Transmuting for all? [Archive] - EQ2 Forum Archive @ EQ2Wire

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RandomStream

02-08-2010, 06:51 AM

Please give all existing toons Transmuting equal to their adventure level * 5 unless already higher All toons have been given Transmuting Skill of five (5) unless they already had a higher level. While this is fine for new toons and not too bad for very low level toons (less than 10) for other toons it is virtually no use. They often no longer have the NO TRADE items they acquired as they developed. They have to get new low level items to transmute either by acquiring them from other toons, who are low level, or by mentoring either themselves or other toons at a low level. I have tried various options to raise the level of my toon Oapel; but this process is slow and rather tedious. Probably the fastest way is to harvest rare raw materials, make mastercrafted items then transmute them. Please set the Transmuting skill of all existing toons to a level that is appropriate for their adventure level (level * 5 seems appropriate to me.) I am assuming you want most players to transmute a significant amount of the items they find but do not want so there is s steady supply of raw materials for making adornments. I think at the moment this is unlikely to happen. I, for one, don't want to replace my existing level 80 toons. And I don’t have the time to get the minimum of 370 low level (sub 75) items I need to get their transmuting skills up so they can transmute level 80 items. (Please adjust these numbers if read after Feb 16) Catin "I'm not ready for retirement" of Runnyeye

Whilhelmina

02-08-2010, 09:59 AM

You can use the mentoring system to go down and kill green mobs to drop chest. You can also use harvesting cloak and mara gear to boost your transmuting and bypass the need of farming T1 mobs from the start. It's way easier to level transmuting now so I don't feel the need for this change

Horgana

02-08-2010, 10:01 AM

Any exisiting transmuter will get converted to having adorning and transmuting skill of equivalent level, i.e 400 transmuter -> 400 transmuter, 400 adornerOnly those who do not already have the skill will get a skill of 5, and it's EASY to level up - automentor down, go to a level appropriate zone, mute the stuff that drops, rinse and repeat. It would probably take you no longer than say raising a harvesting skill from 5 to 400 (or 450) by running around norrath in level appropriate zones harvesting nodes.

Krinta

02-08-2010, 11:14 PM

Also the skill ups come much quicker now. Dont forget also you can stock up on things to transmute befor hand also.

NiamiDenMother

02-09-2010, 07:36 PM

Don't forget that you can harvest T1 zones, and turn the rares you get into mastercrafted gear to transmute, as well, if you don't feel like automentoring, etc. (The harvesting route also gives you spare resources to sell as well <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />)It truly is a much faster/saner process now.

RandomStream

02-10-2010, 06:36 AM

Thank you for your responses. I have clearly failed to make my point lucidly enough. I am assuming that SOE expect most of our toons be able to transmute anything they pick up or have saved. So they will provide a good supply of raw materials for Adorners. My point is the time and effort required to raise all of our existing high level toons to the point where they can do this will be too much trouble.Ok It's not fair on those who have worked the way up but....Catin, Master CarpenterEsric, Master ProvisionerMayol, Master WoodworkerKrez, Master SageQuehdo, Master SageKominac, Master AlchemistStonehammer, Master JewellerHuche, Master Armourer, Tinker 400Goldensword, Master TailorOh and I nearly forgotSkato, Master Weaponsmith, Transmuter 400 <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" />

Terreciel

02-10-2010, 07:23 AM

The current system requires anyone who wants to transmute to begin at lvl 1. How will the new system be a bigger disadvantage than the current system?If you decide to take up transmuting after reaching lvl 80 in either adventure or tradeskill, you still have to start by finding large quantities of low level items to transmute. In addition to this, merely converting these quantities of items to their component shards/powders/etc. will only level you to 100. After that, to level you must not only continue to acquire large numbers of items to break down but you must craft adornments--and you can only raise your skill by crafting weapon adornments, which are in such huge supply that the low level ones are worth a few copper. It takes thousands of fragments and powders to level up transmuting now.But you already know all of this.So I don't understand why you think that your chars should be rewarded with high level transmuting, when transmuting itself is going to be SO much easier to level past 100.

