Trying to pick a healer / Future Use: Raiding [Archive]

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Nodecodiver

04-11-2009, 10:48 PM

Ok, a little backstory, then I'll ask my question thats sure to start a fight, but I just don't know how else to find out.I've played a healer in pretty much every MMO to date. It's like, my thing.I've been playing a Templar (Level 35). I like DD/Regen Healing. Do the math, lol.Anyways, I feel.... useless. I know Temps are probaby pretty good healers, and maybe I am missing something, but the reactive heals just don't seem to do anything. I find myself spamming group heal and wearing out my small DD heals that don't even move peoples healthbars.I know my spells are low rank, but I've looked at the higher ranks, and the numbers aren't bigger to the point where I think I would see a huge different in performance.It just seems like the reactive heals STOP incoming damage. They don't really heal the person. And even though the damage is stopped, my DD heals are too weak to make a different.The heal that comes AOE off a dying mob and group heal are the best my Templar has in terms of really filling up healthbars. I have one big DD heal with a 2-3 secondn recast on it.All in all, I guess Reactive healing is just not my STYLE. I'm sure it works fine, Templars raid all the time. But for me, right now, it just seems like I'm really not able to keep a group up. Especially with a caster getting beat on. Because my biggest reactive hits for 200 something. He gets hit for 500 something. It's just gonna work out in the end.So, my question is.I want to be a good DD/Regen healer. Does Mystic or Warden fit the bill?Does a Mystic or Warden stack up in a raid against a Templar?Do I need to be playing an Inquisitor? Do they get better DD heals?Thanks for the input guys.

Paleskinn

04-12-2009, 11:03 AM

Welcome to EQ2. I'll defend the Templar way of things a bit.The way reactives work, they heal if damage is taken, but before it is actually taken. This will cause the reactive tick to be wasted if the target is at 100% health, but will also save the target's life if the hit would have killed him. Our direct heals are also cheap when compared to other classes, so it's a non-issue to use them. For mystics, on the other hand, direct heals are slow to cast and expensive.When it comes to pure HPS, Templars are Kings of the Hill, hands down. But due to the way reactives work, we have trouble keeping squishies (read: mages) up. For mages in particular, we get the Reverence line, which heals based on power consumed by the target. It's very effective at keeping power sucking toons up.Reactives are not the only means of healing Templars have. Something Templars are often overlooked for by newbies, but is actually a huge part of being a Templar, are our buffs. Once you're in the 70s and get to squeeze out Shield Ally (AGI line AA), you'll know what I mean. SA + Stoneskin Proc can effectively HALF incoming damage on a given target. And you're not even doing anything yet.If you're looking into raiding, you defo need to look deeper into templars. However, the road to raid-ready is long, and templars are not the most enjoyable class for the journey, especially if it's your first toon. It is, however, worth noting that templars can solo, and are capable of soloing things that certain other classes can't. But it's slow, and can become boring for some persons.There is no "best" healer class, whatever you might hear. All 6 of the priests can and will heal a heroic group through anything but the thoughest content. They are all very different, though. You might want to try and level some of those classes to 30, or 50 if you have the patience.As for other classes (not subclasses), druids are regen healers, and shamans are damage prevention healers. Clerics fall somewhat in between those two types. Game mechanics make shamans work first, then clerics, then druids. When a player is hit, and assuming one of each class is watching on him, first up, shaman wards are eaten. If the wards aren't able to eat up all the damage, a tick of each reactive placed on the target is eaten, diminishing the incoming damage. If that's not enough, the player health will drop fast. That's when druids shine. HoTs (Heals over Time) are the best thing there is to replenish a health bar while a shaman keeps more incoming damage from happening.You will find, that when playing solo-heal as a druid, the tank's healthbar is "dancing" all the time, as HoTs work their magic agains incoming damage. As a cleric, this might happen on spike damage, but the tank won't drop pats 80% unless you're slacking or the mob is just too strong. Shamans will rarely see the health bar drop at all, but when the tank goes beyond 50%, the shamans sweat blood.In my humble opinion, the road to 80 is most enjoyable playing a Mystic, a Warden or an Inquisitor. But that's just me.

Sandain666

04-12-2009, 02:55 PM

I want to be a good DD/Regen healer. Does Mystic or Warden fit the bill?Mystics are warders, we are best at preventing damage. If you want regen go WardenDoes a Mystic or Warden stack up in a raid against a Templar?Not entirely sure what you mean here. Mystics , Wardens and Temps are all great in a raid played by a skilled player. At higher levels the person behind the character means much more than the class.Do I need to be playing an Inquisitor? Do they get better DD heals?Inquisitors are highly desired in a raid environment but again if you are se ton regen look to Warden/Fury

