Strategy question - What is the best way to pull (ie get monsters for the group to fight)

[shakako]

<DIV><FONT size=6>What's the best way for tanks to pull mobs?</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I have a level 25 Berserker and I do ok as main tank but I want to be better than just ok.  </DIV> <DIV>Most of the time I am not the main tank because I'm not normally the highest level tank in my group.  Because of that I get to see how other people pull and tank a lot which is a good learning tool.  I've noticed that most main tanks don't seem to talk much in group chat before pulling.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Most of the healers that I've talked to want to cast a spell on the puller before combat starts (for example-Ward).  Most of the tanks don't seem to give them a chance to do this.  I have an alt that's a druid and when I try to put heal over time on the puller before he engages, half the time it lands after he engages and I get agro.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>When I tank I like to ask before most pulls if people are ready, use a macro that says that I'm about to pull %t (to give a chance for reactives,wards,etc) and then engage.  That approach tends to result in fewer deaths but it also seems to irritate some because they want a constant stream of mobs.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>When I tank it's hard for me to know:</DIV> <UL> <LI> <DIV>When it's ok to pull or more importantly when it's not ok.  I don't know every buff for every class and I don't know what they all like to do before combat.  I have noticed that when I ask if they're ready that the one guy that I think is least qualified to say we're ready is normally the one that's first to say yes (for example the very common redundant tank) and the more important people (healers for example) wait a second to say they're ready. </DIV></LI> <LI> <DIV>Where the group is.  Sometimes the group follows me, some times they don't follow me and other times they started walking in the opposite direction. </DIV></LI> <LI> <DIV>What to say.  Right now I tend to ask if they're ready, give a notice right before I run off (for wards) and a notice when I got the mob chasing me.  Like I mentioned before many other tanks tend to say nothing or maybe give an incoming message.  What should I be saying?</DIV></LI></UL> <DIV>One last thing, Keep in mind that this isn't a message about Berserkers, class balance or what equipment to use (other than equipment used to get the monsers attention).  If you have something to say about that start your own post and say anything you want.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>When I use the word pull what I mean is: To start the engagement for the group.  Ie to get the monsters attention.  Not necessarilty to run off, shoot and arrow at a monster and come back with it.</DIV>

[Diabol]

<DIV>You kind of have to adjust things based on the difficulty you face, no fun in being over-disciplined when your knocking out green/gray for a quest for example... but, what you want to do is lay out a few ground rules.  I don't like complexity when I pull.  I use a simple incoming %t type macro, and i'm religious about it. If someone in the group wants to drop pre-pull spells, i just ask how much delay they want between my message and the actual pull.   I don't wait for spell effects or messages, because if nothing happens im not going to stop and say 'sure you dont wanna ward?' etc.  When necessary, I tell the group where to stay, how tight to be, and when to move with me.   As for readiness, I prefer to set a general rule that if no one has wait or afk and the healers are over XX% power (XX varies depending on the area) i'm pulling at my discretion until someone squeals.. i'll double check ready and remind people to buff if the target is a named/boss/etc that requires extra care.   If the group doesnt like to stay where they are told or the healers like to stealth-AFK it's time to find a new group, because I don't like to babysit between pulls.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Tych]

<DIV>When I'm the main tank and puller, it's my decision when to start an enouncter.  As long as the groups' health and power are looking good, we're all at the same location, and no one is afk, we're good to go.  I begin with a macro to alert my group that I'm about to pull.  (Something as simple as "Pulling %t" is fine, but you can get fancier).  I then pause for my group to cast their short term buffs, let scouts enter sneak mode, and wait for the healer's HoT/Ward/Reactive to land.  This is also their opportunity to tell me they're not ready.  Once the buffing is complete, I pull.  I don't worry much about giving others a lot of time to cast a bunch of spells.  They can each fit in one, maybe two.  There aren't really that many short term (less than 1 minute duration) spells that need to be cast anyway.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Obviously, this works better if you tend group with the same people.  It's not too difficult to explain to pickup groups, though.  Those who are a little slower on the uptake will figure it out after they keep drawing agro at the beginning of a fight.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>When I'm playing my mystic, I find it rather frustrating when the tank asks "ready?"  If I say yes, he attacks right away before I can cast my ward.  If I cast my ward first, he waits around for everyone to answer, letting the ward timer run out.  If I'm grouped with a tank that is dawdling, I just go ahead and cast my ward on him when I'm ready, and tell him "go."</DIV>

[Tych]

<DIV>When I'm the main tank and puller, it's my decision when to start an enouncter.  As long as the groups' health and power are looking good, we're all at the same location, and no one is afk, we're good to go.  I begin with a macro to alert my group that I'm about to pull.  (Something as simple as "Pulling %t" is fine, but you can get fancier).  I then pause for my group to cast their short term buffs, let scouts enter sneak mode, and wait for the healer's HoT/Ward/Reactive to land.  This is also their opportunity to tell me they're not ready.  Once the buffing is complete, I pull.  I don't worry much about giving others a lot of time to cast a bunch of spells.  They can each fit in one, maybe two.  There aren't really that many short term (less than 1 minute duration) spells that need to be cast anyway.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Obviously, this works better if you tend group with the same people.  It's not too difficult to explain to pickup groups, though.  Those who are a little slower on the uptake will figure it out after they keep drawing agro at the beginning of a fight.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>When I'm playing my mystic, I find it rather frustrating when the tank asks "ready?"  If I say yes, he attacks right away before I can cast my ward.  If I cast my ward first, he waits around for everyone to answer, letting the ward timer run out.  If I'm grouped with a tank that is dawdling, I just go ahead and cast my ward on him when I'm ready, and tell him "go."</DIV>

[los]

<DIV>On long pulls,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I hit anger from a distance</DIV> <DIV>Then hit the num lock key, run back to the group</DIV> <DIV>Hit Shout (on hotkey)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If enough time before hitting group, self buff or hit anger again</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Then next is Concussion which stuns the mob, enough time for a heal or ward</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Via this method, you already did 2+ hate on the mob</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>After concussion, taunting blow will be ready, hit that and you are all set.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Multiple mobs, follow with hold the line.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Dashel]

If you're grinding, asking before each pull is not a good idea. You need to develop a feel for it. You are basing it on a lot of things, how tough are the mobs, how easily do you take them down, what are the chances of adds coming in, do you have evac if things go really bad, how much power does your healer have...Get into a flow, start slowly, keep an eye on people's power levels. If you're in a rocking group that kills quickly and still has tons of power to spare and is looking for XP, pull as fast as humanly possible. My rule of thumb is if the healers are more than half power you're pulling too slow <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />As puller you need to judge the groups capabilities. I made a lot of friends at low level killing scarecrows in Antonica. I would pull, the Paladin would taunt off me to take agro and tank it, I would help kill it till about halfway then go off and have another scarcrow getting to the group just as the first one died. Why? Beacuse our group was slaughtering them easily and we could handle it. There were many dings that day.

[pen'cilli]

<DIV>I am normally in the same group.  But what we do is I "Stand Firm" and the SK pulls with some form of rang'd spell.  and then he runs back and I use shout or some form of agro grabbing.  And we go from there.  My group usually consits of, Me (zerker 23), Ripheart (SK 23), Lorik (Inq 23).  And we sometimes pickup 1 or 2 more but lay down the law before hand.  As long as you lay down the law before you start, I think you will be good with what ever you come up with.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>