Monument and Might - GU #52 - Test - General Feedback [Archive]

ArivenGemini

05-26-2009, 11:20 PM

Since the entire game up until this change going live has been built with the idea that poisons and procs are boosted by INT and spell bonuses, as evidenced by the fact that the predator line used spell bonus to boost poison damage, are you going to disconnect any +INT or +spell damage adornments from gear of all poison using scouts so they can be sold to recoup the losses on those items that will become worthless?What about those who chose to use some shard gear to boost that as well? are you going to implement some sort of change NPC that will allow you to trade in your hybrid (and as of this change not worth having) gear for class specific shard armor?Dont get me wrong, I think scouts should be purely melee. I like that idea, but the entire game up until now is different in a significant way regarding this than what you propose.. it is going to cost us time, plat, and effort to replace the items that you are invalidating, and while changes to the game are expected, ones that cost us a significant amount of time, effort and plat to accomodate are not very player friendly, and have the effect of causing people to give up and move on.In addition there is precidence in the past to do this, because when other adornments or gear has been invalidated for people they have been removed and placed in inventory, allowing people to recover their investment costs and time.

Tehom

05-26-2009, 11:27 PM

<cite>DominoDev wrote:</cite><blockquote>All the upgraded hex dolls should be on display on Test server on my broker. I'll see if I can get the ranged weapons up also when time permits.</blockquote>Would it be possible to reduce the recast time to something like 30 seconds? 5 minutes seems really excessive to me, considering none of the effects are all that powerful even with the really brief cast time. The mods seem about right for mastercrafted charm slot items though, I like 'em overall. The 2-set bonus seemed a little odd, since a 5 percent cast time reduction on something that fast casting would be pretty much imperceptible.

madha

05-26-2009, 11:37 PM

<cite>Deson wrote:</cite><blockquote>Research assistants are currently one character per account per server. Given the massive encouragement of alts and the very fact that masters are being given away in the first place, this seems inconsistent. Each alt is its own individual in the world and many of us play them as much as so-called mains, making the RA effectively force us into a main. As such an effect conflicts with recent design, suggest removing the restriction all together or explaining why it's seen as an acceptable limit.</blockquote>Can we just git a /boostlvl80 so lvl 1 toon can be 80 with full masters 200 aa and all t3 armor.

Oteo

05-27-2009, 12:14 AM

Looking at this concerning the Research assistants:"They will only assist one character per account at a time and only help those level 20 or higher."Does this mean that if I have 6 toons on my account that I need to pick a single toon and only that toon can use the RA? Or does this mean that only one toon at a time can have a RA upgrading spells/CA and as soon as that toon is finished with the upgrade, another alt on the same account can have upgrades done for him?Seems to be a very valuable NPC but a poor choice if it is in fact a single toon per account that gets to use it.

Lodor

05-27-2009, 12:36 AM

Seems a lot of tso instance loot is now tradable on in this update.Even a few of the better fable drops out of the shard instances are tradable currently on test.

Maroger

05-27-2009, 12:40 AM

<cite>Lodor wrote:</cite><blockquote>Seems a lot of tso instance loot is now tradable on in this update.Even a few of the better fable drops out of the shard instances are tradable currently on test.</blockquote>That is good news <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" />

Gaige

05-27-2009, 12:49 AM

<cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote>That is good news <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" /></blockquote>Sigh.

Deson

05-27-2009, 01:01 AM

<cite>Gage wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote>That is good news <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" /></blockquote>Sigh.</blockquote>You sell loot rights and it's not like it's free. Why are you sighing?

Mheryl

05-27-2009, 01:07 AM

Either the dazed iksar villagers are not respawning as such, or they are very few and far between (quest "Ethernere Escort" in Kunzar Jungle, city of jinisk.One person reported having killed some, I've been all over the jungle and found regular villagers but no "dazed" ones.

salty21db

05-27-2009, 02:15 AM

<cite>Deson wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Gage wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote>That is good news <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" /></blockquote>Sigh.</blockquote>You sell loot rights and it's not like it's free. Why are you sighing?</blockquote>Pretty simple thats a /sigh "i will have to compete against others on the broker for pricing of such items instead of just spiking it the one time i get to sell the loot rights" imo....only thing u could really sigh about.Which i think is their point to kind of eliviate the whole thing of selling loot rights, making it a open market once its on the broker.

Noaani

05-27-2009, 02:58 AM

The effect on Arcane Robe of Hatred, Marrow's Song, Twelve Tone Earstone, Insisious Robe and probably other items all need to be modified to reflect the spell name changes.Basically, anything that is not a part of a class specific set, yet affects specific spells/CAs needs to be adjusted. Seems that the Harbringer of Malcontent is the only such item that has been adjusted so far.

Noaani

05-27-2009, 03:11 AM

<cite>Deson wrote:</cite><blockquote>Research assistants are currently one character per account per server. Given the massive encouragement of alts and the very fact that masters are being given away in the first place, this seems inconsistent. Each alt is its own individual in the world and many of us play them as much as so-called mains, making the RA effectively force us into a main. As such an effect conflicts with recent design, suggest removing the restriction all together or explaining why it's seen as an acceptable limit.</blockquote>I have set the RA to research a level 2 spell, it is set to take just short of 24 hours.I will post my thoughts on it when I have obtained that master.

Kahling

05-27-2009, 04:10 AM

With the new quests comming in and some people liking to run only one toon that are on 200aa's and max level I would love to see an aa cap rise to 210 with 10 extra in the shadows tree so that we go in to next expansion with each tree being at 70.

Malaqai

05-27-2009, 04:37 AM

<cite>salty21db wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Deson wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Gage wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote>That is good news <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" /></blockquote>Sigh.</blockquote>You sell loot rights and it's not like it's free. Why are you sighing?</blockquote>Pretty simple thats a /sigh "i will have to compete against others on the broker for pricing of such items instead of just spiking it the one time i get to sell the loot rights" imo....only thing u could really sigh about.Which i think is their point to kind of eliviate the whole thing of selling loot rights, making it a open market once its on the broker.</blockquote>I highly doubt Gage, or any other raider from a HC or semi-HC guild is worried about competeing on market for instanced loot, or selling loot rights. Most of us are fully mastered and plat drops in buckets in this game.I can't remember the last time someone from a serious raid guild bothered to sell loot rights on my server, it's just not worth the time, you mute it and go about your business.The "sigh", I imagine, is more in line with what this update is doing, continuing the tread of making things trivial, and easy to obtain.Now you can get yourself masters through hailing an NPC (!) and you'll be able to buy fabled loot with plat.Combined with the proc changes, I'll do a "sigh" as well...Anyway, sorry for being slightly off-topic.

Kitsune

05-27-2009, 04:43 AM

Research Assistants - Guards on Test_Copy do not know where they are, in either South Qeynos or North Qeynos, and using myTracking found no one called Research Assistant. I asked 3-4 guards in each place and ran around too. Others on Chat were also asking. One had been spotted in Kelethin.

Noaani

05-27-2009, 04:55 AM

<cite>Kitsune wrote:</cite><blockquote>Research Assistants - Guards on Test_Copy do not know where they are, in either South Qeynos or North Qeynos, and using myTracking found no one called Research Assistant. I asked 3-4 guards in each place and ran around too. Others on Chat were also asking. One had been spotted in Kelethin.</blockquote>Click on a guard and type in research, they will point you straight to them.Track shows player and NPC names, not purpose tags. Try and use track to find an alchemist.I initially thought the portion on the test notes saying how to find the RA was for total newcomers to the game, and was going to point out that it was unnecessary as the people that tend to read patch/update notes already know how to use the guards to find NPCs.I guess you just pointed out that not everyone knows this...

Tallahasee

05-27-2009, 07:06 AM

<cite>Kitsune wrote:</cite><blockquote>Research Assistants - Guards on Test_Copy do not know where they are, in either South Qeynos or North Qeynos, and using myTracking found no one called Research Assistant. I asked 3-4 guards in each place and ran around too. Others on Chat were also asking. One had been spotted in Kelethin.</blockquote>Most likely because there are no Research Assistants in either location <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /> Try some of the original starting hamlets of either Freeport or Qeynos.Research Assistants <ul><li>Research Assistants have moved into many cities in Norrath. These hardworking men and women will do the research to upgrade a spell or combat art from journeyman to adept or from expert to master. They will only assist one character per account at a time and only help those level 20 or higher. Research Assistants can be found in each of the six hoods and villages of Freeport and Qeynos, Neriak, Haven, Gorowyn and Kelethin. You can ask any guard in those areas to point you in the direction of a Research Assistant if you can’t find them. </li></ul>Found mine in Castleview Hamlet.Cheers.Caele Spiritwalker80 Mystic of Test

Kitsune

05-27-2009, 07:19 AM

I do know how to use the guards, just used to putting what I thought was the whole "name" in. ;pAh, light bulb comes on! "hoods" = neighborhoods ... Being a Brit that never occurred to me as we don't use that word in that way. I wondered what it meant.Now that sentence means a lot more to me. I assumed it meant the main town and the sattelite villages. Don't you just love our common language? <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" />

shadowscale

05-27-2009, 07:38 AM

this is probably just me, but i lOVE the new iksar skelly pet necros get, would be even better if it was for our teir 8 tank thogh, i wouldent mind sacrificeing the skelly on a horse for it.

