Fury in Battle grounds needs help

[Nacor]

<p>Hi I play a fury with a full set of bg armor and about 4 or 5 BG items now.  Before the spell nerf went in to effect i use to do ok with like armored opponents and like anyone else if I had more BG armor then them they would go down kinda fast. Now that resists change has gone in I can no longer DPS in any effective way, My 2 high damage spells lighting bolt and start nova hit for 2k if im lucky and other 2 quicker cast spells hit for 200 damage max, ring of fire and ball lighting are not worth casting anymore because again they will only hit for around 200 points.  Even if I debuff my damage is not going up... In everyones haste to knee cap high dps casters the fury class has been destroyed as a dps class with this blanket adjustment.  Sure I can still heal but there are other classes that heal much better like the warden... I have been trying to do the BG's the last few days and all I see now are tank classes, casters are few and far between.  So as a fury is there any use for them in the BG other then just healing... we are supposed to be a dps/healing class.</p>

[Aleste]

<p>You can still out last almost anyone. Because your heals, so what your asking is to be able to heal quite well and nuke ppl into the dust? In group pvp healers heal.. you can toss some dots or damage every once in a while. But when you start "dpsing" your teamates usualy die... leaves ppl saying "wheres our healer?".</p>

[Aleste]

Healing/dps.. when ppl are looking for dps a fury isnt the 1st or 5 thing that comes to mind. Quite a few fury's put up healing numbers to match or surpass wardens while also doing damage.

[Nacor]

<p>No I cant out last almost anyone, you see with melees constant stuns/stifles getting kicked around Im getting damaged faster then I can heal.  yes if some one has less BG armor then me sure I can stay up  and they may not be able to kill me and then yes I depend on some one else to kill them.</p><p>I like how you shove words in my mouth, no Im not asking to heal quite well and nuke ppl into the dust... But if you look at the fury class they are a DPS/Healing class, Furys have never been able to out dps Pure caster classes or out heal the pure healing classes.  </p><p>You see when im in the 6v6 yes all I do is heal and Im thanked for it, if Im lucky enough to have a good group I might be able to get off a dps spell, but in the 12v12 or 24 v 24 a lot of the time my group runs to the 4 corners of the map and a lot of time Im left to fend for my self  so Im left with  a 2k lightning bolt and 2 250 damage spells.  Thats it man I can cast 2500 damage give or take a 100 points.  The fury is a DPS caster class / healer  Fury's by no means ever took some one down with one spell unless you had a fully BG gear player on some one with no gear.  I know the frustration of getting killed on 1 to 2 seconds I get it from both sides of the field, Pure casters can nuke far harder then I ever could, pure melee classes can far out dps me like always, and as for healing again wardens and others can far out heal me... </p>

[Nacor]

<p>Oh and there are bad players for all classes so when you say I have seen furys out heal wardens that does mean anything, for years I have been fighting to get my fury in raids and groups and they are always the last to be picked.  A fury can do very well if the group is a very good group but they struggle with lesser players where other healing classes can make up for the inexperienced.</p>

[Novusod]

<p>Fury can be extremely powerful if played right.</p><p><img src="http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a51/sunny_icefire/klak02_dps.jpg" width="724" height="406" /></p>

[Aleste]

<p>Not shoving words in anyones mouth.. you made it clear you want to be dsp/heals rather than heals/dps. You thinking the dps comes before the heals is the problem. Btw every class has to deal with stifles stuns ect... not every class can heal. Rethink your aa choices and how you play in a pvp atmosphere youll do fine.. yeah and wardens can also dish dmg they just melee where fury's toss spells.</p>

[Nacor]

<p>You see this is what im talking about, I have seen the thread you pulled this from but what you fail to point out is look at how much the other side healed for</p><p><a href="http://www.EQ2Flames.com/battlegrounds/61779-bg-screenshots-18.html" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.EQ2Flames.com/battlegrou...enshots-18.html</a></p><p>I had a fight like that, no one was killing very much you can see that from how the death blow count is low.  I did something like that once also, the fight was constant and nonstop and the deaths were few.  the DPS could hardly keep with with the healing, I can also get huge healing scores past wardens and others if Im main healing the guy holding on to the relic while I also pop off group heals for the rest of the group.  But your only point in arguing on this is to maintain your easy mode play you have right now.  </p><p>But please do tell Novusod how well does your fury do, what is his lighting bolt hitting for on average, as well as the other spells?</p><p>I dueled a few other furys out side of the BG's that have a similar armor make up and are DPS was is so low it was sicking, our main form of attack is next to nothing. Im sure you like others who want to maintain the easy mode play style you complained about casters having will still argue... its like politics with this BS, you don't care how much of an advantage you have other others so long as no one else has it over you.  Furys were never the threat warlocks and wizards where but what do you care so long as you can keep winning. </p><p>Oh and those wizards and warlocks have not gone away, there just now playing there shadow knights, brigands, swashbucklers, bruisers and such now.</p>

[Aleste]

<p>If your team runs off all over the place find the tank they can usualy keep you alive. Or meet them back at the spawn point.</p>

[Aleste]

<p>Now your becomming insulting... its not easy mode anything. Its more like pre bugged resist pvp. Reguardless of what you think players are a bit smarter and better geared than mobs so its not just who lets off a nuke first wins. Soe should of closed bg down as soon as the no resist bug was noticed. Leaving it in place so long enflated alot of lackluster players egos by giving them godmode. Now rather than play their class they complain. Bgs are not about stacks of bodys or there would be no objective. If your stalemating or getting rolled with matched teams your team wasnt doing something right.</p>

[Nacor]

<p>You just made my point, wardens melee where fury's use spells and the fact that I said dps/heals vs heals/dps dose not mean I prefer one over the other so again stop trying to shove words in my mouth.  Wardens can still put out the dps they always did while heal like they always did but guess what??? furys took a hit that was intended to deal with the warlocks and wizards, now all I can do is heal like I did.  Fury's are not warlocks/wizards! Brigands, scouts, shadow knights, assassins, all can kill me before I can get 1- 2 if im lucky heals off on my self.. Unless they have no battle grounds gear.  But like the other poster your only concern is to maintain your advantage over the other classes.  </p><p>Furys never one shot killed anyone, or killed anyone in the time the melees are doing it now.</p>

[Nacor]

<p>aleste your still not getting it, Im am only talking from a fury point of view!  The most I ever did was 4 - 5 k damage with my one best hitting spell. fury is 50 % damage 50% heal, we don't excel in any one field.  thats why in raids fury's are the last to be picked for healer or the last to be picked for a dps caster... we just fill in any slot they cant fill with another class.  Half of my class was just reduced to nothing, I cast on any melee class right now and I cant move his life bar hardly anymore.  </p><p>Please explain to me then what is the purpose of a fury then?  I don't have the healing options a warden does, thus they make better healers, I cant heal as well as plate or chain healers thats why Im not wanted in raids.  if my dps options as a fury are removed why play him anymore? if I want to be a healer.. I should just roll a warden so I can still keep the melee damage they can do and heal better then the fury or do a plate healer.</p>

[Aleste]

<p>Learn to cure your dots and carry pots follow the tank.. whole lot of ways around the cc. The fact that you use a /duel to prove a point shows a noobish nature... duels dont use pvp rule set last i knew. But this whole post and you saying it was better before the fix proves your greed. You want scouts and tanks to take unmitigated damage while you have mit vrs melee? Comeon. A little damagic boost is inc till then learn to counter whats killing you.. cause trust me it can be countered.</p>

[Darkonx]

