Combat Order

[Drah]

<p>Hi All:</p><p>I know its been covered in the past but with AA changes I wanted to revist it.</p><p>What casting order do you guys use for Max dps?</p>

[peepshow]

<p>I to would like to know this.</p><p>As an upcoming Bruiser main (74 atm) I want to be sure that when I do get to raid, I get the most of my Bruiser.</p><p>Been reading a lot about it lately, but I cant really find anything specific..</p>

[Sprin]

<p><cite>Scipius@Splitpaw wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I to would like to know this.</p><p>As an upcoming Bruiser main (74 atm) I want to be sure that when I do get to raid, I get the most of my Bruiser.</p><p>Been reading a lot about it lately, but I cant really find anything specific..</p></blockquote><p>I just make sure i use all my debuff attacks first, as this would allow maximum chance at making the most out of the rest of my attacks...</p><p>Make sure you time your use of combat arts with your auto attack, especially if you have high crit and double attack, you want to make sure your Crit Doubling as much as you can, so spamming as many combat arts as you can wont neccesarily yield the highest possible DPS... you have to get auto attacks in there as well...</p><p>I also like to save the longer casting attacks, AOE's for when im allowing the tank (if im not tanking) to get some aggro, so i might start off with those since they are allowing a few seconds of time between attacks so your not gonna pull aggro off tank, by the time those are done, tank should be well off and you can go to town...</p><p>now if your talking about tanking, especially in an encounter situation... i always tell my group to wait for 4 things to happen... and i used to have a macro for it on my Zerker back in my VOX tanking days...    when you body pull targets, since when you taunt their face burns... Single Burning face, encounter burning face, one AOE attack, 2nd AOE attack, then go to town... this usually allows you to get enough aggron on the encounter so that its hard for people to pull off of you, also gives you just a short duration before your single target taunt comes back... then i usually switch targets to another in the group and single target taunt them... this means that the first one in the encounter has plenty of aggro with the first single taunt + encounter taunt + the 2 AOEs and some auto attacks... switch to the next, single target taunt and start burning that one down and watch the other encounter mobs to see if they are moving to different targets in your group... if they are, tab and go to town on that one...</p><p>Tanking doesnt neccesarily mean maximum DPS but usually means a combo of aggro control and DPS to keep everyone alive and let the DPS'rs do their job... We will see how that changes with new GU... but i imagine it will stay mostly the same...</p>

[Xaile]

<p><cite>Ironfyst@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Make sure you time your use of combat arts with your auto attack, especially if you have high crit and double attack, you want to make sure your Crit Doubling as much as you can, so spamming as many combat arts as you can wont neccesarily yield the highest possible DPS... you have to get auto attacks in there as well...</p></blockquote><p>What Ironfyst says has been my experience too; try to make sure you're not delaying your autoattacks by spamming CA's too quickly, since autoattacks can make up a fairly large chunk of damage.</p><p>That said, my CA order varies depending on how long I think the fights going to be. If it's a short fight (20 seconds or less), I tend to hit just the harder-hitting CA's just to get high numbers in the short time (such as Gut Punch, One Hundred Hands, Chin Break, etc).</p><p>However, I feel the order needs to change in fights where the mob lives a long time, since I don't want to run out of CA's to use. As such, I try to prioritize the low reuse CA's more than the high-reuse ones. My long-fight casting priority order (on single targets) is something like this:</p><ul><li>Hammer & Front Kick get top priority, since they have only 10 second base reuse. I always use these whenever they're up.</li><li>Master's Rage (if applicable). This drops the defense, deflection, parry, etc of mob, so I always try to land this before using One Hundred Hands to maximize its damage.</li><li>Baton Flurry, if you have it.</li><li>One Hundred Hands is high priority too, since it does a lot of damage for only 30 second base reuse.</li><li>Blaze Kick</li><li>Comet Punch</li><li>Eye Rip</li><li>Gut Punch</li><li>Adamantine Fist & Double Stomp always back-to-back. I don't know if you still get the bonus damage on double stomp on mobs immune to knockdown (such as epics), but I still like to do these back to back, just in case (especially since they're on the same re-use timer).</li><li>Chin Break</li><li>Other attacks (such as racial attacks, Eagle Spin, Pressure Point, Desolating Fist, Lightning Fists).</li><li>Savage Assault, if nothing else is available. Long cast time makes it mess up autoattack (especially if you're hasted), but it has high damage, so I'm on the fence on whether it's worth it or not on a single target.</li></ul><p>This is more or less my CA priority list for long fights. This list does not account for fitting Chi, Knockout, or Crane Flock in. This is also assuming you're not tanking. Mostly, I make a point to use Hammer and Front Kick every time that they're up on longer fights. As the fight gets closer to being over, higher burst-damage CA's get higher priority to try to fit in before the mob dies.</p><p>Disclaimer: My bruiser is not my primary raid toon (Dirge and Defiler are), so this is far from a perfect CA priority list. Your mileage may vary.</p><p>(Edit: I forgot to add Blaze Kick to the list)</p>