Powers

05-27-2009, 09:43 AM

Are the four throwing weapons (pouch, sheath, satchel, bandolier) still identical to each other? If so, why?Powers &8^]

Goldenpaw

05-27-2009, 09:51 AM

<cite>Malaqai wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>salty21db wrote:</cite><blockquote><blockquote><cite>Gage wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote>That is good news <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" /></blockquote>Sigh.</blockquote>You sell loot rights and it's not like it's free. Why are you sighing?</blockquote></blockquote>I highly doubt Gage, or any other raider from a HC or semi-HC guild is worried about competeing on market for instanced loot, or selling loot rights. Most of us are fully mastered and plat drops in buckets in this game.The "sigh", I imagine, is more in line with what this update is doing, continuing the tread of making things trivial, and easy to obtain.</blockquote>Please neither one of you believe this for a moment, people have sold -every- no drop, no trade, no loot, no potatoes item in the game, want your myth update but don't want to wait? Buy it. Don't want to have to drop Trak to get his shield? buy it. It is -already- happening, this is just SOE opening their eyes saying people ALREADY do this, lets cut out the middle man and (surprise) do what the customer wants...I can understand about the other portions, but pretending this isn't ALREADY happening is just silly.

Malaqai

05-27-2009, 10:07 AM

<cite>Goldenpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote>Please neither one of you believe this for a moment, people have sold -every- no drop, no trade, no loot, no potatoes item in the game, want your myth update but don't want to wait? Buy it. Don't want to have to drop Trak to get his shield? buy it. It is -already- happening, this is just SOE opening their eyes saying people ALREADY do this, lets cut out the middle man and (surprise) do what the customer wants...I can understand about the other portions, but pretending this isn't ALREADY happening is just silly.</blockquote>It's happening, but it's still relatively rare.Raiders either don't need money or don't care cos they don't have anything to spend on. Stuff gets muted.Casuals equip the drops or on the off-chance they have it, sell it in channel.Either way, another way to buy stuff with plat is just another step backwards in terms of earning your equipment IMO.

Noaani

05-27-2009, 10:12 AM

<cite>Malaqai wrote:</cite><blockquote>Either way, another way to buy stuff with plat is just another step backwards in terms of earning your equipment IMO. </blockquote>I'm not convinced.I counted less than a dozen fabled drops that were made tradeable, meaning 2 - 3 are useful per archtype. THey tended to be the "less good" drops as well (ie, the spear from Kor-Sha). I don't care about legendary items.To me, this does little more than provide people a use for their plat, and give people a reason to run a few of the TSO instances after RAs.Its not like someone could get fully eequipped from the gear that has been made tradeable.

feldon30

05-27-2009, 11:28 AM

I think having some of these items tradeable makes sense. It's just consistent with past expansions. The old policy of 'instance gear is not tradeable, contested gear is' doesn't work when there is almost no contested mobs/zones. On Butcherblock, patterns and NO TRADE fabled loot get auctioned all the time on open chat.

Yimway

05-27-2009, 11:36 AM

<cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite><blockquote>I think having some of these items tradeable makes sense. It's just consistent with past expansions. The old policy of 'instance gear is not tradeable, contested gear is' doesn't work when there is almost no contested mobs/zones. On Butcherblock, patterns and NO TRADE fabled loot get auctioned all the time on open chat.</blockquote>I can't find an arguement for any item other than quest rewards to be no-trade. The rest of them are all 'traded' frequently.

Valdaglerion

05-27-2009, 11:36 AM

<cite>Malaqai wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Goldenpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote>Please neither one of you believe this for a moment, people have sold -every- no drop, no trade, no loot, no potatoes item in the game, want your myth update but don't want to wait? Buy it. Don't want to have to drop Trak to get his shield? buy it. It is -already- happening, this is just SOE opening their eyes saying people ALREADY do this, lets cut out the middle man and (surprise) do what the customer wants...I can understand about the other portions, but pretending this isn't ALREADY happening is just silly.</blockquote>It's happening, but it's still relatively rare.Raiders either don't need money or don't care cos they don't have anything to spend on. Stuff gets muted.Casuals equip the drops or on the off-chance they have it, sell it in channel.Either way, another way to buy stuff with plat is just another step backwards in terms of earning your equipment IMO.</blockquote>Not all servers are the same. We have guilds on our server which make quite a bit of coin selling loot rights. We jokingly say they make more money than SOE. To say its rare its pretty narrow viewing.

Thor71457

05-27-2009, 11:45 AM

Hi On the Research asst. Unholy Blessing Level 79 going from an Expert to Master the guy tells me 29 days.. From what I have been told in game chat that this real time not game time. If this is true I think it is too long, would like to see this cut inhalf.. Thankyou

Scythien

05-27-2009, 11:45 AM

The Research Ast. I went to offered to research the Fire Seeds master (Fire Seed frim the Emerald Halls recipe book)Not sure if this limited use ability is intended to upgrade <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" />*Edit to reply to above poster*Yeesh, give people free masters for no effort and they'll still complain <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" />I think it's fine as it is so long as similar level masters take 1 month-ish to research, and speed up as you outlevel them. I.e. level 70 master at lvl 70 takes the same time as a lvl 90 master at level 90 when next level cap increases.

feldon30

05-27-2009, 11:59 AM

<cite>Thor71457 wrote:</cite><blockquote>Hi On the Research asst. Unholy Blessing Level 79 going from an Expert to Master the guy tells me 29 days.. From what I have been told in game chat that this real time not game time. If this is true I think it is too long, would like to see this cut inhalf.. Thankyou</blockquote>Hail an NPC. Wait 30 days. Hail the NPC again, you get a FREE MASTER. Yep, that must be too long! That's just too hard for casual players.Shouldn't you be able to get more than 11 masters for FREE per expansion without questing, playing any content, investing any plat, but just by hailing an NPC once a month? Why not just login, hail an NPC, and you get all of your masters right then and there?I still think the answers to this problem instead of Research Assistants should have been:<ul><li>Add level 30, 40, and 50 contested x2 mobs with these rare masters on their loot table.</li><li>Provide T8 (71-80) upgrades of all un-upgraded spells.</li><li>A difficult Signature quest that rewards choice of Illusionist, Conjuror, or Necro pet master.</li></ul>

Alienor

05-27-2009, 12:03 PM

<cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite><blockquote>Hail an NPC. Wait 30 days. Hail the NPC again, you get a FREE MASTER. Yep, that must be too long! That's just too hard for casual players.Shouldn't you be able to get more than 11 masters for FREE per expansion without questing, playing any content, investing any plat, but just by hailing an NPC once a month? Why not just login, hail an NPC, and you get all of your masters right then and there?</blockquote>Yes, for testing on the test server this should be reduced. We are not talking about the live servers yet.

Valdaglerion

05-27-2009, 12:09 PM

Ok, some objective feedback on what I seen thus far:<ol><li>Player books - awesome and amazing end result. Aesthetically they look great and honestly the UI was even better than anticipated. Big props on this one. The % counter allowing you to see how much space you have left is extremely useful as is the copy and paste ability with scrolling through multiple pages when larges amounts of text is added. The questline for acquiring them was a lot simpler than I anticipated but all in all this gets an A+.</li><li>Research Assistants: They are in some odd places. Their absence in SQ and NQ was directly an odd thing to me. Logically I would have anticipated these folks to be in the Mage Towers and Libraries, not in the little noob areas of town. The one in Castleview hamlet is in a corner shop. Considering they only assist level 20+ I would consider consolidating them to the most logical area, where the thinkers are in the towns.<ol><li>I still very much dislike the inability to speed this process up with interaction. I would think logically that performing subquests for the NPC would assist his research. IE, acquire XX amount of items through harvesting for that tier, killing XX amount of mobs in that tier for parts research, discovering and talking with people in that tier to acquire knowledge, etc. Currently there is no reward for being engaged in the process, its an idle time sink.</li></ol></li><li>Guild hall amenity slots based on guild level and not guild hall size -> OUTSTANDING! Finally a choice of funcationality over fluff. Gratzi!</li><li>Slayer poster added back to the amenity listing without requiring amenity slot -> OUSTANDING! (Throw in the other purely fluff items like the decorations and uniforms only keeping the initial cost and upkeep on them and I might tear up <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></li><li>The new Aery Hunter conjuror pet: /sigh, seriosuly /sigh. You stuck a greenhood on my Wind Sensei so he isnt completely invisible on the screen. I was expecting that now he is a Ranger he would get ranged attacks or something different but alas, no, he is still a Monk in Rangers clothing. My hope for the next expansion is MUCH MUCH LOVING for the summoners of this game. The conj pets have needed serious consideration for a while now. Thanks for making it more visible but now can we get more useful and meaningful? I was so hoping this guy would have ended up with a bow ranged attack and/or dual wielding for melee attacks.</li><li>Revamped Spell Naming convention: will take a little time to get used to but overall I think its fine, hopefully it will make maintenance and such easier. For now I think its going to cause some initial confusion when learning which one you are looking for on the broker and with them renamed by tier from Apprentice, Adept, Master to Journeyman, Expert, Master it will take a bit longer. In the long run I think it will be fine.</li></ol>I just got started on the other questings. I couldnt find anyone around Dregs Landing but was able to find the NPC in JW to start.

