Brigands need work

[Blindside]

<p>First off, need to change our Mythical to piercing, or change the items to have + to pierce and slash(Chainlinks of Hatred and Enchanted Dagger of the Warmaster).</p><p><strong>Dps needs a boost</strong>. I do think our single target needs work if you dont plan on giving us any type of aoe dps because in our current state, aoe dps is a joke. Single target the Swashbuckler shouldnt hit higher numbers due to their dominant numbers on encounter fights. Barroom Negotiation is a joke compaired to Swathe. Swathe and Sack hit harder then Enfeeblement with 30 sec shorter recast timers. If anything our Dispatched, Blood Rake and Enfeeblement need a boost in damage for being on a 1 min recast timer. We get no type of dps temp buff like the other rouge class. A flurry or proc temp buff would be nice</p><p>Tenure - Increases duration <strong>AND BASE DAMAGE</strong>  by 12%</p><p>Will to Survive - Worthless AA, at least increase the damage 20-30%</p><p>Plank Walker - Should be 25 base 10 trigger percent</p><p><strong>Just a few ideas to improve our class so we are not so [Removed for Content] and have more people betray to Swashbucklers <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/e78feac27fa924c4d0ad6cf5819f3554.gif" border="0" /></strong></p>

[allegacy]

<p>I am in agreement with you.</p><p>Some tweaking can be done to our class all together. I wrote a PM to someone important on the boards in hope that our Will to Survive Post would get some attention. Said person said they would work on passing the post and info along the chain of command, but nothing has come of that so far and its been a week or so. Maybe a tad longer.</p><p>Just a side note, IMO Thieves Guild should have been our equivalant to Insight. I always thought it should have been changed to such.</p><p>Back again to the meat of your post, am in full agreement.</p>

[Turb]

<p>I think Will to Survive could be more useful, sure, it's 'OK' but nothing really class defining.</p><p>Our DPS is OK imo, after all we do a lot of dps through our debuffs, it's just that the extra dps is reported as done by other players <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />     Look at the difference in raid dps with a brig there or a brig absent - that's the real dps we do.</p><p>But WTS and TG could be improved (without needing to raise our dps).</p>

[Arctic_Wulfe]

<p>Ugh. Ok, I've tried to not post in these kinds of threads, because I know that it's going to turn into an argument, and then dissolve into a d**k waving contest, but I can't take this anymore.</p><p> We are single target dps. Our entire class is geared entirely to be good at doing single target dps. We don't need another AoE, and I don't want to make our class a swashbuckler clone.</p><p>Tenure is already awesome beyond belief, and your suggestion would simply make it absurdly overpowered.</p><p>As a class, we have probably the second highest of "invisible" dps. I know this sucks when we're trying to keep on par with other classes in act, but it's simply a known fact that our debuffs improve the entire raid's dps, and is the reason we are sought after.  WTS is simply an extension of this, and is an awesome AA for brigands.</p><p> Oh, and we're not "[Removed for Content]" and if people are betraying from brig to swashy, that's fine. While we are sought after, you really only need one in a raid. So I can understand if people get frustrated and betray.</p>

[Turb]

<p>Indeed, if you want to top dps parse, roll an assassin.</p>

[allegacy]

<p>It's basically a post about trying to improve some area's of the class. Which TBH any and all class's have the right to feedback about what they experience. That is basically, what is being done here.</p><p>People saying that we dont need change and we are fine, are basically lumping the good and bad together, and just swallowing it and not pushing for some tweaks. Which is just fine, it is within their own right so speak about the class they play. But to sit there and knock other's feedback from a armchair saying its just fine isnt much of a debate.</p><p>Will to Survive has been noted that it needs a change. This has been acknowledge'd on both popular site's forums.</p><p>Amazing Reflexes , what was once a very Amazing ability, has been toned down ( nerfed ) and is now in such a broken state , that people would like it fixed.</p><p>Hood of Thug's... must we say anymore. ? A scout casting pets. This one could REALLY be done away with.</p><p>Shenanigans... it was fun back about 2 years ago.</p><p>Thieve's Guild... cmon guys, you know this one was definately due for a change.</p><p>Most of , if not all beta feedback has been against said things and wishing for change, yet we havent recieved the attention that we needed. So therefore we will ask for it... whether it gets changed or not, its just to remind them, hey we are still around.</p>

[SinIsLaw]

