New Traits

[TunaBoo]

Tier 1 Choicesxxx = Aoe Dotxxx = Attack with Chance to StifleUthros's Defiant Cry = Group Buff to slashing/piercing/crushing/spell avoidanceI took Uthros Defiant Cry, as I don't need level 10 attacks at level 33. Worthless like the others, it only buffs crushing etc. by about 5 points. I have better spells.Tier 2 ChoicesBriteblade's Thudnerous Crash - Deals Crushing Damage and drains power over time on a hitKisa's Ruinois Blast - An Extra attack that decreases the target's attack technique and agility on sucessful HitsBraksan's Crippling Slam - Stuns the enemy for a short time. It requires a shield.Slate's Protective Stance - Slightly decreases offensice skills and increase def. and parry skills.Again seem to be repeats of stuff I already have better of. I took slate's as it was the only interesting one. Shares timer with dig in and soldiers stance, seems to be a souped up soldiers stance. Would have been nice back in the day, not much to see now. Dig in is better.Tier 3 ChociesBriteblade's Command - Increases the defense skill and stamina of the partySeloxia's Daunting Cry - Increases hate towards the guardian and lowers the damage and attack speed of all enemies in an encoutnerSlate's Invigorating Threat - An axtra atack that increases hate with the target and increases the guardian's attack speed on a sucessful hit.Anrey's Precise Stike - Launches an extra attack that ignores the targets armor class.This one is tougher. Don't care about a new true stike. I had to choose between a better call of command, a new aoe taunt, or a new taunting blow type spell. Already have AOE taunt adept3 so no luck there. Because of command pressance at 40, I took Slates. Does NOT share timer with taunting blow, I now have two taunting blows to chain for aggro + their effects. very very cool spell.<p>Message Edited by TunaBoo on <span class=date_text>01-06-2005</span> <span class=time_text>02:52 PM</span>

[Zakre]

<DIV>hmm i agree on teir 3 will be a tuff choice .. deffinitely one of the taunts though. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Im 29 Orge Guardian heres what I took and what it did </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>start</DIV> <DIV>52 stamina </DIV> <DIV>1631 HP</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Durable </DIV> <DIV>56 sta</DIV> <DIV>1654 hp</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Rallasion Conditioning</DIV> <DIV>61 sta</DIV> <DIV>1682 hp</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Sturdy</DIV> <DIV>61</DIV> <DIV>1724</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>War Ready </DIV> <DIV>61 sta</DIV> <DIV>1774 hp</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Enduring</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>65 sta</DIV> <DIV>1798 hp</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Tier one I took Uthro Defiant Cry for the spell avoidance. </DIV> <DIV>Teir 2 I took the Slates protective stance. I know we can max defensive but this added some parry also. I might regret this later I know that stun will be a tatic as in EQ.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Tazr]

<DIV>And the reason for 1 star??</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thanks for sharing your opinions bro.  Whats up with aoe tuant on tier 2?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>- Taz</DIV>

[Zakre]

<DIV>hehe wasnt me but ill 5 star you ...probably an upset Zerker <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[TunaBoo]

People 1 star too much.Stun is [Removed for Content] as any hit unstuns the target. I don't miss that <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> That aoe taunt is cool, but if you already have adept3 shouting cry, it is hard to lose some hate for a little bit of an enemy debuff.

[Emb]

<DIV>I gave ya 5 stars to counter the 1. Just the info I was looking for.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thanks,</DIV> <DIV>Embol</DIV>

[Tazr]

<DIV>Tuna, wouldnt it depend on how much hate the trait generated, maybe its more than adept 3 shouting cry?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hard to tell that I guess without playing with it, any feedback on this would be great as AE tuant is my biggest pet peave <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>- Taz</DIV>

[TunaBoo]

Yah it is hard to tell.In any case, Slate's Invigorating Threat attack is on its own timer. I can use it all the way to 50 if I want.. while taunting challenge will get upgraded, I can still have Slate's Threat to chain with it.

[Tazr]

<DIV>Plus its a neat combat art <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>- Taz</DIV>

[TunaBoo]

I didn't mention, but its 38 power 1 sec cast 10 sec recast. So you can chain it pretty fast. Does same damage as taunting challenge (43ish for me).

[Mig]

Seloxia's Daunting Cry - Increases hate towards the guardian and lowers the damage and attack speed of all enemies in an encoutnerI took this one at 32. It does damage and attack speed, where shouting cry doesn't do both. Also just because it's an AOE taunt doesn't mean you can't use it on a single target!As for the other abilities, they pretty much get replaced with everything by the time you hit 30ish.Not really a bad thing, my hot key bars are full anyway.

