Well what's your opinion on this?

[Outkasted2006]

<p>Does SOE/Devs Care about what the "vast majority" want and say? Do you think YOUR opinion matters or is heard?</p><p>My personal opinion is NO. They will do what they want, how they want, when they want, and if you don't like it well your just ANOTHER subscription. I may get suspended or banned on the forums for this post, if so that's fine. I don't care to post anywhere I am going to be suppressed anyways. I have given SOE enough money in almost 7yrs of service, if they don't want my money anymore, I am sure i'll be just fine.</p><p>The vast majority have posted NUMEROUS times, over NUMEROUS issues, to just be flat out ignored, or get a short ,weak, and no basis-arguement on why they are still going to do what they want.</p><p>I can tell you this SOE, that's not the way to run a company or a buisness. Maybe you should stick to developing Electronics and not Video Games, if you don't care what we want out of our game, and what we DON'T want.</p><p>We DON'T want Soga being the first model. The vast majority even after you brought out soga went right back to using the original.</p><p>We DON'T need fighters blanket nerfed. (fix the items/gear ; lower crit chance, change its definition somewhat, DON'T DO THE LAZY FIX)</p><p>We don't need a HUGE ugly SC button on our screens at all times. Make it a option to be displayed. It's our game, WE have to look at it NOT YOU!!!!! I have spent station cash in the past. But I can promise you if your going to try to shove it down my throat in that manner, I will boycott using station cash until it's corrected and will implore everyone else to do the same.</p><p>Why the HECK can I play evil classes as a goodie now and vice versa, and if you most do so, why don't you just go all the way with this POINTLESS CHANGE. Also, to make it fair for the other classes if u can make them right away, you better make it so you dont lose masters to betray. Because you made the other ones playable from the get go. Only fair.</p><p>I close with this...... Do you really care what WE think.  What I have seen so far,  since this update has hit test, YOU DON'T.</p><p>If you truly care about your SOE EQ2 customers, please put down the corp. BS, and let us have some say in the game we pay to play. This GU goes live as it stands now, that will prove I was right.</p><p>I hope I am wrong!</p><p>Customer since Launch.</p><p>Thanks.</p>

[Myrien]

<p>No, I don't think that the management at SOE either know or care what I think as an individual, or as a paying customer.  People like Domino and Rothgar seem very interested in making their customers happy (and for that, they should be praised vigorously), but once you get above the developer level, it's doubtful that anyone cares.  The bottom line is probably all that matters.</p>

[Kain-UK]

<p>I think the dev's care... Rothgar was actually taking our suggestions for the XP bar and trying to work with them as much as he was allowed... for example.</p><p>I think the suits don't give a crap.</p>

[Outkasted2006]

<p><cite>Archan@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I think the dev's care... Rothgar was actually taking our suggestions for the XP bar and trying to work with them as much as he was allowed... for example.</p><p>I think the suits don't give a crap.</p></blockquote><p>I'd just have to disagree.</p><p>If that was true they'd be listenign to what everyone's saying on some of the other issues that are in game things that they have the decisions on. So yeah.  Can't agree</p>

[Kain-UK]

<p>I'm pretty [Removed for Content] sure they do listen.</p><p>I'm also pretty sure they aren't ALLOWED to come here and say "Well we can't change it because the suits say so", and thus just stay quiet.</p>

[Outkasted2006]

<p><cite>Archan@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I'm pretty [Removed for Content] sure they do listen.</p><p>I'm also pretty sure they aren't ALLOWED to come here and say "Well we can't change it because the suits say so", and thus just stay quiet.</p></blockquote><p>I dont think the suits care about fighter heals.</p>

[Kain-UK]

<p>Your topic was an "in general" about if you think the dev's listen or not, it was not specifically about fighter heals...</p><p>And honestly? I wouldn't be surprised if someone above the dev's was pulling the strings on THOSE too.</p>

[Outkasted2006]

<p><cite>Archan@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Your topic was an "in general" about if you think the dev's listen or not, it was not specifically about fighter heals...</p><p>And honestly? I wouldn't be surprised if someone above the dev's was pulling the strings on THOSE too.</p></blockquote><p>Yeah the suits really care about that kind of crap.. and yeah it was a general question which includes everything. Do they care what you think enough to make them not do what the majority doesnt want them to? NO. Simple answer actually <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Armawk]