<p>Tbh, I feel that the Brigand class has been put on a shelf by SoE the last 2 years ... and in one way or the other all other classes have progressed further!</p><p>Nothing "fresh" or "wow look at that" has been seen for us as a class, weather it's our Mythical, the Brigand or TSO AA line... Add to this that the KOS WIS line is imho due for a revamp for ages!!</p><p>I personally would love to see Enfeeblement and Rake line to be cut down to 30 seconds recast/duration! Right in zones where you clear trash for example, you end up with to much down time. Enfeeblement/Rake can only be used on like every second encounter! This would also give us a small boost in DPS, which wouldn't throw the world out of balance ...</p><p>Certain CAs, as mentioned here (Hood of Thugs, Shenanigans, Thieves guild) are in desperate need to be change! I can't recall when I managed to trigger Shenanigans in a group the last time, since a competant tank will grab aggro right back before ... The new AEs we got over the past year HoT/ TG are just a sad joke.</p><p>And sadly, the way this game runs right now, DoubleUp "has been nerfed" as well if you ask me! Lag is a HUGE factor, and adding more and more DS/KBs to the mobs has made DU far less efficient then it used to be!</p>

[allegacy]

<p><cite>Durancer@Runnyeye wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Tbh, I feel that the Brigand class has been put on a shelf by SoE the last 2 years ... and in one way or the other all other classes have progressed further!</p><p>Nothing "fresh" or "wow look at that" has been seen for us as a class, weather it's our Mythical, the Brigand or TSO AA line... Add to this that the KOS WIS line is imho due for a revamp for ages!!</p><p>I personally would love to see Enfeeblement and Rake line to be cut down to 30 seconds recast/duration! Right in zones where you clear trash for example, you end up with to much down time. Enfeeblement/Rake can only be used on like every second encounter! This would also give us a small boost in DPS, which wouldn't throw the world out of balance ...</p><p>Certain CAs, as mentioned here (Hood of Thugs, Shenanigans, Thieves guild) are in desperate need to be change! I can't recall when I managed to trigger Shenanigans in a group the last time, since a competant tank will grab aggro right back before ... The new AEs we got over the past year HoT/ TG are just a sad joke.</p><p>And sadly, the way this game runs right now, DoubleUp "has been nerfed" as well if you ask me! Lag is a HUGE factor, and adding more and more DS/KBs to the mobs has made DU far less efficient then it used to be!</p></blockquote><p>Amen.</p>

[Grumble69]

<p>Given the issues that some of the other classes have, the devs are probably tickled pink with how brigs are.  I don't think we're going to see anything soon.</p>

[allegacy]

<p>It does not change the fact that we still need some adjustments made to our class.</p><p>There has been a lot of solid feedback streamed through these posts.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Yuriz@Splitpaw wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Hood of Thug's... must we say anymore. ? A scout casting pets. This one could REALLY be done away with.</p></blockquote><p><span style="color: #00ccff;">This wouldn't be so bad if they actually did something... besides die in 1 sec.</span></p>

[Xalmat]

<p>Coming from a Tank point of view, the only thing Brigands need is less hate generation. It's a pain in the butt trying to hold aggro over you guys <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/2e207fad049d4d292f60607f80f05768.gif" border="0" /></p>

[Evilslayerz]

<p>Also not to mention what was posted above but we brigs shouldnt be out dpes by coercers and illy's, especially illy's its just plain stupid</p>

[Xalmat]

<p><cite>Evilslayerz wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Also not to mention what was posted above but we brigs shouldnt be out dpes by coercers and illy's, especially illy's its just plain stupid</p></blockquote><p>If you're being outparsed by illys, you're doing something wrong. Coercers on the other hand are a wee bit overpowered.</p>

[Kegofbud]

<p><cite>Akodia@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Yuriz@Splitpaw wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Hood of Thug's... must we say anymore. ? A scout casting pets. This one could REALLY be done away with.</p></blockquote><p><span style="color: #00ccff;">This wouldn't be so bad if they actually did something... besides die in 1 sec.</span></p></blockquote><p>Come on. They also run back and forth like idiots on multimob encounters. That has to count for something.</p>

[Sticknstab]

<p>You've obviously never played with a good illusionist.  Considering they're one of the most powerful classes right now and are doing 20k+ ZW's on trash.   This class has had nothing good added to it only things taken from it.  Every other DPS class is getting boosts and perks while ours stay the same or become useless.   Get rid of Thugs , shenanigans, thieves guild and all the useless defense boost abilites in our AA lines.  We're not tanks we don't want that worthless crap.  Replace all that with DPS CA's or abilities.</p>

[Coho1]

