Happy Guardian

[Zilo]

<DIV>I read lot of complain posts about Guardians and i was wondering if I am one on the few Guardians that:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Can find a group easy (through friends and by turning my LFG flag on, sometimes people send me tells for joining groups even if I am not LFG which makes me really happy).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Can keep aggro on me without a problem.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I am now lvl25 and i really enjoy EQII by being a Guardian.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[LaraE]

<DIV>You are being ridiculously selfish here.  Sure, you're happy.  Thats fine, but there is something bigger at stake than just YOUR happiness.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Its obvious to many many more experienced guardians that there are some fundamental issues (flaws) with the relative versitality of the guardian and berserker subclass.  namely, the berserker is twice as versatile as the guardian.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Both B and G have a "tank mode" in which they are equal with the same gear set up.  However, the berserker also has a DPS mode that the guardian lacks.  Basically, by playing the berserker, you have double the functionality of the guardian, which just plain isnt fair.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The question is, how much extra tankage is that DPS fuction worth? 5%? 10%?  some people think even 1% would be unfair because on a raid mob that 1% extra tankage would matter alot..i.e. berserkers getting the no thank you.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I think it was SOE's intention that guardian protection mode would balance with the berserkers offense mode.  Unfortunately, guard skills are garbage.  They flat out dont work.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>HRH Elle Stormwind, Hunter of Gnolls, Hunter of Undead, Giantslayer, Wood Elven Princess, Antonican Beauty Queen, Norrathian Gossip Monger, Guardian of Qeynos, Fighter of Feydark, Willow Wood Warrior, and Supreme Commander & Chief Justice of the Feysteel Legion</DIV>

[Jenlaana]

<DIV>lol... SHAME ON YOU FOR BEING HAPPY!!!!  How selfish of you!!! haha.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Wow this forum is amusing. lol.... I'm happy too for the most part.   But then, I don't troll these forums looking for a place to complain, so perhaps I'm missing the opportunity to be miserable about my class.  =P</DIV>

[LaraE]

<DIV>The above post proves that ignorance (of the guardian issues among other things...) is indeed bliss.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Elle Stormwind</DIV>

[Jenlaana]

<DIV>Oh get over yourself.  This is JUST A GAME, and it is not a crime to enjoy it.  Just because people do not want to cry and whine like a little girl doesnt mean they're wrong.  I had time in Beta to play various classes before choosing a guardian, and if I didnt like it, I would just pick another class.  heh... god get a life already.  </DIV><p>Message Edited by Jenlaana on <span class=date_text>12-08-2004</span> <span class=time_text>04:45 AM</span>

[Medow]

<DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2>"</FONT><FONT size=2>But then, I don't troll these forums looking for a place to complain"</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2>Isn't that precisely what you just did?</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV>-Medowin</DIV></DIV>

[Azry]

<DIV>I think you can be happy with the class and still want to see some improvements. We are still struggling with the basic issue someone raised: zerkers were balanced vs guardians because they were conceptualized as not being able to don heavy armor. Adding that into the factor they have everything we have + DPS. There is a simple fix that doesnt require any nerfing: give us more hp/dmg mitigation vs. higher con mobs, especially red con. This would allow us to slip nicely into the raid tank position I think the class was designed to fill.</DIV>

[GenesisForgot]

Hell I love my character but I'd like to see a few changes. Its not whining when a huge number of players agree that their class has slight problems and it isn't bad for them to ask for their class to be improved (I've never called for a nerf).I don't want to see guardian's made the warriors of EQlive but I would like to see my guard spells be more useful or give me more information (target is out/in range, what spell is accomplishing, etc etc) since they are the backbone of this class.I was considering what would make the guardian really superb and I think an ability that triggers like bloodlust but defensively to build aggro like bloodlust would be cool and fit the class theme.

[Ainm]

<blockquote><hr>Azryal wrote:<DIV>I think you can be happy with the class and still want to see some improvements. We are still struggling with the basic issue someone raised: zerkers were balanced vs guardians because they were conceptualized as not being able to don heavy armor. Adding that into the factor they have everything we have + DPS. There is a simple fix that doesnt require any nerfing: give us more hp/dmg mitigation vs. higher con mobs, especially red con. This would allow us to slip nicely into the raid tank position I think the class was designed to fill.</DIV><hr></blockquote>No way. I really hope they do not want Guardians to "slip nicely into the raid tank position" you think the class was designed to fill. Anyone who played EQLive at a high level for years knows what a foolish mistake this would be. If Guardians need any more tweaks, it should be along the Protection line. I do not want to have to tank every uber in the game with one class. It was ridiculous in EQLive and it would be ridiculous in EQ2.

[Dalthenn]

Ha! I just went over to the warriors forums in Wow - to see how different they are from guardians; well, let me tell you - I'm glad on this side!! <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />You can check this out on your own : http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-warrior&t=10483&p=1&tmp=1#post10483

[Jenlaana]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> <DIV><FONT size=2>"</FONT><FONT size=2>But then, I don't troll these forums looking for a place to complain"</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2>Isn't that precisely what you just did?</FONT></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Actually, I was just saying that I was happy with my class.  I thought it ironic that someone making a nice, friendly post about that fact got ripped apart for it without a single constructive response (from the original responder).  </P> <P>Someone said they were happy and the response was:</P> <HR> <P>  You are being ridiculously selfish here.  Sure, you're happy.  Thats fine, but there is something bigger at stake than just YOUR happiness.</P> <HR> <P> Nobody said anything about anything beyond being happy with the class.  There was no insinuation about expecting any action, or expecting the world to think that way... nothing.  Just a nice simple statement to the positive.  I'm not sure why its so hard to accept at face value.  I was pretty shocked to see the crude response and said so, thats all.  I thought it was amusing.  And in response I was called ignorant, heh.  It was uncalled for, thats all.</P> <P>That being said, no class is perfect, and I would not expect everyone to like or dislike anything.  I think constructive feedback to SOE and within the Guardian community is great.  It's how we learn and grow as a class.... and is the specific reason why I came to check out these forums.  Of course, with the lack of a flames board, I guess its to be expected that those comments spew over somewhere... sad but expected.</P> <P> </P> <P><EM>"I do not agree with a word you say, but I will defend to my death your right to say it" - Voltaire</EM></P>

