Shaman lottoing for sword of thunder

[Rags]

<DIV>Been soloing for days trying to get that stupid sword. I finally decide to group abit and the sword drops. The 19 lvl shaman wins the lotto and I am like whats up with that? He explains this char was an alt and he needed it for his 50 main, so I see his point and the group moves on xping. After the group splits I get a tell from this person laughing at me and the other tanks in group saying his main cant even use it. His name was Yuzo on unrest server if anyone cares to know.</DIV>

[Styk]

well for those who are on Unrest takes notes then..... SoE was stupid for removing the no drop,no trade flag on the Sword of Thunder.... they need to move the drop to corpse and place the no drop no trade flag back on it....

[SpiderlingBane]

<DIV> <DIV>Loots is loots.  If it can be sold then everyone who helped make it drop deserves an equal opportunity to benifit from their effort.  If up front you all had agreed to "NBG" (which is a dumb concept) then you have a gripe.  Othewise, if you somehow felt entitled to the loot drop just because you can gain benifit from it with fewer steps (i.e. you dont have to sell it before you can buy something you can use) then you have no sympathy from me.  No one is entitled to loot simply because their class can use it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV></DIV>

[Styk]

Spider that is such an assine statement..... Sword of Thunder is meant for tank classes.... ( for its weapon mainly, if there isnt any tanks that need it then yes they can have it for later on for heritage quest for guild xp ) how would that shaman type like it if i won an important adept and i kept it because i can profit from it? From using your reasoning its all good, put back the no drop,notrade.novalue flag on Sword of Thunder and ill bet people will start letting tanks get the reward meant for them...

[-Aonein-]

<DIV>I gotta agree with Styker, that is a pretty poor and very very greedy attitude to have Spider, reguardless of how you look at it, there is a thing called respect for one another, if a caster item drop's in my group and someone say's they can use it, i give it too them, and i dont expect anyone to cry need before greed, cause that's how i play, need before greed, cause at the end of the day, it's a game, not like your struggling to feed your family with the <STRONG><U>insane</U></STRONG> price of 2 plat i see people with attitude's like your's trying to sell the Sword of Thunder for.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Taemek Frozenberg 40th Berserker<BR>16th Outfitter<BR>Blood and Ice<BR>Everfrost Server<BR><BR>Enlightened Aonein Amillion ( retired )<BR>70th Stone Fist of The Celestial Fist<BR>Five Rings on Luclin Server</DIV>

[Rentnil]

<DIV>While sure he is in his right to take the item, this is precisely the reason I do not group outside my own guild for most times. and if this would have happened to me I would have left the group then and there. Although did you not tell the group you were only after that drop when you joined it? I would definately check that when joining a group. if all 5 say they are after the same thing then you know that you may be better off sticking to the mobs solo. Was it his right to lotto for it? Yes. Was it bad form? Yes. Would I never group with him again? Most likely. </DIV>

[Laereneth]

<DIV>I have to agree with stryker.  Those that want items and down with the ship with the rest of the group are just plain greedy and are not group players in any respect.  I'd say 90%, if not higher, of all my pickup groups are NBG...which is an awesome concept.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Laer</DIV>

[scl]

Don't be so [FAAR-NERFED!] ridiculous! Whining like a bunch of babies, you're meant to be berserkers for Christ sake, yet you act like a bunch of florists. First off, this item isn't yours and yours only. Contrary to popular belief the sword of thunder isn't only used by tanks. It can be and is used by the following classes: Assassin, Bard, Berserker, Brigand, Crusader, Dirge, Druid, Fury, Guardian, Paladin, Predator, Ranger, Rogue, Scout, ShadowKnight, Swashbuckler, Troubador, Warden and Warrior. <p> Just because a class can't use an item, it does not mean they should hand it over, especially if you've never even met each other before. Admittedly, I like to help others out and will give up an item if I cannot use it, but this certainly is not a law. <p> Maybe some people keep things they can't use for guild mates or friends. Just because they're not going to use it, doesn't mean they're going to sell it. Stop whining, grow up and go find another one. <p> Call yourself a berserker!? Ha!

