Critical Mitigation correction on Test?

[Wrapye]

<p>Presently on Live if I view my Crit Mit in my Persona window, it reads 7%.  That is coming solely from equipment.  On Test it reads 17%, which is equipment + the 10% from stats.  My question to the devs is:  Is this just a display issue, or is the crit mit on Live presently not taking into account the ammount that should be coming from stats?</p>

[Noaani]

<p>Crit mit on live has never taken in to account the up to 10% you can get from stats.</p>

[Aeralik]

<p>It works correctly on live right now when you mitigate a critical attack. The persona window was just not displaying the attribute based portion until this update.</p>

[BleemTeam]

<p>Is there anyway we could have been able to tell? HAR HAR !!!  <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/97ada74b88049a6d50a6ed40898a03d7.gif" border="0" /></p>

[Oakum]

<p>I read a post (as I remember) that fighters and scouts are based on STR and priest and mages are based on INT.</p><p>Why are priests (as in melee priests)the only one that will not be using a stat they try to raise in the normal course of game play? I think priest should be WIS, not INT. NOW nukers (who will often be out of range of short range aoes) are treated much more favorably in this regard then the melee spec priests.</p><p> Melee speced players take a double hit both from not having high INT like nuking priests but also getting hit by more AOE's as they melee if for no other reason then to proc heals inbetween normal spell casting or 15 second pets from the star of malice.</p>

[BleemTeam]

<p>Melee use AGI and Casters use INT</p>

[feldon30]

<p><cite>Oakum wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I read a post (as I remember) that fighters and scouts are based on STR and priest and mages are based on INT.</p></blockquote><p>Scout is AGI based, which is a useless stat for a Ranger or Assassin. Yet now we are expected to stock up on AGI if we want innate Crit Mit.</p><p>Much easier to just take the Predator AA endline which is a single target 10% Crit Mit on the mob that you cast every 1 minute. I do that at the beginning of fights and it's like the whole group just got +10 Crit Mit for 60 seconds. Or at least that's how I interpret the description. Predators actually have some utility now, wow! <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Kordran]

<p>Fighters and scouts are both based on AGI. Honestly, I think it should be changed so that for fighters it's based on STA, scouts based on STR, mages on INT and priests on WIS.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Oakum wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I read a post (as I remember) that fighters and scouts are based on STR and priest and mages are based on INT.</p></blockquote><p>Scout is AGI based, which is a useless stat for a Ranger or Assassin. Yet now we are expected to stock up on AGI if we want innate Crit Mit.</p><p>Much easier to just take the Predator AA endline which is a single target 10% Crit Mit on the mob that you cast every 1 minute. I do that at the beginning of fights and it's like the whole group just got +10 Crit Mit for 60 seconds. Or at least that's how I interpret the description. Predators actually have some utility now, wow! <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>Deal with it, if you decide to spec like a barbarian.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Kordran wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Fighters and scouts are both based on AGI. Honestly, I think it should be changed so that for fighters it's based on STA, scouts based on STR, mages on INT and priests on WIS.</p></blockquote><p>No. It should be fighters STR, Scouts AGI, Mages INT and priests WIS.</p>

[steelbadger]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kordran wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Fighters and scouts are both based on AGI. Honestly, I think it should be changed so that for fighters it's based on STA, scouts based on STR, mages on INT and priests on WIS.</p></blockquote><p>No. It should be fighters STR, Scouts AGI, Mages INT and priests WIS.</p></blockquote><p>Is this based upon some kind of nebulous idea of what "should" be because of what you feel if the class "Flavour" or simply because you feel it is "the right way"?  Cos it sure ain't balanced.</p><p>Fighters don't have much STR, Scouts don't stock up on AGI.  Mages and priests, however, regularly go overcap on INT and WIS respectively.</p><p>I'm fine with it being agi for tanks, not our primary stat, but still useful and still sought after to some degree at least.  I do feel that making it INT gives mages an unecessarily easy ride...  but then mages don't really have a secondary stat that they keep almost as high, so there's not much choice.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>steelbadger wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kordran wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Fighters and scouts are both based on AGI. Honestly, I think it should be changed so that for fighters it's based on STA, scouts based on STR, mages on INT and priests on WIS.</p></blockquote><p>No. It should be fighters STR, Scouts AGI, Mages INT and priests WIS.</p></blockquote><p>Is this based upon some kind of nebulous idea of what "should" be because of what you feel if the class "Flavour" or simply because you feel it is "the right way"?  Cos it sure ain't balanced.</p><p>Fighters don't have much STR, Scouts don't stock up on AGI.  Mages and priests, however, regularly go overcap on INT and WIS respectively.</p><p>I'm fine with it being agi for tanks, not our primary stat, but still useful and still sought after to some degree at least.  I do feel that making it INT gives mages an unecessarily easy ride...  but then mages don't really have a secondary stat that they keep almost as high, so there's not much choice.</p></blockquote><p><span style="color: #993366;">Fighter's don't have much str? How do you figure that?  My bruiser has over 900str in pretty much any group and my assassin has over 900 agi solo.</span></p>

[feldon30]

<p>It's based on Lethe's ridiculous idea that scouts have plenty of STR but need more AGI. By the way, Lethe is the only one on the entire EQ2 forums here who bangs this "Scouts need AGI" drum.</p><p>I have yet to see a logical explanation for why a Ranger or Assassin needs more AGI than about 450.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It's based on Lethe's ridiculous idea that scouts have plenty of STR but need more AGI. By the way, Lethe is the only one on the entire EQ2 forums here who bangs this "Scouts need AGI" drum.</p><p>I have yet to see a logical explanation for why a Ranger or Assassin needs more AGI than about 450.</p></blockquote><p>You completly over estimate the importance of str for DPS, not to mention the fact that it's easy to get more str then we need with pretty much all TSO scout armor having 40+ str.</p>

[Valphine]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kordran wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Fighters and scouts are both based on AGI. Honestly, I think it should be changed so that for fighters it's based on STA, scouts based on STR, mages on INT and priests on WIS.</p></blockquote><p>No. It should be fighters STR, Scouts AGI, Mages INT and priests WIS.</p></blockquote><p>Agree with that, Take a Paladin for an example, how manny buffs boost AGI?? None. For sure Paladins got the lowest AGI of the tanks, so thats why It should be STR for fighters. The rest I guess others agree on no doubt.</p>

[LygerT]

<p>i have 1k str and 500 agility, just for comparison sakes.</p>

[feldon30]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It's based on Lethe's ridiculous idea that scouts have plenty of STR but need more AGI. By the way, Lethe is the only one on the entire EQ2 forums here who bangs this "Scouts need AGI" drum.</p><p>I have yet to see a logical explanation for why a Ranger or Assassin needs more AGI than about 450.</p></blockquote><p>You completly over estimate the importance of str for DPS, not to mention the fact that it's easy to get more str then we need with pretty much all TSO scout armor having 40+ str.</p></blockquote><p>I guess I should clarify. The Ranger mythical increases damage based on STR. Read the proc.</p><p>Bottom line: I am not going to CHANGE my gear to get more AGI. Self-buffed I have 821 STR.</p>

[BleemTeam]

<p>1200agi was 10% Crit Mit.</p><p>350agi was 5% Crit Mit.</p><p>You math wizards calculate the scale. (from 750ish to 1200ish was roughly 3% increase)</p><p>As an MT I have no issues getting any stat above 500 so, I have no input there. However, I think that Agility and Intelligence make the most sense for the 2 checks for Critical Mitigation. Mages are going to be at 10% instantly and the healers are going to be fine too I think.</p><p>Fighters and Scouts should not have an issue getting their Agility up. Using the scale above, gear alone should make most of us 350+. Group buffs and potions can be used as well.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It's based on Lethe's ridiculous idea that scouts have plenty of STR but need more AGI. By the way, Lethe is the only one on the entire EQ2 forums here who bangs this "Scouts need AGI" drum.</p><p>I have yet to see a logical explanation for why a Ranger or Assassin needs more AGI than about 450.</p></blockquote><p>You completly over estimate the importance of str for DPS, not to mention the fact that it's easy to get more str then we need with pretty much all TSO scout armor having 40+ str.</p></blockquote><p>I guess I should clarify. The Ranger mythical increases damage based on STR. Read the proc.</p><p>Bottom line: I am not going to CHANGE my gear to get more AGI. Self-buffed I have 821 STR.</p></blockquote><p>Ranger's aren't the only scouts.  Maybe they should be changed to have str as their primary stat since it's so important and they don't need avoidance.  But I'm not a ranger and I have had enough with all the equipment with nothing but str/sta.</p><p>Seperate issue is with the crit mit scaleing having such diminishing returns you might as well just give everyone 10% crit mit and not base it on stats since most will be at or close to 10% without trying.</p>

[Ranja]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It's based on Lethe's ridiculous idea that scouts have plenty of STR but need more AGI. By the way, Lethe is the only one on the entire EQ2 forums here who bangs this "Scouts need AGI" drum.</p><p>I have yet to see a logical explanation for why a Ranger or Assassin needs more AGI than about 450.</p></blockquote><p>You completly over estimate the importance of str for DPS, not to mention the fact that it's easy to get more str then we need with pretty much all TSO scout armor having 40+ str.</p></blockquote><p>I guess I should clarify. The Ranger mythical increases damage based on STR. Read the proc.</p><p>Bottom line: I am not going to CHANGE my gear to get more AGI. Self-buffed I have 821 STR.</p></blockquote><p>Ranger's aren't the only scouts. Maybe they should be changed to have str as their primary stat since it's so important and they don't need avoidance. But I'm not a ranger and I have had enough with all the equipment with nothing but str/sta.</p><p>Seperate issue is with the crit mit scaleing having such diminishing returns you might as well just give everyone 10% crit mit and not base it on stats since most will be at or close to 10% without trying.</p></blockquote><p>Ugh not this discussion again. As I was reading your thread, I was reminded of a scout who felt AGI did more for our DPS than STR. I chuckled until I found out that scout was you! Why do you insist on AGI as our number one stat. Do you understand that STR increase the damage of our CAs and Auto-attack and AGI does nothing.</p><p>Please tell me you understand how str affects your characters gameplay. And for rogues and preds their primary stat is STR not just rangers! Man are you being inentionally obtuse?</p>

