Ganak Flag takes 1/5th of the match time to run. Without being hit.

[Corydonn]

<p>Topic. Since now the game is just a deathmatch and who has the better team.</p>

[Lethlian]

<p>Seriously Ganaks is ridiculous now. The speed <em>NOW</em> after today's update is snail slow and in all honesty its not even worth picking up the flag. Ganaks has turned into a <em>automatic 20 minute death match</em>, with the better parsing team, winning at the end of 20mins....how do I know this, because I was on that team that with winning score of 223 against 134 at the run out time ending the match....and that was just the first ganak of three so far that have gone the whole distance of 20 mins.</p><p>You need to adjust flag speed to be at least a little faster or otherwise its going to continue to be a race of DPS/kills to the 20 minute finish line.</p><p>Also while on pvp topic, I may not be helping myself by saying this per-say (seeing I'm not a healer), but healers get blown up like their not even trying to heal themselves. <em>Prior to this update</em> I agree, it should <em><strong>not</strong> take 4 to 12 toons to kill one healer</em>, but now even the respectable healers that play bgs get dang near get one shot....so its not fun killing them like thier nothing either.</p><p>Just my two cents from what I've noticed playing BG(s) today, as I'm limited only to playing bgs by being a guk toon.</p><p>Respectfully,</p><p>Lethlian</p>

[Delethen]

<p>It's unquestionably ridiculous.  It's basically not even capture the flag anymore it takes so long to 'run' it in.</p>

[Snoops]

<p>It really blows my mind why they decided to reduce the speed even further. The speed prior was just about perfect, it gave anyone that was really paying attention to notice and react when their flag was picked up, and it didn't take the entire match to run the flag two times.</p><p><cite>Lethlian wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Also while on pvp topic, I may not be helping myself by saying this per-say (seeing I'm not a healer), but healers get blown up like their not even trying to heal themselves. <em>Prior to this update</em> I agree, it should <em><strong>not</strong> take 4 to 12 toons to kill one healer</em>, but now even the respectable healers that play bgs get dang near get one shot....so its not fun killing them like thier nothing either.</p><p>Just my two cents from what I've noticed playing BG(s) today, as I'm limited only to playing bgs by being a guk toon.</p><p>Respectfully,</p><p>Lethlian</p></blockquote><p>^This. They say they've upped base heals but honestly I can't tell the difference. My group ward goes up for only around 16k WHEN it crits, and when it doesn't it's like I haven't casted anything at all. I have 370 crit in PvE which my ui reports around 50 in PvP. Heals that don't crit barely move health bars, and forget it if i have more than one dps focusing me and TP or channeling isn't up (sometimes even if they are) I'm pretty much dead. Too much reduction of heals imo.</p>

[Delethen]

<p><cite>Snoops@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It really blows my mind why they decided to reduce the speed even further. The speed prior was just about perfect, it gave anyone that was really paying attention to notice and react when their flag was picked up, and it didn't take the entire match to run the flag two times.</p><p><cite>Lethlian wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Also while on pvp topic, I may not be helping myself by saying this per-say (seeing I'm not a healer), but healers get blown up like their not even trying to heal themselves. <em>Prior to this update</em> I agree, it should <em><strong>not</strong> take 4 to 12 toons to kill one healer</em>, but now even the respectable healers that play bgs get dang near get one shot....so its not fun killing them like thier nothing either.</p><p>Just my two cents from what I've noticed playing BG(s) today, as I'm limited only to playing bgs by being a guk toon.</p><p>Respectfully,</p><p>Lethlian</p></blockquote><p>^This. They say they've upped base heals but honestly I can't tell the difference. My group ward goes up for only around 16k WHEN it crits, and when it doesn't it's like I haven't casted anything at all. I have 370 crit in PvE which my ui reports around 50 in PvP. Heals that don't crit barely move health bars, and forget it if i have more than one dps focusing me and TP or channeling isn't up (sometimes even if they are) I'm pretty much dead. Too much reduction of heals imo.</p></blockquote><p>Have to disagree with that, i've seen shamen since the patch that have been nigh on impossible to kill.</p>

