Enraging Demeanor III Red Adornment (10% potency) [Archive]

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Galthren

08-30-2010, 03:23 PM

Please add a component to this Red Adornment to not only give 10% Potency to the target of the spell, but also to the Caster.That way we don't have to put Enraging Demeanor III on ourselves just to get that 10% Potency buff.

Volimor

09-03-2010, 04:54 AM

Don't change it, if you want the potency put it on yourself, with link, with a bard, or a tank to mod your hate and you'll be fine. But there is no reason to change this adornment.

Jeepned2

09-06-2010, 09:40 PM

<cite>Volimor@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote>Don't change it, if you want the potency put it on yourself, with link, with a bard, or a tank to mod your hate and you'll be fine. But there is no reason to change this adornment. </blockquote>Ok, what idiot (unless soloing) is going to put Enraging Demeanor on themselves, especially for those of us who raid? What MT isn't going to raise hell about not getting my hate buff because I have it on myself for the 10% Potency? As MT Coercer, there is no such thing as a Troub for us. The OP was correct, this is messed up and needs changed.

Valena

09-09-2010, 05:38 AM

Well Coercers are considered a Support class, and adding buffs to others (i.e. 10% Pot) is support afterall. I'd love it on myself of course, but it'd make us even better dps which would have other crying out for nerfs.I think that it's fair to ask for this to be changed when they chance Time Compression to be a self-buff for Illu's.

Aule

09-09-2010, 05:59 AM

Jeepned2

09-09-2010, 09:27 AM

<cite>Whiplash@Splitpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote>Well Coercers are considered a Support class, and adding buffs to others (i.e. 10% Pot) is support afterall. I'd love it on myself of course, but it'd make us even better dps which would have other crying out for nerfs.I think that it's fair to ask for this to be changed when they chance Time Compression to be a self-buff for Illu's.</blockquote>We are not talking about a buff that yoy get to change here. This is a red adornment. As fas as I know, it's the only red adornment that gives this kind of buff to some else besides the person who bought the stupid thing and put it on that individuals' piece of gear.As for DPS, nerf us back to Mystic dps like we were 2 years ago. I'm tired of being an opoligist for my DPS. If people want our dps to be dropped, so be it. They are the same people who can kiss my rear end when they are wanting a Coercer for raid or group.As a Coercer I AM NOT A BUFF BOT. Or at least not suppose to be. I am suppose to be a active aggressive mage with my CC. If I wanted to be a buff bot, I'd go back to playing my Troub.Bottom line, if I have to buy it, if I have to use up a red slot on MY gear, then by dang I should get the stupid buff!!!!!! You want the buff? Then buy you own dang red adorn and put it on your own gear. You want more then Hate transfer/generation and Mana regen? Go talk to your dirge, that's one of his purposes in life.BTW, who do you think would benefit more with a 10% Potency buff, a Coercer or a Guardian? If you even have to think about it, then forget everything else I've already said.

Valena

09-09-2010, 11:59 AM

<cite>Jeepned2 wrote:</cite><blockquote>BTW, who do you think would benefit more with a 10% Potency buff, a Coercer or a Guardian? If you even have to think about it, then forget everything else I've already said.</blockquote>Well Guardians do need all the help that they can get <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" />Don't get we wrong, I see your point and would be happy getting the Pot myself but consider the following:1: It would not make sense to add a self buff to a buff that affects someone else. It's make it so that ED transfers hate but buffs us? Not really related items.2: Making us get 10% Pot as well as the recipient of the ED would be overpowered as it doubles the effect of the Pot.3: You can buy Focus Potency Red adorns already which add a whopping 2% Pot to yourself. Do you really think that they'd give us a 10% one for ourselves considering this? The Pot is so high because it is on others rather than ourself, and, as you said, on a target that isn't usually doing our dps.So rage on my friend, I can't see you getting the changes that you want.

