Adventure Class Reset [Archive] - EQ2 Forum Archive @ EQ2Wire

Jrral

03-26-2010, 04:13 AM

<cite>illaria wrote:</cite><blockquote>There is a way to reset tradeskill class is there a way we can reset our adventure class. For example, my assassin would become a plate healer most likely.</blockquote>It's probably in the works, but it's not quite as simple as it sounds. Tradeskill was originally designed as an "add-on" attribute of a character. It's literally just an enumeration field in the character data, different tradeskill classes don't really affect the character data file's format. Adventure class, OTOH, was originally so hard-wired into things that different classes literally had different formats for the relevant parts of the character data file. The original pairs you could swap between were accounted for in the formats, but to change outside those pairs would literally involve deleting the character data and recreating the data file in the correct format. You can imagine all the things that could go wrong there that'd result in you ending up with a naked character (or worse, no character at all). The devs are probably working on that, but until they've got it down to where it's utterly and completely bullet-proof and lossage-proof you aren't going to hear a peep out of them about it.Even beyond that there're some logistical problems. If you reset character level to 1, what happens to quests? If you reset them, some of those quests aren't in game anymore and people may have a problem with losing all those. And rewards would have to be removed too, see again quests that aren't in game and whose rewards can't be gotten again. But if you don't reset them you create a massive problem for levelling, factions etc.. And there's collections, which have similar problems with some not existing anymore. There's also discovery locations. All those sorts of things have to be worked out first before class changing will work right. I don't envy whoever gets that job.So I figure we won't be seeing the ability to change adventure classes any time soon.

Oxie

03-26-2010, 10:29 AM

<cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'd be in favor of it, but most likely it would be a station cash potion.</blockquote>We don't have to pay Station Cash to switch out crafting choice, so why should we have to pay for an adventuring choice change?

Lortet

03-26-2010, 10:40 AM

While no game breaker, I have some crafters of adventure types I no longer wish to play (or their counterparts via betrayal). I would love to access some more characters but don't want to sacrifice the tradeskilling.What about (MUST be within the same account) transfer of tradeskill to another character? - if the above poster is correct on tradeskill being an "add-on" only.

Eveningsong

03-26-2010, 12:31 PM

<cite>Hykaree@Runnyeye wrote:</cite><blockquote>While no game breaker, I have some crafters of adventure types I no longer wish to play (or their counterparts via betrayal). I would love to access some more characters but don't want to sacrifice the tradeskilling.What about (MUST be within the same account) transfer of tradeskill to another character? - if the above poster is correct on tradeskill being an "add-on" only.</blockquote>For many of us crafters, our tradeskills are actually more character-central than our adventuring class, so that wouldn't actually help the situation where someone has levelled a character in tradeskill but really hates their adventuring class. Personally I have at least one character where I'd be very happy to be able to begin again as an adventurer if I could keep my tradeskills.However, when tradeskills are changed, you actually keep the equivalent level of your previous skill if I recall correctly, and just lose all recipes. I'm not sure that that is necessarily desirable with adventuring, but it would certainly be reasonable for adventurers to expect to be treated equally with tradeskillers. But keeping AAs and resetting to level 1, as someone else suggested, may be a decent compromise. After all, in real life people change careers all the time. You don't suddenly lose that previous knowledge (in fact, it often helps in your new career), but you do need some time to master the skills of your new profession.

Freliant

03-26-2010, 12:37 PM

How about this: An item, lets call it, Gem of transference, that when you use on your main character, resets your characters crafting. You put the item in the shared bank, and use it on the level 1 character of your choice, and upon use, you get all your crafting levels of your character that got reset.There you have it, a clean character at the level you want with the crafting skills you want.

Amphibia

03-26-2010, 12:46 PM

<cite>Eugam wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Buneary wrote:</cite><blockquote>as long as AA pts dont get reset to 0!reset adventure class but keep all AA pts!</blockquote>Biggest exploit ever <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" /> Will never happen.To reset an adventurer (level 1 with 0 finished adv. quests and 0 AA) and keep the crafter sounds reasonable. I d do that and i d pay a small fee at SC for it if necessary.</blockquote>Eh. The problem with this is that most quests aren't repeatable, nor is the discovery AA etc. Resetting AA levels to 0 is a horrible idea, and make such a feature completely worthless.

