WE ARE WARRIORS

[Friskc]

<DIV>OK, i just have a couple things to say to all you DPS zerkers!..... ok you guys flame these boards lol like you want to be a bruiser/monk would you guys please come to the realization that we are PLATE "TANKS" and we have been bugged for along time we are now being revamped into what we are supposed to be "berserkers" (kinda like our new spells giving the group a chance to go berserk) thats right a more offensive side plate tank.... meaning we give group offense vs defense tired of seeing everyone want to be a plate tank and do 10000000000 dps if you want that then why would you ever have picked a PLATE TANK you cannot try to tell me you thought that we would do way more dps then all others wearing plate armor. Ya right, now indeed its funny watching me be top 3 dps everynight atm but i can honestly say i am glad to see the crippled classes be fixed along with us as well! all in all were going to be much better over all imo and the game just might be "balanced" like it should be! </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Ya guys we are a Warrior class, and yea atm were ungodly! which is totally wrong to all the other "real dps" classes </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Zerkin Fury </DIV> <DIV>NPU </DIV>

[Selo]

<DIV> <DIV>I 100% agree with Zerkin. Currently, we are the 2nd best tanks and can deal dps so good that we can be the #1 dps if we wanted. Lets be real here guys, is that really fair to the other classes? Im surprised the other classes haven't said anything about berserkers still being overpowered being able to do what we do. Face it, we are PLATE TANKS. Being a plate tank and doing scout-like dps is godly. Don't you feel a bit overpowered? Being able to tank Lord Nagalik with ease while still being able to do the scout's deeds on Kra`Thuk for dps is a bit crazy. I feel we are being a bit too greedy as berserkers. We have it all and most of the people don't even realize it until it's taken away. If people are still crying for dps, then by all means /delete your zerker, and go make a scout, preferably assassin if you want to be the one parsing 1000000 dps. It's time we face reality and play a game that you have to earn your rewards, not have them handed to you on a silver platter. Remember we are playing in their world...not urs...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Raive Velshira</DIV> <DIV>50 Berserker</DIV> <DIV>Equinox</DIV> <DIV>Innothule Server</DIV></DIV><p>Message Edited by Selonx on <span class=date_text>08-08-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:45 AM</span>

[Razie]

After reading these boards about the new changes, and people complaining that our DPS is going to be nerfed etc, At first i felt a knot in my stomach, feeling, what ive spent the last 8 months on has gone to waste.  I felt that,  because i dont tank raids, i would be compleatly useless to the guild while raiding. However after some serious thought about these new changes, I actually welcome it.  We will become better tanks, and somewhat keep some of our DPS.  I figured, I wont be raidng 100% of the time, and with the new expansion DoF coming soon, theres alot more new content I will be playing through , and will have to tank on my way to 60.  Im actually considering selecting the 1 handed Prismatic instead of the 2 handed now after thinking about it. Those Zerkz who do complain about it, well ok its a inconvenience, but keep your heads high, think about the new expansion, and our role there.  Forming groups to tackle the new mobs,  and wouldnt you rather be more welcome as the MT than some half arsed class? Our plate armor will give us extra Mitigation, we will be wanted even more so in groups. All this is based only on the changes ive read in other posts,  dont forget they havent finished with our class, and i cant wait to see more of the changes to come <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div>

[Azr]

Glad ya pointed out we are warriors, not sure I coulda figured that one out on my own.  Btw these changes are gonna makes us more like monk/bruisers (a fighter class) in tanking and dps, not less after changes.  Thats right we are and offensive side plate tank class, and with the changes we get great offensive skills like group hp regen.  Anyways, yes we are overpowered atm, but with this blancing act there is gonna be a huge need for utility from the 6 fighter classes.  Since atm in eq2 all you need is one or two tanks.  I think sony could be a little more creative in this (hps regen etc). Changes are not done though, so little premature to flame about them. <p>Message Edited by Azril on <span class=date_text>08-08-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:23 AM</span>

[Friskc]

