Token Consolodation - Request for Dev Clarification [Archive]

Lizbein

04-27-2010, 02:58 PM

As I sit here in Que for the past 30+ minutes waiting for a Smuggler's Den match specifically because I am required to have those tokens to buy the gear I want, I can't stop wondering whether or not the consolidation will affect PvE servers as well. The test update seemed like it would, the flames comments from people who supposedly are in the "know" seems like it wont. Regardless, I have had 30+ minutes to peruse the forums and catch up on a lot of stuff but as of yet have not come across any discussion concerning the ridiculous amount of wait times. Sure if it is prime time or a weekend it is not a problem, however, as a PhD student I have available time early morning and simply want to hop on and hack/slash/nuke for a bit. Sitting here reading forums waiting for a match is a waste of my time tbh.So the question at hand with less QQ'n is .. Will you consolodate the tokens so those of us who play on off hours can simply do the First Available?

Rocc

04-27-2010, 03:18 PM

I'm trying to find my screenshots. I have some pics that will help explain the changes. If I can ever find those lil suckers.

Dojac

04-27-2010, 03:28 PM

<cite>Lizbein wrote:</cite><blockquote>As I sit here in Que for the past 30+ minutes waiting for a Smuggler's Den match specifically because I am required to have those tokens to buy the gear I want, I can't stop wondering whether or not the consolidation will affect PvE servers as well. The test update seemed like it would, the flames comments from people who supposedly are in the "know" seems like it wont. Regardless, I have had 30+ minutes to peruse the forums and catch up on a lot of stuff but as of yet have not come across any discussion concerning the ridiculous amount of wait times. Sure if it is prime time or a weekend it is not a problem, however, as a PhD student I have available time early morning and simply want to hop on and hack/slash/nuke for a bit. Sitting here reading forums waiting for a match is a waste of my time tbh.So the question at hand with less QQ'n is .. Will you consolodate the tokens so those of us who play on off hours can simply do the First Available?</blockquote>From what i understand the token swap will be for open world PvP tokens only. Currently we have a smattering of token types at different teirs. they're movin em all to one token type.

StaticLex

04-27-2010, 04:15 PM

I can't stand the current token system. Or the que system for that matter. I have like 450 gears in the bank and 8 bottles. Every single thing I have left to get off the vendor requires bottles. If I could trade 10 gears for 1 stupid bottle I'd do it. Smuggler's Den is mostly a waste of time. Let's see.. I can join and waste 30 minutes and get 1 bottle. Yay? What I need to start doing is joining and hiding somewhere AFK since that's about the only way to bring the time spent VS reward ratio into line.

Rattfa

04-27-2010, 04:38 PM

World PvP tokens only, so doesn't affect PvE/Battlegrounds.

Crismorn

04-27-2010, 04:49 PM

<cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote>I can't stand the current token system. Or the que system for that matter. I have like 450 gears in the bank and 8 bottles. Every single thing I have left to get off the vendor requires bottles. If I could trade 10 gears for 1 stupid bottle I'd do it. Smuggler's Den is mostly a waste of time. Let's see.. I can join and waste 30 minutes and get 1 bottle. Yay? What I need to start doing is joining and hiding somewhere AFK since that's about the only way to bring the time spent VS reward ratio into line.</blockquote>If its not fun for you to run smugglers then dont do it.

Sydares

04-27-2010, 04:55 PM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>If its not fun for you to run smugglers then dont do it.</blockquote>I'm glad you like Smuggler's Den. It seems to be all you post about, so you're obviously enthusiastic about it. However, not everyone does. And being forced to run something you dislike in order to get gear to run the other two battlegrounds you do enjoy is irritating, bottom line. There should be some way for people who really, truly hate any given scenario not to have to do it. A repeatable choose-1-token kill quest or something. Anything.

Crismorn

04-27-2010, 05:00 PM

<cite>Sydares wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>If its not fun for you to run smugglers then dont do it.</blockquote>I'm glad you like Smuggler's Den. It seems to be all you post about, so you're obviously enthusiastic about it. However, not everyone does. And being forced to run something you dislike in order to get gear to run the other two battlegrounds you do enjoy is irritating, bottom line. There should be some way for people who really, truly hate any given scenario not to have to do it. A repeatable choose-1-token kill quest or something. Anything.</blockquote>Contrary to popular belief no one is entitled to any of the bg rewards, they are simply rewards for playing the content.

LardLord

04-27-2010, 05:02 PM

<cite>Sydares wrote:</cite><blockquote>And being forced to run something you dislike in order to get gear to run the other two battlegrounds you do enjoy is irritating, bottom line. There should be some way for people who really, truly hate any given scenario not to have to do it. A repeatable choose-1-token kill quest or something. Anything.</blockquote>I can buy that, but don't link it to kills, since kills don't always mean you're doing what's best for your team's chances at winning. The best way would be an exchange like others have suggested, but the ratio should be such that it is, without a doubt, easier to just run each of the three scenarios. It should probably be something like 10:1 (can play three quick Ganak's in the time one Smugglers takes?). If they make it so that you can get the gear fastest by just running one of the scenarios, then the other two will have too few people playing them, since a lot of people in BGs are just there for the gear.

StaticLex

04-27-2010, 05:23 PM

<cite>Quabi@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote>If they make it so that you can get the gear fastest by just running one of the scenarios, then the other two will have too few people playing them..</blockquote>You know what they call this? Poor design. If the game population truly enjoys playing the 6 or 12 man the most, why would you cram the 24 man down their throats by requiring bottles for gear?

Crismorn

04-27-2010, 05:28 PM

<cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Quabi@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote>If they make it so that you can get the gear fastest by just running one of the scenarios, then the other two will have too few people playing them..</blockquote>You know what they call this? Poor design. If the game population truly enjoys playing the 6 or 12 man the most, why would you cram the 24 man down their throats by requiring bottles for gear?</blockquote>It might have something to do with gear being a reward for playing the content. Those crazy game designers and their crazy ways of actually making people do all the content to get all the gear, its madness I tell ya.

StaticLex

04-27-2010, 05:38 PM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Quabi@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote>If they make it so that you can get the gear fastest by just running one of the scenarios, then the other two will have too few people playing them..</blockquote>You know what they call this? Poor design. If the game population truly enjoys playing the 6 or 12 man the most, why would you cram the 24 man down their throats by requiring bottles for gear?</blockquote>It might have something to do with gear being a reward for playing the content. Those crazy game designers and their crazy ways of actually making people do all the content to get all the gear, its madness I tell ya.</blockquote>Being forced to arbitrarily jump through hoops is the dumbest game model of all time, but apparently to you it's a perfectly sound way to entertain people.

Notsovilepriest

04-27-2010, 05:40 PM

<cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Quabi@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote>If they make it so that you can get the gear fastest by just running one of the scenarios, then the other two will have too few people playing them..</blockquote>You know what they call this? Poor design. If the game population truly enjoys playing the 6 or 12 man the most, why would you cram the 24 man down their throats by requiring bottles for gear?</blockquote>It might have something to do with gear being a reward for playing the content. Those crazy game designers and their crazy ways of actually making people do all the content to get all the gear, its madness I tell ya.</blockquote>Being forced to arbitrarily jump through hoops is the dumbest game model of all time, but apparently to you it's a perfectly sound way to entertain people.</blockquote>Killing all those mobs in RoK before VP was dull, They should have never bothered putting them in! Geez! Requiring you to do something before getting to what you want is so...Inconvenient.

LardLord

04-27-2010, 05:42 PM

<cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote>You know what they call this? Poor design. If the game population truly enjoys playing the 6 or 12 man the most, why would you cram the 24 man down their throats by requiring bottles for gear?</blockquote>Honestly, my read on it is that the game population truly enjoys getting gear. If it were easiest to gear up via Smuggler's, it would probably be the most popular.

Chiyoiche

04-27-2010, 05:43 PM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>If its not fun for you to run smugglers then dont do it.</blockquote>its not the fact that it entirely isnt fun. sometimes it is. but sometimes waiting on the que for it, is rediculous. not as many people run it as the others. and of course the PVP server only guys are against anyone else other then them getting the single type token exchange. to give them a even bigger head start then they already have in BGs. wich contrary to some PVP servers beleif...Battlegrounds IS PvP.PvP is Player VS Player. doesnt have to be on a single server to be called PvP.so if some of us, who do play BGs, why cant we have the single tokens too?i wouldnt mind a exhange ratio at all of the tokens, like taking a loss on the quicker to earn ect to get the ones i need. and its not just about the single token thing. the new BG gear...unless they change it, many have to start ALL OVER to to get the new upgraded set. to get something they may have gotten only a week before the G came out, because like most of us, thought the consolodated token thing was for the PvP servers, AND Battlegrounds...wich is...shocker! PVP! :O :ODevs, PLEASE, i beg you, please consider consolodated tokens too for BGs armor? or even a exchange ratio? please? not all of us want to move to PvP servers. some of us like our servers, but also enjoy doing BGs, but would rather not start ALL over again to get tokens for the newer gear sets.