Carpediem

05-27-2009, 12:59 PM

The predator AA isn't adding the correct 16% damage to poison damage. I have all 8 points, and my caustic poison damage went from 979 to 995.

Gaige

05-27-2009, 01:03 PM

<cite>Atan@Unrest wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite><blockquote>I think having some of these items tradeable makes sense. It's just consistent with past expansions. The old policy of 'instance gear is not tradeable, contested gear is' doesn't work when there is almost no contested mobs/zones. On Butcherblock, patterns and NO TRADE fabled loot get auctioned all the time on open chat.</blockquote>I can't find an arguement for any item other than quest rewards to be no-trade. The rest of them are all 'traded' frequently.</blockquote>Selling loot rights isn't the same as fabled loot being attuneable. Loot rights have a finite amount of time before they get looted by the group/raid and transmuted. The chest doesn't sit there forever.So you have to have people on willing to buy the item, they have to be not locked out of the zone and they have to be able to get there before the chest poofs.Making fabled drops attuneable bypasses all of that. Now you loot it, set it on the broker and forget about it and anyone is able to purchase it at their leisure.To compare them is silly.Raid loot was attuneable in T5 and when I was on Guk the first 12 pages of the broker was all raid loot from about every instance in T5, and some contested. You could literally almost fully equip yourself in raid gear if you had enough plat.I just like the finite time frame on loot selling. It enables players to get some good loot for coin but not at their leisure, a certain set of requirements have to be met first.Its not like oh crap I'm locked out of Crucible I can't bid on that essence they're selling, oh wait nevermind look right here there are 7 essences on the broker I'll just buy one of those.

EQPrime

05-27-2009, 01:04 PM

The templar mythical is broken.... or else it was nerfed really hard.

Gaige

05-27-2009, 01:05 PM

<cite>Scythienne@Splitpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote>I think it's fine as it is so long as similar level masters take 1 month-ish to research, and speed up as you outlevel them. I.e. level 70 master at lvl 70 takes the same time as a lvl 90 master at level 90 when next level cap increases.</blockquote>No thanks. A lvl 90 master should take 60 days to research, while level 80 masters when you're level 90 should still take 30 days.

Deson

05-27-2009, 02:19 PM

<cite>Gage wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Atan@Unrest wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite><blockquote>I think having some of these items tradeable makes sense. It's just consistent with past expansions. The old policy of 'instance gear is not tradeable, contested gear is' doesn't work when there is almost no contested mobs/zones. On Butcherblock, patterns and NO TRADE fabled loot get auctioned all the time on open chat.</blockquote>I can't find an arguement for any item other than quest rewards to be no-trade. The rest of them are all 'traded' frequently.</blockquote>Selling loot rights isn't the same as fabled loot being attuneable. Loot rights have a finite amount of time before they get looted by the group/raid and transmuted. The chest doesn't sit there forever.So you have to have people on willing to buy the item, they have to be not locked out of the zone and they have to be able to get there before the chest poofs.Making fabled drops attuneable bypasses all of that. Now you loot it, set it on the broker and forget about it and anyone is able to purchase it at their leisure.To compare them is silly.Raid loot was attuneable in T5 and when I was on Guk the first 12 pages of the broker was all raid loot from about every instance in T5, and some contested. You could literally almost fully equip yourself in raid gear if you had enough plat.I just like the finite time frame on loot selling. It enables players to get some good loot for coin but not at their leisure, a certain set of requirements have to be met first.Its not like oh crap I'm locked out of Crucible I can't bid on that essence they're selling, oh wait nevermind look right here there are 7 essences on the broker I'll just buy one of those.</blockquote>Makes sense. Still, do you see an issue with some of the lower quality loot being tradeable? I've never been a fan of the highest of the high being tradable but I can't find issue with legendary and intro raid loot being brokered. It gives more places for plat to be spent and allows less frustrating upgrade paths for classes that really need to be well equipped like tanks.<cite>Alienor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite><blockquote>Hail an NPC. Wait 30 days. Hail the NPC again, you get a FREE MASTER. Yep, that must be too long! That's just too hard for casual players.Shouldn't you be able to get more than 11 masters for FREE per expansion without questing, playing any content, investing any plat, but just by hailing an NPC once a month? Why not just login, hail an NPC, and you get all of your masters right then and there?</blockquote>Yes, for testing on the test server this should be reduced. We are not talking about the live servers yet.</blockquote>Kirstie said she wasn't a fan of doing that when I brought it up<cite>Kirstie wrote:</cite> <blockquote>A level 80 upgrade from Adept III to Master I is set to take about 30 real life days to complete. Even if we don't get a full 30 days on test, there are a lot of other levels of upgrades I'm hoping people will try on test to help us make sure its working correctly (range is 1 to 30 days). We've been working internally for a little while now to make sure we get the longest periods checked out before we go live.I'm not personally a fan of shortening time spans for testing if it can be avoided and I'm hoping that what we get to test will be the real times that will go live.- Kirstie</blockquote><cite>Gage wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Scythienne@Splitpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote>I think it's fine as it is so long as similar level masters take 1 month-ish to research, and speed up as you outlevel them. I.e. level 70 master at lvl 70 takes the same time as a lvl 90 master at level 90 when next level cap increases.</blockquote>No thanks. A lvl 90 master should take 60 days to research, while level 80 masters when you're level 90 should still take 30 days.</blockquote>It's got to flatten out somewhere. 30 days as upper limit is fine since they've decided to go through with it. Spell/CA power is relative to the cap so there is no reason to extend it out just because the cap increased.

Obadiah

05-27-2009, 02:53 PM

<cite>Gage wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Scythienne@Splitpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote>I think it's fine as it is so long as similar level masters take 1 month-ish to research, and speed up as you outlevel them. I.e. level 70 master at lvl 70 takes the same time as a lvl 90 master at level 90 when next level cap increases.</blockquote>No thanks. A lvl 90 master should take 60 days to research, while level 80 masters when you're level 90 should still take 30 days.</blockquote>/Agreed. Especially since if you change your mind because you loot the one you are researching they are kind enough to apply the time spent toward researching your spell to the next one you pick. That's very very generous.

speedycerv

05-27-2009, 03:00 PM

The ranger AA ability Conservation doesn't seem to be working on the new potions added from mara, is this intended? feedbacking aswell. I still will have to test the Ranger pants proc and see that it was changed to ranged type of ability from spell. And i saw posted that the aoe portion of explosive arrow was changed to melee but it should be ranged. I'll be testing shortly to see if they are ranged.

Kordran

05-27-2009, 03:01 PM

<cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite><blockquote>I still think the answers to this problem instead of Research Assistants should have been:<ul><li>Add level 30, 40, and 50 contested x2 mobs with these rare masters on their loot table.</li><li>Provide T8 (71-80) upgrades of all un-upgraded spells.</li><li>A difficult Signature quest that rewards choice of Illusionist, Conjuror, or Necro pet master.</li></ul></blockquote>1. Forcing players to mentor and farm low tier raid mobs for non-upgradable masters is fail, plain and simple. Progression means going forwards, not backwards, and not stalling yourself at specific tiers. If you want to require players to kill mobs for them, then add all non-upgradables to the loot tables for all mobs at the appriopriate tier and beyond. Regardless, I have no idea why you even mention x2 mobs, since both solo and heroic mobs can drop exquisites with a master in them.2. They've already stated that the percentage based spells that weren't upgraded because they've reached a "ceiling" in terms of the design and to increase them wouldn't be good for game balance. That leaves with providing T8 spells that are upgrades in name only, with exactly the same benefits as the lower tier spell? Yeah, that would go over well.3. And here you're singling out specific classses -- two of which are the least desired for groups and raiding -- and requiring them to do a difficult signature quest to get their core master spells. And everyone else does... what, exactly? This too is fail.Edit: To be clear, I think that the RAs should be more than "click and wait", but I also think that if they're going to add this, it should be something that is equally accessible to all players of all playstyles. Having a plat cost would be the fairest in that regard, IMO. But even free as it is now, I think the overall impact on the game is going to prove to be fairly minimal regardless.

Kiara

05-27-2009, 03:07 PM

Guys. Feedback. Not bickering, please.Leave the bickering in the half dozen or so threads that are devoted to that, please.Thanks.

Deson

05-27-2009, 03:12 PM

<cite>Kiara wrote:</cite><blockquote>Guys. Feedback. Not bickering, please.Leave the bickering in the half dozen or so threads that are devoted to that, please.Thanks.</blockquote>There is a lot of unaddressed controversy with the RA and the lack of real responses or explanations in over 100 pages of discussion hasn't helped that at all. If you want this thread to keep down on the discussion of it, you're going to have to create another specific thread here or just wipe all comments related to it-- or get a dev to actually speak on it better than has been so far. The reintroduction of tradable loot might need its own thread as well but really I don't see that being an issue that will consume this thread.

hellfire

05-27-2009, 03:14 PM

The RA should be removed.The proc changes should be removed.Thanks for letting me feedback!