<P>Ya indeed we have this hp regen, which might not counter with the 2 hp buffs a gaurdian will still have. We still have a powerful defense stance in my eyes seeing we can take up a total of "4" concentration slots for lots of mit then slap in our hp regen for a nice tank stance ..... also our Controlled Rage does not take up a conc which I found to be really nice as well although they might nerf it seeing at master 1 we have the most defense in game hands down .... more then a gaurd !! but all in all we got battle tatics for hp buff yay... so hopefully the regen will counter it. I think its cool though that we have different stuff now it was kinda lame being so close in skills to a gaurd exp. our hp buffs giving identical amount of hp master 1 to master 1.  Indeed i do agree with ya on sony could be little more creative on the hp regen atm i just dont see that countering an extra 600 or w/e hp they will have over us!</P> <P>Also Azril im glad to know you know the roots of our class ........ from how 50% of this board talks they dont know much, I thought it was good idea when i see stuff like "we should where leather armor" ect and all the other [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] things I hear. One of the biggest reasons I quit reading/posting on these boards cause its hard to see all the non sense & moronic comments :smileyhappy:</P> <P>Zerkin - NPU </P> <P> </P>

[Styk]

well zerkin, cant disagree with what you have to say, lets see how Berserker 2.0 rolls on thou <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> im hoping for the best <div></div>

[Friskc]

hehe 2.0 i like that ....... so true like eq3 for the win haha

[KittenClaw]

I can't agree more. Nicely put. <div></div>

[Causti]

<DIV>You say we're this ungodly DPS machine that can do it all, right? There's a few things we can't do though: 1: Combat Res. I've yet to see a Paladin in my guild NOT get in a raid, because combat res is an amazing thing. DPS is nothing compared to the res Paladins have mid combat. 2: Debuffs. Shadowknights have great debuffs to stick to raid mobs and increase the damage output of every caster in the guild. Grouped with a Necro, SKs also put out some fairly decent damage. 3: The taunts, buffs, and mitigation of a Guardian. They are in fact the better tank, unless of course they are complete and total morons. But a Guardian who plays his char 110% will out-tank a Berserker who plays at 110% in the same gear. Now that leaves one plate class left, the lonely little Berserker.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What's our job if not some nice DPS? To tack a few extra hp to the MT, but if you're not in the MT group, your job is really only one thing - damage. Paladins res, SKs debuff, Guardians tank, and Berserkers do damage. That was the always the way it seemed to me, and to be honest - neither I nor anyone else seemed to have a problem with it. Now we're going to be exactly the same as Guardians? We lose all our haste? The very thing that defines Berserker? If that's not [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ing boring as hell, tell me what is.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I agree we should not out damage scouts, that's a given, so FIX the scout DPS, what is the point to tinker with ours? To FIX us? I hardly call this a fix. After playing a character for nine months, don't even feed me "You knew this was coming." bull[expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]. I had no idea this was coming, According to my EQII book, the internet, and the god [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] guy who made me a Berserker in the first place, they all had one word in common - DAMAGE! I was supposed to be a relentless warrior who inflicted damage with all manners of weapons, showing my opponents no mercy as I mercilessly slaughtered them. Yeah, you're right... that just screams out "You'll take damage."</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>To be honest, I had a pretty good idea of what my class would be: a pretty decent damage dealer who could be the tank if needed, but if a guardian was around, he should be the tank. It seemed to work pretty good, and I enjoyed it. Unfortunatly, SONY had ideas nine months ago that they decided to not put into the game until now, when I spent the greater part of those nine months developing a character who is turning into something completely different.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This isn't a combat revamp, it's a class revamp. The kind of [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] you do 2 or 3 weeks into the game, not one year later. And don't tell me to roll a scout, I rolled a [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ing berserker, nine months ago. Fix the scouts. Fix the casters. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Leave me the hell alone.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Styk]

Do me a favor and stop using the eq2 manual for reference on how a Berserker "should be" i mean smell the coffee , it was a marketing ploy! Did you really think we are suppose to be uber DPS when we are in the same tree with Guardians? Did you really think we are suppose to have more utility then most non bard scouts? You actually thought we were suppose to be up there with Wizards and Warlocks in DPS? You really think it was intended for a class to be BE ABLE TO TANK, GIVE MASSIVE HP AND GROUP HASTE AND TOP TIER DPS TO BOOT? If you did then i dont think this class is your fit after the CC, Berserkers got the good end of the stick with these revamps, Better tankability, STILL good dps, and still some utility. Remember every class got things changed for them, the CC was  meant to make the game slow down and be more difficult... It was meant for the game to stay healthy for the long run ( or would you prefer a game that will be crappy in 6 more months time? ) If you cant accept what we will have , then make a predator type or move on to another game . If i remember we are warriors first then berserkers, so our primary mission is to tank FIRST everything else SECOND. Say what you must, you have a right to your own opinion BUT except the role berserkers will be after CC . Like i said earlier if you cant then find a class that will suit you or maybe move on friends, the choice is yours <div></div>

