"Grandfathered" characters (more free stuff!) Official Discussion Thread [Archive] - Page 2

Valdaglerion

12-12-2011, 06:45 PM

<cite>BWLeeEllison wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Jayda@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>EQBariguy wrote:</cite><blockquote>Excuse me?I've been a paying customer for years. I paid for my expansions. I paid for my collectors addition. I paid for my mounts and my extras and, I decidicated a lot of time and effort (for me) into getting the gear that I have. I loved this game, I made wonderful friends and acquaintences. The one thing I should at least still have are the things I, as a paying customer, had. I paid for the time to play when I had this gear. Do you understand that concept? I gave them my money. I paid EQ II to play and in turn, they gave me a service. AKA: Gear, items, etc. At the very least, I should be able to wear the gear I paid for when I had it. I am not asking for new gear. I am not asking for handouts. I'm asking for what I already had! EQ II wouldn't be "giving" me anything I didn't already own. How is that greedy? "Excuse me sir, that house you owned and paid for? Well, when you went on vacation, we (The realtors who sold you this home) just up and decided to sell it to someone else. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" /> You'll have to pay us double the money to get it back. " Right. And it's the house owners who are greedy?If you enjoy the game as it is? Fantastic! Keep enjoying it. But I don't, and I have an opinion about it and can express it if I wish. I'm not going to sit here and "feel sorry," for anyone who doesn't agree with me. </blockquote>I don't understand this mentality. You stopped paying for the game. Therefore you had zero access to anything in EQ2 that you "paid for" previously.Now, Sony makes it so you can come back... for free. Sure, there are restrictions, but you can come check out the game without paying a dime.I have asked this question before but no one touched it: Why should you get to come back, and get everything you *had* while being a paid member for free, while the rest of us have to pay? You don't have access to it because you aren't paying for the *rest* of the game. It wasn't "taken away". It's just not available to you as a FREE member. So are you asking that for those who quit paying for the game, but want all they had before, that us paid member should be reimbursed for what you're asking to be "given back" to you for free? Or that we should continue paying while you get the same access to your stuff for free? It makes zero sense both in fairness or as any kind of successful business model.If Sony caved on that too, and gave you the gear you "earned" while you were a *paying member*, for free, what would that do to the game? Then rest of us who are still paying would want that too! Why should you be rewarded for NOT paying for the use of this game, while the rest of us who have continued to pay just watch the non-payers get handouts?If Sony allowed that, as soon as anyone got the best gear they could, they'd stop paying. If they continue caving to your demands for free stuff, eventually no one would pay for anything. What would happen then? The game would eventually die and then there'd be no game to play anymore. </blockquote>Okay so I lease a car from my favorite dealership, and I get a new car every year. So my dealership comes up with a new program for their leases to help gain new customers. In light of the changes,I stop paying for my car and they come by my house and slap a boot on my car, and won't take it off til I pay some new fee or other. In addition, they deactivate my lonestar roadside assistance program, disconnect my radio, and change the lock on my trunk, again, until I pay a one time fee that will restore all these things.When Sony's logic is applied to other situations of a similar nature, it makes no sense. I mean can you imagine a guy who actually buys cars outright for his wife and three kids, being stuck in the situation I just described? How outraged would he be? Many of us PAID for various expansion packs for access to the content and the gear. We paid our monthly fees loyally and invested a great many hours into acquiring our gear.I have seen a great many FTP models in action. LotRO for example charges you for access to all the quests available in a given zone, BUT they AT LEAST give you the capability to EARN turbine points (coin of the realm as far as buying ftp crap goes). You know, thinking about that, there might be a lot less complaining if there were a way in game to earn station cash. Anyhow, of all the FTP models I have seen, this one is the absolutely LEAST forgiving and the MOST penny pinching, ever!Hats off to Sony for grandfathering our old, well played toons. A noble gesture for sure!But if you defend Sony for keeping broker priveledges, bag and bank slot access, quest journal size, and gear locked up, imagine letting an irresponsible teenager, a party going college student, or a complete and total stranger borrow your car for a month for $15. They'll do less damage to your car, in all likelihood, than Sony has done to your confidence as a long time customer.I can say that because I have been paying money to Sony since EQ classic launched, with very few gaps, paying for monthly fees AND buying expansion packs as well.</blockquote>There you go, I added and highlighted the portion in red you omitted from your analogy. If you leased a car from me and stopped paying for it, yes I would take the car back. In this example if you CHOSE not to pay for the car I might offer you an option of taking another lease car free from me which might have basic amenities and be painted as a rolling marketing advertisement. Such things exist.At the end of the day, nothing is free and people demanding future returns based on past performance is absurd.

Faerless

12-12-2011, 06:53 PM

All I want, my whole life, is a Fish Taco and a Pink Lemonade!<a href="http://www.hulu.com/watch/16529/roadents-beef-barn">http://www.hulu.com/watch/16529/roadents-beef-barn</a>Faerless

Errie_Tholluxe

12-12-2011, 07:51 PM

At the end of the day, nothing is free and people demanding future returns based on past performance is absurd.And this is the reason change doesnt happen in real life as well. Because people like you accept crapola logic like this. If you work hard, looking towards your future , and its all taken away for reasons beyond your control, are YOU still responsible? Can you not be MAD about it? Would you not be upset? Apathy because 'thats the way it is' is just stupidity by another name. I myself am going to stand up for what I feel is right, not fall back because an ijit makes iditoic declarations of logical fallacy.

Alladdim Allibabua

12-12-2011, 08:11 PM

Did they initiate the refund yet ? because i did not get my refund.

SOE-MOD-08

12-12-2011, 08:41 PM

This post has moved: <a href="/eq2/posts/preList.m?topic_id=500098&post_id=5681436" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">/eq2/posts/preList.m?topic_id=50009...post_id=5681436</a> Trolling.

BWLeeEllison

12-12-2011, 11:39 PM

<cite>Artemiz@The Bazaar wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>BWLeeEllison wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Jayda@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>EQBariguy wrote:</cite><blockquote>Excuse me?I've been a paying customer for years. I paid for my expansions. I paid for my collectors addition. I paid for my mounts and my extras and, I decidicated a lot of time and effort (for me) into getting the gear that I have. I loved this game, I made wonderful friends and acquaintences. The one thing I should at least still have are the things I, as a paying customer, had. I paid for the time to play when I had this gear. Do you understand that concept? I gave them my money. I paid EQ II to play and in turn, they gave me a service. AKA: Gear, items, etc. At the very least, I should be able to wear the gear I paid for when I had it. I am not asking for new gear. I am not asking for handouts. I'm asking for what I already had! EQ II wouldn't be "giving" me anything I didn't already own. How is that greedy? "Excuse me sir, that house you owned and paid for? Well, when you went on vacation, we (The realtors who sold you this home) just up and decided to sell it to someone else. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" /> You'll have to pay us double the money to get it back. " Right. And it's the house owners who are greedy?If you enjoy the game as it is? Fantastic! Keep enjoying it. But I don't, and I have an opinion about it and can express it if I wish. I'm not going to sit here and "feel sorry," for anyone who doesn't agree with me. </blockquote>I don't understand this mentality. You stopped paying for the game. Therefore you had zero access to anything in EQ2 that you "paid for" previously.Now, Sony makes it so you can come back... for free. Sure, there are restrictions, but you can come check out the game without paying a dime.I have asked this question before but no one touched it: Why should you get to come back, and get everything you *had* while being a paid member for free, while the rest of us have to pay? You don't have access to it because you aren't paying for the *rest* of the game. It wasn't "taken away". It's just not available to you as a FREE member. So are you asking that for those who quit paying for the game, but want all they had before, that us paid member should be reimbursed for what you're asking to be "given back" to you for free? Or that we should continue paying while you get the same access to your stuff for free? It makes zero sense both in fairness or as any kind of successful business model.If Sony caved on that too, and gave you the gear you "earned" while you were a *paying member*, for free, what would that do to the game? Then rest of us who are still paying would want that too! Why should you be rewarded for NOT paying for the use of this game, while the rest of us who have continued to pay just watch the non-payers get handouts?If Sony allowed that, as soon as anyone got the best gear they could, they'd stop paying. If they continue caving to your demands for free stuff, eventually no one would pay for anything. What would happen then? The game would eventually die and then there'd be no game to play anymore. </blockquote>Okay so I lease a car from my favorite dealership, and I get a new car every year. So my dealership comes up with a new program for their leases to help gain new customers. In light of the changes,I stop paying for my car and they come by my house and slap a boot on my car, and won't take it off til I pay some new fee or other. In addition, they deactivate my lonestar roadside assistance program, disconnect my radio, and change the lock on my trunk, again, until I pay a one time fee that will restore all these things.When Sony's logic is applied to other situations of a similar nature, it makes no sense. I mean can you imagine a guy who actually buys cars outright for his wife and three kids, being stuck in the situation I just described? How outraged would he be? Many of us PAID for various expansion packs for access to the content and the gear. We paid our monthly fees loyally and invested a great many hours into acquiring our gear.I have seen a great many FTP models in action. LotRO for example charges you for access to all the quests available in a given zone, BUT they AT LEAST give you the capability to EARN turbine points (coin of the realm as far as buying ftp crap goes). You know, thinking about that, there might be a lot less complaining if there were a way in game to earn station cash. Anyhow, of all the FTP models I have seen, this one is the absolutely LEAST forgiving and the MOST penny pinching, ever!Hats off to Sony for grandfathering our old, well played toons. A noble gesture for sure!But if you defend Sony for keeping broker priveledges, bag and bank slot access, quest journal size, and gear locked up, imagine letting an irresponsible teenager, a party going college student, or a complete and total stranger borrow your car for a month for $15. They'll do less damage to your car, in all likelihood, than Sony has done to your confidence as a long time customer.I can say that because I have been paying money to Sony since EQ classic launched, with very few gaps, paying for monthly fees AND buying expansion packs as well.</blockquote>There you go, I added and highlighted the portion in red you omitted from your analogy. If you leased a car from me and stopped paying for it, yes I would take the car back. In this example if you CHOSE not to pay for the car I might offer you an option of taking another lease car free from me which might have basic amenities and be painted as a rolling marketing advertisement. Such things exist.At the end of the day, nothing is free and people demanding future returns based on past performance is absurd.</blockquote>In my first example the hypothetical lessee was still paying, hence the absurdity of them booting his car and locking up other features. I couldn't help but notice you had nothing to say about the second example where the cars are bought and paid for.You are correct when you say nothing is free. I paid for the expansion packs that gave me access to get the gear I have, and I also put forth the time and effort to get that gear. I earned it. It belongs to me. It is mine. I did not take that gear to a pawn shop, so why should I have to pay to get it back? That gear is part of my character. No high end character is playable without the gear they quested for, raided for, raised money for and purchased. It's like having a Bugatti without the engines in it. Yes you own a million dollars worth of car that you can leave rusting in your front yard like people do out in the country. Throw a bone to the wolves but keep the meat for yourself next time will ya? Oh wait, BTDT. Without the gear, the grandfather clause is a hollow gesture.