[TunaBoo]

Same timer as shouting cry? And shouting cry does get replaced.. I also suspect adpet3 shouting cry is more hate and the speed debuff doesn't do jack like most of our debuffs... still a very good choice for people not wanting to adept3 shouting cry.

[Mig]

Same timer.

[ArgosyAxeGrind]

<DIV>I must be in the minority, but I am seriously eyeing thies one for our tier 2 ability:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Briteblade's Thudnerous Crash - Deals Crushing Damage and drains power over time on a hit</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>One of the biggest problems is when we get "hit" by a MOBs special attack -- no amount of AC and mitigation will help you with that. I would love to chain this ability with concussion and take out the mob's special attacks early on. Has any other guardian considered that?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>For the T3 selection, I definetly agree that you probably can't go wrong with either of the hate increasing traits. I would tend to think that in terms of generating aggro, the one that increases hate and debuffs the enemy's attack speed would generate more hate than the other one (which solo generates hate but increases DPS). But if you tend to solo fairly often, it may be to your benefit to increase your attack speed <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR></DIV>

[TunaBoo]

Prob is that attack will be on the same timer as concussion, doesn't say extra attack. All it adds is a chance to stiffle on concussion, which batter already has. DOesn't do much.

[ArgosyAxeGrind]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> TunaBoo wrote:<BR>Prob is that attack will be on the same timer as concussion, doesn't say extra attack. All it adds is a chance to stiffle on concussion, which batter already has. Doesn't do much.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> If it's on the same timer, then I agree with the majority that the defensive buff/stance is the way to go. I was *hoping* it could be alternated as second mana/draining ability <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[TunaBoo]

So far the only ones on diff timers say EXTRA attack.

[Jesper]

Well I went a bit different.Tier 1Took the AoE DoT. At 32 the aoe I use is bury. It works great. It is only a encounter aoe and once in a while I need a True AoE ability. Belive it or not we only got the fighter aoe to use.Ability is grey but with HTL It might just be the one ability that actually help.Tier 2Took the power drain. I missed the logic about extra attack so was disappointed at first. But my batter is only app1 and orange (have not mastered it) So getting a blue adept II beefed up power drain works for me.. atleast for now. Will probably upgrade to batter when its upgraded and I got more levels.Tier 3This was a tough one. As Tuna my choices was between the two taunt abilities. I ended up with the Encounter taunt. Hope I did not miss out. Shouting cry was adept 1. But this one reduces the damage of all mobs in an encounter. Great for those big encounter groups. Ruins of Varsoon springs to mind.Slate's Invigorating Threat sounds cool. It is on a seperate timer from taunting challenge. Probably a far better ability when faced with big boss mobs and soloing.Had I not missed the thing about abilities being extra attack/upgrades I would probably have choosen Slate's Invigorating Threat as its a self haste. Desperate flurry uses way to much power for me.Granbar Mountaintall32 Guardian28 AlchemistRunnyeye

[TunaBoo]

Our old AOE taunt reduced damage of all mobs as well. This just added AOE slow... imho slow doesn't do a lot but I cant parse a spell I dont have.

[Belce]

<DIV>Debuffing mob attack speed does tend to be a big agro boost for us.  </DIV>

[Azry]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Migyb wrote:<BR>Seloxia's Daunting Cry - Increases hate towards the guardian and lowers the damage and attack speed of all enemies in an encoutner<BR><BR>I took this one at 32. It does damage and attack speed, where shouting cry doesn't do both. Also just because it's an AOE taunt doesn't mean you can't use it on a single target!<BR><BR><BR>As for the other abilities, they pretty much get replaced with everything by the time you hit 30ish.<BR><BR>Not really a bad thing, my hot key bars are full anyway.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>This ability is incredibly nice, the added reduction of attack speed gives it a huge aggro edge over shouting cry. Its working beautifully.<BR>

[Wulfe]

<DIV>I chose this one:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Briteblade's Thudnerous Crash - Deals Crushing Damage and drains power over time on a hit</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It hits about 55 crushing damage and then drains 4 x 33 points of power. And it really works quite well when soloing. Fought some greens and after two hits woth BTC they were out of power. Dunno how usefull it is later on but atm its neat <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>lv30 Barbarian Guardian</DIV>

[Axs]