[Lethlian]

<p><strong>Delethen wrote:</strong></p><p>Have to disagree with that, i've seen shamen since the patch that have been nigh on impossible to kill.</p><p><strong>Lethlian writes:</strong></p><p>Yeah well now that I've played more now <em>(for what its worth</em>), it seems to vary a little bit from healer to healer tbh. Inq's and temps seem to be getting hammered more easily, while the shamens do relatively well. The one thing it has done is make toughness and lethality more important if you want to live or not die.</p><p>Hard to say, need to play for a few more days and see how other healers (that come to mind) handle the pvp action (I know corny) but yeah as of now its a case by case for the healer (and that person who plays them)</p><p>Respectfully,</p><p>Lethlian</p>

[Sinupox]

<p>  1000% slow for holding the flag in ganak? It seriously takes something like 4-5 minutes to run 1 flag without any fighting. This was a bad change in my opinion.</p><p>  Previously then only time I've seen the flag being carried faster than normal was once when I was holding it. The fury in my group cast cheetah and I have 40% in combat run speed selfbuffed, which put my runspeed a little over the flags detrimental cap. The other time I've seen the flagger run faster than normal a bard was carrying it, and I think he got an improved bolster+cheetah. Perhaps make the flag detriment only as strong as the complete sum of available professional based incombat speed buffs? Or just change it back the way it was....</p>

[Balrok]

<p>No possible way this was ever tested.  lol</p>

[Peak]

<p><cite>Delethen@Mistmoore wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Snoops@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It really blows my mind why they decided to reduce the speed even further. The speed prior was just about perfect, it gave anyone that was really paying attention to notice and react when their flag was picked up, and it didn't take the entire match to run the flag two times.</p><p><cite>Lethlian wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Also while on pvp topic, I may not be helping myself by saying this per-say (seeing I'm not a healer), but healers get blown up like their not even trying to heal themselves. <em>Prior to this update</em> I agree, it should <em><strong>not</strong> take 4 to 12 toons to kill one healer</em>, but now even the respectable healers that play bgs get dang near get one shot....so its not fun killing them like thier nothing either.</p><p>Just my two cents from what I've noticed playing BG(s) today, as I'm limited only to playing bgs by being a guk toon.</p><p>Respectfully,</p><p>Lethlian</p></blockquote><p>^This. They say they've upped base heals but honestly I can't tell the difference. My group ward goes up for only around 16k WHEN it crits, and when it doesn't it's like I haven't casted anything at all. I have 370 crit in PvE which my ui reports around 50 in PvP. Heals that don't crit barely move health bars, and forget it if i have more than one dps focusing me and TP or channeling isn't up (sometimes even if they are) I'm pretty much dead. Too much reduction of heals imo.</p></blockquote><p>Have to disagree with that, i've seen shamen since the patch that have been nigh on impossible to kill.</p></blockquote><p><p>Right. Shamans. The only healers that were arguably super strong before this "nerf", so now they're just somewhat strong rather than stupidly strong. But the other healers? It's an absolute joke.</p><p>It was still super easy to keep people alive on my Shaman. Sure, with "increased" base heals my group ward seemed much weaker, and the same pre-nerf heals when it crit... But on a Fury I played? Absolutely impossible. No chance at all. I didn't try my Inquisitor, but I'm guessing it's not much different.</p><p>When your heal doesn't crit, it does absolutely nothing. A 1K ticking hot? Terrible. 2-3K single target heal? That is absolutely nothing when classes are hitting for 15-20k. And 50-60% of the time, your sh^t doesn't crit at all, so you are worthless.</p><p>Who thought this was a good idea? Fire them.</p><p>And lol @ non-healer classes outhealing the healer classes now. Good work, homies. Better roll a Shaman, because they're the only classes worth healing on.</p></p>

[apwyork]

<p>There's also no health recover anymore.  Unless you have a spell or ability to heal you, whatever damage you take isn't going away until you die.  It's the SOE way, take something players might be enjoying and screw it up so bad everyone stops.</p>