Kirianna1

12-12-2011, 11:47 PM

<cite>BWLeeEllison wrote:</cite><blockquote>In my first example the hypothetical lessee was still paying, hence the absurdity of them booting his car and locking up other features. I couldn't help but notice you had nothing to say about the second example where the cars are bought and paid for.You are correct when you say nothing is free. I paid for the expansion packs that gave me access to get the gear I have, and I also put forth the time and effort to get that gear. I earned it. It belongs to me. It is mine. I did not take that gear to a pawn shop, so why should I have to pay to get it back? That gear is part of my character. No high end character is playable without the gear they quested for, raided for, raised money for and purchased. It's like having a Bugatti without the engines in it. Yes you own a million dollars worth of car that you can leave rusting in your front yard like people do out in the country. Throw a bone to the wolves but keep the meat for yourself next time will ya? Oh wait, BTDT. Without the gear, the grandfather clause is a hollow gesture.</blockquote>The bought and paid for car analogy doesn't work. You own the car, you pay for the maintenance, the gas it runs with, you pay for all upgrades, etc. etc. No one else does. Hence, it's yours to do with as you please until you decide to get rid of it.This game isn't something you own. You may purchase the right to use upgrades (expansions) but you don't pay to maintain it, nor for the gas it runs on. That's what your subscription (or unlock purchases) are for.

BWLeeEllison

12-13-2011, 12:58 AM

<cite>Jayda@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote>The bought and paid for car analogy doesn't work. You own the car, you pay for the maintenance, the gas it runs with, you pay for all upgrades, etc. etc. No one else does. Hence, it's yours to do with as you please until you decide to get rid of it.This game isn't something you own. You may purchase the right to use upgrades (expansions) but you don't pay to maintain it, nor for the gas it runs on. That's what your subscription (or unlock purchases) are for.</blockquote>If the game isn't something you own, then how do you explain the existence of the Bazaar server, where you can buy and sell for real cash money gear and/or characters? The items (gear and characters) are things you make or gain through game play. These items are yours to do with as you please. Keep them or sell them. That is the entire purpose of the Bazaar server.If Sony is seriously going to refuse to acknowledge the fact that the gear is part of the character and expect people to find replacement gear which will be, rest assured, substandard, then I seriously recommend people find some other game to play instead of reinvesting where they have already done so.

savedx

12-13-2011, 10:46 AM

All im going to say is you cant play the game with no gear. Loging in and finding my gear locked was funy tbh. You cant even group or quest. With the way its set up you log in talk to old friends for 5-10min log out and dont log back in. Being hit with a oh you need to buy gear unlocks for all you toons is bs imo. If they want old players to come back and play the game maybe give them the gear they earned the right to have? Just saying loging in and being hit with a bill right away is lame. Either you spend 15-30 bucks on gear unlocks for your toons or spend 15 on gold membership. Either way to actually play the game and not sit in a gh all day you have to buy something.

BWLeeEllison

12-13-2011, 11:17 AM

<cite>savedx wrote:</cite><blockquote>All im going to say is you cant play the game with no gear. Loging in and finding my gear locked was funy tbh. You cant even group or quest. With the way its set up you log in talk to old friends for 5-10min log out and dont log back in. Being hit with a oh you need to buy gear unlocks for all you toons is bs imo. If they want old players to come back and play the game maybe give them the gear they earned the right to have? Just saying loging in and being hit with a bill right away is lame. Either you spend 15-30 bucks on gear unlocks for your toons or spend 15 on gold membership. Either way to actually play the game and not sit in a gh all day you have to buy something.</blockquote>Agreed. That is actually more dire on Nagafen. Gear is so very much more important there and understandably so. As it is right now, if I go out with one of my non-scout characters that do not have a mount under them, I am toast. Until something gets done, all I can do is tradeskill rush orders because I'll not be an easy target. As it stands, I'd be a guaranteed kill. My characters had mostly gear that renders them nakee under the current set up.

Darevo

12-13-2011, 12:02 PM

When is this getting done? I paid for two unlockers (1 race and 1 class) on the 7th, and I still have not been refunded.

savedx

12-13-2011, 12:44 PM

<cite>BWLeeEllison wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Jayda@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote>The bought and paid for car analogy doesn't work. You own the car, you pay for the maintenance, the gas it runs with, you pay for all upgrades, etc. etc. No one else does. Hence, it's yours to do with as you please until you decide to get rid of it.This game isn't something you own. You may purchase the right to use upgrades (expansions) but you don't pay to maintain it, nor for the gas it runs on. That's what your subscription (or unlock purchases) are for.</blockquote>If the game isn't something you own, then how do you explain the existence of the Bazaar server, where you can buy and sell for real cash money gear and/or characters? The items (gear and characters) are things you make or gain through game play. These items are yours to do with as you please. Keep them or sell them. That is the entire purpose of the Bazaar server.If Sony is seriously going to refuse to acknowledge the fact that the gear is part of the character and expect people to find replacement gear which will be, rest assured, substandard, then I seriously recommend people find some other game to play instead of reinvesting where they have already done so.</blockquote>Heres the thing if i buy a game or an expansion i expect to have access to the content i paid the $40 for. If this game gos free to play i expect to have the content i paid for.Curently what soe is saying is oh thanks for buying the expansions but you can not use the stuff you paid for. Either be free to play with things like bags/bankslots/plat limited or dont be free to play at all imo. It looks to me more like a free trial then anything atm. I dont think it would be to much to ask for the gear i earned to be useable for my toons. But as i said in my previos post you cant grp or quest naked.Now will soe listen to its player base about this? Doubtful but we can hope i mean ive played since launch bought all the expansions except aod. Least they could do for the loyal players they have had over the years is let them have the gear they have earned during the time they played.Its just bad business on soes part if they want people to start playig agian.

BWLeeEllison

12-13-2011, 12:55 PM

<cite>savedx wrote:</cite><blockquote><blockquote>Heres the thing if i buy a game or an expansion i expect to have access to the content i paid the $40 for. If this game gos free to play i expect to have the content i paid for.Curently what soe is saying is oh thanks for buying the expansions but you can not use the stuff you paid for. Either be free to play with things like bags/bankslots/plat limited or dont be free to play at all imo. It looks to me more like a free trial then anything atm. I dont think it would be to much to ask for the gear i earned to be useable for my toons. But as i said in my previos post you cant grp or quest naked.Now will soe listen to its player base about this? Doubtful but we can hope i mean ive played since launch bought all the expansions except aod. Least they could do for the loyal players they have had over the years is let them have the gear they have earned during the time they played.Its just bad business on soes part if they want people to start playig agian.</blockquote></blockquote>Here's the deal. All these people defending SOE against those of us asking for a common sense solution and calling us absurd for expecting yet more free crap are most likely all people who can afford to pay to play. My wife is fighting cancer and I have to stay at home to care for both her and our 18 month old son. She was recently put on disability so our budget is incredibly tight. I couldn't pay to play to save my own life right now. LotRO gives players the option to earn their version of Station Cash in game so those who cannot afford or choose not to pay have a way to at least get the FTP locks lifted. In the long run, if I had the money, I would buy certain unlocks there but work for the game credits overall. Earning the credits gives me an option to gain things I don't feel are worth the cash to get. I still have the option to buy stuff I don't want to wait for with real money, even though I can't.If SOE won't give us the unlocks for the gear or w/e, at LEAST give us some way to earn station cash in game. LotRO ties those in with achievements. That could work here. Something to think about.

Arek

12-13-2011, 02:40 PM

They should just change the wording around and all of this would go away. It's F2P for all new charachters/accounts. Old characters on old accounts will need to make a nominal purchase to make their old toons playable. Boom... just fixed the problem.It's great my chars are unlocked. It sucks they are naked. Oh well. My monk will be easy to play and get gear for naked. He should be able to somewhat hold his own with no weapons or armor in the pre 70 game I would think. The rest of my melee's...not so much, they dont do well fighting with their hands. I cant get 80-90 quest gear for them really, since I have already done the quests and either sold or transmuted the drops over a year ago.So.. my best bet is to kill very low lvl mobs and farm cash (lol silver) like that to buy off the broker, or delete half of my toons and make a new one and start fresh. Coming back naked with no decent way to even get marginal gear is not a good plan.I don't fault Sony for this model. I can't think of any corporation that doesnt want to micro-transaction you to death. Like Bank of America and other mega-corps say" We have a right to make a profit"BUT, it was nice to log on for 5 mins and talk to old friends, at least I can do that once a month.

Myserable

12-13-2011, 03:08 PM

ok soe sony wants new blood...lets look at from a newbies point of view.Cool a free game. Lets make some money so i can get gear or makes some. Oh wait by level 20 i can have 400g. Lets see what 400g buys oh wait I cant use the broker to make money and nothing is 400g anymore.Oh lets go questing. Oh look at this ornate chest with this fable item I cant wear. Or look at this quest Iitem I cant wear. I know lets craft oh wait i cant wear what I crafted.Oh I want to tell my long didatnce friend how much fun (not) i am having not being able to do anything...oh wait cant use the mailbox either.Now from a non newb...lets say I quit playing b/c I got layed off my job and the money is tight now b/c of the economy. So i paid in all these years have worked hard all these years and now cant even access what i paid for. Oh wow i have 100 plat wait cant use is it I can only have 20g per level. Oh yeah they stripped my gear. I cant make money b/c i cant use the broker wow all the same arguements. Due to this change I can no longer riad or pve all it is ..is free to dieRunes of Magic a premiere ftp model does not do any of that. You can use the broker, you can use the mail, there is no cap on gold and you can use the gear you buy earn thru a quest or get as a drop.They do limit you bag space. But you can buy more thru micro transactions. You can also upgrade your gear thru microtransactions.They also dont limit your characters except by server 8 per server. Sony has too many limitations and will only drive people away when they see that crafting questing are useless to you.Also when you buy something it is yours too keep. If I buy a tv I dont expect Vizio to take my tv away b/c they have a new model out. If I bought access to an expansion or gear or whatever then you cant just take it away ..if you do I want a refund.furyfire nagafen

simianthief

12-13-2011, 03:13 PM

Make new accountcreate new toon. ?ProfitSend profit to old toons for retrofit.