[Xanrn]

<p>Yes I don't really see why Mages get handed crit mit on a silver plater.</p><p>Its unfair to the other 3 classes, that Mages get crit mit from Int, which on any decent mage is going to be way over 1k.</p><p>It should be the same Stat for all Classes or the Primary Stat for all Classes.</p><p>Fighter and Scouts should be Str, Priests Wis and Mages Int.</p><p>Or all 4 should be Agi or Sta.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Ranja wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>feldon30 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It's based on Lethe's ridiculous idea that scouts have plenty of STR but need more AGI. By the way, Lethe is the only one on the entire EQ2 forums here who bangs this "Scouts need AGI" drum.</p><p>I have yet to see a logical explanation for why a Ranger or Assassin needs more AGI than about 450.</p></blockquote><p>You completly over estimate the importance of str for DPS, not to mention the fact that it's easy to get more str then we need with pretty much all TSO scout armor having 40+ str.</p></blockquote><p>I guess I should clarify. The Ranger mythical increases damage based on STR. Read the proc.</p><p>Bottom line: I am not going to CHANGE my gear to get more AGI. Self-buffed I have 821 STR.</p></blockquote><p>Ranger's aren't the only scouts. Maybe they should be changed to have str as their primary stat since it's so important and they don't need avoidance. But I'm not a ranger and I have had enough with all the equipment with nothing but str/sta.</p><p>Seperate issue is with the crit mit scaleing having such diminishing returns you might as well just give everyone 10% crit mit and not base it on stats since most will be at or close to 10% without trying.</p></blockquote><p>Ugh not this discussion again. As I was reading your thread, I was reminded of a scout who felt AGI did more for our DPS than STR. I chuckled until I found out that scout was you! Why do you insist on AGI as our number one stat. Do you understand that STR increase the damage of our CAs and Auto-attack and AGI does nothing.</p><p>Please tell me you understand how str affects your characters gameplay. And for rogues and preds their primary stat is STR not just rangers! Man are you being inentionally obtuse?</p></blockquote><p>Yeah because 1200 vs 1000 str makes any significant difference. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" />  In fact getting it too high and it will start loseing DPS.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Ummudien@Guk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Yes I don't really see why Mages get handed crit mit on a silver plater.</p><p>Its unfair to the other 3 classes, that Mages get crit mit from Int, which on any decent mage is going to be way over 1k.</p><p>It should be the same Stat for all Classes or the Primary Stat for all Classes.</p><p>Fighter and Scouts should be Str, Priests Wis and Mages Int.</p><p>Or all 4 should be Agi or Sta.</p></blockquote><p>Actually that would make the most sense for it to be just sta for all classes.</p>

[Aule]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>Yeah because 1200 vs 1000 str makes any significant difference. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" />  In fact getting it too high and it will start loseing DPS.</blockquote><p>This is the second time recently I've seen a reference that getting stats too high causes dps to go down. Who knows, maybe the other post was you also. </p><p>Where are you getting this data from?  I've never seen anything else on this board or on flames for any class indicating higher than a certain point causes damage to decrease.  Mitigation and resists do get penalized for using gear that's too low level... is that what you're referring to?</p>

[Geothe]

<p><cite>Aule@Guk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>Yeah because 1200 vs 1000 str makes any significant difference. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" />  In fact getting it too high and it will start loseing DPS.</blockquote><p>This is the second time recently I've seen a reference that getting stats too high causes dps to go down. Who knows, maybe the other post was you also. </p><p>Where are you getting this data from?  I've never seen anything else on this board or on flames for any class indicating higher than a certain point causes damage to decrease.  Mitigation and resists do get penalized for using gear that's too low level... is that what you're referring to?</p></blockquote><p>There is an error due to horrible coding that if you exceed the stat cap (1280) by too much, you actually start to weaken yourself.  Think of a normal diminishing returns curve as a quarter circle, reaching the peak and then staying level from that point on.  The way it is in game, is actually a half circle, so you reach the peak at 1280, but if you start going far above that cap, it starts to drop down again.</p><p>There was a thread in the General forum on these boards about it, as well as on EQ2flames forum (cant remember where there) but no red names ever posted there.</p><p>Here. found the link</p><p><a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?topic_id=424687">http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...topic_id=424687</a></p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Aule@Guk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>Yeah because 1200 vs 1000 str makes any significant difference. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" />  In fact getting it too high and it will start loseing DPS.</blockquote><p>This is the second time recently I've seen a reference that getting stats too high causes dps to go down. Who knows, maybe the other post was you also. </p><p>Where are you getting this data from?  I've never seen anything else on this board or on flames for any class indicating higher than a certain point causes damage to decrease.  Mitigation and resists do get penalized for using gear that's too low level... is that what you're referring to?</p></blockquote><p>I got the data from testing myself and from tons of other people who noticed the same problem.  The diminishing returns curve is infinate and starts to become negative if you go too far over the cap.</p>

[Aule]

Thanks for the link.

[Ba]

<p>Seriously, i am fine with mages getting an easier ride on crit mit. Heck, wearing cloth they sure need it.</p>

[Danelin]

<p>I definitely have issues with crit mit coming from int on an inquisitor.</p><p>Ever look at our EoF AA tree? Every inquistor I know has the battle cleric tree maxed out in both their healing and offense focused AA specs. Why? Because everything else in EoF is complete garbage.</p><p>That being said, we focus on gear with str, sta, and wis.</p><p>My inquisitor in running gear has like 900 sta, 750 wis, 600 or so str... and 200 int.</p><p>I am not rare in this regard. I would imagine many mystics and wardens also don't have huge int numbers.</p>

[Writer Cal]

<p>Right, Int is just as fair for melee priests as it would be to make it Str for casting priests.  Change Priest crit mit to Wis or Stam.  It's the only way to be fair to all 6 types of priests.</p>

[Eugam]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Ummudien@Guk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Yes I don't really see why Mages get handed crit mit on a silver plater.</p><p>Its unfair to the other 3 classes, that Mages get crit mit from Int, which on any decent mage is going to be way over 1k.</p><p>It should be the same Stat for all Classes or the Primary Stat for all Classes.</p><p>Fighter and Scouts should be Str, Priests Wis and Mages Int.</p><p>Or all 4 should be Agi or Sta.</p></blockquote><p>Actually that would make the most sense for it to be just sta for all classes.</p></blockquote><p>True. On my Illu i dont bother about INT really. All a mezzer has to do is to live. A dead caster is a pitty, a dead crowd control is beyond that.</p>

[TalanRM]

<p>It is fairly pointless including a stat bonus if it automatically follows every archtypes highest stat. All stats should be desirable to a certain extend. It would make more sense if it were to be either Stamina or Agility for all classes. If the coding can distinguish between melee crits and spell crits you could make it Wisdom for spell crits (and maybe add a spell crit mitigation bonus to fighters defensive stances to reduce the massive outcry).</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>TalanRM wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It is fairly pointless including a stat bonus if it automatically follows every archtypes highest stat. All stats should be desirable to a certain extend. It would make more sense if it were to be either Stamina or Agility for all classes. If the coding can distinguish between melee crits and spell crits you could make it Wisdom for spell crits (and maybe add a spell crit mitigation bonus to fighters defensive stances to reduce the massive outcry).</p></blockquote><p>Agility for melee crit abd wisdom for spell crit would be perfect.</p>

[Mizou]

<p><span ><strong>Lethe5683 plz quit this game u make me ill !!!!!!!!!</strong></span></p><p>agi for a scout LOL ok ok i have 700 solo but i never focus on agi - never ever !!!</p><p>str sta int is what im loking for everything else - even an assassin isnt focus on agi - is NONESENSE</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Mizou wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><span><strong>Lethe5683 plz quit this game u make me ill !!!!!!!!!</strong></span></p><p>agi for a scout LOL ok ok i have 700 solo but i never focus on agi - never ever !!!</p><p>str sta int is what im loking for everything else - even an assassin isnt focus on agi - is NONESENSE</p></blockquote><p>Don't be stupid.  Just because you are obsessed with str doesn't mean you should get better defebsiv abilities from focusing on it.  That's like saying "Hey INT is good for mage dps!!! They shouldnt just get power from it but they should get hp from it as well".</p>

[Mizou]

<p>u are stupid ...</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Mizou wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>u are stupid ...</p></blockquote><p>No you are for overestimating the importance of str so much that you don't think anything of other stats.  With deminishing returns and especially negative returns focusing on str when you have more than 1k is stupid in any context.</p>

[Mizou]

<p>i said 3 stats - u say str</p><p>gratz u for beeing the noob</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Mizou wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>i said 3 stats - u say str</p><p>gratz u for beeing the noob</p></blockquote><p>3 stats that are just as "useless" as agi.</p>

[Mizou]

<p>sta = hp</p><p>int = poison damage</p><p>str = all melee output and im mostly not caped with it cause i switch gear ....</p>

[Noaani]

<p><cite>Mizou wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>sta = hp</p><p>int = poison damage</p><p>str = all melee output and im mostly not caped with it cause i switch gear ....</p><p><em>agi = crit mit and avoidance</em></p><p><em>wis = resists</em></p></blockquote><p>Awesome!</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Mizou wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>sta = hp</p><p>int = poison damage</p><p>str = all melee output and im mostly not caped with it cause i switch gear ....</p></blockquote><p>ORLY? I never would have guessed.  Grats on figureing that all out... it must have been hard for you.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p>The only thing reallly wrong with the way it is now is that most priests will be behind on crit mit since I don't know many priests with much more than 600 int unless they are a dps specced fury or something.</p>

