Sweet PvP/BG Changes!

[Notsovilepriest]

<p>BF only 10 Triggers in PvP = Win</p><p>DG only 10 Triggers per person = Win</p>

[Darkonx]

<p>Did this really happen?</p>

[Notsovilepriest]

<p><cite>Darkonx wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Did this really happen?</p></blockquote><p>Yeppers! Its on the test update notes. As well as shadow step damage being lowered.</p>

[BadBoyfriend]

<p>No...idea...what you're talking about.</p><p>OA = Fail!</p><p>(OA: Obscure Acronyms)</p>

[Notsovilepriest]

<p><cite>BadBoyfriend wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>No...idea...what you're talking about.</p><p>OA = Fail!</p><p>(OA: Obscure Acronyms)</p></blockquote><p>Divine Guidance(Clerics) and Battle Frenzy(Zerker)</p><p>Meh most people I know talk about them as acromyms, sorry</p>

[Valind]

<p>Citation?</p>

[Notsovilepriest]

<p><cite>Valindor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Citation?</p></blockquote><p>Test Update Notes from Launcher:</p><p>PvP WARFIELDS</p> <p> Antonica and Commonlands have once again become hotbeds of conflict!    Will your lands be overrun or will your forces prevail against the siege?</p> <p>·  Warfields are Good vs. Evil faction based. </p> <p>·  Rewards will be Discord Tokens with a higher quantity to the winning team. </p> <p>·  The event will stagger between Antonica and 2 hours later in Commonlands and last for 30 minutes.</p> <p>·  The Antonica and Commonlands zones have been CHANGED to 10 level ranges from 4 to allow a wider range of skirmishes.</p> <p>Event (Offense)</p> <p>·  Four towers located near the three griffin towers and one near the city gate will spawn 10 minutes before the skirmish.</p> <p>·  At the start of the event, the towers will have 5 guardian statues that will need to be destroyed by the invaders.</p> <p>·  The Tower Guardians are protected by powerful magic but are vulnerable to players of certain levels. </p> <p>o        The Purple Tower Guardian will damage anyone level 31 or higher.</p> <p>o        The Blue Tower Guardian will damage anyone level 51 or higher.</p> <p>o        The Green Tower Guardian will damage anyone level 71 or higher.</p> <p>o        The Red Tower Guardian is attackable by all level ranges. </p> <p>o        The White Tower Guardian will be immune until all other guardians at that tower are defeated.  </p> <p>o        Destroying the White Tower Guardian destroys that tower.</p> <p>·  If all four Towers are destroyed, the invaders are victorious!</p> <p>Event (Defense)</p> <p>·  The battles favors the defending team Evil (Commonlands) or Good (Antonica).</p> <p>·  The defenders have 10 minutes to prepare for the siege and must then defend all four towers for 30 minutes.</p> <p>Torrent and Pestilential Rain now only have one chance to trigger per round of AE Auto-Attacks.</p> <p>PvP: Torrent and Pestilential Rain no longer have an unlimited range.</p> <p>PvP: Stonewill can only trigger once every 20 seconds when in PVP Combat.</p><p>Cleric</p> <p>·  Reactive Heal and Damage spells no longer fail to trigger if the spell has already been cast and the cleric is feared, stifled or stunned.</p><p>Assassin</p> <p>·  Shadow Step has had its damage reduced in PVP Combat.</p> <p>Berserker</p> <p>·  Battle Frenzy now has 10 triggers when used in PVP Combat.</p> <p>Cleric</p> <p>·  Divine Guidance now only has 10 triggers per person in PVP Combat.</p>

[Valind]

<p>Some nice changes and some I really dont like. But that's pretty much always the case.</p><p>I don't like the changes to DG or BF, and the stonewill change is bad as well. Those effects just needed to be made easily dispellable. The Stonewill change had better be once per item and not once total.</p><p>EDIT: why was the zone-wide effect not removed from Concussive shock as well? it shouldn't be allowed on any effect, especially not procs.</p>

[Notsovilepriest]

<p><cite>Valindor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Some nice changes and some I really dont like. But that's pretty much always the case.</p><p>I don't like the changes to DG or BF, and the stonewill change is bad as well. Those effects just needed to be made easily dispellable. The Stonewill change had better be once per item and not once total.</p></blockquote><p>There is no excuse for a 20 second unlimited reactive that triggers for 3kish per hit, Nor a 30 second buff that grants a Crit-able and modifiable % based heal. I don't care how easy they would be to dispell, they are totally unbalanced and a crutch for most players. DG and BF made crappy players look decent.</p>

[Valind]

