Stamina or Agil?

[Larsenex]

<DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" size=4>I read a post a few days back about how most zerks are pumping Stam to increase hps. I have always went Str and Agil. I am about to ding to 62 and have a full suit of mastercrafted waiting plus some jewelry to add. I went and got a stam ring and a str ring. Ill post my stats as soon as I ding. By the way, is there a way to post screenshots of my personal stats? I have a before I dinged and was going to do an 'after'. Do I need to edit the size of my picture and if so how?</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" size=4>Thanks for your patience...</FONT></DIV>

[zormik]

<DIV>mit > resists > hp >sta > agi > wis > str (you will cap out str anyway)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also a big factor is finding jewellery with +def and +parry on (+def and +parry does way more for your avoidance then agility).  +defense is very easily to find.  The best jewellery as a tank that you can find is mostly in the claymore line. (the earrings and the belt are the best ingame imo)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And oh yes get 2 of those light chiting rings while you're at i (farm the den until you have two)...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I don't use anything crafted  tbh.  I just farmed the instances, did the claymore and i got to a lvl i could MT raids like that.  After that you can start getting equiped in fabled gear ...</DIV>

[Triste-Lune]

well the + def items i already got ride of all of them and it was a very long time ago already, the only i still have is the dragonscale sash just because of the mit on it. bracer shoulderpad have been replace immediatly as a wrist and and fabled shoulder dropped. so i wouldnt use the +def as an argument to throw away the AGI line. the cyclone can be cool and the final of the line saved some raids.The mit > everything argument holds the absolut truth.the funny thing is that i have less avoidance now that i m almost fully fabled than when i was in legendary <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> but well i also have like 800 ~ 1K mit more

[Zerv]

Remember if you are in a group always have another tank class put their avoidance buff on you -You loose the agility from your buff, but you gain much more because the other tank can intercept a certain percentage of hits from youMit > hp > stam  everything else is fluff - depending on how you are at wis can be quite benefitial for resists also - you will cap str/defense so easy you will never need to try for these<div></div>

[FightGame]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Triste-Lune wrote:<BR>so i wouldnt use the +def as an argument to throw away the AGI line. <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR> </P> <P>Nobody said anything about the agility AA line.  The person basically just said that +1 defense (or +1 parry for that matter) is greater than +1 agility....which is always true.</P> <P>For me, I've found that +1 defense = about 6.6 agility and +1 parry = about 7.2 agility</P>

[Benaire]

Call me crazy but i thought Agl also helps your ability to hit. I too am working on both STR and AGL to max out my offensive power. Has it ever been proven that agl helps hit rate or was i just dreaming it all up.

[tvies]

<P align=left>Stamina or Agil?  I look at that question this way:</P> <P align=left><FONT size=2>I recently ran a little test just to see which was better.  I trade out two weapons at LVL44, one with +13 AGI and one with +16 STA.  Adding 1 STA adds an additional 4 to 5 HP.  Adding 1 AGI adds an additional .1% avoidance (plus an attack rate bonus I think).  In a pretend situation I have a choice between 10 AGI or 10 STA.  If I go with AGI I have an extra 1% chance of an attack missing me.  So if I have 1000HP and a MOB hits me for 100HP 100 times, one of those hits miss and I have 100HP left.  If I take the STA I have an additional 50HP and the MOB hits me for 1000, so I have 50HP left.</FONT></P> <P align=left><STRONG>1 AGI ~ .1% AVO ~ 2 STA ~ 10HP</STRONG></P> <P align=left><FONT size=2>Take those calculations and apply them to a real character that might have an additional 90 AGI.  If you trade that AGI for STA you would lose 9% avoidance.  Now you're taking 900HP more damage for an additional 450HP to your maximum.  The tricky part here is that HP is a number and not a percentage.  Since I don't have an equation for luck you might more comfortable going with STA.  Being that I am a Berserker, I would rather take my chances!</FONT>  </P> <P align=left><FONT color=#999999 size=1>NOTE: Make sure to watch the +HP attributes as well.  I find that an item that gives an additional STA point will also give some extra HP.  Just remember the equation above, if an item grants an additional STA and 10HP, it is worth trading an item that only gives an additional point of AGI.  Also these numbers drastically change with level, these are calculated with a LVL44.</FONT></P> <P>Message Edited by tvieson on <SPAN class=date_text>09-05-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>10:05 PM</SPAN></P><p>Message Edited by tvieson on <span class=date_text>09-05-2006</span> <span class=time_text>10:41 PM</span>

[FightGame]