[Wanic]

<p>I understand you wanted to make speed buffs null in Ganak while carrying the flag, but its ridiculous.</p><p>You're essentially walking, infact last night i had to check in case i accidentally turned it on <img src="/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>It needs changing (again but right this time?), and as previously said its just a 20 minute deathmatch now, unless you all fight together up and down with the flag.</p>

[Shredderr]

<p>I agree it is now whoever has the stongest team and can overpower the other . Strartegy, tactics have no place I have won several games that we were getting owned by the other side by distraction methods and whatnot but I guess the devs play this also... unable to think they must want their raid toons to have not just an advantage but an airtight advantage. I have came back to the game after being gone for almost 6 months and I guess I am leaving again having all my toons on the pvp server and it being obvious SOE doesn't care about my 2 worthless accounts I have had since the cap was 50 .</p>

[Corydonn]

<p>This would be all fine and dandy if you could press a flag throw button and throw it to a point on the map and the closest player within 5 meters automatically catches it or it will fall on the groun and return like normal as if dropped by another player! Or something.</p>

[Yimway]

<p><cite>Exur@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>No possible way this was ever tested.  lol</p></blockquote><p>But SoE are players too, certainly they understood the effect -1000 runspeed would have and the results are exactly what they intended.</p><p>I do agree with others, this map is now just a brawl and the flag is pointless.  You only run the flag if the other team has given up and is no longer feeding you kills at faster rate.</p>

[Omougi]

<p>It shouldn't be this slow.  Taking a look into it.</p>

[CharityCase]

<p><cite>Atan@Unrest wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Exur@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>No possible way this was ever tested.  lol</p></blockquote><p>But SoE are players too, certainly they understood the effect -1000 runspeed would have and the results are exactly what they intended.</p><p>I do agree with others, this map is now just a brawl and the flag is pointless.  You only run the flag if the other team has given up and is no longer feeding you kills at faster rate.</p></blockquote><p><span style="color: #cc99ff;">I agree, they couldn't possibly have tested this in any constructive way, or they would have stabbed themselves in the eye with a dull stick rather than wait the full time it takes to walk the flag to the other side of the map.</span></p><p><span style="color: #cc99ff;">With this and with the way the clerics can now barely heal their way out of a wet paper bag, BGs are once again something not to be enjoyed.  It was such a brief, happy moment.</span></p>

[Xzerius]

<p><cite>Exur@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>No possible way this was ever tested.  lol</p></blockquote><p>Absolutely agreed!!!  Un-tested  and totally broken.  It's harder to kill a sorcerer than it is a shaman now  AND  this -75 run speed in Ganak is absurd.  Go back to -35 for ANYONE carrying the flag.  It was fine before, the problem was people using racial speed or  spell speeds to get higher than the -35 run speed.</p>

[Davngr1]

<p>it's ok if it stays this slow as long as all you need to do is cap it once.   so players just gather around their flag and protect him while they try to kill the other.</p><p> it would give it a different spin for sure but a death match wouldn't be a bad idea either but you need to make it higher points for kills.  like 10 per kill, that's 40 kills for the win.</p><p> yes, that sounds a bit high but that would also make it detrimental to die.</p>

[Delethen]

<p><cite>Omougi wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It shouldn't be this slow.  Taking a look into it.</p></blockquote><p>Feel free to take a look at the broken swashbuckler CAs while you're at it.</p>

[Snoops]