[ThePhoni]

<DIV>I'm sorry. I'm sorry that SOE chose to call the bezerker a damage dealing fighter, to make a fighter class that at one point had the BEST damage dealing combat art (rampage pre-nerf) in the game.  I'm sorry that to this day SOE has on their website that zerkers do "massive" damage.  I am sorry for thinking that zerkers might be an OFFENIVE fighter first and a tank secondary.  You know.. how it has been for the past YEAR.  [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] me to hell, for believing what was (and is still) told to me by SOE and a FACT ingame.  Next time, I will instead think SOE is playing the opposite game and that every class they state should be DPS is actually a tank or healer.  Because I know they are changing sorcers into healers in the combat revamp.  It makes sense, if SOE does exacally the opposite of what they say time and again!  I'm also sorry for thinking that a big huge barbarian warrior MIGHT be able to do some damage with his huge sword or halbred.  I mean I know if I saw a 7 foot tall ogre charging at me in platemail with a huge 2 handed mace, I would think *yeah, he can't really hurt me, hes just a tank*  Because that is how it "really" should be.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And if you really want to be a second rate clone of a guardian, STILL never chosen to MT a raid mob, but now not even useful enough to have in the raid.  Please go on with your great crusade to make EQ2 zerkers totally different than the normal accepted sterotype of zerkers.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I don't mind where these combat changes are going,  I just think its stupid to think of this new class as actually being bezkers.  When there is really nothing that defines them as such anymore.  Yeah, i know most zerkers would love to be defined now by ... a health regen.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[demolition tank]

<div></div><p><b><span><font color="#ffffff">Stryker, it’s called “false advertising”, and it’s a prosecutable offence. If any lawyers had enough time to play EQ2 enough to know what their talking abo</font>ut, they could feasibly take them to court. </span></b></p><div></div>

[Causti]

<DIV>Stryker, do me a favor and if you're going to respond to my post, respond to the whole thing, not just one word I threw in there. I actually thought I was going to be up there with Wizards and Warlocks? I don't know, seeing as how I had no idea what a Wizard and Warlock would do when I started this game as a wee nublet nine months ago. I thought I would be a WARRIOR who did DAMAGE because that's what EVERYTHING said I would be. If you tell me different, you are just being a [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ing liar.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And I'm sick and tired of hearing that I should of KNOWN better! How the hell was I supposed to know better? I had no idea what a "main tank" was at level 20, I knew I wanted to be the guy with a big sword who went into the battle not caring how hurt he got, as long as he beat the hell out of the other guy. And don't you dare tell me are still "good dps", all our dps came from our haste, you know, the thing we lost. Now we have IN COMBAT HEALTH REGENERATION THANK GOD WE ARE BETTER TANKS NOW!!! Against what? Double up arrow mobs? Yey, that'll be usefull on the way to 60, but once I start raiding again, there isn't going to be a need for 10 tanks in a raid, so there's going to be alot of people sitting out, me included, because I hate tanking. Plus regening 60 hp per tick means jack [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] when a mob is bashing you for 3k+ a hit.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>"Well if you didnd't want to be a tank, why the hell did you pick Zerker?? omg rofl!!1" Because I guess I was a victim of this massive "marketing ploy" that SONY duped me into believing. Everything that had to do with Berserker when I started this game screamed out "you can do damage with your huge sword" and that is all I ever wanted. Guess what? I do do damage with my huge sword, and I love it. I don't want to play a scout, because the thought of using little toothpicks as weapons is very unnappealing to me.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This "make a scout or deal with it" mentality is wearing thin, some of us don't want to level another character to 50, 60 in a month. Some of us don't have the time, and some of us want to play the class we have been paying SONY the past nine months to play. What about us? We should just sit back and let SONY punch us in the throat... just because? I know it's "their game" but without "our money" they wouldn't have a game. Don't tell me we got the good end of the stick on this combat revamp, because you're wrong twice. We got the [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] end of the stick, and this isn't a combat revamp, it's a class revamp. SONY has completely changed the way a Berserker is played, and not many other classes after this revamp can say that. It's only a good thing if the only reason you made a Berserker was to tank, damage was never a thought in your mind. Only then, are you probably ok with this patch. If you wanted to do damage, and became accustomed to doing damage over the past nine months, getting it ripped away from you is pretty [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ed up in my opinion.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I don't want to be a tank, and only a tank. I don't want to do as much damage as a Paladin because I can't res or heal. I want to be a Berserker. But I don't think anyone really gives a [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]. I think some of you are ok with being turned into four classes. I'm not a berserker after this patch, hell I'm not even a warrior. I'm going to be a FIGHTER, because that was the only choice that mattered. At level 3, I determined my role at level 50, Berserker was kind of just a "flavor" after this patch, and it's going to be a pretty dull [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ing flavor at that.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>EverQuest II: FIGHTER SCOUT MAGE PRIEST - coming to a live server near you early September. Have fun with it, I sure as hell won't.</DIV>

