Butcherblock: Severe random PQ lag [Archive] - EQ2 Forum Archive @ EQ2Wire

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Jrel

03-10-2011, 09:48 PM

On Butcherblock, for the past two days, there has been severe choppy server lag at the PQ sites when the event is not even active. Only if I move away from about 12 players or more (near the PQ center) does the lag go away. It is random whether it happens at SG or RW, and only if I face a large group of players near the center of the lag area. Voicechat is totally unaffected. Even with Extreme Performance, frame rate drops from 60 to 2, and other players in raid or chat or nearby state they are sensing the same thing.If I fly straight up from the center of the lag area, or move about 30m away, the lag goes away, but returns if I go back near it. It happens in the same place around RW waypoint 253, -327, -396. In SG, it happens where the chest spawns.

TSR-JoshuaM

03-11-2011, 12:05 AM

In an effort to get as much information as I can for these issues, could you please PM me your DXDIAG information? I'll see what I can do about reproducing the issue to track it down.

kdmorse

03-11-2011, 03:31 AM

I've seen it quite a bit as well. It's something on the screen, something on a player. Be it a item, effect, mount, etc... I do not know. But I think it's flying mount related. Or perhaps a flying mount combined with something else.There have been times where I have been able to (very slowly) just look in the other direction, and it will clear up. Looking straight up or down will always clear it up. I dual client, so I have two points of view up at any given time, and they lag independantly. ie, if the clients are facing in differnet directions, the client with the troublesome player on the screen will lag like this, but the other client will not. It's not always a player in the main pile of combat. Sometimes it's a straggler off to the side. (ie, looking at the main pile is fine, but looking backwards at the straggler causes the problem).Sometimes, after a PQ has broken up, and I leave the area, a player will fly by through my field of view, and trigger the problem, until they are passed. (Always on a flying mount).btw: if you play in a window, you can clear it up quickly by trying to aim your view upwards or downwards, or in another direction, then minimize the client. While minimized, the problem does not occure, and the characters view will change quickly (lag free), then you can restore the client and have your FPS back.

Jrel

03-11-2011, 01:04 PM

<cite>TSR-JoshuaM wrote:</cite><blockquote>In an effort to get as much information as I can for these issues, could you please PM me your DXDIAG information? I'll see what I can do about reproducing the issue to track it down.</blockquote>Done! Thank you for your assistance! I'm not sure about being able to reproduce it without just being there and hanging out until it hits. Maybe once or twice a day for me out of 2-4 separate PQs.Unless I had a direct line or maybe I could send a petition with a special flag word, I could notify as soon as it happens.

Jrel

03-11-2011, 05:57 PM

Happening right now at Ring War, 2:56PM CST, Butcherblock, [Removed for Content] 1.Happened earlier at Ring War, 1pm CST, Butcherblock, [Removed for Content] 2.

ObsidianNightmare

03-11-2011, 05:59 PM

As far as I understand this is a gamewide issue except for perhaps Antionia Bayle

Jrel

03-11-2011, 06:16 PM

Could also be a server virus scanner, or backup, or defragmenter taking up major cpu cycles. Just a thought.

TSR-JoshuaM

03-11-2011, 06:19 PM

<cite>Nyfe@Butcherblock wrote:</cite><blockquote>Could also be a server virus scanner, or backup, or defragmenter taking up major cpu cycles. Just a thought.</blockquote>Absolutely. I wouldn't be able to confirm or deny such a claim is the case, not on the server team here, but hopefully all of the information I have been gathering provides an avenue to progress in resolving this altogether.

Dynon

03-11-2011, 09:27 PM

I have been having the same problem.In the SG PQ I was just in I was running at 55 FPS, but as soon as I looked basically where the chest spawns I would drop to 1 FPS. popping up the performance monitor on my G15 I wasnt using 1/2 my ram or Processor, nothing else on my PC was lagging, just a MASSIVE drop in FPS any time I looked in that general area. It was like somone had an illusion or mount or something that was causing the issue but in trying to pan my camera around and see exactly where the lag started and ended I couldnt narrow it down to a single person/pet/illusion.This Typically doesnt happen to me even in raids on MUCH higher settings and it only happens every once in a while so I am pretty convinced it is something a player was wearing/wielding/etc.

