I want some strategy input for 'my' group.

[Thor]

<DIV>I play regular in a group with friends of mine.<BR>The group consist of 5 players:<BR>me, Guardian lvl 31 (just dinged 31)<BR>a lvl 29 Berserker<BR>a lvl 31 Conjurer<BR>a lvl 32 Warlock<BR>a lvl 32 Templar</DIV> <DIV>I'm getting better and better to keep aggro and take it back from some of the others except the Berserker.</DIV> <DIV>I have a macro I use to tell my group when I believe I have full aggro control, but maybe I'm to quick to use it?<BR>When do I know I have built up enough aggro to keep it?<BR>I'm not sure if zerker gets into the battle to quick. If that's the reason why he sometimes get aggro.<BR>It happens often and I have difficult to get it back. Any advice what to do?</DIV> <DIV>For some time ago, someone in the group came up with the idea that the Berserker should not assist me, instead he targets the mob directly when single mobs or when multiple mobs, he start to beat one of the other in the encounter. Is that a good strategy?<BR></DIV> <DIV>I also wonder if it makes any difference how the different groupmembers are positioned during the fight? </DIV>

[Wulfe]

<P>The problem with most other melee players is that they want to join in fast and they want to join in good. And yes, I am talking about the fighting part. So they assist and start to fight with their best damage hit when they could join in with just simple push of the attack key and then slowly put little more effort to it. Instead they land that big kick or something and you end up wasting power for those taunts to get agro back...</P> <P>I've noticed that easiest way for me to get agro back from Monk is to land vengeful strike and hit with retailiate. I usually get it back right away without using any other taunt skills. I dont have the pleasure to group with berserker very often.</P> <P>Wulfeen 47 Guardian</P> <DIV>edit: some typos</DIV><p>Message Edited by Wulfeen on <span class=date_text>03-17-2005</span> <span class=time_text>06:22 PM</span>

[Grond]

<P>Well if I wanted to be cynical I'd say wait a few weeks till the damage nerf on fighters.  :smileytongue:</P> <P> </P> <P>If I have trouble with aggro I normally pull with my short duration buff then spam high dmg attacks and taunts.  Problem with the short duration buff is the re-use time tho.  Of course with your set up I don't think it will be a problem since you'll have to rest a bit after every fight if you are killing strong mobs.  If you aren't killing strong mobs (like killing blues/greens) then don't worry about it.  The mobs won't hit enough for it really to be an issue.  Personally I'd like a second short duration buff line.  It would really sure up any big aggro problems that I have... course I guess that wouldn't be any fun.</P>

[ugl]

<P>The problem is not yours, its the zerkers...</P> <P>Good zerkers rarely ever take aggro, bad zerkers do it all the time...</P> <DIV>Eventually they figure out how to off tank without stealing aggro, but usually dont get it till the forties...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I think its called "rage" or something, but not sure, I am no zerker expert.   But, I have grouped with alot of bad, and alot of good zerkers..</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>A good zerker knows when to pour it on and when not too, just like a wizard/warlock...    If your using your AE taunt as soon or before the pull gets to the group, and using group buffs (during the pull), and he still taking aggro, he is the one that needs to be posting on the zerker forums...    </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>(Note this ais a fairly commong problem around level 30.  A zerker that steals aggro is destroying yer power trying to taunt it off him, and destroying the healers/buffers power trying to keep him standing till you get aggro back)   Chastise him a bit and have him talk to some higher level zerkers about what the problem buff he is using, and how to use it effectively. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>A good zerker is a good character to have in your group.</DIV>

[Ender]

or you can just let the zerker tank. lol.

[RafaelSmith]

Sounds like the Zerker isnt playing "smartly". Of course what would I know..ive made it a point to only group with those not under the Fighter tree.. Makes life and my job really easy =P Of course my girlfriends Fury is always competing for Aggro =P

[Saradine]