[Sprin]

<p>and remember, CHI + Devastation Fist for quest grinding makes things go by a lot faster... one shotting mobs every 3 minutes or so makes life much easier <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>When you have to grind a lot of mobs out... IE Hammer quests in Jarsath Wastes...   Pull 4 or 5 of them, CHI and then do your Dev Fist on the first one, one down 4 to go, use your mantis leap if you have it, (for crit on your next attack) and use Savage Assault... the "next combat art will critical" counts for every single strike in that attack.. so if you have 8 mobs on you, and you Mantis Leap and do Savage Assault, 4 hits x 8 targets will crit... meaning it lays waste to AOE... and since CHI is still active, you are swinging faster, then do your other AOE's including your AA ones if you have them, and nearly all the mobs will be dead.. a few switch targets with a couple combat arts mixed in and you will have 8 updates and Dev fist will be up 3 minutes later for another round <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  chi will be longer but you can just go Dev fist something while you wait and wait another few minutes for it all to be up again... solo questing = easy on bruiser <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[laawintown]

<p>with this set  up ypu are speaking about have you ever raided with  your bruiser with this tune?  if yes what  kind of  parse are you  doing?</p><p>    im  perty well  dressed and struggleing to parse welll at all seems the harder i try  the  lower i parse at the end of a raid fight im   out of power and mob still at 30%  and i parse between  1600 to 2600    once in a great while ill parse 4500 but just like once our twice so im doing  something wrong for  shure.</p><p>   ive god 67% crit  and  aprox 60% double attack  with bruiser  epic and   doomcoils baton.  so if any one has any idea what im doing wrong please advise im tummped!</p>

[Sprin]

<p><cite>laawintown wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>with this set  up ypu are speaking about have you ever raided with  your bruiser with this tune?  if yes what  kind of  parse are you  doing?</p><p>    im  perty well  dressed and struggleing to parse welll at all seems the harder i try  the  lower i parse at the end of a raid fight im   out of power and mob still at 30%  and i parse between  1600 to 2600    once in a great while ill parse 4500 but just like once our twice so im doing  something wrong for  shure.</p><p>   ive god 67% crit  and  aprox 60% double attack  with bruiser  epic and   doomcoils baton.  so if any one has any idea what im doing wrong please advise im tummped!</p></blockquote><p>Well you have to look at not only your raid setup itself, but raid members and their gear... If your in a group with a bard, are they playing power songs? or the Illy's of the raid feeding you power when you start to get low?  if your running out of power that fast, back off a bit and let your auto attacks do some of the major damage, so your not spamming as much and as often.. ask for power from they enchanters in the raid when you start to get low, if you ask all the time, they will just start to look at your power as second nature and feed you when you start to get low..</p><p>Raid parses have too many variables... your gear, the gear of your group, the gear of your raid, the setup of your group, the mob your fighting, the skill level of your group, skill level of your raid... etc etc...  </p><p>I would definately make sure your time your attacks with your auto attacks, im not sure what the doomcoil baton hit rate is, but i believe epic is 2.5 seconds, so try to time your attacks to give a break every 3 seconds or so, as the /weapon stats will show you what the actual delay is... so you can get a good timing down with which attacks take how long to cast and how many you can do between each auto attack... so you can group similar cast timed Combat arts together so you can maximize Auto attack damage... just study your attacks and look at their casting time, recovery time and reuse time... pair similar ones and ones that you can get off between the 2.5-3 seconds in between auto attacks, and stick with ... CA CA... auto attack... CA CA.... Auto attack... etc</p>