Crismorn

04-27-2010, 05:45 PM

<cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Quabi@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote>If they make it so that you can get the gear fastest by just running one of the scenarios, then the other two will have too few people playing them..</blockquote>You know what they call this? Poor design. If the game population truly enjoys playing the 6 or 12 man the most, why would you cram the 24 man down their throats by requiring bottles for gear?</blockquote>It might have something to do with gear being a reward for playing the content. Those crazy game designers and their crazy ways of actually making people do all the content to get all the gear, its madness I tell ya.</blockquote>Being forced to arbitrarily jump through hoops is the dumbest game model of all time, but apparently to you it's a perfectly sound way to entertain people.</blockquote>Does your internet provider force you to log online? Fail logic is fail.If you want the rewards then you must meet the requirements to those rewards. This is not a new concept, it is a rather old one

Crismorn

04-27-2010, 05:47 PM

<cite>Quabi@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote>You know what they call this? Poor design. If the game population truly enjoys playing the 6 or 12 man the most, why would you cram the 24 man down their throats by requiring bottles for gear?</blockquote>Honestly, my read on it is that the game population truly enjoys getting gear. If it were easiest to gear up via Smuggler's, it would probably be the most popular.</blockquote>Yep, so its a good thing all 3 are required for the gear.

Crismorn

04-27-2010, 05:49 PM

Lack of players might have something to do with you being under level 90.The xpac was released months ago, most players have been 90 for a long time and I do not see these kind of 30 min queues in the level 90 bracket

Chiyoiche

04-27-2010, 05:51 PM

i have a 90 warden. and my lock. but honestly lately its become more fun to play my lock in BGs. and ive had the long que issue with the 90 bracket. so its not just the teir

Notsovilepriest

04-27-2010, 06:09 PM

<cite>Chiyoiche@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>If its not fun for you to run smugglers then dont do it.</blockquote>its not the fact that it entirely isnt fun. sometimes it is. but sometimes waiting on the que for it, is rediculous. not as many people run it as the others. and of course the PVP server only guys are against anyone else other then them getting the single type token exchange. to give them a even bigger head start then they already have in BGs. wich contrary to some PVP servers beleif...Battlegrounds IS PvP.PvP is Player VS Player. doesnt have to be on a single server to be called PvP.so if some of us, who do play BGs, why cant we have the single tokens too?i wouldnt mind a exhange ratio at all of the tokens, like taking a loss on the quicker to earn ect to get the ones i need. and its not just about the single token thing. the new BG gear...unless they change it, many have to start ALL OVER to to get the new upgraded set. to get something they may have gotten only a week before the G came out, because like most of us, thought the consolodated token thing was for the PvP servers, AND Battlegrounds...wich is...shocker! PVP! :O :ODevs, PLEASE, i beg you, please consider consolodated tokens too for BGs armor? or even a exchange ratio? please? not all of us want to move to PvP servers. some of us like our servers, but also enjoy doing BGs, but would rather not start ALL over again to get tokens for the newer gear sets.</blockquote>Really? You think PvP servers have this huge advantage? Thats laughable. The have such a minuet advantage it's really not worth talking about. Oh, and don't say BGs are PvP, your fellow PvP'ers made it abundently clear that isn't valid logic when they lobbied to get our effect procing gear taken out.

KatrinaDeath

04-27-2010, 06:13 PM

I would be okay with a (3-5) to 1 exchange of BG token A for BG token B IF they made smugglers 1000-1200 points for the goal. If you really don't want to run zone A then fine but you'll pay 3-5 times as much.

Chiyoiche

04-27-2010, 06:22 PM

<cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Chiyoiche@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>If its not fun for you to run smugglers then dont do it.</blockquote>its not the fact that it entirely isnt fun. sometimes it is. but sometimes waiting on the que for it, is rediculous. not as many people run it as the others. and of course the PVP server only guys are against anyone else other then them getting the single type token exchange. to give them a even bigger head start then they already have in BGs. wich contrary to some PVP servers beleif...Battlegrounds IS PvP.PvP is Player VS Player. doesnt have to be on a single server to be called PvP.so if some of us, who do play BGs, why cant we have the single tokens too?i wouldnt mind a exhange ratio at all of the tokens, like taking a loss on the quicker to earn ect to get the ones i need. and its not just about the single token thing. the new BG gear...unless they change it, many have to start ALL OVER to to get the new upgraded set. to get something they may have gotten only a week before the G came out, because like most of us, thought the consolodated token thing was for the PvP servers, AND Battlegrounds...wich is...shocker! PVP! :O :ODevs, PLEASE, i beg you, please consider consolodated tokens too for BGs armor? or even a exchange ratio? please? not all of us want to move to PvP servers. some of us like our servers, but also enjoy doing BGs, but would rather not start ALL over again to get tokens for the newer gear sets.</blockquote>Really? You think PvP servers have this huge advantage? Thats laughable. The have such a minuet advantage it's really not worth talking about. Oh, and don't say BGs are PvP, your fellow PvP'ers made it abundently clear that isn't valid logic when they lobbied to get our effect procing gear taken out.</blockquote>i am refering to advantage of your PvP gear, say versus...PvE gear.and yes, to some pve players goign into BGs, yes, its quite an advantage when normal pvp server players with their legendary and or fabled gear against most pve players, with very little to no pvp gear yet.you must be foregetting the definition of PvP let me remind you.<div>PVP</div>Definition: Player Versus Player.Used in Online games.ther Term PvP is stricly not reserved for mainly PvP servers. PvP is as stated above, Player VS Player.

StaticLex

04-27-2010, 06:30 PM

<cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Quabi@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote>If they make it so that you can get the gear fastest by just running one of the scenarios, then the other two will have too few people playing them..</blockquote>You know what they call this? Poor design. If the game population truly enjoys playing the 6 or 12 man the most, why would you cram the 24 man down their throats by requiring bottles for gear?</blockquote>It might have something to do with gear being a reward for playing the content. Those crazy game designers and their crazy ways of actually making people do all the content to get all the gear, its madness I tell ya.</blockquote>Being forced to arbitrarily jump through hoops is the dumbest game model of all time, but apparently to you it's a perfectly sound way to entertain people.</blockquote>Killing all those mobs in RoK before VP was dull, They should have never bothered putting them in! Geez! Requiring you to do something before getting to what you want is so...Inconvenient.</blockquote>This is not even comparable. The ROK raid tiers had structure where gear got better with each progressive kill. BG token costs are apread around arbitrarily. Some items purchased with gears are excellent and some with bottles are trash. I don't care how you try to spin it, it takes way more time get accumulate bottles than it does gears and the rewards are NOT commensurate.

Chiyoiche

04-27-2010, 06:34 PM

<cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote>This is not even comparable. The ROK raid tiers had structure where gear got better with each progressive kill. BG token costs are apread around arbitrarily. Some items purchased with gears are excellent and some with bottles are trash. I don't care how you try to spin it, it takes way more time get accumulate bottles than it does gears and the rewards are NOT commensurate.</blockquote>Thank you! this is explained well and to the point. too bad some refuse to see it though

Crismorn

04-27-2010, 06:50 PM

I'm against being rewarded without doing the content requirements, you just happen to see it as more then it is

Daalilama

04-27-2010, 07:08 PM

<cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Chiyoiche@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>If its not fun for you to run smugglers then dont do it.</blockquote>its not the fact that it entirely isnt fun. sometimes it is. but sometimes waiting on the que for it, is rediculous. not as many people run it as the others. and of course the PVP server only guys are against anyone else other then them getting the single type token exchange. to give them a even bigger head start then they already have in BGs. wich contrary to some PVP servers beleif...Battlegrounds IS PvP.PvP is Player VS Player. doesnt have to be on a single server to be called PvP.so if some of us, who do play BGs, why cant we have the single tokens too?i wouldnt mind a exhange ratio at all of the tokens, like taking a loss on the quicker to earn ect to get the ones i need. and its not just about the single token thing. the new BG gear...unless they change it, many have to start ALL OVER to to get the new upgraded set. to get something they may have gotten only a week before the G came out, because like most of us, thought the consolodated token thing was for the PvP servers, AND Battlegrounds...wich is...shocker! PVP! :O :ODevs, PLEASE, i beg you, please consider consolodated tokens too for BGs armor? or even a exchange ratio? please? not all of us want to move to PvP servers. some of us like our servers, but also enjoy doing BGs, but would rather not start ALL over again to get tokens for the newer gear sets.</blockquote>Really? You think PvP servers have this huge advantage? Thats laughable. The have such a minuet advantage it's really not worth talking about. Oh, and don't say BGs are PvP, your fellow PvE'ers made it abundently clear that isn't valid logic when they lobbied to get our effect procing gear taken out.</blockquote>There that adjustment seems better tbh....after all in 5 years of pvp servers I have never seen a "PvP" fix dones in that recrd amount of time...think the b*tching was what less than a week before PvP server only items were nerf'ed?And BG is not PvP....but continue to believe away

de lori

04-27-2010, 07:14 PM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm against being rewarded without doing the content requirements, you just happen to see it as more then it is</blockquote>I like all three of the maps...I think they're fun in differents ways and would happily play all 3 equally.But currently im sitting on 800+ gears tokens, 150 Ganak, 86 smugglers. The system is extremely favoured towards people that can play at primetime. I get home from work around 1am est and playing first available returns about 4-1 gears matches Vs the others. (by about 4am it is gears only that comes up)I cant even imagine what ratio of tokens the poor EU guys are getting on the seperate server.I would like to see the ability to swap tokens...perhaps 4-5 to 1...but i do see the issue of a token swap making it even harder to get a smugglers or ganak match as people opt for the easier map.maybe change the cost of the gear to 40 gears 20 other token instead of 30/30 or make sure each piece of gear includes gears tokens.I dunno.....just seems like alot more effort needs to be put in to aqquire the gear playing non primetime.