TSR-JoshuaM

03-11-2011, 11:45 PM

We'll see if it can be reproduced with different combinations in office.

Jrel

03-12-2011, 12:56 PM

Ring War, 09:55 AM CST

Liavy

03-12-2011, 04:20 PM

I notice this type of lag when my CPU approaches 150*F, which may be the issue with a lot of people as this game is highly CPU intensive. Download CoreTemp and monitor your CPU temperature when this happens to see if maybe it's a cooling issue. I've since added a couple of fans to my machine and very seldom to I ever go >130*F now, and this issue seems to have gone away for me entirely.

Rotate

03-12-2011, 04:24 PM

I was just in umm ringwar area on naggy sever. I ran up to one fp killed him then a mage comes into view my fps drop from 55 to 1 ... they have like maybe 4 people around. I cant do anything i die.. this mage backs away my fps go back to 55.. he flying in circles around me when he comes withing i guess around 30 metters my fps drop to 1 .. when he flys off they go back up to 55. There is def some graphic bug doing this. Some pq's i go to 90 peeps in zone and i have no screen lag. Others i get this freeze frame 1 fps lag when i face certain people.PS. charaters name i just notced that caused it was Chessterr. I dont think he is doing anything i just think some maybe graphic glich with soemthing he has on? i really dunno whats going on.. lol

ObsidianNightmare

03-12-2011, 06:16 PM

<cite>iavy@Butcherblock wrote:</cite><blockquote>I notice this type of lag when my CPU approaches 150*F, which may be the issue with a lot of people as this game is highly CPU intensive. Download CoreTemp and monitor your CPU temperature when this happens to see if maybe it's a cooling issue. I've since added a couple of fans to my machine and very seldom to I ever go >130*F now, and this issue seems to have gone away for me entirely.</blockquote>To test your theroy I will participate in a Ring War with my CPU monitor running. Waiting for the Ring war to start.. my temps ere at 110˚F - 125˚F on my dual core pc. I am on GukI'll keep my settings on Extreme Performance for the experiment. Still waiting..So, to give you a clue of how terrible lag has been in this game for me and others raiding in contested areas for the last few years, I've had every one of my bars set to the minimal settings and played raids with my settings on a complete blur and this does not improve performance what so ever. In the past I've even gone so far to reduce my video card's settings to minimal quality and max performance.. same deal.Still Waiting..My case is well ventalted and I've only experienced some slowness issues on a very hot day in the summertime being in a room with no AC. My temps seem to have stabalized around 120˚F - 124˚FStill Waiting 3 mins to go...In my experience, there is a slight noticible difference between slowness experienced with the lag in the game on the server end, lag on your end due to performance issues and lag on your end due to your bandwidth being choked. All three of these lag issues have characteristics that, to me, tell them apart. Personally I feel your our hot core issue is different than issues being reported by many game wide. With all the activity I'm about to experience .. we'll see what happens with my temps.OK Battle's over.. no noticible change whatsoever the entire time in my core temps and there was noicable lag.. Not totally horrible but it's 4pm EST on a saturday and it could be off times.The lag I experience that effects gameplay that most everyone is screaming about is what happens when you click your attacks/spells and nothing happens and you're not sure if the game recognizes that you have clicked them or not. Then anywhere from 2 - 10 seconds later you see your bar go across the screen casting the spell. That's if your lucky.. sometimes the spell doesn't even cast at all.. For me and many others raiding TSO avatars and now these PQs, we are used to timing our spells and cures to work with this sort of lag, however there is a limit to what you can do to counter the lag and kill the mob. When the lag is so terrible and your efforts just cause wipe after wipe, you eventuall move on to another zone that might not be so horrible with lag or even call it a night.This is being screamed about more now because the entire server is now getting to experience what most hardcore raiders on all the other servers have experienced through contested Avatars (except AB now.. they are in tip top shape)