Nahdian

12-13-2011, 07:25 PM

There is an old saying . You get what you pay for. Cheap or free stuff is'nt usually worth having. I ptp this game. Not because I am super rich and have money to burn. But I want to be able to experience the game to its fullest.I have no ownership of any type in this game. All I own are the disc and the box it came in. Sony owns my chars, gear ,houses and every virtual aspect of this game. I simply pay a fee each month so I can use it. I purchased every expansion to this game . And the reason for that is so I could explore the game and enjoy it a little bit more. It still does not give me the ownership rights to anything in the game.Someone mentioned that people on the exchange servers made money from selling chars and coin. True we did make money. But it still did'nt make us the owners of the chars or coin. Sony still owned everything . Whether you bought or sold , it was still sony's product. All they did was give us the chance to play the game , have some fun and when we had more coin than we needed we could sell to someone who needed it or save another player the grind of leveling a char.And all this comparing sony to other games that are ftp. Give me a break . If all these other ftp are so great why are you here wanting to play.Nothing in life is ever really free , there is always a catch somewhere.

BWLeeEllison

12-13-2011, 08:44 PM

<cite>Nahdian wrote:</cite><blockquote>There is an old saying . You get what you pay for. Cheap or free stuff is'nt usually worth having. I ptp this game. Not because I am super rich and have money to burn. But I want to be able to experience the game to its fullest.I have no ownership of any type in this game. All I own are the disc and the box it came in. Sony owns my chars, gear ,houses and every virtual aspect of this game. I simply pay a fee each month so I can use it. I purchased every expansion to this game . And the reason for that is so I could explore the game and enjoy it a little bit more. It still does not give me the ownership rights to anything in the game.Someone mentioned that people on the exchange servers made money from selling chars and coin. True we did make money. But it still did'nt make us the owners of the chars or coin. Sony still owned everything . Whether you bought or sold , it was still sony's product. All they did was give us the chance to play the game , have some fun and when we had more coin than we needed we could sell to someone who needed it or save another player the grind of leveling a char.And all this comparing sony to other games that are ftp. Give me a break . If all these other ftp are so great why are you here wanting to play.Nothing in life is ever really free , there is always a catch somewhere.</blockquote>Nobody cares that Sony still OWNS all the crap on their servers. We all know how the EULA works. What you are failing to recognize is the attachment people have to their characters because of the TIME that was spent in building them. Time is a currency more precious than cash. The time you spend playing these games is more valuable to you than it is to Sony. Sony wants your cash only. Cash is earned by selling your time to the company you work for. Doctors and lawyers have a higher value for their time because of what they spent on their educations. Older people with little time left on this Earth have a high value on their time, as do people with terminal illnesses and all the young people who feel the world is over next year. Poor people tend to place a high value on the time they have to give up to earn enough cash to make ends meet; that carries over to a high value on whatever they wind up spending that money on because of the sense of the time spent earning it.Say whatever you like about who owns what. If Sony wants to be Scrooge tight like this from here on out with the people who floated this game for almost the past decade, then the game will fail. What Sony is trying for is a player base boost. Word of mouth is the best way to boost the player base, because they are trying to be cost effective by not laying out a wad of cash for top end advertising. Grandfathering shows they are TRYING to keep the old players happy to help with their word of mouth campaign. But it is only lip service, a hollow gesture, if they do not follow through and make the gear that is such an integral part of those characters available for use.The gear I have on my characters is not the best I could have earned because I never raided. The opportunities to raid just weren't worth the cost in my book. I am the leader of one of the oldest guilds on Nagafen, and I always played for the friendships I had and the people I got to know. I don't see why I should give up my position just so I could join a raiding guild to earn the gear that would make me even more successful as a rogue. The chance for better gear is not worth giving up what I had. My gear at my tier is so substandard it is laughable but it is good enough to allow me to get out there and make a dent in the world. The big problem right now is that I can use none of it. Why the hell should I pay for substandard gear? If I have to shell out cash money for gear, then put up an offer to buy the best gear for my level! The gear I have is crap but it is MY crap and I was happy with it as it was all I could manage to get.Now that the broker is locked, I can't sell anything I have to buy replacement gear with. Given that I don't have any decent gear I can use at my level, grouping and raiding for replacements is out of the question, especially if someone inspects me. I play on Nagafen so gear is doubly important. All I can do is level my guild on rush order writs until this gets resolved. Players without gear cannot contribute to an active world. Those of you clinging to the notion that existing and returning players who chose or have to FTP instead of paying should not be given their gear should actually be asking for the gear to be unlocked as well. All the players who opt not to play because of the gear lock issue leave gaping holes in the selection of people you have to group or raid with.SONY, let us have the option to earn our station cash in game, please. I would not mind paying but I can't. I have no option but to suffer without my gear. Either unlock the gear for grandfathered characters or let us earn station cash in the game somehow.

BWLeeEllison

12-13-2011, 08:45 PM

<cite>Myserable wrote:</cite><blockquote>ok soe sony wants new blood...lets look at from a newbies point of view.Cool a free game. Lets make some money so i can get gear or makes some. Oh wait by level 20 i can have 400g. Lets see what 400g buys oh wait I cant use the broker to make money and nothing is 400g anymore.Oh lets go questing. Oh look at this ornate chest with this fable item I cant wear. Or look at this quest Iitem I cant wear. I know lets craft oh wait i cant wear what I crafted.Oh I want to tell my long didatnce friend how much fun (not) i am having not being able to do anything...oh wait cant use the mailbox either.Now from a non newb...lets say I quit playing b/c I got layed off my job and the money is tight now b/c of the economy. So i paid in all these years have worked hard all these years and now cant even access what i paid for. Oh wow i have 100 plat wait cant use is it I can only have 20g per level. Oh yeah they stripped my gear. I cant make money b/c i cant use the broker wow all the same arguements. Due to this change I can no longer riad or pve all it is ..is free to dieRunes of Magic a premiere ftp model does not do any of that. You can use the broker, you can use the mail, there is no cap on gold and you can use the gear you buy earn thru a quest or get as a drop.They do limit you bag space. But you can buy more thru micro transactions. You can also upgrade your gear thru microtransactions.They also dont limit your characters except by server 8 per server. Sony has too many limitations and will only drive people away when they see that crafting questing are useless to you.Also when you buy something it is yours too keep. If I buy a tv I dont expect Vizio to take my tv away b/c they have a new model out. If I bought access to an expansion or gear or whatever then you cant just take it away ..if you do I want a refund.furyfire nagafen</blockquote>AMEN Fury!!! BTW Love ur tats <img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

RavenwolfB

12-14-2011, 06:15 PM

<cite>RavenwolfB wrote:</cite><blockquote>Hey,I am not here to complain about anything, mearly to ask a question. Has anyone recieved thier race/class pack refunds yet, or heard when they are supposed to be given out? On the 7th I spent 2250sc on packs. (I had yet to decide if I wanted to come back or not. I have since both returned as a subscriber and bought AOD.) I contacted customer service and they said all refunds would be done at the same time across the board and to keep an eye on the community forums. This was yesterday the 11th. The only post I have found so far regarding the refund issue was by Smokejumper who said they were doing it all on the 9th. Thus this question. Answers much appreciated!Have a good one,Raven</blockquote>So I take it no one has any clue regarding this question? <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Marnus

12-14-2011, 06:24 PM

I received one race pack refund(750sc)-which is what i was entitled to-i bought 3 other race packs 2 weeks before, which fell short of the 60 day period lol.

Marnus

12-14-2011, 06:42 PM

Darevo

12-14-2011, 06:43 PM

I am still shy the 1500 points I spent t unlock my 2004 High Elf and my Oct 2011 SK. I am hoping they just havent gotten to it yet because they are getting slammed by returning players, thanks to F2P, and not because everyone called out sick to play the earlyt start of SWTOR. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

BWLeeEllison

12-14-2011, 06:47 PM

It is like I said before, Marmus, the grandfathering is a hollow gesture.

Marnus

12-14-2011, 07:26 PM

But the beauty of it is, are you really any worse off than you were before? The answer is, no you're not. before they did this, you would have had to pay a sub, or, if you couldnt swing that, pay for class/race unlocks for all the characters you made-which, if you're like me , and have a ton of alts, can really add up-And you would have had to pay for item unlocks. Now, you have only to either pay a sub-which in my opinion is by far the better deal-or pay for item unlocks for each character. The fact is, they didn't have to give any kind of gesture-let alone one that saves you at minimum 7.50 in race unlocks. Since you werent paying to play anyway, on what basis do you have to complain? Because other games have a different system? As the poster above said, why do you want to play this game, if the other games' price model is so much better? This is a company, and at the end of the day, they are here to make money-they aren't a non-profit organization. They throw us a bone once in a while, and thats nice, but they dont have to. If you truly feel it was a hollow gesture, that somehow you were entitled to more, than the best way let a company know you are unhappy with them, is 1) write to them or call them-which you have done here, and 2) take your money-or if your not even paying them any money, free time i guess?- elsewhere. Hit em where it counts. I just cant see how anyone honestly and with a straight face can seriously expect everyone to just stop paying a sub and play the game for free with no restrictions, just because at one time, they were a subscriber. It just makes no sense to me.

urgthock

12-14-2011, 07:36 PM

<cite>BWLeeEllison wrote:</cite><blockquote>Okay so I lease a car from my favorite dealership, and I get a new car every year. So my dealership comes up with a new program for their leases to help gain new customers. In light of the changes, they come by my house and slap a boot on my car, and won't take it off til I pay some new fee or other. In addition, they deactivate my lonestar roadside assistance program, disconnect my radio, and change the lock on my trunk, again, until I pay a one time fee that will restore all these things.When Sony's logic is applied to other situations of a similar nature, it makes no sense. I mean can you imagine a guy who actually buys cars outright for his wife and three kids, being stuck in the situation I just described? How outraged would he be? Many of us PAID for various expansion packs for access to the content and the gear. We paid our monthly fees loyally and invested a great many hours into acquiring our gear.I have seen a great many FTP models in action. LotRO for example charges you for access to all the quests available in a given zone, BUT they AT LEAST give you the capability to EARN turbine points (coin of the realm as far as buying ftp crap goes). You know, thinking about that, there might be a lot less complaining if there were a way in game to earn station cash. Anyhow, of all the FTP models I have seen, this one is the absolutely LEAST forgiving and the MOST penny pinching, ever!</blockquote>Sure all that makes sense. Now throw this little caveat in there that you forgot to mention.You stopped making your lease payments!So now, I don't think that "Sony's logic" applied to other situations would seem all that ridiculous. I think that most people looking at someone in the situation you described would ask the Lessee why they were upset? It's not like your paying for anything?Make your lease payments or pay those one time fees and get to driving!