iduckie

04-12-2009, 10:52 PM

<cite>Nodecodiver wrote:</cite><blockquote>Ok, a little backstory, then I'll ask my question thats sure to start a fight, but I just don't know how else to find out.I've played a healer in pretty much every MMO to date. It's like, my thing.I've been playing a Templar (Level 35). I like DD/Regen Healing. Do the math, lol.Anyways, I feel.... useless. I know Temps are probaby pretty good healers, and maybe I am missing something, but the reactive heals just don't seem to do anything. I find myself spamming group heal and wearing out my small DD heals that don't even move peoples healthbars.I know my spells are low rank, but I've looked at the higher ranks, and the numbers aren't bigger to the point where I think I would see a huge different in performance.It just seems like the reactive heals STOP incoming damage. They don't really heal the person. And even though the damage is stopped, my DD heals are too weak to make a different.The heal that comes AOE off a dying mob and group heal are the best my Templar has in terms of really filling up healthbars. I have one big DD heal with a 2-3 secondn recast on it.All in all, I guess Reactive healing is just not my STYLE. I'm sure it works fine, Templars raid all the time. But for me, right now, it just seems like I'm really not able to keep a group up. Especially with a caster getting beat on. Because my biggest reactive hits for 200 something. He gets hit for 500 something. It's just gonna work out in the end.So, my question is.I want to be a good DD/Regen healer. Does Mystic or Warden fit the bill?Does a Mystic or Warden stack up in a raid against a Templar?Do I need to be playing an Inquisitor? Do they get better DD heals?Thanks for the input guys.</blockquote>Hmm..Damage/Regen would be a Druid. (Warden if you want more healer type, Fury if you want more of a damage type)What do you mean "stack up against'?All three sub classes work fine with eachother (Subclasses being Druid, Shaman, Cleric).But two of the same Subclass don't work well with eachother (example: Defiler and Mystic are both shamans but their wards don't stack - they cancel the prevousily casted ward/replace it).Your entire Heal parse will depend on how hard the mob hits, how well you heal and the raid setup. (Can't really relay on a Heal parse like you can a Damage parse)lol, I donno if you need to be playing a Inquistor.. If ya don't like the way a Templar heals, I highly doubt you'll like a Inq anymore then what you already play.. hint hint.. both are a Cleric.. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" />My "personal" break down of the 6 priest classes..Templar, Warden, Defiler are normally Maintank healers.Inquisitor, Fury, Mystic are normally Offtank/Mage/Scout healers. <- generally in that order..All the healers can Solo heal and do damage.. however some of them struggle on things the other doesn't.DD = Direct damage. Regen/HOT = Heal over time.I smell a Druid on the Mystic forums :p

Nodecodiver

04-14-2009, 07:28 AM

Pales - a little update, maybe you can further assist me.I'm now 49, and last night we were doing several fights in Temple of Thule, and a few other zones. Here is what I kep noticing with my Templar.(Bear in mind please, I suspect the reason for my angst is because we are fighting content that 1 healer cannot possibly heal through, but I am not certain)Anyways - this is what frustrates me so badly.In any other game, WoW, EQ1, Vanuard, any game, even if you are SEVERELY outmatched by what you are fighting, you possessed the ability to at least put some HP's back on the tank. In most games, you had a way to do it quickly.So, here is the best I parse from memory.Highest Vitae on TankTank PullsInvoluntary Healer / ResistVitae on Tank (Now at 95%)Mark of Kings / ResistVitae on Tank (Now below 85%)Biggest DH on Tank (moves healthbar 1/4 of a bubble)Group Reactive (Other people are taking damage)Vitae on Tank (Now below 70%)Involuntary / ResistBiggest DH - (barely moves healthbar)Vitae on TankGroup ReactiveGroup HealTank still dying..... Now a DPS class is dying....Vitae on TankBiggest DH on DPS'er (Still barely moves a healthbar on scout types or offtanks)Group.... no wait, OOM.Repeat ad nauseum. I know that was a bit of an over-simplification, but thats how it's going.Perhaps there is something I am grossly overlooking while playing my Temp. But I am just NOT able to solo heal my group through the current content we are fighting.Anyways, back to my earlier point.In EQ1 or WOW, even if you were grossly overmatched - you could "dance" the MT healthbar for a certain period of time. In this game, I cannot affect his healthbar to ANY meaningful extent.My reactives just slow the inevitable, the only way he actually gets healed is to have Vitae / Recast Timer Vitae / Group Reactive.Even if we were going to die, if a Druid can put out numbers big enough to save him from dying once in a while, it migiht be the straw that breaks the camels back for me.When he is at 10%, there is absolutely nothing I can do to help. By biggest DH is MasterII from AA, and it hits for roughly 1200.He's an 80 Warrior mentored down and that heals less than 1/4 of one health bubble. So you can imagine what my reactives do.Am I going to be mad later than I left the templar?I think like I stated before that reactive healing is just not my bag. But I also don't want to be "THAT" class (Fury or Mystic, I'm thinking) that HAS to be put in the raid to not hurt anyones feelings.I want to be useful. But I want to be useful in the "LOOK IM HEALING YOU AND YOU ARE NOT DYING" sense of the word.

