Betrayal Changes

[Xalmat]

<p>GU58 Test server notes:</p><p>BETRAYAL</p> <p>Spells above apprentice are now preserved after betraying in the following situations:</p> <ul><li>Betraying to a different class:<ul><li>Shared spells will retain upgrade</li><li>All new spells will start as apprentice</li></ul></li><li>Betraying back to original class:<ul><li>Shared spells will retain upgrade</li><li>Any spells that were upgraded before betrayal will remain</li></ul></li><li>Betraying to the same class:<ul><li>No spell upgrades will be lost </li></ul></li></ul><p>I will be testing these changes out in the next few days to make sure it works correctly.</p>

[Corydonn]

<p>I'd like to know if when we betray back to the first class, If our hotbar setup stays the same as it was before we betrayed the first time.</p><p>I'd hate if I had to put all my bruiser CAs back in their old order upon returning from the monk class and vice versa.</p>

[Ademelo]

<p>That's as simple as doing a:</p><p>/savehotkeys Bruiser</p><p>/savehotkeys Monk</p><p>For example <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[lostsandman]

<p><cite>Elyl@Crushbone wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>That's as simple as doing a:</p><p>/savehotkeys Bruiser</p><p>/savehotkeys Monk</p><p>For example <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>I think the poster above you were joking, surly he has to? <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/97ada74b88049a6d50a6ed40898a03d7.gif" border="0" /> </p>

[Kain-UK]

<p><cite>Drona@Splitpaw wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Elyl@Crushbone wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>That's as simple as doing a:</p><p>/savehotkeys Bruiser</p><p>/savehotkeys Monk</p><p>For example <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>I think the poster above you were joking, surly he has to? <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/97ada74b88049a6d50a6ed40898a03d7.gif" border="0" /> </p></blockquote><p>Probably not. He was telling me in RPLFG he's intending to fully master the monk class so he can swap between monk and bruiser whenever he wants to or needs to. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[lostsandman]

<p>I too intend to fully master both the SK and Pala classes so that I can swap between the two. However my biggest worry there is the stupid betrayal quest which takes hours and not hotbar setup which should take about 5 minutes or less!</p><p>I hope this change is the first step in removing the betrayal quest altogether in relation to class change.</p>

[Jaremai]

<p>So you guys are hoping that there's a Mirror of Reflected Professions soon?</p>

[-=Hoss=-]

<p>Once you've done the quest to go to one faction, there should certainly be a shortcut.  Just an NPC to hail and convince that you're really on their side again (or explain your actions or whatever)</p><p>Either that, or it should get harder each time you swap, but we all know that'd take too much work making harder and harder quests with no limit.</p>

[Yimway]

<p><cite>Jaremai@Guk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>So you guys are hoping that there's a Mirror of Reflected Professions soon?</p></blockquote><p>Isn't it the next logical step?</p><p>I'll betray zerker as soon as I have all the masters, then betray back to guard.  Allowing me to trivially change classes as I desire.</p>

[Gungo]

<p>I dont think they intend for betrayal to be trivial. It should require at least ~2 hours.</p>

[Corydonn]

<p><cite>Elyl@Crushbone wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>That's as simple as doing a:</p><p>/savehotkeys Bruiser</p><p>/savehotkeys Monk</p><p>For example <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>I never knew those commands existed! Thanks!</p>

[Xalmat]

<p>Just a reminder for people:</p><p>Any class-specific gear that you have will not be equippable once you change classes.</p><p>If your gear has class-specific red adornments on, you will need to either acquire a new item or acquire a new red adorn (or perhaps both). Keep in mind that if gear is LORE-EQUIP, you can have two of the same item in your bags, you can just only wear one of them at a time. The ideal solution to the red adorn problem is to get two of the same item, with different adorns.</p><p>See Shady Swashbuckler to acquire your new Epic Repercussions reward. If you have not completed your other class's epic quest yet, you will have the option of doing so.</p><p>I believe you will need to re-do your AA mirror when you betray. I believe you get a free AA reset immediately when you betray, but you will need another one for the mirror.</p><p>Hotkeys of course will need to be redone.</p>

[Anastasie]

<p>Could you put your aa mirror in the bank or house vault and then buy a new one to put the new class on it?</p>

[Xalmat]

<p><cite>Annelise@Guk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Could you put your aa mirror in the bank or house vault and then buy a new one to put the new class on it?</p></blockquote><p>No, because the AA mirror only links to a single saved AA profile, even if you have multiple mirrors.</p>

[Xalmat]

<p>*edit* Haha, disregard, I was spelling my character's name wrong.</p><p>However there is a bug with the betrayal confirmation window where the "Yes" button will light up even if your name isn't completely spelled out.</p>