Odys

03-26-2010, 01:49 PM

I would use it for my 50ish fury that i keep only as a cook.The only problem would be to reset all the factions but tradeskill one, and all the quests but the tradeskill ones.

Grumble69

03-26-2010, 01:56 PM

<cite>Freliant wrote:</cite><blockquote>How about this: An item, lets call it, Gem of transference, that when you use on your main character, resets your characters crafting. You put the item in the shared bank, and use it on the level 1 character of your choice, and upon use, you get all your crafting levels of your character that got reset.There you have it, a clean character at the level you want with the crafting skills you want.</blockquote>That's the solution imo. Someone in my guild deleted his 80WS just so he could play a new class. That's a bit harsh imo.I'm willing to redo everything from scratch--AAs, quests, harvesting, recipes, factions, and even the faction recipes. But I really would like to have a way to keep my TS level. A fair amount of work went into it.

dreamfordaylig

03-26-2010, 02:00 PM

Definitely something I would like to see in some form or another.

Rahatmattata

03-26-2010, 03:10 PM

<cite>Ruckus@Unrest wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'd be in favor of it, but most likely it would be a station cash potion.</blockquote>We don't have to pay Station Cash to switch out crafting choice, so why should we have to pay for an adventuring choice change?</blockquote>Because there was no station cash when they implemented the crafting reset quest. Notice how changing your race isn't a quest, it's a potion you buy with real cash. You may be right... it would be kind of silly to do a quest in game to change what race you are. Maybe if you are doing quests for <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josef_Mengele" target="_blank">Dr. Mengele</a> it would make some sense... I just think it would probably be a station cash item.

Rahatmattata

03-26-2010, 03:12 PM

<cite>Jrral@Unrest wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>illaria wrote:</cite><blockquote>There is a way to reset tradeskill class is there a way we can reset our adventure class. For example, my assassin would become a plate healer most likely.</blockquote>It's probably in the works, but it's not quite as simple as it sounds. Tradeskill was originally designed as an "add-on" attribute of a character. It's literally just an enumeration field in the character data, different tradeskill classes don't really affect the character data file's format. Adventure class, OTOH, was originally so hard-wired into things that different classes literally had different formats for the relevant parts of the character data file. The original pairs you could swap between were accounted for in the formats, but to change outside those pairs would literally involve deleting the character data and recreating the data file in the correct format. You can imagine all the things that could go wrong there that'd result in you ending up with a naked character (or worse, no character at all). The devs are probably working on that, but until they've got it down to where it's utterly and completely bullet-proof and lossage-proof you aren't going to hear a peep out of them about it.Even beyond that there're some logistical problems. If you reset character level to 1, what happens to quests? If you reset them, some of those quests aren't in game anymore and people may have a problem with losing all those. And rewards would have to be removed too, see again quests that aren't in game and whose rewards can't be gotten again. But if you don't reset them you create a massive problem for levelling, factions etc.. And there's collections, which have similar problems with some not existing anymore. There's also discovery locations. All those sorts of things have to be worked out first before class changing will work right. I don't envy whoever gets that job.So I figure we won't be seeing the ability to change adventure classes any time soon.</blockquote>Simple, don't reset quests. Just roll back the adventure level and change the class. We already know these 2 things are possible as there are mobs in the game that de-level you, items in the game that temporarily level you up, and you can betray to another class.You're AA can either get reset or not. If it gets reset and you've already done most of the content in the game, you simply have to grind mobs to level up adventure and AA level.

Nooblet

03-26-2010, 03:26 PM

Why the reset to zero? Seems a bit harsh and considering you are going to be relegated to combat leveling solely as quests will not be repeatable . .. ouchSeems reasonable to say reset to 10 levels below your current so that you would at least have to play the toon for 10 levels would be sufficient.I think some people might use it but how many? difficult to say. I think there are a good number of people that dont want to lose all their master abilities either, same thing which keeps many from betraying to begin with.