Whilhelmina

02-10-2010, 07:36 AM

Just so we all speak of the same thing, now we can get :- transmuting up through breaking stuff down (starting with T1 stuff)- adorning up through crafting adorns (starting with T1 stuff)One of the idea behind starting transmuting at 1 is helping level 1 adorners to level through the raw mats you'll produce while leveling your new "harvesting" skill

RandomStream

02-10-2010, 01:17 PM

<cite>Terreciel wrote:</cite><blockquote>The current system requires anyone who wants to transmute to begin at lvl 1. How will the new system be a bigger disadvantage than the current system?If you decide to take up transmuting after reaching lvl 80 in either adventure or tradeskill, you still have to start by finding large quantities of low level items to transmute. In addition to this, merely converting these quantities of items to their component shards/powders/etc. will only level you to 100. After that, to level you must not only continue to acquire large numbers of items to break down but you must craft adornments--and you can only raise your skill by crafting weapon adornments, which are in such huge supply that the low level ones are worth a few copper. It takes thousands of fragments and powders to level up transmuting now.But you already know all of this.So I don't understand why you think that your chars should be rewarded with high level transmuting, when transmuting itself is going to be SO much easier to level past 100.</blockquote>We are all taking up transmuting or at least receiving the skill. On Test everyone who was not already a Transmuter recently acquired a new ability "Transmuting" with a Skill level of 5. Transmuters retained thier existing skill level but also acquired a new skill of Adorning at a level equal to thier existing Transmuting Skill. I expect this will go live with the expansion. We will all be able to transmute. We will not all be able to make adornments. We will not advance our transmuting by making adornments, Adorners will advance their skill by making adornments. We will all be able to advance our transmuting skill by transmuting. For toons who are not already transmuters this will start off with items of level 1-6.A (very) good rate of picking up transmutable items would be one per minute. So, assuming one skill-up per item, to get skill from 5 to 375 would take 370 minutes or 6 hours 10 minutes. Why would any one bother? And even if it was worth doing once, so you could supply your own Adorner, why do it a second time? Surely we will pass tradeable items to the Transmuter, and sell the No Trade items to NPC Merchant.I am suggesting giving existing toons the skill they would have had as adventurers, if they had had the skill available at the time they were created and had maintained the skill as they levelled as adventurers. As it is treated as a harvesting skill rather than an adventuring skill, perhaps the average of the toon's harvesting skills would be a fairer method. I was looking for something simple that would encourage existing toons to use the new skill, not just ignore it as irrelevent.Catin of Runnyeye

Golu

02-10-2010, 02:10 PM

So getting the skill up takes a little bit of time.. I'm missing the issue here.

Eveningsong

02-10-2010, 02:42 PM

I have alt banks full of no-trade items my toons have outgrown. They'll all be taking up transmuting to some level. I don't see any reason for a level 80 adventurer to automatically get 400 transmuting anymore than they would automatically get 400 mining without having gone out and harvested in all the previous tiers first. I know lots of folks who decided to do their harvest cloak at 80 and had zero harvesting skill to start. If someone feels that transmuting is useful to them, they'll do it and it is going to be a heck of a lot easier with the new transmuting system and self-mentoring. If folks don't want to transmute, that's ok too, it certainly has no negative impact on transmuting/adorning for anyone else.

Lord Destyn

02-10-2010, 04:31 PM

You sir are a cry baby. You expect to get a free skill up just "Because" over all the other people who put the time in to the skill. Well hey, we have a new xpac coming out w/ a level cap raise too, maybe you should ask SOE to raise all your non 80 alts upto level just so they can enjoy the xpac. Oh wait, thats about as rediculous as what you ARE asking for. Go get off your butt and put in some effort like everyone else did.If you dont have the time, then guess what, you dont deserve it anyways.

