Mystic Utility/DPS/AA in SF [Archive] - EQ2 Forum Archive @ EQ2Wire

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ATTHWSM

04-06-2010, 03:32 PM

Aye guys new to the official forums here but been playing the game since 04. Anyways, heres a list of OMG NEEDS A CHANGE type things, and things that are going well for us.1. Mystic AA CA line. TBH, this was our money maker in TSO and before, allowing us to crap out dps no other healer could touch while at the same time healing just fine. Sadly, with the new CRIT IS CRIT idea, (which I whole heartedly LOVE mind you) the CA line for mystics becomes worthless. This isnt a matter of opinion, or some baseless whine, but pure fact. Spec fully into Melee CA, DPS Stance, and Melee Litany, now look at your CA's as compared to speccing Spell Litany and DPS stance. If you stick with spells, your reuse speed is half as much or better than your CAs, and they hit for more dps at M1. On dumby testing, solo, Im getting about 1200 more dps from spells than CAs, with all the latest t9 Raid stuffs. Factor in massive raid buffs and temps, and the gap gets huge, roughly 3-5 k different between CAs and Spells. Before any melee mystics start whining about how I forgot our base auto attack multi from KOS and base dmg multi from TSO, no I didnt. 2. Stat Debuffs. I may be a little slow slow regarding how stat debuffs really effect a lvl 98 Raid mob, but TBH lowering a targets str/sta by 120 seems stupid. I can see the plus sides for lowering STR obviously, but anything that debuffs stamina is stupid. So I lower a raid mob with 150million hps stamina by 250, OMG thats gonna make him die faster. 3. The DOGDOG. Thing was awesome in TSO, but in SF its getting rocked by about 70% of the raid content. And no, it has nothing to do with positioning, or fail red messages, it has everything to do with the dogs AOE immunity not working on the majority of AOES in SF. I can accept this tbh, if you were to lower the recast speed to like 1 second instead of 7. 4. I kinda feel like were lacking alot of utility for our groups also. Bolster, IS AWESOME, specially with new AAs in it. STAMPEDE IS AWESOME, like OMG we love it. Ancestry still isnt that awesome, and our single target buffs are not awesome. Increasing Str/Agi/Sta by 114 on one person really isnt game changing is it? I love the fact that were a melee healer, but our buffs dont reflect that. Some kind of a melee proc we can give our group, single target procs, SOMETHING, even TEMPS, would make a big difference in our lvl of utlity we bring to a melee dps group. Seems like Mystics got the short end of the stick regarding our dps buffs. THINGS I LOVE -1. Stampede - Guys, this is possibly the sweetest spell ever made in the history of this game. IF your melee, and you dont understand why stampede is amazing, you should probably quit the game. SOE, seriously STAMPEDE is amazing, I dont care if its group only, and melee only, this thing is proccing for like 40% of our scouts 40k dps. AWESOME work here2. Bolster AA - 10% crit mit and 10% mit = AWESOME, this thing is awesome, and its pretty much up as soon as its down. AWESOME3. SF endline Super heal - THIS thing is awesome, at first I was upset about how the other healers got more utility stuff that lasted for like 20 seconds, but then I realized the awesomeness of this spell. ANY kind of spikage, or frontal, or anticipated pulse AOE, this thing makes it like it never happened. AWESOME spell.4. Oberon - This sucked the entire game till this xpac tbh. Maybe not as sweet as SOUL WARD and what not, but its still pretty beast for spikeage. Mystics can solo heal a group in 90% of the raid content in SF, we got what we need and we make it work, just some tweekage and wed be where we should be aye? There is no reason defilers and templars should be outdpsing us EVER, even if were afk. Thanks!Garaktun

Gahnand

04-06-2010, 03:42 PM

I disagree with almost every single thing you said. 1. CAs still offer a huge advantage in that even with longer cool-down, you can get them off much faster than casting spells. So you can joust in, hit all your CAs, get in 2 auto-attacks (before CAs and right after taking advantage of the auto-attack multiplier, which btw does not affect the CAs) and joust out to get back into healing and what not. 3. I feel like the dog is working great for me in much of the SF content especially with the cure proc. Yes it dies sometimes, but just don't use it for those fights. 4. How you think Ancestry is not awesome confuses me. A flat 3% increase is uber. Stampede as you said, is awesome. Spirit tap is still great with JCaps and the new easily obtainable reuse. Stat buffs and nox resist is still pretty awesome. Only thing I would like a little love on is our 70+ AAs in our subclass tree. I'm not really feeling the point in putting points into many of them.