Aule

09-09-2010, 02:44 PM

<cite>Whiplash@Splitpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Jeepned2 wrote:</cite><blockquote>BTW, who do you think would benefit more with a 10% Potency buff, a Coercer or a Guardian? If you even have to think about it, then forget everything else I've already said.</blockquote>Well Guardians do need all the help that they can get <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" />Don't get we wrong, I see your point and would be happy getting the Pot myself but consider the following:1: It would not make sense to add a self buff to a buff that affects someone else. It's make it so that ED transfers hate but buffs us? Not really related items.2: Making us get 10% Pot as well as the recipient of the ED would be overpowered as it doubles the effect of the Pot.3: You can buy Focus Potency Red adorns already which add a whopping 2% Pot to yourself. Do you really think that they'd give us a 10% one for ourselves considering this? The Pot is so high because it is on others rather than ourself, and, as you said, on a target that isn't usually doing our dps.So rage on my friend, I can't see you getting the changes that you want.</blockquote>None of your arguments there hold any water when viewed in light of the pending changes to Time Warp.I generally find that I need to put my hate transfer/booster (notice I didn't say my 10% potency buff?) on the tank so that I won't just rip aggro off of him. Maybe Jeepned2 doesn't generate much hate and so the hate boost to himself doesn't do very much, who knows.

Aule

09-09-2010, 02:55 PM

<cite>Jeepned2 wrote:</cite><blockquote>We are not talking about a buff that yoy get to change here. This is a red adornment. As fas as I know, it's the only red adornment that gives this kind of buff to some else besides the person who bought the stupid thing and put it on that individuals' piece of gear.You need more experience at research then (or need to ACTUALLY do some). That'd be like me saying Jeepned, as far as I know, is in a guild that hasn't killed a single hard mode mob and struggles with the easy stuff. I have no idea what your guild's progression is, and I haven't bothered to look or ask anyone knowledgeable, so what is actually the point of making statements like that?As for DPS, nerf us back to Mystic dps like we were 2 years ago. I'm tired of being an opoligist for my DPS. If people want our dps to be dropped, so be it. They are the same people who can kiss my rear end when they are wanting a Coercer for raid or group.As a Coercer I AM NOT A BUFF BOT. Or at least not suppose to be. I am suppose to be a active aggressive mage with my CC. If I wanted to be a buff bot, I'd go back to playing my Troub.Bottom line, if I have to buy it, if I have to use up a red slot on MY gear, then by dang I should get the stupid buff!!!!!!Yay for the era of the massively self-centered online gamer, grow up and learn how to be part of a team. It'll help when you get a job that pays more than minimum wage.You want the buff? Then buy you own dang red adorn and put it on your own gear. You want more then Hate transfer/generation and Mana regen? Go talk to your dirge, that's one of his purposes in life.Yes, he should spend a concentration slot on something that costs you no concentration so that you can put it on yourself. Tell me then, which 5 buffs should the dirge run? Wait, I mean 4 buffs since one of them is hate boost. Especially in a MT group position, your job is not to DPS. Your job is to ensure the success of the raid by boosting a healer, solidifying the hate position of the MT and not dying to aoe's (and handling pow on any fight with a pow component).BTW, who do you think would benefit more with a 10% Potency buff, a Coercer or a Guardian? If you even have to think about it, then forget everything else I've already said.Found your problem, your guild uses a Guardian for MT? lolz</blockquote>

Valena

09-09-2010, 05:13 PM

<cite>Aule@Guk wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Whiplash@Splitpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Jeepned2 wrote:</cite><blockquote>BTW, who do you think would benefit more with a 10% Potency buff, a Coercer or a Guardian? If you even have to think about it, then forget everything else I've already said.</blockquote>Well Guardians do need all the help that they can get <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" />Don't get we wrong, I see your point and would be happy getting the Pot myself but consider the following:1: It would not make sense to add a self buff to a buff that affects someone else. It's make it so that ED transfers hate but buffs us? Not really related items.2: Making us get 10% Pot as well as the recipient of the ED would be overpowered as it doubles the effect of the Pot.3: You can buy Focus Potency Red adorns already which add a whopping 2% Pot to yourself. Do you really think that they'd give us a 10% one for ourselves considering this? The Pot is so high because it is on others rather than ourself, and, as you said, on a target that isn't usually doing our dps.So rage on my friend, I can't see you getting the changes that you want.</blockquote>None of your arguments there hold any water when viewed in light of the pending changes to Time Warp.I generally find that I need to put my hate transfer/booster (notice I didn't say my 10% potency buff?) on the tank so that I won't just rip aggro off of him. Maybe Jeepned2 doesn't generate much hate and so the hate boost to himself doesn't do very much, who knows.</blockquote>Well Timewarp is a 5 seconds buff every 90 sec or so .. hardly the same as a permanent 10% Pot.And may I say **duh** about putting Hate on the Tank .. it is your primary role in a raid to hate buff him after all.

