Munzak's Material Bastion X4 a failure?

[Zizzu]

<p>I just wanted to see if people think this zone is a failure or not. I know that my guild has no desire to raid this zone and it's due to the loot (nothing really is worthwhile stands out). Plus, you have to clear the X2 in order to kill anything there. Anyone else feel the same?</p><p>I remember when SoH came out and everyone wanted to hit the zone due to loot and the accessibility of the zone (PuGs can easily kill the first 3 names while solid raiding guilds can push further in).</p>

[Katanalla]

<p>I dunno, I got a disco off a trash drop in there like 2 weeks ago.... I think that zone is for those nights that a guild has ABSOLUTELY nothing else to do...</p>

[Tehom]

<p>We got another disco on our server off the second mob in there last night. It's just two things really - the difficulty and rewards. Aside from the first placeholder 4-mob encounter, most of the encounters in there are too challenging currently for guilds that aren't killing the harder mobs in Inner Stronghold, and aside from a few good healer drops their itemization is extremely weak. I mean I look at their loot tables and it's like 'Good healer ring... and trash. Good healer cloak, good fighter cloak... and trash', a few charms people wouldn't use over avatar charms, replacements for SoH-hats some people won't even break up their sets for, and that's about it.</p><p>If you look at their loot tables, you'd think a lot of these mobs would be comparable to, say, Switchmaster, Kultak, etc, and that sure isn't the case. I'd rather see the loot massively upgraded as opposed to making them easier, but either way would work to bring the zone in line.</p>

[Zizzu]

<p><cite>Chath@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>We got another disco on our server off the second mob in there last night. It's just two things really - the difficulty and rewards. Aside from the first placeholder 4-mob encounter, most of the encounters in there are too challenging currently for guilds that aren't killing the harder mobs in Inner Stronghold, and aside from a few good healer drops their itemization is extremely weak. I mean I look at their loot tables and it's like 'Good healer ring... and trash. Good healer cloak, good fighter cloak... and trash', a few charms people wouldn't use over avatar charms, replacements for SoH-hats some people won't even break up their sets for, and that's about it.</p><p>If you look at their loot tables, you'd think a lot of these mobs would be comparable to, say, Switchmaster, Kultak, etc, and that sure isn't the case. I'd rather see the loot massively upgraded as opposed to making them easier, but either way would work to bring the zone in line.</p></blockquote><p>Getting a Disco last night just furthers my point that the zone is a failure (more like a wasteland). I agree the loot is horrendous in comparison to the difficulty of the nameds (not including the first named). Also, this zone shoukd not be for just "Avatar" guilds only. I would expect SoE create a raid zone for all types of guild. I cannot see the average guild getting past the second named period. Plus, having to force all people to finish the X2 makes Munzak's Material Bastion even more horrible.</p>

[Xalmat]

<p>The loot is definitely underpowered for the difficulty of the mobs. The trash drops are relatively worthless unless you like raw resists and HP. The first 2 mobs loot drops are fairly weak overall. The 3rd mob drops Cloaks which are all very nice. The 4th mob drops charms, of which there are a major shortage of raid drops this expansion (unless you can farm Avatars). The hats off the 5th mob are basically upgraded versions of the Shard of Hate hats, which is good if you aren't very fond of T4 set bonuses.</p><p>Hovewer, unless the majority of your guild has 5 or 6 T4 set pieces, you likely won't get past the 3rd named. From what I've heard unless you can kill Anashti you won't get past the 4th mob, and the only guilds that can curretly kill the 5th mob are Avatar-farming guilds.</p><p>This is definitely far from a casual friendly zone, and even not a very good zone if you aren't in the hardest-of-hardcore guilds.</p>

[Zizzu]

<p><cite>Xalmat wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>This is definitely far from a casual friendly zone, and even not a very good zone if you aren't in the hardest-of-hardcore guilds.</p></blockquote><p>Well said.</p><p>I'm hoping the "next" X4 is better conceived and properly equipped. Also, I hope the challenges are more creatived. I'm just sick and tired of seeing another "must cure this and must cure that" type of scenario. I'm already puking at every TSO raid where healers are overwhelmed if not annoyed at the many cures they have to do.</p>

[EasternKing]

<p>Pretty much in agreement with previous posters, either loot gets over hauled, or everything gets nerfed.</p><p>and devs...if you make content that requires avatar loot to beat, it needs to drop gear better than avatar gear, you know progression and all that...</p>

[Kunaak]