<p>I have no doubt whatsoever that Devs care (as people) what players think. They are all gamers and all love games and therefore empathise with gamers concerns. There are however two counters to that.</p><p>One is that, as devs, they are the ones who have to make decisions and those decisions will not always be popular at all and will not ever be universally popular. The game should not be designed by volume of player commentary, that is a horrible route to take and one that destroys games. Players play games, designers and developers design and develop them. Players only know the game from one end and it is a distorted perspective. You can offer your feedback but you cannot instruct/demand them to do as you say.</p><p>The other is that they are employees and members of a team and in the end will do as they are told by management, and management has its own focus.</p><p>Often players will not be able to distinguish between those two types of decisions. Sometimes they can (No dev came up with a  big station cash button) but usually not. You just assume 'suits dont care about mechanics' but suits in fact care about a lot of things that dont seem obvious from outside.</p><p>As a player you have to decide if the decisions taken by the company and devs are ones you can live with. Thats about it.</p>

[Encantador]

<p>I wish people would not assume their personal opinion and the voices of a few vocal people are 'the vast majority'. The OP certainly does <strong>not</strong> speak for me or for that matter any of my friends.</p><p>For example my view on the points posted...</p><p>Soga. Could not careless, this does not affect existing customers.</p><p>Fighter nerf. Something needs doing. Guardians are balanced and fine the rest of the fighters need nerfing.</p><p>SC button <strong>they listened</strong> and have made it so it can be moved off screen (or modded away). So why are you complaining?</p><p>Classes being available both sides? Don't care. Never understood why some were available both sides and some not.</p><p>Do Sony developers listen or not? I tend to think yes. What they most definitely do not do is communicate on why changes are being made.</p>

[Palleon]

<p>1) No, I don't think you'll be banned for posting - SOE dont tend to do that, although you might find this is locked or moved to the appropriate forum.</p><p>2) Yes, I do think they listen - although with somethings that are needed to boost their business, they have little choice</p><p>3) I like the SOGA models and use them all the time. So do all my friends and guildmates</p><p>4) Nerfs and Class changes happen in MMO's. It's called balancing, and all we can do is be vocal about it (which has been the way since the dawn of EQ1)</p><p>5) SC button is small and does not bother me, and it can be modded away if needed.</p><p>6) Classes being available on both sides? I wish this had been in since start!</p><p>Remember, your opinion is just that, and whilst lots may agree with you, please don't think that your view is the ONLY view!</p>

[guillero]

<p>The devs really do care about the game. I have no doubt about that.</p><p>It's Management that has been making all the wrong and bad decisions that have been devastating for this game or any other SOE product.</p><p>The devs aren't incompetent (well at least most of them aren't). It's SOE management that has been incompetent for years on end. And as result it's the competent people, like the devs that have been taking the heat for it and got laid off in the process.</p><p>While it should have been management all the way in the top that needs to be kicked out and replaced with more competent people.</p><p>That they have been getting away with it and that for so long. Is downright baffling. As any other company would have canned such a CEO long long ago.</p>

[Vortexelemental]

<p>Our opinions don't really matter. That's been proved far too well.</p><p>Money is the gambling factor here.</p><p>Either way we won't win out unless they lose money from this...</p><p>Yet that will probably be a much worse development than the current situation.</p>

[Outkasted2006]