BWLeeEllison

12-14-2011, 07:47 PM

<cite>urgthock wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>BWLeeEllison wrote:</cite><blockquote>Okay so I lease a car from my favorite dealership, and I get a new car every year. So my dealership comes up with a new program for their leases to help gain new customers. In light of the changes, they come by my house and slap a boot on my car, and won't take it off til I pay some new fee or other. In addition, they deactivate my lonestar roadside assistance program, disconnect my radio, and change the lock on my trunk, again, until I pay a one time fee that will restore all these things.</blockquote>Sure all that makes sense. Now throw this little caveat in there that you forgot to mention.You stopped making your lease payments!</blockquote>If you'd bothered reading a bit more, you would have seen where someone else tried to make that distinction and I corrected them.

urgthock

12-14-2011, 07:48 PM

<cite>BWLeeEllison wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>urgthock wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>BWLeeEllison wrote:</cite><blockquote>Okay so I lease a car from my favorite dealership, and I get a new car every year. So my dealership comes up with a new program for their leases to help gain new customers. In light of the changes, they come by my house and slap a boot on my car, and won't take it off til I pay some new fee or other. In addition, they deactivate my lonestar roadside assistance program, disconnect my radio, and change the lock on my trunk, again, until I pay a one time fee that will restore all these things.</blockquote>Sure all that makes sense. Now throw this little caveat in there that you forgot to mention.You stopped making your lease payments!</blockquote>If you'd bothered reading a bit more, you would have seen where someone else tried to make that distinction and I corrected them.</blockquote>Correct me then.

BWLeeEllison

12-14-2011, 07:55 PM

<cite>Marnus@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote>But the beauty of it is, are you really any worse off than you were before? The answer is, no you're not. before they did this, you would have had to pay a sub, or, if you couldnt swing that, pay for class/race unlocks for all the characters you made-which, if you're like me , and have a ton of alts, can really add up-And you would have had to pay for item unlocks. Now, you have only to either pay a sub-which in my opinion is by far the better deal-or pay for item unlocks for each character. The fact is, they didn't have to give any kind of gesture-let alone one that saves you at minimum 7.50 in race unlocks. Since you werent paying to play anyway, on what basis do you have to complain? Because other games have a different system? As the poster above said, why do you want to play this game, if the other games' price model is so much better? This is a company, and at the end of the day, they are here to make money-they aren't a non-profit organization. They throw us a bone once in a while, and thats nice, but they dont have to. If you truly feel it was a hollow gesture, that somehow you were entitled to more, than the best way let a company know you are unhappy with them, is 1) write to them or call them-which you have done here, and 2) take your money-or if your not even paying them any money, free time i guess?- elsewhere. Hit em where it counts. I just cant see how anyone honestly and with a straight face can seriously expect everyone to just stop paying a sub and play the game for free with no restrictions, just because at one time, they were a subscriber. It just makes no sense to me.</blockquote>But I am not asking everyone to stop paying a sub and play the game for free with no restrictions just because at one time they were a subscriber. That makes no sense to me as well. What makes even less sense is to try to enlarge the player base by allowing former players to have all their characters back without the gear they need to carry on as before so that they can be at least moderately happy enough to use the word of mouth advertising technique to help Sony make money from something other than battery sales by encouraging all their friends who refused to pay to play for all these years because they were too cheap to pay for a monthly game. I have a solid game group I would love to bring into EQ2, but given the state of the FTP model they have, I know I will have to exclude at least 3 of them because they hate games with too many microtransactions, especially for important things.As I have said on many occasions above, it would be nice to have a way, however slow and tedious it may be, to earn station cash for your account by doing certain things in game. This would ensure that those with no other way to GET station cash have at least that one way to strive to get their unlocks.

ratbast

12-14-2011, 09:37 PM

from a financial standpoint, grandfathering without unlocking all current gear seems short sighted. unlocking that gear would only increase their desire to be competitive. forcing them to unlock current gear would be some money sure. but how reluctant would they be to upgrade that item, when they paid $1.50 just to use it? they will unlock their current gear and try to get by. if they had all their gear in the past, they would work on upgrading piece by piece. a much more palletable start, and they would be more enthusiastic about getting relevent gear to boot. locking old gear seems like unnecessary obstacle to SOE getting $PAID$ and hooking returning players on the unlock process. at the very least, it would seem smarter to grant 1 unlock to get them started. just getting ppl into the interface and gradually accepting it is a basic and simple trick to make ppl do things they dont wanna. slowly erode their sense of right and wrong. due to new aod crafting, old gear is losing its relevence from t2 - t9.

BWLeeEllison

12-15-2011, 12:52 AM

<cite>ratbastard wrote:</cite><blockquote>from a financial standpoint, grandfathering without unlocking all current gear seems short sighted. unlocking that gear would only increase their desire to be competitive. forcing them to unlock current gear would be some money sure. but how reluctant would they be to upgrade that item, when they paid $1.50 just to use it? they will unlock their current gear and try to get by. if they had all their gear in the past, they would work on upgrading piece by piece. a much more palletable start, and they would be more enthusiastic about getting relevent gear to boot. locking old gear seems like unnecessary obstacle to SOE getting $PAID$ and hooking returning players on the unlock process. at the very least, it would seem smarter to grant 1 unlock to get them started. just getting ppl into the interface and gradually accepting it is a basic and simple trick to make ppl do things they dont wanna. slowly erode their sense of right and wrong. due to new aod crafting, old gear is losing its relevence from t2 - t9.</blockquote>Not everyone can afford to pay for the unlock you seem to hope the current situation will force them to pay for. I have all my old characters at the moment, but most of them no longer are able to use their "current gear". Upgrading to new gear is an unlikely event because I cannot be sure that a new piece I buy will be legal for me to use since I have not unlocked. Even if I had a safe list of what to buy, I couldn't buy it because I cannot use the broker to make any money to buy with, and even if I could I can only have so much money on me (8 plat at the moment). The entire situation has the feel of a shake down. Like a dealer standing at a high school fence line giving away free samples of digital crack, hoping to get you junked out so you'll pay the unlocks.Keep my effing gear. See if I care. My guild is at level 62 with 2, possibly 3 people left alive in it. I am the only one willing to give up time levelling it. I cannot level it with pvp. I cannot level it with adventuring writs with naked toons. I will sit in my guild hall probably by myself and level it to 90, however slow that may be. I will not try to get others to come help me in the form of new players for Sony to financially drain so long as I am doomed to play the game without my gear. I cannot afford the unlock, therefor, I will not get the unlock unless and until Sony sees how many people want their old gear back FIRST. I said it before, my current gear is not really worth paying for, but it is better than what I could buy to use right now. If I have to pay cash money for gear, then put the ability to buy the best gear for your current level in as an option. I'll scrounge, beg, and borrow for THAT, but to pay cash money for the crap I currently? eh, no.

SOE-MOD-04

12-15-2011, 02:09 AM

This post has moved: <a href="/eq2/posts/preList.m?topic_id=500111&post_id=5683938" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">/eq2/posts/preList.m?topic_id=50011...post_id=5683938</a> Removed for trolling