Valdaglerion

02-10-2010, 05:39 PM

<cite>RandomStream wrote:</cite><blockquote>Thank you for your responses. I have clearly failed to make my point lucidly enough. I am assuming that SOE expect most of our toons be able to transmute anything they pick up or have saved. So they will provide a good supply of raw materials for Adorners. My point is the time and effort required to raise all of our existing high level toons to the point where they can do this will be too much trouble.Ok It's not fair on those who have worked the way up but....Catin, Master CarpenterEsric, Master ProvisionerMayol, Master WoodworkerKrez, Master SageQuehdo, Master SageKominac, Master AlchemistStonehammer, Master JewellerHuche, Master Armourer, Tinker 400Goldensword, Master TailorOh and I nearly forgotSkato, Master Weaponsmith, Transmuter 400 <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" /></blockquote>I understand your point but understand when Tinkering and Transmuting were released with EoF, it was said at that time that these skills are not everyone. They can be long, expensive and tiresome to skill up; ergo, if you dont want to put in the effort on all, some or none of your toons that is completely your perogrative.Asking to trivialize a new skill because you dont want to do it now is just wrong. Had you taken the time to raise your toons into transmuting over the last 2 years you wouldnt have to worry about it now as your efforts would be migrated over.Level it up or dont but dont ask for it to be trivialized by those that either did put in the effort or are willing to. /kkthnxAnd yes . . .<ul><li>80 Master Sage x 2 (both 400 Tinker, one respecced from a 350 Transmuter)</li><li>80 Master Alchemist x 4 (400 Tinker x2, 325 Transmuter)</li><li>80 Master Jeweler </li><li>80 Master Carpenter x 2 (400 tinker)</li><li>80 Master Provisioner x2 (respecced 1 to become a Master Carpenter)</li><li>80 Master Tailor (300 Tinker)</li><li>80 Master Weaponsmith x2 (400 Transmuter / 250 Transmuter)</li><li>80 Master Armorer (400 tinker)</li><li>80 Master Woodworker</li></ul>

Finora

02-10-2010, 06:10 PM

I am also failing to see the issue.I'm looking FORWARD to being able to do this. No more having to vendor off attuned fabled/legendary gear I've replaced since I picked tinkering as my secondary skill when EOF came out.Having to level up the transmuting skill to break down my old gear is no different than having to level up fishing to complete the Gathering Obsession quests. Almost no one other than provisioners bothered to skill up fishing before but many many people have done so now to do that quest. Either you want to end result bad enough to do the work, or you don't want it bad enough to see it through. Having tested out the leveling speed on both beta & test server, it is going to pretty much be a non-issue, it levels up about as quickly (maybe even quicker) than any other harvesting skill.Getting items is really easy as well. The drop rates for treasured items is through the roof compared to what it used to be, spending a couple of hours harvesting in lower tiers will yeild a LOT of rares (I pulled a dozent1/t2 rares last night while I was running around looking for the wisps and things for the new SF lore book quest).I think perhaps you misunderstand what SOE is wanting with this change. They are allowing anyone who cares to be able to break items down the ability to do so if they so choose, but they will have to actually commit to leveling the skill up (pretty fair in my opinion). It's a harvesting skill, not like aggression and focus which were crippling to not have near your level when they were first introduced. Like I said before, you are either going to want the ability enough that you'll spend the time to skill it up or you won't. That's the players choice.