ObsidianNightmare

03-12-2011, 07:13 PM

Doing SG now.. Same deal.. however the lag is 1000x worse.. also there are 2 raid groups and some other random people in the zone

ET429

03-13-2011, 12:36 AM

1st time I experienced it was during the gnome mount races.I'ts very random..but has to do with 1 player...during the race when i got close to him, my fps dropped to 2 and i would stop racing until he was out of range...back up to 40-60fps...started back up and as soon as he came into view you could not do anything becasue of the lag.The other times I've seen it, it appears to be player related. I have /camp to self and when I respawned with the same group around me, it was gone.Today (one time out of about 6hrs of playtime) I had it at a PQ group...couldn't look at them. I lowered graphic settings to lowest (min on everything) and I didn't have to camp to self. I didn't want to camp because I might not get back in the same zone.Possibly related with the new gnome mounts and players appearance. Just saying, because I never had the issue until they were introduced.

Andok

03-13-2011, 02:50 PM

I was having this same problem, and I just fixed it!!!Like others reported, the severe low FPS was random - I would be in some huge battles and not have it, and then it would just start up even in average sized battles. First I focused on my computer - I disabled just about everything (even my anti-virus) and it didn't help (and I have a pretty good system). I figured it was caused by a texture or spell effect that wasn't common, so I turned down all of my settings to the lowest possible settings hoping to make the texture/effect go away. At first I would think I fixed it, and then it would pop up again (Yay for troubleshooting a problem that comes and goes). Each time it would happen, I would open my settings and turn more settings off or down - when I ran out of display settings to turn down, I starting trying other settings...sound, voice chat, and then I found it! On Alternate Models, somehow one box got checked for SOGA (I think it was half elf females). I unchecked the box, and my PQ slideshow went away! Wooo!!! Another reason for me to hate SOGA <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" />EDIT: BTW, I did that yesterday, and I haven't had a slideshow since... knock on wood.EDIT2: Ok, just to test, I found a female half elf in the PQ area, and then I turned the SOGA model back on. Nothing - not the slide show I expected. The problem still hasn't come back, so maybe I dislodged some bit somewhere when I initially changed the model.

Jrel

03-13-2011, 09:23 PM

<cite>ObsidianNightmare wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>iavy@Butcherblock wrote:</cite><blockquote>I notice this type of lag when my CPU approaches 150*F, which may be the issue with a lot of people as this game is highly CPU intensive. Download CoreTemp and monitor your CPU temperature when this happens to see if maybe it's a cooling issue. I've since added a couple of fans to my machine and very seldom to I ever go >130*F now, and this issue seems to have gone away for me entirely.</blockquote>To test your theroy I will participate in a Ring War with my CPU monitor running. Waiting for the Ring war to start.. my temps ere at 110˚F - 125˚F on my dual core pc. I am on GukI'll keep my settings on Extreme Performance for the experiment. Still waiting..So, to give you a clue of how terrible lag has been in this game for me and others raiding in contested areas for the last few years, I've had every one of my bars set to the minimal settings and played raids with my settings on a complete blur and this does not improve performance what so ever. In the past I've even gone so far to reduce my video card's settings to minimal quality and max performance.. same deal.Still Waiting..My case is well ventalted and I've only experienced some slowness issues on a very hot day in the summertime being in a room with no AC. My temps seem to have stabalized around 120˚F - 124˚FStill Waiting 3 mins to go...In my experience, there is a slight noticible difference between slowness experienced with the lag in the game on the server end, lag on your end due to performance issues and lag on your end due to your bandwidth being choked. All three of these lag issues have characteristics that, to me, tell them apart. Personally I feel your our hot core issue is different than issues being reported by many game wide. With all the activity I'm about to experience .. we'll see what happens with my temps.OK Battle's over.. no noticible change whatsoever the entire time in my core temps and there was noicable lag.. Not totally horrible but it's 4pm EST on a saturday and it could be off times.The lag I experience that effects gameplay that most everyone is screaming about is what happens when you click your attacks/spells and nothing happens and you're not sure if the game recognizes that you have clicked them or not. Then anywhere from 2 - 10 seconds later you see your bar go across the screen casting the spell. That's if your lucky.. sometimes the spell doesn't even cast at all.. For me and many others raiding TSO avatars and now these PQs, we are used to timing our spells and cures to work with this sort of lag, however there is a limit to what you can do to counter the lag and kill the mob. When the lag is so terrible and your efforts just cause wipe after wipe, you eventuall move on to another zone that might not be so horrible with lag or even call it a night.This is being screamed about more now because the entire server is now getting to experience what most hardcore raiders on all the other servers have experienced through contested Avatars (except AB now.. they are in tip top shape)</blockquote>Actually, the lag in my OP is not about the "normal" lag associated with 48+ players, and mass AOEs occuring during the PQs. The lag I am talking about is much more severe than that, and even occurs when a PQ is not happening. The lag only occurs in the PQ areas.

