AWWWW

[Super Du]

<DIV>sooo are you all ready for some nerfs?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>rawr, makes me worried what i'm going to log into after big patch...</DIV> <DIV>my guess is avoid around 40sh percent and mitigation somewhere in umm 55% region...</DIV> <DIV>hehe i have 62 avoid now and 77% mit lol... gonna be a riot... at least they are nerfing mobs too... maybe they won't hit as hard</DIV> <DIV>rawr</DIV>

[Sir_Halbarad]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Super Du wrote:<BR> <DIV>sooo are you all ready for some nerfs?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>rawr, makes me worried what i'm going to log into after big patch...</DIV> <DIV>my guess is avoid around 40sh percent and mitigation somewhere in umm 55% region...</DIV> <DIV>hehe i have 62 avoid now and 77% mit lol... gonna be a riot... at least they are nerfing mobs too... maybe they won't hit as hard</DIV> <DIV>rawr</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>If they are doing it right, the same raid should be able to do the same things after EoF changes as before them.</P> <P>And new equipment will be an improvement. That's the problem with a no-new-tier expansion. If everybody and their mum is at the cap, there is not much need to hunt for equipment upgrades.</P> <P>If they adjust "old expansion" mobs to the new values as well, you won't feel any difference in KoS - but feel an increased difficulty in EoF.</P> <P>That's IF they do it right <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P>

[BoneSmasher]

<DIV>I am at 74% mit overall self buffed without temp buffs.  I am waiting for my guard to copy over to beta I can check it out.  It will be very interesting I think to see just how they handle it this time around.</DIV><p>Message Edited by BoneSmasher on <span class=date_text>11-05-2006</span> <span class=time_text>08:53 AM</span>

[Daywo]

<DIV>Aye if they do it right we will be just fine. my avoid is at 66% Raid buffed and my mit is 6600 well over cap I think we will be ok, my only major concern is the DPS increase going to mage types. I have not seen a lot of hate gain for us yet to adequately compensate for this. If I were you all I would be less worried about mit and avoid and alot more concerned with being able to hold aggro on squishies. =)</DIV>

[BoneSmasher]

<DIV>Ha! Don't need to since they are getting more mit.  I say let 'em get whacked.  j/k</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I too am concerned about the scaling not only of the mit / avoidance but also the hate management.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It will be interesting to say the least.</DIV>

[Cykotik]

Just an example since NDA has been lifted. In the Live servers my standing % for mitigation is about 76% and 56% avoidence. In beta those numbers dropped to 59% mitigation and 44% avoidence.

[Docimodo]

<P>Yes the new cap is 10k odd which gives a max of 75% actual mitigation. </P> <P> </P> <P>Whats sickening is a swash in relic chain was reaching near 50% miti and im only like 10% higher in high end instanced and contested plate. </P>

[MyrdalGroenhart]

What i find really odd is that after LU29 is that it will take alot more mitigation lvl * 150 instead of lvl * 80 to reach the max for mittigation. so we will need alot of gear upgrades to even get to those values. And when we get to those values we are mittigating only 75% instead of 80%. That is if i am reading the latest description of the devs right. My understanding when the changes where first explained was that we would be able to go oer the 80% mit cap but that it would take alot more mitigation and that with my current mitigation my mitigation percentage would drop a bit till i get my mit up a bit again with the new equipment.so in the end after we get the end gear from this expansion we will be mittigating less damage then we are now.Hannu, 70 guardianSpirit of dawnsong, splitpaw.<div></div>

[Domiuk]

<DIV>The mobs are in theory being changed too though.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So a mob that used to hit for 5k damage with 80% mitigation might hit you for 1k</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>IF that mob now only hits for 4k damage at 75% mit you still get hit for 1k</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Of course you will now have less avoidance too so you will be getting hit more often ....</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>That swashbuckler example is worrying, as If avoidance takes the role  they were trying to achieve.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We get raid buffed plate tanks say at 65% Mit and 50% avoidance , Squishy tanks at 50% mit and 65% avoidance.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>But we might just get Swashbucklers at 58% and 58% actually being able to take the most punishment</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> there is a lot of room for them to mess up these changes <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[lostsandman]

