Opinions on "Strength over Stamina"

[KFizzle]

<DIV>I am just kinda curious, I'm a 60 (as of last night, huzzah for me) Zerker on Nektulos...and i've been wondering this myself. I've taken note of what other tank classes use, and what other Zerks are equipped with especially and I'm kinda wondering what thoughts are here on this topic. <BR><BR>As a Tank, I know mitigation is important, and I know having high hit points is important...but i would rather forsake stat buffs on things i know i don't need etc for pieces that will HELP me more. Since Strength gives us more mana, AND higher DPS and damage with our CA's I would rather keep that higher myself. For instance, I have 3 pieces of Cobalt gear and only 3, the Breastplate, legs and boots. Instead I have a Lion Emblazoned Barbute for a helmet, and some other pieces which give me higher Strength than other things.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I've figured out my total 'loss' on mitigation and it's in the range of 300 points (i don't remember offhand, but i just remembered to write this post so I wanted to do it while these things are fresh in my mind). My self buffed Strength is at 343, and I do a hell of a lot of damage and personally tank [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] well ... but am I 'wrong' in wondering why other Zerks don't do the same?</DIV> <DIV><BR>I see so many zerks in full cobalt, and while that helps mitigation those aprox 300 points (I believe its actually in the range of 280 something), but they sacrifice a HELL of a lot in Strength which would give them more mana for taunts and CA's, and more Damage which would drop the mobs faster. When i finally realized all this and decided to try out my theory its been fantastic, but even other tanks of other classes in my guild disagree with me and think i should go for more Stamina and Mitigation (even though I have no problems tanking everything thrown at me).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>True most of this will be moot now that i'm 60 and in a guild that does raid, so I will be adding fabled gear to my stuff (besides my shield), but tell me am I alone out there on this?</DIV>

[Switch9]

<P>Bassically i use full cobalt - helm that is the fabled one. I have all vanadium jewelery and a spiregaze necklace and pearl Ring of admiral marcus. Now i can self buff my str to around 340 with my duel wields and 320 with my 1hd shield. I believe this is the numbers...at school right now... I go with my str becuase our hate comes from our damage.... this is why we have more dps then gaurds and less taunts... Only problem is in raids mobs drain your power hella fast. Also i go with str becuase in a raid your healers... A Shaman, Fury and Cleric type will be able to raise your mitigation to around 7k or higher and your hp to 8k i believe. This is enough for most mobs that a zerk would tank. Any other a guardian who can get to 8k mit and 10k hp would tank. SO i go with str over Sta and its working good for me.</P> <P>-Ardant</P>

[infernus006]

<div></div><div></div><div></div>"I see so many zerks in full cobalt, and while that helps mitigation those aprox 300 points (I believe its actually in the range of 280 something), but they sacrifice a HELL of a lot in Strength..." not really.  i wear full cobalt and str is still my biggest stat by a long shot...over 320 str self-buffed compared to 235 agi and just over 200 sta.  i don't feel like i really need any more str on my own and i'm certainly not willing to sacrifice any of my mitigation for it by wearing some vendor loot just because it has more str on it.  <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  but hey, whatever works for you. but keep in mind that not only are you losing physical mitigation but also resists and since the cobalt helmet has wis on it too that's even more resists down the drain.  that's something else i'm not willing to sacrifice.<p>Message Edited by infernus006 on <span class=date_text>12-16-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:51 AM</span>

[KFizzle]

<DIV>Well i wouldnt call it "Vendor Trash" i mean personally I think if something has 15str 5sta and 301 mit, as opposed to 14 int and 14 wis with 376 mit, that the 75 mit less is 'worth it' (especially since its got more health and is far cheaper ontop of all that).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I mean i understand what you're saying but I just think the 'trade off' is more than worth it personally. I don't know how you guys are getting your strength that high without outside help. I don't have all vanadium jewelery "yet", i still need a second bracelet or whatever but i have another thing that gives me i think 6 str and 6 stamina, so it's not like i have nothing in that slot.</DIV>

