Ranger Loyalty?

[Saynd]

<p>I've seen COUNTLESS posts on how the Rangers are "fail" or that they are constantly overlooked or snubbed when fixes or changes are needed, much more than on any other class forum. So here is my question; "If Rangers are the truly this neglected and unwanted class that is portrayed by your forums posts, why are Rangers the fiercest and most loyal class that I have seen? I mean, if it was just a matter of lacking end game DPS, all Rangers would have betrayed by now. So for all of you veteran Rangers out there, help a new Ranger out, tell me what is so defining and interesting about this class that so many of you all are willing to stay the course, no matter how many hits you all keep taking. New Rangers could certainly use this information as not to be put off by the blanket negativity flowing from these forums. Thanks!</p>

[Belegaer]

<p>1)  Masochism</p><p>2)  When I'm just looking to kick back and do something on my own for awhile the ranger gives me the best / quickest option for killing world named, questing, etc.</p>

[Donilla]

<p>Because I believe that Rangers, and Scouts as well to some degree, are a choice of the heart, of the soul. You either like scouts or you don't. Take that play style to the end point and you have Rangers.  They take a while to learn to play well, and they have a distinct style of play, different from everyone else.  Playing with a bow is such a unique thing, that once chosen, it's hard to give up. I realize this is a simplification but it's suitable for this purpose, so lets NOT hear about melee and all that. Like myself, I belive many rangers in EQ2 were also rangers in other MMO's they've played, further showing it's a class instrinsic to your being.</p>

[Gaige]

<p><cite>Donilla@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Like myself, I belive many rangers in EQ2 were also rangers in other MMO's they've played, further showing it's a class instrinsic to your being.</p></blockquote><p>.....................................</p>

[Azrael_888]

<p>We're loyal cause we like to top parses.</p><p>Well we used to anyway.  Now we just argue with the devs to try and get that DPS back. </p><p>Deep down Im gonna bet about 90% of us are just drama queens with nothing better to do than to yell at sony for ruining a perfectly good DPS class.</p><p>lol have fun with that last staement. =)</p>

[Striikor]

<p>I just love the style of play for a ranger and /whispers (I really suck at my other toons)</p>

[Venez]

<p><cite>Saynd wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I've seen COUNTLESS posts on how the Rangers are "fail" or that they are constantly overlooked or snubbed when fixes or changes are needed, much more than on any other class forum. So here is my question; "If Rangers are the truly this neglected and unwanted class that is portrayed by your forums posts, why are Rangers the fiercest and most loyal class that I have seen? I mean, if it was just a matter of lacking end game DPS, all Rangers would have betrayed by now. <span style="color: #ff0000;">When Rangers in top raiding guilds start betraying to Assassins is when you will see less people playing Rangers and start switching to "other" toons. At this time I personally know of at least 4 Rangers from Avatar killing guilds, 5 from end game raid guilds that have already betrayed - plan on more.</span></p><p>So for all of you veteran Rangers out there, help a new Ranger out, tell me what is so defining and interesting about this class that so many of you all are willing to stay the course, no matter how many hits you all keep taking. New Rangers could certainly use this information as not to be put off by the blanket negativity flowing from these forums. Thanks!<span style="color: #ff0000;">All you new Rangers that play for fun will have no problems with solo content, casuel guild content. Might be hard to get pick up groups for .....certain instances. Dont make a Ranger atm with plans on joining a raid guild - it wont happen. Rangers where a blast to play when you used to be able to cast your CAs on the move, and when you had a legitimate chance at toping your raids parses. IMO they have gutted what a Ranger used to be and the "fun factor" is no longer there.</span></p></blockquote>

[Ixtril]

<p>It is largely a choice of heart for me.</p><p>I was a ranger in every other MMO I've played, albeit that was not nearly as many as some of you out there.</p><p>I feel less bond to the bow than others. I was a ranger in EQ1 where the class was much more melee oriented.</p><p>By chance or by accident, the EQ2 Ranger is an incredibly fun class to play. The kick-butt dps we had for a while was certainly a nice bonus.</p>

[Candoor]