BWLeeEllison

12-15-2011, 04:19 AM

<cite>Nahdian wrote:</cite><blockquote>Unless your born with a gold spoon in your mouth.I was not born with a gold spoon in my mouth, even though the traditional cliche used there is "silver spoon". I get your point. It is not my luck to be in that mold.Your not going to get everything you want in life.Correct. I went to school for game design and had to drop out due to an illness in the family.You chose free to play.I didn't choose free to play. I have no choice but to use FTP because I am in a single income household where the bread winner was diagnosed with cancer and is currently fighting for her life.And Sony was generous enough to unlock your chars for you.As I have stated before, unlocking the characters without the gear is a hollow gesture. Here, let me give you a brand new Lexus. It will be the car without any of the mechanical or electrical amenities.Now you whine to get your gear unlocked, and if they did that . I feel you would demand they unlock something else for you.First of all, I am not whining. I am engaged in earnest dialogue trying to get something accomplished which I feel should have been done in the first place. You may disagree with my opinion, but please refrain from trying to start a flame war. Keep the discussion open and neutral if not friendly, please.You picked the type of game you wanted to play. So play it according to its rules.Son, I started playing EQ classic the year it launched and continued to play it until 2004, when I picked up this game. I have been a loyal supporter of Sony for years and have argued ON THEIR SIDE when others were doing nothing but complain about this policy or that. I have only complained against them one other time and that was in response to a change they made in I believe it was Live Update 42, dealing with the way or rate at which PvP tokens dropped. I take this game seriously. I take this company seriously. I have played this game and its predecessor according to the rules. I was a GM briefly in EQ classic. I have been a guild leader time and again. I have led my guild to 6 wins of 6 guild wars fought. This game and I have history, and I don't want to just give up on the relationship I have had with Sony and its MMO products, especially on the world of Norrath.Life circumstances have steered me away when I did not want to go. I hear the game has gone FTP which made me super happy. I was NOT happy with the terms under which I am allowed to play. The choice was not mine, but rather it was forced upon me. A great many games have gone FTP in the last year or so. If I had my choice of game to play, it would be EQ2. Their current FTP model leaves me no option but to choose something else. Therefor I choose to actively campaign for a more fair FTP model.And this bs about sony giving you a way to earn station cash in the game itself is utter nonsense.How is it utter nonsense? LotRO has this in their FTP model. Exactly how many games did you say you have sampled? How many different FTP models have you played under to have an informed opinion as to what works and what does not? There are many different kinds of environments in the FTP market. Anarchy Online is (or was, haven't been there for a whille) very brutal on their FTP players. You did NOT want to be called out as a FROOB (free noob). You would find yourself unable to get groups or even help figuring the thing out. LotRO was half on that fence, half off. There was no respect for the free player, but no real level of disrespect either. Good help could be had if the right people were online. Champions Online is a good FTP model, but the best I have seen is with Runes of Magic.You seem to forget sony is running a buisness here.No, I am well aware they are running a business. I am simply saying that their FTP model is too restrictive in regards to former players and the goal of luring in new players, which is, ultimately, the goal of any game going FTP. If the game is free, people risk absolutely nothing to try it. If they like what they see, more often than not, they will buy in. Now which is better for a new player to see....a nearly lifeless handful of servers where people don't really give a rat's blast about the FTP newbs asking questions or looking for hand outs, or servers with vibrant populations with more options to find helpful people to get the FTP new players get into the groove of things. They have employees to pay. Buildings to maintain and upkeep on equipment. Not to mention the cost of utilities and thats just the short list.If they were so hard pressed for cash, they would have never gone for the FTP model. They sell all kinds of electronics, batteries, console products, they are even in bed with Hollywood. Going FTP is a stab at increasing their online MMO bottom line by bringing in fresh meat and milking them with microtransactions. I maintain their FTP model is too stingy and will drive away more potential business than it will retain.If they made station cash available via the game itself. Every player with half a brain would jump on that bandwagon.There is a reason why LotRO makes money off their FTP model even with letting people earn their version of station cash (last called Turbine Points). Even though you CAN earn TP with with to buy stuff in game by accomplishing deeds (similar to the achievements system in EQ2), some people are not happy with waiting so long to get what they are trying to earn, so they break out their credit card and just buy the blasted thing. They still have their TP for later in case something else comes along. The point is, there is an option for those, like myself, who have no such luxury.So that leaves only one source of real money coming in. The players who pay a sub each month.Sony makes plenty of cash from their subscribers. Add to that they have various subscription levels a player can use.Well trust me if they had enough subscibers for that . There would'nt be a need to make the game ftp.Well trust me, going FTP is just an attempt at increasing their income. They have watched the bottom lines of other companies going FTP sky rocket because people who have become disenfranchised with whatever game they were playing switched to the free ones to see what else was out there.They need the subs and station cash to keep this game going. Without the money this game will die.This game is a long way from dying. For every person on here arguing to keep the game as tightwad as possible, there are three more trying to get the game they love into a place where they can keep loving it by playing it daily. They argue their points with passion because they love the game and want it to do well. So long as people are dissatisfied to the point they refuse to play it, the servers will remain mostly barren, which is not a state that will woo new people into playing. If there are no players for the new folks to group with or learn from, they will go look for a more active game.Yes the economy is bad and jobs are'nt easy to find. But you seem to have loads of time to keep posting on the forums. So instead get off your butt and go out and mow a yard, shovel snow , clean up doggie poo. These jobs are easy to find and true they won't make you rich or pay your house payment.I do have time, when my wife and son are asleep. Just so you know, I DO have a job, but it is a job most wouldn't recognize as one simply because it generates no income for the household. My wife is fighting cancer. I have to stay at home, cook, clean, do laundry, take care of her, take care of my son. I do not have time to run off and shovel doggie poo, as you put it. The only income we have is from disability. I have to be with her nearly constantly because she struggles with emotions I can't imagine. I see the end results of her inner struggles, and it takes all my strength to not throw my hands up and be done with it. I love her and will be with her through this entire fight she has in front of her, regardless of if she wins or loses.But you will earn enough to play this game.No, my job will not pay for this game. I have to use the time I should be asleep to come here and campaign for what I want. Disagree with me if you must, but please be a little more sensitive when you disagree with someone?</blockquote>

Xeresta

12-15-2011, 02:54 PM

< Deleted, question solved <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> >

Slighted

12-16-2011, 03:50 PM

Did you previously have to pay to unlock class/races of characters you copied over from live to F2P?If so is this amount being reimbursed?I copied over a char of mine back in June 2011 and can't remember if I had to unlcok the class (dirge) or race (wood elf), but would be great to have a refund if I did.

Flynnaz

12-16-2011, 04:15 PM

I wish they would have a plan B for character transfers. The 31 day waiting period after reactivating a old live account before I can transfer my main to the Freeport server is frustrating. I know they made this rule because of Plat farmers/hackers, but I should beable to call CS and verify myself. You already have to pay $25.00 to do it. I was a Silver member for two months before this, and started on the free server when it opened. Just like most here I opened my account when EQ2 started. Just my thoughts on a new frustrating rule.

simianthief

12-16-2011, 05:01 PM

In all honesty BW has the right of it. They have done a LOT to encourage people back, but for the people with older accounts they haven't quite gone far enough. You're talking about players who have supported this game and company for a LONG time, some of us have been playing online games since Fidonet (look it up kids) and migrated to the internet as fast as it became a thing. We've beta tested UO and EQ (wizards could fly folks...it was fun) and EQII, we've watched the games rise to prominance and drift into a weird awkward relationship (uh, did we go out or something?) and wondered if it was really as much fun as we remember.We want to play.We want to be here.And some of us do not mind spending time and money if we can find it, on the old gal. But some of us have no character slots available, some of us can't afford the unlockers for the equipment we USED to have (and trust me, your inventory goes KABOOM when you unatune that stuff). Good luck getting it sorted out and able to play without wanting to stab someone in the eye, much less pick up and play.As vets we're not asking for the world, just give us access as we left it, our equipment will need to be replaced and we'll need those unlockers eventually. We'll want new characters and new slots and new mounts and pretty clothes...but for now, we just want to get in and hack it up.(and BW, if you can get onto the Guk server PM me here, I'll do my dead level best to help you out brother I might even throw some SC your way when I get it myself. If you have to, start a new account...I know...stupid idea.)

BWLeeEllison

12-16-2011, 06:21 PM

<cite>simianthief wrote:</cite><blockquote>In all honesty BW has the right of it. They have done a LOT to encourage people back, but for the people with older accounts they haven't quite gone far enough. You're talking about players who have supported this game and company for a LONG time, some of us have been playing online games since Fidonet (look it up kids) and migrated to the internet as fast as it became a thing. We've beta tested UO and EQ (wizards could fly folks...it was fun) and EQII, we've watched the games rise to prominance and drift into a weird awkward relationship (uh, did we go out or something?) and wondered if it was really as much fun as we remember.We want to play.We want to be here.And some of us do not mind spending time and money if we can find it, on the old gal. But some of us have no character slots available, some of us can't afford the unlockers for the equipment we USED to have (and trust me, your inventory goes KABOOM when you unatune that stuff). Good luck getting it sorted out and able to play without wanting to stab someone in the eye, much less pick up and play.As vets we're not asking for the world, just give us access as we left it, our equipment will need to be replaced and we'll need those unlockers eventually. We'll want new characters and new slots and new mounts and pretty clothes...but for now, we just want to get in and hack it up.(and BW, if you can get onto the Guk server PM me here, I'll do my dead level best to help you out brother I might even throw some SC your way when I get it myself. If you have to, start a new account...I know...stupid idea.)</blockquote>Sadly brother, I am on Nagafen, and that makes the gear situation even more imperative. I can't get out and just adventure a little to get some gear (most of which will be unusuable) without getting it handed to me on a fairly regular basis. The gear I had was adequate to survive an unexpected gank squad most of the time, but I am sorry. If I gotta pay the kind of cash they are wanting for gear unlocks, I'd as soon wait for them to wise up and let you pay for the best gear for your tier. I do not want to pay cash for my old guns. I already spent a ton of in game cash getting and doctoring it up to a usable status. If you really want to help just stay on here with me and help me show Sony they can do better and cash in in the long run by giving the vets their gear back.

Rijacki

12-16-2011, 07:57 PM

<cite>Slighted wrote:</cite><blockquote>Did you previously have to pay to unlock class/races of characters you copied over from live to F2P?If so is this amount being reimbursed?I copied over a char of mine back in June 2011 and can't remember if I had to unlcok the class (dirge) or race (wood elf), but would be great to have a refund if I did.</blockquote>Copied characters had the race/class unlocked for THAT character. They did not have the gear unlocked if they went below Gold and they didn't automatically get Silver if they'd been Gold (or a copy) before. So, the grandfathering of exisitng characters is in a similar manner to the copied, but with the added benefit of giving anyone who had an account before automatic Silver.

Ilavatar

12-17-2011, 04:23 AM

Triple Station Cash tomorrow! <a href="http://www.everquest2.com/news/arti...=5080&tab=0" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.everquest2.com/news/arti...=5080&tab=0</a> Here's a good chance for F2Pers to get their toons back in the game for an affordable price.

BWLeeEllison

12-17-2011, 10:05 AM

Broke is still broke. Put another way, 3 multiplied by 0 is still 0. /sadness

BWLeeEllison

12-17-2011, 12:54 PM

I have been following my ex-girlfriend's attempts to get the basic grandfathering so many of us have already received. Like myself, she has been a loyal EQ2 player, shelling out her monthly dues to Sony for TWO accounts (whereas I could only ever afford one). In spite of Sony saying ALL CHARACTERS created before 12/6 this year would be grandfathered, which every one of her characters WERE MADE BEFORE THAT DATE (well before it), they are refusing to grandfather her characters based on some notion that it is just too many characters to unlock for any one person. Well, which is it? Are they going to unlock ALL CHARACTERS as the grandfather clause states, or are they going to "hem and haw" their way out of it just because someone actually has what they feel to be an unfair amount of characters? They said ALL CHARACTERS, so someone at Sony needs to really step up to the plate and do WHAT WAS PROMISED!!!!

Myserable

12-17-2011, 03:13 PM

yes not only do i have 2 accounts but i piad station access for BOTH of them so i padi double what many ppl paid for. Now that i am disabled i am not able to maintain that lifestyle but they did say they would unlock all chara well only 5 on each account have been and then when i wanted a certain one they said well you can delete on to get to the one you one what kinda cr ap is that

BWLeeEllison

12-17-2011, 04:39 PM

And that is totally unacceptible, given the understanding is all characters created BEFORE 12/6/11.

Mystfit

12-17-2011, 09:32 PM

There's two ways of defining unlocked with the game these days:1. how many character slots you have access to depending on your subscription plan.2. the races/classes that are locked to you because of your subscription plan. (free vs paid)If you had station access at one time, you got to make alot of characters, if you're trying to play free, you likely won't be able to play all of them. Depending on your subscription plan you get so many characters....there's some thread on the mathmatics involved in that when they switched to f2p. What types of accounts get what number of character slots. That's one number. Which sounds like 5 in your case, but I can't speak for sure.Within the parameter of THAT NUMBER OF SLOTS, those characters are all unlocked race/class wise if done before the cut off point. I imagine you'll find ALL your characters have their races and classes unlocked, but not all your character slots are unlocked. I'm nor familar with the math involved, but you'd need to pursure how many slots are avaialbe to you based on your subscrption plan, that's ow many characters you get. Two different words. They promised all your old characters would have their races and classes unlocked, they did NOT say you'd be able to play all of them if your subscription plan has changed since you made them.However, it would be nice to let people order their accounts so they can access the characters they want to play and not delete just to get below a certain threshold in case a person changed their minds and wanted to up their plan and get access to those slots later.