Oldsmotank

05-27-2009, 03:27 PM

The research assistant is one of the most stupid ideas that could be put in. It if going to change the market for the worst drasticly and make it pointless to those who payed countless time working on getting fully mastered. And next expantion if everyone can just research fully mastered, wheres the work in that? This is not bickering this is trying to stop this non-sense before alot of people stop playing.

Obadiah

05-27-2009, 03:30 PM

<cite>akaglty wrote:</cite><blockquote>The predator AA isn't adding the correct 16% damage to poison damage. I have all 8 points, and my caustic poison damage went from 979 to 995.</blockquote>lol. That's just too funny. It would appear it adds 16 damage instead of 16%.

Kordran

05-27-2009, 03:32 PM

<cite>Kiara wrote:</cite><blockquote>Guys. Feedback. Not bickering, please.Leave the bickering in the half dozen or so threads that are devoted to that, please.Thanks.</blockquote>My specific feedback to the RA issue would be: add a cost to the RAs in addition to the time required, ranging from 10gp for a T1 master to 80pp for a T8 master.

Noaani

05-27-2009, 03:35 PM

<cite>Deson wrote:</cite><blockquote>There is a lot of unaddressed controversy with the RA and the lack of real responses or explanations in over 100 pages of discussion hasn't helped that at all.</blockquote>QFE imo.If you don't want this thread to turn into a second RA likes/dislikes thread, have Kirstie come in and actually explain the idea behind the [Removed for Content] thing, and maybe even answer some of the more important of the several hundred questions asked in the other thread.

Maroger

05-27-2009, 03:36 PM

<cite>Kordran wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Kiara wrote:</cite><blockquote>Guys. Feedback. Not bickering, please.Leave the bickering in the half dozen or so threads that are devoted to that, please.Thanks.</blockquote>My specific feedback to the RA issue would be: add a cost to the RAs in addition to the time required, ranging from 10gp for a T1 master to 80pp for a T8 master.</blockquote>There are enough money sinks in this game without adding one more. I think the time involved more than compensates for not charging. 80pp is more than some masters cost on the broker. The idea is not to help farmers get more money for masters but make master more available. I think this is a good addition to the game and I like it.

Oldsmotank

05-27-2009, 03:40 PM

<cite></cite><blockquote>There are enough money sinks in this game without adding one more. I think the time involved more than compensates for not charging. 80pp is more than some masters cost on the broker. The idea is not to help farmers get more money for masters but make master more available. I think this is a good addition to the game and I like it.</blockquote>[Removed for Content] thats stupid, enough money sinks in the game, people who dont even farm can be sitting in the high range of 1k, and farmers for masters have been there since the start. Its not like its easy to farm the masters and its always been one of those things woot a masters when it drops. Now its ganna be crap, another master.

GlitterPaws

05-27-2009, 03:43 PM

Deson

05-27-2009, 04:02 PM

<cite>Noaani wrote:</cite> <blockquote><cite>Deson wrote:</cite><blockquote>There is a lot of unaddressed controversy with the RA and the lack of real responses or explanations in over 100 pages of discussion hasn't helped that at all.</blockquote>QFE imo.If you don't want this thread to turn into a second RA likes/dislikes thread, have Kirstie come in and actually explain the idea behind the [Removed for Content] thing, and maybe even answer some of the more important of the several hundred questions asked in the other thread.</blockquote> 3rd<cite>GlitterPaws wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Noaani wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Deson wrote:</cite><blockquote>There is a lot of unaddressed controversy with the RA and the lack of real responses or explanations in over 100 pages of discussion hasn't helped that at all.</blockquote>QFE imo.If you don't want this thread to turn into a second RA likes/dislikes thread, have Kirstie come in and actually explain the idea behind the [Removed for Content] thing, and maybe even answer some of the more important of the several hundred questions asked in the other thread.</blockquote>This thread is for GENERAL feedback not the personal whipping post for the few and vocal regarding the RA. Request another thread specifically for RA and leave the GENERAL thread for other people on test/testcopy with GENERAL feedback.thanks in advance,gp</blockquote>I both gave specific feedback on the first page and requested the separate thread. Until that time however, fully expect this thread to spill over or this thread to be heavilly modded. The latter will suck because there is specific feedback that can go either way.

NiamiDenMother

05-27-2009, 04:15 PM

Regarding the player-made books, there are broker search issues with the blank "notebook" items that are crafted by sages. (Search by the word "notebook", or a custom search on the vendor name, such as Triptych, and the books are not visible at all.) Until this is resolved, players looking for blank books to test with will need to use the Advanced Search > Item Type dropdown > player-written book - this appears to be the only way to find them.

Gungo

05-27-2009, 04:32 PM

Ra's need a master cost to them 1 master of the equivilant or higher tier to research the master of your choice.This in no way shape or form hurts the master market and actually allows people to obtain the masters they NEED.

Gungo

05-27-2009, 04:34 PM

Noaani

05-27-2009, 04:39 PM

<cite>GlitterPaws wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Noaani wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Deson wrote:</cite><blockquote>There is a lot of unaddressed controversy with the RA and the lack of real responses or explanations in over 100 pages of discussion hasn't helped that at all.</blockquote>QFE imo.If you don't want this thread to turn into a second RA likes/dislikes thread, have Kirstie come in and actually explain the idea behind the [Removed for Content] thing, and maybe even answer some of the more important of the several hundred questions asked in the other thread.</blockquote>This thread is for GENERAL feedback not the personal whipping post for the few and vocal regarding the RA. Request another thread specifically for RA and leave the GENERAL thread for other people on test/testcopy with GENERAL feedback.thanks in advance,gp</blockquote>Why would I need to request a thread for the RA?Assuming no one has started one, in about 10 hours, when I get my first master from the RA on test, I am going to start a thread about RAs all on my own!Also, not sure if you noticed, but the RA is included in "general" feedback to do with this update, and as such is as much at home in this thread as it is anywhere else on these forums.

Fredd

05-27-2009, 04:49 PM

<cite>Gungo wrote:</cite><blockquote>Ra's need a master cost to them 1 master of the equivilant or higher tier to research the master of your choice.This in no way shape or form hurts the master market and actually allows people to obtain the masters they NEED.</blockquote>Payment of Research Assistants Gungo makes an excellent suggestion, which I agree with completely. As payment you should give the RA a M1 of the same tier as the one you want. This will increase the M1 price on broker in the short term, but it should balance out somewhere a little higher than muter price in the medium term.Research Time Waiting for around 30 days by just sitting back and waiting is fine with me, but several folk have suggested being able to reduce the research time by doing something for the RA. Harvesting, killing, questing, it does not matter to me, but I agree fully that active players should be able to do something to reduce the research time - not completely, but say up to a 50% reduction or so.

Thor71457

05-27-2009, 05:05 PM

<cite>Alienor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite><blockquote>Hail an NPC. Wait 30 days. Hail the NPC again, you get a FREE MASTER. Yep, that must be too long! That's just too hard for casual players.Shouldn't you be able to get more than 11 masters for FREE per expansion without questing, playing any content, investing any plat, but just by hailing an NPC once a month? Why not just login, hail an NPC, and you get all of your masters right then and there?</blockquote>Yes, for testing on the test server this should be reduced. We are not talking about the live servers yet.</blockquote>Thankyou for helping me answer Feldon question. I was talking about the test server but maybe I should have madethat more clear. I bow and say I am sorry Feldon . ( A Casual Player )

speedycerv

05-27-2009, 05:26 PM

After testing with my ranger, I've found the following bugs:1. When casting Explosive Arrow, the AOE portion is not working correctly. The AOE portion is only hitting the target of explosive arrow, and never the surrounding mobs, which it should be hitting.2. The wounding shot portion of Precision Flightrift Leggings does not add correctly onto the offensive stance, thus there is no way to proc it. This new wounding shot should use ranged crit to base off of when it should be critting. It is currently using spell crit on live servers, so it will require some tweeking in addition to correct the ineffect on offensive stance.3. When Cacophony of Blades is cast the procs of blade chime switch the auto attack to melee. It should not have this effect. For example if you have your bow cued ready for an auto attack and blade chime hits upon the arrow hitting the mob, your auto attack will be switched from ranged to melee every time.4. The AA ability Conservation for rangers does not work on the new Alchimest potions from Isle of Mara.

Noaani

05-27-2009, 05:46 PM

<cite>Ishidaa@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote>4. The AA ability Conservation for rangers does not work on the new Alchimest potions from Isle of Mara.</blockquote>Do you happen to have screenshots/links of these?The CoB/melee auto attack bug is actually quite funny, but only if it doesn't make it live.