As a lv25 Guardian I picked Uthros' Defiant Cry and Slate's Protective Stance. Uthros the upgrade to Call to Arms and running on the same timer as Guardian's Call, and Slate the upgrade to Soldier's Stance. Here's some hard numbers for anybody interested.First off, my natural stats:Crushing: 37/125Piercing: 75/125Slashing: 125/125Defense: 125/125Parry: 125/125Spell Avoid: 125/125Uthros' Defiant Cry Evaluation:Using Call to Arms (Apprentice I, 45 power cost):Crushing: 39/127 (+2)Piercing: 77/127 (+2)Slashing: 127/127 (+2)Using Uthros' Defiant Cry (55 power cost)Crushing: 42/130 (+5)Piercing: 80/130 (+5)Slashing: 130/130 (+5)Spell Avoid 129/129 (+4)Using Guardian's Call (Apprentince I, 60 power cost)Crushing: 40/128 (+3)Piercing: 78/128 (+3)Slashing: 128/128 (+3)Parry: 127/127 (+2)Evaluation: So as an upgrade to Call to Arms, it succeeds and also adds to Spell Avoidance to boot. And oddly enough, it's ALSO better than Guardian's Call, which is in theory gained 13 levels later. However, the increase is really pitiful (unless +3 to these stats is really good, I'm not sure how the mechanics work). They run on the same timer, but you can use both Uthros and Guardian's Call to get both the Spell Avoidance and Parry increase (but they don't stack, you stupidly only get the +5 to the attack stats from Uthros). I don't really regret picking it, but it's only marginally better than Guardian's Call, and it sounds like the other attack choices may be better than this.Slate's Protective Stance Evaluation:Using Soldier's Stance (Apprentince III, 39 power cost)Crushing: 33/121 (-4)Piercing: 71/121 (-4)Slashing: 121/121 (-4)Defense: 130/130 (+5)Parry: 129/129 (+4)Using Slate's Protective Stance (40 power cost)Crushing: 37/125 (-0)Piercing: 75/125 (-0)Slashing: 125/125 (-0)Defense: 131/131 (+6)Parry: 129/129 (+4)Evaluation: Unless the other choices are REALLY good, this may be a fantastic ability until Dig In comes along, and possibly better if the defense buff of Dig in doesn't justify the speed hit. It's pathetically better than Soldier's Stance (just a +1 to defense), but there's NO offense hit, which I've got a bad feeling is a bug, and it sounds like it should, just less of a hit than Soldier's Stance. Here's where it may be great. I've got Call of Command at Adept I. With Slate up, I only get a +1 to defense, which is pathetic. So, since none of our defense buffs stack (which is bloody [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] in its own right, but that's another discussion), you can just throw up Slate and not have to touch any other defense buff for 12 hours. Of course, this is all under the assumtion that the lack of an offense hit is not a bug.Well, there ya go. My two cents from just another Guardian. I hope this info is helpful to anybody deciding on what to pick for training. And, if any of my numbers are off, just let me know and I'll double check I've got everything right.

[ThramFalc]

<DIV>I think you will find that upgrading guardians call to at least adept 1 is your best option as far as that line of arts goes.  Also, the Stance line is useless as Call of Command gives all the defense you need.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I have found that the first 2 tiers are mostly useless to me as a 34 guardian.  The tier 1 AE is on the same timer as Bury but may be useful if I want to proc HTL for as little power as possible.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I took the tier 2 power drain because its more effecient atm than batter.  I assume as I grow into batter it will get better but atm it sucks because it costs so much power.</DIV>

[Jesper]

Thanks for correcting me Tuna.It does add slow and not damage reduction.As for the extra agro. Well its a adept II version. Unless you got a adept3 shouting cry its better any day of the week.So the benefit is an extra slow ability. Do our slow effekt stack ?? We got quite a few by 32. All in the same tier.AoE slow is still nice. In the end it means they swing less. Even if its 10% slow that still means they swing 9 times in a 10 swing period. Ill take all the mitigation I can get.Really shine against large encounters.In the long run im sure that the agro+haste attack will last longer as its a extra attack. Hope they give something similar at level 40.Granbar Mountaintall32 Guardian28 Alchemist

[TunaBoo]

as I said I had adept3 aoe taunt already, so I was not going to downgrade to an adept2 taunt with slow.. but if you dont adept3 aoe your situation is different.

[n9in]

<DIV> <DIV> <DIV>Anyone know if Briteblade's Command and Commanding Presence Stack?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Urthos and Call to Arms do... just share the same recast</DIV> <DIV> </DIV></DIV></DIV>

[TunaBoo]

The def portion won't I imagine, but the other stuff WILL both show up (and it is on same timer so you gotta dink with it).

[Geothe]

<DIV>Personally, for the tier 2 trait.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I went with Kisa's Ruinois Blast.  It is an upgrade to Mangle.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I find it works really nicely.  For one, it does about 50% more damage on the swing than the mangle style itself.</DIV> <DIV>And it marvelous when you are fighting a single large mob with a group... the normal attack speed debuff... and then an agility debuff on top of it.. making the mob easier to hit for the group.  And, 2 debuffs plus an 100-ish HP hit (for a lvl 24 guardian) generates a lot of hate <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>