Rahatmattata

03-26-2010, 03:34 PM

<cite>Nooblet wrote:</cite><blockquote>Why the reset to zero? Seems a bit harsh and considering you are going to be relegated to combat leveling solely as quests will not be repeatable . .. ouchSeems reasonable to say reset to 10 levels below your current so that you would at least have to play the toon for 10 levels would be sufficient.That might work too.I think some people might use it but how many? difficult to say. I think there are a good number of people that dont want to lose all their master abilities either, same thing which keeps many from betraying to begin with.For example, I have a level 70 defiler I never play. I don't care about losing my masters because I have no desire to play the character anymore. I've done to speak as a dragon, a lot of heritage quests, and other tedious content I don't care to do again. It would be nice if I could change his class to something I'd enjoy playing without having to do the tedious quests again. Many people would say you should have to do all the tedious questing again, and that's their opinion. I disagree and think it would be nice to be able to reset. And of course there is the losing a high level tradeskiller thing.</blockquote>

illaria

03-26-2010, 04:03 PM

If I had to use a "transference gem" to give my tradeskill abilities to another toon, I would.But I would far prefer to keep the character as many of my crafters partcicipated in world events as low level adventurers and just reset adventure class.I would also prefer it as an in game mechanic but would be willing to spend station cash if it meant keeping some of my characters.

Wingrider01

03-26-2010, 04:56 PM

<cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Jrral@Unrest wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>illaria wrote:</cite><blockquote>There is a way to reset tradeskill class is there a way we can reset our adventure class. For example, my assassin would become a plate healer most likely.</blockquote>It's probably in the works, but it's not quite as simple as it sounds. Tradeskill was originally designed as an "add-on" attribute of a character. It's literally just an enumeration field in the character data, different tradeskill classes don't really affect the character data file's format. Adventure class, OTOH, was originally so hard-wired into things that different classes literally had different formats for the relevant parts of the character data file. The original pairs you could swap between were accounted for in the formats, but to change outside those pairs would literally involve deleting the character data and recreating the data file in the correct format. You can imagine all the things that could go wrong there that'd result in you ending up with a naked character (or worse, no character at all). The devs are probably working on that, but until they've got it down to where it's utterly and completely bullet-proof and lossage-proof you aren't going to hear a peep out of them about it.Even beyond that there're some logistical problems. If you reset character level to 1, what happens to quests? If you reset them, some of those quests aren't in game anymore and people may have a problem with losing all those. And rewards would have to be removed too, see again quests that aren't in game and whose rewards can't be gotten again. But if you don't reset them you create a massive problem for levelling, factions etc.. And there's collections, which have similar problems with some not existing anymore. There's also discovery locations. All those sorts of things have to be worked out first before class changing will work right. I don't envy whoever gets that job.So I figure we won't be seeing the ability to change adventure classes any time soon.</blockquote>Simple, don't reset quests. Just roll back the adventure level and change the class. We already know these 2 things are possible as there are mobs in the game that de-level you, items in the game that temporarily level you up, and you can betray to another class.You're AA can either get reset or not. If it gets reset and you've already done most of the content in the game, you simply have to grind mobs to level up adventure and AA level.</blockquote>roll it all back to level 9, just like they do in tradeskills, but retain the completed quest log.

ShinGoku

03-26-2010, 05:00 PM

I really don't see a problem with this idea but if it were to be done, they should empty out your completed journal and let you start from scratch. Either that or if its going to be a paid for change rather than quested, let us keep our AA etc.I'm surprised there haven't been more trolls complaining about how fast it is to level a toon anyways etc <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