Vodr

05-27-2009, 05:54 PM

The RA is a refreshing and very different aspect to the game, however one thing this game lacks is money sinks which causes mudflation. What I would like to see for example, T8 master is 29 days to research it from a ad3, however pay the research assistant say 25p to reduce the time in 1/2 which pricing can be inflated through the expansions.Say on like a level 50 master 2-4p to reduce the time in 1/2 etc. This way you have a great moneysink in the game and give the RA some extra dimension.

feldon30

05-27-2009, 06:06 PM

feldon30

05-27-2009, 06:11 PM

<cite>Kordran wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite><blockquote>I still think the answers to this problem instead of Research Assistants should have been:<ul><li>Add level 30, 40, and 50 contested x2 mobs with these rare masters on their loot table.</li><li>Provide T8 (71-80) upgrades of all un-upgraded spells.</li><li>A difficult Signature quest that rewards choice of Illusionist, Conjuror, or Necro pet master.</li></ul></blockquote>1. Forcing players to mentor and farm low tier raid mobs for non-upgradable masters is fail, plain and simple. Progression means going forwards, not backwards, and not stalling yourself at specific tiers. If you want to require players to kill mobs for them, then add all non-upgradables to the loot tables for all mobs at the appriopriate tier and beyond. Regardless, I have no idea why you even mention x2 mobs, since both solo and heroic mobs can drop exquisites with a master in them.2. They've already stated that the percentage based spells that weren't upgraded because they've reached a "ceiling" in terms of the design and to increase them wouldn't be good for game balance. That leaves with providing T8 spells that are upgrades in name only, with exactly the same benefits as the lower tier spell? Yeah, that would go over well.3. And here you're singling out specific classses -- two of which are the least desired for groups and raiding -- and requiring them to do a difficult signature quest to get their core master spells. And everyone else does... what, exactly? This too is fail.</blockquote>You're just full of suggestions. Except for ones that would solve the problem.So you don't want T8 versions of these spells in-name-only just so they will at least drop from T8 mobs.You don't want these masters to be smart loot off appropriate tier mobs.You don't want special mobs added just to drop these masters.You don't want questlines to earn these masters.Maybe it's different on your server, but on BB, illusionist and summoner pet masters, if they ever appear on the broker, go for over 1,000p. I don't know any other masters that go for that much except maybe Death March and Dispatch-ed.I don't think the answer is giving away 11 free T8 masters per year just for hailing an NPC.P.S. Some of the complaints about lack of AA can be addressed by running T3-T7 raid zones mentored. We have an 'AA' night and have earned over 300 AA points for our guild members.

Aeralik

05-27-2009, 06:16 PM

<cite>Noaani wrote:</cite><blockquote>The effect on Arcane Robe of Hatred, Marrow's Song, Twelve Tone Earstone, Insisious Robe and probably other items all need to be modified to reflect the spell name changes.Basically, anything that is not a part of a class specific set, yet affects specific spells/CAs needs to be adjusted. Seems that the Harbringer of Malcontent is the only such item that has been adjusted so far.</blockquote>I fixed these up and thanks for pointing them out. If you find any others please let me know.

Aeralik

05-27-2009, 06:34 PM

<cite>Ishidaa@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote>After testing with my ranger, I've found the following bugs:1. When casting Explosive Arrow, the AOE portion is not working correctly. The AOE portion is only hitting the target of explosive arrow, and never the surrounding mobs, which it should be hitting.2. The wounding shot portion of Precision Flightrift Leggings does not add correctly onto the offensive stance, thus there is no way to proc it. This new wounding shot should use ranged crit to base off of when it should be critting. It is currently using spell crit on live servers, so it will require some tweeking in addition to correct the ineffect on offensive stance.3. When Cacophony of Blades is cast the procs of blade chime switch the auto attack to melee. It should not have this effect. For example if you have your bow cued ready for an auto attack and blade chime hits upon the arrow hitting the mob, your auto attack will be switched from ranged to melee every time.4. The AA ability Conservation for rangers does not work on the new Alchimest potions from Isle of Mara.</blockquote>Looking into the first three concerns but the fourth one is probably not going to happen. Those are supposed to be semi rare potions made from special recipes and not your normal tradeskilled items.

Kordran

05-27-2009, 07:39 PM

<cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite><blockquote>You're just full of suggestions. Except for ones that would solve the problem.</blockquote>I've already made my suggestion: implement the RA as a significant plat sink in the game. But the "problem" is largely one of your own creation in your head. Or to put it another way, you're making a mountain out of a molehill here.

Graywindnz

05-27-2009, 07:52 PM

If you going to make a research assistant then in stead of a timer on researching the master have repeatable quests to progress the research, make them like the daily ones in the moors 1 per day.Make people work for the master, your farming for them as it is, I doint like the timer based method it seems to easy.. Collect some components, kill some beasties etc etc, even get a void shard or elemental shard

Xalmat

05-27-2009, 08:00 PM

<cite>Graywindnz wrote:</cite><blockquote>If you going to make a research assistant then in stead of a timer on researching the master have repeatable quests to progress the research, make them like the daily ones in the moors 1 per day.Make people work for the master, your farming for them as it is, I doint like the timer based method it seems to easy.. Collect some components, kill some beasties etc etc, even get a void shard or elemental shard</blockquote>What people seem to not realize is that if you wanted your entire spell book to be mastered, and you ONLY utilize the Research Assistant, it's going to take around 5 years. It'll take around 2 years for level 71-80 spells as it is.

lilmohi

05-27-2009, 08:06 PM

<cite>Aeralik wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Ishidaa@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite><blockquote>After testing with my ranger, I've found the following bugs:1. When casting Explosive Arrow, the AOE portion is not working correctly. The AOE portion is only hitting the target of explosive arrow, and never the surrounding mobs, which it should be hitting.2. The wounding shot portion of Precision Flightrift Leggings does not add correctly onto the offensive stance, thus there is no way to proc it. This new wounding shot should use ranged crit to base off of when it should be critting. It is currently using spell crit on live servers, so it will require some tweeking in addition to correct the ineffect on offensive stance.3. When Cacophony of Blades is cast the procs of blade chime switch the auto attack to melee. It should not have this effect. For example if you have your bow cued ready for an auto attack and blade chime hits upon the arrow hitting the mob, your auto attack will be switched from ranged to melee every time.4. The AA ability Conservation for rangers does not work on the new Alchimest potions from Isle of Mara.</blockquote>Looking into the first three concerns but the fourth one is probably not going to happen. Those are supposed to be semi rare potions made from special recipes and not your normal tradeskilled items.</blockquote>I have to say that while i'm happy you are looking into the first 3 not letting an end line aa work on a potion just because it's semi-rare is pretty lame. These aren't the first rare potions introduced to the game and i have a hard time seeing how these potions are so great that a relatively weak aa will just overpower them.<img src="/eq2/images/smilies/e78feac27fa924c4d0ad6cf5819f3554.gif" border="0" />The RA's are great, there are a ton of spells for each class in each tier so even when a new tier is released it's still going to be much faster to buy your masters or get them from mob drops. The only way this will change the economy is people won't be able to gouge the really rare/high demand spells. I know i'd rather buy my offensive stance for 100pp than wait a month for a RA. But no more not being able to find certain critical master for less than 1kpp. What research assistants will do is make all masters roughly the same price (and they will never be cheap) on brokers at least once you get a few months out from an expansion.

Kizee

05-27-2009, 08:14 PM

<cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Noaani wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Deson wrote:</cite><blockquote>There is a lot of unaddressed controversy with the RA and the lack of real responses or explanations in over 100 pages of discussion hasn't helped that at all.</blockquote>QFE imo.If you don't want this thread to turn into a second RA likes/dislikes thread, have Kirstie come in and actually explain the idea behind the [Removed for Content] thing, and maybe even answer some of the more important of the several hundred questions asked in the other thread.</blockquote>If the first post in the RA feedback thread had said:"Here is how we are going to implement Research Assistants. It's going to be free. There's no quest or requirements. It's going to be 30 days for each master. There is no point in arguing. We are not looking to feedback or intend to make any changes. However, here's this thread we've created for entertainment purposes."at least it would have been bluntly honest.Instead we thought -- ok, they are asking for our feedback and will design this feature based on community input.Fooled again!</blockquote>The only feedback we are allowed to offer suggestions on are the spell names and how do we want the message board to be set up...... translation....nothing important.

Morrolan V

05-27-2009, 08:37 PM

Graywindnz

05-27-2009, 08:40 PM

I think this is a great idea and it is not intended to be used to get all your masters, just the hard to get ones.

ArivenGemini

05-27-2009, 09:23 PM

<cite>Aeralik wrote:</cite><blockquote>Looking into the first three concerns but the fourth one is probably not going to happen. Those are supposed to be semi rare potions made from special recipes and not your normal tradeskilled items.</blockquote>Aeralik,Since the entire game up until this change going live has been built with the idea that poisons and procs are boosted by INT and spell bonuses, as evidenced by the fact that the predator line used spell bonus to boost poison damage, are you going to disconnect any +INT or +spell damage adornments from gear of all poison using scouts so they can be sold to recoup the losses on those items that will become worthless?What about those who chose to use some shard gear to boost that as well? are you going to implement some sort of change NPC that will allow you to trade in your hybrid (and as of this change not worth having) gear for class specific shard armor?Dont get me wrong, I think scouts should be purely melee. I like that idea, but the entire game up until now is different in a significant way regarding this than what you propose.. it is going to cost us time, plat, and effort to replace the items that you are invalidating, and while changes to the game are expected, ones that cost us a significant amount of time, effort and plat to accomodate are not very player friendly, and have the effect of causing people to give up and move on.In addition there is precidence in the past to do this, because when other adornments or gear has been invalidated for people they have been removed and placed in inventory, allowing people to recover their investment costs and time.