<p><cite>Delethen@Mistmoore wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Snoops@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It really blows my mind why they decided to reduce the speed even further. The speed prior was just about perfect, it gave anyone that was really paying attention to notice and react when their flag was picked up, and it didn't take the entire match to run the flag two times.</p><p><cite>Lethlian wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Also while on pvp topic, I may not be helping myself by saying this per-say (seeing I'm not a healer), but healers get blown up like their not even trying to heal themselves. <em>Prior to this update</em> I agree, it should <em><strong>not</strong> take 4 to 12 toons to kill one healer</em>, but now even the respectable healers that play bgs get dang near get one shot....so its not fun killing them like thier nothing either.</p><p>Just my two cents from what I've noticed playing BG(s) today, as I'm limited only to playing bgs by being a guk toon.</p><p>Respectfully,</p><p>Lethlian</p></blockquote><p>^This. They say they've upped base heals but honestly I can't tell the difference. My group ward goes up for only around 16k WHEN it crits, and when it doesn't it's like I haven't casted anything at all. I have 370 crit in PvE which my ui reports around 50 in PvP. Heals that don't crit barely move health bars, and forget it if i have more than one dps focusing me and TP or channeling isn't up (sometimes even if they are) I'm pretty much dead. Too much reduction of heals imo.</p></blockquote><p>Have to disagree with that, i've seen shamen since the patch that have been nigh on impossible to kill.</p></blockquote><p>If people just keep wailing on a shaman with tp up then yeah, they're still hard to kill. The defiler's death prevent still procs as many times as the duration of the spell. They're both dispellable temps that couldn't crit in the first place but pretty much keep you from dying even if you're being spammed with interrupts. You can get lucky with channeling if it procs enough from the prestige ability. Every one of our general heals are super underwhelming now and get interrupted just as often as before. They should have looked into altering some of the priest abilities that were allowing people to stay alive with 5+people beating on them instead of generally applying a reduction to everyone in the same way. My group often dies now before I do, because I have to use my emergencies to keep myself up and my other 7 heals are barely worth casting.</p>

[Bjerde]

<p><cite>Omougi wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It shouldn't be this slow.  Taking a look into it.</p></blockquote><p>It is like you have crouch on, it is ridiculous. Thankfully you are looking at it quickly.</p><p>With no interference and in as straight a line as possible, it took me 3min 44seconds to go from one flag to the other.</p>

[CharityCase]

<p><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva; color: #cc99ff;">Picking up the flag and having no interference, it takes just shy of 4 minutes to crawl from one end of the map to cap it.  With any kind of interference at all, it can be a good 10 minute slog to drag that banner home.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva; color: #cc99ff;"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva; color: #cc99ff;">Also ... when the non-healers are saying how bad the healer nerf is ... perhaps something is truly broken.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva; color: #cc99ff;"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva; color: #cc99ff;">Dead horse, not beating it any more.  No fix today.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva; color: #cc99ff;"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva; color: #cc99ff;">Bye, Battlegrounds.  <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></span></p>

[dingobite201]

<p>Not healing at all i even when i get my beastlord bovid out at idle away from the brawl hes not healing me or anyone around us, pet does spam his fight heals though.</p><p>Guess i figured i know why pet wasnt healing now or any other pet with self heal buffs.</p>

[Cynicisim]

<p>The nice think about it is that my CAs that require me to be at a standstill work while I am carrying the flag. LOL</p>

[Shredderr]

<p><cite>Exur@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>No possible way this was ever tested.  lol</p></blockquote><p>agreed</p>

[Ceolus]

<p><cite>Lethlian wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Inq's and temps seem to be getting hammered more easily, while the shamens do relatively well.</p></blockquote><p>On my shaman, my crit group wards are 24k, my non-crit group wards are 20k (reduced by like 1/6).</p><p>On cleric, my reactive crit is ~2500, my non-crit reactive ~1200 (reduced by 1/2, basically). That's like trying to keep someone alive with Celestial Restoration.</p>

[Cathulla]

no point of even having flags in ganak the way it is right now . it's nothing more than a boring , long , slow , brawl between teams now . i wont my tokens and to have some fast paced pvp fun and this is the opposite of that . fix it please , i don't really care to even go into ganak as it is right now . it was my most liked zone before this bad change . Kraylore

[Brigh]

<p><cite>Someone wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>per-say</p></blockquote><p><img src="http://www.mybroadband.co.za/photos/data/500/policecar1.jpg" width="384" height="229" /></p><p><a href="http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/per+se" target="_blank">per se</a></p>

[Xzerius]