[rd]

<DIV>While I feel your pain, I'd suggest that you make arrangements for desired loot BEFORE it drops - especially something so rare.  If someone is not willing to give you the drop you want, don't group with them.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I've been looking for a giant ear to finish my mastery for quite a while now and one of the first things I offer when joining a group is to decline other parts for dibs on the ear.  90% of the time, others are fine with it - especially if they want dibs on something else.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Ooxe</DIV>

[SpiderlingBane]

<DIV>Loot is not "ment" for any particular class.  Loot represents an opportunity for advancement, and we all play the game to advance our characters.  Those who argue that a caster should not get a melee item because they can not use it are wrong.  The caster can use melee gear - they can sell it so they can buy spell and gear upgrades they need.  In fact, it is possible that the caster winning the melee item is the best use for that item, as the upgrades the caster obtains as the result of the sale might improve his character more then using the item would have improved the melee character.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>You need to look ahead farther then the nose on your face.  If you only react without thinking ahead a few steps you will not get very far.  </DIV>

[Styk]

Spider people like you will NEVER get in any groups i have... you have LOOT [Removed for Content] written all over your face... i just hope one day when you finally get the drop you have been waiting for weeks on end and cant buy drops and some other person wins the lotto and uses your reasoning why you wont get it .... Im pretty sure also that many people wont want you in there groups either with that attitude towards loot.... Go ahead be greedy.... thats how you choose to play this game and your entitled to... people are also entitled to not let you join there groups as well.... also who are you btw's cuz if your on Antonia Bayle ill be sure to place you on my not to group list...Strykr Destructicus43 Berserker

[Jahraviel]

Since it's an item used in a later quest, BBC, I'm not sure you can really apply NBG to it. You either have to have the foresight on your way up to get it and hold onto it, or you have to make an alt and try to get it that way. The best alt to make is a healer since it's easier to get a group. It isn't like the guy is playing his level 50 in a raid and a level 50 weapon drops and he rolls on it for his level 9 alt. He can use this item right now on a character that can use the completed BBC right now. Assuming this is the case he needs it just as badly as anyone else and considering how expensive it is buying it is hardly an option for most people. I'm in the same position and leveled an alt just for this reason. If BST is the only reason I'm playing a level 20 toon in a zone I don't like with combat xp turned off there is no way I am hitting the decline button when it drops. It just isn't reasonable to ask someone to do that. If they made it corpse loot the zone would be full of level 50's destroying everything in sight. It's just one of those things everyone has to deal with.

[DaemonSlay]

<DIV>I hate swords.. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>a good sturdy axe is all i requie..</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>beriks axe of thunder.... hmm, wouldnt that be nice... :p</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I never really believe the "Oh but my alt can use it" excuses <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> if NBG wasnt agreed upon... the shaman is entitled to keep it, Even though it is unfair</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> agree with Strykers post 100% <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[SpiderlingBane]

<DIV>Those of us who are not obsessed with loot really don't care all that much about drops or who gets them.  This is a concept which is foreign to many immature players.   As I am a fair minded individual I like it when everyone who contributed has an equal chance at reward.  NBG by design excludes individuals, deems them less worthy, which is why I don't like it.  If that makes me a "loot [Removed for Content]" then I'm proud to be one. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[-Aonein-]

<DIV>The way i read the OP, is everyone was fine with the Shaman looting the sword, the point of the post was he lead people to believe that his main also <STRONG><U>needed</U></STRONG> it when it was pretty much a lie which he then purposely rubbed there nose's in it by going completely out of his way to send the people who <STRONG><U>needed</U></STRONG> it tell's stating that his main cant even use it. There is nothing foreign to this immature player except the Sword of Thunder in his inventory.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The NBG system is good as long as people dont abuse it, you can generally tell if people are being tureful in acually needing the item or not, reguardless of if you know someone or not, you make a good name for yourself by playing with the golden rule of those who need it or can use it right then and there, pass it over, what are you going to lose? You didnt pay for the item, there fore you arent losing nothing, but when you group with the same person over the course of leveling up, wether it be intended or a coincidence and they use the NBG line every drop, then no, that's abusing it. By using this mentalility when playing you are showing to people that you are a mature player instead of a mentalility, " i was in the group, i helped kill it, i deserve it just as much as anyone here even though i cant use it and they need it ", then you go on acting like nothing even happened, when reality is there most likely spreading the word that your a loot [Removed for Content] in tell's and guild chat, as time goes on and you do this in every group you join, word of mouth is like a disease, and you find yourself struggling to get a group which then you will most likely try to blame it on SoE for being a broken class and not viable for a group. It's a vicious cycle.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As Hanna Furycleaver of Graystone in Qeynos says, " Helping other's keeps the soul pure. "</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Taemek Frozenberg 40th Berserker<BR>16th Outfitter<BR>Blood and Ice<BR>Everfrost Server<BR><BR>Enlightened Aonein Amillion ( retired )<BR>70th Stone Fist of The Celestial Fist<BR>Five Rings on Luclin Server</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Styk]

Doesnt matter, SoThunder will get reflagged back soon enough ( and prolly moved to a corspe drop ) .... majority of game players arent 40+ yet so the need for it isnt that great yet, just give it time....

