To switch or not to switch targets in order to take aggro?

[derfrae]

This is my first post after having read these forums for quite a while so I'd like to say hello! =)I have a question on which I'd like to have some opinions of other guardian/tank players. Imagine the following scenario:You pull a group of 3-6 mobs, do the usual AE taunt, buffs etc. in order to establish aggro but the healer was again too fast with one of his high aggro spells and all the mobs start bashing him. As your only taunt/hate abilities remaining are now single target you only manage to pull one or two mobs off the healer. So you now have to constantly switch from one target to the next in order to regain aggro one by one. This is made worse by the fact that Shouting Cry has finally come back up, you use it, but it has no effect. So back to single target taunts.Now also consider that you are assist leader and people who assist you will change targets with you. Which means that the whole group will fail at killing off specific mobs one by one. I guess many tanks will agree that this is detrimental up to the point that it can cause a group wipe.My question now is: What would you do in this kind of situation? What is in your opinion the best way to handle it?Now I usually keep switching and taunting targets because im not comfortable if half the mobs in an encounter are hitting someone else instead of me. There have been groups where I got some praise for my "great tanking" because of this behavior. On the other hand I happened to be in a group yesterday where I did nothing differently but was told to stop switching targets in a rude manner and even explaining that I wanted to taunt didn't help. They even took my attempts at explanation as offensive and "newbish" and I was from then on the secondary tank to a pally.I guess my problem is that I am not yet used to the EQII style of assisting where people target your character and automatically attack AND switch targets with you. As opposed to the old Assist-Macro where people would hit a button, assist your current target and stay on that one until it fell.I'm eagerly awaiting your opinions![Edit: Please excuse my bad English as it is not my native tounge. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />]<p>Message Edited by derfraenk on <span class=date_text>12-26-2004</span> <span class=time_text>05:51 AM</span>

[ThramFalc]

<DIV>In situations where you need to taunt multiple mobs its best to have a different player be the main assist.  Typically this will be the scout or possibly a mage.  If I know a fight is going to be tough agro wise I make sure to always spell this out to my group.  I tank but you assist the other guy.  The other guy gets his initial target from you but after that he stays on that target no matter what you do.</DIV>

[Hip]

<DIV>Good thought that, making the MA someone else in the group in a tough aggro situation.  It happens, either with healers or when a nuker lets a big one go a little too soon...and I usually wind up switching off, grabbing the agg if I can, then diving back to the mob we were engaged on first to get it dead.  Complicated and not always successful...I think I'll give that plan a try. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[Rob]

<DIV>Ok here is my oppinion as a 33 Ogre guardian... When i am main tank in group its this rules that apply: I am only initial assist that mean´s that everyone that is supposed to interact whit the mob have to make a /assist <name> macro button. since its my jobb to hold aggro and the rest of the groups jobb to kill it i dont want to have group members that have me in target whit auto attack on. if group can´t apply to this i simply leave or have the group member that doesnt listen kicked.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>just my 2cp</DIV>

[Zazz]

<DIV>The /assist macro, which I have, is a very EQlive idea but I think it works well here.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What I do in group where I am both the MA and MT is hit my assist macro so everyone stays on the current target and then hit [tab] to scroll through the targets quickly then when I have the one I want, I get off a few taunts or whatever to regain aggro. If there is more than one mob on the someone else, try casting a few buffs. They create a good amount of aggro for all the mobs. You also might want to throw a protection ability on the person being attacked, for example sentinal (but there are other opitions).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Good luck.</DIV>

[Zazz]

<DIV> <DIV>The /assist macro, which I have, is a very EQlive idea but I think it works well here.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What I do in group where I am both the MA and MT is hit my assist macro so everyone stays on the current target and then hit [tab] to scroll through the targets quickly then when I have the one I want, I get off a few taunts or whatever to regain aggro. If there is more than one mob on the someone else, try casting a few buffs. They create a good amount of aggro for all the mobs. You also might want to throw a protection ability on the person being attacked, for example sentinal (but there are other opitions).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Good luck.</DIV></DIV>

[derfrae]

Thanks to all of you for the feedback. There have been quite a few good tips and I will try them out. Especially the strategy with making someone else main assist. That sounds to me like the best solution in a scenario like that. The only problem with that is that I play mainly in random pickup groups and thus will have to explain it again and again every time I enter a new group. But I guess it's worth it if it will save my group's day in such unpleasant situations.

[Dar]

<DIV><FONT size=2>The best recommendation I can make in a situation like this is 'Hold the Line'.  My friend and I join groups together quite often (26 Guardian/26 Warden) and I can not tell you how many times this spell has saved the healers.  The second I know a pull has gone bad I throw this spell up.  If you haven't been using it regularly I would highly suggest giving it a try.</FONT></DIV>

[Dahntahl]

My recommendation is to expand your vision of what gives aggro.You have much more tools in your arsenal then simply the taunts with which to generate aggro. Remember all the group buffs you get? Well... turns out the little critters you're fighting really don't like it when you use those.So first thing.. use those at the beginning of a fight if you're tanking multiple creatures.. it will make it a lot less likely that they will break off and start attacking your healer.Secondly - once a healer or group member has gotten aggro'd.. throw those protection skills on the person that got the aggro. This will help you retrieve aggro without needing to switch to attacking the other creature, staying on your primary target.I guess going back to your initial question.. how to best handle it. Best way to handle it is to learn how to build up aggro better so that the other group members do not steal the aggro. I'm not sure what level you are now.. but I would recommend practicing now because if you are losing aggro to overhealing now just wait till you get to the higher levels cause you start taking a lot more damage, and will need a solid understanding of how aggro levels work for your class. A tank does no good if he's constantly trying to regain aggro. Figure out how to keep aggro now and that will stay with you the rest of the game.