[Xalmat]

<p>For some reason the gnomish machine for "Following Through", the Kelethin final betrayal quest, has a rendering bug where at certain viewing angles it will be invisible to the player.</p><p>Since this quest also requires zoning into the new Aerie Kolmas, you might consider doing something about the outdoor area you now have access to.</p>

[Xalmat]

<p>Now would be a good time to also review the Betrayal Quest faction quests themselves.</p><p>"Exile to Neriak - Spell of the Crawling Skin" - the quest updates for the different spiders is far too low. The quest called for 5 bristly spinner spider carapaces, 2 poison spider sacs, and 4 voracious spider webbings. I cleared the entire spider cave in DLW and the surrounding areas, and only ended up with 2 bristly spinner spider carapaces.</p>

[lostsandman]

<p>Say you are researching a SK master and you betray to a Pala. What happens to the SK maser being researched please?</p><p>And to a poster above, I like to see mirror to swap classes. Eq2 has 12 classes too many <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Kain-UK]

<p><cite>Drona@Splitpaw wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Say you are researching a SK master and you betray to a Pala. What happens to the SK maser being researched please?</p><p>And to a poster above, I like to see mirror to swap classes. Eq2 has 12 classes too many <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>I assume it would be auto-cancelled and you'll get some credit towards researching a new master.</p><p>Basically what would happen if you were, for example, researching Grave Sacrament and then the master dropped so you scribed it. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Again, this is just a guess/assumption, but it seems the most logical one.</p>

[Cica]

<p>So if im a neutral class but i live in Qeynos and want to betray to live in Neriak but dont want to change class i will keep my masters is that right ? and will the quest be easier than if i change classes too or its like 2 hours ? (like if i was going to change classes too)</p>

[Xalmat]

<p><cite>Cica wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>So if im a neutral class but i live in Qeynos and want to betray to live in Neriak but dont want to change class i will keep my masters is that right ? and will the quest be easier than if i change classes too or its like 2 hours ? (like if i was going to change classes too)</p></blockquote><p>Yes, you will keep your masters. No, the quest will not be easier because it still requires doing the entire betrayal series whether you change class or not.</p>

[Xierce]

<p>I love this change... thanks dev team <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/49869fe8223507d7223db3451e5321aa.gif" border="0" /></p>

[snowli]

<p>nice change <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" /> 2 thumbs up <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" /> <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" /></p>

[Cica]

<p>Thank you Sess <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>yes i like this change too <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Cusashorn]

<p>I still think this is just another giant leap towards this game's death, but whatever...</p>

[Cica]

<p><cite>Cusashorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I still think this is just another giant leap towards this game's death, but whatever...</p></blockquote><p>That was SC and EQ2X imo but yeah, whatever ....</p>

[Xalmat]

<p>Finally finished betraying to Necromancer on Test server. Bloody hell, Neriak takes forever to earn faction for compared to Kelethin.</p><p>As expected, my shared Summoner spell Vampire Bats I thru V remained at Master rank. Interesting enough I still had the Conjuror AA Runes of Geoticism able to be used. /bug'd</p><p>Now to betray back to Conjuror (thankfully it won't take as long as betraying to Necromancer) and see if I get my Conjuror masters back.</p><p>The dialog about losing all your spells should be updated to reflect the changes.</p>

[Xalmat]

<p>Just finished betraying back to Conjuror. I gotta say it's <em>much</em> easier to become a Kelethin citizen than it is to become a Neriak citizen. That may need to be looked at.</p><p>Got all my Conjuror masters back without issue.</p><p>Interesting enough I also have several of the AAs that grant abilities that I had before, but without actually spending the AA for it. The list includes:</p><p>Animist TransferenceMagic LeashAnimated DaggerPossess EssenceRunes of Geomancy</p><p>Except for Runes of Geomancy, it appears these were all abilities from the Summoner tree.</p><p>Interesting thing is that, even purchasing these specific AAs, and then resetting those trees, I still have those AAs. So I suspect either my character is bugged, or the AAs are all bugged too. This will need to be looked at before this functionality goes live.</p><p>Also appears a few other random AAs seem to be in effect without purchasing them.</p><p>Also worth noting is that I got my Elemental Mastery buff (the conj Mythical buff) without having to repurchase it.</p>

[Sydares]

<p><cite>Cusashorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I still think this is just another giant leap towards this game's death, but whatever...</p></blockquote><p>To be fair, you've thought just about every change is a giant leap towards the game's death.</p>

[Kreton]