<p>I agree our myth should be piercing.</p><p>Change "Will to live" to a feint death. I'd live longer...<img src="/eq2/images/smilies/97ada74b88049a6d50a6ed40898a03d7.gif" border="0" /></p>

[Chiodos]

<p><cite>Xalmat wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Evilslayerz wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Also not to mention what was posted above but we brigs shouldnt be out dpes by coercers and illy's, especially illy's its just plain stupid</p></blockquote><p>If you're being outparsed by illys, you're doing something wrong. Coercers on the other hand are a wee bit overpowered.</p></blockquote><p>until they start making raid / high end encounters where the cc portion of enchanters abilities is actually relevant why shouldnt they be doing high dmg?</p>

[lazlo1]

<p><cite>Chiodos05 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Xalmat wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Evilslayerz wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Also not to mention what was posted above but we brigs shouldnt be out dpes by coercers and illy's, especially illy's its just plain stupid</p></blockquote><p>If you're being outparsed by illys, you're doing something wrong. Coercers on the other hand are a wee bit overpowered.</p></blockquote><p>until they start making raid / high end encounters where the cc portion of enchanters abilities is actually relevant why shouldnt they be doing high dmg?</p></blockquote><p>Enchanters bring alot of group bufs I think thats the point. Brigands are basically 1 trick ponies and we are made to pay for that over and over. We have no group bufs to speak of.</p><p>Compared to swashies, its hard to take parsing slightly less on single tagets and getting owned on groups. Illys can parse right with brigs and coercers own us. Most classes have increased their dps more of late that brigs. The brig AAs are very lack luster. A slight boost in dps would get us back where we should be.</p>

[Grumble69]

<p><cite>Evilslayerz wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Also not to mention what was posted above but we brigs shouldnt be out dpes by coercers and illy's, especially illy's its just plain stupid</p></blockquote><p>I can live with the casters beating me out.  But I've been spanked by a priest before.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Turb]

<p>I expect brigs contribute more to raid dps than even raw 'T1' dps, simply from debuffs.</p><p>The issue is how dps is reported/parsed.</p><p>A chanter does dps when another player with a buff hits a mob.</p><p>If the extra dps the raid did due to our three main debuffs were credited to us, noone would moan.</p><p>Dirges could certainly argue the same from CoB etc.</p><p>It's a shame we can't see such numbers - it would certainly be interesting <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Dalwhinnie]

<p><cite>Ratius@Splitpaw wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Indeed, if you want to top dps parse, roll an assassin.</p></blockquote><p>I rolled in beta and I missed the memo that rogues(swash & brigs) wouldn't measure up to rangers(rangers & assassins) dps wise. Just because SOE can't retain developers or maintain continuity of design; I don't feel a loyal player base should have to reroll.  I am sure necros an conjs from day one feel the same. I am ok with specific fights being dominated by certain classes but if you chose to play evil over good it shouldn't have made you a debuffer vs. aoe dps.  I realize everything evolves but in my opinion the current discrepancies are more from neglect than design.</p>

[rucni]

<p><tr><td height="28" valign="top"><table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td colspan="2"><span style="font-size: 12px; color: #ffffff;"><p style="font-family: verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif;"> Get rid of Thugs , shenanigans, thieves guild and all the useless defense boost abilites in our AA lines.  We're not tanks we don't want that worthless crap.  Replace all that with DPS CA's or abilities.</p></span></td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr><tr><td colspan="2" height="1"><p>My main is a Brig and if you have the right classes in a group thieves guild a awesome put on a bard or enchanter. shenanigans has saved my butt several times on name fight getting in the last killing blow when the rest of the group is almost dead. Now thugs need some work. </p><p>And as for Brigs tanking spec them right and they are awesome tanks. Before i got my myth i was tanking crypt of agony and VOES in 20minutes each zone.</p></td></tr></p>

[jaguarjp]

<p>The best point I read thus far in this thread mentioned that, although the DPS parse of the actual Brigand may be lower than you'd like, the DPS of the group or raid is heightened due to Dispatched, Enfeeblement, and Blood Rake.</p><p>I'm ok with that. One thing I would like to see is Will to Survive changed to a permabuff that changes our rear only attacks to rear/flanking, and our rear/flanking attacks to non-positional. But that's probably asking for too much, huh?</p>

[jaguarjp]

<p>I just came up with a sweet idea for a Shenanigans re-work: have it function as a Feign Death that only works if you are #1 on the hate list - and when you feign, the amount of hate you have over the #2 person (the difference, in other words) gets transferred to them.</p><p>Or heck, redo Will to Survive and make it work like this. Then, the ability would even match the name!</p>