Blambil

03-14-2011, 01:47 PM

(sorry for the repost, but this seems to be the right thread for this information)-------------------------First off, the lag isn't specific to Storm Gorge, I've observed serious lag issues in both PQ's. There are several things currently broken, together they can make the PQ's amazingly painful to downright impossible, mostly when an x4 or greater are in the same general area with each other.. 1. Server Lag -- This is manifested as delay in spell icons.. Click it,, wait.. nothing happens.. 2 to 20 seconds later, your spell casts, icons gray out. This happens OFTEN in PQ's, especially as the number of people in the area exceeds an x4..2. Client Lag -- This is new, worse. This manifests as complete client freeze. Mouse is usable OUTSIDE the EQ2 window, but inside the EQ2 window, all game progress, including the network monitor, framerate display, text chat, is COMPLETELY frozen. Chatter in chat channels, and within my own guild, indicates this is happening across MULTIPLE machines, across MULTIPLE OS's, across MULTIPLE network connections. I've had it happen on <a href="mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>/NV580 set at Extreme Performance, so it's not a client horsepower issue.I participated in probably a dozen PQ's over the weekend, and experienced both #1 and #2.. I did notice that looking directly down at the ground, zoomed all the way in, seems the ONLY way to survive when #2 happens. Sony, I beg you... Server lag is an issue you've been dealing with for years.. You know how to solve it.. throw $$/servers at it, and it goes away. The Client-side-lag is a BUG.. a big BAD bug.. that needs to be prioritized and fixed as quickly as possible. Realize that you have a highly intelligent user base, willing to help test to resolve this issue. Post a debug load, give us directions on how to collect data, let us help.

Hecula

03-14-2011, 06:04 PM

There are at least two types of lag in the PQs - the button lag is server side and isn't the subject of this particular bug. I have had the bug the OP described twice so far - both times was in the RW PQ. The first time I had it, I assumed it was just some graphics glitch in the zone. The second time, I tried to find out what was going on. I would be at 38fps solid then when I panned my view over the group of people, at some point it would drop to 1fps. When I panned away it went back to 38fps. So I started moving around to try and find the spot, still thinking it was some glitch in the scenery or something. I would walk forward then pan around until the glitch happened then move in that direction. I eventually go to a point where I could pan around 360 degrees and not get a drop in FPS. I thought I had found it so I was looking at the ground and couldn't see anything unusual. Then I looked up. Directly above me there was someone flying on a gryph - it was the tan one or light brown or whatever - when I panned up, as soon as the gryph got in view, I was down to 1fps again.I mentioned this in guild chat and someone there said that it was a soga glitch and suggested I try the old soga reset trick that we had to use on Trak where you type "/soga_models 0" - this worked perfectly. Back to 38fps and I could look up at the person on the gryph just fine.

Jrel

03-14-2011, 06:29 PM

SG 4:14pm CSTSG lagged a good 5 min straight so bad that the 4th rider disappeared during the middle of the 3rd wave, then showed up again 2 min later, we killed it, the quest journal is still showing 3/4 riders.A full 29 min after SG started, the SG has decreased in difficulty again for no reason.