[KFizzle]

<DIV>See I'm all over the board on the whole Zerker thing personally ... i don't know if i'm going to like the changes or hate them. I am going to give them a try personally but here's my thought real quick.</DIV> <DIV><BR>Paladin/Shadowknight are are the two "Utility" type tanks to me ... because they can heal/rez and SK can even evac so i've been told.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Monk/Bruiser are the higher DPS, Less Mitigation Tanks who at least Monks i know can heal, and to be honest thinking back on my choices, I should have gone this route ... BUT...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Guardian/Berserker are the Heavy Plate, (should be if you ask me) Best tanking guys, with the zerker having less utility than Pally/Sk, and being a great DPS (by description). <BR><BR>I WANTED to be a Great DPS in armor type ... because thats how it sounded a berserker would be (and through 46 levels so far...26 as a zerker, it has been). My problem is though, we lose our main utility purposes (our HP Buffs and Haste stuff) and our DPS at the expense of being a MT/Meat Shield. If anyone says I should have known, how? I didnt play EQ1. This is my first MMORPG besides Star Wars Galaxies, and this is the first game i've ever heard where Warriors in the Form of berserkers do the LEAST Physical damage in a combat situation. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Theoretically shouldnt Scouts do less? I Mean who would swing a sword harder and more accurate, someone whose soul focus in life Is fighting (All our things are focused on fighting, we have no heals,rez or anything else other classes have), or someone who has MANY other purposes (Tracking, Group Sneak, Evac, Movement speed buffs etc)? </DIV> <DIV><BR>Just think on that, our soul purpose is fighting ... shouldnt we be at least the best at it?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Styk]

Well Caustick i dont know what to tell you then, you obviously are looking for something that just wont happen any longer in this game, I mean cmon now, in the 10 months this game has been LIVE we took beating after beating with the nerf stick and we are still overpowered as a class, Also claims of False Advertisement is not really applicable since in the EULA it also states that they have a right to alter this game in any state or form since its their product. I can understand why the berserker community is up in arms about this, i feel it is partly SoE's fault for not allowing people like myself or Taemak ( if you see his thread in test forums it was locked for no reason )  to /copy over to test to put the Berserker 2.0 to a test and give yall the feedback... I feel that if we were able to do so, we could put alot of worries about our class to rest ... EVERYONE SIT BACK AND RELAX, im pretty positive that overall the changes for our class are for the better in the long haul, Mind you i am also one of the legions of zerkers who put ALOT of time and effort into our class and IF we are infact destroyed as a class , i wont hesitate to leave this game as well .... Give it some time zerkers pls, <div></div>

[Sambora]