<p>Ranger toon since Dec 2004.</p><p>I betrayed well over a year ago.</p><p>A few months in I outparsed my ranger comfortably but I really didnt enjoy the play style compared to ranger and my toon just didnt quite feel right even though the spike dps was fun.</p><p>So back to ranger I went with my guild up in arms and I wont betray back again - I will retire my toon instead.</p><p>Solo - easy stuff falls apart but tough stuff or anything at all in confined spaces? not by a long shot.  I can round up entire spider cave in JW on my SK and aoe the hell out of it and survive - SK solo'd yellow triple up nameds no problem and is able to get anywhere in non raid zones with FD / furor etc... (ps devs reading this - there are much more OP classes for solo than SK).</p><p>Ranger gets a few of unexpected under con adds and he dies or evacs <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p><p>Im lucky enough to have a guild that struggles a bit for numbers on raids hence I got a slot.   If that was not the case I can concentrate on my ghetto Illus, tank on my SK or when they are at a pinch for healers log my Warden.</p><p>But none of those would keep me playing for long - ranger play style is just my thing.</p><p>What it sounds like is happening to our class sucks balls frankly.   I remember being a complete God around DoF (pre nerf stream of arrows) and have seen the class seen chipped away every expansion since (thanks aerelik).     What was so wrong with miracle arrow the way it was?   What was sooo wrong with us being able to pull without getting social aggro - not like every single pet class cant do the same.   I actually was of some use on a raid then.</p><p>Its tough being loyal 4 plus years in a row when most of those you are completely ignored as a class and worse when the focus is on you they nerf you even more (tier appropriate arrowfix  pleads resulted in more auto attack nerfs).</p><p>Now our auto atk melee will do more dps than our ranged attacks but we cant use it because our procs work of ranged.</p><p>Also supposedly our auto atk on ranged has taken a major nose dive on beta - why !</p><p>Of course theres ae auto and flurry issue too.... oh and casting time of ca's being way high... low ca dmg...and..  /cry</p><p>Please Devs - after 4 years of degradation - fix rangers - we need to be serious DPS competition for Assn/Wiz/Warlock - currently we struggle with rogues / ench / conj and have absolutely no useful utility.</p>

[Mary the Prophetess]

<p>I am a Ranger by choice and by disposition.  I have played a Ranger in every MMO I have played, (and that is a lot).  I have played a Ranger in MMOs that didn't even have Rangers; specing my character out to be the most 'ranger-like' that the game mechanics permitted.</p><p>I play solo.  I always have.  It is a personal preferance.  Rangers are a solitary breed, and a very 'solo-friendly' class.</p><p>As for the Nerfs:</p><p>I've seen 'em come, and I've seen 'em go.  From being the god of DPS, to being the red-headed step child of DPS.</p><p>Improvise.  Adapt.  Overcome.</p><p>I am a Ranger.  I don't quit because my class got nerfed (again), I find new ways to do the same things.  I have in the past, I will now.</p><p>Since these changes mainly affect Raiding Rangers, I will let others with more knowledge in that area, discuss it.</p><p>But for a solo player, Rangers still have abundent tools:  Tracking, Stealth, Evac, Snares, Roots, and, (dare I say it), sufficient DPS to get me to lvl 80 on a PvP server.</p><p>So if your preference is raiding or grouping, perhaps a Ranger is not for you.  But for soloing or duoing, Rangers still 'lead the way'.</p>

[Carpediem]

<p><img src="http://images.clipartof.com/small/5813-Man-Chasing-A-Hotdog-On-A-Stick-Attached-To-His-Head-Clipart-Illustration.jpg" width="450" height="305" /></p>

[Lleren]

<p><cite>Gaige wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Donilla@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Like myself, I belive many rangers in EQ2 were also rangers in other MMO's they've played, further showing it's a class instrinsic to your being.</p></blockquote><p>.....................................</p></blockquote><p>There do seem to be a lot of those, not me though.</p><p>Rangers are absurdly popular for the amount of high end raid Representation we have.</p>

[Alenna]

<p>Why did I choose Ranger? Why do I keep hoping that the Devs will listen to those in the Ranger community that have been playing Rangers longer then I've been playing the game?</p><p>1. I am not a good Tank after getting a Gaurdian to level 50+ and not enjoying her because people expected to be able to MT groups when I had a OT or MA tank style which I was fine with I deleted her and played my 2nd toon I made about a month after I started the game my half-elf Ranger.</p><p>2. I think like a Ranger, as my brother noticed and pointed out to me when we were talking(skype(this was before the in game VC) while I was at the broker buying arrows for my Ranger, I looked at all 3 crafted arrows and choose the Fieldpoint when he asked me why when didn't do as good damage as a broadhead I said " if I don't hit I don't do damage and the fieldpoint has a better chance to hit." and he pointed out my thinking was good for ranger. He also did not let me get discourged when I was hearing about all the nerfs and how no one wanted Rangers or when I had trouble early on soloing her he noticed during our play that I was enjoying myself more with her then I ever did with my guardian tank. I love it when the fettering poisen procts and the mob slows down and dies just before getting to me with all those arrows in it. or that unlike the mages if the mob reaches me I finish the job with a few melees hits without worring that my chain armor will allow the mob to one hit me.</p><p>3. While I enjoy playing mages who are also ranged I love the idea of using a bow and other weapons not just spells.</p><p>4. The Ranger community is one of the best communities I've seen here, I would come here to the forum and ask about what AAs what diety, etc.. to help me get the most dps out of my ranger and you not only told me what but why so I could learn to think for myself.(I wish the Devs had of listened to you all)</p><p>5. I love being a Ranger, so much so that I switched from tailoring to woodworking on this toon so I could make my own arrows while making a little money on the side.</p><p>Given all that. I am having to make a decision I had hoped not to have to think about.</p><p>While I'm in a guild that allows you to raid if you want, and guildmates who will group with me and even have made me a project since I came back to the game after 8 months being away to get me geared up(T2 shard armor, Fabled epic, working on shard jewelry and mythic) because they know she's my main.  However I do not want to be begging my guildmates all the time to be able to play the way I love to play, working with others(whom I've come to think of as friends) towards a goal in a group or raid . I can solo and do but that is not my play style. I would like to be able to join the occasional PuG or PuR with the possibility of making new friends, which is very difficult if not impossible for a ranger.</p><p>So at the moment I'm debating whether to get my ranger to 90 adventure and tradeskill as quickly as possible then semi retire her and work on getting one of my other toons(a couple of whom I enjoy playing as well) to 90 as quickly as possible that has better dps, and/or utility(warlock, conji) or can heal on a dime(warden, fury) so I can have a toon for my prefered play style and not feel I'm begging for space on groups or Raids. Or continue hoping that the Devs will finaly listen to the Ranger community. Or I could just level all my toons tradeskills(which I enjoy doing when adventuring gets frustrating.) Until the Devs realize that People who love playing the ranger class are not experiencing as much of the content as they would like because they can't seem to understand that less dps and no utility does nothing to make a Class wanted by Groups and Raids.</p><p>So will I keep my ranger you bet I love the Ranger class and am an eternal optimist. Will she be my main toon as I hope. That remains to be seen and is up the the Devs.</p>