<P>From what i am seeing you can't really compare Swashbucklers  (monks, bruiser) avoidance to plate tank avoidance when tanking epics.</P> <P>The dev has been saying that Block avoidance is better than all other avoidance so 20% Block avoidance (since only the mob lvl lower it and not its skill) is better than say 20% Parry avoidance so even if the display say they have more avoidance its not the end the story for epics anyway...</P> <P>Also i think we can increase the avoidance of shield by extra 4% with new trade skill stuff....</P><p>Message Edited by lostsandman on <span class=date_text>11-10-2006</span> <span class=time_text>02:37 PM</span>

[Docimodo]

<P>I simply compared a self buffed relic CHAIN geared swash's mitigation to my own self buffed nearly endgame kos PLATE gear mitigation. I get only 10% more actual mitigation. diminished returns ftw. </P> <P>how that 10% creates the massive increase in survivability that a tank should have over a dps class i don't know. </P> <P><SPAN class=time_text></SPAN> <P><SPAN class=time_text>And yes block is apparently going to be great for epic encounters but since when can't a swash use a round shield and the same tradeskilled block bonuses <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></SPAN></P> <P>unless you are confusing the example here. we are not discussing brawlers.</P><p>Message Edited by Docimodo on <span class=date_text>11-10-2006</span> <span class=time_text>06:42 AM</span>

[lostsandman]

<P>Pretty much all the plate tanks have the same mitigation now given equal gear. The mitigation form WIS line used to give Warriors an advantage but thats really gone now in that it only give 1.7%. We still have 2 short term mitigation buffs but SK have pretty much got 1 right now in EoF so they are not far behidn us  anymore.</P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[EpokSilvermo]

<div><blockquote><hr>Docimodo wrote:<div></div> <div></div> <div></div> <div></div> <div></div> <div></div> <p>I simply compared a self buffed relic CHAIN geared swash's mitigation to my own self buffed nearly endgame kos PLATE gear mitigation</p><hr></blockquote>There is a lot of jewlery out there that gives mitigation.What Jewlery did the scout have compared to you? Was the scout in <i>full </i>relic?What do you mean with "nearly endgame kos PLATE gear". Where you in <i>full relic and above</i> gear?</div>

[Judist]

<P>I forget if its the Swashy or Brigand (maybe both) that can AA spec for extra mitigation. A full set of T7 fabled chain will only get you about 3.1k mitigation. He may have been wearing alot of mit jewelry and spec'd to solo/tank.</P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[Domiuk]

<DIV>"HPs sit at 6800 (solo), mitigation 4k, avoidance 68%"  thats a decent equipped swash at the moment   solo.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Raid buffed for another 1500 mitigation. and extra avoidance i would be very interested to see his stats compared to both a well geared brawler and a plate tank in EOF.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Lol a paladin in his group might be able to give him 1k+ mitigation if there new buff stacks with the old one (paladins get a new 700 mitigation group buff that does not work on tanks)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>That would be 5600+ with just a paladin and a healer <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> add a conjurer and he is catching me up on mitigation and beating me on avoidance <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Oh and of course he will blow my dps out the water even though he is tank specced</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If numbers like a 1000 mitigation makes little differance past say 5500 and avoidance starts to make a real diffearance then swashies and Brigands will make really great group tanks.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[BetaMaster]

<DIV>Here is EoF logic (trust me it makes sense)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>All stat caps raised: This means that high end raiders get rewarded for having huge stat boosts... YAY I will no longer have 700sta that does nothing.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Gear is nurfed in mit:  Augments have been added to bring your gear back to it's old quality.  This rewards those who have the means to make their character well rounded and allows them to customize their play style even more.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>More gear will be added with better stats:  This will allow us to get even higher towards the new stat caps.  I have a feeling we'll be seeing scouts with 900+str soon.  Priests boosting their wis up to the 800s, mages with 800+int.  These things excite me.  Sweet, we're no longer bound by the low standards of the game.  I hate being capped... at least the cap is actually hard to reach now.</DIV>

[Docimodo]

<DIV>i mean exactly what i say. Having almost all of the highest mitigation pieces of gear except a few only gives me roughly 10% more actual mitigation than a bog standard relic geared scout... Im not talking about the actual number im talking about the percentage damage reduction from that number. I ofcourse have about 50% more mitigation in terms of the number but because of diminished returns it adds up to far less. I just think that is amusing.</DIV>

[Waldo2]

yeah I am ready to be nerfed again, maybe they will let brigands and swashies tank raid mobs too<div></div>