Berz better be MT and Guards OT ?

[Leo]

<div>HI friends,</div><div> </div><div>i am playing my guardian since beta of eq2. I played it when the guardians where loosers, when we were kings (pre lu 13) and nowdays. Always i am asking myself who ist the best raid tank, guard or berz. But let me tell the little story from the beginning.</div><div> </div><div>We started raiding t7 labaratory last friday, and the Tanks for the evening where a berz and me (a guardian) both lvl 70 with nearly the same mitigation, avoidance. He had a little more stats but i had much more resistenz and health.</div><div>Ok the maintank group wasn´t perfectly build, our templer was on vacation and our warden was sick. So i got the MT group only with, fury, inqui, mystic, paladin, and a dirge. Agro was not the problem and the first few trash mobs in laboratory went down very quick. When we came in the first bigger hall with the fearing boss, there were a trash mob group of 3 mobs.</div><div>First pull, all def stances on, tower of stone and mobs incomming. Got stunned on the pull and went down fast</div><div>Second try, we managed to find a tank spot where i had not to run so far. Same procedure als first one, got buffed and pulled the mobs in the corner. After a few seconds the mobs where tearing me down very quick, and the berz had to take over and fought till the end of the fight. Hmmm ok, pure luck.</div><div>Then we started to move into position for the first big named. Walking on, buffs on, tower of stone running. Mob incomming, and yes i stood around 1 min and then went down. The berz took over and stood very good till his mana was nearly to sero. then we zwitched again and i took the named again. Till then the adds of the named were down and i only had to tank the big one, but i went down again realy fast, and the berz took over again and tanked to the end of the fight.</div><div>Now the raidleader decide to switch the MTs and let me tell you something... he didnt went down so much.</div><div> </div><div>I don´t know why but i felt a little strange.</div><div>I made a few theories this evening:</div><div> </div><div>1) The healers got lazy and/or dont liked me for being the MT... naaahhh... ok my best friends the tempel and my rl frind the warden where not there.</div><div>2) When the Berz pulled i whent fast behind the mobs and casted Plant and the two debufing strikes on the mob. (all master spells). Maybe the berzerker had not done the same and i got the no real debuffs for the mobs when i started to build agro the first few seconds.</div><div>3) Also it seems that the mobs where tearing me apart and i got more dmg than the berz. I have no grey armor, maybe a few t6 legendary armor peaces and the berz who was the MT during t6 got more fabled, but miti and avoidance were nearly same.</div><div> </div><div>It seams to me that there is somewhere a bug, that helped mobs to ignore guardian stances, armor or avoidance.</div><div> </div><div>Has someone a clue why it could be so ?</div>

[JeffBship]

<div></div><p>It's not a class issue.  I tanked those guys at 68.</p><p>I few suggestions...</p><p>1.  Look closely at your gear.  You said you have a 'few pieces' of T6 fabled.  Does that mean that you've upgraded to T7 except for a few, or that you have T6 non-fabled and a few fabled?  T7 gear from single group mobs and quests is way better than T6 fabled...and it's not to hard to get.  Look for other threads here, one of them lists some good gear drops.  For jewelry, make sure you have enough with you so you can get to the resist cap (80%) for any given damage type.  Note that the resist cap is based on the mob's level, not yours.  So when you have 7000 heat resist and it says 80%, that's against a level 70 opponent.  For an orange mob, say level 74, you can add a few hundred more till you're capped even though it won't show. (guessing on the numbers there, I'm at work)</p><p>2.  Look through your parsing.  If you don't have a parser I suggestAdvanced Combat Tracker ( <a target="_blank" href="http://home.maine.rr.com/eqaditu/ACT/">http://home.maine.rr.com/eqaditu/ACT/</a> ) but I'm sure there are others.  I like that one because you can import your log files from previous raids and analyze the fights.  It will break down the combat into damage types, particular spells, graphs and pie charts and such.  Use it to see what the greatest portion of the damage to you was coming from, then adjust your gear accordningly.  It helps if you keep some short notes on each mob.</p><p>3.  Order killed can count for a lot.  You can analyze this with the parser too.  In general kill highest dps first, or maybe healer if they have one.  I don't have my notes with me, but I remember the trash group by that named had a Thaumaturge in it that did a lot of AoE, and I think a LOT of poison and disease damage.  So switch to poison/desease gear and kill him first.</p><p> </p>

[mochl]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Leos2 wrote:<div> </div><div>1) The healers got lazy and/or dont liked me for being the MT... naaahhh... ok my best friends the tempel and my rl frind the warden where not there.</div><div></div><div>3) Also it seems that the mobs where tearing me apart and i got more dmg than the berz.</div><hr></blockquote>You have to watch out for those pesky Ravagers in the Lab. The have Brigand abilities and just like the mobs in Halls of Fate, they can take your mitigation down to nothing in a heartbeat. I actually ended up having our MA zerker take a Debilitate hit for me on a couple of pulls, after that we switched to having a Conjuror pet pull which seemed to work out really nice. The Debilitate move only seems to get used once during the encounter and doesnt require special positioning. There are also some Endbringers towards the end that are either Brigands or Monks (look at the their weapons to tell). Just make sure you have a healer watching out for Trauma effects so they can cure it asap.</span></div>

[ZoriouzBlaze]

<div></div>Remember, cures are as good as heals. Those KoS mobs have some nasty dots so reactives reactives reactives, make sure you have them before each pull. If you dont get the reactives and cure fast you will melt like butter, I dont care what class you are.