[Thunderbr]

<DIV>Well, to him that Sword probably = a few platinum, hell, even if my character couldn't use it, a few platinum makes up for it...NBG does NOT apply to items like this, know what would solve the problem though? Make this a no-trade item, therefore, no market to sell in, hence, it would become an NBG because it would be USELESS on the other character...</DIV>

[-Aonein-]

<DIV>The problem is, people know what it's long term use is intended for, making people think charging insane prices for it like 2 - 5 plat is worth it, all because it's a part of a Hertiage quest, so they over price it. If Sword of Thunder had nothing to do with any other quest, so all it was was a Berik's, Sword of Thunder, this item would have trouble selling for 10 gold, if Sword of Thunder had no other use or purpose, people would galdly pass it to someone in the group without even thinking twice. It's the same as how people abuse the fact that High Quaility pelt used for Manastone quest get's priced at 2 - 5 plat and same for Rough Opal that is used for the Stein of Moggok quest, 2 - 5 plat also. People forget that these item's arent only used in heritage quest's, there also used for more simpler thing's like T4 spell's, 12 slot back pack, T4 light armor, item's that once made cant sell back for the price people charge for the Rare, most of which no one can afford because of the insane pricing. Would you pay 2 pp for a 12 slot backpack or a T4 adept III spell? Feysteel is another rare that get's crazy price value, 80 gold for a feysteel cluster? 1 pp for a feysteel bar? What exactally is going through people's mind's when they set these price's? Anyway, this isnt about rare's it's about greedy people seeing nothing but $$$$$.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Taemek Frozenberg 40th Berserker<BR>16th Outfitter<BR>Blood and Ice<BR>Everfrost Server<BR><BR>Enlightened Aonein Amillion ( retired )<BR>70th Stone Fist of The Celestial Fist<BR>Five Rings on Luclin Server</DIV>

[Thunderbr]

<DIV>Yeah man I totally here what you're saying, but put it this way, if you're, persay, a lvl 23 in Stormhold, you see tons of $$$ in front of your eyes, you're set till like lvl 40 now with cash if you actually end up selling the Sword, or, you can just hold for an alt if you really wanted to...as I said, NO-TRADE would solve some problems here...:smileywink:</DIV>

[Zakane]

Wow don't even get me started with this thing ok well to late.First I am there for three days in a row Litterly almost all day, killing thousands of undead. Not droping ONCE! then a monk tells me he got it like after a few kills. He didn't even know what the sword was for and what not. They really need to let it drop of corpse and put no drop on it. Since its crazy and annoying and greedy people!

[Zenmu]

<DIV>Ooo! Berrik horror stories. I had one last night.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So.. my lvl 25 Zerker, who has been soloing and grouping in SH exclusively for the past 2 weeks, and has done AQ3 probably 30 times now from start to finish for everyone from very light to heavy armor, hasn't seen a single sword of thunder drop. Until last night.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I finished one groups AQ3, and immediately jumped into another. There were three of us, they needed a tank, and supposedly only need goo's and torrents for the AQ. So i'm thinking ok, no problem. It's getting late, and this will be my last group before i go to bed. The group leader, a druid, even knows that i want to just fly through this and go. I made it very clear.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So for starters, i find out we need everything for the very light AQ3. Goo's, torrents, and books in the library. Again, no problem i'm thinking, it's just gonna take a little longer...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Then the group leader starts inviting random people, none of which are tanks mind you, and all of whom need AQ3, start to finish. It's wasn't even a consistant group, and has all kinds of armor class's (Medium, Light, Very Light, and one Heavy templar)... But seeing how i'm the only tank, and there were none lfg on the whole fricking server our level range, i'm stuck... </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So i proceed to fly through the mobs, hoping to wrap this up as quickly as possible (i've become a bit of a pro at this AQ, have it down to almost a science...)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We head over to destroy the Cav's, and that lone wandering crusader path's by us, so i pull it, we kill it, and BOOM. The first sword of thunder i've ever seen (in over two weeks of killing in SH).</DIV> <DIV>So i start to plead my case, and i explain i'm the only tank in the group, i'm only in SH for that quest, and i'm the only one in group thats not here for AQ3, and i have nothing else to gain from helping them, except that sword and some really lame XP...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Majority of the group was ok with it, and i don't think they rolled. The group leader even said he would role and give it to me, just to make sure i got it... And low and behold, some lvl 21 Warden (3rd healer in the group) rolls, and wins. So i immediately take it to tells, and try to explain to him again why i want it. It turns out, he has no idea what it is, what it's for, or what it does. So i tell him. I even explain how it's used in a higher level quest weapn that he can't use...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So what's he do... he goes and looks it up on Ogaming.com... and after several tells from not only me, and several other group members telling him how i deserve it, NBG, etc. etc., he decides he's going to keep it... because its' warden useable...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>At this point i'm [Removed for Content], but i don't let it carry over into the group. I continue to pull, and quietly look for a tank to replace me...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I made one last ditch effort to wrestle it from him, and offered him pretty much every piece of loot i had on me, and all my coin. A few adept 1's, about 1.5 gold, a Master 1 assassin skill, and all the vendor crap i had... which all in all probably would come out to a plat or so...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>He reply's with "But i really need a weapon", to which i responded "You can buy a weapon with all that stuff, and besides, your a warden..."</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>His last reply before i put him on ignore and vowed to never group with him again was "Besides, Ogaming says i can get up to 4 plat for it"...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>[FAAR-NERFED!] YOU OGAMING!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm on the Kithicor server, his name is Lost.</DIV>