[Gisallo]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Ranger's aren't the only scouts.  Maybe they should be changed to have str as their primary stat since it's so important and they don't need avoidance.  But I'm not a ranger and I have had enough with all the equipment with nothing but str/sta.</p><p>Seperate issue is with the crit mit scaleing having such diminishing returns you might as well just give everyone 10% crit mit and not base it on stats since most will be at or close to 10% without trying.</p></blockquote><p>Please don't make it sound like you don't know Rangers Lethe, you were ranger before you betrayed to Assassin and were a Ranger after the Epics were released so you should know whats better for rangers as well as Assassins.   As for gear having Str and Sta for Rangers LOL.  If I remember correctly, when you were a Ranger, you were one who used to complain that Ranger's were completely overlooked gear wise because of the lack of ranged crit and double attack.  Now suddenly the gear is designed with Ranger's in mind?  Funny how that changed miraculously after you betrayed.  </p>

[liveja]

<p><cite>Noaani wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Mizou wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>sta = hp</p><p>int = poison damage</p><p>str = all melee output and im mostly not caped with it cause i switch gear ....</p><p><em>agi = crit mit and avoidance</em></p><p><em>wis = resists</em></p></blockquote><p>Awesome!</p></blockquote><p>In my experience, raising WIS in order to raise resists is a waste of time. Much better to get +resists via gear. Of course, if those +resists come on gear that also has WIS on it, you'll get a bit more, but I don't think that most classes will get enough out of WIS to make raising it worthwhile.</p><p>Now, speaking strictly as a melee Scout ....</p><p>AGI = crit mit & avoidance, which for any DPS class that spends most of its time behind the mob's back is nice to have, but largely spurious. Obviously, it's more important for people who solo a LOT. My Swashy has about 650-700 or so, fully buffed, & I'm not going to expend lots of effort looking for more.</p><p>In my view, the three most important stats for a melee Scout are STR, STA, & INT, but once you start hitting the majikal STR curve -- which is really, really easy to do -- it's best to just concentrate on STA & INT.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Gisallo@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Ranger's aren't the only scouts.  Maybe they should be changed to have str as their primary stat since it's so important and they don't need avoidance.  But I'm not a ranger and I have had enough with all the equipment with nothing but str/sta.</p><p>Seperate issue is with the crit mit scaleing having such diminishing returns you might as well just give everyone 10% crit mit and not base it on stats since most will be at or close to 10% without trying.</p></blockquote><p>Please don't make it sound like you don't know Rangers Lethe, you were ranger before you betrayed to Assassin and were a Ranger after the Epics were released so you should know whats better for rangers as well as Assassins.   As for gear having Str and Sta for Rangers LOL.  If I remember correctly, when you were a Ranger, you were one who used to complain that Ranger's were completely overlooked gear wise because of the lack of ranged crit and double attack.  Now suddenly the gear is designed with Ranger's in mind?  Funny how that changed miraculously after you betrayed.  </p></blockquote><p>I was origionally an assassin and regretteds betraying shortly after I did but didn't have the money to betray back so I stuck with it longer than I would have otherwise.  I never said equipment was good for rangers, where did you see that?  I was only "admiting" that maybe the other rangers knew what was best for their own class but that doesn't mean it's the best for all scouts.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Flaye@Mistmoore wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Noaani wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Mizou wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>sta = hp</p><p>int = poison damage</p><p>str = all melee output and im mostly not caped with it cause i switch gear ....</p><p><em>agi = crit mit and avoidance</em></p><p><em>wis = resists</em></p></blockquote><p>Awesome!</p></blockquote><p>In my experience, raising WIS in order to raise resists is a waste of time. Much better to get +resists via gear. Of course, if those +resists come on gear that also has WIS on it, you'll get a bit more, but I don't think that most classes will get enough out of WIS to make raising it worthwhile.</p><p>Now, speaking strictly as a melee Scout ....</p><p>AGI = crit mit & avoidance, which for any DPS class that spends most of its time behind the mob's back is nice to have, but largely spurious. Obviously, it's more important for people who solo a LOT. My Swashy has about 650-700 or so, fully buffed, & I'm not going to expend lots of effort looking for more.</p><p>In my view, the three most important stats for a melee Scout are STR, STA, & INT, but once you start hitting the majikal STR curve -- which is really, really easy to do -- it's best to just concentrate on STA & INT.</p></blockquote><p>I still have a hard time understanding why you say avoidance, mit, crit mit, power are not important for a scout since they don't tank but then you say you focuse on sta for more hp...</p>

[liveja]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I still have a hard time understanding why you say avoidance, mit, crit mit, power are not important for a scout since they don't tank but then you say you focuse on sta for more hp...</p></blockquote><p>AFAIK, Avoidance doesn't do much to help you survive AOEs, or if it does help, the amount you gain from adding more AGI isn't enough to make a noticeable difference.</p><p>Mit is pointless unless you're soloing or tanking. You get enough from your armor for either of those anyway.</p><p>Crit Mit is irrelevant outside of TSO & certain very high level raids, & even then only matters if you're actually taking hits -- which, as a good Scout, you shouldn't be, at least not for very long. Having said this, Crit Mit is the only stat you mention that's worth worrying about, & at this point, I'm not worried, though I might be in the future.</p><p>Power, for a melee Scout at least, is almost-to-wholly irrelevant, unless you're fighting one of those wierd raid encounters where you have to watch your power. If you have power problems as a melee Scout, you likely need to quit spamming CAs.</p><p>It's quite possible that adding more hit points from STA won't get you enough to make much difference, which would make the discussion of AGI vs STA moot & render INT the only ability a high-level Rogue or Predator needs to concentrate on. Regardless, I still wouldn't worry much about AGI, as it comes often enough from "Scout gear" that it's not really an issue.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Flaye@Mistmoore wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I still have a hard time understanding why you say avoidance, mit, crit mit, power are not important for a scout since they don't tank but then you say you focuse on sta for more hp...</p></blockquote><p>AFAIK, Avoidance doesn't do much to help you survive AOEs, or if it does help, the amount you gain from adding more AGI isn't enough to make a noticeable difference.</p><p>Mit is pointless unless you're soloing or tanking. You get enough from your armor for either of those anyway.</p><p>Crit Mit is irrelevant outside of TSO & certain very high level raids, & even then only matters if you're actually taking hits -- which, as a good Scout, you shouldn't be, at least not for very long. Having said this, Crit Mit is the only stat you mention that's worth worrying about, & at this point, I'm not worried, though I might be in the future.</p><p>Power, for a melee Scout at least, is almost-to-wholly irrelevant, unless you're fighting one of those wierd raid encounters where you have to watch your power. If you have power problems as a melee Scout, you likely need to quit spamming CAs.</p><p>It's quite possible that adding more hit points from STA won't get you enough to make much difference, which would make the discussion of AGI vs STA moot & render INT the only ability a high-level Rogue or Predator needs to concentrate on. Regardless, I still wouldn't worry much about AGI, as it comes often enough from "Scout gear" that it's not really an issue.</p></blockquote><p>Most of the scout gear now has nearly no agi and it's pretty much impossible to focuse on int as a scout since there is almost nothing with int that has other good stats.</p>

[Mizou]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Flaye@Mistmoore wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I still have a hard time understanding why you say avoidance, mit, crit mit, power are not important for a scout since they don't tank but then you say you focuse on sta for more hp...</p></blockquote><p>AFAIK, Avoidance doesn't do much to help you survive AOEs, or if it does help, the amount you gain from adding more AGI isn't enough to make a noticeable difference.</p><p>Mit is pointless unless you're soloing or tanking. You get enough from your armor for either of those anyway.</p><p>Crit Mit is irrelevant outside of TSO & certain very high level raids, & even then only matters if you're actually taking hits -- which, as a good Scout, you shouldn't be, at least not for very long. Having said this, Crit Mit is the only stat you mention that's worth worrying about, & at this point, I'm not worried, though I might be in the future.</p><p>Power, for a melee Scout at least, is almost-to-wholly irrelevant, unless you're fighting one of those wierd raid encounters where you have to watch your power. If you have power problems as a melee Scout, you likely need to quit spamming CAs.</p><p>It's quite possible that adding more hit points from STA won't get you enough to make much difference, which would make the discussion of AGI vs STA moot & render INT the only ability a high-level Rogue or Predator needs to concentrate on. Regardless, I still wouldn't worry much about AGI, as it comes often enough from "Scout gear" that it's not really an issue.</p></blockquote><p>Most of the scout gear now has nearly no agi and it's pretty much impossible to focuse on int as a scout since there is almost nothing with int that has other good stats.</p></blockquote><p>failed again - go back to school</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Mizou wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Flaye@Mistmoore wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I still have a hard time understanding why you say avoidance, mit, crit mit, power are not important for a scout since they don't tank but then you say you focuse on sta for more hp...</p></blockquote><p>AFAIK, Avoidance doesn't do much to help you survive AOEs, or if it does help, the amount you gain from adding more AGI isn't enough to make a noticeable difference.</p><p>Mit is pointless unless you're soloing or tanking. You get enough from your armor for either of those anyway.</p><p>Crit Mit is irrelevant outside of TSO & certain very high level raids, & even then only matters if you're actually taking hits -- which, as a good Scout, you shouldn't be, at least not for very long. Having said this, Crit Mit is the only stat you mention that's worth worrying about, & at this point, I'm not worried, though I might be in the future.</p><p>Power, for a melee Scout at least, is almost-to-wholly irrelevant, unless you're fighting one of those wierd raid encounters where you have to watch your power. If you have power problems as a melee Scout, you likely need to quit spamming CAs.</p><p>It's quite possible that adding more hit points from STA won't get you enough to make much difference, which would make the discussion of AGI vs STA moot & render INT the only ability a high-level Rogue or Predator needs to concentrate on. Regardless, I still wouldn't worry much about AGI, as it comes often enough from "Scout gear" that it's not really an issue.</p></blockquote><p>Most of the scout gear now has nearly no agi and it's pretty much impossible to focuse on int as a scout since there is almost nothing with int that has other good stats.</p></blockquote><p>failed again - go back to school</p></blockquote><p>How?  You clearly must not understand english if you think what I just said was incorrect.  Go back to germany.</p>

