a guardian tank?? you must be kidding me...

[Demoniac]

<DIV>ok.. I am not [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ing you guys.. your class is totally [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ed up...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I am an inquistior. we trying to kill the third name mob for silence city access quest. we wiped 9 times ( the gear was repaired for sure ) we don't even hit that mob to 80%..  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>we had a full fable difiler, me? geb, invokor robe, prismatic weapon, mind of battlement ring for sure.. another 3-4 piece of heavy armor from vaz'gok and solosek's fist.. we are not uber but we just ok..</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>the problem is very simple. we can't even hit that mob to 80%. then me and the defiler ran out of power. very very simple..</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>ok..:smileysad: same group. we use the monk ( he doesn't even have a single fable on.. some of them not even legendry) tank the mob.. we killed that sob at the first try...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>guys.. no more guardians.. no more.. priest offences, mage defences... I would quit this game rather than group with a guardian. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>hope sony can fix this soon</DIV>

[Demoniac]

<DIV>you guys should do something to sony... the situation is completely unacceptable... </DIV>

[Raahl]

<P>Wow.  It almost seems like the guardian must be doing something wrong.  </P> <P>I knew we were a broken class, but not that much.</P> <P> </P>

[TanRaistlyn]

<P>Finally another class came in and said what almost all Guardians have been saying since revamp...Im sure Gunga and Gaige will come in and say that its not true, but perhaps if other classes start speaking up something might get changed...I havent played my Guard in 3 days, and I am GUILD leader and MT of our guild...its sickening is what it is...</P> <P> </P> <P>Covenant</P>

[Poochymama]

I belive that all the plate tanks need to have their mit increased a tad to compete with the brawlers.

[Demoniac]

<DIV>well you know what I feel.. think about your raid..</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>A guardian.. the best tank in this game ever... I am asking myself are you gonna raid with these guardians? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>lol.. you must be kidding me.. I would rather to get my corpes myself under the Kru'thak spawn point. at least, that sounds much easier.</DIV>

[Demoniac]

<DIV>I dunno what happened to you guys...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>look at the hitpoints. 6000?? ok 7000?? what happened?? even I can get 5000...you guys missing a buff?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>look at their aggro.. taunt? lol they called it taunt lol... I asked the tank what the heck going on with you? can you taunt? he said I did I swear I taunted.. but the mob resisted. then I got interruped..I cast it again. then stun..after that I was knocked back. [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] it.. I am like.. :smileysurprised:</DIV>

[TanRaistlyn]

<P>If there was a petition Id sign it...But not sure if anyone cares about the Guards Woes'</P> <P> </P> <P>Covenant</P>

[Derwille_Oasis]

<P>First off, i agree that guardians took it on the chin with the update, personally im back to playing my original char (wizard) for now, however, i dont see how you can whipe 9 times on that quest, we did it a few nights ago, with 5 people (51 guard, 51wiz, 51warden, 50 templar, 49 conjuror) and while i agree it was a bit hairy at times its by no means impossible. Afaik none of us wears more than 1 piece of fabled. The named is pretty easy to root while you do off with adds, and land some debuffs.</P> <P>Guardians need some re-tuning for sure, either their avoidance needs a big boost, or their mitigation needs to scale up much more. Guardians should be the best possible defensive tank class in the game, period. However, once you get into the new mindset of playing i honestly dont think guards are in too bad of a shape. From a wizard point of view, guard aggro seems to have gotten a very nice boost (assuming guard is using maddening defense master2 atleast), [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] near impossible for me to pull aggro now unless i deliberatly dont assist etc. First few fights after changes we got our [Removed for Content] kicked something awful, but after a few nights of working out the kinks of the changes, most heroic mobs 1 level below orange con isnt peticularly hard. And even most high yellow named are doable.</P> <P>The main thing is to loose the gung-ho attitude, the time of being able to charge into huge clusters of yellow mobs, and being pretty much immune due to defense buffs is over, and other classes abilities is now much more valuable in taking down tough mobs. Stuns/stiffles go a long way to making high yellow named doable. The guardian of today is more like the warrior of eq1 than the powerhouse of earlier eq2, still a good tank, but in need of support classes to really shine.</P> <P>That being said, i dont see myself logging onto my Ogre guardian for a while, mostly cause im enjoying my wizard again with the changes, but also because guardians got the bat so badly as they did. However its not really a catastrophy imo, a bit of tweaking of the tank ability of guardians and they are back as the most desirable tank for big game hunting. It does seem like the alot of the changes was meant with high end raiding/fabled guardians as a measuring stick, but im pretty confident that once things settle down some, we'll see improvements of the classes who's left in the dark atm.</P> <P>Just my 2cp</P> <P>Alsosprach Zarathustra, 51th Erudite Wizard, [T R], Oasis</P> <P><A href="http://eq2players.station.sony.com/en/pplayer.vm?characterId=264146206" target=_blank>http://eq2players.station.sony.com/en/pplayer.vm?characterId=264146206</A></P> <P>Gaap Toof, 50th Ogre Guardian, [T R], Oasis</P> <P><A href="http://eq2players.station.sony.com/en/pplayer.vm?characterId=328345206" target=_blank>http://eq2players.station.sony.com/en/pplayer.vm?characterId=328345206</A></P> <P> </P> <P> </P><p>Message Edited by Derwille_Oasis on <span class=date_text>09-22-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:08 PM</span>