Jeepned2

09-09-2010, 09:34 PM

<cite>Aule@Guk wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Jeepned2 wrote:</cite><blockquote>We are not talking about a buff that yoy get to change here. This is a red adornment. As fas as I know, it's the only red adornment that gives this kind of buff to some else besides the person who bought the stupid thing and put it on that individuals' piece of gear.You need more experience at research then (or need to ACTUALLY do some). That'd be like me saying Jeepned, as far as I know, is in a guild that hasn't killed a single hard mode mob and struggles with the easy stuff. I have no idea what your guild's progression is, and I haven't bothered to look or ask anyone knowledgeable, so what is actually the point of making statements like that?Vaclaz ReleasedAs for DPS, nerf us back to Mystic dps like we were 2 years ago. I'm tired of being an opoligist for my DPS. If people want our dps to be dropped, so be it. They are the same people who can kiss my rear end when they are wanting a Coercer for raid or group.As a Coercer I AM NOT A BUFF BOT. Or at least not suppose to be. I am suppose to be a active aggressive mage with my CC. If I wanted to be a buff bot, I'd go back to playing my Troub.Bottom line, if I have to buy it, if I have to use up a red slot on MY gear, then by dang I should get the stupid buff!!!!!!Yay for the era of the massively self-centered online gamer, grow up and learn how to be part of a team. It'll help when you get a job that pays more than minimum wage.You want the buff? Then buy you own dang red adorn and put it on your own gear. You want more then Hate transfer/generation and Mana regen? Go talk to your dirge, that's one of his purposes in life.Yes, he should spend a concentration slot on something that costs you no concentration so that you can put it on yourself. Tell me then, which 5 buffs should the dirge run? Wait, I mean 4 buffs since one of them is hate boost. Especially in a MT group position, your job is not to DPS. Your job is to ensure the success of the raid by boosting a healer, solidifying the hate position of the MT and not dying to aoe's (and handling pow on any fight with a pow component).No, my job is suppose to be CC with hate management and mana regen on the side. My job is to be tired of SoE not ever fixing the Coercer the way they where suppose to clear back after messing it up at LU13 and LU17. What you are talking about is what my job has forced to become because of SoE's incompetence at fixing us. And I couldn't agree more, my job is not DPS, but that's what SoE decided to give us in the "big fix" two years ago to get us to quiet down and stop complaining about our class situation. I stilll out dps wizards, warlocks, rangers, swashies and brigand. On a good fight the summoners and coercers are pumping out 40K while the rest are just behind us. Oddly enough the monk seems to be catching up to us, when did that happen? The complaint here is why am I forced to give up a slot on my gear, pay 10P for an adornment that does me absolutely no good. If the MT needs 10% potency, then fix it so they can get one and put on thier own [Removed for Content] gear. I have no problem buffing the MT for hate. But if I have to spend my money, take up one of my precious spots on my gear, then by dang it should be for something I need, not something that someone else needs. They have their own money and own slots for stuff they need. BTW, who do you think would benefit more with a 10% Potency buff, a Coercer or a Guardian? If you even have to think about it, then forget everything else I've already said.Found your problem, your guild uses a Guardian for MT? lolz'Actually no, Zerker. Umm come to think about it we don't even have a Guardian in guild.</blockquote></blockquote>As for " None of your arguments there hold any water when viewed in light of the pending changes to Time Warp. What do I care about Time Warp? What do that really have to do with me having to give up my money and my slot for something that doesn't benefit me? And btw, you've been around long enough to know that "pending" changes don't mean squat to SoE. When the changes happen, then lets discuss it.I generally find that I need to put my hate transfer/booster (notice I didn't say my 10% potency buff?) on the tank so that I won't just rip aggro off of him. Maybe Jeepned2 doesn't generate much hate and so the hate boost to himself "doesn't do very much, who knows." If 10% protency is all that is keeping you from ripping aggro off the MT then something is wrong on your end, not mine. Otherwise for most of us the ED without the red adorn seems to work just fine.And for Harown"Well Guardians do need all the help that they can get <img src="../images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" /> No they don't, they need a complete revamp that SoE has been working on for how long?Don't get we wrong, I see your point and would be happy getting the Pot myself but consider the following:1: It would not make sense to add a self buff to a buff that affects someone else. It's make it so that ED transfers hate but buffs us? Not really related items.2: Making us get 10% Pot as well as the recipient of the ED would be overpowered as it doubles the effect of the Pot.3: You can buy Focus Potency Red adorns already which add a whopping 2% Pot to yourself. Do you really think that they'd give us a 10% one for ourselves considering this? The Pot is so high because it is on others rather than ourself, and, as you said, on a target that isn't usually doing our dps.So rage on my friend, I can't see you getting the changes that you want." Unfortunately you're right. But also I can't get rid of the ED red adorn since every tank out there knows about it and wants it. Basically they want a free 10% pot at my expence.

