Can we get an update on previously mentioned "adjustments"

[Nevao]

<p><span style="color: #ff9900;">I could be slightly off on my time line but at the very least I remember the following:</span></p><p><strong><span style="color: #ff9900;">During Beta</span></strong></p><ul><li><span style="color: #ff9900;">We were told that Rothgar was not happy with the "Default Auto Attack" implementaion and was going to shelve it until he could come up with a better interface.</span></li><li><span style="color: #ff9900;">After the uproar caused by including Flurry and AE Attack Red addorns that only Rangers could not use, well correction could barely use since we're supposed to be using our bows, that Rothgar talked to Xelgad about implementing somet method that would allow rangers to use these stats and that Xel had some ideas. I seem to remember it being stated that this would not happen before the expansion (SF) came out but at the point I can't remember and the boards were long ago taken down. I honestly don't think this is going to make the difference up in parses but it's an example of something we were told would happen and never heard about it again.</span></li></ul><p><strong><span style="color: #ff9900;">Post SF Launch</span></strong></p><ul><li><span style="color: #ff9900;">During the uproar over not having 0 range be part of the Mythical Self Buff Fyreflyte stated that 0 range was not going to be included on any bows moving forward and that the team was going to work on adjust hit boxes, when the had time.</span></li><li><span style="color: #ff9900;">It was also mentioned earlier in the same thread by Fyreflyte that rangers were going to be given some form or "encouragement" to fight at ranged but that the devs did not want to address it until after they had a better feeling where everyone was post stat changes and consolidation. I'm hoping that unlocking Potency, tweaks to weapon damage and loot from the two new raid zones is not going to be used as an excuse to not yet have a firm picture.</span></li><li><span style="color: #ff9900;">A change made during Beta to remove our minimum range on AEs was made but it only works if you have the Epic Bow equipped. This is not how it was advertised, and we have all been working under the assumption that it is broken.</span></li></ul><p><span style="color: #ff9900;">SF has now been out for 3 months, can we please get an update on what the curernt plan/status on these items are? Are they still on the table, have they been postponed, have they been shelved? I understand that timelines are tricky and hard to nail down but with current silence is just creating more tension then even a "bad" answer would.</span></p>

[Neiloch]

<p>I tried talking to some devs 1 on 1, fishing for at least a 'no comment' reply and couldn't even get that. New tier of levels was the perfect time to introduce these stats, its going t be much harder to do when (most likely) the cap doesn't raise in the next xpac.</p><p>At this point i would settle for a 'whats next' and vague timeframe something like 'this year' or before/on the next xpac. Its getting kind of degrading how often we basically beg for some answers and almost always get nothing.</p>

[Nevao]

<p><span style="color: #ff9900;">Holding off for a moment....</span></p>

[Sydares]

<p><cite>Neiloch@Crushbone wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Its getting kind of degrading how often we basically beg for some answers and almost always get nothing.</p></blockquote><p>They really need to work on their communication skills. Hundreds of updates about appearance loot, upcoming game events, shader work, but class balance they won't even bother discussing with us anymore in any tangible way.</p><p>When they do, it's always just to say, 'We talked about this but don't have a timeline.' Cue nothing being done.</p>

[Magnethjelmen2]

<p>Dear SOE team, can we please get a heads up on this? Its been like 3 months now, and we still have not seen a single adjustment to the ranger class in the update notes since launch of SF <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> When will we see anything happen? Next month, or next year?</p><p>I do not understand that it can be so hard to improve us. I can understand that fixing code for AE autotattack and Flurry is tricky, and takes time. But that is really not my biggest concern. We need our CA's improved, they are silly compared to an assassin. Why is it so hard to go to your CA database and just increase dmg, castspeed and reusespeed for the ranger? It is obvious something we need.</p><p>Plz reply to us fellow rangers that are still left, and enjoys playing the class.</p>

[Noob1974]

