR more useful then hate TRANSFER.  Because the swashie/assasin must attack your target at all times, and if they over dps on another target and u have weak agro they will steal it.  However, they are still very useful.</P> <P>3.  Your Taunt Stratergies + MA system</P> <P> An MA job is essential, they are to focus the full fury of the raid on the target u have the most hate on.  i.e. they target through you with /assist, and call the MRF onto ur target... u keep taunting it... once ur satisfied, you can tab targets and then secure hate on another then the MA will do the same thing etc etc. (plantboy MA ftw!).   Your CA with Threat increase should NEVER be usable for more then one second.   Your not taunting properly when you see one of ur taunts go usable and stay that way for for a mili second.  I tend to save IG for catching multi adds + Rescue for an emergancy. Or on a named (time it right if they have memwipe).  oh and ur MA should never make the call to the MRF until all the mobs are infront of u.</P> <P>Oh and NO-ONE should dps until your MA has made the call (except for debuffers like brigands etc)</P> <P>4. Your equipment</P> <P> This is not overly essential, it will jus add to your ability to tank.  Obviously you should (after threat) make sure firstly Mitigation is buffed --> hp --> avoidance ---> spell resists (can swap with avoidance depending on mob). Make sure u you use the most balanced dps weapon you can find with regards to the Weapon Damage Triangle, i have posted bout that previously.  Your 1h + 76% double attack does ALOT for your hate, dont under estimate it.</P> <P>5. Macro Coordination <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>  Tell your group what your doing, dont go overboard.  But have a macro for Rambo, so your dirge knows when to cast Caco of Blades (beware that if its done early other classes rapid hits may actually pull agro briefly)</P> <P>Other:</P> <P>With a good group, you should be able to tank an easy zone such as Labs in offensive... but remeber alot of mobs have miti debuffs!  And if you use juggernaut be VERY careful.  I would only suggest using it, if you have a brilliant group setup (defiler, templar etc) and they have plenty of warning.  You will raidwipe on trash if u use it at not jus the right time... and u will then [Removed for Content] off all of ya raid and cost em money and delay the progress in the zone... for a small inc in dps.. So only use it if ur mrf is bored lol.</P> <P> and lastly.   Your dpsers in your raid should kno not to do stupid dps numbers immdiately after pull,  They each should kno when to unleas their dps.</P> <P>DONT TELL A RAID TO REDUCE THEIR DPS!!!</P> <P>With the correct group setup, you wont need to despite the quality of your CAs and armour.  I can hold agro on groups when several members do more then 1.8k damage.  Simply because, They kno NOT to nuke a mob if i have to for some reason run away from it to grab an add AND They kno not to dps jus after i have body pulled and am waiting for ALL mobs to run to me (an MA will eliminate this problem)... Remeber, when you are no longer hitting a target or taunting it... e.g. while your chasing down an add because some noob who got agro hasnt ran to MT, you threat hold on that first target will deteriorate rapidly and you will lose agro (this is where hate transfer comes in handy)</P> <P>So basically, there are alot of things that you can do to make sure u maximise ur agro hold... but equally there are alot of the things the MRF should do.  And if, as with me, you get a good team going... the mages should be able to nuke a few seconds after pulling and you wont loose agro....</P> <P>Vladnor The Berserk</P> <P>70 Berserker</P> <P>Unity</P> <P>Splitpaw </P> <P> </P> <P>Message Edited by Thor Of Halla on <SPAN class=date_text>10-13-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>07:01 AM</SPAN></P><p>Message Edited by Thor Of Halla on <span class=date_text>10-13-2006</span> <span class=time_text>07:10 AM</span>

[arieste]

<DIV>btw, I didn't mean to say the raid should reduce DPS, I meant to say the raid may need to watch aggro.  Which means watching "stupid" DPS, such nuking a mob before it even gets to the tank, etc.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>That last post is on teh money <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[dragit]

yea , I figured , that what i really needed was a good hate transfer and or have an Ma setup . I wasnt doing too bad  , I normaly lost ago  with in the first couple of seconds , at which time i had a hard time getting the hate back . or if the fight went into overtime , I'd lose it . I never let my tuants sit idle . and i was always using rampage and open wounds , and useing mayhem  during every fight . last night we just didnt have anyone on the raid that had a hate transfer , no pallies , swashies , or driges , or assasins , just the worst in agro management , ( monk , warlock , necro, conjuror , shadowknight ) I take my job pretty serious , and figured it was nothing i could really do but wanted to ask anyway . , I just wish they would give a modifier to hate with the defensive stance , it would make it so much easier .<div></div>