denmom

03-26-2010, 06:24 PM

<cite>Wingrider01 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Jrral@Unrest wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>illaria wrote:</cite><blockquote>There is a way to reset tradeskill class is there a way we can reset our adventure class. For example, my assassin would become a plate healer most likely.</blockquote>It's probably in the works, but it's not quite as simple as it sounds. Tradeskill was originally designed as an "add-on" attribute of a character. It's literally just an enumeration field in the character data, different tradeskill classes don't really affect the character data file's format. Adventure class, OTOH, was originally so hard-wired into things that different classes literally had different formats for the relevant parts of the character data file. The original pairs you could swap between were accounted for in the formats, but to change outside those pairs would literally involve deleting the character data and recreating the data file in the correct format. You can imagine all the things that could go wrong there that'd result in you ending up with a naked character (or worse, no character at all). The devs are probably working on that, but until they've got it down to where it's utterly and completely bullet-proof and lossage-proof you aren't going to hear a peep out of them about it.Even beyond that there're some logistical problems. If you reset character level to 1, what happens to quests? If you reset them, some of those quests aren't in game anymore and people may have a problem with losing all those. And rewards would have to be removed too, see again quests that aren't in game and whose rewards can't be gotten again. But if you don't reset them you create a massive problem for levelling, factions etc.. And there's collections, which have similar problems with some not existing anymore. There's also discovery locations. All those sorts of things have to be worked out first before class changing will work right. I don't envy whoever gets that job.So I figure we won't be seeing the ability to change adventure classes any time soon.</blockquote>Simple, don't reset quests. Just roll back the adventure level and change the class. We already know these 2 things are possible as there are mobs in the game that de-level you, items in the game that temporarily level you up, and you can betray to another class.You're AA can either get reset or not. If it gets reset and you've already done most of the content in the game, you simply have to grind mobs to level up adventure and AA level.</blockquote>roll it all back to level 9, just like they do in tradeskills, but retain the completed quest log.</blockquote>It's far easier to roll back a crafter to L9 than it is an adventure toon.Crafters are all the same class/type from levels 1-9. They're all Artisans. From there you can repick what class you want to be, Outfitter, Craftsman, Scholar, and from there the sub-class.Adventurers don't have this commonality. They're Scout, Mage, Fighter, or Priest. You can't simply roll back to L9 for any of the classes and restart. Totally different mechanics.

Rahatmattata

03-26-2010, 06:57 PM

<cite>Pheep@Unrest wrote:</cite><blockquote>They're Scout, Mage, Fighter, or Priest. You can't simply roll back to L9 for any of the classes and restart. Totally different mechanics.</blockquote>It's obviously possible to change your level and class. Your character's level changes when you get enough xp, and changes class when the character betrays. You can even possess other creatures and use their abilities, and furies (for example) can give one of their spells to another class (I realize this isn't the same as changing classes, but I give these two examples to illustrate the robustness of the game engine and/or database to have the ability to change character sheet data). If it is possible to switch from an assassin to a ranger it is possible to switch from an assassin to a paladin, unless there is some crazy code problem that would prevent it, which none of us in this thread would know.

Grumble69

03-26-2010, 08:07 PM

One of the reasons I'd like to see a complete reset is that I don't want it to remember my AAs (or lack of). I wasted a TON of discovery AA by running my low level crafters around on various quests.

denmom

03-26-2010, 08:14 PM

<cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Pheep@Unrest wrote:</cite><blockquote>They're Scout, Mage, Fighter, or Priest. You can't simply roll back to L9 for any of the classes and restart. Totally different mechanics.</blockquote>It's obviously possible to change your level and class. Your character's level changes when you get enough xp, and changes class when the character betrays. You can even possess other creatures and use their abilities, and furies (for example) can give one of their spells to another class (I realize this isn't the same as changing classes, but I give these two examples to illustrate the robustness of the game engine and/or database to have the ability to change character sheet data). If it is possible to switch from an assassin to a ranger it is possible to switch from an assassin to a paladin, unless there is some crazy code problem that would prevent it, which none of us in this thread would know.</blockquote>True.I remember at launch the quest you could do on the Isle of Refuge to see which you want to be, Scout, Mage, Fighter, or Priest. If one wasn't to your liking, you could tell the NPC and he'd offer you the other three to try until you settled on what you wanted.The four archetypes had the same attacks and abilities until L10. As in all Scouts had the same for their class, and so on.Then the progression was taken out and what we have currently put in, where you don't have to go thru the whole class to subclass headache to test out a class.Anyhow, maybe this can be brought back, I dunno. But the mechanics were there at one time.