<p>What bothers me is, even Rothgar didnt give anytime frame in his Beta Statement, it was expected in the ranger community atleast to get some stuff done till or with GU56.... Im not sure if the devs didnt understand this at the time.</p><p>The problem is during TSO Beta the dev at that time had a vision of the Ranger being a hybrid hence why we got all the AAs attached to Melee CA's. Now they have a vision of the ranger as a purely "ranged" dps class according to a fyreflyte statement a couple of weeks ago.</p><p>Thats one problem they changed their point of view due to changes in their Devs lines far too often. Secondary while a lot classes needed a boost they only focused on one class during SF Beta , conjis, who needed a boost at that time.</p><p>Devs dont seem to understand that the gap between Sins and Rangers is getting further with every Expansion/GU they bring out. Maybe due to the fact, as a couple mentioned before, they are a very strong PVP and Solo Class.</p>

[Candoor]

<p>Just as a nice measuring tool devs - run a heroic dummy on a 90 ranger similarly equipped as a 90 assn (aa spec dps similar stats on crit/dble atk/potency/crit bonus etc..)</p><p>The results from my guild shows my ranger doing just under 17k on heroic doll - our assassin does 60k on heroic dummy.</p><p>Thats over 3 times dps - our casting speed is not the issue anymore on that doll - I can cast everything and have to await recast.</p><p>Seriously can we please please get some love to compete with other classes?!?!</p><p>My ranger is shelved until we do from raids.</p><p>Just so very sad you let us get this bad.</p>

[Carpediem]

<p>I don't think they even read the ranger boards anymore (apart from Kiara making sure nobody is swearing) I have sent PM's to Roth and Xel asking them to update us on what the plan is and heard nothing back. The new producer said he couldn't comment on the class issues because he doesn't know enough about them at this time.</p><p>I don't think it's an issue with how well we solo. I see SK's and paladin's solo zones we couldn't dream of doing. Same goes with BG's.</p><p>Seriously, what the hell do we have to do at this point?</p>

[Nevao]

<p><span style="color: #ff9900;">On a happy side note while we wait to see if we are able to get a response (in fairness it is a holiday weekend and people may have left early last week), after seeing new weapons out of Underfoot Depths that are being linked in channel it looks like once again melee weapons are having their damage rating increased while bow damage stays the same. Granted we are far from seeing all the items out of there yet, but this is just what we needed, one more advantage to Assassins.</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff9900;">Smokejumper, Devs, we are not looking to be better than Assassins, we just want to be able to do the same type of damage in raids with some equivalent useful utility. This is not about being better but just being equal.</span></p>

[Noob1974]

<p>Rather than giving us something it looks like the gap is going further thropught the items in the new hole raidzone.</p><p>Eboz linked a throwing weapon that summons 99 fabled dagger with 15% hit bonus that rivals the crafted arrows easily.</p><p>Its going insane that rather closing the gap its getting larger everyday dps wise.......</p><p>Im not convinved we see any changes before or with GU57, mainly either devs spend the time on velios as they know people expect alot form the next expansion or some BG Stuff needs to be changed ans new armor/items designed.</p>

[glowsintheda]

<p>So people that use throwing can summon all the ammo they want and its better then the rare crafted arrows?  Wow, just wow, won't give us endless quiver or any new ammo summoners because it would impact woodworkers too much, but no problem doing it for the other ammo that woodworkers make, feel the hipocracy</p>

[Neiloch]

<p>Only difference is that the daggers have 83 less damage on them. But compared to spirit blessed field point they have the same range bonus and hit rate bonus, both of which USED to be exclusive to these arrows. Here are some item links for reference.aITEM 1044985137 715322778:Weightless Pouch of Diamond Etched Daggers/aaITEM 992312651 -224083851<img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />iamond Etched Dagger/aaITEM -184340551 49425290:spirit-blessed field point arrow/aReally its just more proof that we are used to keep woodworkers going for a large part. Then again since its so crucial to rangers just about any one who plays one a lot has their own personal woodworker, therefore not participating in the world market anyway.</p><p>Maybe if we come at it from this angle..</p><p>Hey! Maybe if rangers actually did DPS comparable to sorcerers assassins and swashbucklers more people would roll one and therefore more people would be buying arrows. eh? eh? *nudge nudge*</p>

[Alenna]