[Kaja]

<p><span><strong>Lethe5683, </strong></span></p><p><span><strong> </strong>you need to really really stop posting such nonsense and missinformation, you have been told i dont know how many times now by people a lot cleverer about eq2 game mechanics than yourself that agil is a dead stat for a scout. right uptil they had this brainwave of making it the crit mit stat for melee class's(inc rangers)</span></p><p>my Brig has STR 1100+solo STAM 650+ solo INT 650+ solo Agil and wis i couldnt care less about i have 555 AGIL and 52 WIS</p><p>not until you reach 1450+ in a stat will you start to see a tiny miniscule decrease in benefit, uptil that point maxing out STR will increase your CA + auto attack both of primary importance to every single dps scout in eq2, keep harping on str isnt important and agil is the roxxors.</p><p>Agil does absolutley nothing for you unless you want to tank, i play a brigand and i have tanked a lot of eq2 content and i still dont care about agility cos its increase to your ability to dodge attacks is non exsistant, you play an Assassin for crying out loud, tank much on that do you? AGIL should mean absolute zilch to you, i does not help you survive aoes, it dont do nothing period. apart from now it adds to your inherent crit miti, a flawed choice of stat by the Dev responsible</p><p>STR+STAM+INT are priority stats for a dps scout, 2 make you do more damage one helps you eat aoes. other 2 stats are dead, they could remove them from the class for all i care and all other raiding scouts, so long as they changed the crit mit stat first ofc <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Kaja wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><span><strong>Lethe5683, </strong></span></p><p><span><strong> </strong>you need to really really stop posting such nonsense and missinformation, you have been told i dont know how many times now by people a lot cleverer about eq2 game mechanics than yourself that agil is a dead stat for a scout. right uptil they had this brainwave of making it the crit mit stat for melee class's(inc rangers)</span></p><p>my Brig has STR 1100+solo STAM 650+ solo INT 650+ solo Agil and wis i couldnt care less about i have 555 AGIL and 52 WIS</p><p>not until you reach 1450+ in a stat will you start to see a tiny miniscule decrease in benefit, uptil that point maxing out STR will increase your CA + auto attack both of primary importance to every single dps scout in eq2, keep harping on str isnt important and agil is the roxxors.</p><p>Agil does absolutley nothing for you unless you want to tank, i play a brigand and i have tanked a lot of eq2 content and i still dont care about agility cos its increase to your ability to dodge attacks is non exsistant, you play an Assassin for crying out loud, tank much on that do you? AGIL should mean absolute zilch to you, i does not help you survive aoes, it dont do nothing period. apart from now it adds to your inherent crit miti, a flawed choice of stat by the Dev responsible</p><p>STR+STAM+INT are priority stats for a dps scout, 2 make you do more damage one helps you eat aoes. other 2 stats are dead, they could remove them from the class for all i care and all other raiding scouts, so long as they changed the crit mit stat first ofc <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>There is almost no benefit from taking str higher than 1000 and it would be stupid to sacrifice any other stat to do so.  AGI is useless for avoidance?  hmm so like 10% avoidance = nothing?  STA is not a significant gain to hp that it would help you survive much of anything.  Yes I have tanked a few instances on my assassin but that's not the point.  Avoidance is for surviving when the tank looses aggro or dies and for avoiding physical aoes.</p>

[Kaja]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kaja wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><span><strong>Lethe5683, </strong></span></p><p><span><strong> </strong>you need to really really stop posting such nonsense and missinformation, you have been told i dont know how many times now by people a lot cleverer about eq2 game mechanics than yourself that agil is a dead stat for a scout. right uptil they had this brainwave of making it the crit mit stat for melee class's(inc rangers)</span></p><p>my Brig has STR 1100+solo STAM 650+ solo INT 650+ solo Agil and wis i couldnt care less about i have 555 AGIL and 52 WIS</p><p>not until you reach 1450+ in a stat will you start to see a tiny miniscule decrease in benefit, uptil that point maxing out STR will increase your CA + auto attack both of primary importance to every single dps scout in eq2, keep harping on str isnt important and agil is the roxxors.</p><p>Agil does absolutley nothing for you unless you want to tank, i play a brigand and i have tanked a lot of eq2 content and i still dont care about agility cos its increase to your ability to dodge attacks is non exsistant, you play an Assassin for crying out loud, tank much on that do you? AGIL should mean absolute zilch to you, i does not help you survive aoes, it dont do nothing period. apart from now it adds to your inherent crit miti, a flawed choice of stat by the Dev responsible</p><p>STR+STAM+INT are priority stats for a dps scout, 2 make you do more damage one helps you eat aoes. other 2 stats are dead, they could remove them from the class for all i care and all other raiding scouts, so long as they changed the crit mit stat first ofc <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>There is almost no benefit from taking str higher than 1000 and it would be stupid to sacrifice any other stat to do so.  AGI is useless for avoidance?  hmm so like 10% avoidance = nothing?  STA is not a significant gain to hp that it would help you survive much of anything.  Yes I have tanked a few instances on my assassin but that's not the point.  Avoidance is for surviving when the tank looses aggro or dies and for avoiding physical aoes.</p></blockquote><p>just wow, where do you get your facts from?</p><p>avoidence has squat diddly to do with avoiding aoes, you avoid an aoe by resisiting its damage type or having an ability on you that blocks the aoe.</p><p>going from 550agil-1280agil would at BEST see you take 1-2% less damage on a zonewide parse with you tanking the entire time, in heroic settings who cares if the tank dies? if it can 1shot a tank its going to 1 shot you even with capped agility</p><p>going from 100ostr to 1280 str the cap is going to directly improve your dps out put, your an assassin your designed to do dps. maybe you should reroll at this point seeing as you seem to be so confused with the game and the class's roles, you know try again from scratch.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Kaja wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kaja wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><span><strong>Lethe5683, </strong></span></p><p><span><strong> </strong>you need to really really stop posting such nonsense and missinformation, you have been told i dont know how many times now by people a lot cleverer about eq2 game mechanics than yourself that agil is a dead stat for a scout. right uptil they had this brainwave of making it the crit mit stat for melee class's(inc rangers)</span></p><p>my Brig has STR 1100+solo STAM 650+ solo INT 650+ solo Agil and wis i couldnt care less about i have 555 AGIL and 52 WIS</p><p>not until you reach 1450+ in a stat will you start to see a tiny miniscule decrease in benefit, uptil that point maxing out STR will increase your CA + auto attack both of primary importance to every single dps scout in eq2, keep harping on str isnt important and agil is the roxxors.</p><p>Agil does absolutley nothing for you unless you want to tank, i play a brigand and i have tanked a lot of eq2 content and i still dont care about agility cos its increase to your ability to dodge attacks is non exsistant, you play an Assassin for crying out loud, tank much on that do you? AGIL should mean absolute zilch to you, i does not help you survive aoes, it dont do nothing period. apart from now it adds to your inherent crit miti, a flawed choice of stat by the Dev responsible</p><p>STR+STAM+INT are priority stats for a dps scout, 2 make you do more damage one helps you eat aoes. other 2 stats are dead, they could remove them from the class for all i care and all other raiding scouts, so long as they changed the crit mit stat first ofc <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>There is almost no benefit from taking str higher than 1000 and it would be stupid to sacrifice any other stat to do so.  AGI is useless for avoidance?  hmm so like 10% avoidance = nothing?  STA is not a significant gain to hp that it would help you survive much of anything.  Yes I have tanked a few instances on my assassin but that's not the point.  Avoidance is for surviving when the tank looses aggro or dies and for avoiding physical aoes.</p></blockquote><p>just wow, where do you get your facts from?</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">Common sense?</span></p><p>avoidence has squat diddly to do with avoiding aoes, you avoid an aoe by resisiting its damage type or having an ability on you that blocks the aoe.</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">I said physical AoEs not magic ones.  Yes avoidance is for avoiding physical aoes.</span></p><p>going from 550agil-1280agil would at BEST see you take 1-2% less damage on a zonewide parse with you tanking the entire time, in heroic settings who cares if the tank dies? if it can 1shot a tank its going to 1 shot you even with capped agility</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">Because the tank dies that means that they were one shotted? I don't think so.  If you're fighting anything that can one shot your tank you either need a new tank or need to stop trying to fight epics in a single group.</span></p><p>going from 100ostr to 1280 str the cap is going to directly improve your dps out put, your an assassin your designed to do dps. maybe you should reroll at this point seeing as you seem to be so confused with the game and the class's roles, you know try again from scratch.</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">Oh woot maybe 200 more dps.. like that even matters?</span></p></blockquote>