Wingrider01

03-27-2010, 09:03 AM

<cite>ShinGoku wrote:</cite><blockquote>I really don't see a problem with this idea but if it were to be done, they should empty out your completed journal and let you start from scratch. Either that or if its going to be a paid for change rather than quested, let us keep our AA etc.I'm surprised there haven't been more trolls complaining about how fast it is to level a toon anyways etc <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></blockquote>this ability already exists

Katz

03-27-2010, 10:33 AM

I had a friend that deleted a level 80 alchemist because he didn't like the adventure class. Me, I wouldn't do that, no way I'm grinding up crafting on a toon more than once. I'll just leave them unplayed on the adventure side if I find I don't like the class. I'd love someway to not lose the crafting level of toons.

snowli

03-28-2010, 08:00 AM

Main account has 4 high level crafters I don't want to adventure with and 3 adventurers I haven't crafted with - the transference of the crafting class would be excellant.I guess it really comes down to SoE's estimation of what creates more cashflow:<ul><li>either freeing "alt" slots from crafters people don't want to delete improves the longevity of the subscription by increasing played classes for a person</li><li>or the current situation produces more revenue in those who fill up spaces and use second accounts, or use xfer tokens etc to help the problem, or choose station accounts for more slots.</li></ul>

Chakos

03-28-2010, 08:58 AM

I definitely think resetting adventure class to 1 while retaining all earned AA would be a HUGE mistake. If the argument is to be able to retain crafting level, I do agree with that -- the transference gem idea is a great one.If allowed to do it by others means, meaning existing toon dropped to level 1 adventure level rather than a transference gem used on a new toon, then AA would need to be reset to zero as well as resetting at least the quest journals so that they can be redone for AA. Disco xp I dont necessarily feel should be reset, it would just be a sacrifice you make in order to have changed your class without having rerolled a toon.Comparisons to resetting tradeskill level are moot, as the comparison is not the same on any level: if you were to reset a max level crafter, you would be restarting at level 9 with ALL recipes learned now stripped -- even ones common amongst ALL craft classes that you had already learned -- all your advanced countering techniques reset to the lowest skill levels. The only thing remaining is your faction gains -- which you should also retain, if adventure reset were allowed. As far as quests go, quests you had done in the past are now repeatable (the tradeskill tiered harvesting quest for books, for example, though I cannot confirm the high tiers ones such as Proof of the Pudding), so I imagine it would be fairly simple to remove the completed quest flags from a reset adventuring toon, as well.

Wingrider01

03-28-2010, 09:08 AM

from one of the other multiple posts on this exact same subject that has been responded to by SOE in multiple threads, as per an example in this thread by Grimwell. Time has oassed but suspect the reasoning is still 100 oercent on<a rel="nofollow" href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?start=165&topic_id=366561" target="_blank">http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...topic_id=366561</a>Grimwell wrote:So I looked into the "Why can't we reset our adventure class back to 1?" question, because in the perspective of a dedicated tradeskiller who does not like their adv. class it's a very valid question. The answer is that there is no clean way to nuke an adventure class without risking the destruction of the character record. Adventure class is tied to sooooooo many different things, that it's essentially untouchable in terms of a class change. Tradeskill classes were much easier because they aren't tied to a lot of other things. So sorry guys, while it's interesting as an idea, and I can definitely see how the tradeskill population would benefit from it specifically, adventure class reset is just not on the table.and hereCopy/Paste/Delete works fine in my little world of writing updates for the EQ2Players website, but it does not work so easily in a DB with character records. Sorry, I can see the logic of the suggestion (and something I talked to Scott about when I dug into the idea of adventure class reset with the team), and it's just not an easy/clean operation like that.numerous ohter replys in that thread also concerning this exact discussion

Rahatmattata

03-28-2010, 01:59 PM

<cite>Wingrider01 wrote:</cite><blockquote>The answer is that there is no clean way to nuke an adventure class without risking the destruction of the character record. Adventure class is tied to sooooooo many different things, that it's essentially untouchable in terms of a class change.</blockquote>It's weird he (Grimwell) says this, but it's obviously quite possible to change your adventure class. Oh well, whatever.