wayfaerer

09-13-2010, 01:43 AM

I think its fine, it's a powerful adorn. I bought it even though I knew I would never get to put it on myself. For the record there are other adorns of this nature such as the Primal Fury one (Fury spell) which gives 10% reuse on a buff that they really shouldn't be casting on themselves.

Gaige

09-13-2010, 02:16 AM

<cite>Jeepned2 wrote:</cite><blockquote>As fas as I know, it's the only red adornment that gives this kind of buff to some else besides the person who bought the stupid thing and put it on that individuals' piece of gear.</blockquote>Wrong.

Dreadpatch

09-29-2010, 05:37 PM

My guild uses 3 coercers, and we are all pretty solid. When I'm in MT or OT group I put it on the tank, when I'm in the dps group I put it on myself with link (which I must admit is pretty win). Sometimes if I'm feeling really generous, I give it to one of our harder hitting dps with link and let them pwn just a little more (obviously if they are ripping agro they lose it lol). Great adornment, works like it's supposed to, and would be way OP if it gave 10% potency to two group members. I can honestly say I have very little complaints about the coercer class in general. We get a couple of sucky spells that are completely useless, but so does every other class.

Banditman

10-01-2010, 07:04 PM

<cite>Jeepned2 wrote:</cite><blockquote>I generally find that I need to put my hate transfer/booster (notice I didn't say my 10% potency buff?) on the tank so that I won't just rip aggro off of him. Maybe Jeepned2 doesn't generate much hate and so the hate boost to himself "doesn't do very much, who knows." If 10% protency is all that is keeping you from ripping aggro off the MT then something is wrong on your end, not mine. Otherwise for most of us the ED without the red adorn seems to work just fine.ED isn't about 10% potency preventing aggro from going where it shouldn't. ED is about the 22% Hate Gain and 22% Hate Transfer that costs no concentration to maintain. This is why it needs to be on your tank, irrespective of whether it is enhanced by 10% potency or not.Now, for the adornment itself, is there another adornment out there that will be of more value? What else helps your raid get things deader, faster? I can't think of one.If your tank gets 10% more potency, it simply means that your REAL DPS classes can go that much harder, that much faster, because they know your tank has that (*@# under control. 10% to your DPS is pretty irrelevant. On the other hand, 10% to your tank means that much more DPS potential for EVERYONE in your raid.You're a support class. Get over it. For real.</blockquote>

slippery

10-04-2010, 01:22 PM

I put it on myself or a dps class unless I'm in a third tank group that has a troub instead of a dirge.

Adornling

10-06-2010, 07:01 AM

This thread is full of win...I especially like the part where RAIDING coercers should be avoiding putting this on themselves more than non-RAIDERS. I giggled for a while, thanks for the laugh.Most of the people who are saying put ED on the tank need toa) Tell your tank to step it up. Seriously... b) Learn your class. We are NOT support. When was the last time you mezed something in a raid? when was the last time you actually flowed someone who was over 40% power? Power is a joke. CC is (unfortunately) no longer used.Slap that potency buff on yourself and generate some numbers people! This isn't t5. You rolled a dps class. Get on it. And if you really feel like you ARE a support class than do your raid a favor and give it to a dps class.