Crismorn

04-27-2010, 07:14 PM

<cite>Daalilama@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Chiyoiche@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>If its not fun for you to run smugglers then dont do it.</blockquote>its not the fact that it entirely isnt fun. sometimes it is. but sometimes waiting on the que for it, is rediculous. not as many people run it as the others. and of course the PVP server only guys are against anyone else other then them getting the single type token exchange. to give them a even bigger head start then they already have in BGs. wich contrary to some PVP servers beleif...Battlegrounds IS PvP.PvP is Player VS Player. doesnt have to be on a single server to be called PvP.so if some of us, who do play BGs, why cant we have the single tokens too?i wouldnt mind a exhange ratio at all of the tokens, like taking a loss on the quicker to earn ect to get the ones i need. and its not just about the single token thing. the new BG gear...unless they change it, many have to start ALL OVER to to get the new upgraded set. to get something they may have gotten only a week before the G came out, because like most of us, thought the consolodated token thing was for the PvP servers, AND Battlegrounds...wich is...shocker! PVP! :O :ODevs, PLEASE, i beg you, please consider consolodated tokens too for BGs armor? or even a exchange ratio? please? not all of us want to move to PvP servers. some of us like our servers, but also enjoy doing BGs, but would rather not start ALL over again to get tokens for the newer gear sets.</blockquote>Really? You think PvP servers have this huge advantage? Thats laughable. The have such a minuet advantage it's really not worth talking about. Oh, and don't say BGs are PvP, your fellow PvE'ers made it abundently clear that isn't valid logic when they lobbied to get our effect procing gear taken out.</blockquote>There that adjustment seems better tbh....after all in 5 years of pvp servers I have never seen a "PvP" fix dones in that recrd amount of time...think the b*tching was what less than a week before PvP server only items were nerf'ed?And BG is not PvP....but continue to believe away</blockquote>Yeah bg's are vastly different then pvp.Maybe the dev's could scale KP down, make a 48 vs 48 map and co-ordinate spawn points with where the giant cluster zerg fest happens to be for a more realistic pvp experience.

StaticLex

04-27-2010, 07:15 PM

Notsovilepriest

04-27-2010, 07:35 PM

<cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm against being rewarded without doing the content requirements, you just happen to see it as more then it is</blockquote>lol? So you would go raid VP to get PR quality drops? I guess so since you would be fulfilling the content requirements..</blockquote>Would you prefer all the goodp pieces take bottles?

Notsovilepriest

04-27-2010, 07:48 PM

<cite>Chiyoiche@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Chiyoiche@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>If its not fun for you to run smugglers then dont do it.</blockquote>its not the fact that it entirely isnt fun. sometimes it is. but sometimes waiting on the que for it, is rediculous. not as many people run it as the others. and of course the PVP server only guys are against anyone else other then them getting the single type token exchange. to give them a even bigger head start then they already have in BGs. wich contrary to some PVP servers beleif...Battlegrounds IS PvP.PvP is Player VS Player. doesnt have to be on a single server to be called PvP.so if some of us, who do play BGs, why cant we have the single tokens too?i wouldnt mind a exhange ratio at all of the tokens, like taking a loss on the quicker to earn ect to get the ones i need. and its not just about the single token thing. the new BG gear...unless they change it, many have to start ALL OVER to to get the new upgraded set. to get something they may have gotten only a week before the G came out, because like most of us, thought the consolodated token thing was for the PvP servers, AND Battlegrounds...wich is...shocker! PVP! :O :ODevs, PLEASE, i beg you, please consider consolodated tokens too for BGs armor? or even a exchange ratio? please? not all of us want to move to PvP servers. some of us like our servers, but also enjoy doing BGs, but would rather not start ALL over again to get tokens for the newer gear sets.</blockquote>Really? You think PvP servers have this huge advantage? Thats laughable. The have such a minuet advantage it's really not worth talking about. Oh, and don't say BGs are PvP, your fellow PvP'ers made it abundently clear that isn't valid logic when they lobbied to get our effect procing gear taken out.</blockquote>i am refering to advantage of your PvP gear, say versus...PvE gear.and yes, to some pve players goign into BGs, yes, its quite an advantage when normal pvp server players with their legendary and or fabled gear against most pve players, with very little to no pvp gear yet.you must be foregetting the definition of PvP let me remind you.<div>PVP</div>Definition: Player Versus Player.Used in Online games.ther Term PvP is stricly not reserved for mainly PvP servers. PvP is as stated above, Player VS Player.</blockquote>Oh, So wait, You can achieve the same toughness with the MC as someone wearing the full PvP set, Granted it has less blue stats, but still. Thats what matters the most is toughness. Also, I wasn't the one that said it wasn't PvP, it was your PVE'ers in their crusade to remove PvP gear.

Meirril

04-28-2010, 05:49 AM

<cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Quabi@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote>If they make it so that you can get the gear fastest by just running one of the scenarios, then the other two will have too few people playing them..</blockquote>You know what they call this? Poor design. If the game population truly enjoys playing the 6 or 12 man the most, why would you cram the 24 man down their throats by requiring bottles for gear?</blockquote>It might have something to do with gear being a reward for playing the content. Those crazy game designers and their crazy ways of actually making people do all the content to get all the gear, its madness I tell ya.</blockquote>Being forced to arbitrarily jump through hoops is the dumbest game model of all time, but apparently to you it's a perfectly sound way to entertain people.</blockquote>You know that is an accurate description of raiding?

Trawe

04-28-2010, 08:20 AM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote>I can't stand the current token system. Or the que system for that matter. I have like 450 gears in the bank and 8 bottles. Every single thing I have left to get off the vendor requires bottles. If I could trade 10 gears for 1 stupid bottle I'd do it. Smuggler's Den is mostly a waste of time. Let's see.. I can join and waste 30 minutes and get 1 bottle. Yay? What I need to start doing is joining and hiding somewhere AFK since that's about the only way to bring the time spent VS reward ratio into line.</blockquote>If its not fun for you to run smugglers then dont do it.</blockquote>this is the issue. i don´t know if it is fun or not because i am not able to join x4 with 10 players in total ( from two servers ).

Kizee

04-28-2010, 08:55 AM

What happens when there aren't enough people running the less popular BG's to get a group or the que is too long to wait for?I didn't jump into BG's because I really wasn't too intrested in them and just reached 90 a few days ago.I really like the appearance of the BG armor and if it is close to impossiable to get groups for the less popular instances i wont bother frustrating myself trying to get tokens.It would be nice to consolidate the tokens and let people play in the BG they want to play in.

Lizbein

04-28-2010, 11:44 AM

Please take your pointless QQ'n and b!tching back and forth to another forum. Seems I had to read through 3 pages of posts to see a handful of decent responses.There exists a problem here and your b!tching is not bringing the actual problem to the Dev's attention but rather making them say, oh look another thread with whiny b!tches .. skip!Currently right now NO one is "not wanting" to do Smug's Den, the problem is we don't want to wait 30 mins+ to play a BG match. It's a waste of time. I'd prefer a fix. Could we get a Dev's response on this please? You have to realize that some people play on extremely off times and this was bound to happen.

Dareena

04-28-2010, 01:42 PM

Why not just throw in a token conversion merchant who's rates are insultingly high? You can establish rediculous ratios like 10:1 or 20:1 per token conversion. That would let people still get Smugglers token gear, let them avoid Smugglers if they chose to, yet also make this path stupidly time consuming. With a rip off conversion rate in place, everyone would be happy. The crowd who's anti-exchange would be satisfied with this kind of insulting conversion rate and the anti-Smugglers crowd can still eventually get their gear. Frankly it sounds like a win-win scenerio to me.

StaticLex

04-28-2010, 01:44 PM

<cite>Lizbein wrote:</cite><blockquote>Currently right now NO one is "not wanting" to do Smug's Den, the problem is we don't want to wait 30 mins+ to play a BG match. It's a waste of time. I'd prefer a fix. </blockquote>Obviously if people really wanted to do smuggler's den, you wouldn't be waiting that long to get one going.

Notsovilepriest

04-28-2010, 01:56 PM

Smugglers den is the longest, so should give the highest rewards, that would be the "progression" people want

Lizbein

04-28-2010, 02:39 PM

Ok I should reiterate, me personally I want to do Smuglers Den and yes you are right, obviously not everyone wants to do that. However, it still is an issue. As far as an obscene exchange rate, I don't agree. Yes it should be weighted heavier towards requiring more gears for each Smug den token, but 10? A decent exchange rate would be around the 4-5 range. You can probably pump out 3 rounds of klak or 2 rounds of ganak in the same time it takes for a smug den. So if it's 4-5 it is slightly more than the time and effort normally expended. 10 in my opinion is rather ridiculous, but the idea of higher amounts IS sound and there will be some equilibrium where we can make everyone happy.Furthermore this issue, while it isn't readily apparent to everyone involved atm, it very soon will be. With the opening up of battlegrounds from 30-70, a lot of the players in the top battlegrounds will mess around on their alts. Assuming there's no massive Exodus from other MMO's to ours, you can see that the top end battlegrounds populations will be diminished. As well as the low end battlegrounds not having enough people possibly to get all the matches going.If this is fixed NOW or implemented with the next update, at least you the DEVS will alleviate future complaints because I can assure you they will come once others start feeling the effects of this.

Lizbein

04-28-2010, 02:41 PM

In addition ...The easier fix imho, is simply to consolidate the tokens and have the different battle grounds provide larger rewards based on the time it takes to complete them. For a generic example: Klak - 1/3 (loss/win) Ganak 2/6 SMug 4/12. This would make it simpler, and produce the same desired effect.