Cythera

04-14-2009, 01:38 PM

I have an 80 Fury, my Templar is only 59 atm.If you don't like to watch a tank's health bouncing up and down then I don't suggest a druid. While druids cast faster heals and can top up a tank quick, they also don't "prevent" any damage, so the tank's health drops fast. Clerics and Shamen are much better at keeping a tank's health bar stable due to their heal types. If reactive type heals aren't working for you, maybe give a shaman a try. You may find that when the wards get burned up quick that you will feel slow topping the tank back up with a shaman too since their cast times are similar to the clerics.I'm not sure of the quality of your heals as you stated "my spells are low rank". Are they apprentice 1? Getting adept 3 quality of the heals you use the most while leveling helps a lot for any healer. You get more heals and abilities the higher you get in levels and AA's to make healing easier.The only other thing I can think of is maybe that level 80 mentored tank was pulling more than you could handle for your character's level to heal. The tank might have been making you work harder than you needed to by taking on too many mobs at a time. I've had a few tanks do that to me with my Templar thinking that their higher level gear would compensate. It got pretty ugly at times and I had to ask them not to pull so many at once.

Vith

04-14-2009, 04:19 PM

Why isn't your tank keeping aggro, or why are your dps classes grabbing aggro? Sounds like there's more going on than just your healing skills here.

tebion

04-15-2009, 03:55 AM

<cite>Cythera@Najena wrote:</cite><blockquote>Clerics and Shamen</blockquote>for the love of the kicking mossnake, the plural of shaman is shamAn, it has NOTHING to do with man <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Cythera

04-15-2009, 04:01 PM

<cite>tebion wrote:</cite><blockquote>for the love of the kicking mossnake, the plural of shaman is shamAn, it has NOTHING to do with man <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" /></blockquote>Plural of shaman is shamans. Guess we both need to take remedial spelling courses <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Kiern

04-16-2009, 06:24 AM

Let me start by saying that if you are "SEVERLY outmatched by what you are fighting", you will wipe. But this is not a situation that you should be in on a regular basis. I can't comment on your healing strategy since I don't play a templar. It might be better to ask on their forum for strategy specific to the class. Having grouped with many Templars, I can tell you that they can most certainly do the job. I can also tell you that there are many reason why you would have problems as a healer. Based on what you have said so far, I think that there are a few that are more likely than others.You will often run into problems if the tank has not kept their armor upgraded or if they pull more than they can reasonably handle. I'm guessing the latter is at least part of the problem. Good tanks will adapt and do their best to pull as few as possible, but some will just continue to just rush into a room full of mobs and count on you to save them. It is also a problem if they can't keep aggro. It is a lot more work if you have to heal everyone in the group.What do you mean that your spells are "low rank"? It sounds like you have severly underestimated the importance of upgrading you spells. You should never have a healing spell that is below Adept 1 (at your level you should never, ever be using apprentice level spells). Get adept 3 when possible, and hope for Master drops. For "Templar Training", every ten levels that allow you to turn one spell into a Master 2, always choose one of the healing options when they are available. Upgrading your spells makes a big difference and master spells make a huge difference. Also, if you plan on being the best healer you can be, hopfully you are specing your AA points for healing. Increased healing crits, and faster casting. Yes, you have to go through a lot of fluff to get them, but all the classes do. Also start look for gear that has +healing.Whatever the casting skill/school is for your proc heals, it looks like it is too low, most likely due to lack of use. That would account for all the resists. If that is the case, start casting those spells even when you don't need them, just to get the skill up for when you do need them. I think that all the healers have an panic spell, that heals for a lot and has a quick cast time, but a long recast time. Make sure you use it when necessary.It sounds like you went into this thinking that Templars are better healers than the other classes based on your experience in other games. That is not the case, they are just different. It may also be that you are use to the direct healing from the other games and are having trouble adapting to the reactives. You may, or may not like Druids better. They have heal over time spells, and those come with their own frustrations. At least until you spend the AA's to improve them. The one thing that you will have to get use to as a Druid, is that if there is another type of healer (Shaman or Cleric) in the group, you will be the backup healer. Not because Druids are inferior, but because of the way the heals work, as Pales pointed out. There is nothing for you to heal until the damage gets through the wards and/or reactives. I mention this because you may be having a grass is greener on the other side of the fence moment. Regardless of the healing class you play there will be times when it's a cake walk, and times when you have to work your butt off to keep the group alive......and, of course, there are times when nothing you do will save the group from a wipe.

Zapo

04-16-2009, 06:47 AM

@NodecodiverIf you want Templar tipps you should probably post there. Anyway here some tipps concerning your spell order:- try to cast the single AND group reactive before fight. As a templar (any cleric) you have to think ahead and be prepared for what will hit the tank in 5 seconds. Sometimes you might draw aggro during pull. Tank should help, use deaggro or stun then.- why did your involunatry heal and mark spells got resisted ? Looks like mob wasn't properly debuffed by group or group missed vital debuff classes- Cast your Mark spell before involuntary, it lowers resists- if it was a heroic encounter use your stun and daze spells. They are very usefull decreasing damage and give you time to keep your heals/debuffs upAs a cleric, if you don't pay attention before fight you will have a rough time.