<p><cite>Xalmat wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Just finished betraying back to Conjuror. I gotta say it's <em>much</em> easier to become a Kelethin citizen than it is to become a Neriak citizen. That may need to be looked at.</p><p>Got all my Conjuror masters back without issue.</p><p>Interesting enough I also have several of the AAs that grant abilities that I had before, but without actually spending the AA for it. The list includes:</p><p>Animist TransferenceMagic LeashAnimated DaggerPossess EssenceRunes of Geomancy</p><p>Except for Runes of Geomancy, it appears these were all abilities from the Summoner tree.</p><p>Interesting thing is that, even purchasing these specific AAs, and then resetting those trees, I still have those AAs. So I suspect either my character is bugged, or the AAs are all bugged too. This will need to be looked at before this functionality goes live.</p><p>Also appears a few other random AAs seem to be in effect without purchasing them.</p><p>Also worth noting is that I got my Elemental Mastery buff (the conj Mythical buff) without having to repurchase it.</p></blockquote><p>I believe the bug has to do with any AA abilities that you can get above a certain rank (I think 7 ranks, but not sure) that put abilities into your knowledge book.  It is remembering these AA's as if they were normal spells, so you never lose those abilities in your knowledge book, even if you respec.  I betrayed a Defiler to a Mystic and noticed this right away.  Even putting points into the AA's again, I still had the higher ranked ability from when I betrayed.  So they need to fix this so that this new code that "remembers" your spell tiers doesn't also include AA's that give you abilities, because they are indeed giving you permanent AA abilities without using the AA points.</p>

[Xalmat]

<p><cite>Kreton wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I believe the bug has to do with any AA abilities that you can get above a certain rank (I think 7 ranks, but not sure) that put abilities into your knowledge book.  It is remembering these AA's as if they were normal spells, so you never lose those abilities in your knowledge book, even if you respec.  I betrayed a Defiler to a Mystic and noticed this right away.  Even putting points into the AA's again, I still had the higher ranked ability from when I betrayed.  So they need to fix this so that this new code that "remembers" your spell tiers doesn't also include AA's that give you abilities, because they are indeed giving you permanent AA abilities without using the AA points.</p></blockquote><p>For some AAs that didn't give abilities, but enhanced my basic spells, I was apparently retaining the effects of those AAs until I repurchased them and  reset my tree. Also a few AAs I was retaining were not spent more than 5 ranks.</p><p>It's definitely something that will need to be fixed before it goes Live.</p>

[Rahatmattata]

<p><cite>Gungo wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I dont think they intend for betrayal to be trivial. It should require at least ~2 hours.</p></blockquote><p>I'm sure they will nerf it down within the next year and make it completely trivial to swap sub classes. IMO, this is the devs admitting... hey we fail at balancing sub classes so this is the best we can do... make it easy to swap within your class at will.</p>

[Xalmat]

<p><cite>Gungo wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I dont think they intend for betrayal to be trivial. It should require at least ~2 hours.</p></blockquote><p>And as a follow up, it does take ~2 hours.</p><p>As a level 90 Conjuror betraying from New Halas to Neriak, it took roughly 4 hours or more due to how tedious the Neriak Faction quests were.</p><p>Betraying from Neriak to Kelethin took about ~2 hours, again due to how tedious the Kelethin Faction quests were (although less so than Neriak).</p>

[Sydares]

<p><cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Gungo wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I dont think they intend for betrayal to be trivial. It should require at least ~2 hours.</p></blockquote><p>I'm sure they will nerf it down within the next year and make it completely trivial to swap sub classes. IMO, this is the devs admitting... hey we fail at balancing sub classes so this is the best we can do... make it easy to swap within your class at will.</p></blockquote><p>If that were their intention, I'd support them. 24 classes is an unreasonable amount of classes to balance.</p>

[Rahatmattata]

<p>I would actually support the whole subclass mirror thing too.</p>

[Stubbswick]