Jrral

03-28-2010, 03:39 PM

<cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wingrider01 wrote:</cite><blockquote>The answer is that there is no clean way to nuke an adventure class without risking the destruction of the character record. Adventure class is tied to sooooooo many different things, that it's essentially untouchable in terms of a class change.</blockquote>It's weird he (Grimwell) says this, but it's obviously quite possible to change your adventure class. Oh well, whatever.</blockquote>No, it's not possible (currently) except for the specific pairs that the code was originally designed to allow for. It's easy to do something the code already allows for, but not so easy to do something the code was designed not to allow for.

illaria

03-28-2010, 04:27 PM

At one point we were also told it was impossible to change race and they got around that snag, I am hoping they will get around this snag at one point.

Rahatmattata

03-29-2010, 03:36 AM

It's definitely possible. It would be possible to re-code the entire game from scratch. It's just a matter of is it worth implementing considering the time it would take to redesign whatever it is that would need to be redesigned.

Wingrider01

03-29-2010, 08:06 AM

<cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote>It's definitely possible. It would be possible to re-code the entire game from scratch. It's just a matter of is it worth implementing considering the time it would take to redesign whatever it is that would need to be redesigned.</blockquote>redesign for thos single issue would be a very poor ROI from a business standpoint, unless the cost sits are around 75.00 - 100.00 US per change.

Wingrider01

03-29-2010, 08:07 AM

<cite>illaria wrote:</cite><blockquote>At one point we were also told it was impossible to change race and they got around that snag, I am hoping they will get around this snag at one point.</blockquote>race is not tied into any of the items listed, race means nothing as compared to adventure class

Wingrider01

03-29-2010, 08:10 AM

<cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wingrider01 wrote:</cite><blockquote>The answer is that there is no clean way to nuke an adventure class without risking the destruction of the character record. Adventure class is tied to sooooooo many different things, that it's essentially untouchable in terms of a class change.</blockquote>It's weird he (Grimwell) says this, but it's obviously quite possible to change your adventure class. Oh well, whatever.</blockquote>really it is? Only class change I know of is within the same archtype just good to evil or evil to good. Have never seen it shown where you can change outside of the archtype. There is a major difference between archtype (sk to pally, necro to conjuror) then changing the class type - conhuror to wizard or warden or gaurdian

Iamken

03-29-2010, 09:57 AM

The only acceptable way to do this in my opinion is to reset all attributes except crafting information. If you have done rare quests that are no longer in game but want to keep credit for them, then simply do not reset your adventure level. It needs to be an all or nothing deal on the adventure side.

Rahatmattata

03-29-2010, 03:15 PM

<cite>Wingrider01 wrote:</cite><blockquote>There is a major difference between archtype (sk to pally, necro to conjuror) then changing the class type - conhuror to wizard or warden or gaurdian</blockquote>Not really. You just think switching classes within the same subclass is easier because a shadowknight is kinda like a paladin and a necromancer is kinda like a conjuror. But if you actually switch classes when you betray you get an entirely different set of abilities, the gear you can equip changes, and even your factions change. The same things that would need to happen no matter what class you switch to.Anyway, what they probably did was make us all a subclass, and when we betray we aren't really changing classes. So we are all warriors, bards, clerics, sorcerers, etc. and our characters have the abilities and properties of both classes. When we betray they turn on one set of abilities and properties and assign the other set to null/off. This would explain why I sometimes see the subclass of players in my group window when the UI bugs out. So we aren't actually changing classes at all, and our characters are hauling around enough data for two classes. That is my guess. If this is how the characters are designed it would be quite funny if there was a bug that when you betray one class didn't get shut off.