<DIV>Ok, here is is plain and simple.  I can't see why some of you chowdah heads can't get this through your skulls.</DIV> <DIV>When I had the chance to either become a defensive fighter (guardian) or OFFENSIVE fighter (zerker) I chose the latter.</DIV> <DIV>I have taken my character to level 50 and understand where I fit in both groups and raids.  Now we are being punished for making the offensive over defensive choice?  Had I wanted to be a 100% MT I would have chosen to go guardian!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As far as our Zerker buffs go....It would make sense that the character that goes into battle not caring if he lives or dies would be able to increase the attack speed of his party (offensive buffs).  Rather a guardian should be more defensive with his buffs, which they are.  Perhaps our HP buffs are a bit much, but SOE wants to give us HP regen buffs that mean crap instead?  I mean if that's what they want to do, they could at least make it worth it and not some wuss 50 per tick crap.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Oh, and don't even get me started on this defensive/offensive stance crap....I mean if that's what I wanted then I would go play WoW instead.  Is there anything else SOE would like to copy from that other crappy game and install in what is soon to be an equally crappy game for us true zerkers!?!?!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We are all wittnessing the beinging of the wussification of a great character that most of us have been playing since day 1!!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Once again, I can't wait for Vanguard!!</DIV> <DIV>I would much rather be giving Brad my money than these [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]-clowns that are changing a game 9 months after its inception</DIV> <DIV>/blowit SOE!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[CherobylJ]

<P>Good post Zerkin.  I too am tired of hearing "take away shields/take away plate/take away yada yada".  We are a heavy tank class.</P> <P>But I also kinda agree with what Styker said; we really shoudl be a heavy tank, with situationally extraordinary DPS and some reasonable raid utility.  Because of bad design we really have the best of all 3....and this isnt particularly fair to other classes (be they tank/dps/etc).  I am hoping that the revamp will keep is a fun class to play but open the door for better balance.</P>

[Razie]

<div></div>Sorry you feel that way<span> Caustick</span><a href="../view_profile?user.id=23334" target="_blank"><span></span></a>, Shut the door on your way out...No amount of whinging is going to solve anything.  Re-roll another toon, or play something else if you dont like it.I look forward to these changes.<a target="_blank" href="../view_profile?user.id=23334"><span></span></a><div></div>

[Tar~Palantir]

<P>I myself am in the process of rolling a beserker.  WHen i picture a Berserker, the whole Viking Berserkgang comes to mind, where some huge long-haired blonde norseman comes to mind throwing batleaxes at your ehad and then charging you with jagged greatsword.</P> <P> </P> <P>Of course, in the tank world, we probably will be on the more vicous side.  </P> <P>I will take joy listening to a crusader say a prayer to his "God" before he gets martyred.  </P> <P>/cackle</P> <P> </P> <P>From what I hear, Warriors still walk out of these revamp with a few cuts and bruises compared to others who well....just send them a get well card *cough* paladin *cough*.</P>

[Jumb]

<div></div> When I chose Berserker I admit I did expect to be an offensive tank but i still did not expect the class to do as much damage as it did sure I thought it was cool and bragged to my friend from time to time but even I knew it would not last forever. Yea I was worried about combat revamp alot in fact it did almost make me change classes. We are still gonna do more damage than guardians (atleast according to the posts and updates from the people who actually post info instead of whine).      When I picked the class I did invision a guy goin psycho all over a mob but guess what i still wanted to be a tank first and foremost of all and let's face it do you really think all the whining and crying about how I thought i was gonna do this much damage and be this and that really effects sony? don't you think they expected there to be hundreds of crying posts they dont give two craps cause they know not everyone is gonna like it.     Guess what it is their game they can make whatever changes they want to it and if you don't like it then leave. You will be one of the few of thousands of subscribers to do and apparently you dont hate the revamp too bad or else you woulda been gone by now I know I woulda. Sorry if this comes off kinda mean or cruel w/e I am jus tired of coming here for advice  but instead jus see hundreds of posts about " why i dont like combat revamp" Who gives a [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] leave if you dont like it so bad. <div></div><p>Message Edited by Jumbia on <span class=date_text>08-09-2005</span> <span class=time_text>09:49 PM</span>

[Sambora]

<P>Hey Jum</P> <P>That's what message boards are for!  I could give a flying [Removed for Content] what you have to say...but I don't go around complaining about it.</P> <P>So [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]!</P>

[Tar~Palantir]

I am attracted by the versatility by this class.  I can whip out a halberd and DPS, or can take out my sword and shield and tank.  Maybe even i would utilize my bow skills.