<p><cite>Xalmat wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>And as a follow up, it does take ~2 hours.</p><p>As a level 90 Conjuror betraying from New Halas to Neriak, it took roughly 4 hours or more due to how tedious the Neriak Faction quests were.</p><p>Betraying from Neriak to Kelethin took about ~2 hours, again due to how tedious the Kelethin Faction quests were (although less so than Neriak).</p></blockquote><p>The one where you have to go click the staffs in Darklight Woods isn't that bad at all.  Plus you get 5k a pop instead of 3k in Kelethin.</p><p>In any event, I'm wondering, along with the changes to neutral classes, betrayal, etc., if we can get different means of alignment betrayal and class betrayal?</p><p>I was testing out betrayal changes on my Inquisitor last night.  I switched from Freeport to Kelethin to make the swap from evil -> good, and that all worked fine.  I picked that I wanted to stay an Inquisitor.</p><p>So now, if I want to switch to a Templar, I would have to do the entire betrayal process over again?  Even if I was staying in the same city?  This is even more problematic for citizens of the "Neutral" cities of Gorowyn and New Halas.  If you're an Inquisitor in New Halas, and you want to become a Templar in New Halas, your best chance would be to change citizenship to Kelethin, betray Kelethin to Exile, grind back faction with Kelethin, and finally change citizenship back to New Halas.</p><p>I understand changing your subclass shouldn't be trivial, but this just doesn't even make sense.  If these classes are neutral now, what sense does it make to betray your city and earn back faction with your city just to change to another class that's already accepted by that city?</p><p>It may be too late, or too much work, but I think it would make sense to leave betrayal the same for switching between good/evil alignment if you're keeping your class.  If you want to change your subclass, though, make a separate questline.  Or make it some sort of timed event - for example you talk to the trainer for the other subclass, and you have to wait 24 hours to complete the change.  Or maybe 1-2 Norrath days, but you can't cast any spells while you're waiting.  If you're betraying as a non-neutral class, this would become a mandatory step of the betrayal process - when you're on the last step and they tell you to seek out your trainer, you would do it then.</p>

[Xalmat]

<p>I agree 100%. A subclass swap shouldn't require full-blown betrayal, but should still be somewhat time consuming.</p><p>Would be nice if <em>all</em> classes were in all cities, though.</p>

[Anastasie]

<p>Hmmm - that's odd - I swear a dev said they were seperating the process of betraying cities from changing subclasses.  So if you were living in Neriak and wanted to stay living in Neriak as a neutral class you would go through a sub-class change process and not betray your city.</p>

[Anastasie]

<p><cite>Waters wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>We've been talking about city betrayal quests on the design team recently, and it's likely we'll make some improvements.</p><p>There are three different things you might want to do with your character:</p><p><strong>Citizenship:</strong></p><ul><li><em>Change your home city from the current one to another friendly city (Qeynos to New Halas)</em> <ul><li>Never changes your class or alignment</li><li>Should be relatively easy and painless</li></ul></li></ul><p><strong>Betrayal:</strong></p><ul><li><em>Change your home city from the current one to an enemy city (Qeynos to Freeport)</em> <ul><li>Always changes your alignment</li><li>May change your class (<em>offers you a change if you’re neutral, requires a change if you’re an aligned class</em>)</li><li>Should require some effort</li></ul></li></ul><p><strong>Sub-class Change:</strong></p><ul><li><em>Swap your neutral sub-class to its counterpart (Monk to Bruiser, Berserker to Guardian, Fury to Warden, etc)</em> <ul><li>Never changes your alignment</li><li>Never changes your home city</li><li>May only swap to the other sub-class in your pairing – can NOT go from Monk to Warden, for instance</li><li>Should require some effort</li><li>This is a new quest type that we may offer</li></ul></li></ul><p>As part of the update, we could see if it's important to strip master spells or not.  Right now, it adds a big cost to betraying for some players (<em>high-level characters with many master spells</em>) and is inconsequential for other players (<em>low to mid-level players, or players with few master spells</em>).  I'm not sure such a big cost is critical to balancing city betrayal.  Anyone have thoughts on this?</p><p>Please keep in mind that this is still under discussion, so it may change greatly before being implemented.  As it's still in the idea phase, I'm not sure when this would go live.</p><p>- Rich</p></blockquote><p><a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?start=0&topic_id=484871#5395379">http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...=484871#5395379</a></p>

[Stubbswick]

<p>Gotcha.  I vaguely remembered reading this too - but I guess I thought the change currently on test was the result of those changes.  Re-reading it - it sounds like it's still an ongoing process.</p><p>In that case... <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" /></p>

[Xalmat]

<p>From the test notes:</p><p><strong>BETRAYAL</strong></p><ul><li>Fixed a bug where you would incorrectly keep some AA abilities from your previous class after betraying.</li></ul><p>Once this change goes in (Test isn't updated as of this post), then I think we're set. I unfortunately won't be able to test to see if this fix actually works, however.</p>

[Boldac]