[infernus006]

<div></div>"Well i wouldnt call it "Vendor Trash" lol sry i only called it that because i think i remember having actually sold a couple of those things to the vendor before. but like i said whatever works for you. and unlike many people i tend prefer cobalt over many of the t6 fabled items i have seen just because of the lack of resists on that stuff.  <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> some of the things i would consider "vendor loot" actually has better resists on it than t6 fabled stuff which i think is sad. like i said you gotta pay attention to your resists too because they are very important for tanking caster mobs and wis adds to your resists. so personally i don't think it's a good idea to trade a piece of armor that has more mitigation, more resists, and a bunch of wis on it for something that has less mitigation, less resists, and no wis on it just because it has more str. but then again that's just me. "I don't know how you guys are getting your strength that high without outside help." well jewerly helps a lot along with your weapons and/or sheild.  i have vanadium bracelets and rings and the tactician's hoop that has 12str on it and a t4 fabled necklace that has 13str on it plus an imbued ironwood longbow, cobalt weapons, and a t6 fabled kite shield.  and then don't forget about traits, i chose 2 str options from the normal traits and another str option from my racial traits on top of that.  oh yeah i have a t6 str hex doll too. <div></div><p>Message Edited by infernus006 on <span class=date_text>12-16-2005</span> <span class=time_text>11:42 AM</span>

[Renzai]

<P>IMO It's all relative to your playstyle. When you group are you having problems staying alive? In most cases if you have a good group then going all-out mit isn't that big of a factor since you want DPS increase so you don't have to worry too much about aggro. In the situation where you're the guild MT on raids I'd definitely go mit/hp before str.</P> <P>Group Buff + ring adds about 80 or so STR. I'd say around 200-250 unbuffed is sufficient in most cases, considering raid usually jacks you up above 400 anyways.</P>

[infernus006]

"Group Buff + ring adds about 80 or so STR." the ad3 of our t6 str buff gives 83 str and the ring gives 22 so thats 105 str.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div>

[R2Chie]

full cobalt apart from helmet which i switch between immovable barbute and the one that drops in poets palace dont forget that you say "only 300 mit", 300 mitigation is ALOT, chaos at master 1 i have adds 500 to my mitigation, you essentially having to use chaos just to catch up to me with no chaos, add in my other temporary buffs and i get self buff to 72% mitigation. Tanking 62++ mobs i like to have every bit of mitigation i can, and my str is near capped anyway using full vanadium jewellery except my necklace which i use the necklace of desert fury from cazel. Ive seen the lion emblazed barbute many many times in my camps in silent city and everytime ive sold it to a vendor thinking "useless". Use the t6 hex dolls, full vanadium and some fabled jewellery and str is NOT a problem ever, and i would never sacrifice mitigation for a tad extra strength no matter the reason. So no i would have to disagree with you But as said above, each to there own... personally cobalt clusters sell for 75-80gp on our server atm and still appear to be dropping so its really not all that expensive at all. <div></div>

[KFizzle]