[Wyvernsti]

<DIV>I followed where he won the lotto.  I didn't notice where you had everyone agree to your getting this sword (should it drop), as a pre-condition of your participation in the group?  If that was the case and everyone agreed, you got shafted.  I'm sorry for you.  Put them on ignore and move on. </DIV>

[Ni]

<DIV>All this hoopla and whining about not getting a weapon at level 25 so one can have an uber weapon at level 45 is just insane. The first expansion EQ2 has will introduce weapons that make the modified BBC look like a punch dagger.  Get over it. I play a bezerker and if thing dropped and I won it I would sell it in a heartbeat, bird in hand and all that...</DIV>

[Talz]

<DIV>If there is a problem with a great weapon in the first expansion I guess your answer would be to wait until the second because there will be a better item?  Great logic.</DIV>

[Styk]

Mentoring will solve all these problems ....

[Avera]

<DIV>NBG is inherantly flawed.  We all know that the lotto just isn't perfect.  Last night I was playing with a guy who got seven drops in a row.  No one could use them so we let him have them.  But what happens if something drops that he can use ?? NBG says we should just let him win the lotto so he gets 8 in a row.. and thats not right.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The prices set for the SOT are rediculous.  So rediculous that , in order to balance the market, eventually they will HAVE to make it corpse loot.  They did the same thing with stilettos orders.  peopel were charging obscene amounts of money for it.. so they made it corpse loot.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As for the EBBC  I have given up.  There is so much more to do in this game than camp a lvl 20 zone with an alt for hours on end waiting for an ultra rare drop. that seems kinda stupid to me, and a waste of money since I pay to play,  If I want a two hander i will go with monsoon.  </DIV>

[Davish_Darkwolf]

<DIV>Guess what?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Level 6 mage selling his Sword of Thunder in my server for 10 Platinum.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Gotta love it  <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[Rentnil]

<DIV>Did you all see on the Test Server notes that all quest starters will be No Trade??</DIV> <DIV>hmm wonder if they will also move it to a corpse drop as well.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Edit: Actual text from Feb 25th test server update on Quests</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>- All items that initiate a quest have been changed to NO-TRADE.<BR></DIV> <DIV> </DIV><p>Message Edited by Rentnil on <span class=date_text>03-01-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:15 PM</span>

[Ni]

<DIV>NO TRADE seems like a bad fix. There are plenty of times where I just click Accept on a loot without examining it, figuring I can hand it to the person that needs it if necessary. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Whatever. There is way too much being made about Berik. </DIV>

[cfteagu]

<DIV>The problem with NBG is that it's not fair to the classes that NEVER need gear.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Think about it this way.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Pickup group fights for 5 hours.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Sword drops, Pally can use, gets</DIV> <DIV>Shield drops, tank can use, gets</DIV> <DIV>Helmet drops, cleric can use, gets</DIV> <DIV>....</DIV> <DIV>fricking any weapon or armor drops, caster cant use, caster dont get.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If your a caster, you get NO loot under NGB.  (and before you say spells, when's the last time you saw an adept drop that was actually for YOUR class?)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If the caster wins the sword, he's going to sell it to a tank.  So a tank is gonna end up with the sword anyways.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>For guilds, and for friends, NBG is great.  But for strangers in a pickup group, everyone should get an equal shot, even if it does mean dumb things like a caster with a sword and a warrior with a Master spell.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Jyste]

<DIV>This thread highlights why NBG really sucks and is a complete waste of time.</DIV> <DIV>Mentoring is gonna bring in a whole lot of other issues with regards to groups camping SH for this drop. Glad Ive done my AQ's because theres gonna be no mobs for people wanting to do these.</DIV>