[Illine]

<p><cite>laawintown wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>with this set  up ypu are speaking about have you ever raided with  your bruiser with this tune?  if yes what  kind of  parse are you  doing?</p><p>    im  perty well  dressed and struggleing to parse welll at all seems the harder i try  the  lower i parse at the end of a raid fight im   out of power and mob still at 30%  and i parse between  1600 to 2600    once in a great while ill parse 4500 but just like once our twice so im doing  something wrong for  shure.</p><p>   ive god 67% crit  and  aprox 60% double attack  with bruiser  epic and   doomcoils baton.  so if any one has any idea what im doing wrong please advise im tummped!</p></blockquote><p>A bruiser I know put a mana adorn on one of her weapon to get mana back ... it can still be usefull.</p>

[peepshow]

<p>TBH, if the choice is between a +crushing damage and a power Proc, I would chose the power proc anytime...</p><p>Sure the Illu's and bards can give power, buyt with 2 power procs, you will not run out even if soloing and chain pulling Heroic mobs..</p>

[Gilasil]

<p><cite>Ironfyst@Nagafen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>and remember, CHI + Devastation Fist for quest grinding makes things go by a lot faster... one shotting mobs every 3 minutes or so makes life much easier <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p><p>When you have to grind a lot of mobs out... IE Hammer quests in Jarsath Wastes...   Pull 4 or 5 of them, CHI and then do your Dev Fist on the first one, one down 4 to go, use your mantis leap if you have it, (for crit on your next attack) and use Savage Assault... the "next combat art will critical" counts for every single strike in that attack.. so if you have 8 mobs on you, and you Mantis Leap and do Savage Assault, 4 hits x 8 targets will crit... meaning it lays waste to AOE... and since CHI is still active, you are swinging faster, then do your other AOE's including your AA ones if you have them, and nearly all the mobs will be dead.. a few switch targets with a couple combat arts mixed in and you will have 8 updates and Dev fist will be up 3 minutes later for another round <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" />  chi will be longer but you can just go Dev fist something while you wait and wait another few minutes for it all to be up again... solo questing = easy on bruiser <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>I guess Chi is like a good spice.  It makes other good things better.  I like Chi with my knockout combo.  With the faster recycle of my combat arts I can spam that many more in my 20 second run.  It's overkill for typical solo situations but really shines in a group setting.  I like to save it for adds (often makes the difference between killing the adds or a wipe) or for nameds. </p>

[Pnaxx]

<p>In regards to the auto attack timing thing....you don't need to over think it. To get the auto attack bennies, just pause 1 second in between spamming your CA's. You will be ok with that. I know some prolly have it down to a better science, but for the lazy, it works well enough  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Illine@Storms wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>laawintown wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>with this set  up ypu are speaking about have you ever raided with  your bruiser with this tune?  if yes what  kind of  parse are you  doing?</p><p>    im  perty well  dressed and struggleing to parse welll at all seems the harder i try  the  lower i parse at the end of a raid fight im   out of power and mob still at 30%  and i parse between  1600 to 2600    once in a great while ill parse 4500 but just like once our twice so im doing  something wrong for  shure.</p><p>   ive god 67% crit  and  aprox 60% double attack  with bruiser  epic and   doomcoils baton.  so if any one has any idea what im doing wrong please advise im tummped!</p></blockquote><p>A bruiser I know put a mana adorn on one of her weapon to get mana back ... it can still be usefull.</p></blockquote><p>The power weapons are very usefull, especially while tanking.  +crushing damage is pretty useless, if you want a damage adornment get one of the damage proc adornments or the lifetap.</p>