<p><cite>Nacor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>You just made my point, wardens melee where fury's use spells and the fact that I said dps/heals vs heals/dps dose not mean I prefer one over the other so again stop trying to shove words in my mouth.  Wardens can still put out the dps they always did while heal like they always did but guess what??? furys took a hit that was intended to deal with the warlocks and wizards, now all I can do is heal like I did.  Fury's are not warlocks/wizards! Brigands, scouts, shadow knights, assassins, all can kill me before I can get 1- 2 if im lucky heals off on my self.. Unless they have no battle grounds gear.  But like the other poster your only concern is to maintain your advantage over the other classes.  </p><p>Furys never one shot killed anyone, or killed anyone in the time the melees are doing it now.</p></blockquote><p>Wardens were doing 100k damage pre-fix. You were doing 900k damage pre-fix. Wardens are doing 90k damage post-fix. You are doing 140k damage post-fix. These numbers are of course % based, not actual. Yes, you took a nerf. Yes, you needed one. I was getting hit with Bolt of Thunder for 8-9k. That's absolutely ridiculous coming from a healer, especially considering the fairly low recast/casting time. Furys are still amazing. I've ran into furys and wardens that I just CAN NOT KILL, and I'm one of the best geared SK's WW.</p>

[Aleste]

<p>Ask a fury from vox or naggy if they can 1v1 any of the classes you mentioned.. they will say yes. Sk being the problem child but hey sks do magic dmg to, so they got "nerfed" too. Swashies reach doest work in pvp which is a huge b@&%' slap. Brigs been on the end of the nerf bat since kos. Sins and rangers were left out of your post it seems. But they should be your biggest problem lol</p>

[Aleste]

<p>Im not trying to be rude but idk if bg is your only pvp exsposure and im trying to tell you its most likley a spec or playstyle issue. If you have a free slot make a toon on naggy or vox make a toon and /3 just ask to talk to a high level fury. We pvp daily so we have to adjust to any junk hand were dealt by fixes. They can give you tips.</p>

[Nacor]

<p>spoken like a true shadow knight, the top killers in the bigs now... I do understand where you guys are coming from, no one likes to lose and now that you melee classes have the run of the BG's you will argue what ever to hold on to it.  </p><p>And again I am only looking at it from a fury point of view, one of the least wanted classes due to its low HEALING/dps  (there I reversed it so no one will think I prefer one over the other)  and again, no fury ever single shot some one full health like the other casters did, or took down a whole group with one spell like the others did, it just never happen</p>

[Nacor]

<p>Well ya know aleste thats what I have been trying to do, get answers for my fury but all I have been met with is you casters needed it and I know that comes from the frustration of warlocks and wizards but the fury never had that kind of ability... and now all I hear from people is don't wast your time in BGs with fury there are better classes to play now, only trouble is I don't want to level up another class to play in BG's</p>

[Aleste]

I play a dirge ROFL wheres my advantage? Yes im a scout but hey.... i cast for damage.. wow i lost my ability to kite cause snares/fear is resisted more than anything. Yes a dirge (who was also nerfed) is telling you to adjust its not as bad as it seems. At least when a fury kills someone that person doesnt run off in shame.. ever died to a dirge?

[Nacor]

<p>Oh yea and the ever so lovely "learn to play your class noob" it gets old real fast when you hear that from the Shadow knights, assassins, rangers, brigands that are running the show in the BG's now.  </p>

[Aleste]

<p>I understand im only egging you on so you dont lose hope fury can still do well and will get rebalanced its teh sucx but thats the life of pvp. For now tho i do sugguest rolling a lowb just to ask in naggy or vox chat. You never get real anwsers here just speculations.</p>

[Nacor]

<p>I tell you this, I survived better when warlocks and wizards where at there worst.  But I'm getting killed now with out much of a chance at all, I don't just rely on my 3 main dps spells.  I pop off raid wide porcupine when I can, I cure dots as often as I can cast them but fury's don't have all that much utility, I can cast my brambles and try to stifle folks but my reuse timer on that is long.</p><p>I have spent lots of plat readjust my AA's to the point that I been dropping 10 plat for the last month now </p>

[Novusod]

<p>There are only 3 classes that can parse over a million dps and a million plus heals in the same fight. Fury is one of them.</p>

[Nacor]

<p>Thats very situational novusod, that link you pulled the screen shot from was the only one out of all those. there was another link with a ton more screen shots and fury's didnt pars that high in both, it was one or the other.  If im the only healer in the group thats all I have time to do then its the debuffs going out and any fast dps spells I can rattle off before I have to recycle the heal spells again., if there is a group with 3 of us in there I will go heavy DPS if the other 2 are a better healer then I and then yes my dps was high.  Only one time were both High, my self and one other healer, so I was able to do both healing and damage but I never got any kill shots just credit for kills by damaging people.   In the time I could cast my 3 main attacks before the nerf, I might have done 7k to 9K and again that depends on the persons armor make up... ugg it don't matter anymore. Im going to bed</p>

[Aleste]

<p><cite>Nacor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I tell you this,<strong> I survived better when warlocks and wizards where at there worst</strong>.  But I'm getting killed now with out much of a chance at all, I don't just rely on my 3 main dps spells.  I pop off raid wide porcupine when I can, I cure dots as often as I can cast them but fury's don't have all that much utility, I can cast my brambles and try to stifle folks but my reuse timer on that is long.</p><p>I have spent lots of plat readjust my AA's to the point that I been dropping 10 plat for the last month now </p></blockquote><p>But scout and tank dps didnt change so idk why your worse off now. Its prob cause you had a mage on your side that was decimating everything in sight.</p>

[Allforgrog]

<p>I think what has changed are the targeting priorities more than anything, with the relative increase in value of heals players are placing healers as their absolute top priority instead of OMGZ kill teh wizzy NAO!! Leaving the easy to CC druids first and easy pray without a taunt happy tank present to control the enemies attention.</p><p>Druids aren't weak healers at all IMO, they are just more vulnerable to hostile actions in comparison to other healing classes.</p>

[Shorcon]

<p><cite>Nacor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>No I cant out last almost anyone, you see with melees constant stuns/stifles getting kicked around Im getting damaged faster then I can heal.  yes if some one has less BG armor then me sure I can stay up  and they may not be able to kill me and then yes I depend on some one else to kill them.</p><p>I like how you shove words in my mouth, no Im not asking to heal quite well and nuke ppl into the dust... But if you look at the fury class they are a DPS/Healing class, Furys have never been able to out dps Pure caster classes or out heal the pure healing classes.  </p><p>You see when im in the 6v6 yes all I do is heal and Im thanked for it, if Im lucky enough to have a good group I might be able to get off a dps spell, but in the 12v12 or 24 v 24 a lot of the time my group runs to the 4 corners of the map and a lot of time Im left to fend for my self  so Im left with  a 2k lightning bolt and 2 250 damage spells.  Thats it man I can cast 2500 damage give or take a 100 points.  The fury is a DPS caster class / healer  Fury's by no means ever took some one down with one spell unless you had a fully BG gear player on some one with no gear.  I know the frustration of getting killed on 1 to 2 seconds I get it from both sides of the field, Pure casters can nuke far harder then I ever could, pure melee classes can far out dps me like always, and as for healing again wardens and others can far out heal me... </p></blockquote><p>Please stop saying you know the gear of the people killing you. You dont. FACT.</p>

[Shorcon]

<p><cite>Aleste wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Ask a fury from vox or naggy if they can 1v1 any of the classes you mentioned.. they will say yes. Sk being the problem child but hey sks do magic dmg to, so they got "nerfed" too. Swashies reach doest work in pvp which is a huge b@&%' slap. Brigs been on the end of the nerf bat since kos. Sins and rangers were left out of your post it seems. But they should be your biggest problem lol</p></blockquote><p>I love ranger's................................ when they are on my team.    : /</p>

[Nacor]

<p>Please stop leaving comments with out having read the posts!!!  where does it say I know the gear of people killing me??  </p>

[bks6721]