Valena

10-07-2010, 06:00 AM

<cite>Enokarda wrote:</cite><blockquote>This thread is full of win...I especially like the part where RAIDING coercers should be avoiding putting this on themselves more than non-RAIDERS. I giggled for a while, thanks for the laugh.Most of the people who are saying put ED on the tank need toa) Tell your tank to step it up. Seriously... b) Learn your class. We are NOT support. When was the last time you mezed something in a raid? when was the last time you actually flowed someone who was over 40% power? Power is a joke. CC is (unfortunately) no longer used.Slap that potency buff on yourself and generate some numbers people! This isn't t5. You rolled a dps class. Get on it. And if you really feel like you ARE a support class than do your raid a favor and give it to a dps class.</blockquote>I have to ask .. do you actually play a Coercer?Most Guilds raid with a Coercer in the MT and OT group for practically the sole reason of having the extra hate from ED. Without the hate transfer / buff few Tanks would stand a chance of keeping agro off the dpswhores.As for the dps / Support argument: We do great dps and because of that ED is even more valuable for the hate transfer.So, to quote yourself, thanks for the laugh because you sound full of win!

Coju

10-12-2010, 11:11 AM

We have a Guardian MT and I never have to give him ED. I never rip agro off him if your ripping agro either A. Learn to cast bewilderment after reactives or B. Your tank is just crap end of story.

Valena

10-12-2010, 01:17 PM

<cite>Coju@Permafrost wrote:</cite><blockquote>We have a Guardian MT and I never have to give him ED. I never rip agro off him if your ripping agro either A. Learn to cast bewilderment after reactives or B. Your tank is just crap end of story.</blockquote>Maybe it's more about the Wizards, Warlocks and Assassins pulling agro than Coercers....So many HM mobs need the raid splitting and have OT's grabbing adds that it's not just about buffing your MT to the max.

Coju

10-12-2010, 01:57 PM

I am not trying to sound like a [Removed for Content] or anything here at all. If your Assassin pulls agro and hes transfering to the tank again fail tank IMO. Wizards and Warlocks should be linked and they are more then likely grouped with an Illy and Troub again if they pull agro fail tank. I am there giving my DPS mod, Myth buff, and buffing my shaman with CH. If the tank needs me to keep threat it is his problem not mine. If I am in a heroic zone I will however ask my tank if he/she will need ED if there is a dirge in group. If they request it I am more then happy to give it away, but there is no point in wasting the 10% potency if threat transfer is not needed.

Valena

10-12-2010, 02:22 PM

It's an interesting argument Coju.All I'll say is that if I don't ED the OT then he notices, if I don't ED most Instance tanks then they notice.ED and hate transfer is in for a reason .. You maybe lucky and only group with top of the line Tanks, but I'd say that in 90%+ of cases then ED should be on the tank and not doing so will cause agro issues, certainly moreso in instances than raids.

Coju

10-12-2010, 02:27 PM

I agree with you there have been very few instance tanks I have grouped with that could hold agro without ED. Anytime I group with a pally I never use it because of Amends. The 3 Sages HM if I am with the brawler he has to have ED we usually don't have any transfer in that group. Who cares if they notice anyways tell him/her it's a crutch holding them back from their true potential =)

Urgol

10-15-2010, 09:44 PM

You MUST be kidding me. First and foremost, on like 99.99% of all the mobs the main tank does NOT need the transfer. Unless they are a monk tanking something third-wing, in which case if you are guilded with one you dont need any advice on transfer usage.Second, as already stated in this thread multiple times, coercer is NOT a buff bot. A good coercer should parse like 8 to 9% of raid's dps being in the usual mt grp with a dirge. That is pretty dps-classy to me. Buffing the tank's aggro is what a dirge is for.Third, you people seem to be really, well, REALLY clueless about the class mechanics in a raid. A warlock is never really going to rip aggro since their myth proc is more then enough even on single targets. Trust me, I've raided as a lock for over 2 expansions. Dont live in eof, it's sf now. Btw, have you heard the news? Assasins have both a hate xfer and a range of deaggro skills to use when the [Removed for Content] hits the fan. They rip aggro and die? Tell them to learn to play and control their dps. Especially since you should have a link on them anyways, for the critbonus part.