Hene

04-06-2010, 03:50 PM

<cite>ATTHWSM wrote:</cite><blockquote>Aye guys new to the official forums here but been playing the game since 04. Anyways, heres a list of OMG NEEDS A CHANGE type things, and things that are going well for us.1. Mystic AA CA line. TBH, this was our money maker in TSO and before, allowing us to crap out dps no other healer could touch while at the same time healing just fine. Sadly, with the new CRIT IS CRIT idea, (which I whole heartedly LOVE mind you) the CA line for mystics becomes worthless. This isnt a matter of opinion, or some baseless whine, but pure fact. Spec fully into Melee CA, DPS Stance, and Melee Litany, now look at your CA's as compared to speccing Spell Litany and DPS stance. If you stick with spells, your reuse speed is half as much or better than your CAs, and they hit for more dps at M1. On dumby testing, solo, Im getting about 1200 more dps from spells than CAs, with all the latest t9 Raid stuffs. Factor in massive raid buffs and temps, and the gap gets huge, roughly 3-5 k different between CAs and Spells. Before any melee mystics start whining about how I forgot our base auto attack multi from KOS and TSO, no I didnt. But how well can you fit spells into your standard buff-debuff-heal routine? I do hate the added reuse, but they're SOOO much easier to fit in as CAs, and I honestly don't know how a defiler or templar are beating you DPS wise. I'm in all TSO T3 or lower gear and consistently beat my templar friend AND defiler buddy...2. Stat Debuffs. I may be a little slow slow regarding how stat debuffs really effect a lvl 98 Raid mob, but TBH lowering a targets str/sta by 120 seems stupid. I can see the plus sides for lowering STR obviously, but anything that debuffs stamina is stupid. So I lower a raid mob with 150million hps stamina by 250, OMG thats gonna make him die faster. AFAIK, stamina affects your base hitpoints. Since raid mobs have significantly large base hitpoints, a stamina debuff is going to do wonders. But debuffing strength is plain stupid for tons of mobs. This now only affects fighter mobs' DPS.3. The DOGDOG. Thing was awesome in TSO, but in SF its getting rocked by about 70% of the raid content. And no, it has nothing to do with positioning, or fail red messages, it has everything to do with the dogs AOE immunity not working on the majority of AOES in SF. I can accept this tbh, if you were to lower the recast speed to like 1 second instead of 7. I would also like to see the casting time reduced. I will say that its untimely deaths can be quite annoying at times, but you can easily get around this: when you have to joust, make your dog joust.Sadly, the dog cures don't do much at all; I've yet to see it do more than 5% of the total cures if I'm actively curing...It just makes me feel like I'm wasting AA points.4. I kinda feel like were lacking alot of utility for our groups also. Bolster, IS AWESOME, specially with new AAs in it. STAMPEDE IS AWESOME, like OMG we love it. Ancestry still isnt that awesome, and our single target buffs are not awesome. Increasing Str/Agi/Sta by 114 on one person really isnt game changing is it? I love the fact that were a melee healer, but our buffs dont reflect that. Some kind of a melee proc we can give our group, single target procs, SOMETHING, even TEMPS, would make a big difference in our lvl of utlity we bring to a melee dps group. Seems like Mystics got the short end of the stick regarding our dps buffs. Rage used to say otherwise, until most scouts got capped on atk speed and double attack; honestly, they should add a couple of percent to flurry instead of dbl atk.Ancestry is actually amazing; it only adds 3% extra procing chance, but it adds up if you put it one someone with a lot of procs, or important ones, like a dirge for stoneskins. 3% extra stoneskin + whatever else he has can be very useful.</blockquote>I'll add more later

Banditman

04-06-2010, 05:58 PM

I agree with Hene on the CA's versus spells. I'm sure it's possible that in a situation where a Mystic has absolutely nothing to do he could crank more DPS from spells. But honestly, how often is that? For me, it's pretty rare, which is to say, pretty much never.I can however stand up there next to the mob swinging a weapon, do my standard debuffs and heals, and when I get just a second or two with nothing to do, toss on 3 or 4 CA's.Sure, I'd love to see our dog actually IMMUNE to AE's like the thing promises, but I got rid of the mutt and honestly I haven't really missed him. I will call him up and park him at the ZI if some SK wants to mooch some mitigation off him, but I don't promise he'll live.Stampede may well be really good, but Enchanters have had it since TSO. For a melee only buff, it should really have a shorter recast.

Hene

04-06-2010, 06:50 PM

<cite>Banditman wrote:</cite><blockquote>I agree with Hene on the CA's versus spells. I'm sure it's possible that in a situation where a Mystic has absolutely nothing to do he could crank more DPS from spells. But honestly, how often is that? For me, it's pretty rare, which is to say, pretty much never.I can however stand up there next to the mob swinging a weapon, do my standard debuffs and heals, and when I get just a second or two with nothing to do, toss on 3 or 4 CA's.Sure, I'd love to see our dog actually IMMUNE to AE's like the thing promises, but I got rid of the mutt and honestly I haven't really missed him. I will call him up and park him at the ZI if some SK wants to mooch some mitigation off him, but I don't promise he'll live.Stampede may well be really good, but Enchanters have had it since TSO. For a melee only buff, it should really have a shorter recast.</blockquote>/agree, dogdog is horrible now...it seems the dogdog dps and hps increase was not quite proportional to any other dps/hps increases game wide. So he's nearly worthless now:1) He dies a lot2) His DPS sucks now3) Aura of warding no longer does as much as it used to, proportionally4) and kind of related to the previous point: Aura of warding pales in comparison to Spiritual leadership...BIG TIME