[Neiloch]

<p><cite>Donilla@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Like myself, I belive many rangers in EQ2 were also rangers in other MMO's they've played, further showing it's a class instrinsic to your being.</p></blockquote><p>This is more or less what I do. In Eq1, VG, FF11, guild wars and DDO I played a ranger. Hunter in WoW and Lotro.</p><p>I'll quit before I switch mains. And if they go down a road where rangers are better off using melee auto i'll quit then too.</p>

[Alenna]

<p><cite>Neiloch@Crushbone wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Donilla@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Like myself, I belive many rangers in EQ2 were also rangers in other MMO's they've played, further showing it's a class instrinsic to your being.</p></blockquote><p>This is more or less what I do. In Eq1, VG, FF11, guild wars and DDO I played a ranger. Hunter in WoW and Lotro.</p><p>I'll quit before I switch mains. And if they go down a road where rangers are better off using melee auto i'll quit then too.</p></blockquote><p>Looks like they've started down that road hopefully they will nt take a year to fix that.</p>

[Neiloch]

There's a lot of class mechanics that make it so the bow is still better. Melee weapons would have to do consistently more damage than bow, myth buff, offensive stance, makeshift arrows, and Focus Aim put together. Focus Aim because it debuffs melee and buffs ranged

[Striikor]

<p><cite>Neiloch@Crushbone wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>There's a lot of class mechanics that make it so the bow is still better. Melee weapons would have to do consistently more damage than bow, myth buff, offensive stance, makeshift arrows, and Focus Aim put together. Focus Aim because it debuffs melee and buffs ranged</blockquote><p>Hmmm are you forgetting all the procs and advantages you can get from melee weapons that you cannot get from ranged? Trigger FA and cancel, still get the best of the buff and get rid of the melee nerf. Also melee has improved as there is no longer a negative effect to slashing and peircing on offensive stance. I compared with myth and makeshift, defensive, offensive, FA and FA/Cancel. Better dps with melee. Just have to joust it even with the dummy to get int he ranged ca's. Course I might have better main and off hand than you do.</p>

[Neiloch]

<p><cite>Striikor@Nektulos wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Course I might have better main and off hand than you do.</p></blockquote><p>That's likely. This is again where I would like to know the devs intentions but they seem hell bent on not telling players their long term goals (not communicating) and have us kind of wait and see.</p><p>Either this will shift back to ranged being better and melee being better is because these were balanced before merges and new items 'should' be properly balanced for it, so the 'melee' might just be better in the interim. If it does end up being better anyway hopefully they fix it sooner rather than later.</p><p><strong>OR</strong> they plan on making us 'mix' the two or switch to melee outright in which case I will be quitting EQ2 and I won't give a crap what they do. Knowing SoE maybe they think people are betraying because they like the assassin play style better so they're converting rangers a little bit. Opposed to the reality Assassins are faring much better overall to make a lot of people even see past the playstyle and they're just a betrayal away.</p><p>Makes me think they didn't put in the default auto attack selector because rangers would be able to test out using melee so much easier and rangers would see this on a larger scale.</p><p>For now I'll just forgo switching ranged auto on and just let them go as they please and make sure I'm in range for melee if its trying to go off. Another way ranged still might be better though is using melee allows for more room for error due to distance. Done perfectly melee could do better but if mistakes are made, even very few, I wonder how it would turn out.</p><p>In the mean time every group I have done I have easily handed the rogues butt to them and in a lot of cases sorcerers and assassins which where I basically was at before.</p>