<p><cite>Novusod wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>There are only 3 classes that can parse over a million dps and a million plus heals in the same fight. Fury is one of them.</p></blockquote><p>sadly, so is a tank</p>

[Shorcon]

<p><cite>Jjay@Befallen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Novusod wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>There are only 3 classes that can parse over a million dps and a million plus heals in the same fight. Fury is one of them.</p></blockquote><p>sadly, so is a tank</p></blockquote><p>Lol. /agree. Were is my guardian heals?</p>

[Yimway]

<p>Fury's require no tweeking for BG's.</p><p>If your getting constantly interupted, ask your tank why he isn't taunting.</p>

[ailen]

<p>everyone wants to win 1v1.</p><p>sorry bub it doesn't work like that.</p><p>There are some insane furies running around.  you are a PRIEST first.  PRIESTS heal... get that?  You get some limited dps in exchange for some reduced heals but that is where the line is drawn. </p><p>You can and should outlast just about every other nonpriest class in the game, save a few that might get lucky on an interrupt.  if you do the one thing that most druids just don't do.. PREHEAL with your HOT.. you will likely survive more times than not. I love healers that say, my bar is green i don't have to heal yet.  its an amazing concept.</p><p>Of all the classes out there right now that might have a legitimate gripe I'd have to say druids are near last on the list.  Fury is amazing, even after this spell resist nerf.  So focus on staying alive, watching some idiot blow his cooldowns into your hots / emergencies and then work them over before they come back up. </p><p>THAT is how a druid wins.  By lasting longer...  take a little blue pill and win!</p>

[Nacor]

<p>Thats the trouble with when a post gets soooo long people like maliak read a small bilp and then open there blow hole and solve the whole thing.... just stop it man you make your self look stupid.  </p>

[ailen]

<p>I do make myself look stupid .. .quite often.</p><p>This isn't one of those times.</p><p>You need to figure out who the good PVP furies are on Nagafen and go ask them some question.  I assure you, a really good fury is close to impossible to kill for most classes.</p>

[Aleste]

<p><cite>Maliak@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I do make myself look stupid .. .quite often.</p><p>This isn't one of those times.</p><p>You need to figure out who the good PVP furies are on Nagafen and go ask them some question.  <strong>I assure you, a really good fury is close to impossible to kill for most classes.</strong></p></blockquote><p>Glad im not the only one who thinks so. Only way to take one down imo is well timmed/lucky inturupt and burst damage from hades. Other than they they laugh at you while healing and slowly wear you out.</p>

[ntommyb]

<p><cite>Nacor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>No I cant out last almost anyone, you see with melees constant stuns/stifles getting kicked around Im getting damaged faster then I can heal.  yes if some one has less BG armor then me sure I can stay up  and they may not be able to kill me and then yes I depend on some one else to kill them.</p><p>I like how you shove words in my mouth, no Im not asking to heal quite well and nuke ppl into the dust... But if you look at the fury class they are a DPS/Healing class, Furys have never been able to out dps Pure caster classes or out heal the pure healing classes.  </p><p>You see when im in the 6v6 yes all I do is heal and Im thanked for it, if Im lucky enough to have a good group I might be able to get off a dps spell, but in the 12v12 or 24 v 24 a lot of the time my group runs to the 4 corners of the map and a lot of time Im left to fend for my self  so Im left with  a 2k lightning bolt and 2 250 damage spells.  Thats it man I can cast 2500 damage give or take a 100 points.  The fury is a DPS caster class / healer  Fury's by no means ever took some one down with one spell unless you had a fully BG gear player on some one with no gear.  I know the frustration of getting killed on 1 to 2 seconds I get it from both sides of the field, Pure casters can nuke far harder then I ever could, pure melee classes can far out dps me like always, and as for healing again wardens and others can far out heal me... </p></blockquote><p>On my warden I never seem to have any problems getting kills when I'm one v one, sure if they run they're prolly going to get away but freaking nobody can kill me  I have much less dps than you and your healing is comparable if you do it right, it just works different.  Fury is harder to be good at but I don't think dps is your problem.  If you're struggling with stuns and stifles you need to work on your pvp strat, that stuff is easy to mitigate with potions and signet's </p>

[Mesander]

<p><cite>Maliak@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I do make myself look stupid .. .quite often.</p><p>This isn't one of those times.</p><p>You need to figure out who the good PVP furies are on Nagafen and go ask them some question.  I assure you, a really good fury is close to impossible to kill for most classes.</p></blockquote><p style="margin: 0in 0in 0pt;"><span style="font-family: Verdana; color: #000000;"><span style="font-size: x-small;">You are sooo right Maliak. You are definitely not stupid...you sound like a heads up player. My main is a fury and I have several pieces from BG as well as some raid gear. I am not one of your Top 10 Furies WW or whatever but I do consider myself a solid player of the fury class. Pre-healing is huge in BG. Especially in 6v6. And yes, if we are getting killed alot while staying near our tank...then DUH!!! Why aren't you taunting??? TANK NOT TAUNTING = GROUP FAIL. I never try to DPS in a BG fight...unless I am playing with total morons and know that losing is emminent. Then I just go right at the group and try to get a spell of or 2 just to end the fight quicker and get my one quick token. I can usually come out on the parse well in PVE when I am in groups whether I am solo healing or not. When I am solo healing I usually parse 3-4K. When I am used as a secondary healer/DPS…I can parse 8-10K. When I get my AA’s maxed and I have some more raid gear I am sure this will improve. Furies in group – No. 1 priority: You are a healer…SO HEAL!!! No. 2 – DPS when heals are easily attained. If you have a primary healer already in group…then have fun. But don’t forget to heal in emergency situations. </span></span></p><p style="margin: 0in 0in 0pt;"><span style="font-family: Verdana; color: #000000;"><span style="font-size: x-small;"> </span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: Verdana; color: #000000; font-size: 12pt; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-bidi-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA;"><span style="font-size: x-small;">TIP: When you are in 6v6 BG and you and your tank and group are on your side holding the relic…after pre-heals (HOTS and GROUP HOTS) cast Ring of Fire and Ball Lightning every time its up…that way when the group gets ambushed…you can hit them for a small about of DMG to aid your group while healing at the same time. Every little bit helps.</span></span></p>

[urgthock]

<p>I don't get what the OP is complaining about. Furies are awesome in the Battlegrounds. Perhaps you should look over your AA spec? Break down and dissect what each ability does and try to work out the best abilities that work synergistically with each other.</p>

[Crismorn]

<p>Furies can be amazing in BG's</p>

[Nacor]

<p>You know I figured it out now, My problem is not me, I just don't have access to the gear that all the super furys are getting.  I play on PVE server so I cant get the armor from the PVP servers.  early in this post some one put this up</p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"><img src="webkit-fake-url://3363F24F-FC4C-40D0-AF1A-81EFADB01584/klak02_dps.jpg" /></p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"> </p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;">see furys are deadly!!! well I contacted spahnlie and asked them questions and what it boils down to is this...</p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"> </p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"><span style="font-family: verdana, geneva, lucida, 'lucida grande', arial, helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 13px;">Dps is a little lower that it has been but I also swapped back from using all the bg armor and jewelery I had (about 5 pieces) to only using the neck and gloves. I find that I am very reluctant to use BG gear over my raid gear (I'd estimate that 90% of my raid gear is the best you can get at this point in the game).</span></p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"> </p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;">So you see battle grounds now I guess is for the elite players who have all the top end gear, I thought the BG armor was going to be the equalizer when it came to armor but thats not the case.  So all of you people who say furys are a deadly class... your not looking at the norm, you looking at the extreem.</p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"> </p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;">But once again all of you missed the point of my post, my complaint was the blanket adjustment made to all casters because of all the complaints of wiz ice comet and warlocks... </p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"> </p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;">What about this avatar armor I hear about that PVP server players have?  There untouchable for some reason so why not use them as the benchmark and make a blanket adjustment to the armor for all classes so those who have the avatar armor can not one shot people or kill them in less then 3 seconds??  or would it be better to cap armor to the BG armor so more people are on an even footing??</p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"> </p>