<p>the gear appears fine from what I saw.</p><p>its just the progression of the zone is odd. the first encounter is zero challenge. the second encounter is pretty much instant death, if all the adds arent dead in about 5 seconds from spawning.</p><p>there was no leeway between the two.</p><p>in the last month, we spent a total of about 20-30 minutes in there. it just didnt seem to catch anyones interest. on our raid schedule, no ones going out of thier way to ask to go there. it definatly needs some tweaking, cause the progression of the zone is waaaaaaaaay off. the loot is fine from the names, but the trash loot is complete garbage.</p><p>I think it really came down to this - the first name was zero challenge, the second name was instant death. we pulled him 2 more times, half asleep really, cause you could just tell no one really wanted to be in there... and that was it. we're all sick of these instant death fights, from the naga, and gynok and switchmaster, that another instant death fight - that has no chance for patterns, just doesnt feel like its worth bothering with.</p><p>over the last few months, all TSO fights seem to come down nuclear bombs dropping on you, sure, they give them different names, but they all do the same thing - instant death.</p><p>thats why I think the zone really isnt big with us, its the same thing, with a different back drop, and quite honestly, we're all sick of the same gimmick - instant death fights. on gynok we deal with it, cause we get patterns and healer gear and such. we know we get people geared from it. in munzaks, it really doesnt feel like its worth putting any time or effort into it.</p>

[Tehom]

<p>The trash loot were designed to be resist gear people would actually use - interesting idea, but they're not strong enough still. What he should do is attach an effect to em of like 1-2k recurring wards against their resist types; they'd actually be good situational gear then.</p><p>Even the first named's loot is odd/bad though. The encounter's a pushover, but a melee buckler? Those aren't even used anymore, so it doesn't make much sense. If it was designed as a priest/melee buckler solely for offense at the expense of giving up healing/defense, he should have slapped a few base CA/spell onto it - not much, since the first named is so easy, but a few percent would have worked for a tradeoff/situational item.</p><p>Also, the real problem is from a progression standpoint, everything in the zone is a one-dropper while pretty much every other encounter in the expansion is a two dropper. Most nameds in instances are a pattern and a regular item, and even the earliest ones tend to have better things on their tables than these. Given the difficulty, the zone is pretty much spectacularly unrewarding.</p>

[LardLord]

<p><cite>Xalmat wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Hovewer, unless the majority of your guild has 5 or 6 T4 set pieces, you likely won't get past the 3rd named. From what I've heard unless you can kill Anashti you won't get past the 4th mob, and the only guilds that can curretly kill the 5th mob are Avatar-farming guilds.</p></blockquote><p>It's rare that I agree precisely with statements like that, but that seems like a perfect description of how the progression in this zone works to me.</p><p>Also note that they majorly nerfed the second named.  The descriptions I'm reading of that named seem out of date to me.  Nowadays, the second named isn't very tough, and the loot table isn't too bad either. </p><p>Ykesha and Ozyk share a gear check AE, and the test patch notes said they're nerfing Ykesha's, so maybe Ozyk's will be weaker as well?  That'd make sense to me.  The cloaks he drops are upgrades for most people, but the loot table isn't nearly rewarding enough for his current difficulty, in my opinion.</p><p>I think maybe they should add set pattern drops to the zone, but I'm not sure that'd really be a solid fix or anything...just might increase people's interest in the zone a bit, since we've kinda gotten spoiled with most mobs in other zones dropping a set patten <strong>and</strong> an item of comparable (or better) quality to what's dropping in Munzok's for the difficulty.</p><p>EDIT: Gloves (first named) -> Hat (second named) -> Shoulders (third named) -> Pants (fourth)....</p><p>Those set pieces dropping from those mobs would make sense to me, since they kinda match the difficulty of the other mobs that drop those set pieces (at least if Ozyk's AE gets nerfed).  The second named is easier than Tyrannus (but about as hard as Xebnok?), so those hats would be a nice reward for guilds in between Xebnok and Tyrannus in progression.</p>

[Yimway]

<p>Add smart loot patterns in Munzok only <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Gaige]

<p><cite>Quabi@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Those set pieces dropping from those mobs would make sense to me, since they kinda match the difficulty of the other mobs that drop those set pieces (at least if Ozyk's AE gets nerfed).  The second named is easier than Tyrannus (but about as hard as Xebnok?), so those hats would be a nice reward for guilds in between Xebnok and Tyrannus in progression.</p></blockquote><p>Do we really need THREE mobs dropping the same set pieces?</p>

[LardLord]

<p><cite>Gage wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Do we really need THREE mobs dropping the same set pieces?</p></blockquote><p>Nah, don't need it, and that's probably why they didn't put set drops on it.</p><p>I just think most people now are used to seeing two drops in each chest, and I think the quantity of loot from Munzok's is even more of a problem than the quality, at least for the first three nameds.  If you actually look at what drops from the first three named, there are a lot of quality items.  Compare the drops from the first named to Switchmaster loot and the second named to Xebnok loot, and I think the items are better while the difficulty is similar.  Almost everyone wants their cloak from Ozyk, too.  That's why I think the problem is more based in quantity than quality.</p><p>EDIT: Though looking at it on Xanadu...I guess quality is of a problem on the first named.  I was thinking of the Voidcursed Spike when I wrote that the items are good for the difficulty of the mob, but the other three items on that loot table aren't good enough.</p>

[Xalmat]

<p><cite>Quabi@Antonia Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Also note that they majorly nerfed the second named.  The descriptions I'm reading of that named seem out of date to me.  Nowadays, the second named isn't very tough, and the loot table isn't too bad either.</p></blockquote><p>Indeed. My guild killed the second name before the nerf, and it's not even the same fight anymore.</p>