[kr8ztwin]

<P>I just wanted to throw in my 2 cents :robottongue:</P> <P>I personally would have liked them to focus more on the berserk part instead of the plate tank part.  I'd rather lose vanguard and be limited to only 2-H weapons, than to be a guardian with a tower shield and sword :robotvery-happy:</P> <P>When I created my evil ratzerker I had this in mind. ....yeah thats all I wanna say bout dat.</P>

[infernus006]

Not me...call me weird but I would much rather lose a little dps than lose any of my tanking ability.  I am worried that the upcoming CC will take too much of our current dps abilities away from us but if what some are saying is true about us losing only a little dps and gaining even more taking ability overall, then I'm ok with that.  We'll just have to wait and see I guess.  Like the original poster said, we are warriors not brawlers.  And let me just say that when I first made my zerker which is now level 50 I didn't really have it in mind to tank a lot but despite that I found myself almost always getting chosen as the MT for groups for some reason, not as DPS.  That's the way it's always been for me from like level 6 (when I first started grouping) to level 50, so instead of deleting the char and making a brawler I went with it and made what I feel is a pretty badazz tank, which Im happy with and wouldn't trade for anything.  People are happy that I can take damage and hold aggro really good while dishing out a little dps in the process.  I accepted the fact that I am a plate tank that is not that much different from a guardian and now I really don't want that to change and it doesn't look like it's going to so maybe the new CC won't be so bad after all...at least not for us so much as other classes from what I'm hearing.  Like I said, though, we'll just have to wait and see.  But I'm not like some of these other people who say "take away our vanguard and defense and all our taunts I dont care because I don't wanna tank ever I just wanna dps like crazy and that's it"...I agree with the others who tell them to reroll a scout or a caster if that's what they want because that would make more sense than trying to make our class into something it's not and not meant to be. <div></div>

[ThePhoni]

<DIV>At no time was SOE ever going to take away bezerker tanking and taunting abilities.  In the combat revamp they have augmented those abilities very well.  NOT to the point were we are as good as guardians, at least that is my experience.  They still have more mitigation, more defense, and better taunts.  Guardians ARE the better tank.  What this revamp brings to bezerkers is 1 thing, a DPS nerf.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I enjoyed being the main tank of groups, its a fun place to be.  It is fun to manage aggro and to feel like your keeping the others in your party safe.  Up until  this revamp we fulfilled those roles along with being able to beat the crap out of mobs.  Which is exacally what i signed up for.  In this revamp, we ARE losing roughly 50% of our combat art damage.  In <A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=comtest&message.id=2362" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=comtest&message.id=2362</A> this thread there is a comparison of our current and the proposed changes to our abilities up to level 44.  I challenge anyone to give me examples where we are not losing about half of our DPS.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We are warriors, and as such we should be able to slay the dragon, instead of hiding behind a shield and a healer.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The only other classes that really have been hit in the nuts by these changes are the enchanters and troubaours.  And the entire priest class, but hopefully SOE will put up its full healing revamp in soon.</DIV>

[infernus006]

<div></div>"We are warriors, and as such we should be able to slay the dragon, instead of hiding behind a shield and a healer." Don't be silly, no class was ever able to or made to solo a dragon in this game.  Sheilds and healers are in the game for a reason.  And guardians are warriors too.  As such they should also forgo the usage and sheilds and healers to take down tough mobs?  I think not.  And neither should a zerker IMO. Furthermore, I have found myself being able to out-tank some guardians who were the same level as me, with similar gear and about equal HP and mit.  It's not just the class you play but how well you play it. And from what I've heard even after the revamp we will still be able to out-dps guardians, we will still be going berserk at least some of the time, so we will still have at least one edge against them. In your sig, "Heres a suggestion to all those that went Berserker that wanted to be a tank, GO PLAY A GUARDIAN." Not sure if you are actually serious about that comment but if so (and even if not that's still [Removed for Content]), face it, guards aren't the only tanks in the game.  Like I said, when I started my zerker I didn't really have it in mind to tank a whole lot, I just found myself being chosen by other players to fill that role most of the time and found myself doing it well.  Go figure. <div></div><p>Message Edited by infernus006 on <span class=date_text>08-16-2005</span> <span class=time_text>08:22 AM</span>

[[sp00k]]