[Kaja]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kaja wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kaja wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><span><strong>Lethe5683, </strong></span></p><p><span><strong> </strong>you need to really really stop posting such nonsense and missinformation, you have been told i dont know how many times now by people a lot cleverer about eq2 game mechanics than yourself that agil is a dead stat for a scout. right uptil they had this brainwave of making it the crit mit stat for melee class's(inc rangers)</span></p><p>my Brig has STR 1100+solo STAM 650+ solo INT 650+ solo Agil and wis i couldnt care less about i have 555 AGIL and 52 WIS</p><p>not until you reach 1450+ in a stat will you start to see a tiny miniscule decrease in benefit, uptil that point maxing out STR will increase your CA + auto attack both of primary importance to every single dps scout in eq2, keep harping on str isnt important and agil is the roxxors.</p><p>Agil does absolutley nothing for you unless you want to tank, i play a brigand and i have tanked a lot of eq2 content and i still dont care about agility cos its increase to your ability to dodge attacks is non exsistant, you play an Assassin for crying out loud, tank much on that do you? AGIL should mean absolute zilch to you, i does not help you survive aoes, it dont do nothing period. apart from now it adds to your inherent crit miti, a flawed choice of stat by the Dev responsible</p><p>STR+STAM+INT are priority stats for a dps scout, 2 make you do more damage one helps you eat aoes. other 2 stats are dead, they could remove them from the class for all i care and all other raiding scouts, so long as they changed the crit mit stat first ofc <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>There is almost no benefit from taking str higher than 1000 and it would be stupid to sacrifice any other stat to do so.  AGI is useless for avoidance?  hmm so like 10% avoidance = nothing?  STA is not a significant gain to hp that it would help you survive much of anything.  Yes I have tanked a few instances on my assassin but that's not the point.  Avoidance is for surviving when the tank looses aggro or dies and for avoiding physical aoes.</p></blockquote><p>just wow, where do you get your facts from?</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">Common sense?</span></p><p>avoidence has squat diddly to do with avoiding aoes, you avoid an aoe by resisiting its damage type or having an ability on you that blocks the aoe.</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">I said physical AoEs not magic ones.  Yes avoidance is for avoiding physical aoes.</span></p><p>going from 550agil-1280agil would at BEST see you take 1-2% less damage on a zonewide parse with you tanking the entire time, in heroic settings who cares if the tank dies? if it can 1shot a tank its going to 1 shot you even with capped agility</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">Because the tank dies that means that they were one shotted? I don't think so.  If you're fighting anything that can one shot your tank you either need a new tank or need to stop trying to fight epics in a single group.</span></p><p>going from 100ostr to 1280 str the cap is going to directly improve your dps out put, your an assassin your designed to do dps. maybe you should reroll at this point seeing as you seem to be so confused with the game and the class's roles, you know try again from scratch.</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">Oh woot maybe 200 more dps.. like that even matters?</span></p></blockquote></blockquote><p>1 to common it seems and not refined enough</p><p>2 avoidence skill is not used in any shape or form to help avoid an aoe, aoes auto hit unless you either joust oor, are using aoe blocking skills/abilitys. physical damage aoes funnily enough use your physical mitigation to work out whether your take the damage or resist it. any non physical damage uses your spell mitigation aka resists.</p><p>3 sorry for my confusing of you, in a heroic zone it doesnt matter who has aggro, heroic content is a joke, thus making agil usless for a dps scout, if your dying cos you have heroic mob aggro your healers suck. in a raid which i mentioned 1shotting to cover, if you get aggro in a raid the mobs have that many abilitys that ignore your def stats, your going to die 99.999999% of the time, regardless of what your agil stat is as a dps scout. hope thats clear enough for you this time.</p><p>4 200dps ? your playing the permier dps class in eq2 atm, you should be concerned with not much else than your amazing ability as an assassin to do DPS, just the fact that you think Agil is more important to Assassins than STR begs the question really, why did you pick an Assassin? if you dont care about the class's main reason for being in eq2?</p><p>5 im sure you are going to give me some long winded explanation that you dont care about dps etc etc and you play  an Assassin for the flavour and rp type reasons, that my friend is perfectly fine and acceptable, no one has the right to tell you what you can and cant play in eq2 but yourself, what is not acceptable is posting the wrong information about scouts in eq2, and that my friend is what you seem to be doing here fairly regularly, which is why myself and others who know better keep telling you what we do.</p><p>you never know, there could be a reason why so many of us scouts repeat the same information, in response to your "information", just sayin....</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Kaja wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kaja wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kaja wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><span><strong>Lethe5683, </strong></span></p><p><span><strong> </strong>you need to really really stop posting such nonsense and missinformation, you have been told i dont know how many times now by people a lot cleverer about eq2 game mechanics than yourself that agil is a dead stat for a scout. right uptil they had this brainwave of making it the crit mit stat for melee class's(inc rangers)</span></p><p>my Brig has STR 1100+solo STAM 650+ solo INT 650+ solo Agil and wis i couldnt care less about i have 555 AGIL and 52 WIS</p><p>not until you reach 1450+ in a stat will you start to see a tiny miniscule decrease in benefit, uptil that point maxing out STR will increase your CA + auto attack both of primary importance to every single dps scout in eq2, keep harping on str isnt important and agil is the roxxors.</p><p>Agil does absolutley nothing for you unless you want to tank, i play a brigand and i have tanked a lot of eq2 content and i still dont care about agility cos its increase to your ability to dodge attacks is non exsistant, you play an Assassin for crying out loud, tank much on that do you? AGIL should mean absolute zilch to you, i does not help you survive aoes, it dont do nothing period. apart from now it adds to your inherent crit miti, a flawed choice of stat by the Dev responsible</p><p>STR+STAM+INT are priority stats for a dps scout, 2 make you do more damage one helps you eat aoes. other 2 stats are dead, they could remove them from the class for all i care and all other raiding scouts, so long as they changed the crit mit stat first ofc <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>There is almost no benefit from taking str higher than 1000 and it would be stupid to sacrifice any other stat to do so.  AGI is useless for avoidance?  hmm so like 10% avoidance = nothing?  STA is not a significant gain to hp that it would help you survive much of anything.  Yes I have tanked a few instances on my assassin but that's not the point.  Avoidance is for surviving when the tank looses aggro or dies and for avoiding physical aoes.</p></blockquote><p>just wow, where do you get your facts from?</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">Common sense?</span></p><p>avoidence has squat diddly to do with avoiding aoes, you avoid an aoe by resisiting its damage type or having an ability on you that blocks the aoe.</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">I said physical AoEs not magic ones.  Yes avoidance is for avoiding physical aoes.</span></p><p>going from 550agil-1280agil would at BEST see you take 1-2% less damage on a zonewide parse with you tanking the entire time, in heroic settings who cares if the tank dies? if it can 1shot a tank its going to 1 shot you even with capped agility</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">Because the tank dies that means that they were one shotted? I don't think so.  If you're fighting anything that can one shot your tank you either need a new tank or need to stop trying to fight epics in a single group.</span></p><p>going from 100ostr to 1280 str the cap is going to directly improve your dps out put, your an assassin your designed to do dps. maybe you should reroll at this point seeing as you seem to be so confused with the game and the class's roles, you know try again from scratch.</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">Oh woot maybe 200 more dps.. like that even matters?</span></p></blockquote></blockquote><p>1 to common it seems and not refined enough</p><p>2 avoidence skill is not used in any shape or form to help avoid an aoe, aoes auto hit unless you either joust oor, are using aoe blocking skills/abilitys. physical damage aoes funnily enough use your physical mitigation to work out whether your take the damage or resist it. any non physical damage uses your spell mitigation aka resists.</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">That's not true I have avoided AoEs before.</span></p><p>3 sorry for my confusing of you, in a heroic zone it doesnt matter who has aggro, heroic content is a joke, thus making agil usless for a dps scout, if your dying cos you have heroic mob aggro your healers suck. in a raid which i mentioned 1shotting to cover, if you get aggro in a raid the mobs have that many abilitys that ignore your def stats, your going to die 99.999999% of the time, regardless of what your agil stat is as a dps scout. hope thats clear enough for you this time.</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">I don't give a **** about raids.</span></p><p>4 200dps ? your playing the permier dps class in eq2 atm, you should be concerned with not much else than your amazing ability as an assassin to do DPS, just the fact that you think Agil is more important to Assassins than STR begs the question really, why did you pick an Assassin? if you dont care about the class's main reason for being in eq2?</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">I didn't pick an assassin to be some slow stupid brute.  Avoidance is very important for the way I play.  If you're one of those people who cares about nothing but numbers then don't bother talking to me anymore your kind disgust me.</span></p></blockquote>

[Kaja]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kaja wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kaja wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kaja wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><span><strong>Lethe5683, </strong></span></p><p><span><strong> </strong>you need to really really stop posting such nonsense and missinformation, you have been told i dont know how many times now by people a lot cleverer about eq2 game mechanics than yourself that agil is a dead stat for a scout. right uptil they had this brainwave of making it the crit mit stat for melee class's(inc rangers)</span></p><p>my Brig has STR 1100+solo STAM 650+ solo INT 650+ solo Agil and wis i couldnt care less about i have 555 AGIL and 52 WIS</p><p>not until you reach 1450+ in a stat will you start to see a tiny miniscule decrease in benefit, uptil that point maxing out STR will increase your CA + auto attack both of primary importance to every single dps scout in eq2, keep harping on str isnt important and agil is the roxxors.</p><p>Agil does absolutley nothing for you unless you want to tank, i play a brigand and i have tanked a lot of eq2 content and i still dont care about agility cos its increase to your ability to dodge attacks is non exsistant, you play an Assassin for crying out loud, tank much on that do you? AGIL should mean absolute zilch to you, i does not help you survive aoes, it dont do nothing period. apart from now it adds to your inherent crit miti, a flawed choice of stat by the Dev responsible</p><p>STR+STAM+INT are priority stats for a dps scout, 2 make you do more damage one helps you eat aoes. other 2 stats are dead, they could remove them from the class for all i care and all other raiding scouts, so long as they changed the crit mit stat first ofc <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>There is almost no benefit from taking str higher than 1000 and it would be stupid to sacrifice any other stat to do so.  AGI is useless for avoidance?  hmm so like 10% avoidance = nothing?  STA is not a significant gain to hp that it would help you survive much of anything.  Yes I have tanked a few instances on my assassin but that's not the point.  Avoidance is for surviving when the tank looses aggro or dies and for avoiding physical aoes.</p></blockquote><p>just wow, where do you get your facts from?</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">Common sense?</span></p><p>avoidence has squat diddly to do with avoiding aoes, you avoid an aoe by resisiting its damage type or having an ability on you that blocks the aoe.</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">I said physical AoEs not magic ones.  Yes avoidance is for avoiding physical aoes.</span></p><p>going from 550agil-1280agil would at BEST see you take 1-2% less damage on a zonewide parse with you tanking the entire time, in heroic settings who cares if the tank dies? if it can 1shot a tank its going to 1 shot you even with capped agility</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">Because the tank dies that means that they were one shotted? I don't think so.  If you're fighting anything that can one shot your tank you either need a new tank or need to stop trying to fight epics in a single group.</span></p><p>going from 100ostr to 1280 str the cap is going to directly improve your dps out put, your an assassin your designed to do dps. maybe you should reroll at this point seeing as you seem to be so confused with the game and the class's roles, you know try again from scratch.</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">Oh woot maybe 200 more dps.. like that even matters?</span></p></blockquote></blockquote><p>1 to common it seems and not refined enough</p><p>2 avoidence skill is not used in any shape or form to help avoid an aoe, aoes auto hit unless you either joust oor, are using aoe blocking skills/abilitys. physical damage aoes funnily enough use your physical mitigation to work out whether your take the damage or resist it. any non physical damage uses your spell mitigation aka resists.</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">That's not true I have avoided AoEs before.</span></p><p>3 sorry for my confusing of you, in a heroic zone it doesnt matter who has aggro, heroic content is a joke, thus making agil usless for a dps scout, if your dying cos you have heroic mob aggro your healers suck. in a raid which i mentioned 1shotting to cover, if you get aggro in a raid the mobs have that many abilitys that ignore your def stats, your going to die 99.999999% of the time, regardless of what your agil stat is as a dps scout. hope thats clear enough for you this time.</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">I don't give a **** about raids.</span></p><p>4 200dps ? your playing the permier dps class in eq2 atm, you should be concerned with not much else than your amazing ability as an assassin to do DPS, just the fact that you think Agil is more important to Assassins than STR begs the question really, why did you pick an Assassin? if you dont care about the class's main reason for being in eq2?</p><p><span style="color: #800080;">I didn't pick an assassin to be some slow stupid brute.  Avoidance is very important for the way I play.  If you're one of those people who cares about nothing but numbers then don't bother talking to me anymore your kind disgust me.</span></p></blockquote></blockquote><p><span ><p>5 im sure you are going to give me some long winded explanation that you dont care about dps etc etc and you play  an Assassin for the flavour and rp type reasons, that my friend is perfectly fine and acceptable, no one has the right to tell you what you can and cant play in eq2 but yourself, what is not acceptable is posting the wrong information about scouts in eq2, and that my friend is what you seem to be doing here fairly regularly, which is why myself and others who know better keep telling you what we do.</p><p>you never know, there could be a reason why so many of us scouts repeat the same information, in response to your "information", just sayin....</p><p>reposted as you were that quick replying.</p><p>And just give it up avoidence is not factored into the equation of avoiding aoe damage, this is a fact of eq2, you can out right resist its damage, you can joust it, and you can block it with CA's, Procs, AA abilitys, item clickys thats it. AOES are 100% hit chance if your in range of it. no amount of avoidence skill helps to avoid an aoe, im done trying to be civil with your obvious attitude and lack of game mechanic knowledge.</p><p>someone else can have fun beating there head against the Brick <cite>Lethe5683 </cite>Wall.</p></span></p>