<p><cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Valindor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Some nice changes and some I really dont like. But that's pretty much always the case.</p><p>I don't like the changes to DG or BF, and the stonewill change is bad as well. Those effects just needed to be made easily dispellable. The Stonewill change had better be once per item and not once total.</p></blockquote><p>There is no excuse for a 20 second unlimited reactive that triggers for 3kish per hit, Nor a 30 second buff that grants a Crit-able and modifiable % based heal. I don't care how easy they would be to dispell, they are totally unbalanced and a crutch for most players. DG and BF made crappy players look decent.</p></blockquote><p>You mean like raid gear makes crappy players look good? Or how being in a good group/raid/whatever made crappy players look good? Or how having a good healer/tank combo can make crappy players never die, thus increasing their damage output (because they aren't dead) making them look better?</p><p>I dont disagree with changing those abilities, like you said, they were OP. What i do disagree with is nerfing them that heavily. Why not simply make them a flat heal of 400 or whatever. Not modifiable, cant crit. It is just always a 400pt heal?</p>

[Notsovilepriest]

<p>I think they have at least a good start to balancing it, as long as DG keeps the health buff while the triggers are out that still leaves the heal potential to about 30k per person in group which is no joke, as well as for BF still being over a 30% heal, there maybe need for tweeking but a solid start</p>

[EndevorX]

<p><span style="color: #ff6600;">1.) Will the warfare event cycle every 2 hours starting at the end of the match, or from when it began?</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">As I see it, this might be too infrequent to promote this as healthful invigoration to world PvP.</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">Every hour, the ten minute waiting period should begin, alternating from Antonica and Commonlands.</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">Then, if defense wins at the end of 30 minutes, that still leaves TWENTY minutes for the opposing faction to reassemble as defense for their faction's Dlereian or Karanian overland zone (Commonlands or Antonica).</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">If offense is victorious, that still leaves up to 45 minutes for reorganizing as defense in the adjacent zone (possible if one faction is making a predominant stand over the other, unless these statues have great supplies of HP).</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff0000;">If there isn't a global menu that one can bring up to review timers for these events, then many people might just keep to their normal raid schedules and not bother as much as they would if these events occurred every hour on the hour.</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">2.) Will the stonewill restriction be once per 20 seconds per item, once per 20 seconds per stonewill grade (1, 2, or 3), -OR- once per 20 seconds REGARDLESS of grade?</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">If it's per grade, can this please be revised to be per item?</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff0000;">Players can have FIFTEEN plus items with damage procs, and the small number of ward procs available deserve to be on a fair ground.</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">If this limitation is once per 20 seconds per grade and NOT once per 20 seconds per item (and this WONT be changed to be per item), then please ensure that Torrent, Pestilential Rain, Followthrough, Fatal Lifetap, Wildfire, Toxic Tempest, and Blood Ritual also have this limitation throughout.</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff6600;">3.) Are the guardians at each tower only attackable by players of certain levels, or will they only damage players of certain levels with their magical protection?</span></p>

[Trawe]

<p> ^^^</p><p>afk will still work for you - don´t worry.</p>

[Eboncross]

<p>Agree good start. Those Zerkers were impossible to kill with melee</p><p>Now change Bloodletter in pvp to proc one time only for 50% health.</p>

[ailen]

<p><cite>Eboncross@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Agree good start. Those Zerkers were impossible to kill with melee</p><p>Now change Bloodletter in pvp to proc one time only for 50% health.</p></blockquote><p>lol right.  I wish.</p>

[Ceolus]

<p><cite>Kiara wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><cite><p>ITEMS</p><ul><li>Bane Warding can no longer trigger if it has triggered within the past second. It can no longer be modified and cannot critically hit. </li><li>Ancient Invigoration now regenerates every two seconds rather than every three seconds. </li><li><span style="color: #ff0000;">Divine Guidance now has a shorter duration rather than less triggers in PVP Combat. </span></li><li>Stonewill now has reduced amounts rather than a reuse time in PVP Combat.</li></ul></cite></blockquote><p>Changed on test server again.</p>

[Valind]

<p>They need to do the same with Battle Frenzy. Make it shorter duration perhaps. Or put it at a set amount per hit, say +400hp per trigger.</p><p>The sad thing is that the ability is both dispellable, doesn't trigger from magical hits and has a long recast. People don't see that, they just see a tank that they can't kill.</p>

[Tehom]

<p><cite>Valindor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>They need to do the same with Battle Frenzy. Make it shorter duration perhaps. Or put it at a set amount per hit, say +400hp per trigger.</p><p>The sad thing is that the ability is both dispellable, doesn't trigger from magical hits and has a long recast. People don't see that, they just see a tank that they can't kill.</p></blockquote><p>What is it dispellable by? I've never seen it dispelled. Is it physical, so only coercers with the AA dispel can?</p>

[Yimway]

<p><cite>Chath@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>What is it dispellable by? I've never seen it dispelled. Is it physical, so only coercers with the AA dispel can?</p></blockquote><p>I know it has been removed via Serene Symbol.</p><p>I imagine rogue taunts, and other common dispel abilities work as well.</p>

[Valind]