Blambil

03-14-2011, 06:39 PM

<cite>Hecula wrote:</cite><blockquote><snip>... I would be at 38fps solid then when I panned my view over the group of people, at some point it would drop to 1fps. When I panned away it went back to 38fps........ you type "/soga_models 0" - this worked perfectly. Back to 38fps and I could look up at the person on the gryph just fine.</blockquote>You're describing what I was trying, but didn't have the patience for.. I just pointed at the ground to survive.That sounds like it just might work.. I'll try it tonight... Whatever the bug, it's broken bad.

TSR-JoshuaM

03-14-2011, 06:51 PM

I made some progress on reproducing some of these reports and my data has been sent in. I'll provide more information when I have it. In the meantime, if you have any further relevant information do not hesitate to post it here so that I may add it to my reporting.

Andok

03-14-2011, 07:16 PM

<cite>Andok wrote:</cite><blockquote>I was having this same problem, and I just fixed it!!!Like others reported, the severe low FPS was random - I would be in some huge battles and not have it, and then it would just start up even in average sized battles. First I focused on my computer - I disabled just about everything (even my anti-virus) and it didn't help (and I have a pretty good system). I figured it was caused by a texture or spell effect that wasn't common, so I turned down all of my settings to the lowest possible settings hoping to make the texture/effect go away. At first I would think I fixed it, and then it would pop up again (Yay for troubleshooting a problem that comes and goes). Each time it would happen, I would open my settings and turn more settings off or down - when I ran out of display settings to turn down, I starting trying other settings...sound, voice chat, and then I found it! On Alternate Models, somehow one box got checked for SOGA (I think it was half elf females). I unchecked the box, and my PQ slideshow went away! Wooo!!! Another reason for me to hate SOGA <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" />EDIT: BTW, I did that yesterday, and I haven't had a slideshow since... knock on wood.EDIT2: Ok, just to test, I found a female half elf in the PQ area, and then I turned the SOGA model back on. Nothing - not the slide show I expected. The problem still hasn't come back, so maybe I dislodged some bit somewhere when I initially changed the model. </blockquote>A guildmate just fixed his 1FPS slideshow by shutting off all SOGA. I don't know if it's the SOGA models themselves or just the process of switching that fixes it, but it has worked wonders for some of us.

TSR-JoshuaM

03-14-2011, 07:50 PM

I added in the SOGA part and did some testing here.

Kreton

03-14-2011, 08:29 PM

<img src="http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z178/subspacer/gglitch.jpg" />This is an old screenshot that illustrates the exact problem I'm having now in PQ's. It's not related to Soga models, but if you reset the models, the problem fixes itself. I have not seen this problem since this screenshot was taken years ago, that is until now in PQ's. I just dont have a screenshot of it in PQ's. But what happens is models are being randomly rendered with polygons connecting usually my head with some random person in PQ's. If I'm far enough away, the polygons are stretched so thin you don't actually see them, but the generate IMMENSE graphic lag. Simply resetting models (like disabling Soga models) fixes it, but I don't use Soga models so it's not directly related to them, it's just reseting the models redraws them correctly.So typically I can be standing in a raid in PQ's and will see this problem. I never have this issue in instance raids, and in fact I never have this issue any other place but PQ's. Something happens in the rendering of some player's models that cause this randomly, and it cripples my system until I reset the models. I don't know why this rendering bug is showing up again now, but it is.

Jrel

03-14-2011, 08:43 PM

I'm trying it now with all SOGA models off so I'll see how that goes.

Jrel

03-14-2011, 11:13 PM

All Soga models off didn't work. RW PQ, about 9:06PM CST lasted full 7 min.

Blambil

03-14-2011, 11:41 PM

soga off WORKED for me.. Thank you!!

Andok

03-21-2011, 01:46 PM

For SoE techs - even after shutting off SOGA models, this problem comes back occasionally. I made a macro with "/soga_models 0" that makes the problem go away instantly, so it isn't a major problem as long as you know what to do to fix it.