Gaige

05-27-2009, 10:39 PM

<cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote>There are enough money sinks in this game without adding one more.</blockquote>Name them. I have 2,000 plat with nothing to spend it on outside of temp adorns, potions, poisons and arrows.

Noaani

05-27-2009, 10:41 PM

<cite>ArivenGemini wrote:</cite><blockquote>What about those who chose to use some shard gear to boost that as well? are you going to implement some sort of change NPC that will allow you to trade in your hybrid (and as of this change not worth having) gear for class specific shard armor?</blockquote>Can we set up a DKP return system for mages and, well, most of our gear?

BrainCandy

05-28-2009, 12:44 AM

I am all for the tradeable loot. Part of my enjoyment of this game is browsing the broker for upgrades. As it is right now all I do is search for whatever master spell I am missing and buy consumables like food/drink/totems. This goes for high level toons as well as low level. Because at low levels mastercrafted is the end-all and makes everything else pointless. So maybe now at least at the high end I can browse around for a gear upgrade or two. -BC

Raveen

05-28-2009, 01:07 AM

Ra is cool I have most of my masters but it seems with most classes there are a few spells/ca's that are WAY over priced or never seem to drop lol. Finishing off a few hard to get masters isn't gonna break the game <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> As far as proc changes go I'm not seeing a big difference there and most of my gear is proc based I'll do more testing on this. Seems like im cutting through mobs even faster now. My spells are casting at the speed there intended to don't know if the new GPU stuff has any bearing on that or if its the fact that all the gear isnt making a huge math calculation every time I cast a spell to figure out what the proc will end up at. Love the Hex dolls lol its been awhile since I have used thous in raid <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Player made books will add alot of fun I think. And the new GPU stuff runs great almost doubling my frame rate (I do take in account the test server is way low on the pop)And on the real peeps we pay $15 a month to go slay dragons <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> to escape the perils of the real world. Fire up the intro to the game I bet its been a few years and remember why you play.

Qandor

05-28-2009, 01:32 AM

<cite>Fredd@Splitpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote>Payment of Research Assistants Gungo makes an excellent suggestion, which I agree with completely. As payment you should give the RA a M1 of the same tier as the one you want. This will increase the M1 price on broker in the short term, but it should balance out somewhere a little higher than muter price in the medium term.</blockquote>I would like to nominate the bolded text for understatement of the year....maybe the century.In the current money supply condition, I would venture to guess that there would be no T8 master (no matter how crappy) left on the broker for under 100pp if such a requirement were instituted. There would be mass buying of masters by those who can well afford it just for speculation purposes alone. I would probably buy 100 or so myself if I could get to the broker quick enough.

Hecula

05-28-2009, 03:23 AM

Forgotten Ring of Souls needs to be un-nerfed now that the proc nerf is seemingly going to go forward. Also, the damage of procs needs to be scaled up slightly - loss of DPS is very large. I was getting over 2K DPS on GVB while wearing 4 pieces before the first round of nerfs - granted that was OP. After the first round, I was getting 500-600. Now it's more like 150.

Besual

05-28-2009, 03:28 AM

Adding a pp cost to the RA will only support the plat sellers -> more pp farmer doing their "business" -> disturbing normal game play -> lot of unhappy players.Adding a "master" cost to the RA will only support the farmers -> more farmer doing their "business" -> disturbing normal game play -> lot of unhappy players.Not liking either version.Shards / elemental gizmos won't work too because you can get them only in higher end of T8.The only way I see (without adding a new system of shards / tokes/ whatever with quests / zones to get them) is to use something that is already in game like status or faction.

Noob1974

05-28-2009, 03:43 AM

The Problem with exchange one master from the same tier with another is not so much a problem in this tier. However with the next expansion having a lvl increase means , if you are in a raidofrce/alliance, you have to make a decision if an important master dropps to trade that master in for of yours, or one of your RF memeber find an important class master for you but want to trade it in for an important master of their class.

Noaani

05-28-2009, 04:39 AM

<cite>Besual wrote:</cite><blockquote>Adding a pp cost to the RA will only support the plat sellers</blockquote>The current cost for a master is coin, but is determined by players.How will an SoE based plat cost increase players desire for masters more than it already is, and thus increase their desire for more coin, sending them to plat sellers?Your thought would be valid if it wernt for the fact that people already use plat to obtain masters.

Turb

05-28-2009, 09:38 AM

I don't agree with Research Assistants, but if we must have them can we also get a RA NPC for guildhalls please? There's all sorts of plebs and riffraff in the villages that I have no intention of catching something from.

Deson

05-28-2009, 10:08 AM

<cite>Ratius@Splitpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote>I don't agree with Research Assistants, but if we must have them can we also get a RA NPC for guildhalls please? There's all sorts of plebs and riffraff in the villages that I have no intention of catching something from.</blockquote>I thought I saw it in the patch notes, checking again.<cite>Kirstie wrote:</cite> <blockquote>I have some updated information on this feature for anyone who is still following this thread <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" />There were a few changes made between my initial post and now. The primary one is that we removed the tradeskilled versions of spells and combat arts from the progression of the research assistants. This means that in order to use the research assistant you will have to have scribed one of the tradeskilled versions (APP IV or Adept III) of the spell/ca you want to research.The research assistants are going to be moving out into the world instead of staying in people's homes. You'll find them in many of the places where you would have previously bought App II's. There is also a good chance that we'll be adding a research assistant as a guild hall amenity either in 52 or future update.GU52 will probably hit the test servers on the week of the 18th, and this feature is slated to be part of that. Once it goes to the test server we'll be looking for feedback again on the specifics of the implementation which should be fully spelled out then.- Kirstie</blockquote> Not in the patch notes...wonder where else I saw it.

Besual

05-28-2009, 10:16 AM

<cite>Noaani wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Besual wrote:</cite><blockquote>Adding a pp cost to the RA will only support the plat sellers</blockquote>The current cost for a master is coin, but is determined by players.How will an SoE based plat cost increase players desire for masters more than it already is, and thus increase their desire for more coin, sending them to plat sellers?Your thought would be valid if it wernt for the fact that people already use plat to obtain masters.</blockquote>Some palyers buy plat already. The rare masters go for 300-500p at least. Buying 500pp for 50$ (or whatever the current rate is) to get a master might to much for players but 5$ or 10$ for 50pp or 100pp will lure more playerys to the dark side. And once they bought plat the inhibition threshold to do it again will be lower much lower.

Thunderthyze

05-28-2009, 10:16 AM

Not a huge fan of the new spell/CA naming policy. It just looks a bit confusing when you have t8 abilities and non-upgraded abilities from previous tiers as well as AA skills. Plus I have to keep reminding myself of the names for the skill levels.

Yimway

05-28-2009, 10:40 AM

<cite>Besual wrote:</cite><blockquote>Some palyers buy plat already. The rare masters go for 300-500p at least. Buying 500pp for 50$ (or whatever the current rate is) to get a master might to much for players but 5$ or 10$ for 50pp or 100pp will lure more playerys to the dark side. And once they bought plat the inhibition threshold to do it again will be lower much lower.</blockquote>Hogwash.I frequently buy the rarest masters for guild members using guild coffers. Nothing sells for over 250p.It may be listed for 500p, but nothing sells for 500p.

Dalwhinnie

05-28-2009, 10:46 AM

Bloodthirsty Choker still seems to be effecting Mindbite on Woven Shadow Chestplate on Test.

Thor71457

05-28-2009, 11:31 AM

<cite>Gage wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote>There are enough money sinks in this game without adding one more.</blockquote>Name them. I have 2,000 plat with nothing to spend it on outside of temp adorns, potions, poisons and arrows.</blockquote>Hey Gage You can sent me some of that Plat , will be happy to take some of it off your hands .. Feeding a family of 5 ogre's cost a lot... : )) Send to Icejo Ant Bayle server

Couching

05-28-2009, 12:18 PM

ACHIEVEMENTS General <ul><li>Castable Achievement abilities have been moved to the Combat Art or Spells tab depending on the class and the ability type.</li></ul>Based on LU52 note, brawler tree, wis line, crane whirl is bugged on test server and needs a fix. It's melee damage proc. It should be moved to the Combat Art instead of Spells tab. However, on test server, the crit rate is still based on spell crit chance and the damage can't be modified by + base CA. Please fix it.

feldon30

05-28-2009, 01:50 PM

<cite>Noaani wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>ArivenGemini wrote:</cite><blockquote>What about those who chose to use some shard gear to boost that as well? are you going to implement some sort of change NPC that will allow you to trade in your hybrid (and as of this change not worth having) gear for class specific shard armor?</blockquote>Can we set up a DKP return system for mages and, well, most of our gear?</blockquote>I LOLed.Yeah, every mage worth their salt dumped class-specific gear and loaded up with proc-specific gear. Now it's worthless.