<p><cite>Palleon wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>1) No, I don't think you'll be banned for posting - SOE dont tend to do that, although you might find this is locked or moved to the appropriate forum.</p><p>2) Yes, I do think they listen - although with somethings that are needed to boost their business, they have little choice</p><p>3) I like the SOGA models and use them all the time. So do all my friends and guildmates</p><p>4) Nerfs and Class changes happen in MMO's. It's called balancing, and all we can do is be vocal about it (which has been the way since the dawn of EQ1)</p><p>5) SC button is small and does not bother me, and it can be modded away if needed.</p><p>6) Classes being available on both sides? I wish this had been in since start!</p><p>Remember, your opinion is just that, and whilst lots may agree with you, please don't think that your view is the ONLY view!</p></blockquote><p>Was hard to choose who I wanted to quote. Since a lot of posts happened while i was gone tonight. I don't want to spam answers to each one seperately. So i'll just mainly reply to this one</p><p>1.) If they move it ok, if they LOCK IT, might as well just delete it. That's just as bad.</p><p>2.) Some things are needed to boost buisness, couldn't agree more. ignoring the majority of your fan base yes(fast reply now to person that said something needed to be done about the rest of the classes and guardians are fine as is, seriously you are a minority and the FEW people who agree with you, go read the threads and in game channels. enough said, can't believe u actually believe for a second guardians are balanced NOW lol. Just wow. Whoever agrees with that now /uninstall. ) is a not the very good buisness and other things they have done.</p><p>3.) I can tell you the people that like Soga that I know from 3 different servers is like 5 to 1 at the very minimum that prefer original. No reason to change what isn't broken anyways, if you want to have it on soga, heck, go ahead, u can set it that way. Also, some people like the way some races look soga, and not so much on other races.</p><p>4.) Just because nerfing and class changes been around since day 1 of MMO's, doesn't mean it's it can't be wrong, doesn't mean it should always be done.  Or at least to complete other spectrum as has been posted to them more then a thousand times already to be ignored.</p><p>5.) It's fine as is, I shouldnt have to hide it off my screen. Shoving it down our throats to begin with is insulting enough. We get it, we all know what station cash is.</p><p>6.) Not suprised lots of people are loving the easy mode progression this game has been taking for a LONG LONG TIME now.</p>

[Encantador]

<p><span ><a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/user/profile.m?user_id=271311"><strong><span style="color: #3333ff;"><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Outkasted2006</span></span></strong></a></span></p><p>You really need to open your eyes and read threads. Guardians being considered fine or needing a small amount of tweaking is undoubtably a very wide spread belief. Guardians are underpowered when compared to Berserker, Paladin, and Shadowknight. I don't think anyone with half an eye would disagree with that statement. Brawlers aren't very overpowered and I don't really see a need to do more than tweak them. </p><p>Look through just about any thread on tank balance and you will find many many statements that guards are underpowered when compared to the other plate tanks and many satements that they do their job just fine.</p><p>My opinion is that the way to fix guards is to nerf the others. The OP disagrees with me. Thats fine. A lot of plate tanks disagree with me. Thats fine. A lot of people playing the 18 non-fighter classes <strong>do agree</strong> with me.</p><p>To say the 'vast majority' of players agree with the OP on the points made, is just plain wrong.</p>

[kcirrot]

<p><cite>Outkasted2006 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>We DON'T want Soga being the first model. The vast majority even after you brought out soga went right back to using the original.</p><p>We DON'T need fighters blanket nerfed. (fix the items/gear ; lower crit chance, change its definition somewhat, DON'T DO THE LAZY FIX)</p><p>We don't need a HUGE ugly SC button on our screens at all times. Make it a option to be displayed. It's our game, WE have to look at it NOT YOU!!!!! I have spent station cash in the past. But I can promise you if your going to try to shove it down my throat in that manner, I will boycott using station cash until it's corrected and will implore everyone else to do the same.</p><p>Why the HECK can I play evil classes as a goodie now and vice versa, and if you most do so, why don't you just go all the way with this POINTLESS CHANGE. Also, to make it fair for the other classes if u can make them right away, you better make it so you dont lose masters to betray. Because you made the other ones playable from the get go. Only fair.</p></blockquote><p>Who is this "we"?</p><p>I don't care about the SOGA change.  There's a big button to change to the normal model. </p><p>The fighter nerf may not be the best way to fix their problems, but it's not the end of the world.</p><p>The SC button is not huge and it's not intrusive. </p><p>As for the change of classes, I think that's a great change.</p>

[Thakris]