<p><cite>CharityCase wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva; color: #cc99ff;">Picking up the flag and having no interference, it takes just shy of 4 minutes to crawl from one end of the map to cap it.  With any kind of interference at all, it can be a good 10 minute slog to drag that banner home.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva; color: #cc99ff;"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva; color: #cc99ff;">Also ... when the non-healers are saying how bad the healer nerf is ... perhaps something is truly broken.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva; color: #cc99ff;"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva; color: #cc99ff;">Dead horse, not beating it any more.  No fix today.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva; color: #cc99ff;"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva; color: #cc99ff;">Bye, Battlegrounds.  <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" /></span></p></blockquote><p>/AgreedBut it's not just a BG's thing for me.  It's my server.  My Two main toons are Dirge and Inquis and they have both been rendered useless in PvP.  I tried to PvP with my Inq today and that took hopeless to a new level.  I'm about done with this ..... i do wish i could get back the 8 years I wasted though   LOL</p>

[Delethen]

<p>Even at the best of times I never liked Ganak but it's beyond awful right now.  How long can it possibly take to fix the flag run speed?</p>

[Corydonn]

<p>Things that are faster than running the flag in Ganak.</p><p>1. Listening to Convoy.</p><p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWO_AIh8drk" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWO_AIh8drk</a></p>

[Snached]

<p style="margin: 0in 0in 10pt;"><span style="font-family: Calibri; font-size: small;">I agree please fix this run speed debuff is way out of whack..</span></p>

[Omougi]

<p>A fix is on the way.</p>

[CharityCase]

<p><cite>Omougi wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>A fix is on the way.</p></blockquote><p><span style="color: #cc99ff;">Awesome, thank you!  <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></span></p><p><span style="color: #cc99ff;"></span></p><p><span style="color: #cc99ff;">Will you be addressing the cleric/druid nerf, or should I keep leveling my Mystic?  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></span></p>

[Xarc]

if you want to make Ganak right again change the slow effect to limit players to 100% runspeed and make the flag caps worth only like 50 points instead of the 150.

[Deathsound]

<p>if the flag speed is made quicker, there will be alot less tokens at the end of the match</p>

[Yimway]

<p>-100% runspeed is about right.</p><p>Classes with snare reduction will stand out a little bit, but all in all thats good flavor.</p>

[Cynicisim]

<p>After experiencing the flag run speed reduction I am rather liking it. No longer can a fast running noob get the flag before anyone can stop him. Being slower helps in a few ways.. teamwork to move the flag and more tokens at the end of the match.</p>

[convict]

<p><cite>Omougi wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>A fix is on the way.</p></blockquote><p>When? The servers got taken down for an emergency patch to fix the cut and shave, priorities I guess. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" /></p>

[Delethen]

<p><cite>convict wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Omougi wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>A fix is on the way.</p></blockquote><p>When? The servers got taken down for an emergency patch to fix the cut and shave, priorities I guess. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>If you check the patch notes for Tuesday 21st you will see that amongst a number of changes that are being made, the flag run speed in ganak is being altered.</p>

[Novusod]

<p>The flag shouldn't have a snare on it at all. To prevent death matches the flag should drop after about 2 or 3 minutes.</p>

[Proud_Silence]

<p><cite>Novusod wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>The flag shouldn't have a snare on it at all. To prevent death matches the flag should drop after about 2 or 3 minutes.</p></blockquote><p>yeah because running at 150% speed with close mind, tenacy, impenetrable, myth immunity and a handfull of stoneskins isn't going to turn it into a farce.</p><p>What really neeeds fixing is the fact there's always been ways to circumvent the snare effect and you see someone running at 100%+ runspeed across map. Or flat out cheating/hacking and "warping".</p><p>Give it a snare effect that applies to every class and while carrying flag A) all already existing runspeed enhancements get disabled ( not dispelled) and B) runspeed enhancements cast on you have no effect.</p>

[NardacMM]

<p>Thought it was much improved last night</p><p>BATTLEGROUNDS</p><p>Battlefield of Ganak</p><p>The snare effect while carrying the flag now snares for 30% instead of 75%</p>