Thunderthyze

05-28-2009, 05:05 PM

<cite>Kiara wrote:</cite><blockquote>Please remember that the purpose of this thread is feedback on the content that is on test. There are many other threads at your disposal for bickering and arguing.Thank you.</blockquote>Nice try Kiara. So far 7 pages and we're still all whining on one way or another about RAs. I did my best, I tried to introduce a discussion about the naming nomenclature but meh!

Dradorin

05-28-2009, 05:37 PM

Regarding Research Assistants,Scenario: You select a level 71-80 level spell to be upgraded to a master. Lets say the assistant says it will take 30days. At day 20 you win the spell/CA that you are having researched. Questions: Can you change your selection and choose another spell/CA? How do you cancel getting the spell you are having researched? If you can change it, do you have to start from scratch for another spell/CA?Thanks for your time,

Eveningsong

05-28-2009, 05:46 PM

Kirstie answered this here <a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?start=1200&topic_id=444889�" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...89�</a>One of the tradeoffs of using a Research Assistant is that you have to wait a while before you get that upgrade. So if you are out adventuring and have a spell/ca drops you'll have to make the call if you want it right now or you want to give up some of that time you've had the researcher working.As it is implemented now, if you change what the researcher is working on you'll be refuded one third of the days he's been working on the spell. So if he's been working 10 days on a spell you'll get 3 days back (it's rounded down) to apply to the next thing you want to research whether he's part way through the research or all finished.- Kirstie

Dradorin

05-28-2009, 05:57 PM

<cite>Eveningsong wrote:</cite><blockquote>Kirstie answered this here <a rel="nofollow" href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?start=1200&topic_id=444889�" target="_blank">http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...89?</a>One of the tradeoffs of using a Research Assistant is that you have to wait a while before you get that upgrade. So if you are out adventuring and have a spell/ca drops you'll have to make the call if you want it right now or you want to give up some of that time you've had the researcher working.As it is implemented now, if you change what the researcher is working on you'll be refuded one third of the days he's been working on the spell. So if he's been working 10 days on a spell you'll get 3 days back (it's rounded down) to apply to the next thing you want to research whether he's part way through the research or all finished.- Kirstie</blockquote>Thank you for pointing me to the answer... Much appreciated.

speedycerv

05-29-2009, 04:23 AM

I found a possible bug for Epic weapons that have damage procs:The Talon Strike proc on the Eagle's Talon is still spell based and this is probably why it has the "cannot be modified" tag. This should be able to be modified and then changed to ranged crit. Most of the scout's abilities that were spell are being moved to other types of damage, so a proc on a ranger's epic, should have the corresponding damage type(in this case ranged, in the case of the assassin epic, it should be melee).I'm not sure if the damage portion of procs on epics was supposed to have the tag "cannot be modified" just like any other piece of proc gear since it is a signature item that most characters would use and thus the proc should be valueable moreso than just any other proc gear. I wasn't able to test the assassin epic since i don't have one with the epic, but the damage portion of that epic has the "cannot be modified" just like the ranger one.

Coniaric

05-29-2009, 04:27 AM

<cite>Qandor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Fredd@Splitpaw wrote:</cite><blockquote>Payment of Research Assistants Gungo makes an excellent suggestion, which I agree with completely. As payment you should give the RA a M1 of the same tier as the one you want. This will increase the M1 price on broker in the short term, but it should balance out somewhere a little higher than muter price in the medium term.</blockquote>I would like to nominate the bolded text for understatement of the year....maybe the century.In the current money supply condition, I would venture to guess that there would be no T8 master (no matter how crappy) left on the broker for under 100pp if such a requirement were instituted. There would be mass buying of masters by those who can well afford it just for speculation purposes alone. I would probably buy 100 or so myself if I could get to the broker quick enough.</blockquote>Likewise. I'm not sure if trading in another master for a choice of your own is really viable. Especially when it comes to the broker. Prices may go up and stay up there - no matter if the masters are pointless or least used - they're all "valuable" for trading to Assistants.Other thing, if players don't want to buy overpriced master books, they will resort to going to group instances. If a master dropped by chance, what will stop all 6 from rolling Need for it? The player may get lucky, or not. Once again, we're back to the randomness which the RA's supposedly to be in game to help with.Just some thoughts on the potential outcomes if this suggestion of payment is added.

Deson

05-29-2009, 10:40 AM

The near perfect solution for "greed" need was posted months ago-- change need to scribe in the case of masters.

bryldan

05-29-2009, 10:47 AM

<cite>Deson wrote:</cite><blockquote>The near perfect solution for "greed" need was posted months ago-- change need to scribe in the case of masters.</blockquote>I would LOVE this idea because both you and I know that the guy who just got one of his masters drops will more than likely still roll need on the master even if he has it.

Teircen

05-29-2009, 04:41 PM

Just for feedback sake:I very much appreciate the new player-made books. It's an outlook for role playing, creativity, and more. They look great. Thank you.Research assistant. This one is hostly contested but for the sake of feedback I'll add that I very much like them. My thoughts on them:1 lvl 80 master / month is not unbalanced. As it stands some people do have enough time and money to buy or aquire all their masters. My main has seen a lot of masters drop but very few for his class and has only won 1 of them. He's bought 1 other and been given 1 other. Heck I've given away more masters than I have. I make a fair bit of money but not as much as some others and I've just been unlucky in drops. If I wanted to spend all my money on masters I'd have most but not all. Some just are very rarely up on broker on my server and when they are paying 200-300p is ludicrous. I know a lot of casual players who put the time they can into the game and they just can't pay anywhere near that kind of money.Can someone earn that kind of money? Sure. Can everyone who really is trying to play well? Absolutely not. The game should not be only for the elitist crowd only. Nor should it pander to the lowest common denominator.I think the RA does a good job. One T8 master in the month is not going to destroy the market even if every T8 person does it. It'll bring the cost down, sure, but raiders and anyone with the money who needs them anyhow are not going to wait 30 months to get all their masters. I see this as a very reasonable normalizing impact on the market.If anything I would like to see a way to speed it up a little but the cost would have to be fair in time and work. Add some quest that a small group could do to earn supplies or something. Make the person put time and effort into speeding it up, just don't make it so it requires raid-equipped people to do it. I see the RA as a way for casual players to get some of the rewards (with time and work) that raid geared people get so very much faster. It's just nice that raiders can benefit from it equally as well so it's not unbalancing to them. It should stay that way.(And that's IF any changes. I wouldn't say it's necessary or anywhere near it. 1 a month is fair enough I think at end game)The spell name changes to make them more consistent is not something I really like. I think it takes flavor out of the game but it's not a game breaker for me. I can see where it's the direction Sony wanted to go and I'll live with it.The rest, I'm still looking over but so far I haven't seen anythign that I really think breaks things or will hurt the game. Some of it should improve the game for me as far as I'm concerned.I'm looking forward to this GU.

Kordran

05-29-2009, 06:11 PM

<cite>Coniaric wrote:</cite><blockquote>Just some thoughts on the potential outcomes if this suggestion of payment is added.</blockquote>The RAs are a done deal, it was posted in the other thread (specific to the issue) that they're going forward with them as is. So discussion of a payment system, or the merits thereof, is just a waste of bandwith at this point. We'll just have to wait and see how it shakes out over the next few months.

Kain-UK

05-29-2009, 10:07 PM

Regarding the re-naming of spell "qualities"...Apprentice 1 to Apprentice, Adept 1 to Adept... ok, no problem. What about Summoners mythical pets? On live, the spells they throw are currently listed as "Master IV". On Test Copy, they've been lumped with the "Grandmaster" tag, which would imply "Master II" quality.Display issue or have these actually been downgraded?