Jeepned2

10-19-2010, 12:27 PM

When to ED and when not to ED. This should actually be it's own thread. This actually is a huge question for a lot of people. And as much as I'm irritated that the Potency is on ED instead of say Peaceful Link, there are still questions on when not hitting the tank with ED is acceptable.My general rule of thumb is if Zerker I'll not ED. Guardian, Pally and SK? Not normally but just depends. Monk? Yes. Does the monk really need it? Probably not. Just I'm a wimp, don't want to have the monks excuse for losing aggro being that I didn't ED him. That actually is the concern for not putting ED on any tank.Who's our biggest aggro ripper? Assassin? No, Necro? No, Wizard? No, Warlock? No, Trouby? No. It's nearly always the conjuror. More to the point, the Conjy's pet. This class alone is causing some raid leaders to want ALL hate on the MT. Just because someone can't control thier pet.... amazing.Urgol, you know and I know that the Coercer is not a buff bot. My other guildmate Coercer knows we are not buff bots. Unfortunately 95% of the other players out there think we are buff bots.

Valena

10-19-2010, 01:49 PM

I'm not sure that anyone here said that we are Buffbots,and anyone that has raided with a half-decent Coercer shouldn't ever think that either. I've said that we are a Support class and in SOE's vision we are. We cast a nice number of buffs, add Crit Bonus and dps to the group as well as regen mana. On top of that we are dps, and [Removed for Content] fine dps.Sometimes I think that some of the more "advanced" players lose sight of the fact that not every raid is optimised and that many go with what they can get due to a shortage of classes or a reluctance to have long-time Guildmates sit on the sidelines. A lot of people do PU groups with tanks that are alts and who aren't exactly overly experienced. In both of these cases I'd rather ED the tank than RISK anyone else grabbing agro. 10% Pot is very nice, but I'm not so embarrased about my dps that I'd take it for myself rather than give it to the tank: I can often top the parse without it so why rub so-called dps's nose in it further?

Dreadpatch

10-19-2010, 02:08 PM

<cite>Whiplash@Splitpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Enokarda wrote:</cite><blockquote>This thread is full of win...I especially like the part where RAIDING coercers should be avoiding putting this on themselves more than non-RAIDERS. I giggled for a while, thanks for the laugh.Most of the people who are saying put ED on the tank need toa) Tell your tank to step it up. Seriously... b) Learn your class. We are NOT support. When was the last time you mezed something in a raid? when was the last time you actually flowed someone who was over 40% power? Power is a joke. CC is (unfortunately) no longer used.Slap that potency buff on yourself and generate some numbers people! This isn't t5. You rolled a dps class. Get on it. And if you really feel like you ARE a support class than do your raid a favor and give it to a dps class.</blockquote>I have to ask .. do you actually play a Coercer?Most Guilds raid with a Coercer in the MT and OT group for practically the sole reason of having the extra hate from ED. Without the hate transfer / buff few Tanks would stand a chance of keeping agro off the dpswhores.As for the dps / Support argument: We do great dps and because of that ED is even more valuable for the hate transfer.So, to quote yourself, thanks for the laugh because you sound full of win!</blockquote>fraid I have to agree with Whiplash here. The only time I put it on myself is in the rare instance I'm in neither the MT or OT group. It does happen, but not often (my guild runs with 3 coercers, and we all get switched around on the reg). Plus many tanks can put up some pretty good dps numbers, so the potency isn't exactly hurting the raid dps. I rolled my coercer about 4 or 5 years ago when it was a support class for the record.

Dreadpatch

10-19-2010, 02:12 PM

<cite>Urgol wrote:</cite><blockquote>You MUST be kidding me. First and foremost, on like 99.99% of all the mobs the main tank does NOT need the transfer. Unless they are a monk tanking something third-wing, in which case if you are guilded with one you dont need any advice on transfer usage.Second, as already stated in this thread multiple times, coercer is NOT a buff bot. A good coercer should parse like 8 to 9% of raid's dps being in the usual mt grp with a dirge. That is pretty dps-classy to me. Buffing the tank's aggro is what a dirge is for.Third, you people seem to be really, well, REALLY clueless about the class mechanics in a raid. A warlock is never really going to rip aggro since their myth proc is more then enough even on single targets. Trust me, I've raided as a lock for over 2 expansions. Dont live in eof, it's sf now. Btw, have you heard the news? Assasins have both a hate xfer and a range of deaggro skills to use when the [Removed for Content] hits the fan. They rip aggro and die? Tell them to learn to play and control their dps. Especially since you should have a link on them anyways, for the critbonus part.</blockquote>Well obviously, I mean I'm sure 95% of folks in the game are raiding 3rd wing right now. So basically this statement applies to most raid forces, because most toons are maxed out on their T3 hard mode gear.

wayfaerer

10-24-2010, 09:41 PM

I always put my ED on the MT zerker. Our wizard is constantly complaining about being at 95+ aggro and asking for our swash to hate swap him as is, without ED it would be a much bigger problem. Maybe I'll try putting ED on myself and spamming the wiz with sever hate on fights where I don't need Respite for some other purpose.