BWLeeEllison

12-17-2011, 10:09 PM

The original thread is here <a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?topic_id=510914">http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...topic_id=510914</a>.The specific text in that post to which I am referring is as follows:*Every* character that was created before 12/06/2011 at 12:01 am will be grandfathered in without race or class restriction. This means that regardless of your membership level, you will be able to play any character created before 12/6 without paying for race- or class-pack unlocks.Please note: I did not highlight the section in green. That was done by Sony. That text is at the heart of the argument I am making for my exgf. SHE DESERVES the same grandfathering every returning player got so that she will "be able to play ANY character created before 12/6". Forget any other unlocks. SHE should have this same level of grandfathering.

Mystfit

12-17-2011, 11:34 PM

OK. I'm out <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Sagart

12-19-2011, 04:39 PM

Did this get done? I have exactly TWO characters on this account. One created after F2P that is in the free choices. and one created LONG ago that was supposed to get grandfathered and my station cash refunded for the unlocks I had to buy to make him playable before they decided to grandfather. But I have not yet seen the SC go back into my account.

BWLeeEllison

12-19-2011, 06:21 PM

<cite>Sagart wrote:</cite><blockquote>Did this get done? I have exactly TWO characters on this account. One created after F2P that is in the free choices. and one created LONG ago that was supposed to get grandfathered and my station cash refunded for the unlocks I had to buy to make him playable before they decided to grandfather. But I have not yet seen the SC go back into my account.</blockquote>You have to petition them to get it taken care of. Whether or not they will honor their word is entirely up in the air. They have honored it for me, but not for my ex gf. Presumably, as you have only one character to grandfather, they will, based on previous perfomance, take care of you. Their word is apparently not their bond, however, so don't hold your breath, unless you prefer to have the complexion of a smurf <img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.

WhillowDivchyna

12-22-2011, 12:29 PM

I'm not complaining at all, simply because I haven't logged into this game since 2006 and still had mail from a guild I barely remember. I don't remember how to play a Brigand, but hopefully I'll figure that out soon.The only question I have is how I'm supposed to play my Kerra Druid...*dead silence*. I can't change her class because none of them are compatible, and her class doesn't exist anymore? I don't want to delete it if there's someway to fix it. I'm thinking I'll just have to delete her.

rwolfen

12-22-2011, 12:33 PM

Absolutely shocked and overjoyed!!! Right now I am on the silver membership because I just can't afford the gold. When I can afford the gold I pay for it. Thank you so much for a great Christmas present!<img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" />

BWLeeEllison

12-22-2011, 01:05 PM

<cite>WhillowDivchyna wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm not complaining at all, simply because I haven't logged into this game since 2006 and still had mail from a guild I barely remember. I don't remember how to play a Brigand, but hopefully I'll figure that out soon.The only question I have is how I'm supposed to play my Kerra Druid...*dead silence*. I can't change her class because none of them are compatible, and her class doesn't exist anymore? I don't want to delete it if there's someway to fix it. I'm thinking I'll just have to delete her.</blockquote>All you have to do is finish her quests.

BWLeeEllison

12-22-2011, 01:06 PM

<cite>rwolfen wrote:</cite><blockquote>Absolutely shocked and overjoyed!!! Right now I am on the silver membership because I just can't afford the gold. When I can afford the gold I pay for it. Thank you so much for a great Christmas present!<img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" /> </blockquote>Glad for you! It would be nice is Sony were to grandfather my ex gf's characters.

WhillowDivchyna

12-22-2011, 01:09 PM

<cite>BWLeeEllison wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>WhillowDivchyna wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm not complaining at all, simply because I haven't logged into this game since 2006 and still had mail from a guild I barely remember. I don't remember how to play a Brigand, but hopefully I'll figure that out soon.The only question I have is how I'm supposed to play my Kerra Druid...*dead silence*. I can't change her class because none of them are compatible, and her class doesn't exist anymore? I don't want to delete it if there's someway to fix it. I'm thinking I'll just have to delete her.</blockquote>All you have to do is finish her quests.</blockquote>I don't think I made that post clear - I can't log in using her. She is completely unplayable because the class I chose for her is no longer an option. When I click on her, it prompts the character creation screen. The classes for my subscription level are unavailable, and I'm quite certain I wouldn't be able to click on the premium classes if I paid for them. She's completely unplayable, but still in my character screen.

BWLeeEllison

12-22-2011, 10:49 PM

Back in the old days, you had to play through one class to level 10, and another to level 20 where you got your final class.It was fighter, mage, priest, and rogue from 1 to 10. Each of those classes had a couple of choices to 20 at which point you became one of the classes we have now. The reason I say finish up her quests is that the quest givers should still be in the game and so you should be able to get her to her final form which would be fury or warden.If they grandfathered her, which means she is playable, then she can reach her final state, and is worth saving.

PsiaMeese

12-22-2011, 11:38 PM

<cite>BWLeeEllison wrote:</cite><blockquote>Back in the old days, you had to play through one class to level 10, and another to level 20 where you got your final class.It was fighter, mage, priest, and rogue from 1 to 10. Each of those classes had a couple of choices to 20 at which point you became one of the classes we have now. The reason I say finish up her quests is that the quest givers should still be in the game and so you should be able to get her to her final form which would be fury or warden.If they grandfathered her, which means she is playable, then she can reach her final state, and is worth saving.</blockquote>So their Kerra is a Druid. This places it somewhere between level 11 and 19. These days you choose Fury or Warden from start of the character, it's unlikely the earlier steps are still a part of the game anymore. Unfortunately, quests do get removed from EQ2 as development progresses. I recommend /petition may be necessary to get the issue into a GM queue. I suspect with the holidays unfolding it may take a few weeks for a GM to sort out that specific character.

BWLeeEllison

12-23-2011, 12:33 AM

Be that as it may, I am heartened by the fact that the character got grandfathered.

WhillowDivchyna

12-23-2011, 02:31 AM

<cite>BWLeeEllison wrote:</cite><blockquote>Be that as it may, I am heartened by the fact that the character got grandfathered. </blockquote>So am I, which is why I don't want to delete her. I do plan on purchases in the future, but wasn't thinking of the race packs. My main is a Dark Elf Brigand that I stopped leveling in '06 - I'll be occupied with learning how to play that again, lol./petition may be the way to go. Until then - she'll just be hanging out on the character screen. Thanks for the advice, guys!

zokissa

12-28-2011, 02:58 PM

This is great for us returning folks.... but I do have a question? My live account was on a European server. I would love to transfer my main character to the US server that I am playing on now but have found that splitpaw is the only European server listed. I played on Runnyeye. I found an article on transferring characters but it was dated 2009. Is this the current practice $25 for character transfer or has that changed since then? Can we even transfer our characters anymore? I would really love to get her back as she has items that were discontinued and you can't get anymore not to mention she was the only character that I got to level 80.... Any information on this would be greatly appreciated....Zokissa

Serelinde

12-31-2011, 08:36 PM

I'm returning. I was forced not to play after 4 years of paying for membership due to monetary situation. I'm now trying to log in for the first time (busy holiday) and I'm so excited my heart is racing. I get to keep my characters? That's thrilling to me. I did pay for one class race pack after trying F2P before merge, so this could all be great news for me. I'm not yet sure what the differences will be in logging in. Fingers are crossed. I was on Nagafen. Just hope that nothing messed up the character names I've had for close to 4 years.

Serelinde

12-31-2011, 09:11 PM

So let me get this straight. I log in to my level 90. I have full slots of toons, most with masters and good gear that I've earned in Raiding. It's 150 station cash for 5 slots to unlock. It's $10 for 1000 station cash. So for $20 I get around 66 slots/spells to unlock. I have at least around 17 slots worth of different types of gear to unlock just on one toon. Plus her masters (I'm assuming, I haven't tried them to know what I can and can't use.) It's all adept and I know they were masters, so yeah, all of those. How much money do they expect someone to pay just to unlock gear and spells? Isn't 150 for 5 slots a bit ridiculous to get the gear we had before? I started to pay for station cash, did the math and just want my money back. I was excited, but why bother? LOTRO is far easier to deal with, and with LOTRO they DO get my money when I have money to give because they give more for what you are doing on the game. I paid for 4 years, bought expansions, all that. Not that excited anymore. It's been a very rough year and an even rougher holiday month. We didn't have Christmas like a lot of people did. Just couldn't afford that. LOTRO doesn't take away what you've already earned and paid for and I'm fine with paying to unlock NEW stuff. Just unlock on one character is hard enough, once more on my two main toons? We won't even go into that we have 7 character slots.

Serelinde

12-31-2011, 09:22 PM

Basically, until they do better with their grandfathered, once I'm past this bad patch, I'll go pay to play LOTRO and won't pay for Everquest II. If they can't do a bit better with their F2P set up, then another company deserves my money more. I won't bother.

Juravael

01-01-2012, 12:28 AM

<cite>Serelinde wrote:</cite><blockquote>Basically, until they do better with their grandfathered, once I'm past this bad patch, I'll go pay to play LOTRO and won't pay for Everquest II. If they can't do a bit better with their F2P set up, then another company deserves my money more. I won't bother. </blockquote>Bye.