[Notsovilepriest]

<p><cite>Nacor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>You know I figured it out now, My problem is not me, I just don't have access to the gear that all the super furys are getting.  I play on PVE server so I cant get the armor from the PVP servers.  early in this post some one put this up</p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"><img src="webkit-fake-url://3363F24F-FC4C-40D0-AF1A-81EFADB01584/klak02_dps.jpg" /></p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"> </p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;">see furys are deadly!!! well I contacted spahnlie and asked them questions and what it boils down to is this...</p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"> </p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"><span style="font-size: 13px; font-family: verdana,geneva,lucida,'lucida grande',arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Dps is a little lower that it has been but I also swapped back from using all the bg armor and jewelery I had (about 5 pieces) to only using the neck and gloves. I find that I am very reluctant to use BG gear over my raid gear (I'd estimate that 90% of my raid gear is the best you can get at this point in the game).</span></p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"> </p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;">So you see battle grounds now I guess is for the elite players who have all the top end gear, I thought the BG armor was going to be the equalizer when it came to armor but thats not the case.  So all of you people who say furys are a deadly class... your not looking at the norm, you looking at the extreem.</p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"> </p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;">But once again all of you missed the point of my post, my complaint was the blanket adjustment made to all casters because of all the complaints of wiz ice comet and warlocks... </p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"> </p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;">What about this avatar armor I hear about that PVP server players have?  There untouchable for some reason so why not use them as the benchmark and make a blanket adjustment to the armor for all classes so those who have the avatar armor can not one shot people or kill them in less then 3 seconds??  or would it be better to cap armor to the BG armor so more people are on an even footing??</p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Helvetica;"> </p></blockquote><p>This whole thread boils down to a fury being mad their DPS...Not healing...is where they feel it should be...Is this correct?</p>

[Nacor]

<p>No its not</p>

[Notsovilepriest]

<p>Thats what that whole post that I quoted was about, DPS.</p>

[Nacor]

<p>Its so easy to get sidetracked when trying to respond to so many post that start to take things off topic.  I was upset when sony made a blanket adjustment to all casting classes when the real trouble lie with just two it seemed.  wizards and warlocks, my thunderbolt would hit for 5K tops, not a quick cast and not a quick recast as well.  I have two others that are a bit quicker that might hit for around 1k, now  I hit for 2.5k tops and around 2 - 3 hundred with the other two now.  </p><p>Im not trying to discuss the roll of a fury in groups but people always seem to want to take the topic in that direction.  I was trying to point out why blanket adjustments are wrong is all and how it can effect other classes.</p>

[Nacor]

<p><cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Thats what that whole post that I quoted was about, DPS.</p></blockquote><p>Oh no no part of that quote was to make a point about armor is all not meant to focus on dps.</p>

[Putyo]

<p>Furies are almost as good as wardens at healing this expac and can dps amazingly, learn to play is really all that needs to be said</p>

[Nacor]

<p>despite your views this class has two capabilities, there was no reason to hurt one of them.</p>

[Notsovilepriest]

<p>And as Putyo said, The class can still do both effectively, L2play!</p>

[Nacor]

<p><cite>Putyo@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Furies are almost as good as wardens at healing this expac and can dps amazingly, learn to play is really all that needs to be said</p></blockquote><p>Ummm yea cuz its hard to push buttons... please if you have nothing genuine to add just move along.</p>

[Notsovilepriest]

<p><cite>Nacor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Putyo@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Furies are almost as good as wardens at healing this expac and can dps amazingly, learn to play is really all that needs to be said</p></blockquote><p>Ummm yea cuz its hard to push buttons... please if you have nothing genuine to add just move along.</p></blockquote><p>You say this, but fail to realize a large majority of EQ2 players aren't good at their classes. I suspect you were trying to be sarcastic though. Instead of thinking you are great at your class already, look around, find out what the good people at the class do, find out how they would deal with different situations, rather than assume you already know all there is to know.</p>

[Nacor]

<p><cite>Notsovilepriest@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>And as Putyo said, The class can still do both effectively, L2play!</p></blockquote><p>There ya go, the end all cop-out statement  "learn to play"  I wish you would have answered the other points I made... guess you cant or don't want to. </p><p>Im done</p>

[Crismorn]

<p><cite>Nacor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Putyo@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Furies are almost as good as wardens at healing this expac and can dps amazingly, learn to play is really all that needs to be said</p></blockquote><p>Ummm yea cuz its hard to push buttons... please if you have nothing genuine to add just move along.</p></blockquote><p>It's not hard and this game is really, REALLY easy.</p><p>Yet, somehow more then 95% of eq2's community makes it look really, REALLY hard</p>

[Nacor]

<p><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Nacor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Putyo@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Furies are almost as good as wardens at healing this expac and can dps amazingly, learn to play is really all that needs to be said</p></blockquote><p>Ummm yea cuz its hard to push buttons... please if you have nothing genuine to add just move along.</p></blockquote><p>It's not hard and this game is really, REALLY easy.</p><p>Yet, somehow more then 95% of eq2's community makes it look really, REALLY hard</p></blockquote><p>Nope its not hard to play the game, the challenge is getting in to raids for that high end stuff.</p>

[Notsovilepriest]

<p>It's not all about raid gear</p>

[Crismorn]

<p>I wear 0 pieces of SF raid gear.</p>

[Nacor]

<p>sorry but now I have no faith in anything you post at this point, it is very much about gear and to say that... now your just being insulting.  </p>

[Nacor]

<p>I know log in your furys and suit up in some BG gear and show me your numbers then?</p>

[Crismorn]

<p><cite>Nacor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>sorry but now I have no faith in anything you post at this point, it is very much about gear and to say that... now your just being insulting.  </p></blockquote><p>No one requires any faith from you, we are trying to help you realize that Furies are fricken amazing right now especially in bg's.</p><p>Gear is important for every class in eq2, please just accept the fact that you have alot to learn on how to play a fury or continue blaming your inadequacies on the class you rolled</p>

[Crismorn]

<p><cite>Nacor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I know log in your furys and suit up in some BG gear and show me your numbers then?</p></blockquote><p>Talk to a good fury and listen to everything he tells you, there is no harm in listening</p>

[Shankapotomus]

<p>If I may speak...</p><p>I'm a fury with almost full BG gear and lvl 80 PvP pieces filling in the rest. And heres how it goes...</p><p>DpS- Moderate</p><p>Heals- Moderate</p><p>Utility- low</p><p>I took a big hit with the spell resist change. I used to be able to blow through BGs and top heal and DpS chart. Is this right? no. You can't expect to blow people away and heal like a champ. And no, we should in no way be able to match a wardens heals (not to mentions we blow through power like nothing compared to them). I believe a lot of our spells are useless, like our pets that put out no damage, while wardens have pets who can heal them alone.</p><p>But is it right I can get passed in the heal parse by Zerkers and Paladins? no. The problem lies less in the furies capability and more in the blown out proportions of other classes. My single target HoT ticks for less than some classes heal procs...</p><p>But you have to make your choice between DpS and Heals, and there is only one right answer. Heals! I get kills by keeping my heals up and when I see the right time, beat the heck out of someone from the other side. But you can't kill anything if you don't keep yourself alive and your group.</p>

[Nacor]

<p><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Nacor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>sorry but now I have no faith in anything you post at this point, it is very much about gear and to say that... now your just being insulting.  </p></blockquote><p>No one requires any faith from you, we are trying to help you realize that Furies are fricken amazing right now especially in bg's.</p><p>Gear is important for every class in eq2, please just accept the fact that you have alot to learn on how to play a fury or continue blaming your inadequacies on the class you rolled</p></blockquote><p>If you wanted to help me you would answer my questions, not ignore or dodge them by the old insult "you just don't know how to play your class" </p>