d1anaw

03-29-2010, 03:53 PM

Walford

03-29-2010, 04:01 PM

What about this?1. Player makes a request to change adventure class on their crafting character (on Antonia Bayle, for example). Request is approved or denied.2. Sony allows player to CREATE a new character (any race gender combo they like) of the selected ADVENTURE CLASS on a designated server ( like the TEST server ). 3. Player informs CS when completed (providing payment). CS moves the unwanted char from Antonia Bayle to a storage place. Any housing , gear, items or money they have is lost. (Storage chars are deleted after 2-3 months)4. CS then matches the TRADESKILL quests, skills and level, AND matches harvesting, transmuting and tinkering skills.5. CS does server transfer of player's new ADVENTURER/CRAFTER to Antonia Bayle, and player can resume play.This would represent a serious cost to folks... Mostly from the lost AA which is not addressed here, but maybe SOE could sweeten the pot on it's end in some way to entice people with more AA to use it. Everyone has theire own ideas about the value of things in MMOs. /shrugI am not sure how easy it would be to give people their housing or items back on a new char, so I assumed that it would not take place. It would obviously not be my preference, but it might help keep the price of the service reasonable.CanulNB: I do not play on TEST and have never transferred a char.

d1anaw

03-29-2010, 04:02 PM

<cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Wingrider01 wrote:</cite><blockquote>There is a major difference between archtype (sk to pally, necro to conjuror) then changing the class type - conhuror to wizard or warden or gaurdian</blockquote>Not really. You just think switching classes within the same subclass is easier because a shadowknight is kinda like a paladin and a necromancer is kinda like a conjuror. But if you actually switch classes when you betray you get an entirely different set of abilities, the gear you can equip changes, and even your factions change. The same things that would need to happen no matter what class you switch to.Anyway, what they probably did was make us all a subclass, and when we betray we aren't really changing classes. So we are all warriors, bards, clerics, sorcerers, etc. and our characters have the abilities and properties of both classes. When we betray they turn on one set of abilities and properties and assign the other set to null/off. This would explain why I sometimes see the subclass of players in my group window when the UI bugs out. So we aren't actually changing classes at all, and our characters are hauling around enough data for two classes. That is my guess. If this is how the characters are designed it would be quite funny if there was a bug that when you betray one class didn't get shut off.</blockquote>I would be ok with maintaining the same archetype until/unless they find a way to change that. Clearly it is possible, as it is with the betrayal quest. Start with remaining in the same archetype and then maybe work on a way to change that for those who want to ultimately do that.

Reapicheap

03-29-2010, 04:15 PM

<cite>d1anaw wrote:</cite><blockquote>I would be ok with maintaining the same archetype until/unless they find a way to change that. Clearly it is possible, as it is with the betrayal quest. Start with remaining in the same archetype and then maybe work on a way to change that for those who want to ultimately do that.</blockquote>Anyone wishing to discuss the technical feasibility of this suggestion, please read the above BOLDED, ITALICIZED and UNDERLINED statement. You can already change your adventuring class with reliability and ease just doing Betrayal. It should be NO HARDER to make the option available to anyone who wishes to pay for it.

Grumble69

03-29-2010, 04:19 PM

I definitely am not going to pay for it.

Rahatmattata

03-29-2010, 04:21 PM

Reapicheap

03-29-2010, 04:32 PM

<cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote>Maybe we aren't really changing classes when we betray.</blockquote>Go on...

Rahatmattata

03-29-2010, 04:35 PM

<cite>Reapicheap@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote>Maybe we aren't really changing classes when we betray.</blockquote>Go on...</blockquote><a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?start=0&topic_id=475003#5286504" target="_blank">This</a>Second paragraph.

Jrral

03-29-2010, 05:19 PM

<cite>Reapicheap@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote>Maybe we aren't really changing classes when we betray.</blockquote>Go on...</blockquote>Consider this: the technical names are in fact archetype, class and sub-class. So a berserker and a guardian are the same archetype (Fighter) and the same class (Warrior), they differ only in the sub-class (Berserker vs. Guardian). And you can only change your sub-class via betrayal, you can't change your class or archetype. I'd bet that archetype and class determine the layout of character data, while sub-class is just a flag field and doesn't affect data layout. Which would match with what I've heard from devs that the code accomodates the betrayal pairs but changing class outside those pairs gets a lot more complicated and involves the character data format.