[Wabit]

<div></div>ehh i've gone down on the pull a few times there...  second guard, paly, SK, whoever can pick them up and tank it np...  its honestly the brigand mobs that are killin you...  cures are needed as soon as the effect comes up...  dispatch + debilitate = 0 mita

[ZoriouzBlaze]

<div></div>Very correct, I think thats your problem. Also, let a monk pull to you <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> haha

[Leo]

<div></div>Thanks for all the answers. Next friday out berz will tank those mobs from the start on. I will parse what is going on and then get the clue what was wrong.

[OriginalIrongno]

<div>I have the same problem currently...</div><div> </div><div>I am for the first time depressed as a guard, I never had a real complaint about my class and enjoyed tanking.  However for the first time (btw I know about the debuffs) I found myself with extreme difficulties tanking a mob that should not be hitting me for the damage they do hit me for.</div><div> </div><div>I think there is something else maybe less noticeable for some of you? Maybe you have more healers to counter the damage?  I dunno what it is I am missing but I know its not the gear, I watch my mit and stats during combat (persona "p key&quot<img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> and it seems well not seems I see mobs that are even cons and below tearing me to ribbons.</div><div> </div><div>Again its not a gear issue, its not a debuff issue and I have more healers than before...</div><div> </div><div>Example besides the raid zone Lab, in HOF as compared to PP in DOF.</div><div> </div><div>A 65 Orange con ^^^ barely touches me, Cazel with people you know and 1 healer is a joke...  Now comes a instance (laggy as all H E L L) that mobs which are even cons lower in some cases hit like a truck.  Now it bugs me that I cannot tank something thats an even con. I made my guard to be the mit hog with the hps to back it up.  Not for DPS not for anything more than what they are a WALL for the group or raid. Being hit for 15,000 with out being debuffed on mit, some how surviving then being hit for 8k and dieing... makes no sense. Where is the 15k hit coming from, I wish I had taken [Removed for Content] of the whole thing un folding. I am level 70 and the mob is level 70...  I have T7 fabled and legendary 1 slot t6...  This makes no [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] sense.  It's frustrating enough to just say hell with it till next LU and play my ranger which I don't see the real nerf effects /shrug perfectly playable class <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.</div><div> </div><div>Have a nice day, again I am not [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ing I am just confused and tired of their "fixes" also [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] is with giving SK's and Pals tower shields. way to slap us in the face.  /rolls his eyes.</div><div> </div><div>Later guys.</div>

[aislynn00]

<div>Vanquishing Blow and Hammer Fist do hit extremely hard in Halls of Fate--I have been single-rounded on a few occasions due to a 15,000 damage hit. </div><div> </div><div>I don't think that is a class issue, though.  It is simply a matter of Halls of Fate being a challenging high-end zone, something I have been sorely missing since I switched to EQ2 a year and a half ago.  Am I the only one who misses the challenge level (I played a paladin in EQ1) of Tipt, Vxed, Kod'Taz, Ikkinz, and so on?</div>

[Belce]

<div></div>Could it be due to front loading of damage by the big targets?  Just like us I guess they get slow refresh big hits as well.  You started the fight, took the big hits and the zerk played cleanup.  Considering the refresh on the big hits you may have took it may not even qualify as a save.  

[AZZER01]

<div></div><p>While we are on the topic of Vyemm's......any advice on the triplets? The Reaver lays out big dps and HT's...the Ravager stuns and the Prophet fears. Any tips on the order of mobs and how to deal with the fear?</p><p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><p>Azzer</p>

[Wabit]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>AZZER01 wrote:<div></div><p>While we are on the topic of Vyemm's......any advice on the triplets? The Reaver lays out big dps and HT's...the Ravager stuns and the Prophet fears. Any tips on the order of mobs and how to deal with the fear?</p><hr></blockquote><p>with one none crusader tanking it all...  sanctury on pull + chain cures (had sanctury break on me the first hit i took), burn prophet, burn the scout mob (hits hard for cold), yawn at the tank...  just gotta out heal them...</p><p>we've sent a beefed up conj tank pet pet to eat the inital onslaught (really starting to like the planer shifted tank pets)...  sacrifical monk works better though...  if you have a well rounded raid, have a crusader offtank the prophet (antifear AA)...  the fight is more difficult that the next few named encounters...  its about middle of the road difficulty for named in the zone...</p>