[Nacor]

<p><cite>Shankapotomus@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>If I may speak...</p><p>I'm a fury with almost full BG gear and lvl 80 PvP pieces filling in the rest. And heres how it goes...</p><p>DpS- Moderate</p><p>Heals- Moderate</p><p>Utility- low</p><p>I took a big hit with the spell resist change. I used to be able to blow through BGs and top heal and DpS chart. Is this right? no. You can't expect to blow people away and heal like a champ. And no, we should in no way be able to match a wardens heals (not to mentions we blow through power like nothing compared to them). I believe a lot of our spells are useless, like our pets that put out no damage, while wardens have pets who can heal them alone.</p><p>But is it right I can get passed in the heal parse by Zerkers and Paladins? no. The problem lies less in the furies capability and more in the blown out proportions of other classes. My single target HoT ticks for less than some classes heal procs...</p><p>But you have to make your choice between DpS and Heals, and there is only one right answer. Heals! I get kills by keeping my heals up and when I see the right time, beat the heck out of someone from the other side. But you can't kill anything if you don't keep yourself alive and your group.</p></blockquote><p>I think another problem is this, they should have never put PVP servers with PVE servers in battle grounds.  I cant get my hands on any PVP gear other then what the vender sells.  </p><p>Also I never said I expect to blow people away and heal like a champ, the reason I chose the fury is they have the capability to dps or heal, the trade off is Ill be at the bottom of both ends of the spectrum and I have always gotten this and don't have a problem with it.</p><p>I have talked with other level 90 furys that score Hi on dps and heals and what Im saying is they are all set up in the best gear the game has to offer right now, the advice they offer is what Im doing already.  </p><p>This was never about play style and the roll fuys play in the game, this was always about how sony handled the warlock/wizard class and how it effected the class I play.  </p>

[Costa]

<p>I can understand your frustration at not getting our pvp gear but within a couple weeks of BG release they removed the procs. You said in an earlier post you are from a blue server and don't have the opportunity to get the same gear. Sorry but your wrong right there as we all have the opportunity if in the right guilds to get the same raid gear and t9 BG is exactly the same as t9 pvp gear. The fact people may have a few extra fabled items from t8 pvp gain nothing than a few extra crit or modifiers. All easy to get within t9 if you look for it.</p><p>To keep saying people are not answering your question, i think they have but they're not giving you the answer your looking for. I have had battles with fury's in open world and BG pvp and when played well can be horrible to fight. They will sit and heal through incomming damage and just run you oop and throw in the occasional dot or nuke and just wear you down. You've had your damage reduced and peoples resists are now working due to the recent changes. With the next update your spell damage will go back up but peoples resists will still be functioning. If a scout the day before the changes went in couldn't kill you but did the day after how was that possible when all they did was reduce spell damage and make resists work? As far as i can see it is 1 of 3 things, either the scout went away and worked on another strat to kill you, the scout got gear upgrades or the scout was able to live longer to do the damage required to kill you.</p><p>I don't think there is much more to say on the topic as you reject any comment's people make to try and help you. If scouts are now getting to you and killing you etc then maybe the fact warlocks are no longer 1 shotting groups or wizzies are not killing people left and right is the main reason. The fact you now need to adjust to counter the cc effects that scouts use to kill you is just part of the character development. The way to counter scouts is fairly straight forward if you have the right items at your disposal, starting with a tank that will taunt. The fact that there are potions, signets and an aa ability that can also counter most of the problems you have are other ways to survive. Going full bore into BG armor and jewlery may not be the most appropriate items to have either. People on pvp servers tend to mix and match gear to give them an edge. Some of those items are easy to get others take 24 people and several hours worth of work to get but pvp gear is not the be all and end all for pvp.</p><p>Sorry if i come across as having a go at you but i feel after reading the posts that your main question was answered and that the discussion has now changed to something a little different. If you feel that comments on here go off topic then like others have suggested is roll a toon on naggy and ask in the fury channel and see what you will get. There is a high chance you'll get dumb comments but you may get some tips or ideas that you've missed through doing your own research.</p>

[Nacor]

<p><cite>Nacor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Hi I play a fury with a full set of bg armor and about 4 or 5 BG items now.  Before the spell nerf went in to effect i use to do ok with like armored opponents and like anyone else if I had more BG armor then them they would go down kinda fast. Now that resists change has gone in I can no longer DPS in any effective way, My 2 high damage spells lighting bolt and start nova hit for 2k if im lucky and other 2 quicker cast spells hit for 200 damage max, ring of fire and ball lighting are not worth casting anymore because again they will only hit for around 200 points.  Even if I debuff my damage is not going up... In everyones haste to knee cap high dps casters the fury class has been destroyed as a dps class with this blanket adjustment.  Sure I can still heal but there are other classes that heal much better like the warden... I have been trying to do the BG's the last few days and all I see now are tank classes, casters are few and far between.  So as a fury is there any use for them in the BG other then just healing... we are supposed to be a dps/healing class.</p></blockquote><p>this was my original post, all I have been hearing from people is learn to play your class, furys are still a deadly class and look at these furys and what they can do, if you push your buttons in the right order a fury will never die...</p><p>No one really addressed this, but what I did learn from all of you is BG is for the high end player and not for the common gamer.  I am not able to get into the raids to get that high end gear, furys are still the last picked in a line up when comes to healer class or DPS class.  I dont have another main that is more popular so my fury can ride on his coat tails to get this better gear so he can compete.  I can say this because the stats posted from what other furys have done are furys that have access to the high end gear.  They are the exception not the rule, just like the players in the avatar armor from the PVP servers.. another point no one would address.</p><p>Like most on my server I will play BG's just long enough to get the BG armor I want or need then never go back again, Ill leave that like so many other raid zones to the exceptions.</p>

[Chaosfairie27]