Loadtoads

11-13-2010, 10:29 PM

We use a Guard MT, and he told me to put ED on myself unless he asks for it. And I do.

sandwarrior

11-18-2010, 11:10 AM

<cite>Banditman wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Jeepned2 wrote:</cite><blockquote>I generally find that I need to put my hate transfer/booster (notice I didn't say my 10% potency buff?) on the tank so that I won't just rip aggro off of him. Maybe Jeepned2 doesn't generate much hate and so the hate boost to himself "doesn't do very much, who knows." If 10% protency is all that is keeping you from ripping aggro off the MT then something is wrong on your end, not mine. Otherwise for most of us the ED without the red adorn seems to work just fine.ED isn't about 10% potency preventing aggro from going where it shouldn't. ED is about the 22% Hate Gain and 22% Hate Transfer that costs no concentration to maintain. This is why it needs to be on your tank, irrespective of whether it is enhanced by 10% potency or not.Now, for the adornment itself, is there another adornment out there that will be of more value? What else helps your raid get things deader, faster? I can't think of one.If your tank gets 10% more potency, it simply means that your REAL DPS classes can go that much harder, that much faster, because they know your tank has that (*@# under control. 10% to your DPS is pretty irrelevant. On the other hand, 10% to your tank means that much more DPS potential for EVERYONE in your raid.You're a support class. Get over it. For real.</blockquote></blockquote>Are you an idiot, banditman? 95% of the time i'm top 5 on the parse, regardless of how some people like to spin it, i'm not just a support class. I pride myself on being able to buff and do great dps at the same time. That is how every enchanter should play, because otherwise u r a wasted spot on a raid. The only time I EVER give my tank the ED buff is if it's a progression kill or he just needs it for the transfer cause we have 3 healers in the group and no scout xfer. 99.9% of the time ur tank is going to be capped on hate gain, and with a dirge and a scout xfer in the group, it's pointless to put ED on the tank. Also, it looks like u wasted 5 AAs maxing out the ED buff in the shadows tree. lol. Unless of course u grabbed the red adorn for 5% in which case u lose all credibility with anyone because that was a terrible decision.

Loadtoads

11-29-2010, 07:48 PM

<cite>Wuladien@Oasis wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Banditman wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Jeepned2 wrote:</cite><blockquote>I generally find that I need to put my hate transfer/booster (notice I didn't say my 10% potency buff?) on the tank so that I won't just rip aggro off of him. Maybe Jeepned2 doesn't generate much hate and so the hate boost to himself "doesn't do very much, who knows." If 10% protency is all that is keeping you from ripping aggro off the MT then something is wrong on your end, not mine. Otherwise for most of us the ED without the red adorn seems to work just fine.ED isn't about 10% potency preventing aggro from going where it shouldn't. ED is about the 22% Hate Gain and 22% Hate Transfer that costs no concentration to maintain. This is why it needs to be on your tank, irrespective of whether it is enhanced by 10% potency or not.Now, for the adornment itself, is there another adornment out there that will be of more value? What else helps your raid get things deader, faster? I can't think of one.If your tank gets 10% more potency, it simply means that your REAL DPS classes can go that much harder, that much faster, because they know your tank has that (*@# under control. 10% to your DPS is pretty irrelevant. On the other hand, 10% to your tank means that much more DPS potential for EVERYONE in your raid.You're a support class. Get over it. For real.</blockquote></blockquote>Are you an idiot, banditman? 95% of the time i'm top 5 on the parse, regardless of how some people like to spin it, i'm not just a support class. I pride myself on being able to buff and do great dps at the same time. That is how every enchanter should play, because otherwise u r a wasted spot on a raid. The only time I EVER give my tank the ED buff is if it's a progression kill or he just needs it for the transfer cause we have 3 healers in the group and no scout xfer. 99.9% of the time ur tank is going to be capped on hate gain, and with a dirge and a scout xfer in the group, it's pointless to put ED on the tank. Also, it looks like u wasted 5 AAs maxing out the ED buff in the shadows tree. lol. Unless of course u grabbed the red adorn for 5% in which case u lose all credibility with anyone because that was a terrible decision.</blockquote>I agree with everything Wul said spot on. My tank told me to put ED on myself unless he ask for it, which is usually only on a progression kill. ED imo is for tanks who aren't skilled/geared enough to hold aggro. I bet if you ask the majority of Coercers in WW endgame raid guilds, they're putting it on themselves too.