<p>I like these changes, however, unless the quests for gaining faction with cities are updated or there is a lockout timer put in place, it will be abused.  At L90 it takes me less than 2 hours to from one class to another.  (I know, I just went from mystic to defiler on live...oops) </p><p>My point is, people, as they have stated in this thread, are already planning on mastering out both sides of their class.  The problem is, based on what is the perceived FOTM, which class is least broken, etc, people will hop the fence on a daily basis. </p><p>Please put a lockout timer (say a week or so) on how often you can betray.  If people truly want to do it, they will wait.</p><p>Also, any chance of opening the betrayal to any class in your chosen archetype?  You'd still end up having to gear out the toon, heck, I'd be happy with even having to rebuild my spells/ca's.  What I'm getting at is, say I have a 90 assassin, I don't want to play the assassin or ranger, and I don't really much have the time (or character slots for that matter) to level an entirely new toon, let me betray to one of the bards or rogues.  This way, I'm still a scout, I'm not changing my "class", just something new to keep me going.</p>

[Xalmat]

<p><cite>Boldac wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I like these changes, however, unless the quests for gaining faction with cities are updated or there is a lockout timer put in place, it will be abused</p></blockquote><p>How do you figure abused? What makes you think it isn't intentional?</p>

[Boldac]

<p>While most classes aren't that different from one another, some still have significant advantages over their counterpart.</p><p>"Ok look, I'm going to do bg's...think I'll be a ranger..." rip through the betrayal...go do your bg's...oh, almost raid time, guess I'll go back now....bam...assassin....</p><p>Same can be said for the bards....oh look, we need a trouby this week....bam, betray....oh, we need a dirge tonight...bam, betray.  Say what you want, people will be betraying on a regular basis once this goes live.  At least put a timer on it.</p><p>The removal of any sort of consequence for ones actions is part of what is killing the MMO.  There is zero penalty for dying now.  Zero penalty for betrayal with this change.  Zero penalty for failing on a pull...the list goes on and on.  Coupled with the ever growing list of broken/bugged classes and abilities, the last thing the game needs is to be dumbed down some more.</p><p>All this change will do is help the rich (or those with good luck on master drops) get richer.  It does nothing to benefit the community or help the game.</p>

[Darkor]

<p><cite>Boldac wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>While most classes aren't that different from one another, some still have significant advantages over their counterpart.</p><p>"Ok look, I'm going to do bg's...think I'll be a ranger..." rip through the betrayal...go do your bg's...oh, almost raid time, guess I'll go back now....bam...assassin....</p><p>Same can be said for the bards....oh look, we need a trouby this week....bam, betray....oh, we need a dirge tonight...bam, betray.  Say what you want, people will be betraying on a regular basis once this goes live.  At least put a timer on it.</p><p>The removal of any sort of consequence for ones actions is part of what is killing the MMO.  There is zero penalty for dying now.  Zero penalty for betrayal with this change.  Zero penalty for failing on a pull...the list goes on and on.  Coupled with the ever growing list of broken/bugged classes and abilities, the last thing the game needs is to be dumbed down some more.</p><p>All this change will do is help the rich (or those with good luck on master drops) get richer.  It does nothing to benefit the community or help the game.</p></blockquote><p>A penalty for dying ingame is not the same as a penalty for switching classes. It shouldnt be hard at all. How can a system be abused when it does not even affect you?</p>

[Kithica]

What's the fastest way to move my assassin from Freeport to Qeynos?

[Xalmat]

<p><cite>Kithica@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>What's the fastest way to move my assassin from Freeport to Qeynos?</blockquote><p>Betray from Freeport to Kelethin first.</p>

[Xalmat]

<p><cite>Boldac wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Say what you want, people will be betraying on a regular basis once this goes live.</p></blockquote><p>And again I ask, how is this a bad thing?</p><p>Not everyone is going to do it either, as it's essentially requiring you to gear and master out two separate classes, as well as <em>learn </em>how to play two separate classes. Most people are barely good at playing one class as-is; asking them to learn a second class would be too much.</p><p>I know where you're going with this, and I know what your line of thinking is because I once shared the same opinions. But it is overall best for the long term health of the game if it means it will be easier to balance classes if you don't think of them in terms of "Subclass vs Subclass" (ie Wizard vs Warlock) and instead you think of your character as "Class" (Sorcerer).</p>

[Boldac]

<p>There aren't many classes that offer a huge difference between sub-class A and B.  Dirge and Trouby come to mind based on their buffs, but for the most part it's a matter of single target vs aoe damage or functioning vs broken. </p><p>I think they should open the betrayal to the archetype level.  In other words, if you are an illusionist and are bored (or fed up with the way the class is being treated) you could betray to any mage.  Same with tanks, scouts and healers. </p><p>At least this way, it allows people who have invested alot into their characters to experience some other aspect of the game without losing much.  Make it reset your spells/CAs.  And give it a 7 day timer where you can't betray again during that time.  They've proved you can switch classes on a whim with the "oops" not too long ago.</p><p>Keep the current changes for going subclass to subclass.....I guess it won't matter.</p>