Serelinde

01-01-2012, 06:22 AM

<cite>BWLeeEllison wrote:</cite><blockquote>Keep my effing gear. See if I care. My guild is at level 62 with 2, possibly 3 people left alive in it. I am the only one willing to give up time levelling it. I cannot level it with pvp. I cannot level it with adventuring writs with naked toons. I will sit in my guild hall probably by myself and level it to 90, however slow that may be. I will not try to get others to come help me in the form of new players for Sony to financially drain so long as I am doomed to play the game without my gear. I cannot afford the unlock, therefor, I will not get the unlock unless and until Sony sees how many people want their old gear back FIRST. I said it before, my current gear is not really worth paying for, but it is better than what I could buy to use right now. If I have to pay cash money for gear, then put the ability to buy the best gear for your current level in as an option. I'll scrounge, beg, and borrow for THAT, but to pay cash money for the crap I currently? eh, no.</blockquote>I have a level 90 Troubador. Naked she's toast. My current gear is mostly fabled that I earned through Raiding, Class questing, my fabled weapon, my PVP writs. Even had to pay for the harvesting cloak to be unlocke and I spent hours and days on that quest. It's a PVP server, so it's not like I can run out and quest anywhere without gear. I'll just get ganked constantly. So whereas I'd happily pay when I'm able to to unlock new gear, unlocking what I've earned in time is expensive on 7 toons. So I unlocked 2 toons and I really don't feel like bothering to quest, to play, or do anything after having to do so at a time when it's tight financially. Why do I have to? You can ask? I have friends I made over 4 years. I talk to them in game. To even log in, I had to pay $5 for 3 days when I could. I did so. I pay any month that I can afford it. Unfortunately, that's not right now. So it's like saying, "Here, have your toons, but just kidding, you can't actually play." I can at least talk to my friends for free now. I mention the other game, which is PVE mind you, because when you pay each time they don't take away the gear you earned. They just have you pay to unlock new areas or quest packs, gear etc after you stopped paying. Then when you're able to pay again, you can get those things included. It creates loyalty. As a business model, loyalty is necessity. Sony has made so many decisions over the years that overall they have a bad name. I love EQ2 because I built friendships, was in the same guild for 4 years, worked hard on the toon. With LOTRO, I haven't had as much time into the game, but I can see that their model seems to keep a lot more people coming back. We loyally do pay for it on the months we can afford to do so. We know that when we can't pay for a month, we're locked on quests and areas, but the character isn't naked in battle. I had no gear, no ability to GET gear because I couldn't quest for that level of gear without gear on me, couldn't use the broker to buy gear either. Those are a lot of limitations that force someone to have to pay in a supposedly (but not really) free to play environment. To make a new toon under restrictions and start from scratch, I'd have to delete a beloved toon. Sorry, won't do that. I could play the new one for free, but I didn't want to give up something else to have to do that. I no longer had the option of just free to play. I had too many toons as the accounts were merged with no available slots and overflow. So I was pretty much stuck having to pay to unlock gear so I wouldn't only be stuck in my Guild Hall until someday when I can play. So basically, it went F2P and became merely a teaser I could log in to and remember what it was like to see my guild, but not play with them still without paying. That's really not free to play. That's false marketing. And I was in one of the oldest standing, largest guilds on Venekor, went through the merge to Nagafen, and now this merge. It's a PVP server. I have no choice but have gear. I do recurrently pay for the game and pay to play. I just don't like what feels like dishonesty when a business does whatever it can to get money out of people in ways that are...as stated, not entirely fair or honest. "You are correct when you say nothing is free. I paid for the expansion packs that gave me access to get the gear I have, and I also put forth the time and effort to get that gear. I earned it. It belongs to me. It is mine. I did not take that gear to a pawn shop, so why should I have to pay to get it back? That gear is part of my character. No high end character is playable without the gear they quested for, raided for, raised money for and purchased. "Agreed! I did pay a LOT into this game and for gear and a lot of time, and got a lot of people into this game to begin with. It would be awesome if life circumstances were different, but a character allowed to still be played...without gear, is useless. They'll get their money either way. It just means instead of paying for future monthly subscriptions, new expansions, new gear unlocks, lots more money they could easily have out of me as a paying customer if they had my loyalty...I'll pay the one time fee for the gear unlocks for the gear I already have so I can just talk to friends and I'll take money elsewhere. It's how consumerism works. You BUY loyalty just as much as customers pay you for services. It's give and take. Without give, you don't make money. I'm not in the boat of people able to defend SOE or pay for the game when I'm fighting to have a place to live month to month. All this said, (and loved the 'bye' as it contributed so much to the conversation) I'll probably just request a refund of the money for the unlocks and not play again ever. I thought it would be great to return. I really don't think the game is what it used to be.

Darkdourden

01-11-2012, 02:12 PM

First of all excuse my english.Well since i know that EverQuest 2 is "FTP" y decided to come back, but surprise, all the items for ur lvl 85 guardian (full fabled and what about the epic weapon? ridiculous since all the work i had to do to get it.) cant be used and not only my guardian so how am i going to kill anything nude? mastercrafteds are so expensive at broker and all i can get is a handcrafted / treasured stuff that turns me from MeatShield to PaperShield (i dont mean that u cant kill anything with that kind of stuff, but u all know that gear is half way to be good at ur class or atleast thats what i think).Gold/silver membership, whats that? really? so you mean that if i get my toon to lvl 90 i will not be able to raid or make normal/hard instances if i dont pay the 14$ - 15$? o well wait... u can buy tokens to unlock stuff, is this serious? 100SC each unlock that means that u need tons of unlockers to be something, and what if a piece u unlock today is gonna be upgraded tomorrow and you dont know or you are not sure? 100sc to the garbageIm sure that theres ppl that thinks they have to pay something to get quality and thats true, but making something free to force u pay to play the characters u have and u payed month by month to develop them and be able to use ur current stuff is not the best idea to keep returning players i rather prefer to play from 0 in a full EQ2 "FTP" (with its market) instead a False FTP that to be something u have to pay the same money each month.And after all this complain, all i want to know is when gonna SoE decide to grandfather characters instead of waiting the longer they can to grab all the money they can. Not a very kind comment i know but thats what i feel from SoE since i left the game.PD: I used to love this game, i would buy expansions if needed but dont make this such of things that make us feel robbed.PD2: Remove that Gold/Silver membership that all we know is something to force u pay to be able to do something at high lvl. Yeah that would make me feel robbed too, and thats me.PD3: make something free or not but dont play with ppls money like that.PD4: I like the idea to grandfather old toons but maybe not great idea to keep new players.

Hirofortis

01-12-2012, 08:01 PM

Thanks for the good laugh here. I would think you would be happy that you can actually play the game again and it is not costing you anything. The cost to unlock all your gear is prob $20.00 so don't know what the complaint is. Especailly when you consider that 1 month of gold is $15.00. So you can pay 20 and be set. Give it a break. they have give n you tons already.

Serelinde

01-12-2012, 10:19 PM

<cite>Hirofortis wrote:</cite><blockquote>Thanks for the good laugh here. I would think you would be happy that you can actually play the game again and it is not costing you anything. The cost to unlock all your gear is prob $20.00 so don't know what the complaint is. Especailly when you consider that 1 month of gold is $15.00. So you can pay 20 and be set. Give it a break. they have give n you tons already.</blockquote>Congratulations. You contributed nothing to the thread. $20.00....IF you have only lower level toons with few unlocks. A lot more if you have a PVP server and a toon at 90. I don't play my 90 for a reason. She has a full set of PVP gear, Raid gear, various gear pieces to unlock. She be expensive. If I get to where more outgoing funds fit my budget, maybe I'll play. I notice generally those that are upset are those that don't have much income right now and generally those that defend are clearly those that have plenty. It's really just the haves and have nots. This is par for the course. Either way, this thread goes no where anyway and I seriously do not expect that Sony cares or pays much attention to any of its players, as evidenced by a lot of the crazy stuff they've done throughout the last 4+ years. I'll play something else until this game is even viable, if I end up ever deciding that it is.

Darkdourden

01-13-2012, 08:45 AM

You probably havent read my post carefully Hirofortis, cause i never said that i dont want to pay anything, all i said is that if they really wanted a "FREE TO PLAY" they shouldnt force us to pay more than someone that pays month by month, for example, i have 3 toons at lvl 90 full fabled, then i decide to come back to the game cause now it's supposed to be "free" but not, you cant use the gear you fighted to obtain and all you can do is pay unlocks or upgrade to gold, Ok from this point now lets take care about tokens to unlock stuff:If there is 21 pieces of years in case of my Guardian: Tank stuff + Dps stuff = 42 pieces + resistances gear + some appareance items i have farmed (in a legit way without stealing to anyone something they can really use) lets say 50 pieces to unlock, considering that each token costs 150 SC and 500 is = 5€ (not sure about dollars) means that i have to spend -- 50 pieces * 150 SC = 7500 SC -- without considering the upgrades i could get in the future its = around 60€ + expansions packs velious + (the last one that name i dont remember) lets say 120 - 130€ average in total. And its only considering that i unlock 1 character, unlocking all my characters could be around 200€ to 300€ average in a low range i would say.So now, can you tell me wheres the trick? ok, i'll tell you, the trick is that they force you to pay monthly something that now its supposed to be "FREE" but it is cause if you dont, you will have to pay way way more than the monthly fee, and with more i mean 14€ *month or around 100€ to 300€ + future unlocks (depending on the account) that could cost you to play a "FREE" game with a gear that permits you do something, it's not free, it's a cruel joke from SoE that shows you "FREE TO PLAY YOUR WAY" in its game like if they where a NGO but they should change it to "(PAY THE) FEE TO PLAY YOUR WAY".To finish, i never meant that i want to play it free cause im monthly fee hater. I payed it for years until i had to leave and i was happy to pay and as i said i wouldnt mind to pay for expansions and to buy something from market that i really like, but dont call something free when it is NOT.

darwich

01-13-2012, 09:11 AM

It IS free to play, you can not say it is not. Before f2p you could not log in or anything..without paying... now with F2P you can log in and do things with no costs.. if you want to do more things, yes there is cost.. but you do not HAVE to do them.. if you want to, then there is additional costs, but there is a portion of the game that is entirely F2P up to 90 minus DOV..AOD... so yes, it IS F2P.

akin99

01-13-2012, 09:59 AM

People need to understand that yes the game is FTP but if you want to be able to play just like you did before you left you will have to pay. You can unlock 5 items for 150SC. so 600 SC in a one time payment lets you equipe one toon.I dont know where people get this idea that since the game is FTP I shold be able to do anything that anyone paying customer does for Free. Its not the way FTP works try any FTP game you are limited greatly unless you either subscribe or spend money in Micro transactions.EQ2 gives away far more than most of the games do. No FTP MMO is really Free it is just a different way to pay.

Finora

01-13-2012, 10:33 AM

<cite>akin99 wrote:</cite><blockquote>People need to understand that yes the game is FTP but if you want to be able to play just like you did before you left you will have to pay. You can unlock 5 items for 150SC. so 600 SC in a one time payment lets you equipe one toon.I dont know where people get this idea that since the game is FTP I shold be able to do anything that anyone paying customer does for Free. Its not the way FTP works try any FTP game you are limited greatly unless you either subscribe or spend money in Micro transactions.EQ2 gives away far more than most of the games do. No FTP MMO is really Free it is just a different way to pay.</blockquote>This exactly. F2P is pretty much an extended trial of the game. If you don't pay a sub you can at least log on and do stuff. For example, prior to this I couldn't log in my other account at all unless I wanted to pay a sub. Now I can. That's pretty nice.While I imagine it would be a pain to unlock a ton of gear you already had. However, you can get 50 unlockers for the price of a month's sub ($15/1500SC). I fail to see how that is a huge deal. The only thing I see is that on my silver account I will have to upgrade wisely as my characters get higher to avoid spending more than I want to (less than I would be spending on a month's sub else why go free?).