gatrm

12-03-2010, 02:23 PM

I just gotta say here....you guys are sounding extremely selfish. ED is a FREAKING HATE BUFF. Give it to the tank. If the tank doesn't need hate from both dirge and coercer, then the coercer should do it since it doesn't take a concentration buff, let the dirge put up a different buff that will add more to the group. Unlike coercers, dirges must spend a valuable concentration slot on hate.......And yes, coercers are support. Like dirges......and like dirges they are also dps. Live with it.

sandwarrior

12-05-2010, 03:06 AM

<cite>gatrm wrote:</cite><blockquote>I just gotta say here....you guys are sounding extremely selfish. ED is a FREAKING HATE BUFF. Give it to the tank. If the tank doesn't need hate from both dirge and coercer, then the coercer should do it since it doesn't take a concentration buff, let the dirge put up a different buff that will add more to the group. Unlike coercers, dirges must spend a valuable concentration slot on hate.......And yes, coercers are support. Like dirges......and like dirges they are also dps. Live with it.</blockquote>It isn't just a "freaking hate buff" but GG on making urself sound completely ignorant. It's 10 % potency. 90% of the time my tank makes the dirge run dps buffs instead of hate and lets me put ED on myself and he holds aggro like a champ.I think this is more of an issue of u guys have terrible tanks than it's an issue of us being selfish. Because we aren't.

Loadtoads

12-06-2010, 06:46 PM

LoL I agree Wul, and these guys were making fun of Guardian tanks? Azure Skies uses a [Removed for Content] fine Guardian as our MT, and last time I checked we're doing just fine.10% pot on ED should be group wide imo.... just like timewarp lol

sandwarrior

12-07-2010, 01:46 PM

<cite>Drivenmad@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote>LoL I agree Wul, and these guys were making fun of Guardian tanks? Azure Skies uses a [Removed for Content] fine Guardian as our MT, and last time I checked we're doing just fine.10% pot on ED should be group wide imo.... just like timewarp lol</blockquote>Well it shouldn't be group-wide, but if they made it so that it put 10 % potency on someone else AND urself, that would be pretty awesome. Kinda like the 1st attempted change to timewarp. Except ours would be a permanent buff.

Loldawg

02-10-2011, 10:17 AM

I'd rather help our raid succeed by helping the tank hold aggro than boosting my own parse numbers. I'd rather see success for our team and do everything I can to help my team succeed. I get satisfaction from supporting my group / raid AND parsing in the top few positions. So - I put ED on my tank when I'm in MT group.If I'm not in MT group - then hell yeh it goes on me. I might put it on me for easy mode fights before we get to HM or progression - but beyond that I think it's just selfish and doesn't help our team.

Krilinye

02-16-2011, 07:34 AM

Must admit i hardly ever use ED on the tank, only when im his only hate gain (ie. no dirge) or when were fighting a mob where the MT hardly ever gets a chance to taunt/gets dropped several positions for various reasons.We usually run with guardian, coercer, assassin, dirge, defiler and templar. Theres plenty of hate from dirge and assassin for me to drop ED and pop it on someone else/myself.Besides, with Dirge hate buff most tanks are pretty [Removed for Content] close to the cap anyway. Think a 17-22% transfer is gonna save someones live? (have they even fixed stacking of hate transfers/leeches?) Its already [Removed for Content] easy to keep agro. Maybe with DOV and the new "Zomg burst dps" buttons ED might be worthwhile to pop on the tank.. Hopefully theyll spend the last 6 days before launch well and give Tanks some dps/taunt buff with the xpansion.Havent read rest of the thread btw so sorry if i repeat what someone else said.