[Ceolus]

<p>Sure, mages get the upper hand in that their primary ability is the same that increases their crit mit. However the primary stat of a healer is wisdom, which gives them the upper hand on resists. It balances out imo.</p>

[Mizou]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kaja wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><span><strong>Lethe5683, </strong></span></p><p><span><strong> </strong>you need to really really stop posting such nonsense and missinformation, you have been told i dont know how many times now by people a lot cleverer about eq2 game mechanics than yourself that agil is a dead stat for a scout. right uptil they had this brainwave of making it the crit mit stat for melee class's(inc rangers)</span></p><p>my Brig has STR 1100+solo STAM 650+ solo INT 650+ solo Agil and wis i couldnt care less about i have 555 AGIL and 52 WIS</p><p>not until you reach 1450+ in a stat will you start to see a tiny miniscule decrease in benefit, uptil that point maxing out STR will increase your CA + auto attack both of primary importance to every single dps scout in eq2, keep harping on str isnt important and agil is the roxxors.</p><p>Agil does absolutley nothing for you unless you want to tank, i play a brigand and i have tanked a lot of eq2 content and i still dont care about agility cos its increase to your ability to dodge attacks is non exsistant, you play an Assassin for crying out loud, tank much on that do you? AGIL should mean absolute zilch to you, i does not help you survive aoes, it dont do nothing period. apart from now it adds to your inherent crit miti, a flawed choice of stat by the Dev responsible</p><p>STR+STAM+INT are priority stats for a dps scout, 2 make you do more damage one helps you eat aoes. other 2 stats are dead, they could remove them from the class for all i care and all other raiding scouts, so long as they changed the crit mit stat first ofc <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>There is almost no benefit from taking str higher than 1000 and it would be stupid to sacrifice any other stat to do so.  AGI is useless for avoidance?  hmm so like 10% avoidance = nothing?  STA is not a significant gain to hp that it would help you survive much of anything.  Yes I have tanked a few instances on my assassin but that's not the point.  Avoidance is for surviving when the tank looses aggro or dies and for avoiding physical aoes.</p></blockquote><p>failed again - go home !</p>

[Mizou]

<p>and btw yes u can avoid melee aoes - do u want to know how ? ok ok i will tell ya im not a turk:</p><p>parry !!! use a shield !!! get some of these things ... this is the only way to a) reduce a aoe and b) completly avoid 1 of 150 aoes</p><p>thats it - now u can go home and dont forget to eat some agility</p>

[CenturaEQ]

<p>Cap: 15 * Level + 20</p><p><img src="http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i301/neleso/diminishingreturns1.jpg" width="800" height="750" /></p><p>No reason to even care about attributes.</p>

[Gisallo]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><blockquote><p><span style="color: #800080;">That's not true I have avoided AoEs before.</span></p></blockquote></blockquote><p>If you can show the screen shot of a combat log that says "you avoided billy bob's AoE" WITHOUT another classes abilityt kicking in nd saving your butt okay.  However this would fly in the face of the games mechanics.  What makes AoE's, even melee AoE's, is that they can only be jousted, parried, blocked, deflected, or defeated by AoE blocking AA's and CA's.  You do not get a "standard" avoidance check for AoE's.  Basically you are saying A) I have a high agility B) AoE's have not faced me, so Agility must have been what saved me.  However if you actually know the games AoE mechanic then you would realize this is NOT the case.</p><p>Also, unless you are looking for RP and flavor (and it appears thats your primary goal given your comment about hulikng brutes)  its all good.  One of my toons is in an RP guild and I have a blast with him.  Thing is though you shouldn't be turning around and saying "this stat is best mechanically" when it clearly isn't, heck in this case its not even a matter of preference such as does a Pally want a higher Wis or Int (since they have damage spells too) its a matter of you saying that a stat effects a mechanic that it has NO impact on whatsoever.  </p>

[Gisallo]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Gisallo@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Ranger's aren't the only scouts.  Maybe they should be changed to have str as their primary stat since it's so important and they don't need avoidance.  But I'm not a ranger and I have had enough with all the equipment with nothing but str/sta.</p><p>Seperate issue is with the crit mit scaleing having such diminishing returns you might as well just give everyone 10% crit mit and not base it on stats since most will be at or close to 10% without trying.</p></blockquote><p>Please don't make it sound like you don't know Rangers Lethe, you were ranger before you betrayed to Assassin and were a Ranger after the Epics were released so you should know whats better for rangers as well as Assassins.   As for gear having Str and Sta for Rangers LOL.  If I remember correctly, when you were a Ranger, you were one who used to complain that Ranger's were completely overlooked gear wise because of the lack of ranged crit and double attack.  Now suddenly the gear is designed with Ranger's in mind?  Funny how that changed miraculously after you betrayed.  </p></blockquote><p>I was origionally an assassin and regretteds betraying shortly after I did but didn't have the money to betray back so I stuck with it longer than I would have otherwise.  I never said equipment was good for rangers, where did you see that?  I was only "admiting" that maybe the other rangers knew what was best for their own class but that doesn't mean it's the best for all scouts.</p></blockquote><p>Well you said...."But I'm not a ranger and I have had enough with all the equipment with nothing but str/sta....."</p><p>Since you are complaining that all the gear has Strength and Sta on it...in the context of not being a ranger its a pretty logical conclusion to say you are saying this is for rangers. </p><p>Also the mechanics for melee DPS are pretty consistent because only certain stats effect melee combat.  Doesn't matter if you are using a bow or a sword, melee dps gets calculated using the same stats and equations when it comes to a character's physical stats.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Gisallo@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Gisallo@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Ranger's aren't the only scouts.  Maybe they should be changed to have str as their primary stat since it's so important and they don't need avoidance.  But I'm not a ranger and I have had enough with all the equipment with nothing but str/sta.</p><p>Seperate issue is with the crit mit scaleing having such diminishing returns you might as well just give everyone 10% crit mit and not base it on stats since most will be at or close to 10% without trying.</p></blockquote><p>Please don't make it sound like you don't know Rangers Lethe, you were ranger before you betrayed to Assassin and were a Ranger after the Epics were released so you should know whats better for rangers as well as Assassins.   As for gear having Str and Sta for Rangers LOL.  If I remember correctly, when you were a Ranger, you were one who used to complain that Ranger's were completely overlooked gear wise because of the lack of ranged crit and double attack.  Now suddenly the gear is designed with Ranger's in mind?  Funny how that changed miraculously after you betrayed.  </p></blockquote><p>I was origionally an assassin and regretteds betraying shortly after I did but didn't have the money to betray back so I stuck with it longer than I would have otherwise.  I never said equipment was good for rangers, where did you see that?  I was only "admiting" that maybe the other rangers knew what was best for their own class but that doesn't mean it's the best for all scouts.</p></blockquote><p>Well you said...."But I'm not a ranger and I have had enough with all the equipment with nothing but str/sta....."</p><p>Since you are complaining that all the gear has Strength and Sta on it...in the context of not being a ranger its a pretty logical conclusion to say you are saying this is for rangers. </p><p>Also the mechanics for melee DPS are pretty consistent because only certain stats effect melee combat.  Doesn't matter if you are using a bow or a sword, melee dps gets calculated using the same stats and equations when it comes to a character's physical stats.</p></blockquote><p>That's not true, rangers have a specific proc ont heir epic that adds extra CA damage based on STR.  On other melee classes STR does as little for dps as AGI does for avoidance. (Unless it's something low like sub 800 raiseing any stat past that does little.)</p>