[Gungo]

<DIV>news flash that guy is a caster who nukes for 4-6k ice comets. if you dont stun stifle interupt him he will 1 shot any tank. adding mittgation will not help the gaurd. you need a enchanter or some other stunning class (cough monk) in order to tank him.</DIV>

[Shizzirri]

<DIV>Inquistor's heal??? You must be kidding me!</DIV>

[Dagsxx]

<DIV>I bet the OP is a guardian in disguise.  They'll do anything to be king of the hill again.  Pathetic.</DIV>

[Raahl]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Dagsxx wrote:<BR> <DIV>I bet the OP is a guardian in disguise.  They'll do anything to be king of the hill again.  Pathetic.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>What's pathetic is non-guardian classes coming to the guardian forums to tell guardians what's wrong with their class.   </P> <P>Upping our mitigation will not make us "king of the hill".   It will fix one of the issues that the guardian class has.</P>

[Gungo]

the point is he was tanking a caster mob w/o controling the guys nukes.  an 3 up heroic npc that you let ice comet the main tank will drop him in 1 shot.

[Corv]

    One thing they are making much more extensive use of in DoF is mobs that auto-attack for non-trauma damage.  (Trauma is crushing, piercing and slashing meelee damage)  When you see a mob that "hits you for XXXX points of poison damage", that mob is dealing damage that your avoidance and mitigation do absolutely nothing against.  Your avoidance *and* mitigation versus non-trauma damage is calculted entirely from your spell resistance to that damage type.      I don't recall anything about the mob you're speaking of, but there are a good number of  mobs in the Living Tombs that hit for non-Trauma damage.  If you were fighting such a mob, your Guardian's armor would have been functionally useless other than for the resists it had.   If his resist against the mob's auto attack damage type was much lower than the monk's then he would have gotten hit both more often and for more damage than the monk.  (Monks' defensive stance offers a significant ammount of either poison or disease resistance.  I forget which)      Against Trauma-based mobs, guardians still have an edge.  Against mobs that hit for non-trauma damage, resists are king.   While I think non-trauma boss mobs are nice to throw into the game in *rare* instances, they're now using them as yard-trash.  (e.g. The spectres in Sinking Sands hit for disease damage)   This is why you see mages with high disase resist tanking those better than guardians!   Ostensibly, non-trauma mobs were put in specifically to take specific tanking jobs away from Guardians and hand them to other classes who have stances which grant them resistance versus that damage type.   In practice, if your guardian keeps a couple packs of resist gear on hand you can get by pretty well.  Ironically, for many fights we now have to doff our fabled plate and put on whatever trashy treasured crap we've found that has the right resists for  the job.  It can even be cloth armor.  The resists are all that matters. <div></div>

[Gaige]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Corvan wrote:<BR>  (Monks' defensive stance offers a significant ammount of either poison or disease resistance.  I forget which)  <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>We get mental, which is pretty useless imho so far.  Bruisers, on the other hand, get poison.</DIV>

[Raahl]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Gaige wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Corvan wrote:<BR>  (Monks' defensive stance offers a significant ammount of either poison or disease resistance.  I forget which)  <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>We get mental, which is pretty useless imho so far.  Bruisers, on the other hand, get poison.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Guardian's is Fire.

[Pry]

<P>Nothing gives SOE a message like an ol' kick in the moneybags!  </P> <P>After 6 years of playing SOE products, thinking like 2 $30 expansions a year, $12 a month, 3 games at $50 apiece...</P> <P>It's about $300 bucks a year or so that they can kiss goodbye.  I know, it's not much, but $300 x 100 subscribers is a pretty big number and $300 x 1000 subscribers is a cool 3.5 million dollars. </P> <P>Fix my guardian and I will come back.  But they won't so eh, $300 buys a lot of beer!</P>

[Raahl]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Prynn wrote:<BR> <P>Nothing gives SOE a message like an ol' kick in the moneybags!  </P> <P>After 6 years of playing SOE products, thinking like 2 $30 expansions a year, $12 a month, 3 games at $50 apiece...</P> <P>It's about $300 bucks a year or so that they can kiss goodbye.  I know, it's not much, but $300 x 100 subscribers is a pretty big number and $300 x 1000 subscribers is a cool 3.5 million dollars. </P> <P>Fix my guardian and I will come back.  But they won't so eh, $300 buys a lot of beer!</P> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Not to rain on your thought, but your math is off, 300 x 1000 is 300,000.<BR></DIV>

[Pry]

Oh yeh, well $300,000 is a lot of money too <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[TanRaistlyn]

<P>I suppose we could all sign a petition, and mail it to SOE, whos got a pen and paper??</P> <P> </P> <P>Covenant</P>