TSR-JoshuaM

03-21-2011, 01:48 PM

I put in a lot of time with the PQ's over the weekend and 'button lag' made it an auto-attack fight for me. This definitely needs more exposure and while I have already reported it previously I'll see what kind of pushing can be done.

Blambil

03-21-2011, 08:53 PM

<cite>TSR-JoshuaM wrote:</cite><blockquote>I put in a lot of time with the PQ's over the weekend and 'button lag' made it an auto-attack fight for me. This definitely needs more exposure and while I have already reported it previously I'll see what kind of pushing can be done.</blockquote>Sweet! When red-names can reproduce the problem, that usually means it's solved quick.... right?? <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

ObsidianNightmare

03-21-2011, 10:07 PM

If quick means waiting for similar fixes since TSO then sure!

Jrel

03-24-2011, 10:53 AM

<cite>Andok wrote:</cite><blockquote>For SoE techs - even after shutting off SOGA models, this problem comes back occasionally.</blockquote>+1

TSR-JoshuaM

03-24-2011, 11:08 AM

<cite>Blambil@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>TSR-JoshuaM wrote:</cite><blockquote>I put in a lot of time with the PQ's over the weekend and 'button lag' made it an auto-attack fight for me. This definitely needs more exposure and while I have already reported it previously I'll see what kind of pushing can be done.</blockquote>Sweet! When red-names can reproduce the problem, that usually means it's solved quick.... right?? <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></blockquote>Doing my best to get as much information over to development that I can. I did reproduce the issue and it does get pretty sluggish due to the amount of people present but I am confident we are on the right track towards improving the situation. I'll continue to update as information becomes available to me.

Jrel

04-01-2011, 12:59 AM

I think the issue is related to a character model. I've been hit with the severe lag now when someone suddenly runs close to me, and turning off the alternate models (or switching them on and off) fixes it. Locations were at the othmir dock and at the griffon station at Ring War remnants.

TSR-JoshuaM

04-01-2011, 12:07 PM

Disabling the SOGA models definitely helps many people, we're still working as hard as possible on reducing the amount of latency present during the PQs.

Jrel

04-03-2011, 12:58 PM

I'll try to collect names of people that lag me instantly when they appear on my screen while I'm solo (meaning, no one else besides me and the "lagger"):Barakruzz, while on his griffon mount, at RW station (on Bristlebane)

TSR-JoshuaM

04-04-2011, 06:14 PM

<cite>Nyfe@Butcherblock wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'll try to collect names of people that lag me instantly when they appear on my screen while I'm solo (meaning, no one else besides me and the "lagger"):Barakruzz, while on his griffon mount, at RW station (on Bristlebane)</blockquote>That could be invaluable information on identifying the issue here. Can you keep em coming and PM them to me instead?

Jrel

04-04-2011, 07:49 PM

Sure, will do.

TSR-JoshuaM

04-04-2011, 07:54 PM

Thank you! <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Jrel

04-28-2011, 01:17 PM

Still getting that weirdy choppy lag by other players once every few days, but it has been impossible to figure out which one due to many players in the PQ areas. I can state that it has never happened in a heroic instance or raid zone.

TSR-JoshuaM

04-29-2011, 03:35 PM

We've been able to identify a few things that induce the low FPS and the reporting is in on those issues. Our upcoming server upgrades planned for Butcherblock should be a very large improvement for everyone across the board.You can read Smokejumper's pending announcement information here, <a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?topic_id=499539&post_id=5547654#5547654">http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...5547654#5547654</a>

Jrel

05-26-2011, 02:15 PM

FYI, RW PQ lag has been slowly creeping up in lag delay times. For a spellcaster, it's currently at 1-2 seconds delay time, If it continues, I'd say in about 2 weeks, it will be close to original SG PQ lag (4+ seconds). From DoV launch to a month ago, RW used to have no lag at all compared to SG; but after the PQ lag fix, RW started having noticeable lag, which seems to be getting worse as time goes by. Or maybe BB's server is dying.