Wingrider01

03-29-2010, 05:20 PM

<cite>Reapicheap@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>d1anaw wrote:</cite><blockquote>I would be ok with maintaining the same archetype until/unless they find a way to change that. Clearly it is possible, as it is with the betrayal quest. Start with remaining in the same archetype and then maybe work on a way to change that for those who want to ultimately do that.</blockquote>Anyone wishing to discuss the technical feasibility of this suggestion, please read the above BOLDED, ITALICIZED and UNDERLINED statement. You can already change your adventuring class with reliability and ease just doing Betrayal. It should be NO HARDER to make the option available to anyone who wishes to pay for it.</blockquote>sorry you are wrong, in the betrayal you are changing ARCHTYPE NOT CLASS, you betray to what is available in the current archtype you do not betray to a difference CLASS.Archtypeconjuror, necropaladin,shadowknightwarden,furyClasswarriorWardenfuryyou also expect them to convert every piece of armor you have, your weapons, your skills, etc also? don't forget that minor issue also - oh what about the class specific mounts? Like the RIM faction mounts, different class type, different mount is normally chosen. Personally selected two different mounts between my caster classes and the melee classes. whne you start thinking about it, the change class starts as a pebble rolling down the snow covered hill and ends up as a snowball taller then the empire state building when you put in all the variables that need to be considered

Wingrider01

03-29-2010, 05:22 PM

<cite>Jrral@Unrest wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Reapicheap@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Rahatmattata wrote:</cite><blockquote>Maybe we aren't really changing classes when we betray.</blockquote>Go on...</blockquote>Consider this: the technical names are in fact archetype, class and sub-class. So a berserker and a guardian are the same archetype (Fighter) and the same class (Warrior), they differ only in the sub-class (Berserker vs. Guardian). And you can only change your sub-class via betrayal, you can't change your class or archetype. I'd bet that archetype and class determine the layout of character data, while sub-class is just a flag field and doesn't affect data layout. Which would match with what I've heard from devs that the code accomodates the betrayal pairs but changing class outside those pairs gets a lot more complicated and involves the character data format.</blockquote>give th man(or woman) a kewpie doll, suspect they have just hit in the head in the first try. If I recall correctly it iwas what has been posted prior on all the other requests for this exact same thing.

Reapicheap

03-29-2010, 06:18 PM

<cite>Wingrider01 wrote:</cite><blockquote>sorry you are wrong, in the betrayal you are changing ARCHTYPE NOT CLASS, you betray to what is available in the current archtype you do not betray to a difference CLASS.you also expect them to convert every piece of armor you have, your weapons, your skills, etc also? don't forget that minor issue also - oh what about the class specific mounts? Like the RIM faction mounts, different class type, different mount is normally chosen. Personally selected two different mounts between my caster classes and the melee classes. whne you start thinking about it, the change class starts as a pebble rolling down the snow covered hill and ends up as a snowball taller then the empire state building when you put in all the variables that need to be considered</blockquote>Badly designed database structures not withstanding, there still shouldn't be a reason these entries can't be poked. Regardless of calling it a class or archetype, the database shouldn't require more than a couple pokes and prods to get it working properly.And obviously not. Don't be stupid. If you armor doesn't conform to your new class and level (which it probably won't unless you're wearing Level 1 Cloth) then I expect it to be popped off and put in your bags to be either used at the appropriate level, transmuted, sold, or stored for nostalgia. I believe the idea of class specific <anything> and changing classes basically answers that question. And no, these considerations are purely part of your choice to change classes and a realization of how you will be losing nearly everything that you gained from being Class <X> when you change classes to Class <Y>. If you are unwilling to make that change, you shouldn't be changing classes.Realistically, people WON'T be leveling to 90 and then changing classes to do it all over again. People will piddle around to 20 or 30 and decide they don't like how the class plays, but be unwilling to delete/reroll, and thus just want to change their adventuring class, not necessarily their tradeskilling profession. Really, the idea that you wonder whether or not someone would be wanting to keep a ... what? Paladin mount? when they change to be a Necromancer? Really? Is that even a question or a concern? Or are you just throwing leaves in the wind hoping to obscure legitimate ideas and discussion? Please try not to bog the discussion down with useless banter that won't be considerations if such a change were made possible. You lose them. They're class specific. Deal with it or don't change classes. Moving on...