<DIV>"my" group is set up close to yours =)</DIV> <DIV>31 Guard (me and I just dinged too LOL)</DIV> <DIV>29 Templar</DIV> <DIV>29 Monk</DIV> <DIV>29 Conj</DIV> <DIV>30 Ranger</DIV> <DIV>28 Mystic</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We normally go for the normal groupage. I tank they dish out the damage. The mystic is in charge of the HOs for the priest side. Of course there are a bunch of different stuff we do but some of the more "off standard" stuff we do:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We commonly use a "anchor" setup with pullers. (anchor = me HTL/dig in)</DIV> <DIV>Monk normally pulls for multi mob pulls</DIV> <DIV>Ranger snare pulls the ++ heavy hitters.</DIV> <DIV>I assist the pullers and hit my ranged auto attack button. HTL works through ranged FYI.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I cast intervine on the puller. Sometimes on tricky pulls I use other damage soaking skills for him.</DIV> <DIV>Monk keeps Staggering Stance up for me, he never uses it for himself (adds 25% avoidance)</DIV> <DIV>We use team speak so we cycle all of the knock down attacks to keep the mob on its back most offten. (cant cast/special attack for the ground)</DIV> <DIV>4 way heavy hitting HOs of course</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>One thing you might want to let your DPS crowd know is this. Healer mana is what sets the speed for your group. If it is burned on some glass cannon that doesnt understand agro then you are shooting yourselves in the foot.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The #1 job for ANY DPS class is learn not to get agro!.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Ask them to ramp up slowly to max damage output. Once you go through 2-3 rounds of taunts (with HTL engaged) they can dump the kitchen sink and can't take agro. But if you have to fight for control from the start, you burn your mana up faster too. A side effect of doing HOs (esp if you finish them) it paces the damage output so that is scales with your hate. (So it seems).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Eal]

<P>        The problem is each class has a high agro attack. Our main one  is Vengeful strike. They are just too dense to realize this and they keep hitting it, building agro. Backstab is one and beserkers have attacks that mimic ours. If you dont believe me, try this on a raid. Wait until a Raid Mob gets to about 50%. I am using this to illustrate, you can do it at anytime and it will draw the same outcome.</P> <P>Once the Mob is 50%, hit vengeful strike by the second time you hit this in a row. I can garauntee you will get agro. This is even more of a problem with classes that have other ways of generating agro such as high dps combined with high agro attacks.</P> <DIV>If you are in a guild. Tell your guild mates to learn their class and find out which attacks generate most agro. This doesnt mean they cant use them. They just need to regulate them. You can tell who they are because its always the same person.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Tower</DIV> <DIV>Lvl 50 Guardian</DIV> <DIV>Legion/Najena</DIV>

[Thor]

<DIV>The warlock sometimes get aggro but I can usually take it back without to much trouble.</DIV> <DIV>But in 99.9%, I can't get aggro back once the zerker got it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What do you think about the strategy we started to use some weeks ago, that the Berserker fight the mobs without assisting me?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also, does it makes any difference how the players are positioned around the encounter during the fight?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Eal]

<P>     This is called multi-tanking or Offtanking and it isnt a very good idea in a single group. This tactic is used when you have multiple mobs in a raid encounter. Since AE taunts do not work on raid mobs it becomes necessary to have one tank attack the adds while you keep agro on the Raid Mob. Otherwise the second you finish killing the adds in the group, the Main mob will break free since you never put any agro on him and he agros the rest of your raid party, usually the healers.</P> <P>Positioning only affects directional attacks from the Mob. Does nothing for Agro. Except you of course since you are infront and are doing less DPS because he is blocking and parrying.</P> <P>Tower</P> <P>lvl 50 Guardian</P> <P>Legion/Najena</P>

[Rorrak]

<DIV>As far as strategy input, just make use of all of your aggro generation tools:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>- Don't stop using taunts that have their own timer just because they gray out.  Taunting Blow still generates a few hundred hate at 37 so I still use it in my cycle of taunts. </DIV> <DIV>- If it's a multi-mob group always encounter taunt on incoming</DIV> <DIV>- If you want to be an absolute perfectionist about maximum hate always pull yourself.  A 200 damage bow shot or hate from entrench gives you a little head start on your group</DIV> <DIV>- Use Hold the Line whenever possible.  33% chance to proc 16x hate (at Adept III, Adept I is 15x hate) is good.  Faster weapons are better for using Hold the Line.  Cancel it before the fight is over to have it ready for the next encounter, you can do this in your maintained spell window (alt+m if you don't see one)  Once you get it Topple is great with Hold the Line for holding aggro on multiple encounters since it's not encounter only like Bury, plus it puts a 5% slow on everything it hits, which helps.</DIV> <DIV>- Use your short duration buffs to really solidify aggro.  Toughness and Battle Cry can generate a mass of hate for everything engaged with your group.  Any buffs with less than a minute in duration are going to give you a nice hunk o' aggro.  I like to line these up next to rescue in case I need to pull aggro off someone in a hurry. </DIV> <DIV>- Damage abilities are good too, but I don't focus on them as a major source of aggro, as I've found if you want to fight a damage battle with mages/scouts we're always going to lose.  Taunts/Buffs are the way to go, but if you've used them all and still need aggro then use the highest damage abilities you have.  Stun abilities supposedly have a little more aggro associated with them, as do DoTs.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Good luck.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>- Rorrak</DIV>