Mulethree

05-31-2009, 12:09 AM

Theres something called 'a shardhammer sentinal' out on the ice sheet near the rime merchants and such. I've never seen it tho its killed me twice - the second time I was on the look out and hunting for it.. I got to target it - 80^^^ - after it starts hitting me - but still couldn't see it - its either invisible or underground in the ice, can't be targetted with tab etc. It does some nasty slashing dot that will kill you in seconds - 5000 dps seems excessive for an 80^^^There are merchants and ?menders? out there and giants that appear to be hailable (greyed hail option - too far ) but I don't see quests showing on the map. How does one improve Rime faction? Presumably the shardhammer sentinals are on a rime faction?Punja the haggler has nothing to say to me - i have almost +15,000 bellywhumper faction and refuse to harvest snakes for them 100 times. There appear to be quest burynai NPC's near the Kurns entrance - tho they just say 'hail dialogue' atm, will they help the bellywhumper faction? It does let me into both kurns instances. I got an 'In honor of the Fallen' quest from a burynai corpse in kurns and it says it rewards at least 2 plat Faction 0 The Bellywhumpers. I suppose the zero is a bug or why list faction at all? Patch notes say "Citizens of Dreg’s Landing in Kylong Plains, Riliss in Fens of Nathsar, the City of Jinisk in Kunzar Jungle and Danak in Jarsath Wastes " Kaitheel's thread says "Citizens of Dreg's Landing in Kylong Plains, Sathir's Span in Fens of Nathsar, the City of Jinisk in Kunzar Jungle and Danak's Upper Command Camp in Jarsath Wastes " Which is an improvement - I looked all over Danak and Riliss before I saw his note saying sathirs span and upper command camp. I looked all over dregs landing and didn't find any quests and haven't been to Jinsk. "Killing NPCs will now accumulate achievement experience faster. " About 2,000 solo 80 no-arrow kills to make 1AA @ 194AA's - vs 10,000 on live for 1AA @197AA's. about 5X better. The AAXP meter seems flakey sometimes needing 3 kills to move one pixel and other times moving 2 pixels on one kill. You currently have bubbles for 10ths and 100ths, perhaps you need another row for 1000ths so theres actually a visible indication of the reward for an action.

madha

06-01-2009, 06:03 PM

<cite>Mulethree wrote:</cite><blockquote>Theres something called 'a shardhammer sentinal' out on the ice sheet near the rime merchants and such. I've never seen it tho its killed me twice - the second time I was on the look out and hunting for it.. I got to target it - 80^^^ - after it starts hitting me - but still couldn't see it - its either invisible or underground in the ice, can't be targetted with tab etc. It does some nasty slashing dot that will kill you in seconds - 5000 dps seems excessive for an 80^^^There are merchants and ?menders? out there and giants that appear to be hailable (greyed hail option - too far ) but I don't see quests showing on the map. How does one improve Rime faction? Presumably the shardhammer sentinals are on a rime faction?Punja the haggler has nothing to say to me - i have almost +15,000 bellywhumper faction and refuse to harvest snakes for them 100 times. There appear to be quest burynai NPC's near the Kurns entrance - tho they just say 'hail dialogue' atm, will they help the bellywhumper faction? It does let me into both kurns instances. I got an 'In honor of the Fallen' quest from a burynai corpse in kurns and it says it rewards at least 2 plat Faction 0 The Bellywhumpers. I suppose the zero is a bug or why list faction at all? Patch notes say "Citizens of Dreg’s Landing in Kylong Plains, Riliss in Fens of Nathsar, the City of Jinisk in Kunzar Jungle and Danak in Jarsath Wastes " Kaitheel's thread says "Citizens of Dreg's Landing in Kylong Plains, Sathir's Span in Fens of Nathsar, the City of Jinisk in Kunzar Jungle and Danak's Upper Command Camp in Jarsath Wastes " Which is an improvement - I looked all over Danak and Riliss before I saw his note saying sathirs span and upper command camp. I looked all over dregs landing and didn't find any quests and haven't been to Jinsk. "Killing NPCs will now accumulate achievement experience faster. " About 2,000 solo 80 no-arrow kills to make 1AA @ 194AA's - vs 10,000 on live for 1AA @197AA's. about 5X better. The AAXP meter seems flakey sometimes needing 3 kills to move one pixel and other times moving 2 pixels on one kill. You currently have bubbles for 10ths and 100ths, perhaps you need another row for 1000ths so theres actually a visible indication of the reward for an action. </blockquote>i experienced these gems of a mob and with 2 players we both died without ever seeing the mobnone of the npc giants say anythign when you hail them. no idea seems unfinished atm.

chogan

06-01-2009, 09:04 PM

New changes will weaken toxic expertise.On the surface changing 56% spell crit to 16% we can already see that damage will be lost.old damage = (.56 * 1.35%) + (.44 * 1) = 1.196new damage = 1.16On top of this rangers using enhance: caustic poison that increases caustic poison by 10% or a preditor using Sinister toxins from equipment (increase player made poisons by 10%)old damage = 1.196 * 1.10 = 1.3156new damage 1 + .16 + .10 = 1.26Rangers with Sinister toxins and enhance: caustic poison with toxic expertiseold damage 1.196 * (1 + .1 + .1) = 1.4352new damage 1 + .16 + 1 + 1 = 1.36In general preditors will lose 3.6% poison damageRangers and those with sinister toxins will lose 5.56% damageand Rangers with sinister toxins will lose 7.56% damageOn top of this i did some testing the new change and got these resultsPreditor Achievement skill claims to raise poison damage by 16% at 8 ranks.Test Procedure.Reset Preditor Achievements.Reset Ranger Achievements.Remove all equiped items.Gain Preditor achievement - 4 ranks Nightshades Intellegence.Gain Preditor achievement - 4 ranks Poison combinationGain Preditor achievement - 4 ranks Nurotoxic coatingExamine item Expert's Caustic Poison.Note current damage - 683Gain Preditor achievement - 8 ranks Toxic Expertise.Examine item Expert's Caustic Poison.Note current damage - 699Expected damage 683 * 1.16 = 792Actual increase (699-683)/683 = 2.3% Did some further combination testing with expert's caustic poison as examine targetBase no gear or achievement = 665no gear, 4 nightshade's intellegence = 683 28 int increases damage by 18 or 1 int = .64 poison damageno gear, 4 NI, 8 toxic expertise (16% increase) = 699no gear, 5 enhance: caustic poison (10% increase) = 731sebilite croaking dirk gives 10% increase and 15 int = 741 15 int increases damage by 10 or 1 int = .66 poison damagedirk, 5 enhance: caustic poison = 808+256 int gear = 826 256 int increases damage by 161 or 1 int = .62 poison damage+256 int gear, enhance:caustic poison = 909cannot determine stacking mods right now since only have 2 different 10% mods to stack and not enough variance to determine 1.10 * 1.10 = 1.21, 1 + .1 + .1 = 1.2 .01 is not enough to account for rounding errors so going to assume addition because it gives lower bonuses.From these figures we can see...Toxic expertise doesn't work.Even if toxic expertise worked preditors would lose damage, and rangers would lose even more damage. Intellegence increases are increasing poison damage by roughly 1 int to .65 damage at lower intellegence (sub 200? or 500?). Does this go against "This spell can not be modified except by direct means"?Edit forgot about poison mitigation debuff, will also cause anoth 2/3% drop in poison damage because of these changesold preditor damage = 1.196 * 1.20 (decent debuff mod) = 1.4352new preditor damage = 1.16 * 1.20 (decent debuff mod) = 1.3921.435 - 1.392 = 4.3%old +10% damage = 1.3156 * 1.20 = 1.57872new +10% damage = 1.26 * 1.20 = 1.5121.57872 - 1.512 = 6.67%and rangers with sinister toxins will loseold +20% damage = 1.4352 * 1.2 = 1.72224new +20% damage = 1.36 * 1.2 = 1.6321.72224 - 1.632 = 9%so update In general preditors will lose 4.3% poison damagerangers or those with sinister toxins will lose 6.67%and rangers with sinister toxins will lose 9% poison damagePreditors do not get any spell crit except that given from AA and this was soley for increasing the DPS of poisonsSuggestions:Increase toxic expertise to 20% at rank 8 (2.5% per rank) and increase enhance: caustic poison to 13% at rank 5 (2.6% per rank) If "This spell can not be modified except by direct means" means int does not modify applied poison damage and gets fixed then crafted poisons will need the damage values increased.

feldon30

06-02-2009, 11:31 AM

<cite>Gage wrote:</cite><blockquote>Selling loot rights isn't the same as fabled loot being attuneable. Loot rights have a finite amount of time before they get looted by the group/raid and transmuted. The chest doesn't sit there forever.So you have to have people on willing to buy the item, they have to be not locked out of the zone and they have to be able to get there before the chest poofs.Making fabled drops attuneable bypasses all of that. Now you loot it, set it on the broker and forget about it and anyone is able to purchase it at their leisure.To compare them is silly.</blockquote>Gage,I agree with you on many things, but I do not agree with you here. I do not see a distinction between the two.It sounds like you are just trying to protect your guild's income from selling loot rights. There is no difference whatsoever between folks coming to your saved instance zone, and using the mechanics of exquisite chests and looting to buy an item, than just buying it off the broker for the same amount of plat.If the price drops, it will because there are other guilds on your server clearing the same content but are uninterested in doing the public loot auction shuffle and so just currently mute these items.

Pexsus

06-02-2009, 09:24 PM

If the trend of pushing MASSIVE GU's on to test with half finished content and broken core mechanics is one that is going to continue then I think you really need to conisder some kind of in-game CS presence on the test servers. Honestly, I dont mind the bugs. It's a test server, that is to be expected. But the lack of any resolution to questions and problems is dishearteneing to people trying to wade through the mess and actually test the content.The TSO beta is a great example. There were CS reps and devs in-game that were available to address concerns, broadcast warnings/alerts that people needed to know about, they facilitated group/raid setups and just generally assisted the testing process. Honestly, I enjoy the "first look" offered by playing on test and betas. With the addition of the /testcopy command I will happily offer my feedback on anything thrown out on test, but the simple fact that it is a test server, and generally low population, makes any kind of serious testing/feedback without some kind of support difficult at best.