<P>**This is to all you DPS Zerkers - Re-roll**</P> <P>There seems to be a lot of people thinking and assuming Berzerkers can't tank and/or tank not as good as a "guardian".  I beg to differ.  I will only exp, and adventure with a zerker.  You will never catch me letting a guardian tank for me.  Berzerkers have the same tank ability as guardians and do 10x more dps.   </P> <P>I am a healer, and I have a good perspective on who tanks better.  I tend to have to work harder healing a guardian than a Zerker.  This is mainly in exp, and adventure groups the same goes for raiding but not so much so.   If you want to dps go play a ranger or something.   </P> <P>Zerkers are Tanks, Guardians are Tanks</P> <P>Thanks, my 2cp</P> <P> </P><p>Message Edited by [sp00k] on <span class=date_text>08-16-2005</span> <span class=time_text>06:04 AM</span>

[ThePhoni]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> infernus006 wrote:<BR> "We are warriors, and as such we should be able to slay the dragon, instead of hiding behind a shield and a healer."<BR><BR>Don't be silly, no class was ever able to or made to solo a dragon in this game.  Sheilds and healers are in the game for a reason.  And guardians are warriors too.  As such they should also forgo the usage and sheilds and healers to take down tough mobs?  I think not.  And neither should a zerker IMO.<BR><BR>Furthermore, I have found myself being able to out-tank some guardians who were the same level as me, with similar gear and about equal HP and mit.  It's not just the class you play but how well you play it.<BR><BR>And from what I've heard even after the revamp we will still be able to out-dps guardians, we will still be going berserk at least some of the time, so we will still have at least one edge against them.<BR><BR>In your sig, "Heres a suggestion to all those that went Berserker that wanted to be a tank, GO PLAY A GUARDIAN."<BR><BR>Not sure if you are actually serious about that comment but if so (and even if not that's still [Removed for Content]), face it, guards aren't the only tanks in the game.  Like I said, when I started my zerker I didn't really have it in mind to tank a whole lot, I just found myself being chosen by other players to fill that role most of the time and found myself doing it well.  Go figure.<BR> <P>Message Edited by infernus006 on <SPAN class=date_text>08-16-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>08:22 AM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>I'm sorry if you did not get the general sentiment of sarcasm in my post.  No i do not want bezerkers to be able to solo dragons.  Yes do agree that one of our primary roles in a group is that of tank.  I AM happy with that role.  If you search my previous posts, I have explicately stated MANY times that I think we should be "decent/good" tanks.  I think that we should be able to be MT in normal exp groups.  My problem is that I believe that we can be tanks and should also have DPS.  The slay a dragon quote was to convey the idea that yes WARRIORS can and should do more than taunt.  Warriors should be able to deal damage.  No not as much damage as a sorcerer or preditor class, but a decent balanced amount.  NOT the 50% nerf we have recieved.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> The final suggestion: <U>" Heres a suggestion to all those that went Berserker that wanted to be a tank, GO PLAY A GUARDIAN" </U>is for people that want the bezerker to be NOTHING more than a tank.  I think that the reason why people chose bezerker over guardian was so that they could do more than just be a meatshield.  This combat revamp relagates us to meatshield status!  If you don't believe me, PLEASE roll a test toon.  It takes about 8 hours of decent groups to get to lvl 20 if you know what your doing, and its very obvious in the mid 20's what they have made the bezerker into, a second rate guardian.  Try to pull aggro from a guardian groupmate, you can't he is not better at it than you.  Ask the healer who needs more heals as the maintank, the guardian or you.  The 2 i have been able to test with have told me the guardian needed fewer heals.  Yes when bezerk we do more damage than a guardian, but otherwise we do the SAME damage.  If 10 seconds of bezerk with a small haste and DPS boost to autoattack is the <U><EM><STRONG>only</STRONG></EM></U> reason to play a bezerker over a guardian.  Why bother?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Please if you have a wait and see attitude, look on the test and guardian forums. Compare us to them, each forum has a thread with the new combat revamp spells!  Guardians are still the superior tank with better mitigation and defense skills.  They have more and better taunts.  The nerfed bezerk ability is not enough to make this class worth playing.  A health regen is not a reason to play a bezerker.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[infernus006]