<p>One thing I can agree on is guardians need a lot of work.</p><p>One thing i can't agree with is people that come here and think they speak for everyone. or even the vast majority. I've been playing this game quite awhile, so have seen vast changes to the game made. I'm only now posting my opinion because I joined the test server for the first time and wanted to see what other people thought about the new spell/combat art graphics(I love 'em). But seeing some of these opinions just makes me want to say <span style="text-decoration: underline;">you're not required to play if you hate SOE that much. </span>You are entitled to your opinion of course, but if I felt the way some of you seem to, I'd have left the game a long time ago. I'm talking about those of you who insist the dev's don't care at all, it's money, blah blah blah. Why keep paying for something that doesn't make you happy? Especially a game??? Serious question.</p><p>Outkasted2006, I completely agree with you on the evil/good thing. I think the betrayal system should be only way to do that.</p><p>Not sure about the fighter nerfing thing, but I do think they should take each problem and fix it, not blanket nerf. I agree there.</p><p>I could not disagree more on the SOGA thing. I think the original models are hideous. But it is NOT A BIG DEAL AT ALL TO CLICK ONE BUTTON AND CHANGE IT. Sounds like whining to me. In the years since SOGA models came out, I've heard every opinion in the book. there is no vast majority on this one.</p><p>The SC button is not huge, lol. I play on a 47-inch flatscreen 1080p LCD tv, with an HDMI cable and I hardly notice it. more whining.</p><p>I've tried many, many other mmo's since I started playing EQ2, and I always come back. To me this game is by far the best mmo experience out there.</p><p>Thank you SOE. And go ahead and accuse me of buttkissing. As if that would get me anything. It's just how i feel.</p>

[StaticLex]

<p><cite>Outkasted2006 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Does SOE/Devs Care about what the "vast majority" want and say? Do you think YOUR opinion matters or is heard?</p></blockquote><p>Eh.  Like any other company they probably care so long as it's convenient to do so.  And despite any flaming I do on the forums or through feedbacks, I really don't lose any sleep over being ignored.  I simply realize that at the end of the day I'm free to go play whatever games I want.</p>

[Whilhelmina]

<p>200% agree with the OP</p>

[Laiina]

<p><cite>Outkasted2006 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Does SOE/Devs Care about what the "vast majority" want and say? Do you think YOUR opinion matters or is heard?</p></blockquote><p>The one false assumption here is that posts here reflect the actual player base. They don't.</p><p>We have hundreds of people in our guild, and the Hot Complaints I see here so often are not even an issue inside the game.</p><p>I have played quite a few mmo's since 1999, and have seen this same complaint on every forum for every game. But what is posted in forums does not always reflect what the majority of players think.</p><p>It is no different than the daily news cycle on TV - some obscure group with 11 members sends out a press release about how they are boycotting Acme Widgets and it makes the news. Yet 99% of the population has never heard of either Acme Widgets or the group boycotting them.</p>

[Guy De Alsace]

<p>Devs cant do anything about what the suits decide is best for us. Which is a shame really since the suits have likely not even played the game.</p>

[kelvmor]

<p><cite>Encantador wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><span><a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/user/profile.m?user_id=271311"><strong><span style="color: #3333ff;"><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Outkasted2006</span></span></strong></a></span></p><p>You really need to open your eyes and read threads. Guardians being considered fine or needing a small amount of tweaking is undoubtably a very wide spread belief. Guardians are underpowered when compared to Berserker, Paladin, and Shadowknight. I don't think anyone with half an eye would disagree with that statement. Brawlers aren't very overpowered and I don't really see a need to do more than tweak them. </p><p>Look through just about any thread on tank balance and you will find many many statements that guards are underpowered when compared to the other plate tanks and many satements that they do their job just fine.</p><p>My opinion is that the way to fix guards is to nerf the others. The OP disagrees with me. Thats fine. A lot of plate tanks disagree with me. Thats fine. A lot of people playing the 18 non-fighter classes <strong>do agree</strong> with me.</p><p>To say the 'vast majority' of players agree with the OP on the points made, is just plain wrong.</p></blockquote><p>Or, Guardians need to be made better. I play a Guardian, a berserker, and an SK. I'd rather have the Guardian made better than the other three nerfed.</p><p>BTW, my Guardian was my main for like, two years.</p>