Crismorn

04-28-2010, 03:16 PM

All of these ideas would just move everyone from doing 3 different bg's to just doing the X2.Leave it as is, there is a reason why they made 3 maps, 3 scenario's, 3 currencies and 3 currencies required to get gear.Suck it up buttercup

Chiyoiche

04-28-2010, 03:23 PM

<cite>Lizbein wrote:</cite><blockquote>In addition ...The easier fix imho, is simply to consolidate the tokens and have the different battle grounds provide larger rewards based on the time it takes to complete them. For a generic example: Klak - 1/3 (loss/win) Ganak 2/6 SMug 4/12. This would make it simpler, and produce the same desired effect.</blockquote>those ideas sound pretty good to me. i personaly like smugglers. but the wait...lol...is like pulling teeth somtimes. i dont always get to play BGs during prime time, like many others, so we end doing 'first availible'. wich is usualy gears or the 2x2. but honestly i prefer gears and den.and seeing as smugglers requires much more cooperation from your raid as a whole(ive been in some a few time were we lost by a few points because the ''leader'' was ignoring the raids cries to fix the groups. but thats another issue and not relevant to here entirely.) the map is bigger, much bigger, and take longer to complete. the 3 for win reward isnt on par with the rest of the game. usualy the harder zones in SF, that have the daily/weekly mark quest, reward more tokens. dens should be the same.an exchange merchant, or consolodation would be great, if we cant get the reward tokens for wins upped.i am all for working for your things. but the fact that the que for smugglers, is the worst for all 3, and has the worst reward, in comparison to the rest of the game.

StaticLex

04-28-2010, 03:30 PM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>All of these ideas would just move everyone from doing 3 different bg's to just doing the X2.</blockquote>Yeah, god forbid people are allowed to play the BG they enjoy the most while earning a balanced amount of tokens. /sarcasm

Crismorn

04-28-2010, 03:49 PM

<cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>All of these ideas would just move everyone from doing 3 different bg's to just doing the X2.</blockquote>Yeah, god forbid people are allowed to play the BG they enjoy the most while earning a balanced amount of tokens. /sarcasm</blockquote>You can play whatever bg you want, if you want all the rewards then you have to play all 3 scenario's.Suck it up buttercup.Gear is a reward, not a right

LardLord

04-28-2010, 03:59 PM

<cite>Dareena@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote>You can establish rediculous ratios like 10:1 or 20:1 per token conversion. That would let people still get Smugglers token gear, let them avoid Smugglers if they chose to, yet also make this path stupidly time consuming. With a rip off conversion rate in place, everyone would be happy. The crowd who's anti-exchange would be satisfied with this kind of insulting conversion rate and the anti-Smugglers crowd can still eventually get their gear. Frankly it sounds like a win-win scenerio to me.</blockquote>Yeah, I wouldn't mind a 10:1 or 12:1 ratio (20:1 seems over the top). The problem, I guess, is that some people think a 5:1 (or even 3:1) would be fair, but you can pretty consistently finish Ganak matches in literally 1/5th the time a Smugglers match takes if you have a pre-made. That would result in people just doing pre-made Ganaks instead of touching Smugglers, since their win percentage in a pre-made Ganak is going to be higher, making it easier to earn bottles that way.

Crismorn

04-28-2010, 04:07 PM

Everyone would do Ganak, they would max in combat run speed and run flags for the fastest tokens ever.Either way one thing is certain, a token exchange would hurt bg's. How much is up for speculation

Crismorn

04-28-2010, 04:36 PM

These supposed 30min wait times are a joke I hope.I did ~5 smuggler runs last night between 10pm-1am pst and I waited 1-2mins at most for a match to pop.In fact I've never waited longer then 5minutes ever and I've probably run well over 200 smugglers at various times/days of the week.

Notsovilepriest

04-28-2010, 04:37 PM

I love it, PvE'ers are starting to think like PvP'ers tended to. If you want a reward, buck up and work for it the means it says. If they change it to be lower, whatever, but until then, just enjoy all of the scenerios and play them.

Shareana

04-28-2010, 05:26 PM

No need for insults please!

Lizbein

04-28-2010, 06:41 PM

All i got to say is wow. He runs his mouth and calls people buttercup and I call him an idiot for not actually reading the discussion before flaming people for his assumption that they do NOT want to run Smugglers, and my post gets deleted? How bout you moderate him for not actually adding to the conversation but detracting completely and being condescending regarding an issue he is apparently not aware of at all.The 30 min wait times are no joke. I have them ALL the time which is why I never get a chance to do Smugglers Den. Now I'm playing on the 80-89 and so maybe since I'm assuming you are not, you do not see that. The fact that it does exist shows that there will be additional issues in the future regarding BG populations when the 30-70 go live.With regard to sucking it up and enjoying it for what it is and not saying anything about it. That mentality is what leads to no progress or improvements being done. The fact is, there exist a lot of issues that the developers and coders do not encounter and they rely on us for SOME insight as it is the case they don't have the time to spend hours upon hours playing the game when they got work to do. Given that thought, this post was made.For those naysayers who have continually not actually read the posts with VALID concerns, if you cannot read do not post here. Your not helping find a solution to the current and future problems regarding BG populations causing long wait times but simply saying, in not so many words, . Sucks to be you, eat it and stop saying there's a problem. That condescension is not productive and in no way is promoting a solution to what appears to me at least to be a more wide spread problem that you guys are aware of.With regard to my "insult" of DavionFor clarification - According to Wiki an idiot is a mentally deficient person, or someone who acts in a self-defeating or significantly counterproductive wayWhich he currently is doing. So it is fact as opposed to me simply making up something random to refer to him as.in·sult (n-slt)v. in·sult·ed, in·sult·ing, in·sults v.tr.1. a. To treat with gross insensitivity, insolence, or contemptuous rudenessI think that seeing Davionx's posts around the forums that he is not a sensitive person, and as such, I am not being insensitive to him, but rather speaking his language, i.e. not an insult.

Crismorn

04-28-2010, 06:59 PM

You should try the level 90 bracket, the longest wait I've yet to see for a smugglers to pop since bg's started was 5 minutes.The average wait time for a smugglers to pop is aprox. 20-30 seconds. I've run well over 200 smugglers

Masuma

04-28-2010, 09:46 PM

<cite>Lizbein wrote:</cite><blockquote>The 30 min wait times are no joke. I have them ALL the time which is why I never get a chance to do Smugglers Den. </blockquote>Wish we would only have to wait 30 minutes on runnyeye <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> I think the next match will be on Saturday

StaticLex

04-28-2010, 11:07 PM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>Everyone would do Ganak, they would max in combat run speed and run flags for the fastest tokens ever.</blockquote>l2p and kill the flag runner.

LivelyHound

04-29-2010, 05:13 AM

<cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Lizbein wrote:</cite><blockquote>Currently right now NO one is "not wanting" to do Smug's Den, the problem is we don't want to wait 30 mins+ to play a BG match. It's a waste of time. I'd prefer a fix. </blockquote>Obviously if people really wanted to do smuggler's den, you wouldn't be waiting that long to get one going.</blockquote>You do realise not everyone on the planet lives in the US right? And quite a few of us play on US servers right? and as such our playtimes can be vastly different to yours right?The point: We do often wait for 30 mins+ to get into smugglers.Yeah I know, sucks to be us, deal with it, play on a Europe server... whatever.

Vulkan_NTooki

04-29-2010, 07:26 AM

<cite>LivelyHound wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Lizbein wrote:</cite><blockquote>Currently right now NO one is "not wanting" to do Smug's Den, the problem is we don't want to wait 30 mins+ to play a BG match. It's a waste of time. I'd prefer a fix. </blockquote>Obviously if people really wanted to do smuggler's den, you wouldn't be waiting that long to get one going.</blockquote>You do realise not everyone on the planet lives in the US right? And quite a few of us play on US servers right? and as such our playtimes can be vastly different to yours right?The point: We do often wait for 30 mins+ to get into smugglers.Yeah I know, sucks to be us, deal with it, play on a Europe server... whatever.</blockquote>This part was funny.. We (runnyeye/splitpaw) usually only see Den runs on saturdays.. if your lucky u can get some running on sundays too.. but alot harder to gather the ppl. The only reasons u see these Den runs is the coordinated forum efforts of a few souls from Runnyeye/Splitpaw that informed ppl of when the Den's will be run..(more or less).We either have to become a part of the complete server farm for BG or we need some sort of exchange... As it is now, the only ppl able to get a reasonable amount of den tokens is the ones that can actually play 10-15h straight on saturdays. And thats unfair compared to the other servers where atleast u can get Dens running everyday on prime time.

snowli

04-29-2010, 04:26 PM

The EU BG experience is:40% of the week x1 isn't running80% of the week x2 isn't running97% of the week x4 isn't runningGathering enough tokens to equip for PvP is only really possible for people who can devote entire saturdays to playing non-stop. What would take days to earn in US BG will take months on EU BG, for some players it will simply never be practical, no matter how much time they're bored in emtpy queues.Unless SoE either consolodate tokens, lower costs in the EU vendors, or let EU players into the US BG network on all the times our client versions match (which is a massive improvement on the current 'players fedup with another and predictable EU mess, so little to no uptime' situation), the EU BG is in a sorry state.Whatever about EU localised problems, token consolodation is just flat out a good design evolution, and very easy to do, look at the average running length of the different match types, assign token rewards broadly based on that and just use a single token currency.

Notsovilepriest

04-29-2010, 04:34 PM

Please Euro's stop poluting threads about your population, yes it's a problem, but keep it to your own threads. I feel bad for you, I really do, but complaining in every thread won't do it for you. I really do wish they would let you guys BG with us, but holy crap I read about your population so often in threads that have little to no to do with it.

snowli

04-29-2010, 08:38 PM

I guarantee you, reading about EU BG is vastly less annoying than being saddled with the current situation in them.