<p>I dont know what dispels it. All I know is that a few times, my healer has died so I put that up and i stay about the same level of health, maybe fall a bit, maybe gain a bit. Then about 5 seconds later i just pop. So something is dispelling it.</p><p>If anything, DG is the more powerful of the two because it is applied group wide and also gives other bonuses. Why is that DG had its duration nerfed, but BF was completely neutered?</p><p>Here are some suggestions to tone BF down without completely destroying it.</p><p>1. Reduce its duration. What's good for the goose (DG) is good for the gander (BF)2. Have it drain a small amount of power every time it is triggered. Say 1% power for 4% health.3. Remove its ability to crit. Cannot be modified etc. Its just a straight 4%. Not modifiable.4. Change it to be a direct heal instead of a %age. +500 health on every attack is alot less powerful than +4% health back on each hit5. Make it more easily dispellable.</p><p>Manashield combined with dispersion type items have been making sorcerers unkillable for 30 seconds for how long now? Why is it OK for a sorcerer to have an inpenetrable shield, but not for Zerkers? Why is it ok for Divine Aura, and Aura of the Crusader to both do this? Atleast Dragoon Reflexes only works on melee. DA works on all damage less than 50% of the target's health, and when the target is a Shadowknight with 25000 hitpoints, how many people can hit for 12500 on a single attack anymore? Anyone? Didn't think so.</p><p>Why is it OK for those abilities to be OP? Why are they not being fixed?</p>

[Notsovilepriest]

<p><cite>Valindor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I dont know what dispels it. All I know is that a few times, my healer has died so I put that up and i stay about the same level of health, maybe fall a bit, maybe gain a bit. Then about 5 seconds later i just pop. So something is dispelling it.</p><p>If anything, DG is the more powerful of the two because it is applied group wide and also gives other bonuses. Why is that DG had its duration nerfed, but BF was completely neutered?</p><p>Here are some suggestions to tone BF down without completely destroying it.</p><p>1. Reduce its duration. What's good for the goose (DG) is good for the gander (BF)2. Have it drain a small amount of power every time it is triggered. Say 1% power for 4% health.3. Remove its ability to crit. Cannot be modified etc. Its just a straight 4%. Not modifiable.4. Change it to be a direct heal instead of a %age. +500 health on every attack is alot less powerful than +4% health back on each hit5. Make it more easily dispellable.</p><p>Manashield combined with dispersion type items have been making sorcerers unkillable for 30 seconds for how long now? Why is it OK for a sorcerer to have an inpenetrable shield, but not for Zerkers? Why is it ok for Divine Aura, and Aura of the Crusader to both do this? Atleast Dragoon Reflexes only works on melee. DA works on all damage less than 50% of the target's health, and when the target is a Shadowknight with 25000 hitpoints, how many people can hit for 12500 on a single attack anymore? Anyone? Didn't think so.</p><p>Why is it OK for those abilities to be OP? Why are they not being fixed?</p></blockquote><p>I'm willing to bet because, I don't know, Healers are supposed to heal good amounts, while a tank should only get some self heals.</p>

[Valind]

<p><cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I'm willing to bet because, I don't know, Healers are supposed to heal good amounts, while a tank should only get some self heals.</p></blockquote><p>Sarcasm fail. Last time I checked, battle Frenzy *WAS* a self heal.</p><p>You still didn't propose a reason why this is the only ability being singled out here. Divine Aura is better than Battle Frenzy and hasn't been touched.</p>

[Avirodar]

<p><cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I think they have at least a good start to balancing it, as long as DG keeps the health buff while the triggers are out that still leaves the heal potential to about 30k per person in group which is no joke, as well as for BF still being over a 30% heal, there maybe need for tweeking but a solid start</p></blockquote><p>Regarding divine guidance, you are assuming everyone in the group will get 10 triggers per person? I am curious as to what leads you to this conclusion? From what I have read on the change, it looks/sounds more like DG was changed to be similar to our normal group reactive spell, which shares a collective trigger count among all group members, as opposed to being a triggers per person effect. If this is so, DG was nerfed to hell and back, and the 20% HP bonus will most likely vanish the instant the 10th trigger is used.I will have to patch the test client and see what it is actually doing. It has been months, so it will be a hefty download. If you have tested the change to see what it actually does, please let me know.</p>

[Notsovilepriest]

<p><cite>Avirodar@Befallen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I think they have at least a good start to balancing it, as long as DG keeps the health buff while the triggers are out that still leaves the heal potential to about 30k per person in group which is no joke, as well as for BF still being over a 30% heal, there maybe need for tweeking but a solid start</p></blockquote><p>Regarding divine guidance, you are assuming everyone in the group will get 10 triggers per person? I am curious as to what leads you to this conclusion? From what I have read on the change, it looks/sounds more like DG was changed to be similar to our normal group reactive spell, which shares a collective trigger count among all group members, as opposed to being a triggers per person effect. If this is so, DG was nerfed to hell and back, and the 20% HP bonus will most likely vanish the instant the 10th trigger is used.I will have to patch the test client and see what it is actually doing. It has been months, so it will be a hefty download. If you have tested the change to see what it actually does, please let me know.</p></blockquote><p>They changed it again, Now its reduced duration, but when this posts was made it was</p><p>-<span >Divine Guidance now only has 10 triggers <span style="text-decoration: underline;"><strong>per person</strong></span> in PVP Combat.</span></p>