<p>Sorry to disagree with you, OP, but BG's are not only for folks with high end raid gear.  I am a lvl 90 Fury on a pvp server and am mostly wearing the T9 mastercrafted BG set.  I get my face owned, alot, I own a little face, sometimes, that's just how it is, both in the BG's and in open world PVP.</p><p>I am not sure if you started this post just to troll, which I hope not, or if you sincerely need some advice, but alot of good advice has been given here other than "Learn to play".  The best piece of advice was to start a lowbie toon on Naggy or Vox and ask for help in the Fury channel.  Pvp'ers do have a bad rep for not being helpful, but if you ask correctly, I am sure many people would offer assistance.</p><p>AA's are extremely important in building a Fury, as I am sure they are to most classes, but we have so many different ways we can spec to play totally different roles.  Make sure you have spec'ed for Serenity, this will be your best friend.  Those few seconds of immunity can save not only yourself, but your team too.  Also get some AA into Back Into The Fray.  I can't even tell you how awesome it is that we can cast this on ourselves now as well.  Has saved me, my tank, and those darn squishies I'm always stuck with <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  more times than I can count.</p><p>Alot of what a Fury needs to do is based on your BG group.  If you are grouped with two other healers and lacking dps classes, get out there and nuke your butt off, will you take the place of a T1 DPS class, heck to the no, but it's better than having no one in that DPS slot.  If you want to be formidable DPS, master out your nukes and high hitting spells, max out your dps AA's if you haven't, it's there for us to use, so why not go for it.  Make sure that your spell rotation makes sense, if you have nothing to cast while waiting for Thunderbolt or Starnova to come back up, you're not doing something correctly.  I think that all of our AOE's are very useful in BG's, casting Ring of Fire and Ball of Lightning in Gears is almost a must if your team is holding onto the relic.  And let your team know, I am going to be dps'ing as much as I can to help out, so they won't count on you for main heals.  If you are the only healer, stay near your tank if you can and try to keep the tank alive and get off those group heals for those team members that are in range.  Just always remember, you cannot be the whole team.  I've topped the heal parse in BG's, I've been amongst the top 3 or 4 in dps and kills, I've been low in the heal parse too.  BG's are not a solo effort and alot of the outcome depends on how your group is matched up and again, what is needed of you.  Furys are not an easy class, look at how many bad ones are out there, but there are some hella good ones out there as well.  You have to know your class almost inside and out and make your own decisions on whether you should dps or heal or just stand there with your thumb up your nose and hope that no one notices you.</p><p>Once the other team sees that priest tag above your head, guess who the number one kill on-sight target will be!!  You will be, just for being tagged as a healer!!  So be prepared to be die a little, be prepared to take some damage, be prepared for that one fun-loving scout that stays glued to your butt the entire time melee'ing the heck out of you.  Revive and get your butt back in there.</p><p>I don't think that Furys were ever meant to be nuke masters, we are fast healing class there to help groups survive spike damage when it occurs and keep our HOTs up to help with the spike damage while we are casting.  I think Furys have a very nice balance going on right now, flame away if you must, but I can heal groups well, I can dps okay, but most importantly I have fun with my class and I enjoy learning new things, new techniques, and new strategies that help me be a better player and keep myself and my group alive.  I learn from every fight and let failures aid me instead of disuade me.  You have to ask yourself, I got my face owned, but what did I learn from that?</p><p>If you feel you've been nerfed, I'm not saying that we haven't been, learn where your other strengths lie and play it up 100%.  Feel like you're not doing as much damage as you're used to?  Heal yourself while the other person damages you, don't even try to nuke them, just auto-attack, conserve your energy, and when they run out of power, kick their behinds and then laugh at them for not knowing your strength!  It's the little things that can make a huge difference.</p><p>Now if we could just get some more power regen, I'd be in fury loving heaven!</p><p>Long post I know!  But hopefully that will all help a little bit.</p>

[Shankapotomus]

<p><cite>Nacor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Shankapotomus@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>If I may speak...</p><p>I'm a fury with almost full BG gear and lvl 80 PvP pieces filling in the rest. And heres how it goes...</p><p>DpS- Moderate</p><p>Heals- Moderate</p><p>Utility- low</p><p>I took a big hit with the spell resist change. I used to be able to blow through BGs and top heal and DpS chart. Is this right? no. You can't expect to blow people away and heal like a champ. And no, we should in no way be able to match a wardens heals (not to mentions we blow through power like nothing compared to them). I believe a lot of our spells are useless, like our pets that put out no damage, while wardens have pets who can heal them alone.</p><p>But is it right I can get passed in the heal parse by Zerkers and Paladins? no. The problem lies less in the furies capability and more in the blown out proportions of other classes. My single target HoT ticks for less than some classes heal procs...</p><p>But you have to make your choice between DpS and Heals, and there is only one right answer. Heals! I get kills by keeping my heals up and when I see the right time, beat the heck out of someone from the other side. But you can't kill anything if you don't keep yourself alive and your group.</p></blockquote><p>I think another problem is this, they should have never put PVP servers with PVE servers in battle grounds.  I cant get my hands on any PVP gear other then what the vender sells.  </p><p>Also I never said I expect to blow people away and heal like a champ, the reason I chose the fury is they have the capability to dps or heal, the trade off is Ill be at the bottom of both ends of the spectrum and I have always gotten this and don't have a problem with it.</p><p>I have talked with other level 90 furys that score Hi on dps and heals and what Im saying is they are all set up in the best gear the game has to offer right now, the advice they offer is what Im doing already.  </p><p>This was never about play style and the roll fuys play in the game, this was always about how sony handled the warlock/wizard class and how it effected the class I play.  </p></blockquote><p>Handled the warlock/wizard? it was a spell resist coding problem.</p><p>So before when I could one shot or get people in the red with one thunderbolt (doesn't matter about gear) as a healer that was OK? No...</p><p>There is no doubt they hit a spellcasters a little too hard, but thats what the incoming fix is for.</p><p>If you except that you want to play a fury accept these facts, when you run into a good player:</p><p>       your heals may not save you from the high DpS classes</p><p>       your DpS will not take down tanks or other healers</p><p>       Being stunned or and other negative effect is going to really get you down since your heals are moderate and you only    wear leather with most likely lower health than other classes (besides mages)</p><p>       O yea, And your power is very depleting...</p><p>But this is playing against the best of the and you always have to test the waters, but always understand your limitations</p>

[Shinmuriel]

<p><cite>Aleste wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>You can still out last almost anyone. Because your heals, so what your asking is to be able to heal quite well and nuke ppl into the dust? In group pvp healers heal.. you can toss some dots or damage every once in a while. But when you start "dpsing" your teamates usualy die... leaves ppl saying "wheres our healer?".</p></blockquote><p>You obviously know nothing about how a fury works or the fact that they dps "while" healing. Regardless your still missing something important here, so ill kindly ask you to shut your ignorent mouth. Fury's are broken either way now due to the damage nerf, before they could do a reasonable amount of DPS and heal there groups just fine but now DPS is a poor f'n joke and they cannot solo heal because every other healer class simply runs them out of mana with superior wards and mana pools. Every fight is a long 15 min zerg fest with no out of combat mana regen. So lets change the subject to something like... When are wards and plate/chain healers going to get ner... balenced so its fair to everyone else? Because um, <em>hello</em> there gods right now. Tell me what the f'k does a fury do when they know there going to lose in a long fight AND they cannot DPS to help speed that fight up? Again shut your mouth and exit stage left.</p>

[ailen]

<p>lol.  I love it when people come on  here "telling others" what to do.. like SHUT UP.</p><p>Grand times indeed!</p><p>The Fury class is fine.  Get over it.  Broken?  Hardly.</p>

[Shinmuriel]

<p>Yea actually they are rather broken in BG right now, whether you believe it or not your yet another jack*** that doesn't know what hes talking about. So you can shut your dirty mouth to. I may seem abrasive but im right. <strong>FIGHTS LAST TO LONG so furys run out of mana much much faster than any other healer and due to the damage nerf they can no longer DPS to even help speed that fight up, they are worthless as solo healers against any other healer class now, if you think otherwise its because your a twit or you have not played a fury in BG lately. Your a berserker you know how this goes everytime you get outclassed by a crusader doesn't it bother you just a little bit?.</strong> I'm starting to believe there are a bunch of trolls in disguise (probably scouts and plate/chain healers who currently own BG's) that do nothing but go into other class threads to say there is nothing wrong with there class. I'll keep that in mind when they nerf... er "balence" plate/chain healers and they start crying because godmode is over. This is coming from a berserker to, your already walking on thin ice so you should go find a quiet dark corner and hope the nerfbat doesn't hit you to hard when it gets passed around. I don't expect any changes made really because SOE doesn't even grasp the meaning of the word balence to be honest. Balence is when every class can actually participate and have fun (and have a purpose) rather than just 4 out of 24. They will continue alienating every class until the entire game is a ghost town then move on to dev EQ3, its already started. Ever played SWG? Yea, thats about the jist of it.</p>

[Shankapotomus]

<p>Um... I am of the fury class... and there is nothing wrong with me...</p><p>If you're talking about other classes posting on other classes, take your own advise.</p><p>you have to look at it from within the class arch-types. Check parses once in a while. I out DpS every single healer in my BG (maybe not another fury, but usually) and keep up with all the other healers. You know what... on occasion I even beat shamons! To me this looks pretty balanced. But what you want is to balance out the classes with more imbalance. We got the bad end of the stick right now because some other classes have been blown out of proportion. What we need to do is wait for those fixes and gut it out. And if you think only 4 players out of a 24 make a difference... maybe if you quit Queing up we can get 5 out of 24 who have a purpose.</p>