Masuma

04-29-2010, 11:03 PM

<cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote>Please Euro's stop poluting threads about your population, yes it's a problem, but keep it to your own threads. I feel bad for you, I really do, but complaining in every thread won't do it for you. I really do wish they would let you guys BG with us, but holy crap I read about your population so often in threads that have little to no to do with it.</blockquote>to "our own threads"?I believe this comment displays very well how europeans are seen very often in this game, doesnt it?

Armironhead

04-29-2010, 11:14 PM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>You should try the level 90 bracket, the longest wait I've yet to see for a smugglers to pop since bg's started was 5 minutes.The average wait time for a smugglers to pop is aprox. 20-30 seconds. I've run well over 200 smugglers</blockquote>totally depends on the time of day. Sometimes it seems i cant get a smugglers at all. Figure everyone is raiding then.

Notsovilepriest

04-29-2010, 11:26 PM

<cite>Shalin@Runnyeye wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote>Please Euro's stop poluting threads about your population, yes it's a problem, but keep it to your own threads. I feel bad for you, I really do, but complaining in every thread won't do it for you. I really do wish they would let you guys BG with us, but holy crap I read about your population so often in threads that have little to no to do with it.</blockquote>to "our own threads"?I believe this comment displays very well how europeans are seen very often in this game, doesnt it?</blockquote>No, but to throw little whiney comments, into threads they don't belong, that is annoying. Nobody hates Euro's. Nobody disagrees with Euro's being here in BGs with us, but these threads about about things other than the Euro population. Don't you guys have a thread about Euro BG Population

Enoe

04-30-2010, 06:59 AM

Its true Den tokens dont come easy and its take time to zome in and finish zone. On the other hand this content is there and is required to be used to gear up.My idea would be to play a bit with the prices:Ratio on gear should be like 3:2:1 (klak/ganak/den)so lets say now chest for fighter was 50 klak 50 ganak - change it to 60 klak 40 ganak 20 denlesser gear which cost 30/30 now should be - 40 klak/20 ganak/ 10 denSo make generally all gear to cost all kind of tokens, instead of just 2 but chamge ratio required to be suitable to time u spent on getting tokens.

Masuma

04-30-2010, 11:22 AM

<cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Shalin@Runnyeye wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote>Please Euro's stop poluting threads about your population, yes it's a problem, but keep it to your own threads. I feel bad for you, I really do, but complaining in every thread won't do it for you. I really do wish they would let you guys BG with us, but holy crap I read about your population so often in threads that have little to no to do with it.</blockquote>to "our own threads"?I believe this comment displays very well how europeans are seen very often in this game, doesnt it?</blockquote>No, but to throw little whiney comments, into threads they don't belong, that is annoying. Nobody hates Euro's. Nobody disagrees with Euro's being here in BGs with us, but these threads about about things other than the Euro population. Don't you guys have a thread about Euro BG Population</blockquote>That is true but "Token Consolodation " is something that would improve the situation for us directly until they (hopefully) let us join the US BGs.I guess sometimes i would wish for some support even from US players. A lot of times it seems like it works for them, so they don't care and even dont want to have to read about it. But we should be a community.

Megavolt

04-30-2010, 02:06 PM

<cite>Enoe wrote:</cite><blockquote>Its true Den tokens dont come easy and its take time to zome in and finish zone. On the other hand this content is there and is required to be used to gear up.My idea would be to play a bit with the prices:Ratio on gear should be like 3:2:1 (klak/ganak/den)so lets say now chest for fighter was 50 klak 50 ganak - change it to 60 klak 40 ganak 20 denlesser gear which cost 30/30 now should be - 40 klak/20 ganak/ 10 denSo make generally all gear to cost all kind of tokens, instead of just 2 but chamge ratio required to be suitable to time u spent on getting tokens.</blockquote>Honestly, this is the best idea I've seen so far in here, although I think the ratio should be more around 5/4/2 since ganak only runs a bit longer than gears in most situations. It would keep people playing smugglers, but even up the time investment a bit.

Crismorn

04-30-2010, 03:57 PM

I have a better idea, lets leave the token costs as is and fix the euro servers without having to change the game

snowli

05-01-2010, 09:55 PM

Anything that means I can choose to not play boredom den and still gear up for pvp is a win frankly.

Sydares

05-02-2010, 02:57 AM

Smuggler's Den is the most abominably unfun gameplay I've yet to experience. It combines zerging with long runs, flat terrain, and idiotically weighted point values - to top it off, it by design runs nearly twenty minutes for every game.We've all done the content - and largely, are complaining about it.

Crismorn

05-02-2010, 04:18 AM

By largely do you mean 2-3 people in one thread? Cause if so then Ill agree with you.But if you mean the entire eq2 community then.... Well I'll let you figure that one out on your own

Draag

05-02-2010, 07:49 AM

<address>a lot of us lurk - but still complain.. just not on these boards (since most complaints are met with deletion)</address>smugglers sucks - Big time.

Crismorn

05-02-2010, 09:07 AM

That makes 3.

Avirodar

05-02-2010, 09:27 AM

Smugglers Den sucks. It is mundanely boring, full of stupid tanks that run around like headless chickens, and utility and DPS that never stay near the healers/tanks. The raid leader is usually someone who does not join voice chat, does not read raid chat, and does not even move until 30 seconds to 1 minute into the round, so groups are a total mess. There is often the obligitory nagafen player or two that try to ninja-afk somewhere out of sight to add to the enjoyment.The time and effort required for reward in smugglers, is absurd when compared to Gears and Ganak. That is what I dislike more than any of the points listed in the paragraph above. I don't care too much if its a lotto roll on if I am fortunate enough to be on the winning team, it's the volume of time required compared to equivalent sources of BG rewards.

Masuma

05-02-2010, 10:32 AM

<cite>Avirodar@Befallen wrote:</cite><blockquote>Smugglers Den sucks. It is mundanely boring, full of stupid tanks that run around like headless chickens, and utility and DPS that never stay near the healers/tanks. The raid leader is usually someone who does not join voice chat, does not read raid chat, and does not even move until 30 seconds to 1 minute into the round, so groups are a total mess. There is often the obligitory nagafen player or two that try to ninja-afk somewhere out of sight to add to the enjoyment.The time and effort required for reward in smugglers, is absurd when compared to Gears and Ganak. That is what I dislike more than any of the points listed in the paragraph above. I don't care too much if its a lotto roll on if I am fortunate enough to be on the winning team, it's the volume of time required compared to equivalent sources of BG rewards.</blockquote>I hate smugglers Den as well. Too many people play tanks, often they dont seem to try to protect healer and dps that stay close to them. That is probably because half of them do not know what they are doing other than being overpowered hard to kill DPS machines that can heal. As DPS / healer it is difficult to know which of the 3-4 Tanks in your group to follow. I hate Dens! Wish i wouldnt need to tokens from there.

snowli

05-02-2010, 12:30 PM

I hate afk leeching, I've always hated it across many games, but on the otherhand I hate the den content so much that I find myself actually considering just going afk during den to do something I don't hate, for the very first time in any game.

snowli

05-02-2010, 02:06 PM

Oh btw I just DISCOVERED the chain healer / bard leggings on my server a few minutes ago - I think that says a lot.

Sydares

05-02-2010, 05:37 PM

StaticLex

05-02-2010, 05:44 PM

I don't even attempt to play smuggler's den properly anymore. Nobody stays near me for heals when I'm on my warden so I just run around and find enemies to see how much damage I can keep myself alive through. On my scout I just kinda hide out and gank people. Both things are getting boring though so like others have mentioned, I'll probably just start joining them and hide AFK for the easy token.

Lizbein

05-02-2010, 06:50 PM

Haven't been to this thread in a while so a few things of note.To you Euro's .. while you may think that your friends from across the pond have somehow abandoned you, we have not. The original post was made due to weird play times causing issues with getting into den matches, which includes you.To the people who don't like Den. Uh Suck it up .. buttercup <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Seriously tho, most of the pain in the azz of Den is due to the player base sucking on average and you just notice it more with more people. However, there are things we can do to minimize that. Such as, berating people who do not get into voice chat where it becomes well known and accepted across the battlegrounds servers that getting into voice chat is a GOOD thing. Secondly, start taking some leads. I've lead my fair share of den and when people listen things go great, I've also had people listen and loose but meh at least you saw teamwork. This takes SOMEONE taking the reigns. Unfortunately most people don't want to do that. But if we as a COMMUNITY start staying with our group and REINFORCING that idea on a constant basis, .. then the servers may eventually fall in line and realize.. hey Group buffs are nice, .. heals are nice, done. I've already seen a decent evolution over the past month of being a clusterfuk to being a somewhat disorganized mess attempting to be organized. Which is progress however you slice it. I hope that idea continues. Maybe someone can take it upon themselves and post some standard expected PVP rules or something. Personally i like den for the strategy. I've had more fun when the matches were 1500-1450 on a come back swing than any gears or ganak fight. I JUST WANT TO GET INTO THEM WITHOUT LONG WAIT TIMES.Lastly with regaard to ways in which to fix this as suggestions.Token consolidation across the board whilst keeping it fair for time expended.Server consolidation to bring our European friends in.And how about worldwide consolidation to a specific server. Personally I would love the idea of saying yes I am going to PVP for awhile, .. and be transported to "another" Norrath within which i can group up with other people for premades if i so chose, .. or go duel while waiting for the next match. If there was a way to make this coding happen, it could also save on the server strain associated with people constantly going in/out/in/out .. since ONCE you go into that server you most likely will stay awhile.I think it would also promote more worldwide cooperation when you could group up cross server to go into these things. Given this they could go crazy with the rankings, .. current scores, group vs group challenges as opposed to randomly getting in and going against random other groups. It would most definitely add an additional level of fun and competitiveness that the BG could use atm.