<div></div><div></div>"I'm sorry if you did not get the general sentiment of sarcasm in my post." Kinda hard to tell unless you use emoticons.  Which you didn't.  So it "sounded" serious to me. "This combat revamp relagates us to meatshield status!" We are now and always have been "meatshields", or at least that is what we are supoposed to be, not just dps.  You say this like it's a bad thing.  If you didn't want to be considered a "meatsheild", even when in the role of a dps, then you shouldn't have chosen a class that gets taunts and plate armor. "The final suggestion: <u>" Heres a suggestion to all those that went Berserker that wanted to be a tank, GO PLAY A GUARDIAN" </u>is for people that want the bezerker to be NOTHING more than a tank." We have to get hit, ie tank, to get the extra dps out of our berserk buff as it is now.  So if you're a zerker that wants to get the most out of your char then you should be striving to be the MT whenever possible to achieve that.  I don't feel that we are meant to be standing behind the mobs all or most of the time.  I don't mind doing it when it's better for the group to have someone else tank (like if there's a higher level one that has better gear than me) but we actually get less dps that way so that position is less desirable to me.  Not because I just wanna tank all the time but because I know that's the only way I can get the most out of my char.  Besides, there is no such thing as "nothing more than a tank" in this game, except guardians.  That's all THEY are.  The rest of the fighters in this game have at least one or two things about them that sets them apart and gives them something special to add to groups and be noted for.  Guardians, of course, have their superior defense but that's really all they have going for them.  There's some reason why a lot of people choose the zerker class over guardian and it's not because it's "nothing more than a tank" because then they would have chosen guardian if that's all they wanted to be.  How this will change with the new revamp remains to be seen. "I think that the reason why people chose bezerker over guardian was so that they could do more than just be a meatshield." The only real difference between us and them, currently, is the slightly reduced defense for a LOT more dps, as I see it  But that doesn't change the fact that we still have to be the one holding the aggro to get that uber dps, so we are, in effect, still meant to be meatshields whether you like it or not.  Currently we can still do some dps behind the mobs but not nearly as much.  I think the new revamp intends to change it so the only difference between a guard and a zerker is that zerkers will have slightly reduced defense for slightly more dps instead of the huge advantage we have now in dps.  But don't get me wrong, I'm not happy about losing any of my dps and I am worried that they might be taking way to much away from us to make it really worth going zerker over guard.  Hopefully, if this is the case, it will become evident in the testing and they will do something about it before it becomes a real problem on live servers. "If 10 seconds of bezerk with a small haste and DPS boost to autoattack is the <u><em><strong>only</strong></em></u> reason to play a bezerker over a guardian.  Why bother?" Don't forget this is all still in testing...I really don't think they are done fixing it yet.  If they were then it would probably be on the live servers already, don't you think?  But the berserk buff has always been our trademark.  It IS the main thing about being a zerker, or at least it's supposed to be.  I'm not happy about losing all the other haste buffs we have now either, but don't forget that everyone is having things taken away from them, not just us.  We are also getting some new things that we didn't have before.  I'm looking forward to that at least, not to mention the promised respec we're supposed to get out of this as well.  Guards are also losing some of their uber defense from what I've heard, so we're not alone as far as nerfs go.  Remember, they're trying to "even things out" and i'ts not just players that are changing but mobs as well.  Now whether that's actually a good idea or not remains to be seen.  Personally, I'm hoping for the best and willing to give it a try (not that I really have a choice other than quting the game of course).  And if it turns out bad then at least then we'll have solid facts to go by and not just speculation to support our concerns. <div></div><p><span class="date_text"></span><span class="time_text"> </span></p><p>Message Edited by infernus006 on <span class=date_text>08-17-2005</span> <span class=time_text>08:59 AM</span>

[Mie]

<DIV>Great post. Combat revamp will give us a role in high end raid.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We are warrior , we are tank !</DIV>

[KittenClaw]

A lot depends on the quality of players. The berserkers who are whining about losing all their "l33t" abilities at DPS are probably crappy tanks and don't know how to play a main tank. "I put nine months into my character!" Then you should be rich. Twink a scout class, and stop whining. If you want to be pure DPS then you don't want to be a fighter. If you want to wear chain and do massive amounts of damage... Reroll as a ranger/assassin. I feel that the changes will be a vast improvement on the class and we will finally get the respect we deserve as tanks, as warriors, as meatsheilds. If you recall, when you chose "warrior" to later become a berserker you chose "meatsheild." Think back to the day you picked your class and later subclass. Think of  your character's discription. Just THINK. <div></div>