[Shinmuriel]

<p>I wouldn't be here if I didn't play a fury so im not quite sure what you mean by "take your own advice." Specifically in BG's furys have little chance to solo heal there groups against other healers because of power issues thats all im saying. There will ALWAYS be exceptions, I am not a nub, I am not undergeared, I understand how to play the class in PvE just fine and conserve mana but in PvP when people are dropping heavy damage to your group in closed quarters like Klak there is no such thing as "conserving" mana, you keep healing or you fail. Furys keep healing just fine right up until the point where they run out of mana (about 90 seconds or so) then your group wipes. Maybe the answer IS to balence "other" healers so there wards do not make them invincible, I don't know the answer personally but I know that there is still a definate problem with furys ability to heal there groups over long periods of time in BG's and its bull****. There is nothing wrong with the capacity of the class to heal (all things even) the issue is either other healer classes are OP or damage has been reduced to much extending encounters to the point where furys are simple being rooted out by natural selection. You can argue about balence until the f'n cows come home but if a class is broke its broke, balenced or not. End of story. I don't give a sheit personally about out DPSing other healers if i cannot keep my group alive for more than 90 seconds.</p>

[Oakum]

<p><cite>Aleste wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>Healing/dps.. when ppl are looking for dps a fury isnt the 1st or 5 thing that comes to mind. Quite a few fury's put up healing numbers to match or surpass wardens while also doing damage.</blockquote><p>Maybe its no fun just healing to be killed by an dps scout in one to 4 seconds unless your a cleric with very high mit. Furys can heal almost as good as wardens though if they are specced for it. If I was to go full dps spec, I would lose a lot of healing aa's.  Granted with the PVP/BG healing reductions, even wardens run out of power just as quick as other healing classes and sometimes quicker since they are casting more trying to stack the regen portions of their heals on their group or healing target in a fight. Half of all warden heals being regens. </p><p>The equally geared scout will kill and equally geared healer pretty much everytime (at least druids) so maybe we should be asking that no scout should have a higher damage attack then a healer has a heal in BG's.</p><p>That would be fair, dont your think?</p>

[Oakum]

<p><cite>Aleste wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Learn to cure your dots and carry pots follow the tank.. whole lot of ways around the cc. The fact that you use a /duel to prove a point shows a noobish nature... duels dont use pvp rule set last i knew. But this whole post and you saying it was better before the fix proves your greed. You want scouts and tanks to take unmitigated damage while you have mit vrs melee? Comeon. A little damagic boost is inc till then learn to counter whats killing you.. cause trust me it can be countered.</p></blockquote><p>Not so sure about the pvp ruleset and duels. I think they do actually. Would explain why the warden power regen is so low in a duel as to not to be noticeable.</p>

[Crismorn]

<p>I would play a Fury in bgs over my Inq is a second right now the fury class is amazing in SF.</p><p>Get gear, learn what aa's to get and learn when to use your abilities.  It can take time, but its well worth the effort.</p>

[Shinmuriel]

<p><cite>Crismorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I would play a Fury in bgs over my Inq is a second right now the fury class is amazing in SF.</p><p>Get gear, learn what aa's to get and learn when to use your abilities.  It can take time, but its well worth the effort.</p></blockquote><p>I'm sorry my intention isn't to just blatently talk smack but what crack are you smoking for real? You would play a fury? That obviously implies that you do NOT play a fury... So stop commenting on classes threads when you have no clue what your saying. Go back to the inquis forums and like the serker who commented above, hope your class is still playable when you get nerfed. Your class is one of the most OP classes in BG's right now you should learn to keep your mouth shut telling others there class is fine when its not. Jump in Klak on a fury and try out lasting a mystic or inq (MANA wise) solo healing there group, its poor comedy. Do not try saying I don't know how to play the class, heals are not a problem neither is DPS, the issue is plate/chain healers (with even decent gear) are virtually immortal in BG's without timing stuns/stiffles and coordinating attacks, there like f'king raid mobs. You cannot mana spec on a fury can you? Then [Removed for Content] are you talking about "learn what AA's to get"? Pull the d*** out of your ear and actually listen to what people are saying instead of talking sheit and assuming there nubs and your the only one who knows [Removed for Content] hes talking about (especially if you do not play the class).</p>

[Crismorn]

<p>I've seen what furies are capable of doing when they take the time to learn their class and build it properly.</p>

[Shinmuriel]

<p>Its solved then, apparently were all idiots for not speccing our fury's for mana regen! Yea i know well what the class is capable of but regardless they still have issues at solo healing groups in Klak without any mana. I will give SOE this much however, i logged onto test and seen several mana regen items including the Zarrakon belt. I imagine what "you have seen" is what fury's with tons of mana regen gear can do with a good chanter watching there back. Hopefully they will bridge the gap and make more items available to the masses. God knows they have to keep the rats on the ship somehow right? I just wish the never ending zerg fest would end in BG's before i have to go back. It could be fixed right now and i wouldn't know, its all i can do to keep from throwing up in my mouth thinking about going in there. (-_\</p>

[Crismorn]

<p>So when you are running low on mana do you ever think "Hmm, maybe I should do something about my mana?"</p><p>Signets</p><p>potions</p><p>manastone</p><p>overlocked manastone</p><p>heart/shard</p><p>Power roots</p><p>tons and TONS of gear options for mana procs off beneficial spells, hostile spells, when target takes dmg...</p>

[Shinmuriel]

<p>Yea having to waste 20k status on signets every BG match got old fast, sorry. But i use everything including the lower level tinkered mana stones that have a 50/50 chance (first before i use the overclocked). As far as mana gear I got the T8 jewelery that procs off heals, the DPS proc's are useless for the most part when solo healing in closed quarters in BG's (have to spam HoT's and single heals, much less caster DPS is a poor joke now) so i tend to only go for call of storms and starnova when i get the chance. I only DPS when I have a illy (which is never in BG's) and hearts/shards? Summoners, just like chanters are a luxory you cannot count on in pug BG matches. After all is said and done, all of the mana gear might give a fury group another 30 seconds of life in a long drawn out 15 min zerg fest.</p><p>After the damage nerfs fights became a mana war, first one out of mana loses. That puts furys at the bottom of the food chain, flat out. Even if we use everything to regen mana, we have nothing that other healers cannot get and use so the end result is the same. What needs to be done? Maybe raise damage or lower heals, the sound of lessening heals seems kinda repulsing. I don't think they can really fix BG's or PvP in this game period, tbh. If you want good PvP play WoW (wierd hearing myself say that since i kinda hate WoW). I actually feel bad for the devs now, it just seems everything they do to help just makes things worse, BG's is wretchid and they are without a clue how to fix it (or anything else in this game). I have actually heard one of there excuses for BG's sucking so bad was not enough people on test server... My reply to that is, we PAY to play this game and for quality content not the other way around, we don't get paid to play so honestly that excuse doesn't elicit much mercy, sorry. Hire (pay) for beta/test server players and stop being cheap or allow people to play the game for free to play the test server so many hours a week. You would think somewhere around the office is a operators manual one of the devs they fired left behind and maybe someone might pick it up one day and read it but thats wishful thinking. The game is so out of balence its sad at times, every expansion every class is worried about "who is going to get nerfed" more than what content is being released, thats poor development at its best. Its garbage. Why do I QQ so much? Because im paying for this garbage for another 5 months (or until something better comes along) so I feel I have a right to let them know the service they provide is trash.</p>

[Shankapotomus]