<DIV>Well i'm not saying its nothing, but i will say I tank those 62^^^'s with little to no problem with one healer. I like the added DPS and mana for many reasons, highest amongst those is the fact that it helps me hold agro easier with the higher DPS and the Mana simply because i'm a mana burning [Removed for Content] <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR></DIV> <DIV>I Have two of the imbued vanadium rings (str and sta), a vanadium neck piece thing with that 10 str or whatever it is (not able to boot eq2 so i cant say exactly) i forget which earring i have, its not the +12 +12 one, its the +9 str and +9 agi i believe, um one vanadium bangle or what ever its called and the other is the beryllium one or however that [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] thing is spelled. My belt, i refuse to give up the FBSS till i get something else with haste on it ... </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I came from a small guild that didnt raid at all, so i know this isn't exactly 'impressive' to you guys but the fact that i've been able to tank Broog, Meathooks, Rahotep, the 'fake' Epics in The Clefts, the CQ4 guy (since i was level 51 with only 2 pieces of cobalt), Poets Pallace and all sortsa other things with little to no problem at all ... hell i've died less lately than ever before (I used to die all the time with pickup groups...[expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] them pickup groups). I mean It's not like i have a problem staying up at all, which is kinda why I wonder why people dont focus more on the Str/Mana aspect. I Havent tanked the Silent City Epics yet but thats mostly because like i said i'm new to this bigger group, plus we have a 60 Guardian who is the main tank for most things (although she's let me tank alot of stuff because I hold agro like crap holds flies).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm far from a 'rich' player, so simply going out and buying fabled or rares is partly out of the question (by not rich, i mean i currently have 4 plat total to my name and i plan to have less after i buy another vanadium for a bangle today). </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As for t6 Hex dolls that would be a decent idea, lol i still have my t4 agi and t5 strength, so maybe i'll get a pair of t6 strength ones tonight too...crap that will drop my funds, but hey what can ya do?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I have alot of adept 3's, from harvesting rares, but my luck has dried up the last few weeks (also co-incidentally since i joined the new guild and have had alot less free time to do BS like harvesting because i'm being called upon to tank <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  )</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Resists and the extra mit wouldnt be bad but i believe my 'non cobalt' armor adds up to 51 extra strength plus the other stuff (stamina and or agility depending on the piece, with health and power comparable or better) and that makes a big difference to me. For some reason I always have had a problem with 'lower strength' for some reason. I picked strength things for racial bonus' and even still i only manage 343 str with my ring buff and adept 3 str buff. </DIV>

[Renzai]

<DIV>Oh 105 then <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> ... My mistake.</DIV>

[infernus006]

"I mean It's not like i have a problem staying up at all, which is kinda why I wonder why people dont focus more on the Str/Mana aspect." well like i said str is still my biggest stat by quite a lot already so i don't believe that sacrificing legendary quality armor for stuff that will reduce my defensive capabilites (mitigation and resists) just to have a bit more str is a good idea.  the point being you can wear full cobalt and still have very high str compared to your other stats, so the fact is you don't have to resort to wearing tresured stuff to get your str up to a high level. now if the reason (or one of the reasons) you choose to wear this type of armor is because you lack the money and/or time to harvest the rares to have better stuff made then that's a different story.  but then the question is would you really choose to forgo wearing a new peice of cobalt armor if it was available to you and replace a lower quality piece if it meant sacrificing a bit of your current str to wear it?  well that's up to you but like i said i don't think it's a good idea, especially if you do in fact tank a lot and expect to be able to tank any kind of raids at all without overloading your healers. "Resists and the extra mit wouldnt be bad..." imo they are essential. "For some reason I always have had a problem with 'lower strength' for some reason. I picked strength things for racial bonus' and even still i only manage 343 str with my ring buff and adept 3 str buff." you say "only" like 343 self-buffed str is nothing.  that's actually pretty high imo.  but i would like to know what your other stats are like along with your resists, mitigation, and avoidance.  it's true that str is supposed to be our most important stat but it's certainly not the only thing you need to be concerned about.  furthmore as it's been pointed out by others in a full group it's easy to reach or even surpass the soft cap for str which i believe is 440.  so anything beyond that does nothing at all for you. furthermore if you're worried about being able to hold aggro with lower str well as long as you have at least ad3 on all your taunts you should have no problem in that department. <div></div>

[KFizzle]

<DIV>I'll tell you my stats probably later tonight and all, i'll post all the stuff about my charrie, but like i said 343 is fully self buffed as is, if i had the cobalt all the way around (i even have another piece of cobalt unworked, but dont get me wrong i could do it with cobalt prices as they are now), but then it would be i believe 50 some odd points lower</DIV>