[Avadale]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> LaraEQ2 wrote:<BR> <DIV>You are being ridiculously selfish here.  Sure, you're happy.  Thats fine, but there is something bigger at stake than just YOUR happiness.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Easy there Lara, the OP never said that things shouldn't change, just they were having fun. Stating that one is having fun is not selfish. Frankly, I found the post a refreshing break in a sea of discontent.<BR>

[freg]

<DIV>I think everone is entitled to their oppinion about this issue here, but complaining about other people having fun and calling them "rediculously selfish" ??! That's a load of crap to me. Ziloth just goes with the game and have som fun, that's what it's all about isn't it? Don't like the class? Don't play it.. Just don't take a huge dump on people that likes the game. I'm becoming a Guardian soon. Ziloth is one of my reasons that I'm going to be.. I'm in guild with Ziloth and I'll tell you, he's one of the most dedicated players around.. he's always online! :smileyhappy:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Ghorm of Immortal Spirits.</DIV><p>Message Edited by fregor on <span class=date_text>12-09-2004</span> <span class=time_text>08:41 AM</span>

[SiferJam]

<DIV>I'm in the same boat as the OP. My guardian is also level 25 and alot of fun! I feel in no way inferior to berserkers. I accept the game dynamics as they are and spend my play time actually playing and enjoying my toon. I'm really annoyed that people will be so selfish as to call for another class to be nerfed because of their own inadequacies in playing their own class. I have no trouble holding aggro when I want it. If I'm grouped with a higher berserker, I usually let them be MT and use my abilities to be the best bodyguard there is, which is also alot of fun.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Honestly, Lara, you're an idiot. Sorry, I don't like personal insults - but you're a total idiot. Berating someone for enjoying themselves and hijacking the thread for your own issues is selfish. I've yet to see an ability "flat out not work", maybe if you were more specific...? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The whole "THERE IS SOMETHING BIGGER THAN YOUR HAPPINESS AT STAKE" makes me angry and laugh at the same time. You sound like you're on some sort of rebellious crusade. Its totally pathetic that you're blinded by your own ignorance and you're seemingly too stubborn to accept the fact that there are some of us out there that really enjoy this class and the playstyle it is currently designed for.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Get over yourself and your inferiority complex. I suggest you get off the forums and start enjoying the game as is.</DIV>

[vaalen]

<DIV>Well you are 25. I have a 38 guardian and i tell you, this class needs some serious work. </DIV>

[bjo]

<DIV>im 34 and i dont see why everyones complaining either..im happy with my class too. </DIV>

[NissaClo]

<DIV>I am a very happy Guardian also i have read every thing i need to know how to play a guardian and i dont lose agrro as well.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>You negative people if game to hard there is always WOW its very cartoony and easier to play, and youll probably do better there.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So if ya dont want to learn ya class and how he is used and plays with other classes then dont play just my opinion.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So, i dont get how because we know how to play a guardian we are selfish.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Should just call us smart</DIV><p>Message Edited by NissaCloud on <span class=date_text>12-09-2004</span> <span class=time_text>08:11 AM</span>

[SiferJam]

<DIV>So you're telling me everyone around 25 and whining about the class is wrong, that we're actually balanced at the moment, but we're not at 38? Did you feel inadequate at 25? Where does this imbalance begin?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Like I said, I have no problems with aggro being taken off me, which is possible when grouped with a berserker unless I work hard to keep it. With the "Guarding" abilities I have I just switch roles to assisting the MT.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The perception that the guardian is "OMGWTFBBQ weaker" is unfounded in my opinion. I can only conclude that people came into the class thinking they'd be the one and only "uber tank", taking all the damage at little or no risk all the time and that no other tank could compete. They then find out they're pretty equal with other tanks and this whole inferiority complex starts...</DIV>

[a6eaq]

<DIV>You do have a second function if you bother to understand your role!  WE are there to PROTECT the casters of our parties!  Have you even bothered to look at your abilities... they are not solely Tanking, you are there to keep the casters and other DPSers alive numbskull, this does not have to be done by Tanking!  If you do not have aggro  Ihave news for you as well...You are in a DPS mode!  Do you really play this game LaraEQ?  Or have you played a Guardian.  The problem is that a lot of EQ1 lifers want there to only be one Tank and EQ2 is NOT designed to operate that way.  Look up the definition of Guardian and play that role, it might not be a Tank.</DIV>

[lailoken]

<DIV><FONT face=Century color=#33cc00 size=3>I agree with the last couple posters and the OP. I myself am looking forward to playing the guardian role, in whatever way I can to best help "guard" the group. Not be the only tank, but be the only one to help redirect damage to myself. I mean look at our skills stuff like intervene is very cool and now i know that is  warrior skill but I think it only begins to help a gaurdian understand his role as "guard".</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#33cc00 size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#33cc00 size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#33cc00 size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#33cc00 size=3>LVL 17 warrior can't wait to be a guardian </FONT></DIV>