<p>^^^^</p><p>that is the truth of the matter.</p><p>Gettin content out just to get it out there and make some money puts your game in a world of hurt, as you can see. Now they are fixing fixes they put in to fix changes they changed to fix a problem because they decided to make another change without looking into what would happen. When they put out SF you know they were just waiting for the backlash before they got to work on any problems.</p><p>What needs to happen is, they need to get melee and spells in check. Then they need to look at the overall standing of class skills and make them proportional to the dmg output in PvE, but have it scaled to PvP health standards. I can hit a thunderbolt for 15k solo. In PvP the most I can hit is 1.5k (if they aren't fully geared), which is more than non healer classes have gear heal procs for...</p><p>But if I sit here and demand changed to my class, all that will happen is my class will get easier and it will leave other classes behind. Then they will have to buff them back up again and just keep playing leap frog... look how blown out it already is... why should I run around with 130% crit chance? And they expect this game to keep having longevity...</p><p>Guild Wars 2 comes out early next year I believe! hopefully this game can last till then...</p>

[ntommyb]

<p><cite>Shinmuriel wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Yea having to waste 20k status on signets every BG match got old fast, sorry. But i use everything including the lower level tinkered mana stones that have a 50/50 chance (first before i use the overclocked). As far as mana gear I got the T8 jewelery that procs off heals, the DPS proc's are useless for the most part when solo healing in closed quarters in BG's (have to spam HoT's and single heals, much less caster DPS is a poor joke now) so i tend to only go for call of storms and starnova when i get the chance. I only DPS when I have a illy (which is never in BG's) and hearts/shards? Summoners, just like chanters are a luxory you cannot count on in pug BG matches. After all is said and done, all of the mana gear might give a fury group another 30 seconds of life in a long drawn out 15 min zerg fest.</p><p>After the damage nerfs fights became a mana war, first one out of mana loses. That puts furys at the bottom of the food chain, flat out. Even if we use everything to regen mana, we have nothing that other healers cannot get and use so the end result is the same. What needs to be done? Maybe raise damage or lower heals, the sound of lessening heals seems kinda repulsing. I don't think they can really fix BG's or PvP in this game period, tbh. If you want good PvP play WoW (wierd hearing myself say that since i kinda hate WoW). I actually feel bad for the devs now, it just seems everything they do to help just makes things worse, BG's is wretchid and they are without a clue how to fix it (or anything else in this game). I have actually heard one of there excuses for BG's sucking so bad was not enough people on test server... My reply to that is, we PAY to play this game and for quality content not the other way around, we don't get paid to play so honestly that excuse doesn't elicit much mercy, sorry. Hire (pay) for beta/test server players and stop being cheap or allow people to play the game for free to play the test server so many hours a week. You would think somewhere around the office is a operators manual one of the devs they fired left behind and maybe someone might pick it up one day and read it but thats wishful thinking. The game is so out of balence its sad at times, every expansion every class is worried about "who is going to get nerfed" more than what content is being released, thats poor development at its best. Its garbage. Why do I QQ so much? Because im paying for this garbage for another 5 months (or until something better comes along) so I feel I have a right to let them know the service they provide is trash.</p></blockquote><p> If you have problems with power, you obviously don't know how to set up your group or you queue solo.  If you queue solo all bets are off.  Even if the match maker mechanic worked better it would suck because most people have no idea how to play this game beyond the parse.  Its not a good system, its a huge gamble that only a few classes can be successful at consistently.  </p><p>This is a group game and you're really annoyed that you have to depend on other players to know how to play their class in order of you to be successful.  Please note the irony.</p><p> Its supposed to be a complex fight so it can't last 3 shots.  If you like mindless pvp with cookie cutter encounters, you're right, play WoW or raid in eq2.  If you want a game where you have to coordinate debuffs and CC with timed bursts,  use taunting with sustained damage to drain then play EQ2.  I've been pvping for 5 years and I still get pwned by better groups or superior players.</p><p>also THEY WERE NOT DAMAGE NERFS, it was a bug fix.  You were broken....now you're fixed</p><p>Please, for your own good get over it</p>

[Shinmuriel]

<p>Say what you want, its still trash. You have been PvPing for 5 years but BG's (as much as they try to make it) is NOT and prolly never will be the same as the PvP on the PvP servers. There foolish for trying to make it so IMO. Just like card games like Magic the Gathering will never be D&D (nerd flashback). Ive never played on a PvP server, to many idiots who like to gank and act a fool, people who as children enjoyed pulling the wings off of flies. No desire to take part in that tbh. And if you want to argue that BG's is group based and you have to know how to work on a team then right there is the problem all together... The groups are random, there is little strategy, aside from making due with what you can. Its not war/strategy its more like surviving on a deserted isle by eating bark and snails. So they should be creative enough like WoW to balence each class so that class can function both independantly and in a group. Keep in mind they asked for this when they opened BG's up to allow all servers to play together, PvP servers have been working together for years and coordinate efforts whereas the majority of the games populous has never even logged onto a vent server and most likely never even been in a raid. So of course BG's would be better perhaps if everyone had PvPed for years but they haven't and SOE should have taken that into consideration. This game is to far along to expect to get by without a culture shock when they institute such a dramatic change. I imagine the issue with plate/chain healers being demigods is just a "coding error" also like caster DPS. Regardless, until BG's isn't completely owned by plate/chain healers and scouts im going to talk trash everytime i step foot in there. It is NOT PvP its BG's so stop making people have to think or work together, your ruining it. =)~ HELLO SOE if we wanted PvP we would have started on a PvP server! Duh!</p>

[ntommyb]

<p><cite>Shinmuriel wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>. And if you want to argue that BG's is group based and you have to know how to work on a team then right there is the problem all together... The groups are random, there is little strategy, aside from making due with what you can. Its not war/strategy its more like surviving on a deserted isle by eating bark and snails. So they should be creative enough like WoW to balence each class so that class can function both independantly and in a group.</p></blockquote><p>Jeez dude I explained it already, BG's are group based if you queue solo you take a huge risk because that system is fundamentally flawed just like any system that drops you with random idiots.  Its well in your control to play in a good group theres a /tell system that works great or a /lfg.  It not that hard to attach yourself to a guild that will make it really easy to find friends.  </p><p>Your complaints are based on the fact that you can't queue solo and consistently win?  Thats crazy.   btw I've heard of the class imbalances in WoW too, hell I played it for 50 or so levels.  Its not that great, as a matter off fact its really really bad compared to eq2.</p><p>Listen this whole arguing about not wanting to have to work together with people is starting to make this look like a troll.  Thats the fundamental difference between eq2 and everybody else.  You can't win a raid by yourself or having 24 sk's in the raid or 24 templars, so you can't win at pvp if you don't have a proper group...period</p>

[Aatex]

<p>update for the OP:</p><p>Since they added the new BG gear I've been using most of the Challengers BG gear and a couple BG jewelery. (<3 blue adorns) But even back then I also used other items that you could have got easily or with a little patient farming (Cloak of Justice and Stone of Nizara). Though in most cases I am more focused on healing than dpsing now but still do both.</p><p>@Davionx - even with all the power goodies/tricks/abilities power can still be a huge issue for furies in BG.</p>

[Wigg]

<p>Don't listen to Spahnlie.  Major nub that one.</p>

[Crismorn]

<p><cite>Spahnlie@Butcherblock wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>update for the OP:</p><p>Since they added the new BG gear I've been using most of the Challengers BG gear and a couple BG jewelery. (<3 blue adorns) But even back then I also used other items that you could have got easily or with a little patient farming (Cloak of Justice and Stone of Nizara). Though in most cases I am more focused on healing than dpsing now but still do both.</p><p>@Davionx - even with all the power goodies/tricks/abilities power can still be a huge issue for furies in BG.</p></blockquote><p>neutral 2set.</p><p>Thats all I will say about that, seriously though try it if you have 2</p>

[Aatex]

<p>Don't have a set =/</p>

[Crismorn]

<p>damneet</p>