Masuma

05-03-2010, 10:14 AM

<cite>Lizbein wrote:</cite><blockquote>Token consolidation across the board whilst keeping it fair for time expended.Server consolidation to bring our European friends in.And how about worldwide consolidation to a specific server. Personally I would love the idea of saying yes I am going to PVP for awhile, .. and be transported to "another" Norrath within which i can group up with other people for premades if i so chose, .. or go duel while waiting for the next match. If there was a way to make this coding happen, it could also save on the server strain associated with people constantly going in/out/in/out .. since ONCE you go into that server you most likely will stay awhile.I think it would also promote more worldwide cooperation when you could group up cross server to go into these things. Given this they could go crazy with the rankings, .. current scores, group vs group challenges as opposed to randomly getting in and going against random other groups. It would most definitely add an additional level of fun and competitiveness that the BG could use atm.</blockquote>I like your post, Lizbein. Reading about "european friends" was nice, wish it would be like that more often <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />I love your idea about the PVP server. Only worry I have is that it could increase problems that have to do with the low population on some servers. So what i would love to see is:- Token consolidation across the board whilst keeping it fair for time expended.- Server consolidation to bring our European friends in.- PVP Server as in Lizbein's post suggested- sever merge where it makes sense (Runnyeye / Splitpaw?)- possibility to communicate with friends that decided to go to that PVP server Lizbein described. That way it is possible to ask them if they like to come back to join for... whatever <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Trawe

05-03-2010, 11:38 AM

<cite>Lizbein wrote:</cite><blockquote>To you Euro's .. while you may think that your friends from across the pond have somehow abandoned you, we have not. The original post was made due to weird play times causing issues with getting into den matches, which includes you.</blockquote>yes you have abandoned us. german players will never ever see smugglers den anymore as they will never everget the possibility playing wiht a healthy player base. thanks to a not so good translation no one wants anyway.edit : just fyki i am queued up for the next available match for like 2 hrs and not even a klak match is happening.

Lizbein

05-03-2010, 06:49 PM

Just as an additional tidbit. I was talking with my roomate a bit about the Worldwide consolodation when battlegroundsing it up and it does have some great potential. You could theoretically have guilds on that server that represent teams. Teams could get rankings as well. Veteren players could challenge other veteren groups to 6v6 challenging contests rather than the fish in the barrel that they're used to and possibly bored of. It would definately raise the bar of competition across the board.I think soe has a great game here and I'd be willing to wager 99% of the people on these threads agree, despite their demeaner in some of these forums. What I do think Sony needs to do is make other people aware of the fact they got one of the best games out there. This can be done by, .. not neglecting German players, consolodating a few servers so they're not as lonely! Allowing battlegrounds to be a more worldwide immersion experience.

centkin

05-05-2010, 08:02 PM

I do agree that there is an issue with smugglers... What I would like to see with it is:1) Points to win reduced to 1000.2) Allow it to run with 12 or even 6 people on a side if 48 people arent queued for it. Maybe have it set up so it runs at 12 or 6 during NON prime time and 24 during prime time. Smugglers might be interesting with 6 trying to hold the spots.3) Give an extra token for smugglers. 4/2 instead of 3/1. It doesnt even need to be smugglers -- have it be whichever one ran the fewest times the day before gets the bonus the following day.4) And this occurs to ALL of the BGs -- raise the OUT time for dying from the 0-30 seconds to 15-60 seconds. Especially if you have the timing down and know you are coming back in 5 seconds it is often easier to DIE than it is to run to an important area. Having such a short timer also makes really silly strategies work -- like -- NOT killing the healers. If you keep them with 0 mana it is far worse for the other side than taking them out in the long run.

Masuma

05-06-2010, 01:37 PM

<cite>centkin wrote:</cite><blockquote>I do agree that there is an issue with smugglers... What I would like to see with it is:1) Points to win reduced to 1000.2) Allow it to run with 12 or even 6 people on a side if 48 people arent queued for it. Maybe have it set up so it runs at 12 or 6 during NON prime time and 24 during prime time. Smugglers might be interesting with 6 trying to hold the spots.3) Give an extra token for smugglers. 4/2 instead of 3/1. It doesnt even need to be smugglers -- have it be whichever one ran the fewest times the day before gets the bonus the following day.4) And this occurs to ALL of the BGs -- raise the OUT time for dying from the 0-30 seconds to 15-60 seconds. Especially if you have the timing down and know you are coming back in 5 seconds it is often easier to DIE than it is to run to an important area. Having such a short timer also makes really silly strategies work -- like -- NOT killing the healers. If you keep them with 0 mana it is far worse for the other side than taking them out in the long run.</blockquote>Centkin, i like your ideas 1-3.I very much dislike idea 4! I find 30 seconds is very long, a lot of matches run without or hardly any healers (on european BG). I find 30 seconds already long. making it longer is more unfair to all squishy classes, who - after my experience - aren't well looked after anyway, even when they stick to a tank and healer (ofc there are exceptions).After waiting so long to even get a match going, i dont want to spend x minutes of it dead.NO to longer out time after dying!!!

Crismorn

05-06-2010, 02:51 PM

Please leave smugglers as it is currently on live, also leave the rum as a requirement for 2/3rds of the gear pieces and do not allow any token swapping.

Lizbein

05-07-2010, 06:41 PM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>By largely do you mean 2-3 people in one thread? Cause if so then Ill agree with you.But if you mean the entire eq2 community then.... Well I'll let you figure that one out on your own</blockquote>Well given that argument, you seem to be the only person against any modification to Smuglers or battle grounds in general. So our 3 people vs your 1 person wins.<img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" />Realistically, in all situations there are MANY who do not respond nor take the time to post issues. Any complaints and concerns should be seen as representative of a LARGER body of people and not just 2-3. If you truly believe that only 2-3 people have issue, your not only wrong due to there being more than 2-3 people in this thread alone stating issues, but also foolish for believing only those who speak up have issues.Does a battered woman or child have no issue with getting beaten because she doesn't speak up? that would be silly. So obviously many can have issues with things without verbalizing them publicly. I've seen around 10-15 people in here state issues with the current setup and I'd speculate that is representative of 100's to 1000's of people across all server, if not more. We just happen to have the time to check forums! <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />So, this is an issue and PLEASE fix it in some way shape or form. You have been given numerous suggestions within this thread. Make me believe that the Devs listen, are rational, and have the players interests in mind again!

Crismorn

05-07-2010, 07:26 PM

There is nothing to fix.There are 3 maps right now with 3 unique objectives to win.If you want the gear REWARDS then you must complete all of the content.I'm not even worried about this happening since they only created 3 maps/objectives I can hardly see the eq2 team being foolish enough to destroy a 1/3rd of their content because people want gear faster

Lizbein

05-07-2010, 07:34 PM

As I've said numerous times, I don't mind Den and actually enjoy it. I just don't want long wait times to get into it. So the question is HOW do you fix these long wait times? They are there most likely due to lack of population, i.e. the Euro servers. How are they gonna fix that population issue? Well if they knew how, they would, because they ALWAYS want more players cause that = more money. So I don't see that population issue being fixed at all. With opening up the lower tier battle grounds, the population issue will be larger.Since we cannot magically make people come from other MMO's, we have to do something to mitigate these wait times for smugglers, .. either force smugglers first with groups of 6 in there, .. or do token consolidation. I'd prefer the smugglers force because I think a 12v 12 smugglers could be a lot of fun, but regardless there needs to be some form of a fix to this. Currently my fix is to sit in que while i do mind numbingly boring quests, .. and i personally LOATHE questing but at least doing that it's a somewhat efficient use of my time in game.Once again, this is not due to me NOT WANTING to do smugglers, it is due to not wanting to wait 30mins + to get into a 80-89 match. So your repeated use of this "content" argument is null and void with regard to this topic.

Crismorn

05-07-2010, 07:47 PM

Get to lvl 90.Longest I've waited in the 300-400+ smugglers I've run is 10ish mins.The average wait time is somewhere between 10-20 seconds.I've also played at pretty much every time of the day, from 9am somedays, 6pm sometimes and then 3am other days.

Jabberwock

05-07-2010, 11:19 PM

Currently on test there are pvp writs that allow you to earn discord tokens, which may be used to purchase gear. Not sure if/when this will go live.

Stuckx

05-07-2010, 11:29 PM

<cite>Jabberwock wrote:</cite><blockquote>Currently on test there are pvp writs that allow you to earn discord tokens, which may be used to purchase gear. Not sure if/when this will go live.</blockquote>That's for PVP servers only..not PVE.

Sydares

05-08-2010, 12:29 AM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote> There is nothing to fix.There are 3 maps right now with 3 unique objectives to win.If you want the gear REWARDS then you must complete all of the content.I'm not even worried about this happening since they only created 3 maps/objectives I can hardly see the eq2 team being foolish enough to destroy a 1/3rd of their content because people want gear faster</blockquote>Your opinion is pretty much worthless.

Crismorn

05-08-2010, 12:40 AM

<cite>Sydares wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote> There is nothing to fix.There are 3 maps right now with 3 unique objectives to win.If you want the gear REWARDS then you must complete all of the content.I'm not even worried about this happening since they only created 3 maps/objectives I can hardly see the eq2 team being foolish enough to destroy a 1/3rd of their content because people want gear faster</blockquote>Your opinion is pretty much worthless.</blockquote>I'm sorry that it takes you longer to get the rewards then you had hoped, maybe this game has not been simplified enough for you.