<p>has someone posted this in the items and equipment forum to ask why nothing like that has dropped for Rangers?</p><p>Looks like Sony doesn't want people to know that that pouch is there I cannot find it on the official Players site where can you find a discription of what this puch does?</p>

[Nevao]

<p><span style="color: #ff9900;">Meh, while I'm annoyed I'm not too worried about the ammo summoning pouch. It gives 4 classes that were not designed (or just flat out not allowed) to use spirt blessed arrows access to something similar. We also do not know the drop rate or the difficulty of the mob it came off. Might be ultra rare off a "chalenge mode only" boss.</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff9900;">I'm much more bothered by the "ranger only bow" not having a higher damage rating than what we could previously get while all the melee weapons do. But again, we don't know who drops it so that might be a non-issue as well... A lot of this would not a big deal though if the DPS gap wasn't growing with each expansion...</span></p>

[FearDiadh]

<p>None of the devs have time to give us an update on this?</p>

[Laenai]

<p><cite>Jack@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>None of the devs have time to give us an update on this?</p></blockquote><p>Even just a "Hey guys, we hear you." would be nice....</p><p>Sadly, though my raid spot is always safe (helps when you're the leader) I've shelved my ranger because its not worth having to fight bards on the parse and I'm far more useful as a defiler than a ranger. Maybe, some day, when either A) SoE figures out [Removed for Content] they're doing with the class or B) actually listens to ranger players for ideas on what to do with the class I'll pull her back out.</p><p>Do any of the devs actually play and group/raid with a ranger?</p>

[Neiloch]

<p><cite>Karimonster wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Do any of the devs actually play and group/raid with a ranger?</p></blockquote><p>I think they do. Unfortunately I think its PvP and soloing, and maybe some inconsequential casual grouping. Grouping where they areally aren't aiming to get a lot of AA or certain pieces of loot. Take it or leave it kind of grouping.</p><p>This would lead a developer to have a kind of 'first hand' knowledge that rangers are fine since we do well in PvP and solo. that coupled with a spreadsheet somewhere telling them 'on paper' we are balanced for raids. they don't do as much self reliant damage but hey they got that group buff so other people will want them and they can shoot arrows at jousting distance using chain instead of cloth (as if jousting mattered anymore).</p>

[Carpediem]

<p>I posted something in general gameplay forum. I'm hoping some devs will read it before Kiara just moves it into here where it will never be read.</p>

[Upir]

<p>It'll be Shareana who comes in with the boot.  The modding has been way too heavy handed around here for my liking as of late.  I can say this here with zero fear of reprisal because I'm posting it in the ranger forum and we all know that, much like a black hole, all things that go into the ranger forum are never seen, heard, or spoken of again in the eyes of SoE.</p>

[Carpediem]

<p>There are posts from Xelgad in three different class forums today and he can't stop in here and give us an idea if they're working on anything. They better not give us excuses about how they don't have time.</p>

[Nevao]

<p><cite>akaglty wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>There are posts from Xelgad in three different class forums today and he can't stop in here and give us an idea if they're working on anything. They better not give us excuses about how they don't have time.</p></blockquote><p><span style="color: #ff9900;">My guess is that Xel is not authorized to talk on certain things without permission. When Xel was introduced by "the previous administration" it was with the caveat that he would not be posting nearly as much as the previous mechanic devs. I could be completely off base, just the impression I got.</span></p>

[Neiloch]

Maybe they can't say anything because they got stuff they are working on for rangers but its not 'final'....