[Sprin]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Illine@Storms wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>laawintown wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>with this set  up ypu are speaking about have you ever raided with  your bruiser with this tune?  if yes what  kind of  parse are you  doing?</p><p>    im  perty well  dressed and struggleing to parse welll at all seems the harder i try  the  lower i parse at the end of a raid fight im   out of power and mob still at 30%  and i parse between  1600 to 2600    once in a great while ill parse 4500 but just like once our twice so im doing  something wrong for  shure.</p><p>   ive god 67% crit  and  aprox 60% double attack  with bruiser  epic and   doomcoils baton.  so if any one has any idea what im doing wrong please advise im tummped!</p></blockquote><p>A bruiser I know put a mana adorn on one of her weapon to get mana back ... it can still be usefull.</p></blockquote><p>The power weapons are very usefull, especially while tanking.  +crushing damage is pretty useless, if you want a damage adornment get one of the damage proc adornments or the lifetap.</p></blockquote><p>Well the +6 crushing, fabled T8, adornment for your main weapon, if you tank at all, or roll PVP at all, you should be doing it in Defensive, which decreases your Crushing skills by quite a bit, 22 i think, which is a major part of the decreased DPS, because your attacks arent hitting as often on the mobs as they would, therefore not procing your weapons / items as often as in Offensive, so its not just that your not hitting the mobs as often, your not procing as often... so that drops DPS by quite a bit, and until this new "hate bar" thingy comes out and we figure that out, DPS is a big part of getting and holding aggro on mobs... and in PVP, if your not running in Defensive all the time, you should be...   so + crushing will allow you to increase burst and sustained DPS, as well as increase the procs on not only my damage procs, but heal and ward and power procs because my attacks are landing more often...</p><p>Now if you dont tank or PVP, I agree + crushing is useless as you are probably running only in Offensive where you get a huge boost to your Crushing already, which puts you over 400 on your crushing, so you are hitting mobs just about as much as you possibly can....  in that case a power or damage proc is probably the way to go...</p><p>Mythical gives +10 Crushing, +6 on top of that and your nearing negating your defensive buff, minus the extra damage proc of your offensive, but of course that drops your defense waaaaaay down...  you get your PVP chest piece, for those of you who are on PVP servers, and thats another +10 crushing... so your at 26 crushing between chest / mythical / fabled adornment, so you've ridded your self of the detrimental effect of putting on your defensive buff and now your parrying 22% of incoming attacks and have boosted your avoidance and poison resists through the roof at the same time = your very hard to kill....</p>

[Roldor]

<p>If power is an issue for you then get your hands on a 'Mark of the Ankexfen'. I picked mine up about six months ago, coupled with one 'Smouldering Phantom Handle' I have since had no power problems. I rarely get below 70% power unless there is a power drain in effect.</p><p><img src="http://www.lootdb.com/eq2/examine/1482634583" width="280" height="473" /></p><p>Below is a post I originally made on eq2flames.com a few weeks back, hope this helps with your CA order.</p><p>- Roldy</p><hr /><p>I spend 80% of my time tanking so my hotbars are setup for tanking rather than DPS efficency. Mainly everything is in order of recast value. I'd set things up a bit different if I spent more time in a DPS role but I guess this gives you an idea of what order a tanking bruiser might use.</p><p style="text-align: center;"><img src="http://i341.photobucket.com/albums/o397/Eluthria/hotbars.jpg" width="458" height="170" /></p><ul><li><div>I start at bar 1 and work left to right, once I reach the end of bar 1 Hammer and Front Kick are up again so I will usually go back hit those and then if I need more DPS I'll move down to bar 2 and use Chin Break or Gut Punch if I've lost agro.</div></li><li><div>The CA you see next to Gut Punch is Brutal Bashings which is a troll racial ability (knockdown + stun).</div></li><li><div>I've taken five points in Comet Punch which is why you see it so high up my order.</div></li><li><div>I've taken five points in Body Flail, this is why you see it in my order in the first place.</div></li><li><div>I've got Eagle Spin way down the bottom out of the way on bar 4 as I mainly tank and scout classes tend to get cross with me when I spin the mob. I still use Eagle Spin in my rotation though when I drop Chi + Knockout.</div></li><li><div>I keep Chi safely down in the bottom corner so I don't accidentally click it because that makes me sad when I waste it.</div></li><li><div>All my buffs and things I don't need to see on the screen all the time are hidden away on hotbar 5 (shift + 5).</div></li><li><div>I also have two smaller utility boxes that I didn't include in the screenshot, these are for macros and cures etc.</div></li></ul><p style="text-align: left;">Feel free to critique my set-up I'm always open to suggestions and stuff. Hope this helps you.</p><hr />