Sydares

05-08-2010, 12:52 AM

Chiyoiche

05-09-2010, 03:01 AM

Crismorn

05-09-2010, 03:23 AM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm sorry that it takes you longer to get the rewards then you had hoped, maybe this game has not been simplified enough for you.</blockquote>

Notsovilepriest

05-09-2010, 06:06 PM

<cite>Sydares wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm sorry that it takes you longer to get the rewards then you had hoped, maybe this game has not been simplified enough for you.</blockquote>You're probably the worst troll on the forums - please try harder in the future.Edit: Buttercup.</blockquote>Don't be mad he has a point and you can offer no valid counter points. Last expansion, If a sorc wanted Najena's ring, they had to, guess what! Run Najena a bunch of times, they didn't want to do it, but they wanted the reward. Same goes for BG's, if you want that reward, do what it takes to get it and don't complain. Does it stink, yes it does, but it's part of the whole rewarding for your effort thing.

StaticLex

05-09-2010, 06:22 PM

<cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Sydares wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm sorry that it takes you longer to get the rewards then you had hoped, maybe this game has not been simplified enough for you.</blockquote>You're probably the worst troll on the forums - please try harder in the future.Edit: Buttercup.</blockquote>Don't be mad he has a point and you can offer no valid counter points. Last expansion, If a sorc wanted Najena's ring, they had to, guess what! Run Najena a bunch of times, they didn't want to do it, but they wanted the reward. Same goes for BG's, if you want that reward, do what it takes to get it and don't complain. Does it stink, yes it does, but it's part of the whole rewarding for your effort thing.</blockquote>Hey look, another mindless response.Anyone who has been in favor of a token exchange or consolidation isn't looking to get something for nothing. You people who oppose it continually ignore the fact that it would be MORE time consuming and MORE "work" to exchange 8 or 10 gears for 1 bottle (for example). The only reason you're argueing to keep it as is is apparently because you enjoy the map. Not a single one of you has backed up your arguement with anything more than circular logic since the discussion started.

Notsovilepriest

05-09-2010, 06:27 PM

<cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Sydares wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm sorry that it takes you longer to get the rewards then you had hoped, maybe this game has not been simplified enough for you.</blockquote>You're probably the worst troll on the forums - please try harder in the future.Edit: Buttercup.</blockquote>Don't be mad he has a point and you can offer no valid counter points. Last expansion, If a sorc wanted Najena's ring, they had to, guess what! Run Najena a bunch of times, they didn't want to do it, but they wanted the reward. Same goes for BG's, if you want that reward, do what it takes to get it and don't complain. Does it stink, yes it does, but it's part of the whole rewarding for your effort thing.</blockquote>Hey look, another mindless response.Anyone who has been in favor of a token exchange or consolidation isn't looking to get something for nothing. You people who oppose it continually ignore the fact that it would be MORE time consuming and MORE "work" to exchange 8 or 10 gears for 1 bottle (for example). The only reason you're argueing to keep it as is is apparently because you enjoy the map. Not a single one of you has backed up your arguement with anything more than circular logic since the discussion started.</blockquote>What have you offered as an valid point? I fail to see any. Everyone would just run Ganak which can be over as fast as 3 minutes, switch that into bottles and get gear even faster than they do now. If you don't like doing a map, don't expect the rewards others get for doing that map. You don't wish you way into raid gear if you collect enough Mark of Manaars can you?

StaticLex

05-09-2010, 06:34 PM

<cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Sydares wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm sorry that it takes you longer to get the rewards then you had hoped, maybe this game has not been simplified enough for you.</blockquote>You're probably the worst troll on the forums - please try harder in the future.Edit: Buttercup.</blockquote>Don't be mad he has a point and you can offer no valid counter points. Last expansion, If a sorc wanted Najena's ring, they had to, guess what! Run Najena a bunch of times, they didn't want to do it, but they wanted the reward. Same goes for BG's, if you want that reward, do what it takes to get it and don't complain. Does it stink, yes it does, but it's part of the whole rewarding for your effort thing.</blockquote>Hey look, another mindless response.Anyone who has been in favor of a token exchange or consolidation isn't looking to get something for nothing. You people who oppose it continually ignore the fact that it would be MORE time consuming and MORE "work" to exchange 8 or 10 gears for 1 bottle (for example). The only reason you're argueing to keep it as is is apparently because you enjoy the map. Not a single one of you has backed up your arguement with anything more than circular logic since the discussion started.</blockquote>What have you offered as an valid point? I fail to see any.</blockquote>Obviously.So here, let me help you:You people who oppose it continually ignore the fact that it would be MORE time consuming and MORE "work" to exchange 8 or 10 gears for 1 bottle (for example). You people who oppose it continually ignore the fact that it would be MORE time consuming and MORE "work" to exchange 8 or 10 gears for 1 bottle (for example). You people who oppose it continually ignore the fact that it would be MORE time consuming and MORE "work" to exchange 8 or 10 gears for 1 bottle (for example). You people who oppose it continually ignore the fact that it would be MORE time consuming and MORE "work" to exchange 8 or 10 gears for 1 bottle (for example). You people who oppose it continually ignore the fact that it would be MORE time consuming and MORE "work" to exchange 8 or 10 gears for 1 bottle (for example). You people who oppose it continually ignore the fact that it would be MORE time consuming and MORE "work" to exchange 8 or 10 gears for 1 bottle (for example). You people who oppose it continually ignore the fact that it would be MORE time consuming and MORE "work" to exchange 8 or 10 gears for 1 bottle (for example). You people who oppose it continually ignore the fact that it would be MORE time consuming and MORE "work" to exchange 8 or 10 gears for 1 bottle (for example).

Crismorn

05-09-2010, 06:41 PM

Hey I have a great idea, lets make 1/3 - 2/3's of our content obsolete because people want gear faster...Oh wait, thats your idea.

Notsovilepriest

05-09-2010, 06:42 PM

<cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite><blockquote> You don't wish you way into raid gear if you collect enough Mark of Manaars can you?</blockquote>Look I can quote myself too, Anwser this. If you don't put time into raiding, your not going to get most of the good raid gear. If you don't put the time into doing whats needed to attain the BG gear then your not going to get all the good pieces, it's simple.

StaticLex

05-09-2010, 07:04 PM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>Hey I have a great idea, lets make 1/3 - 2/3's of our content obsolete because people want gear faster...</blockquote>The only content that is going to become obsolete is Den. Do you know how I know this? Give everyone in the game full BG gear and see how many Den maps get run. Yeah that's right, close to zero. The map is failboat, plain and simple.If you don't put time into raiding, your not going to get most of the good raid gear.Wow, welcome to 3 weeks ago. I'm not going to take the time to show you how this is a stupid arguement as well, you can go back and re-read old posts.

Crismorn

05-09-2010, 07:17 PM

<cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>Hey I have a great idea, lets make 1/3 - 2/3's of our content obsolete because people want gear faster...</blockquote>The only content that is going to become obsolete is Den. Do you know how I know this? Give everyone in the game full BG gear and see how many Den maps get run. Yeah that's right, close to zero. The map is failboat, plain and simple.If you don't put time into raiding, your not going to get most of the good raid gear.Wow, welcome to 3 weeks ago. I'm not going to take the time to show you how this is a stupid arguement as well, you can go back and re-read old posts.</blockquote>Once people realize which bg is faster then the slower one will see less people.Once again.I'm sorry that it takes you longer to get the rewards then you had hoped, maybe this game has not been simplified enough for you.

StaticLex

05-09-2010, 07:23 PM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StaticLex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>Hey I have a great idea, lets make 1/3 - 2/3's of our content obsolete because people want gear faster...</blockquote>The only content that is going to become obsolete is Den. Do you know how I know this? Give everyone in the game full BG gear and see how many Den maps get run. Yeah that's right, close to zero. The map is failboat, plain and simple.If you don't put time into raiding, your not going to get most of the good raid gear.Wow, welcome to 3 weeks ago. I'm not going to take the time to show you how this is a stupid arguement as well, you can go back and re-read old posts.</blockquote>I'm sorry that it takes you longer to get the rewards then you had hoped, maybe this game has not been simplified enough for you. </blockquote>Length of time has nothing to do with it. But keep on ignoring the fact that it would take more time to earn 8 or 10 gears to trade for 1 bottle. It's the only thing that allows you to keep making this same stupid post.

Notsovilepriest

05-09-2010, 07:28 PM

Now I remember trying to logic with you before Static, I remember you being a brick wall of ignorance where logic is not allowed past. I'm done trying to reason with you, I'd suggest you do the same Davionx

Disarm

05-10-2010, 12:39 PM

It would be nice if the the smuggler's den was more available for the lvl 80's. In the US its very common to not see a smugglers den all night when your queueing up for first available. The long wait times for the zone really kind of kill it more than anything else.