[Gisallo]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Gisallo@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Gisallo@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Ranger's aren't the only scouts.  Maybe they should be changed to have str as their primary stat since it's so important and they don't need avoidance.  But I'm not a ranger and I have had enough with all the equipment with nothing but str/sta.</p><p>Seperate issue is with the crit mit scaleing having such diminishing returns you might as well just give everyone 10% crit mit and not base it on stats since most will be at or close to 10% without trying.</p></blockquote><p>Please don't make it sound like you don't know Rangers Lethe, you were ranger before you betrayed to Assassin and were a Ranger after the Epics were released so you should know whats better for rangers as well as Assassins.   As for gear having Str and Sta for Rangers LOL.  If I remember correctly, when you were a Ranger, you were one who used to complain that Ranger's were completely overlooked gear wise because of the lack of ranged crit and double attack.  Now suddenly the gear is designed with Ranger's in mind?  Funny how that changed miraculously after you betrayed.  </p></blockquote><p>I was origionally an assassin and regretteds betraying shortly after I did but didn't have the money to betray back so I stuck with it longer than I would have otherwise.  I never said equipment was good for rangers, where did you see that?  I was only "admiting" that maybe the other rangers knew what was best for their own class but that doesn't mean it's the best for all scouts.</p></blockquote><p>Well you said...."But I'm not a ranger and I have had enough with all the equipment with nothing but str/sta....."</p><p>Since you are complaining that all the gear has Strength and Sta on it...in the context of not being a ranger its a pretty logical conclusion to say you are saying this is for rangers. </p><p>Also the mechanics for melee DPS are pretty consistent because only certain stats effect melee combat.  Doesn't matter if you are using a bow or a sword, melee dps gets calculated using the same stats and equations when it comes to a character's physical stats.</p></blockquote><p>That's not true, rangers have a specific proc ont heir epic that adds extra CA damage based on STR.  On other melee classes STR does as little for dps as AGI does for avoidance. (Unless it's something low like sub 800 raiseing any stat past that does little.)</p></blockquote><p>Okay now you are clearly desperate to save face.  I was talking about the base damage calculations in the game NOT procs., especially not procs off of Epics.   The use word MECHANIC (also known as the base code of the game) pretty much should have been the give away there so please stop trying to obfuscate the issue.  Funny also that before you were pleading ignorance of Rangers and yet bring this up suddenly knowing them, even though its not germain to the conversation of base game mechanic. </p><p>I will grant you the game does have a "soft cap" for stats, no doubt but even after the 8-900 where the extra damage for strength starts to taper (never goes away mind you simply becomes less efficient) it still gets better. </p><p>Thing is though IF you see your class as there to DPS (and thats what most, not all but most scouts see themselves as) then you are thinking Str Sta and Int regardless of the soft cap.  Str and Int for dps Sta because all the agility in the world isn't going to save you from an AOE and even in a group the tank should be holding aggro and the times avoidance does help you should be minimal.  There is no hard cap so you still get more damage, simply not as much as you get higher.  MAYBE if you are a soloer it makes sense but then you should not be using a classic "dps" build under those circumstances anyway.</p><p>The problem yet again Lethe is that you do not differentiate between circumstances.  You make sweeping comments about the game and its mehanics.  When you get called on it you bring up the ONE circumstance (the Rangers freaking Epic) which may not even be germain to the conversation to try and support your view.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Gisallo@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Gisallo@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Gisallo@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Ranger's aren't the only scouts.  Maybe they should be changed to have str as their primary stat since it's so important and they don't need avoidance.  But I'm not a ranger and I have had enough with all the equipment with nothing but str/sta.</p><p>Seperate issue is with the crit mit scaleing having such diminishing returns you might as well just give everyone 10% crit mit and not base it on stats since most will be at or close to 10% without trying.</p></blockquote><p>Please don't make it sound like you don't know Rangers Lethe, you were ranger before you betrayed to Assassin and were a Ranger after the Epics were released so you should know whats better for rangers as well as Assassins.   As for gear having Str and Sta for Rangers LOL.  If I remember correctly, when you were a Ranger, you were one who used to complain that Ranger's were completely overlooked gear wise because of the lack of ranged crit and double attack.  Now suddenly the gear is designed with Ranger's in mind?  Funny how that changed miraculously after you betrayed.  </p></blockquote><p>I was origionally an assassin and regretteds betraying shortly after I did but didn't have the money to betray back so I stuck with it longer than I would have otherwise.  I never said equipment was good for rangers, where did you see that?  I was only "admiting" that maybe the other rangers knew what was best for their own class but that doesn't mean it's the best for all scouts.</p></blockquote><p>Well you said...."But I'm not a ranger and I have had enough with all the equipment with nothing but str/sta....."</p><p>Since you are complaining that all the gear has Strength and Sta on it...in the context of not being a ranger its a pretty logical conclusion to say you are saying this is for rangers. </p><p>Also the mechanics for melee DPS are pretty consistent because only certain stats effect melee combat.  Doesn't matter if you are using a bow or a sword, melee dps gets calculated using the same stats and equations when it comes to a character's physical stats.</p></blockquote><p>That's not true, rangers have a specific proc ont heir epic that adds extra CA damage based on STR.  On other melee classes STR does as little for dps as AGI does for avoidance. (Unless it's something low like sub 800 raiseing any stat past that does little.)</p></blockquote><p>Okay now you are clearly desperate to save face.  I was talking about the base damage calculations in the game NOT procs., especially not procs off of Epics.   The use word MECHANIC (also known as the base code of the game) pretty much should have been the give away there so please stop trying to obfuscate the issue.  Funny also that before you were pleading ignorance of Rangers and yet bring this up suddenly knowing them, even though its not germain to the conversation of base game mechanic. </p><p>I will grant you the game does have a "soft cap" for stats, no doubt but even after the 8-900 where the extra damage for strength starts to taper (never goes away mind you simply becomes less efficient) it still gets better. </p><p>Thing is though IF you see your class as there to DPS (and thats what most, not all but most scouts see themselves as) then you are thinking Str Sta and Int regardless of the soft cap.  Str and Int for dps Sta because all the agility in the world isn't going to save you from an AOE and even in a group the tank should be holding aggro and the times avoidance does help you should be minimal.  There is no hard cap so you still get more damage, simply not as much as you get higher.  MAYBE if you are a soloer it makes sense but then you should not be using a classic "dps" build under those circumstances anyway.</p><p>The problem yet again Lethe is that you do not differentiate between circumstances.  You make sweeping comments about the game and its mehanics.  When you get called on it you bring up the ONE circumstance (the Rangers freaking Epic) which may not even be germain to the conversation to try and support your view.</p></blockquote><p>/sigh</p><p>What is your problem really?  You go out of your way trying to prove me wrong for something I never even said.</p><p>Here were my arguments:-Crit mit should be based on AGI.-Gear has tons of STR/STA and not enough AGI/INT.</p><p>Heres what people replyed:-AGI isn't important. "<span >agi for a scout LOL ok ok i have 700 solo but i never focus on agi - never ever !!!"</span> -Mizou-I shouldn't pretent to not know rangers and am suddenly lieing by saying gear is "all good" for rangers even though before I had complained about it. "<span >Please don't make it sound like you don't know Rangers Lethe..." "...</span><span >when you were a Ranger, you were one who used to complain that Ranger's were completely overlooked gear wise because of the lack of ranged crit and double attack.  Now suddenly the gear is designed with Ranger's in mind?" -Gisallo</span></p><p>To which I replyed:-AGI is just as important as STR/STA/INT.-I never said that equipment had gotten better for rangers all I said is that STR is more usefull for rangers than any other class.</p><p>And Gisallo replys:"Well you said...."But I'm not a ranger and I have had enough with all the equipment with nothing but str/sta....."<span ><p>Since you are complaining that all the gear has Strength and Sta on it...in the context of not being a ranger its a pretty logical conclusion to say you are saying this is for rangers. </p><p>Also the mechanics for melee DPS are pretty consistent because only certain stats effect melee combat.  Doesn't matter if you are using a bow or a sword, melee dps gets calculated using the same stats and equations when it comes to a character's physical stats."</p><p>My reply: "The reason I said STR is more important for rangers is because theres a proc on their epic that increases CA dmg based on their total STR".</p><p>::::: Now that I have reviewed that all for you let me reply to your most recent post :::::</p><p>Gisallo says:</p><p><span >"Okay now you are clearly desperate to save face.  I was talking about the base damage calculations in the game NOT procs., especially not procs off of Epics.   The use word MECHANIC (also known as the base code of the game) pretty much should have been the give away there so please stop trying to obfuscate the issue.  Funny also that before you were pleading ignorance of Rangers and yet bring this up suddenly knowing them, even though its not germain to the conversation of base game mechanic. "</span></p><p>-I'm desperate to save face? I haven't changed my arguement.  The one thing I was wrong about was that AGI helps to avoid AoEs, which I admit.  I did also say "Not true I have avoided a AoE before" well that wasen't a lie because I did avoid it, not dodged maybe but I did still avoid it (Not saying that agi helped me to).</p><p>-I know what mechanic means.  The fact that you just recently added mechanic to your arguement is just a irrelevant detail that you added to try to prove me wrong.  It doesn't matter if it's a mechanic or a item that pretty much all rangers use since they both effect gameplay pretty much equally.</p><p>-I never pleaded ignorance of rangers I only said that "I am not a ranger".</p><p>Gisallo says:</p><p>"<span > There is no hard cap so you still get more damage, simply not as much as you get higher."</span></p><p>-That's completly untrue.  There <em>is</em> a hardcap and actually once you exceed it then it becomes negative returns effectivly decreaseing whatever the stat is ment to benefit.</p><p>Gisallo says:</p><p>"<span >You make sweeping comments about the game and its mehanics.  When you get called on it you bring up the ONE circumstance (the Rangers freaking Epic) which may not even be germain to the conversation to try and support your view."</span></p><p>-My statements where very general and all of them where true (except the aoe avoidance one...).</p></span></p>

[Mizou]