Darkdourden

01-13-2012, 11:15 AM

As i can see, not many ppl sees the trick on this F2P, so now think why SoE is deciding to grandfather characters, maybe they not doing that good guys.I can see that some ppl doesnt know about high end and how hard you need good gear to do be something at that point.So keep thinking that SoE do everything great and they will keep playing with you and your money as they are doing right now.

darwich

01-13-2012, 11:21 AM

<cite>Darkdourden wrote:</cite><blockquote>As i can see, not many ppl sees the trick on this F2P, so now think why SoE will grandfather characters, maybe they not doing that good guys.</blockquote>we do not see a trick because there isnt a trick... its people that think you shoudl get EVERYTHING free that have a bad perception, nothing is totally free in an F2P game.. your gimme gimme gimme attitude is what the trick is.

Darkdourden

01-13-2012, 11:23 AM

darwich mate why dont you read again? maybe the problem is my english but i never said that i dont want to pay for anything. Dont put words that i didnt say homie. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" />

darwich

01-13-2012, 11:35 AM

could be the translation, but hey, you should see me try to type in another language... dfkdjfli dfkdjfdkjkd fjdkfdfkdfkjd - why cant you understand me?? <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Aklira

01-13-2012, 01:24 PM

<cite>Darkdourden wrote:</cite><blockquote>You probably havent read my post carefully Hirofortis, cause i never said that i dont want to pay anything, all i said is that if they really wanted a "FREE TO PLAY" they shouldnt force us to pay more than someone that pays month by month, for example, i have 3 toons at lvl 90 full fabled, then i decide to come back to the game cause now it's supposed to be "free" but not, you cant use the gear you fighted to obtain and all you can do is pay unlocks or upgrade to gold, Ok from this point now lets take care about tokens to unlock stuff:If there is 21 pieces of years in case of my Guardian: Tank stuff + Dps stuff = 42 pieces + resistances gear + some appareance items i have farmed (in a legit way without stealing to anyone something they can really use) lets say 50 pieces to unlock, considering that each token costs 150 SC and 500 is = 5€ (not sure about dollars) means that i have to spend -- 50 pieces * 150 SC = 7500 SC -- without considering the upgrades i could get in the future its = around 60€ + expansions packs velious + (the last one that name i dont remember) lets say 120 - 130€ average in total. And its only considering that i unlock 1 character, unlocking all my characters could be around 200€ to 300€ average in a low range i would say.So now, can you tell me wheres the trick? ok, i'll tell you, the trick is that they force you to pay monthly something that now its supposed to be "FREE" but it is cause if you dont, you will have to pay way way more than the monthly fee, and with more i mean 14€ *month or around 100€ to 300€ + future unlocks (depending on the account) that could cost you to play a "FREE" game with a gear that permits you do something, it's not free, it's a cruel joke from SoE that shows you "FREE TO PLAY YOUR WAY" in its game like if they where a NGO but they should change it to "(PAY THE) FEE TO PLAY YOUR WAY".To finish, i never meant that i want to play it free cause im monthly fee hater. I payed it for years until i had to leave and i was happy to pay and as i said i wouldnt mind to pay for expansions and to buy something from market that i really like, but dont call something free when it is NOT.</blockquote> It is free to play because before you wouldn't have been able to even log in without paying. Also this game has far fewer restrictions than other MMOs that are f2p. I think i've played most of them that are out there when I couldn't afford to pay for EQ2.You are misrepresenting the amount that it would cost you to unlock 1 high end character's gear. 150sc = 5 unlockers so 150sc x 10 = 50 unlockers. You would need 1500sc to unlock every slot. $5 USD=500sc so unlocking all your gear would be $15 USD which is approximately what you would spend on a 1 month subscription. You then would not have to pay anything more until you need to upgrade your gear which if you're level 90 and have maxxed out your gear you shouldn't need to do. If you haven't maxed out your gear.. pay for one or two months, max it out and then just buy the unlockers. It's not rocket science.. if you are on a tight budget do the math and figure out what you can afford. $15 USD is not a lot for unlocking all the gear on a high-end toon especially since you'll then be able to play without incurring further fees... unless you want to buy something fancy for your home or buy vanity armor from the cash shop.It really is free to play your way, they simply didn't mean it in the 'you get everything without paying anything' way that all the greedy whiners have interpreted it to mean. They're a business, businesses need to make money. they are simply trying to follow a new business model that has so far been proven to work and been a lot more generous in what we're getting in the process.And before all you trolls hit with me the you must be wealthy blash blah blah stuff. I'm living on umemployment while looking for a new job. My fiance is disabled. I pay for 2 accounts for for us to have a little relaxation. I have to budget my money carefully to make sure we get all our bills paid and still get to eat so don't even go there.

Aklira

01-13-2012, 01:41 PM

<cite>zokissa wrote:</cite><blockquote>This is great for us returning folks.... but I do have a question? My live account was on a European server. I would love to transfer my main character to the US server that I am playing on now but have found that splitpaw is the only European server listed. I played on Runnyeye. I found an article on transferring characters but it was dated 2009. Is this the current practice $25 for character transfer or has that changed since then? Can we even transfer our characters anymore? I would really love to get her back as she has items that were discontinued and you can't get anymore not to mention she was the only character that I got to level 80.... Any information on this would be greatly appreciated....Zokissa</blockquote> Last I knew there were still transfer tokens but I'm not sure of the current cost.If they are available on the station cash store (they used to be but I haven't checked recently) you might be able to save a bit of money by waiting for a double or triple sc event to purchase.

Darkdourden

01-13-2012, 02:07 PM

It's a pity, i cant Quote what moderators says about grandfathering characters before de F2P, maybe i dont know how to, not very used to post on forums, but if after weeks or months of making this game F2P they have decided to grandfather characters, but theres still ppl that defends that its not fair or something or maybe i dont get it at all.15USD? expensive no i dont think so, in my position i should be able to afrod that, but since i could play this game for only 2 days per week it doesn't deserve to pay it.I'd like to know that if SoE decide to definitely remove gold/silver subscription removing the montly fee, keeping market and keep making new exp packs that i would definitely pay. Would you agree or not with that? or would you feel bad because while they keep earning money, (probably enough if not more since free mmorpgs are getting mayor income with microtransactions) your not paying your 15USD - 14€ that makes you feel better with your self?You should know that what i mention in the previous paragraph is highly probably to happen since the growing mmorpg market, and in my opinion SoE is making a race against this to earn all the money they can before making it this way, so why dont you guys break your mental wall out of the basics of the economy and try to think on it in an other way?Maybe years ago i would think like you Aklira, i dont mean that im totally right but what i say i think makes sense and is the fairest way for everyone that wants to play this game.

akin99

01-14-2012, 12:55 PM

SOE only wants players who are willing to spend money to play. I dont see why you dont understand this. If they unlock all of your items and toons what incentive do you have to ever pay them any money.I know this game is very gear driven basicly the FTP is designed to give you a extended free trial then convince you to subscribe or spend in the cash shop.I think a 15-30 day free gold membership for returning players might be nice but really that is about the limit to what they should offer. You can play all the way to 90 in tresured items and adept spells. Now if you want to do DOV yes you will have to buy unlockers or sub that is really to be expected.Every FTP game has some point where the FTP just no longer works that is by design. SOE doesnt want FTP customers they want and need paying customers.

Grimfang

01-16-2012, 11:40 PM

I still think they *** veterans that are returning or dont/didnt want to sub when the game went F2P. Why am I stating that? Well, you see, all that gear you managed to get your hands on, say legendary/fabled. You now somehow magically cannot use that equipment.What they should have done was:The gear you have amassed BEFORE the game went F2P you can still use, I mean, the veterans DID work hard for that gear.But oh well, what do I care anyways? I am not playing anymore. But just wanted to went the above.

savedx

01-17-2012, 05:21 AM

So hear me out guys. I get an email EQ2 is now f2p and not just f2p "free to play your way". So i log into my account thinking wow i get to play the game ive payed for all these years for free cool. Then the game is done loading poof my character has no gear. How is a game that is so gear oriented going to be played with out gear? Now im not saying that you shouldnt pay for unlocks for future gear that you get but the gear you had on should still be useable for that toon. As far as the money argument im lucky if i have enought money to have internet/gas money let alone paying for a game every month. The main argument im seeing here is how is it sonys fault that you dont have any money? Its not but if you are going to claim that a game is going to be free to play your way using the words they provided. I would assume since you are sending the email to vetrans that the gear they had on at the time they loged out would still be usable by them. The state of the game when i quit was not good to begin with let alone what it probly looks like now with tor. If you want to be a pay to play game then get rid of the silver/bronze subs but being free to play atleast means you should have what you earned before you quit.

Sai

02-11-2012, 09:30 AM

<cite>savedx wrote:</cite><blockquote>So hear me out guys. I get an email EQ2 is now f2p and not just f2p "free to play your way". So i log into my account thinking wow i get to play the game ive payed for all these years for free cool. Then the game is done loading poof my character has no gear. How is a game that is so gear oriented going to be played with out gear? Now im not saying that you shouldnt pay for unlocks for future gear that you get but the gear you had on should still be useable for that toon. As far as the money argument im lucky if i have enought money to have internet/gas money let alone paying for a game every month. The main argument im seeing here is how is it sonys fault that you dont have any money? Its not but if you are going to claim that a game is going to be free to play your way using the words they provided. I would assume since you are sending the email to vetrans that the gear they had on at the time they loged out would still be usable by them. The state of the game when i quit was not good to begin with let alone what it probly looks like now with tor. If you want to be a pay to play game then get rid of the silver/bronze subs but being free to play atleast means you should have what you earned before you quit.</blockquote>Agreed. I stopped playing in 2010. Now I downloaded the game, and I was really happy (almost cried ^_^<img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />, when I saw my good old character on my screen. I loged in, and I was nude, since all my stuff is Fabled (the shard set from the Void) with my old mythical weapon. It's a nice move to make old characters "grandfater", but once I was able to wield these armors and gear, why not now?It's a nice move indeed, but not even close to perfect.