[Sprin]

<p><cite>Roldor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>If power is an issue for you then get your hands on a 'Mark of the Ankexfen'. I picked mine up about six months ago, coupled with one 'Smouldering Phantom Handle' I have since had no power problems. I rarely get below 70% power unless there is a power drain in effect.</p><p><img src="http://www.lootdb.com/eq2/examine/1482634583" width="280" height="473" /></p><p>Below is a post I originally made on eq2flames.com a few weeks back, hope this helps with your CA order.</p><p>- Roldy</p><hr /><p>I spend 80% of my time tanking so my hotbars are setup for tanking rather than DPS efficency. Mainly everything is in order of recast value. I'd set things up a bit different if I spent more time in a DPS role but I guess this gives you an idea of what order a tanking bruiser might use.</p><p style="text-align: center;"><img src="http://i341.photobucket.com/albums/o397/Eluthria/hotbars.jpg" width="458" height="170" /></p><ul><li><div>I start at bar 1 and work left to right, once I reach the end of bar 1 Hammer and Front Kick are up again so I will usually go back hit those and then if I need more DPS I'll move down to bar 2 and use Chin Break or Gut Punch if I've lost agro.</div></li><li><div>The CA you see next to Gut Punch is Brutal Bashings which is a troll racial ability (knockdown + stun).</div></li><li><div>I've taken five points in Comet Punch which is why you see it so high up my order.</div></li><li><div>I've taken five points in Body Flail, this is why you see it in my order in the first place.</div></li><li><div>I've got Eagle Spin way down the bottom out of the way on bar 4 as I mainly tank and scout classes tend to get cross with me when I spin the mob. I still use Eagle Spin in my rotation though when I drop Chi + Knockout.</div></li><li><div>I keep Chi safely down in the bottom corner so I don't accidentally click it because that makes me sad when I waste it.</div></li><li><div>All my buffs and things I don't need to see on the screen all the time are hidden away on hotbar 5 (shift + 5).</div></li><li><div>I also have two smaller utility boxes that I didn't include in the screenshot, these are for macros and cures etc.</div></li></ul><p style="text-align: left;">Feel free to critique my set-up I'm always open to suggestions and stuff. Hope this helps you.</p><hr /></blockquote><p>Very cool... though i have one complaint.. what is this "tanking" your speaking of... for, if i hear correctly about 10 times a day, people whos group im in say "so we gonna get a tank for this place or go without" or in a PVP group... "should we get a tank"... or "plate tank wanted for TSO instance"...  so im confused as to why your saying your "tanking" when obviously bruisers are not tanks... <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  </p><p>Makes me sick to my stomach.... and im not kidding i hear that every day... people are so blinded by "leather armor" that they dont think we're tanks... never mind the fact i actually have chain amor equivalent, or 82%+ avoidance self buffed, or damage absorption spells that would put the best Raid tank Guardians to shame... or my 22 seconds I have of just flat out dodging/parrying any melee attacks... or the 30 seconds of solid knockdowns on top of my 5 knockdown combat arts to prevent any damage from being taken by anyone... or the 4 "rescues" we have when people start getting stupid with their DPS control.... or the near 100 percent HP in self heals i have if things get bad.... or the 30 seconds of immunity to everything that would control me, and a self heal of said control effects if needed.... </p><p>forget all that, just look at my armor and how it says "leather" and then assume were junk tankers and cant hack it... lame...</p>