Gisallo

05-10-2010, 06:36 PM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Sydares wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>If its not fun for you to run smugglers then dont do it.</blockquote>I'm glad you like Smuggler's Den. It seems to be all you post about, so you're obviously enthusiastic about it. However, not everyone does. And being forced to run something you dislike in order to get gear to run the other two battlegrounds you do enjoy is irritating, bottom line. There should be some way for people who really, truly hate any given scenario not to have to do it. A repeatable choose-1-token kill quest or something. Anything.</blockquote>Contrary to popular belief no one is entitled to any of the bg rewards, they are simply rewards for playing the content.</blockquote>Agreed. BUT if you have a system where its nigh impossible to get a token, not due top difficulty but due to the fact the circumstance rarely arises, it needs to be examined. Comparing it to the RNG in PvE is not quite right. There at least you do something. I ran zones in excess of 80 times to get specific items to drop. I get that, and accept that as part of this game. I have sat and spawn camped mobs killing place holders again and again waiting for the named to pop in KOS back in the day for a Claymore update. The thing is though I RAN them. Got some coin, some exp and AA for my troubles. There was something for my time. In this case you stand in a qeue for what seems like forever waiting for the Smugglers den or you qeue first available and do everything BUT smugglers den. In the end you rarely even get the CHANCE to get 3 Smugglers tokens. Thats the problem. The opportunity isn't even there.

sdaigneault

05-11-2010, 01:27 AM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm sorry that it takes you longer to get the rewards then you had hoped, maybe this game has not been simplified enough for you.</blockquote>I'm sorry that you can't see that games are not always designed well, especially when new features are introduced. I'm fine w/ some kind of trade, but I'm also fine if they would address the issues that make the den suck. Shorten the fight. Change the terrain. Offer people who queue in the x2 if they'd like to try a x4 instead. Crismorn would keep on repeating this same reply until the last player just threw in their towel and quit b/c den sucks so bad...And yeh, no one will be doing den once they get the bottles they need... that tells you a lot right there. I believe SOE wants BG to be fun. Getting gear is fun, but I know a lot of us keep on playing even tho we dont need the ganak or klak tokens, because those maps are fun. No one plays this game because they hate playing it. And when it gets like that, people stop playing. People stop playing, you lose subs. Duh. This aint rocket science...But hey... "I'm sorry that it takes you longer to get this concept than we had all hoped. Maybe this response hasn't been simplified enough for you."

Crismorn

05-11-2010, 01:58 AM

Smugglers is long because you want gear faster, I'm sorry

Sydares

05-11-2010, 02:30 AM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm sorry</blockquote>It's okay.

LivelyHound

05-11-2010, 07:36 AM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>Smugglers is long because you want gear faster, I'm sorry</blockquote>Not true.I like smugglers, i need rum tokens, I cant get them.Why?Cos the map never ever queues when I 'm playing.I get 1 den to 100 of the other two. It's sad and it sucks.Now quit parroting the same tired old line about do the content.Why?Cos its inaccurate, the content is not available to do. It's been said many times by many people.If you can't grasp that very simple point then you are as much a fool as your posts seem to imply.

prusso1970

05-11-2010, 08:24 AM

I think if we were able to pick multiple zones we need instead of only First Available it would help.Smuggler's wants 40+ players to sign up for it before it activates. But if 8 people for Gears sign up they'd play that rather than sitting around waiting. Some folks just have blood lust and want to get into any of it asap. I queue for all then have to decline Gears every time it comes up since I too need rums more than the others.We should be able to have check boxes for zones we need in addition to First Available.

Crismorn

05-11-2010, 02:27 PM

<cite>LivelyHound wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>Smugglers is long because you want gear faster, I'm sorry</blockquote>Not true.I like smugglers, i need rum tokens, I cant get them.Why?Cos the map never ever queues when I 'm playing.I get 1 den to 100 of the other two. It's sad and it sucks.Now quit parroting the same tired old line about do the content.Why?Cos its inaccurate, the content is not available to do. It's been said many times by many people.If you can't grasp that very simple point then you are as much a fool as your posts seem to imply.</blockquote>I've done over 400 smugglers by now, longest wait was about 10 minutes and the average is somewhere between 10-20 seconds.

LivelyHound

05-11-2010, 03:13 PM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>I've done over 400 smugglers by now, longest wait was about 10 minutes and the average is somewhere between 10-20 seconds.</blockquote>Lucky you, my average wait is around 1 hour. So what was your point again? Oh right that you play in the US and have lots of people around who play at the same time... some of us arnt so lucky, open your eyes, and acknowledge the problem.

StaticLex

05-11-2010, 03:38 PM

<cite>prusso1970 wrote:</cite><blockquote>I think if we were able to pick multiple zones we need instead of only First Available it would help. .... We should be able to have check boxes for zones we need in addition to First Available.</blockquote>This.

Megavolt

05-11-2010, 04:25 PM

or just go ahead and let smugglers que with just 6 people, making it available more for "first available". True 3 vs. 3 would be entirely boring, but that leaves it to where there are more people than bases and would be a doable map.

Lizbein

05-12-2010, 07:36 AM

Can we get a ban on Crimson being allowed to respond in this thread? If I have to read one more forum post that says, .. "Man I can't stand waiting in Que for 30mins + " and then a response from him sayingIF YOU DONT WANT THE GEAR< >> DONT DO THE CONTENT, ... I wait 10 seconds for matches, sucks to be you.I will go crazy. He claims to be based within this magical realm of logic, however, the fact is that it's only logical to him. The rest of us are sitting here in que for den (30+ mins thus far as i catch up on forums). Jesus, let's not forget his other infamous response.Level to 90.You realize that part of the reason that they are introducing battle grounds to other tiers is FOR the purpose of level locking a toon? There's literally no current population base at those levels for more than a week ... therefore it's obviously for level locking. So if that's the case, .. we're CHOOSING not to go to 90 and that is not only our RIGHT but the design SOE has for the multiple tiered battlegrounds.Lastly, as I've said PREVIOUSLY. If this lack of population is causing this much of an issue as it is on US servers (not even gonna touch the $h!t storm that is the EU wait times), can you imagine what it will be like with 5 more tiers of battlegrounds available? There wont be dens or ganaks available for lvls 30-60+ considering the population will be even lower ... but as always..IF our level 30 toon wants that fancy gear.. HE BETTER DO THE CONTENT .. And by content i mean .. get 48 people on your server to make level 30 toons so you can ensure there will be enough people queuing up to make an actual DEN happen.Or you know what we could do,.. *ponders .... puts on his thinking face .... * Since we can't make 1000's of new subscriptions magically appear by waving our magical wand of magic waving, .... in order of course to fill the countless spots in order to provide den matches at REASONABLE wait times. Why not come up with a way in which the players can get the gear,.. based on equitable time, ..... with some form of exchange .... That way they actually have to put in work to get the rewards. Which was the original idea of our token system. Hrm... Perhaps that is the easiest, fairest, fastest, and most workable solution. Just maybe, ...Until an actual idea for a resolution to this problem pops out of the mouths of all the naysayers like Crimson .. (which i believe is like, one guy world wide), I will continue to believe you all to be short sighted, ignorant, and self absorbed due to somehow dismissing everyone else's issues because you yourself have not experienced it.And if you couldn't detect the sarcasm, this post was dripping with it.

Gisallo

05-12-2010, 01:42 PM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>Smugglers is long because you want gear faster, I'm sorry</blockquote>First sir, your attempts at sarcasm over look the facts yet again. Most people are NOT asking for and easier time. Most are saying create a system where the same amount of time is needed because Den simply doesn't cue. I have 2 accounts, I have done 3 full ganaks on one toon and I am still waiting for smugglers den on the other. That is the problem.Second, with so many people having a completely different experience from u it does beg the question, are you being honest or simply exaggerating to prove your point, which simply appears to be that you are just so darned uber.

Crismorn

05-12-2010, 03:29 PM

Leet strat for joining a smugglers den in less then 10 minutesQue up for Smugglers Den only > Join > The endRinse/repeat

Gisallo

05-12-2010, 09:33 PM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>Leet strat for joining a smugglers den in less then 10 minutesQue up for Smugglers Den only > Join > The endRinse/repeat</blockquote>Obviously you have issues with critical thinking sir. If I did 3 Ganak's in a row, logic dictates that I just qeued for ganak because Klak is short and qeues up all the time. For the same reason IF I did 3 ganaks in a row on one toon and was qeued and did not get a smuggler's den, then logic dictates I was qeued for smugglers den. If I wasn't qeued just for Smuggler's den on the other account I wouldn't be [Removed for Content]. Thats the issue. One seperate account qeued for Ganak. 3 runs. 1 other unique account qeued for smugglers, NO runs offered. But then again, logic does not seem to be your strong point. All you seem to be interested in is attempting to get people upset with your juvenile attempts at sarcasm.

Chiyoiche

05-13-2010, 04:18 AM

<cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>Leet strat for joining a smugglers den in less then 10 minutesQue up for Smugglers Den only > Join > The endRinse/repeat</blockquote>i suggest everyone stop feeding the trolls. it doesnt help anything. hes so one sided and will never see anything but his own point of view. refusing to even see any other logical reason why others are having issues. he CLEARLY does not speak for everyone in the game, or on the forums. the reason we have yet to see a single mod or dev responde to this issue in this thread, because we have let ourselves be goated by a troll throwing pebbles in the wagon wheels.i vote for ignoring Crismorn, and his blind ignorance.

Crismorn

05-13-2010, 06:06 AM

<cite>Chiyoiche@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite><blockquote>Leet strat for joining a smugglers den in less then 10 minutesQue up for Smugglers Den only > Join > The endRinse/repeat</blockquote>i suggest everyone stop feeding the trolls. it doesnt help anything. hes so one sided and will never see anything but his own point of view. refusing to even see any other logical reason why others are having issues. he CLEARLY does not speak for everyone in the game, or on the forums. the reason we have yet to see a single mod or dev responde to this issue in this thread, because we have let ourselves be goated by a troll throwing pebbles in the wagon wheels.i vote for ignoring Crismorn, and his blind ignorance.</blockquote>Thats exactly why there has been no dev response, they saw me tell you guys how the longest I've waited was 10 minutes and they realized there is no problem.I bet you are also really good at clue