RandomStream

02-10-2010, 09:21 PM

<cite>Artemiz@The Bazaar wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>RandomStream wrote:</cite><blockquote>Thank you for your responses. I have clearly failed to make my point lucidly enough. I am assuming that SOE expect most of our toons be able to transmute anything they pick up or have saved. So they will provide a good supply of raw materials for Adorners. My point is the time and effort required to raise all of our existing high level toons to the point where they can do this will be too much trouble.Ok It's not fair on those who have worked the way up but....Catin, Master CarpenterEsric, Master ProvisionerMayol, Master WoodworkerKrez, Master SageQuehdo, Master SageKominac, Master AlchemistStonehammer, Master JewellerHuche, Master Armourer, Tinker 400Goldensword, Master TailorOh and I nearly forgotSkato, Master Weaponsmith, Transmuter 400 <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" /></blockquote>I understand your point but understand when Tinkering and Transmuting were released with EoF, it was said at that time that these skills are not everyone. They can be long, expensive and tiresome to skill up; ergo, if you dont want to put in the effort on all, some or none of your toons that is completely your perogrative.Asking to trivialize a new skill because you dont want to do it now is just wrong. Had you taken the time to raise your toons into transmuting over the last 2 years you wouldnt have to worry about it now as your efforts would be migrated over.Level it up or dont but dont ask for it to be trivialized by those that either did put in the effort or are willing to. /kkthnxAnd yes . . .<ul><li>80 Master Sage x 2 (both 400 Tinker, one respecced from a 350 Transmuter)</li><li>80 Master Alchemist x 4 (400 Tinker x2, 325 Transmuter)</li><li>80 Master Jeweler </li><li>80 Master Carpenter x 2 (400 tinker)</li><li>80 Master Provisioner x2 (respecced 1 to become a Master Carpenter)</li><li>80 Master Tailor (300 Tinker)</li><li>80 Master Weaponsmith x2 (400 Transmuter / 250 Transmuter)</li><li>80 Master Armorer (400 tinker)</li><li>80 Master Woodworker</li></ul></blockquote>Thank you, a well put counter argument. Yes, I too recall Transmuting and Tinkering as not being for everybody. Indeed I am unclear as to why Transmuting is being split into two separate skills now, unless it is intended that most toons become transmuters. My suggestion was intended to facilitate that end. It was not my intention to trivialise the skill, but I do not believe it will be widely developed if it is not given a kick start by the developers. Furthermore existing Transmuters are being give a kick start. Those who have reached the maximum skill are being given 400 Transmuting and 400 Adorning, but earned at most 100 Transmuting while earning 300 or more Adorning on the way to being maxed Transmuters. So why should current (live) Transmuters be given 400 Skill-ups when nobody else is? Also there is a precendent for giving us skills we have not earned. The former cross-craft skills such as Geomancy and Binding are set to our highest crafting skill level when we need them - at least that was the position last time it was possible to examine them on the skills tab (they are no longer visible). We do not have to raise them by practising them, but they do still crop up in the game.Catin of Runnyeye

Chikkin

02-10-2010, 09:56 PM

everyone having transmuting skill is good in a sense that even those who hate crafting with passion can still make their over adorning materials, from their own outgrown gear or newly aquired junk, then ask a friend who skilled up adorning to make stuff for themit will also make a quick work of your overflowing with stuff bags if you don't have a merchant or bank close, fragments and powders and infusions and manas stack, unlike gear and spells

Skywarrior

02-10-2010, 10:06 PM

<cite>RandomStream wrote:</cite><blockquote>Furthermore existing Transmuters are being give a kick start. Those who have reached the maximum skill are being given 400 Transmuting and 400 Adorning, but earned at most 100 Transmuting while earning 300 or more Adorning on the way to being maxed Transmuters. So why should current (live) Transmuters be given 400 Skill-ups when nobody else is? </blockquote>Uh, because they actually skilled up to 400 in Transmuting? It isn't like they all stopped transmuting stuff at level 100, they just stopped getting advancement credit from it and had to get it in a way many of them would have preferred not to have to do. In the old (current) setup, the vast majority of Transmuters wanted as little to do with Adorning as they could get away with. They were skilling up to Transmute stuff. They still had to buy, make, or loot tons of gear and spells to break down (without getting skillups) in order to get materials to make useless adornments they then put on the broker for (usually) less then it cost to make them.Your argument really doesn't make a whole lot of sense, if you look at the whole picture fairly. Transmuting is a skill that has been around for some time now and everyone who played had the exact same opportunity to skill up in it. They are changing the mechanics and making it more accessible now for everyone but you still have to decide to do the work to skill it up, regardless of difficulty level. Now you don't have to choose, you can have it all. But you still have to skill up in it if you haven't already done so in the old system.