ATTHWSM

04-06-2010, 11:32 PM

To begin guys, if your still working on Tox easy mode, or some BS first 3 in labs, your input doesnt apply. Im here for end game stuff, not group stuff, not soloing, so on so forth. Regarding CA's, no, in any situation where your really jousting in to knock out 5 CAs then jousting out, your dps is [Removed for Content] poor to begin with. What debuff routine are we talking about? You cast thema ll, and when there gone, you recast them, there isnt some grand scheme to it. Heal routine? 99% of the content your really only group warding and group healing unless youve got a tank, then spam singles if there up, its not a routine, its simply recasting when its up. Secondly, if your in all TSO armor at this point, your input is ABSOLUTELY worthless right now, and if your beating your friends with said gear, then they are even more so, sir.The DOG, dies on just about every named in palace, and every hard mode mob will kill your dog, regardless of whether you joust it or not, thanks.Stampede is the biggest dps boost for melee in the game, NOTHING accounts for more % dps than that spell, so thanks again for that. Cure proc on dog? Honestly how much are you curing in SF ? honestly, not anywhere near enough for your dog to cure sir.Come on guys, this is pie,Rage, does kinda suck with how easy DA is now, not a big deal though. Stuff happens with old gear and new xpacs. TAP is still awesome, and i can see why they upped the reuse with all the reuse gear, mines at just over 6 minutes now, cant imagine if it had the base 5 minute recast still.I love Pie.

Hene

04-07-2010, 02:37 AM

<cite>ATTHWSM wrote:</cite><blockquote>To begin guys, if your still working on Tox easy mode, or some BS first 3 in labs, your input doesnt apply. Im here for end game stuff, not group stuff, not soloing, so on so forth. </blockquote>Good for you. I'm glad you consider content that you don't care about unimportant, grats. Also, way to keep an open mind about other people and overall game balance.<cite>ATTHWSM wrote:</cite><blockquote>Regarding CA's, no, in any situation where your really jousting in to knock out 5 CAs then jousting out, your dps is [Removed for Content] poor to begin with. What debuff routine are we talking about? You cast thema ll, and when there gone, you recast them, there isnt some grand scheme to it. Heal routine? 99% of the content your really only group warding and group healing unless youve got a tank, then spam singles if there up, its not a routine, its simply recasting when its up. Secondly, if your in all TSO armor at this point, your input is ABSOLUTELY worthless right now, and if your beating your friends with said gear, then they are even more so, sir.</blockquote>Well, considering this templar is in SF gear, I'd say its actually an accomplishment, tbh.I LOL@ the fact that you get beat by templars or defilers, what do you parse? like 6k?hahaha and I just noticed, you're in Burz's guild! I WILL [Removed for Content] if you actually get beat on the parse by burz i have to ask him, I beat him with my good-for-nothing mystic, in TSO gear!!!But I tend to cure and debuff and spot heal and spot ward and buff and do some CAs and keep wards up on the OT when i'm in his group.....tbh, the CA's are a LOT nicer to fit in to all that as opposed to spells. I can see how with 100% casting speed would make spells a lot less painful (and 100% crit would make them awesome damage wise), but I still like meleeing because of the near instant casting speedI'd say the overall point is that even when you're sqeezing practcally all you can (heal-wise and debuff-wise) out of your mystic, with melee abilities you can still put out some moderate dps.<cite>ATTHWSM wrote:</cite><blockquote>Stampede is the biggest dps boost for melee in the game, NOTHING accounts for more % dps than that spell, so thanks again for that. </blockquote>When it is up it does amazing dps, but it is up only ~8-16% of the time. So while it may add 40%, over time that averages out to 3-6% dps. Kick butt proc I agree, but that only affects melee, with the primary advantage to fast-casting and fast-attacking scouts. I see Blade Chimes do at least 3% all the time.....not to mention bane warding used to do four times that much in TSO, granted it was only on the tank, it was still a massive DPS addition. And is stampede outparsing peace of mind for your group? What if you have 3 melee and 3 casters?<cite>ATTHWSM wrote:</cite> <blockquote>Cure proc on dog? Honestly how much are you curing in SF ? honestly, not anywhere near enough for your dog to cure sir.Come on guys, this is pie,Rage, does kinda suck with how easy DA is now, not a big deal though. Stuff happens with old gear and new xpacs. TAP is still awesome, and i can see why they upped the reuse with all the reuse gear, mines at just over 6 minutes now, cant imagine if it had the base 5 minute recast still.I love Pie.</blockquote> So then why would you care about the dog dying if it doesn't need to cure, and its ward isn't anything to write home about?But I agre on rage, the proc itself sucks now, but SL makes up for it

Banditman

04-07-2010, 09:47 AM

Gahnand

04-07-2010, 01:42 PM

<cite>ATTHWSM wrote:</cite><blockquote>I love Pie.</blockquote>Rage more in official forums, anon.