[Venez]

<p><cite>Nevao wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>akaglty wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>There are posts from Xelgad in three different class forums today and he can't stop in here and give us an idea if they're working on anything. They better not give us excuses about how they don't have time.</p></blockquote><p><span style="color: #ff9900;">My guess is that Xel is not authorized to talk on certain things without permission. When Xel was introduced by "the previous administration" it was with the caveat that he would not be posting nearly as much as the previous mechanic devs. I could be completely off base, just the impression I got.</span></p></blockquote><p>What do you want them to post? That they lied in beta and they havent done anything since then would just make them look worse than the liers they have already proven themselves to be ? </p><p> Or wait they could post something more towards the truth > What do you guys want, its been almost 4yrs ( <a name="4322292">Game Update #38, September 12th, 2007</a>) that we have been listening to your complaints and we have chosen not to address the complaints, your still playing, your still paying, get over it your working as intended, congratulations on being a solid T3 dps class, you work fine in single PuGs and are awsome in PvP. We really added BG's just so you rangers would have something you could be good at.</p><p>Now GO Away, Thanks the SoE Dev Team   /cha ching</p>

[Neiloch]

Hell I would love that reply if that's what they were really thinking. I doubt they would do it though since it would guarantee a fair amount of people unsubbing including myself.

[Carpediem]

<p>If we could even get a dev to come in here and post "I read this" on a few of the big topics it would be a miracle!</p>

[FearDiadh]

<p><cite>akaglty wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>If we could even get a dev to come in here and post "I read this" on a few of the big topics it would be a miracle!</p></blockquote><p>That would not be ok with me.  They have done that several times months back, and done nothing since.  I would like to know they have something in the works, what it is, what time frame we are looking at and that it is not going to be next expansion.</p>

[Nevao]

<p><cite>Venez@Permafrost wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Nevao wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>akaglty wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>There are posts from Xelgad in three different class forums today and he can't stop in here and give us an idea if they're working on anything. They better not give us excuses about how they don't have time.</p></blockquote><p><span style="color: #ff9900;">My guess is that Xel is not authorized to talk on certain things without permission. When Xel was introduced by "the previous administration" it was with the caveat that he would not be posting nearly as much as the previous mechanic devs. I could be completely off base, just the impression I got.</span></p></blockquote><p>What do you want them to post? That they lied in beta and they havent done anything since then would just make them look worse than the liers they have already proven themselves to be ? </p><p> Or wait they could post something more towards the truth > What do you guys want, its been almost 4yrs ( <a name="4322292">Game Update #38, September 12th, 2007</a>) that we have been listening to your complaints and we have chosen not to address the complaints, your still playing, your still paying, get over it your working as intended, congratulations on being a solid T3 dps class, you work fine in single PuGs and are awsome in PvP. We really added BG's just so you rangers would have something you could be good at.</p><p>Now GO Away, Thanks the SoE Dev Team   /cha ching</p></blockquote><p><span style="color: #ff9900;">I want an update on these items that they already discussed with us. Are these on the table still? Any idea on when they are going ot happen? I work in IT. I'm a Systems Analyst. I help design, test and train on business systems for my company. I interact directly with our intended customers of the software. That said I can completely understand not talking about features that have not yet been discussed. I can completely understand about being obscure about timelines (though in this case they have taken it way too far). But when someone asks me about a feature that I have already mentioned/promised I have to give an update/answer, even if it's just "we're still planning to do it." And that was the point of this thread. I know you're relunctant to talk about future plans but can we please get some kind of update on what you've already told us. The silence though speaks loudly, and it's looking more and more like "tell them whatever it takes to shut them up when they make too much noise in public places and then go back to what you were doing." </span></p><p><span style="color: #ff9900;">But hey, what do I know?</span></p>

[Neiloch]

<p>I'm hoping against hope since they got their 'casual' game update out, with the PvP, starter city and some raids zones they are going to concentrate on more mechanical things now. But I've been hoping since February so I won't be making a bet on it any time soon.</p>

[Nevao]

<p><cite>Neiloch@Crushbone wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I'm hoping against hope since they got their 'casual' game update out, with the PvP, starter city and some raids zones they are going to concentrate on more mechanical things now. But I've been hoping since February so I won't be making a bet on it any time soon.</p></blockquote><p><span style="color: #ff9900;">I would hope so to, but unfortunately we will not know much until we see what direction SmokeJumper wants to take things. The random things I have heard make it sound more like a start of game/middle game concerns but who knows, they aren't exactly talking about it yet.</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff9900;">Even if that is the case it may not matter as it's technically different resources to do a new zone vs AA/Ability tweaks, unless they have Xel (or whoever it is) doing multiple things.</span></p>