<p>guys just ignore this dude he is out of his mind and maybe needs the people with the white cloth (u know with arms at the back)</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Mizou wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>guys just ignore this dude he is out of his mind and maybe needs the people with the white cloth (u know with arms at the back)</p></blockquote><p>Are you getting bored of trolling yet?</p>

[Gisallo]

<p><cite></cite></p><blockquote><p><span><p>-My statements where very general and all of them where true (except the aoe avoidance one...).</p></span></p></blockquote><p>The point is you have been saying Agility should be the basis for the Scouts because Agility is their most important stat.  You have said this time and time again on other threads that Agility is more important for reasons that have been shot down.  Thats my issue, not that you are saying "well crit mit is based on our agility so NOW its an important stat."  You have always said it was the most important stat.  You complained about Str, Sta and Int being on gear instead of agility.  I used to be the same way.  I assumed "hey Gisallo is a ranger, rangers are about agility, agility must be important."  Dang was I wrong.</p><p>I have done the research and there may be a hard cap but as of now its completely anecdotal.  even if it does exist do you know what that is?  You get negative returns after 1350 in a stat...1350.  You yourself said "I could give a **** about raiding."  Please tell me under non-raiding circumstances when you will EVER have a stat over 1350?  Only way is to have Fabled raid gear and masters to go with it.  Since you don't care about raiding you will never see the cap so it will be a non issue to you.  here's the link for those interested <a href="http://ogrebear.com/?p=522" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://ogrebear.com/?p=522</a> .</p><p>So what it comes down to is "get your self buffed stat to about 900.  Once you are there you likely will not go over the hard cap."  After 900 then you can start putting stats into other things.  Until then we have the priority list and for Scouts, barring Crit Mit, its Str, Sta, Int.  Always has been always will be.</p>

[KniteShayd]

<p>For a pred on PvP, namely a Ranger, agi is nice for power, but I have never put any faith into that stat. Ever.  I am all STR STA, and  INT when i can.  I am a dps, not a tank.  Other PK'rs know this and know that to get a Ranger kill, you either get the jump, or run up and melee. (unless you're a mage.  then you either have mana shield, or you just get the jump)</p><p>If agi had more affect on avoidance, say making me able to go all agi and actually survive a brig attack, then I would say, "OK, agi it is."  But agi, as it is, is a joke for a ranger. save for power...</p><p>Back at launch I decided to try an all agi illus, since our spells were crap.  I survived about 3/4 solo encounters and about 8/10 group encounters when I pulled aggro.  Why? Because agi actually seemed to have an effect on avoidance stats, and mages had inital parry/block/riposte/dodge.  So going all agi and int was better than sta and int.  Why take a hit a hit when you could dodge it?</p><p>Now if the devs were to do things like this for the game again, then some aa lines would be worth putting points into. Like the agi line for enchanters.  Same woukld go for a cloth monk.  Make them get a good avoidance going on becasue of the extra agi boost they get from having something lighter.  Could you imagine a leather tank? all agi, no sta, avoid the hits and let the single healer actually be able to debuff?!? that would be awesome!!!  And, the extra recipes we would get for more cloth options.</p>

[schizolic]

<p>I know a zerker can block a wing beat aoe with gut roar, and it has no aoe avoidance to it, just parry one attack</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Gisallo@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite></cite></p><blockquote><p><span><p>-My statements where very general and all of them where true (except the aoe avoidance one...).</p></span></p></blockquote><p>The point is you have been saying Agility should be the basis for the Scouts because Agility is their most important stat.  You have said this time and time again on other threads that Agility is more important for reasons that have been shot down.  Thats my issue, not that you are saying "well crit mit is based on our agility so NOW its an important stat."  You have always said it was the most important stat.  You complained about Str, Sta and Int being on gear instead of agility.  I used to be the same way.  I assumed "hey Gisallo is a ranger, rangers are about agility, agility must be important."  Dang was I wrong.</p><p>I have done the research and there may be a hard cap but as of now its completely anecdotal.  even if it does exist do you know what that is?  You get negative returns after 1350 in a stat...1350.  You yourself said "I could give a **** about raiding."  Please tell me under non-raiding circumstances when you will EVER have a stat over 1350?  Only way is to have Fabled raid gear and masters to go with it.  Since you don't care about raiding you will never see the cap so it will be a non issue to you.  here's the link for those interested <a rel="nofollow" href="http://ogrebear.com/?p=522" target="_blank">http://ogrebear.com/?p=522</a> .</p><p>So what it comes down to is "get your self buffed stat to about 900.  Once you are there you likely will not go over the hard cap."  After 900 then you can start putting stats into other things.  Until then we have the priority list and for Scouts, barring Crit Mit, its Str, Sta, Int.  Always has been always will be.</p></blockquote><p>Agility is technically a scouts primary stat weather you like it or not.  Baseing crit mit off str would make no sense anyways at least agi and int both make some sense... although to be fair to most classes sta would work best since it is a good stat for any class and easy to get on pretty much all gear even for mages.</p>

[Gisallo]

<p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Gisallo@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite></cite></p><blockquote><p><span><p>-My statements where very general and all of them where true (except the aoe avoidance one...).</p></span></p></blockquote><p>The point is you have been saying Agility should be the basis for the Scouts because Agility is their most important stat.  You have said this time and time again on other threads that Agility is more important for reasons that have been shot down.  Thats my issue, not that you are saying "well crit mit is based on our agility so NOW its an important stat."  You have always said it was the most important stat.  You complained about Str, Sta and Int being on gear instead of agility.  I used to be the same way.  I assumed "hey Gisallo is a ranger, rangers are about agility, agility must be important."  Dang was I wrong.</p><p>I have done the research and there may be a hard cap but as of now its completely anecdotal.  even if it does exist do you know what that is?  You get negative returns after 1350 in a stat...1350.  You yourself said "I could give a **** about raiding."  Please tell me under non-raiding circumstances when you will EVER have a stat over 1350?  Only way is to have Fabled raid gear and masters to go with it.  Since you don't care about raiding you will never see the cap so it will be a non issue to you.  here's the link for those interested <a rel="nofollow" href="http://ogrebear.com/?p=522" target="_blank">http://ogrebear.com/?p=522</a> .</p><p>So what it comes down to is "get your self buffed stat to about 900.  Once you are there you likely will not go over the hard cap."  After 900 then you can start putting stats into other things.  Until then we have the priority list and for Scouts, barring Crit Mit, its Str, Sta, Int.  Always has been always will be.</p></blockquote><p>Agility is technically a scouts primary stat weather you like it or not.  Baseing crit mit off str would make no sense anyways at least agi and int both make some sense... although to be fair to most classes sta would work best since it is a good stat for any class and easy to get on pretty much all gear even for mages.</p></blockquote><p>Yes Agility is a primary stat for a scout for getting power BUT if you scroill over the power tab (at least with the scouts I have played) you get power from str and agility.  Also it is a "primary" power based on lore.  Scouts are lithe, agile etc.  BUT the way the machanics have evolved over 5 years agility is not, for a practical matter a primary stat and I think this is the point people are trying to make.  A dps scout (which is what they are supposed to be) has strngth as their top stat.  A dps caster has Int as their top stat for the same reason.  Why then should mages get their number 1 stat buffed and not the other classes.  For goodness sakes Priests do not even get power from Int so that makes even less sense than the scout since they at least get power from it.</p>

[Lethe5683]

<p><cite>Gisallo@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Lethe5683 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Gisallo@Lucan DLere wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite></cite></p><blockquote><p><span><p>-My statements where very general and all of them where true (except the aoe avoidance one...).</p></span></p></blockquote><p>The point is you have been saying Agility should be the basis for the Scouts because Agility is their most important stat.  You have said this time and time again on other threads that Agility is more important for reasons that have been shot down.  Thats my issue, not that you are saying "well crit mit is based on our agility so NOW its an important stat."  You have always said it was the most important stat.  You complained about Str, Sta and Int being on gear instead of agility.  I used to be the same way.  I assumed "hey Gisallo is a ranger, rangers are about agility, agility must be important."  Dang was I wrong.</p><p>I have done the research and there may be a hard cap but as of now its completely anecdotal.  even if it does exist do you know what that is?  You get negative returns after 1350 in a stat...1350.  You yourself said "I could give a **** about raiding."  Please tell me under non-raiding circumstances when you will EVER have a stat over 1350?  Only way is to have Fabled raid gear and masters to go with it.  Since you don't care about raiding you will never see the cap so it will be a non issue to you.  here's the link for those interested <a rel="nofollow" href="http://ogrebear.com/?p=522" target="_blank">http://ogrebear.com/?p=522</a> .</p><p>So what it comes down to is "get your self buffed stat to about 900.  Once you are there you likely will not go over the hard cap."  After 900 then you can start putting stats into other things.  Until then we have the priority list and for Scouts, barring Crit Mit, its Str, Sta, Int.  Always has been always will be.</p></blockquote><p>Agility is technically a scouts primary stat weather you like it or not.  Baseing crit mit off str would make no sense anyways at least agi and int both make some sense... although to be fair to most classes sta would work best since it is a good stat for any class and easy to get on pretty much all gear even for mages.</p></blockquote><p>Yes Agility is a primary stat for a scout for getting power BUT if you scroill over the power tab (at least with the scouts I have played) you get power from str and agility.  Also it is a "primary" power based on lore.  Scouts are lithe, agile etc.  BUT the way the machanics have evolved over 5 years agility is not, for a practical matter a primary stat and I think this is the point people are trying to make.  A dps scout (which is what they are supposed to be) has strngth as their top stat.  A dps caster has Int as their top stat for the same reason.  Why then should mages get their number 1 stat buffed and not the other classes.  For goodness sakes Priests do not even get power from Int so that makes even less sense than the scout since they at least get power from it.</p></blockquote><p>The amount of power scouts get from STR does not count.  It's like 1/6th the amount that agi gives or less.  Like I said it doesn't make sense that mages have int  while priests also have to have int for crit mit.  Mages are fine to keep with int but priests should be wis.</p>