<P>agility does not help you hit.  your melee skills help your ability to hit with auto attack, and your melee skills + tier of combat art (apprentice, adept, master, etc) help your ability to hit with combat arts.</P> <P> </P> <P>I know that 1 agility does not give me any where near .1% avoidance.  More like .01%.   Obviously isn't the same for everyone and depends on several things.  If you mouse over your avoidance %, you will see how it breaks down.  You have Base Avoidance which is affected by racial traits (pretty sure), agility, and defense.  You have Parry which is affected by parry itself.  And you have block, which is affected by your shield protection number.  There's also deflect, but for a plate wearer, this is always zero.  Your overall avoidance is a number that is derived from the 3 of these things together (the exact equation is written somewhere in the forums).   Agility only affects your Base Avoidance, and in turn, your overall avoidance, and is the very smallest thing you can do to affect your overall avoidance.</P> <P>Trying to figure which is the better choice for everyone in every situation is impossible.  If you're in a group that buffs stamina and you're at cap, then any extra is total waste.  If you're in a group that buffs agility, and you're at cap, any extra is a total waste.  If you're fighting a mob about 5 levels higher than you, they get abilities that basically ignore your avoidance, and allows them to hit you like 99% of the time, so in this case, more stamina would be better....again, assuming you're not at stamina cap.  In most cases, stamina = health and would probably be better choice.  If you're not alive you can't avoid anything.</P>

[Fleaba]

<P>Ok, I just started lvling a zerker too.</P> <P>So, since def and str are so easily capped.....stamina and wisdom would be good lines to go up for tanking? (wisdom for def vs. casters)</P>

[Dimgl]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> tvieson wrote:<BR> <P align=left>Stamina or Agil?  I look at that question this way:</P> <P align=left><FONT size=2>I recently ran a little test just to see which was better.  I trade out two weapons at LVL44, one with +13 AGI and one with +16 STA.  Adding 1 STA adds an additional 4 to 5 HP.  Adding 1 AGI adds an additional .1% avoidance (plus an attack rate bonus I think).</FONT></P> <P align=left><STRONG>1 AGI ~ .1% AVO ~ 2 STA ~ 10HP</STRONG></P> <P align=left><FONT size=2>Take those calculations and apply them to a real character that might have an additional 90 AGI.  If you trade that AGI for STA you would lose 9% avoidance.  Now you're taking 900HP more damage for an additional 450HP to your maximum.</FONT><BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><FONT color=#00cc99>A lot of people are disagreeing on the effect of agility in this thread. That's because agility has a variable effect depending on your level. While you may gain 9% avoidance at level 44 from 90 AGI, at level 70 that same 90 is going to add between 3 and 4% avoidance. The amount of avoidance you gain from AGI is entirely dependent on your stat cap for any given level. Max AGI grants around 22-27% avoidance. On the flipside, STA has a constant return at all levels. A point of STA is worth ~4.5 hp. 10 STA at level 10 is worth the same as 10 STA at level 70.</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#00cc99>I also agree that to my testing agility has no effect on hit rate. Combat skills (Slashing/Piercing/Crushing) and the type of enemy you are fighting determine it entirely.</FONT><BR></P>

[tvies]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> tvieson wrote:<BR> <P align=left><FONT color=#999999 size=1>NOTE: Make sure to watch the +HP attributes as well.  I find that an item that gives an additional STA point will also give some extra HP.  Just remember the equation above, if an item grants an additional STA and 10HP, it is worth trading an item that only gives an additional point of AGI.  Also these numbers drastically change with level, these are calculated with a LVL44.</FONT><BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Not to quote myself, but...<BR><p>Message Edited by tvieson on <span class=date_text>09-06-2006</span> <span class=time_text>03:19 PM</span>

[Taschen77]

<blockquote><hr>vcjester wrote:<div></div> <p>Ok, I just started lvling a zerker too.</p> <p>So, since def and str are so easily capped.....stamina and wisdom would be good lines to go up for tanking? (wisdom for def vs. casters)</p><hr></blockquote>Stamina line for additional damage and Wisdom for additional damage and physical mitigation. 80% of the incomming damage you'll face as a tank is melee based, therefore mitigation > all. Resists can be buffed with the proper classes or by switching out gear, in addition to several classes being able to buff wisdom to the group or a single target. That other 20% of magical damage is really irrelvent if your healer is on the ball curing magical resist debuffs and damage over time effects. Only when you get into the endgame raid arena do resists move up in importance, where mobs can AOE for more damage than you have health if not properly resist buffed (again, a MT group will be able to buff resists really well, so you don't need to use the Wisdom line). <div></div>

[Larsenex]

<FONT face="Comic Sans MS" size=4>Actually I am going down the Wisdom line. I find that the straight increase in DPS and Mitigation is very very nice and I feel worth the effort to get there. AFTER I finish down this line I am going to head on down the stamina line for the dps increase.  I see LOTS of Zerkers on Antonia bayle wearing bucklers and thinking to myself hmmm. I am Main tank for my guild Nomads. We do some raiding where needed to complete quests or HQs but we mainly get together to have fun and do regular heroic mobs.  For that reason alone I will finish the wis line and remove my penalties to my stances. I like the Mitigation increase I have in defesive. I was happy at first with belly smash but with its nerf I am so so on it. At 63 I am looking for any good one hander to possibly compliment the stam line later on. Does anyone have any good suggestions?</FONT>